cressiesprochoice

[cressiesprochoice]

if you don't mind, could you elaborate on why many pro-choice arguments are bad? what made you switch?

most arguments for abortion don't address why people are pro-life or any of the concerns pro-life people have. so they're bad in the sense that they're bad at convincing people, and they're also bad in the sense that they're not sound arguments. u have to understand that the other side views abortion as murder in the same way everyone views drowning someone as murder. so if u say "it's a personal choice" you aren't going to convince anyone anymore than u would if u argued shooting someone was a personal choice. same for saying "abortion will happen anyway, we might as well make it legal so it's safer." those points will never change someone's views bc it's (to them) as ridiculous as saying "robbery will happen anyway, we might as well make it legal so it's safer." in addition to this some pro-choice talking points are flat out wrong. yeah a fetus is a clump of cells but so is literally every human on earth, that's meaningless. a fetus isn't a parasite, a parasite is by definition not a member of your own species. a fetus is human; being a fetus is another stage of human development, just like a toddler and a teenager and an adult. the word fetus literally means 'little one/little person.'

the argument that made me change my mind (and in my view the only argument for abortion) is bodily autonomy. imagine you have an extremely rare blood type and only one person on earth shares it. this person needs a blood transfusion and if you refuse to give blood they will die. should it be legal for the government to tie you down and force u to give blood? of course not! we don't even take organs from corpses without consent, even though corpses can't feel pain and won't know it ever happened. and unlike giving blood, being pregnant is extremely dangerous and detrimental for your health. even in first world countries like america, pregnancy causes death and injury. if you don't think people should be forced by law to give blood, donate organs, or give skin grafts--even when it won't harm the donor, and it will save the life of someone who already has a consciousness, a family, and a community--why should pregnant women be forced to give their entire body, enduring pain and suffering and risking injury and death, for someone who doesn't even have consciousness yet? and that's not even going into how having a child changes the course of your entire life. if the government passed a law saying you must donate your entire body for someone, and then you must support that person financially, emotionally, and physically, or else you would be the same as a murderer, it would be a clear violation of human rights. but that's exactly what we expect of women. there's no doubt in my mind that the only reason we have this exception for bodily autonomy for pregnancy is because society views women as mothers and not people, so abortion is seen as a perversion of the natural order of the world. and that's why i am now pro-choice.

[cressiesprochoice]

I’m reading a book about midwifery in New England in the eighteenth century and I’m struck by how pro-woman their treatment of birth was compared to how it’s done today.

Like, it was the norm for labouring women to be surrounded by a midwife and several female friends who all performed some kind of function to aid the woman in delivering her baby safely. Male physicians hated the social tradition and dismissed the gathering of women as facilitating “gossip” and as a hindrance on the rare occasion they attended a birth.

The work of midwives was so valorised that many town maps from this period clearly identify where every midwife was located, and paying the midwife was one of the biggest household expenses alongside taxes.

Midwives developed their own manuscripts full of medicinal remedies for all aspects of reproduction. Birth was managed by women themselves – it was a collective female ritual.

Male obstetricians, motivated in my opinion by a deep-seated envy of women’s reproductive power, began to steal and suppress women’s wisdom around childbirth in the nineteenth century, and by the twentieth century unnecessary medical intervention in childbirth had exploded.

We need to make childbirth woman-centred again.

[cressiesprochoice]

“I have done several abortions on women who have regularly picketed my clinics, including a 16 year old schoolgirl who came back to picket the day after her abortion, about three years ago. During her whole stay at the clinic, we felt that she was not quite right, but there were no real warning bells. She insisted that the abortion was her idea and assured us that all was OK. She went through the procedure very smoothly and was discharged with no problems. A quite routine operation. Next morning she was with her mother and several school mates in front of the clinic with the usual anti posters and chants. It appears that she got the abortion she needed and still displayed the appropriate anti views expected of her by her parents, teachers, and peers.” (Physician, Australia)

“I’ve had several cases over the years in which the anti-abortion patient had rationalized in one way or another that her case was the only exception, but the one that really made an impression was the college senior who was the president of her campus Right-to-Life organization, meaning that she had worked very hard in that organization for several years. As I was completing her procedure, I asked what she planned to do about her high office in the RTL organization. Her response was a wide-eyed, ‘You’re not going to tell them, are you!?’ When assured that I was not, she breathed a sigh of relief, explaining how important that position was to her and how she wouldn’t want this to interfere with it.” (Physician, Texas)

“In 1990, in the Boston area, Operation Rescue and other groups were regularly blockading the clinics, and many of us went every Saturday morning for months to help women and staff get in. As a result, we knew many of the 'antis’ by face. One morning, a woman who had been a regular 'sidewalk counselor’ went into the clinic with a young woman who looked like she was 16-17, and obviously her daughter. When the mother came out about an hour later, I had to go up and ask her if her daughter’s situation had caused her to change her mind. 'I don’t expect you to understand my daughter’s situation!’ she angrily replied. The following Saturday, she was back, pleading with women entering the clinic not to 'murder their babies.’” (Clinic escort, Massachusetts)

“We too have seen our share of anti-choice women, ones the counselors usually grit their teeth over. Just last week a woman announced loudly enough for all to hear in the recovery room, that she thought abortion should be illegal. Amazingly, this was her second abortion within the last few months, having gotten pregnant again within a month of the first abortion. The nurse handled it by talking about all the carnage that went on before abortion was legalized and how fortunate she was to be receiving safe, professional care. However, this young woman continued to insist it was wrong and should be made illegal. Finally the nurse said, 'Well, I guess we won’t be seeing you here again, not that you’re not welcome.’ Later on, another patient who had overheard this exchange thanked the nurse for her remarks.” (Clinic Administrator, Alberta)

“We saw a woman recently who after four attempts and many hours of counseling both at the hospital and our clinic, finally, calmly and uneventfully, had her abortion. Four months later, she called me on Christmas Eve to tell me that she was not and never was pro-choice and that we failed to recognize that she was clinically depressed at the time of her abortion. The purpose of her call was to chastise me for not sending her off to the psych unit instead of the procedure room.” (Clinic Administrator, Alberta)

“Recently, we had a patient who had given a history of being a 'pro-life’ activist, but who had decided to have an abortion. She was pleasant to me and our initial discussion was mutually respectful. Later, she told someone on my staff that she thought abortion is murder, that she is a murderer, and that she is murdering her baby. So before doing her procedure, I asked her if she thought abortion is murder – the answer was yes. I asked her if she thought I am a murderer, and if she thought I would be murdering her baby, and she said yes. But murder is a crime, and murderers are executed. Is this a crime? Well, it should be, she said. At that point, she became angry and hostile, and the summary of the conversation was that she regarded me as an abortion-dispensing machine, and how dare I ask her what she thinks. After explaining to her that I do not perform abortions for people who think I am a murderer or people who are angry at me, I declined to provide her with medical care. I do not know whether she found someone else to do her abortion.” (Physician, Colorado)

“In 1973, after Roe v. Wade, abortion became legal but had to be performed in a hospital. That of course was changed later. For the first 'legal abortion day’ I had scheduled five procedures. While scrubbing between cases, I was accosted by the Chief of the OB/Gyn service. He asked me, 'How many children are you going to kill today?’ My response, out of anger, was a familiar vulgar retort. About three months later, this born-again Christian called me to explain that he was against abortion but his daughter was only a junior in high school and was too young to have a baby and he was also afraid that if she did have a baby she would not want to put it up for adoption. I told him he did not need to explain the situation to me. 'All I need to know’, I said, 'is that SHE wants an abortion.’ Two years later I performed a second abortion on her during her college break. She thanked me and pleaded, 'Please don’t tell my dad, he is still anti-abortion.’” (Physician, Washington State)

“The sister of a Dutch bishop in Limburg once visited the abortion clinic in Beek where I used to work in the seventies. After entering the full waiting room she said to me, 'My dear Lord, what are all those young girls doing here?’ 'Same as you’, I replied. 'Dirty little dames,’ she said.” (Physician, The Netherlands)

“I had a patient about ten years ago who traveled up to New York City from South Carolina for an abortion. I asked her why she went such a long way to get the procedure. Her answer was that she was a member of a church group that didn’t believe in abortion and she didn’t want anyone to know she was having one. She planned to return to the group when she went back to South Carolina.” (Physician, New York)

“I once had a German client who greatly thanked me at the door, leaving after a difficult 22-week abortion. With a gleaming smile, she added: 'Und doch sind Sie ein Mörderer.’ ('And you’re still a murderer.’)” (Physician, The Netherlands)

“My first encounter with this phenomenon came when I was doing a 2-week follow-up at a family planning clinic. The woman’s anti-choice values spoke indirectly through her expression and body language. She told me that she had been offended by the other women in the abortion clinic waiting room because they were using abortion as a form of birth control, but her condom had broken so she had no choice! I had real difficulty not pointing out that she did have a choice, and she had made it! Just like the other women in the waiting room.” (Physician, Ontario)

“A 21 year old woman and her mother drove three hours to come to their appointment for an abortion. They were surprised to find the clinic a 'nice’ place with friendly, personable staff. While going over contraceptive options, they shared that they were Pro-Life and disagreed with abortion, but that the patient could not afford to raise a child right now. Also, she wouldn’t need contraception since she wasn’t going to have sex until she got married, because of her religious beliefs. Rather than argue with them, I saw this as an opportunity for dialogue, and in the end, my hope was that I had planted a 'healing seed’ to help resolve the conflict between their beliefs and their realities.” (Physician, Washington State)

“I had a 37 year old woman just yesterday who was 13 weeks. She said she and her husband had been discussing this pregnancy for 2-3 months. She was strongly opposed to abortion, 'but my husband is forcing me to do it.’ Naturally, I told her that no one could force her into an abortion, and that she had to choose whether the pregnancy or her husband were more important. I told her I only wanted what was best for her, and I would not do the abortion unless she agreed that it was in her best interest. Once she was faced with actually having to voice her own choice, she said 'Well, I made the appointment and I came here, so go ahead and do it. It’s what’s best.’ At last I think she came to grips with the fact that it really was her decision after all.” (Physician, Nevada)

“We have anti-choice women in for abortions all the time. Many of them are just naive and ignorant until they find themselves with an unwanted pregnancy. Many of them are not malicious. They just haven’t given it the proper amount of thought until it completely affects them. They can be judgmental about their friends, family, and other women. Then suddenly they become pregnant. Suddenly they see the truth. That it should only be their own choice. Unfortunately, many also think that somehow they are different than everyone else and they deserve to have an abortion, while no one else does.” (Physician, Washington State)

[cressiesprochoice]

In the Netherlands, abortion is freely available on demand. Yet the Netherlands boasts the lowest abortion rate in the world, about 6 abortions per 1000 women per year, and the complication and death rates for abortion are miniscule. How do they do it? First of all, contraception is widely available and free – it’s covered by the national health insurance plan. Holland also carries out extensive public education on contraception, family planning, and sexuality. An ethic of personal responsibility for one’s sexual activity is strongly promoted. Of course, some people say that teaching kids about sex and contraception will only encourage them to have lots of sex. But Dutch teenagers tend to have less frequent sex, starting at an older age, than American teenagers, and the Dutch teenage pregnancy rate is 9 times lower than in the U.S.

[cressiesprochoice]

I don't get why radical feminists are always whinging about how 'painful' or 'traumatic' child birth is. Like yeah it's painful, but that's the only way new humans are born. Childbirth is the only way for the species/humanity/society to develop and move forward. And women have been doing it for thousands and thousands of years. Like sorry, but it's necessary. What do you suggest instead?

i…..haven’t seen any radfems complaining about this? childbirth is obviously necessary for the continuation of human life

i think maybe you’re seeing feminists explain that its unreasonable to deny a woman an abortion because she should just give birth and then give the baby up for adoption, because childbirth IS medically traumatic and will put that woman in tens of thousands of dollars of debt. it’s sexist to insist that women tear themselves apart giving birth to children they don’t want, the pain of childbirth itself isn’t the issue and there’s not much that can be done about that, obviously

i dont understand this ask at all tbh it seems like you’re misrepresenting an argument on purpose and im not even sure which one it is

#not abortion #childbirth

[cressiesprochoice]

A few weeks ago my mom stapled pages of a story in one of her women’s magazines together and handed it to me. She gave it to me pretty much with the tag lines “for your feminist blog” and “something new to consider.” Indeed it was; she knows me well.

The story is titled “I was forced to be pregnant.” With a title like that, reading it was actually not on the top of my to read list. I thought it was about women not exercising their right to choice. I was very, very wrong on that one.

Have you ever heard of Reproductive coercion? It is a term that was quite recently coined by the advocates against domestic violence to describe a certain type of abuse some women face. It occurs when a man pressures their partner to have kids and/or impregnates them against their will. Reproductive coercion comes in three different types: 1. Emotional pressure that turns into verbal and physical abuse. 2. Sabotaging birth control 3. Marital rape Over 75% of women 19-49 who reported once experiencing domestic violence also endured some type of reproductive control by men. It’s all about control and domination over a woman’s body.

The first story in the magazine is about a woman who got married around 36 years of age. After a few months of dating her boyfriend talked excitedly about having children. After he proposed he began calling her “The Babymaker.” She then confided with him that one of her fallopian tubes was blocked. He in return insisted she see a fertility doctor. She recounts, “I had finally met a great guy who was eager to start a family with me. What woman wouldn’t fall for that?” Soon after her honeymoon he persisted on in an obsessive manner, but his efforts had to be temporarily halted as she had to get emergency back surgery. Alas, 6 months into recovery he was back to pressuring her again. She was in much pain at the time due to her back, but she agreed to In Vitro Fertilization. She then became pregnant, but soon miscarried. In response, her husband grabbed her by the neck, choking her. He apologized, blaming his outburst on his grief and had her sign up for another round of IVF. And then a third round. She tried to put him off with the excuse that she needed to weigh more before she could take treatments, her husband forced her to get on the scale often and filled the fridge with fattening foods. “It hurt that all I was good for was getting pregnant.” She recounts. At the end, he screamed at her, threatening to replace her with a maid if she couldn’t get pregnant and she told him she no longer wanted to have his child. He destroyed bedroom furniture, pushed her down the stairs and threatened her with a gun. She fled to a domestic violence shelter.

The second story was about a woman who faced marital rape. This woman was 40, had a then boyfriend and two children from a previous marriage. After telling her boyfriend she did not want any more children, her boyfriend refused to wear a condom and began to rape her.  She then became pregnant with her third child. Birth control was never an option for her because she couldn’t hide pills anywhere for he went through all of her belongings. Three months after giving birth, he raped her again, impregnating her with twins. She lost the twins in a physical fight with him, but soon became pregnant again. During her recovery she begged her obstetrician to remove her ovaries and devise a lie to tell him; that she had cancer. After a decade of sexual abuse and violence she was able to get a job that kept her out of the house and often times traveling.

One in four callers to the National Domestic Abuse hotline said that their partners had tried to force them to become pregnant. Why? As one woman stated, “Its like he wants to own me from the inside out.”  Having a baby is the perfect tie that binds. These type of abusers want to create a circumstance in which their partner is dependent on him.

WHAT’S THAT HAVE TO DO WITH PLANNED PARENTHOOD?

Many voters never consider how defunding these clinics could hurt victims of domestic violence who turn to them for counseling as well as pregnancy prevention. Abused women will turn to health care providers long before they will turn to domestic abuse hotlines and organizations. Many women in abusive relationships rely on life saving, affordable care programs such as Title X. It is critical that such places are open and operation when women and children need them so desperately.

#abortion #pro choice #radical feminism

[cressiesprochoice]

#abortion #pro choice #radical feminism

[cressiesprochoice]

#abortion #pro choice #radical feminism

[cressiesprochoice]

abortion that late should 🚫❌

I did not know that in 7 states in America, you can carry out an abortion the day before you give birth (allows abortion at any time). That’s so fucking disgusting. And other states allow abortion up to 28 weeks. That’s not a ball of cells no more, that’s a damn baby. It’s good that abortion is legal but not the fucking late into the pregnancy 😷😷 nasty

#abortion #pro choice #radical feminism

[cressiesprochoice]

That is literally what Dr. Wicklund was trying to do. 

The particular clinic Dr. Wicklund ran (Mountain Country Women's Clinic in Bozeman, Montana) is a small location, however, so she contacted a local facility whose entire purpose was to help people like her and they didn’t. That’s the point of this.

#the clinic was so small in fact that dr wicklund was the only abortion provider in ~100 mile radius of the area #and when she retired there wasnt anyone else even close to the area that could fill the position #it was THAT small #so can you see why she reached out to another group to help someone in need?

[cressiesprochoice]

You knew darn well what I was askong you. Is it okay for me to kill you because you're tissue? Why is murder even illegal then? Also do you thonk a 6-9 month old fetus (someone failed latin cause that means offspring) is okay to abort? Because seems like you apply no limitations.

My six years of Latin straight As would beg to differ. The word lunatic has a Latin root in the word for moon but it doesn’t mean crazy people are moons. Etymology is not the same as a definition.

Firstly “do you thonk a 6-9 month old fetus…is okay to abort?” Personally, for me, yes. Not everyone agrees with me on that and that’s fine but if it’s necessary, it should be allowed. If you think it’s a a sentient human being- from the minute it’s conceived then you should believe that any form of abortion is murder even if it’s the result of rape or incest, or if the mother is 13. 

The thing you seem not to realise is that the majority of people who are pro choice couldn’t give a shit about when life begins. There is no medical or scientific consensus. The reason we’re pro choice is because we live in reality. Abortion has existed since the beginning of time. It’s centuries older than the religion which has led you to believe abortion is wrong. Women will get abortions as long as we continue to ignore the root causes (again, the fault of pro lifers) so we have two options: legalise it so we can regulate and make it safe or ban it and lead to the deaths of millions of people- deaths which will happen in back rooms of illegal abortion clinics with women bleeding slowly to death while the rest of the world turns a blind eye. Now before you say “BUT MURDER IS OLDER THAN CHRISTIANITY AND WE STILL BAN THAT” I’d say that’s true. But legalising murder doesn’t reduce murder, whereas legalising abortion does consistently reduce rates. And we do legalise the premeditated death of others all the time: in combat situations. If it’s ok to take away the life of another human being- someone with family and friends and thoughts and beliefs and memories- in a war zone, then we are explicitly saying that stopping a life is ok as long as it benefits the person with the most power. 

The other main point is the fact that if you say that a fetus is a human being then you give it all of the basic human rights a person has by law. Let’s look at the Convention on the Rights of the Child. The fetus would have a right to a name so everyone has to name a baby the moment they find out they’re pregnant. They have the right to a nationality, even though you can’t be a citizen of places like the United States unless you’re born there. They have the right to privacy (I’m sure you can see the issues with that when they live inside their mother).  I read an article the other day that pointed out that if we force a woman to go through with a pregnancy she doesn’t want then we’d be violating the fetus’s right to be free from arbitrary detention! And even if we all decided to give the fetus the inalienable right to life, that doesn’t give them the right to their mother’s oxygen or her blood supply. They can have the right to life if you want but only if we grow them in labs. You can’t hand out rights to someone who isn’t born. It is just completely irrational. 

Pro lifers like to play on the emotions of people and that’s not what it’s about for pro choice people. Emotion is irrelevant for policy decisions. What’s relevant is logic and realism. Being anti-choice is neither logical or realistic. 

#abortion #pro choice #radical feminism

[cressiesprochoice]

Some quotes from the the article:

“This embarrassing scene happened two years ago and the episode is just one of the many challenges we have faced since Stephen, our second child, was born with Down’s Syndrome. So difficult has it been that I can honestly say I wish he hadn’t been born.“

“I know this will shock many: this is my son, whom I’ve loved, nurtured and defended for nearly half a century, but if I could go back in time, I would abort him in an instant.”

“Perhaps you’d expect me to say that, over time, I grew to accept my son’s disability. That now, looking back on that day 47 years later, none of us could imagine life without him, and that I’m grateful I was never given the option to abort. However, you’d be wrong. Because, while I do love my son, and am fiercely protective of him, I know our lives would have been happier and far less complicated if he had never been born. I do wish I’d had an abortion. I wish it every day. If he had not been born, I’d have probably gone on to have another baby, we would have had a normal family life and Andrew would have the comfort, rather than the responsibility, of a sibling, after we’re gone.”

“Instead, Stephen - who struggles to speak and function in the modern world - has brought a great deal of stress and heartache into our lives. That is why I want to speak in support of the 92 per cent of women who choose to abort their babies after discovering they have Down’s Syndrome.”

“For my own part, however, I don’t think I will ever come to terms with Stephen’s disability.”

“One day, Stephen’s doctor sat us down and told us that Stephen needed an operation to remove his spleen. Without it, he said, he would ‘go to sleep and never wake up’. Those were his exact words. Looking back, I believe the doctor was guiding us towards allowing our son to pass away naturally, but we were not much more than children ourselves, in our mid-20s, and didn’t understand then what he was trying to do for us. I wish we had - it would have spared us all a great deal of pain.”

“Years ago, I was so worried about history repeating itself that Andrew, Roy and I went for genetic counselling at Guy’s Hospital in London and found Stephen was just ‘bad luck’. I say ‘bad luck’, but that’s the greatest understatement that anyone can imagine.”

I know this was written in 2014, but it’s so, so awful. Yeah, it’s challenging to raise children with disabilities and yes, it will make your life harder, but the fact that she wishes she could go back in time and kill her son and have never had him, never known him, doesn’t really come across as love to me.

When you love someone, you don’t wish they had never been born because it would make your life easier. I feel so bad for her son, Stephen. Hopefully, he doesn’t know his mother feels this way. No child will think they are loved if they hear “I love you but I wish you had never been born. If I could go back in time, I would never have had you. If I could go back, I would take advantages of the opportunities I had to kill you because you make my life harder.“

This is incredibly sad. Hopefully Stephen has people in his life who really do love him and don’t wish he had never been born.

Aborting babies just because they have down syndrome is a horrible thing to do and wishing you could go back in time and kill your adult son before he was born just because it would make your life easier is not love. It’s horrific. People who struggle with disabilities aren’t less valuable than “normal” people. Shame on this woman and anyone who agrees with her.

#abortion #pro choice #radical feminism

[cressiesprochoice]

This breaks my heart. Please reblog.

#abortion #pro choice #radical feminism

[cressiesprochoice]

How can someone stand behind abortion, when you have a life inside of you that God created for you? How can you say that this life isn’t worth it? If you can’t take care of the baby for whatever circumstances than there is always adoption available to couples who can’t conceive, but still want the joy of being parents. OPEN YOUR EYES! God has bigger plans for us all that we don’t even realize the picture.

#abortion #pro choice #radical feminism

[cressiesprochoice]

Want to go to Planned Parenthood in D.C.? You’ll have to run the anti-choice gauntlet first.

This is what it looks like when clinics don’t have buffer zones.

#abortion #pro choice #radical feminism

[cressiesprochoice]

http://ift.tt/1dTRasb

#abortion #pro choice #radical feminism

[cressiesprochoice]

This is what a real, qualified OBGYN will tell you about what women feel when they get an abortion

Dr. Willie Parker, who is trained as a gynecologist and OBGYN, is a hero for the pro-choice movement because he’s honest about the undiscussed aspects of getting (or not getting) an abortion. Watch how he gives a consultation.

#abortion #pro choice #radical feminism