#Real Ciel Mastermind Theory

[midnight-in-town]

What if the day of the manor has been attacked, Real!Ciel had realized what happened when nobody came for them? The twins waited for a while and realized that something was wrong. Then Real!Ciel make a face who seems to indicate that he may know something.

What if this something was just that Vincent had told him that "it" could happen (after all Vincent seems to feel that his death could be close)? And he goes out to see if he could find a safe route to go out of the manor but get captured on the way?

What if Real Ciel thought "so the day has come hu?" and focused to get his brother in safety first by finding a way out?

I guess we'll never know :/

Hey Anon! Well, first of all, I'm pretty sure we'll know the truth one day about what took place when the manor was attacked, considering it's the main mystery of the manga, hahaha. xDDD

Secondly, yeah I think real!Ciel pretty much had an inkling as to why Tanaka was late...

...but unlike you, I think it's because he was an accomplice to the attack on the manor 4 years ago and knew what was actually happening. Until he got double crossed (can't be helped, he was ten years old and probably didn't see it coming) and ended up sold with his twin brother, that is.

In case you're not familiar with the theory called "the real!Ciel mastermind theory" (its name's actually a red herring, because in this theory real!Ciel is only an accomplice of the mastermind, who is the true target of our!Ciel's revenge), I have a recap post and this theory also has its own tag.

Oh and might I also suggest visiting @cielsama14's blog? They're very dedicated to this theory!

TL;DR don't sweat it Anon, this is completely a plot point and we'll get our answers one day. However, I think real!Ciel is real guilty, up till a certain point in the massacre. Feel free to make your own opinion. :))

Have a good day ! :3

#kuroshitsuji #2CT #rcmt #anon #answers #kuroshitsuji theory #people: 'maybe real!ciel was a good kid?' me : 'no :)'

[abybweisse]

Hello, I have an idea. The r!ciel used to give our ciel milk honey at night and told him dont tell anyone (under the pretext that Tanaka says it is bad for the teeth)

and our ciel was always sick since he was four or five years old. But after the attack on the mansion, his attacks decreased and he even almost recovered Even when the twins were kidnapped, he didn't seem to have a attack.

Is it possible that his brother was making him sick from the beginning (and our ciel was not sick) so that he would stay with him in the house, considering the obsession he had with our ciel?

Or does our ciel get asthma himself and then his brother thinks that being sick will make him stay at home and aggravate his illness with something that he dissolved in honey milk?

Also sorry for my English.I'm persian and wrote this with google translate so that i can share it with you.😃

Did real Ciel poison his twin?

That's actually a really old theory that became part of Real Ciel Mastermind Theory, or RCMT.

And I strongly disagree with pretty much everything about it. I'd rather not go into all the details, but I have older posts about it, including an answer to a very similar ask.

No, I don't think he ever added anything to the milk to keep his younger brother, who had already been diagnosed with asthma, ill. For one thing, if his recurring symptoms started to look more like he'd ingested poison, Madam Red would have been suspicious.

I believe that real Ciel would have done his best to support his younger twin, emotionally and financially, if our earl had pursued his dream of opening a toy shop. And Phantomhive Manor would always welcome him with open arms. Real Ciel would make up all sorts of excuses to entice our earl to visit him, as well as his own excuses for traveling to London. Our earl would live in their London townhouse, and real Ciel would visit whenever his brother couldn't make the trip to the manor. That's what I envision.

The kid has quite the evil streak, but I don't think he would stoop to poisoning his beloved brother, let alone killing his own parents.

#black butler #kuroshitsuji #real ciel #ciel phantomhive #earl phantomhive #our earl #Munchausen by proxy #anon asks #I answer #answered asks #apr 20 2023 #rcmt

[frosteee]

Undertaker & R!Ciel’s relationship (so far)

Does anyone else feel like Undertaker seems to act more distant towards to R!Ciel, like Tanaka? 

By R!Ciel’s side, and in doing his duty by him as butler, Tanaka appears cold, as if he is just going through the motions, whereas he was a far more animated individual in O!Ciel’s service, often going above and beyond the call of duty and clearly doing what he did for O!Ciel out of care and respect as well as duty.

With R!Ciel, he appears to have checked out, and while he does his duty, there is none of the feeling. 

I think that Undertaker, to an extent, shares this disconnect. In Chapter 151, R!Ciel asks him for assistance with his Earl duties twice, but is flatly rejected both times. 

This struck me as a little odd. Whenever O!Ciel asked Undertaker to do something, though Undertaker was never willing to give his assistance without proper ‘payment’ (laughter), he at least offered O!Ciel the opportunity to get what he wanted (and O!Ciel did). Even when his true identity was revealed!

With R!Ciel, Undertaker completely snuffs the possibility of even trying to help. 

Yes, he really might not have a single clue about how to do what R!Ciel is asking of him, and I might be thinking too much into it. He would probably be a crap butler, but so was Sebastian when he started out. Undertaker knows this. Besides, wouldn’t Undertaker just find it hilarious, especially the reaction of his disgusted master when he shows him how terrible of a job he made of... well, everything!

I’d imagine Undertaker would much rather have that than sit in one place and read a book for two hours.

For Undertaker to make excuses, however true they might be, seems weird. He is speaking to ‘Earl Phantomhive’, whose predecessors he has assisted and cared for for at least two generations.

I wonder if this may tie in to the RCMT - Real Ciel Mastermind Theory, in which R!Ciel had involvement in or outright planned the Phantomhive massacre.

Undertaker would know this (as he rescued the boy and his ‘episodes’ from the fire... at least he claims to have anyway). If true, then Undertaker would have more than enough reason to only assist the boy insofar as it benefited his goal, but nothing more.

R!Ciel appears to respond in kind, by being curt and rude towards him, in spite of the fact that he owes Undertaker his ‘life’. 

Undertaker is literally the reason he is able to sit at a desk and look at paperwork. Hardly a ‘useless arse’. Then again, with his attitude towards Sebastian, R!Ciel is quite a different master than O!Ciel, so his attitude towards UT could be a product of that.

Alternatively, Undertaker’s response to R!Ciel’s requests may have to do with both his and Tanaka’s (seemingly) shared dislike of R!Ciel’s readiness to get stuck into his role as Earl (and, more importantly, Watchdog).

Very glum faces, both. I’m very interested to see their dynamic and relationship going forward, how much their shared long history as people close to the Phantomhive family informs their actions and connection.

Anyway, it seems clear that neither man is thrilled to see R!Ciel jump into O!Ciel’s shoes, most likely because they know what the role entails, possibly because of what it means for O!Ciel, or a mix of both. Maybe they fear what R!Ciel will do, what his newfound power could cause, for himself and O!Ciel.

Undertaker, as we know, hates the Queen, the Watchdog duty she places on the young Phantomhive heir, and now R!Ciel has returned, to see him willingly take that burden and that tragic fate on his shoulders must rankle Undertaker as much as it did with O!Ciel.

It’s difficult to know what Tanaka is thinking. Perhaps he is concerned for O!Ciel, or wary of R!Ciel’s intent, or perhaps he shares Undertaker’s desire for the boys to free themselves of their duty and heritage and find happiness.

In any case, Undertaker dragging his heels and rebuffing R!Ciel’s requests come in stark contrast to his attitude towards O!Ciel back when he was still ‘just the undertaker’, and I’d be willing to bet it’s more than just “I just can’t be arsed, kid!”.

#undertaker kuroshitsuji #undertaker black butler #black butler #kuroshitsuji #theory #meta #discussion #Tanaka #RCMT #Real Ciel Mastermind Theory

[cielsama14]

https://realcielmastermindsoundscool.wordpress.com/2018/04/02/rcmt-masterpost/

Ok I think it’s been years since I’ve last posted, but I suddenly got Real!Ciel inspiration recently (it’s a long story) and decided to update the masterpost after a long time. I mainly added stuff to the Bonus section but I also made some edits here and there. 

#real ciel #real ciel mastermind theory #rcmt #i don't think i'm really going to be active #i don't know if i'll even really post at all #but i'm still alive XD

[funtomrabbits]

Do you think the queen knows that OCiel isnt RCiel? because she never addressed him as Ciel in all her letter to him, it was always "to my cute boy", "to my adorable boy" so plainly, "boy". like she never said his name, which gives me a feeling that shes quite aware that he isnt the legitimate earl. and tbh, i highly dislike the queen, theres something fishy about her. especially that one scene in the manga -green witch arc i guess- when she told John that ciel resembles his father, idk.

Okay this might be a loaded answer but I’ve tried condensing it multiple times so please bear with me.

…she never addressed him as Ciel in all her letter to him, it was always “to my cute boy”, “to my adorable boy” so plainly, “boy”

The Queen’s terms of endearment that she’s always used for O!C (”my cute boy,” “my adorable boy,” etc.) I always thought were just that- terms of endearment. I never really looked at it as being that deep, although I know this is a key argument with people who believe the Queen is playing some darker role in the story (i.e. was involved with the Phantomhive murders). 

…which gives me a feeling that shes quite aware that he isnt the legitimate earl…theres something fishy about her. especially that one scene in the manga -green witch arc i guess- when she told John that ciel resembles his father, idk.

I wonder how she’d have any idea of the identity of which twin actually came back. And the offhand comment about O!C resembling Vincent could have just been a passing observation. 

The two biggest theories I see floating around are the infamous Real Ciel Mastermind Theory and the one involving the Queen. Imo both of them are so severely different and complex individually, that it’s hard to summarize the details of each. I bring this up because, while I don’t entirely agree with all the details of the RCMT, I lean towards it more than this one because of a couple reasons:

What motivation would the Queen have for killing off her most vital noble’s position?

She would have had to of known of the twins’ kidnapping, and if she wanted them dead as well, she would have made sure of it, especially after one of them came back. (Although with this I guess it could be argued that she might have known about the kidnappings and chose to do nothing about it. But we also have no way of knowing whether the Queen was actually just under the impression that they died like everyone else.)

How would the Queen know which twin was the one to survive?

If she was involved and wanted the Phantomhives gone, why hasn’t she done anything to threaten O!C’s life?

I may not be fond of the entirety of the RCMT, but it does provide more explanations as to why some events took place, the motivations R!C would have had, etc. I just feel like there’s more info to back it up- though at this point I’m not particularly against any theory. I’m sure the Queen might be revealed to have played a part in something, I’m just not sure what, but atm I’m more focused on R!C.

Thoughts from anyone else?

#i hope this answered your question haha #kuroshitsuji #our ciel #ciel phantomhive #real ciel mastermind theory #rcmt #real ciel #asks

[rationalkuroshitsuji]

Thoughts on RCMT

I am mostly on board with Real Ciel Mastermind Theory. I think it explains more than it doesn’t.

I can’t explain these gaps in it though:

If RC muzzled Sebastian the dog, when did he do it?

OC and RC were together all day before they waited in their room to be brought to their birthday party. RC only left OC when Tanaka failed to bring them downstairs.

That means something must have already gone weird in the mansion which stopped Tanaka, before RC had a chance to tie up the dog.

Either Sebastian the dog was unmuzzled in the mansion while someone else stopped the birthday party, or the person who stopped the party muzzled the dog.

Since we don’t hear a lot of commotion before the twins start to worry, I think it’s more likely that someone else muzzled the dog.

If RC killed Vincent, why is Undertaker on his side?

Undertaker’s motivation for bringing back RC, if you believe him (which maybe we shouldn’t), is that he cannot bear to lose another Phantomhive. But if RC killed Vincent, whom Undertaker loved, why would Undertaker work so hard to bring him back? Shouldn’t he be angry with RC? Why would he help Vincent’s killer?

Maybe Undertaker doesn’t know. I have a hard time believing that, because Undertaker was in the right place at the right time to retrieve the corpse. He knows a lot that we don’t know.

Maybe Undertaker knows but doesn’t care. I’d have a much easier time believing that Undertaker’s love of the Phantomhives trumps anger he’d have for Vincent’s killer, but I still think he ought to care.

#RCMT #real ciel mastermind theory #kuroshitsuji #black butler #chapter 140 analysis #rk reviews chapters #ciel phantomhive #undertaker

[piolhyna]

Okay, I have two Kuroshitsuji theories that I can’t get out of my mind, so I am going to post them here (spoilers, obviously):

I think RealCiel has his own soul back because UT snatched it away from Sebastian’s stomach at the Campania arc. I don’t know, alright, I just feel it. It is already clear he wanted to attack Sebastian to steal his cinematic record, not just to know why such a beast was acting that way but to also add that up to RealCiel’s bizarre doll new and improved cinematic record. BUT, did he really had to attack him directly at his stomach? Sebastian told us RealCiel’s soul was used to pay the fee so he could be on this land, but still, his soul could have been inside Sebastian all along and UT carefully prepared everything at the Campania to get that back. I know is very far-stretched but it could be! Every time I think about it more things add up  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I am pretty sure Doll is one of the Four Masters of the Guardian Stars. We already know RealCiel is Sirius, but since I saw that post saying all of the Four Masters must be Bizarre Doll children, I can’t help but wonder if Doll is one of them. She was close to OurCiel, also very dead but not incinerated, and UT was close enough from where it happened to grab her body. I mean, she kinda tried to kill OurCiel but still... (I just want Doll back okay, I liked her T.T)

Anyway, those are my thoughts!!

#kuroshitsuji #kuroshitsuji spoilers #black butler #undertaker #Campania Arc #bizarre dolls #kuroshitsuji theories #real ciel #our ciel #sebastian #ciel phantomhive #doll #circus arc #UT you absolute mastermind

[blackreapersreign]

Good afternoon! What is your current favorite headcanon or theory?

Well hello there. I’ve been thinking of how to answer this since you sent this ask... which is, of course, a long time ago. The thing is: I have two major theories I absolutely love, but they’re still in my drafts. Have been so for the past two years. So there’s that, I can’t talk about them.

But one that I’ve talked about already and I still really like is the theory about Polaris being the unknown prefect in this picture.

I still really like this theory. I am assuming we are going to find out Polaris’ identity when we’ll get to the final confrontation between the twins (basically at the end of Sebastian and our!Ciel’s mini-arc), and if Polaris was to actually be related to his father in some way, it would be a perfect trigger for the final arc. Perhaps Polaris is one of the people who died the night Vincent died, and he knows (and could reveal to our!Ciel) who the mastermind is? That would be interesting.

Plus, if Aleister and Vincent were already working together -> and now Undertaker and Aleister are working together -> and Polaris is working for real!Ciel -> and Polaris used to work for Vincent -> and Polaris, Vincent, Aleister and Diedrich all knew each other from their college days -> it would basically be a huge circle coming together for me and my theories.

I know that this is a major crack theory (as most of my theories are anyway) but yeah, you asked about favorites so... this is it. Thank you for asking and I hope you’re having a nice weekend! Sorry about taking so long to answer this! And stay safe! 

#kuroshitsuji #theory #kuro theories #polaris #aleister chamber #vincent phantomhive #our ciel #real ciel #undertaker #i mean i am open to all other theories on polaris #but i've had this for a long time and I will be going down with it

[sunshine-tattoo]

so here are my theories for upcoming kuroshitsuji chapters:

- the anime was a guideline for all the major plot points in the story

I've said it in another post, but since Yana had such a big impact on the writing of the anime that I think she went out of her way to make sure it followed the general path of her ideas.

-bard is gonna get a small storyline about his past

finny already had one during the green witch arc and mey rin is having one now. it makes sense to see more in-depth backstories on the servants

- the queen is gonna turn out to be the Final Boss

I'm not sure yet what her connection to all of this is yet, but she's definitely suspecious. Plus Queen Victoria was a complete monster in real life.

- Jon brown is a supernatural

eyes are a big symbol in this story and he constantly wears a visor. we saw the same with undertaker hiding his grim reaper eyes and mey rin hiding her owl eyes. Brown's weird connection to his horse is odd too.

- the Phantomhives have supernatural ancestry

what kind (demon, grim reaper, or angel) we don't know. But we do know that the ancestry of Claudia (Ciel's paternal grandmother) has been carefully hidden. Maybe undertaker was her father, making him Ciel's great grandfather.

- our ciel will prove himself the strongest Phantomhive and defeat his brother

o! Ciel has evolved so much since his family died. It's quite amazing. And I don't think r! Ciel understands that yet.

- undertaker is ultimately a good guy

whether he's a relative of Ciel's or not, he still cares about the family quite a lot. He and r! Ciel will probably team up with Ciel's crew to defeat the final boss, most likely the queen.

- the series will end with o!Ciel becoming a demon himself

I talked about this in another post, but I'll give the short version here. O! Ciel has always had the mindset of a demon: he's cunning and brilliant and loves to play games with his prey. His strategic skills as a child even allowed him to restrain Sebastian, who we know is exceedingly powerful.

most likely, the story will end once the final masterminds behind the Phantomhive murders have been dealt with. Most likely the queen and whatever the hell Jon Brown is.

R! Ciel will take the manor and marry Lizzy, once they are old enough. A great power couple.

Sieglinde will live with Wolfram in London and continue to invent wonderful things.

O! Ciel will sneak away a bunch of money from his brother and give it to the Servant Trio. Letting them start a peaceful life somewhere. Or they stay with Sieglinde as her household.

And o! Ciel will face Sebastian, ready to be devoured, only for Sebastian to smile and say that he has something better in mind. O! Ciel is of course stunned and Sebastian explains that the game they have spent the last 4 years playing together is the best fun he's ever had. And it would be a shame to waste such a potential for new games simply because he's hungry. Sebastian then picks him up and they dive into Hell together, ready to start a new life.

#kuroshitsuji demons #kuroshitsuji manga #kuroshitsuji #kuroshitsuji theory #Phantomhive family #demon ciel #our ciel #ciel phamtonhive #real ciel #servant trio #mey rin #bard #finny #sebastian michaelis #undertaker #kuroshitsuji arcs

[azuresins]

Here’s a hot take: OurCiel didn’t inherit asthma.  Edit 2/23/21: If he did inherit asthma, it was purposefully exacerbated: 

And as we all know, OC was extremely sick the next morning and couldn’t go on the boating trip. Honey might have been in the milk, but I’m betting there was something else in the milk. A lot of poisons are sweet, and are only lethal in certain amounts.  And then, fast forward to much later in the manga:   

Why wouldn’t he be coughing and unspeakably ill in such deplorable, utterly filthy conditions? He’s a sickly child, after all. With an Aunt who is a doctor with the best care he could have had he was often sick at home. After all the abuse he was subjected to, in such a terrible place for MONTHS, we see no coughing? Nothing? 

This is the first thing RCiel says to his brother. He scolds him for being outside in the rain and delivers this line.  The Theory Is: Real Ciel, was hiding some dark, dark turmoil as a small child. From everyone including even his own family, his twin, and his dear butlers. Likely, he had a very real serious case of munchausen by proxy. Accompanied by other mental illnesses.  While RC may or may not be the mastermind behind everything, he had problems, well before he became a bizarre doll.  Edit: 2/23/21 - Even if RC was not the entire mastermind behind it all, I think he had his role to play in what happened ultimately to the Phantomhives and the mastermind exploited him.  While OC was later shown having asthma attacks, it very well could have been asthma induced by the poisons he was subjected to as a small child, between the ages of five to ten.  If he was indeed poisoned for five years, it surely had some permanent effect on his health and lungs-- but it would not be as predictable and as simple to treat, as an ordinary case of naturally-inherited asthma.  *Edit: Many people are pointing out the circus ark asthma attack, and his diagnosis as “asthma” but remember: This is the 19th century we’re dealing with. Misdiagnosis happens today. If it looked like asthma and his mother had it, there’s no reason for them to call it anything else. Edit: 2/23/21

This is one of the Translation Notes in Chapter 32 of the Circus Ark. Even Yana Toboso Herself pointed out during this time period “Asthma” was the slap-on diagnosis for a lot of illnesses even from the most skilled physicians.  I’d like to point out every attack he suffered so far in this story, was triggered by something severe. We have yet to see an unprovoked, completely random, asthma attack.  Scarred lungs, and Lung damage is more fickle and harder to predict than run-of-the-mill asthma. Asthma attacks can occur unprovoked and O!Ciel has never had one without a serious irritant present. In the circus ark, it was the cold/wet that aggravated his lungs. He had another attack while a raging fire and smoke was beside him and smoke is harsh.  Also, why didn’t the bloody mustard gas in the green witch arc pretty much kill him if it was asthma? His eyes and skin were affected first, not his lungs?  On another note, RC was not a stupid child.

Taken from Kuroshitsuji Side story; a story that is considered in direct relation to the circus Ark. We know he was sneaking cough drops, which had medicinal properties/laudanum in them, during the time period.  Real!Ciel was taught how to carefully cook (How to use a victorian stove) and how to carefully measure. There isn’t much else needed to know if your intention is to tamper with someone’s food.  We KNOW he knows how to use the stove because this same night was the very night he snuck the warmed-milk and honey to his brothers bedroom. We also know that RC was the one who was allowed to carry the meal up to his brother, and was left with his food; unattended.   He wouldn’t have done this if he thought he would get caught.  And for the record, because this is important: if he was a mentally ill child, that doesn’t make him evil! And I’m not trying to imply that he was/is or label him as such! Merely, that he was sick himself.  Finally, as I and others have pointed out: Sebastian the Dog treated OC differently from EVERYONE in his family, Including Rachel-- who had the same illness? Yeah, sorry, I don’t buy that! I don’t buy he hated OC for no reason until the last second the dog was alive. I think he was trying to call attention to something and protect him the best way he knew how without hurting RC ; dogs know. 

Edit 8/10/18 - I was talking with @mischief-mage​ - they pointed out that the comfort food that RC gives to OC has ties to fairy tales to being poisonous.  -Mushrooms can be poisonous  -Poison apples? (In snow white?) There is symbolism here. 

And not only that-- 

If you recall the time OC was sick in the Circus Arc and recovering in the London Town house, Sebastian made OC the exact same comfort foods.

So it was NOT just a coincidence that Sebastian made OC the milk and honey. Sebastian may know these foods bring comfort to OC but how?  Edit: 2/23/21 Admittedly I had forgot Sebastian just happened upon the reciepe, but I think he had a lingering instinct that it meant something to O!Ciel.  He has RealCiel’s soul inside him, afterally. But if he was able to obtain this information, what else does he know?  New Spice to this Theory: Sebastian knows RC was poisoning his Master, and has kept his mouth shut this entire time. 

#I updated a few things #real ciel #our ciel #INTERESTING SO INTERESTING #kuroshitsuji spoilers #the snow white poison reference is also like.... pointing to his name being Fenian but I mean #The plot is always thickening isnt it #umf #kuroshitsuji theory #spoilers #meta #black butler #real!ciel poison theory #RC poison theory

[thedarkestcrow]

i've reread the chapter back and forth but i still do not understand why RCiel betrayed OCiel. his motives and intentions, its not like OCiel killed him. he even went as far to using Lizzy to hurt OCiel, that's one of the worst besides killingAgni. I'm not even surprised if he decided to kill Lizzy if she choose OCiel(whichwouldeventuallyhappen). btw this is the second time i asked this question coz i am so confused with the new 'I'm not a robot' quiz so im not sure if the 1st one got thru to u

Hi. :) I only got your question this once so I guess the other one didn’t get through. I hope this is not happening to more people. ;^^

I think the most important thing about this topic you’re referring to is that real Ciel now isn’t the person anymore he once was. He died in that cult and even though Undertaker has found a way to revive him to this level of seemingly perfection he’s surely not exactly like he was back before he died. His soul was eaten by Sebastian so it should be gone for good. Undertaker may have revived his body and saved his memories but without his soul it’s surely not the same as before.

If Undertaker used a similar method for real Ciel as with Agares in the School arc real Ciel, too, may run on episodes aka his yearnings for the future. And it was quite obvious in the flashback that real Ciel’s plans for his future always revolved around being with his brother. Just remember how upset he was when our Ciel told him about his own plans which didn’t fit with real Ciel’s vision of having our Ciel nearby all the time.

So if he was that upset back then already, imagine how he must feel now if he’s solely running on his wish to be with his brother forever. It must have become an obsession to the point where everything and everyone else doesn’t matter anymore and he’s willing to do horrible things if it serves the purpose of binding our Ciel to himself forever. And that’s what I think he’s trying to achieve by his actions. He may want to isolate our Ciel from all those he has formed a connection with so that real Ciel will be the only one left to turn to. Even having him arrested might be part of that plan if it serves to break our Ciel to make him more dependent on his brother again.

It doesn’t matter to real Ciel anymore what happens to everyone else in that process. Even our Ciel’s well-being seems not that important at long as real Ciel gets the future he’s always imagined as a child: Him being the Earl with our Ciel by his side as his weak little brother who’s dependent on real Ciel.

Real Ciel surely had issues before. Especially if the “real Ciel mastermind” theory has any truth to it. But now that he’s been revived he has changed for the worse and his obsession is getting out of control with no regard to anyone else.

#analysis: the twin #my analysis #anonymous #replies

[midnight-in-town]

Maybe its a unpopular opinion but i think that Real!Cile wouldn't be like that if he had still his soul (so if he was still alive). I think that the lack of soul has a impact. Bizarre Doll can love without one but on the long term, i think that there are consequence. Soul are often tied to rationality, emotions and stuff like that. Real!Cile didn't have grow up, Undertaker has just mess with his memories+body. His obession over his little brother would have vanished with time but without soul...

Hey Anon!

While I agree that Bizarre Dolls are definitely more messed up and insane than alive humans (because their record is edited, namely with their "yearnings for the future" being implemented, turning them into obsessed zombies), to this day I still think that real!Ciel's obsession with his little brother was not your usual childish whim.

I've written about this in the past, so if you're interested in a more detailed analysis of the twin, please read the following posts:

The main difference between the twins

Personal take on the real!Ciel "mastermind theory" (RCMT) 

The RCMT tag

Feel free to disagree, of course, and I don't know whether or not it's an unpopular opinion in the fandom but it's certainly not one I share. :))

Have a good weekend Anon!

#kuroshitsuji #2CT #ciel phantomhive #undertaker #rcmt #kuroshitsuji theory #answers #anon

[abybweisse]

The think I don't like about rciel mastermind theory is that it just ....doesn't make sense. I'm not saying rciel is a good person or not but he was a child and also it's very predictable and a boring storyline,I think there is much more behind the fire of that day, but I do think maybe he knew somethings maybe he had over heard things because of his expression is some panels. But overall the idea of a 10 year old planing and bringing down his own family is just a bit funny to me😂

RCMT nonsense?

Yeah, it really doesn't make much sense. Of course, there are different versions of the theory, but they usually include some type of secret deal being made between real Ciel and the queen or her servants, and -- to me -- it also makes no sense for a ten year old to be making deals like that, especially managing to keep all of it secret from his family. How would Vincent know something's up and plan for his own demise but not know his own child was involved? How would Tanaka not know way in advance? And let's not forget that the twins were mostly raised by Rachel and Aunt An until the attack. These kids were doted on, not neglected or left alone to their own devices. If anything, our earl is the one who seems to have any alone time. Regardless of why the queen and/or her servants would target the Phantomhives, why on Earth would they involve the ten year old heir of their target and actually entrust him with any of this knowledge?

Ambition is one of the major motives mentioned by individuals who support some version of this theory, but this is a child who clearly acts like a child, despite whatever evil streak he possesses. I see no reason for the queen to be interested in including real Ciel in any plans she might have to make him the next watchdog sooner than later, plus he was obviously not ready for the responsibility yet. I should think if he approached any of her staff about wanting to become watchdog sooner, they'd laugh it off. There's also no evidence yet that real Ciel has ever met the queen herself. And if he hoped to avoid becoming watchdog altogether, this definitely isn't the way to go about it. He'd be better off running away or flat-out refusing to take the post.

Another motive mentioned in versions of the theory is to get rid of their parents so that real Ciel can make his brother stay with him forever. For one thing, I cannot envision any way for that to not backfire, even if the whole thing had gone exactly as planned. One can argue that he's ten and just doesn't see that clearly, but I'd just say "Yeah, he's ten... and if he can't see that plans like that won't achieve his goal, he's also not likely to be able to even plan stuff like that, let alone try to carry it out". There's also the fact that we've seen Rachel show real Ciel how he can still be close to his brother and help him out. Rachel even suggests that our earl would be largely dependent upon the help of his older brother, the one who will be titled and will hold the key to the family coffers. So, all real Ciel would need to do is enjoy the remaining time with his family and, when he's earl, make it so that his brother spends as much time with him as possible... even if it means holding funding over his head to keep him around. Both boys likely would have been sent to Weston, too, since some other students there are second (and possibly third) sons. At such a young age (when they turn 13 and go to Weston), he wouldn't be ready to go off on his own to London, or whatever, so our earl would be happy to attend school with his older brother... and learn whatever he could that might help him later set up and run his toy business.

And when people talk about the fire, like who might have started it, I have to remind them that our earl doesn't even know about the fire until he returns to the manor and sees the burnt ruins for himself. Chances are, that fire wasn't started at all until after the boys were crated up and carted off.

The whole idea of RCTM strikes me as poorly thought out in every aspect. Less funny, more sad.

#black butler #kuroshitsuji #attack at the manor #fire at the manor #discussion #rcmt #anon #i answered a thing #answered asks #jun 17 2023 #sorry for the delay

[cielsama14]

Alright, finally updated the masterpost! The main things to look out for are the details about the Druitt comparison and the mirror dynamic that I added to the Pawn vs Mastermind section along with the integration of the mirror dynamic post I made a while ago as a side note after the motives section. 

#real ciel #real ciel mastermind theory #also finally put it in that rc being a bizarre doll is confirmed

[funtomrabbits]

If the Real Ciel Mastermind Theory turns out to be canon and if Ciel intentionally planned for his parents to be killed on their birthday, it makes the situation even more sinister to think that Ciel might have considered it as sort of a 'birthday present' to OC in that he'd be getting rid of the people (his parents, etc) who were standing in the way of them "always being together."

#just a thought #kuroshitsuji #ciel phantomhive #our ciel #real ciel #2ct #phantomhive twins #real ciel mastermind theory #rcmt

[rationalkuroshitsuji]

Ch 143 review: RCMT + Undertaker and Sebastian

(Ch 143 pg 10)

Real Ciel is very much set up as the villain in this arc. That makes me think Real Ciel mastermind theory -- the theory that Real Ciel is responsible for the original attack on the manor -- is a little more likely to be true. 

If it turns out to be true, then I think that makes Undertaker and Sebastian’s duel a lot more interesting. 

Undertaker and Sebastian have been playing chess for control over Ciel’s body and soul since the Campania arc, when Undertaker outmaneuvered Sebastian and viewed his record. Undertaker outmaneuvered Sebastian at the end of the Weston arc as well, forcing Sebastian to protect Ciel and allow Undertaker to get away. 

Sebastian’s end-goal is to allow his young master to achieve his revenge, locating and eliminating the “mastermind” behind his family’s attacks.

If his older brother was responsible for the attack, and if Undertaker had not reanimated his brother’s corpse, then it would have been impossible for Our Ciel to find the true “mastermind.” * 

So Undertaker would have done Sebastian a huge favor by restoring the target of OC’s revenge and delivering him directly to his home.

That sits weird with me. I don’t think Undertaker has any incentive to do Sebastian any favors. He seemed fine with the fact that Sebastian was protecting the Earl, but I always got the impression that Undertaker was okay with that on a temporary basis, and he always intended to separate Sebastian from his young master for his own good.

Undertaker and Sebastian’s game of chess has been so one-sided that I would love to see Sebastian take an opportunity to pull one over the Undertaker. 

* If RC and Undertaker were never involved at all, OC might have still eventually have found someone he decided was the mastermind. He just wouldn’t have been correct. Sebastian wouldn’t have to tell him he was wrong before he called the contract fulfilled. 

To be honest I think Sebastian never expected OC to find a “mastermind,” and that’s why Sebastian looks resigned to this contract when they leave the manor where the twins were tortured, because he doesn’t think it’s likely they’ll find someone who fits the bill within OC’s lifetime.

#kuroshitsuji #black butler #ciel phantomhive #real ciel phantomhive #undertaker #sebastian michaelis #rk reviews chapters #chapter 143