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#Suki meta
zuko-always-lies · 19 days
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What exactly were everyone's character arcs supposed to be?
This is an interesting question for ATLA, and one sometimes without a clear answer. Some characters have reasonably complete character arcs, and others simply don't, to a degree which is often not acknowledged today. A few are in-between. This not necessarily a function of screen time. Jet and Yue have reasonably complete character arcs despite only briefly appearing, while others with far more screen time do not.
Without further ado, I'll go through the characters one by one and try to give an answer:
Yue, as I said, has a story which feels complete with a beginning, middle, and end. She's a very duty bound person committed a political marriage to help her tribe, a person who was saved by the holy symbols of it in the first place. Then she falls in love with Sokka but refuses to break off her engagement out of duty. And finally she sacrifices her life out of duty to save everyone.
Jet also feels like he has an arc. You can take issue with how it was written and how it plays out, since he really got the short straw, but it's an arc. From being orphaned by the Iroh-aligned Rough Rhinos, to fighting the Fire Nation and going "too far," to trying to make a new start in Ba Sing Se, to correctly getting suspicious about Zuko and Iroh, to being brainwashed by the Dai Li, to dying fighting against Long Feng. It's not nearly as coherent as Yue's arc, but it's something.
Suki, by contrast, doesn't have much of an arc. I've heard before the concept of "character arc" being defined as "either the character changes or the audience's perception of them changes." Neither of those things ever happen with Suki. She remains unchanged, and we learn nothing really about her. The only meaningful character change which happens is that she and Sokka fall in love.
Aang quite obviously has an arc: grow into the position of Avatar, defeat the Firelord, befriend Zuko, and the end the war. And, of course, get together with Katara.
Zuko also has an arc, which the show probably spends more time on than with anyone else: change sides, become friends with the Gaang(although that bit was very poorly written), and reject his abusive father and instead start worshipping his uncle. And I suppose grow strong enough to beat the crap out of his sister, like he's always wanted to do.
Iroh, by contrast, couldn't have less of an arc. Any attempt to read an arc into the mess of extremely incoherent writing he was would require extreme charity. In the end, we're supposed to both accept he "changed" offscreen before the show(that his arc was already mostly complete?) but also that he was "always good" anyways.
Toph doesn't have an arc. 90% of her character development, such as it was, is confined to her first two appearances. After that, she's merely a hanger on to the Gaang. As much as people love her, there is so little to her story. Her character is better defined than Suki, but her story isn't.
Azula is supposed to have an arc. It's supposed to be about falling apart, going insane, and being lain low. But it was extremely rushed and shoved unconvincingly into the last few episodes, and the writers were uninterested in explaining what actually happened to make her fall apart, so I struggle to say she has anything resembling a coherent arc.
Ty Lee also doesn't have an arc. Her arc, such as it was imagined, was supposed to "betray Azula." Yet none of the character development she gets over the series leads in that direction, and we have every reason to believe she would have acted the same at the beginning of the series as she did at the end. And of course there was no "redemption" aside from switching sides for her.
Mai has slightly more of an arc than Ty Lee, but that's only because it involves her getting together with Zuko and eventually sacrificing herself to protect him. Otherwise, it's about as coherent as Ty Lee's arc.
Sokka's arc is an interesting one. I would say that there are four things they experiment with as the basis for his arc. First, there is his distrust for Aang, which is rapidly resolved. Second is his sexism, which is equally rapidly resolved. Third is unease over being a nonbender, but that's only rarely referenced over the course of the series, and is fully "resolved" in the truly awful episode "Sokka's Master" early in Book 3. Finally, there is the issue of his daddy issues and his desire to prove himself as a warrior. That is something his story keeps coming back to over and over again. However, it is almost entirely resolved in the Day of Black Sun episodes, where Sokka leads the SWT in battle, despite a couple weird later references in the Boiling Rock episodes. Thus, I would Sokka has an arc, but it's resolved well before the series ends.
Finally, we reach Katara. I don't think Katara really has much of a coherent arc in the series. In Book 1, it was all about her trying to become a master waterbender, but she achieves that by the end of the Book. After that, her character lacks clear direction. What's her story supposed to be about after that? Getting together with Aang? "Forgiving Zuko"? The daddy issues which show up for exactly one episode? The conflict with Toph which shows up for two? "Accepting that ordinary Fire Nation people are people too," even though she was always shown to be compassionate to ordinary Fire Nation people not actively engaged in genocide? The "mommy issues" which she often brings up but which are rarely taken seriously by the show, and are ultimately used to get her to forgive Zuko (two separate times!)? All of these seem completely unworthy of hanging her arc on, and I have to say, I don't think Katara has much of a coherent arc past Book 1.
If we had to order these characters in terms of coherence of arc from most to least, it would probably go something like: Aang, Zuko, Yue, Jet, Sokka, Katara, Azula, Mai, Ty Lee, Iroh, Toph, Suki.
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prodogg · 2 years
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Soooo I was reading again and I recognized Suki is very often very negatively against Azula or has a healthy suspicion of her, which is good but I was asking myself is that really true for Suki. You are probably asking yourself if I have drunk some cactus juice but hear me out. We see Suki be very quickly friendly to Sokka after beating his ass for sexist remarks and seeing her get along with him, then we see Suki be very fast accepting of Zuko after a half assed apology at the boiling rock for attacking her and burning her village.
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Then we come to Ty Lee, who was part of the trio that took down the Kyoshi Warriors and it’s for me implied that she took down Suki as well. At the boiling rock Suki was focused on Ty Lee only and don’t even bat an eyelash towards Azula.
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You see, after the war Ty Lee was accepted into the Warrior’s, yes Ty Lee got along with them before hand in prison but Suki is the leader and has to nod it off. So, again Suki is being quickly forginving to somebody.
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In all cases we can see Suki was forgiving and accepting after the person showed Suki they are better, it could be argued that she was tolerating Zuko at first but this is not important right now. Now we come to Azula who was just like Ty Lee a part of the trio that beat her and the Kyoshi Warrior’s, we know that Ty Lee beat her so the hurt pride and anger for that is directed at Ty Lee so where are we now, Azula was only responsible for putting Suki in prison, which makes it not even a personal problem Suki has with Azula. So because of this I’m just confused when Suki is mostly so negative in fics and holds a grudge towards Azula because I think Suki is a very forgiving person imo based on the above mentioned points, ofc Azula has to do something that would give Suki the nudge to forgive her for putting her in prison but I don’t see her as this always negatively person toward Azula. I didn’t consider any Comics for this post and oriented myself on atla show events. Of course this is my opinion. I would be interested in what you think about my take that Suki is a quickly forgiving person and please excuse any mistakes because it’s 1 am, I’m tired and don’t want to edit.
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the-power-of-stuff · 26 days
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Just sat through the first three NATLA live els and have so many thoughts - the first thing I did was come straight over to your blog because why wouldn’t I?!?
A part of me LOVES Suki’s awkwardness. In fact, none of the gripes I have with Suki and Sokka aren’t about Suki and Sokka and their characterisation themselves, but rather just the execution.
But anyways — the vibe I’m getting is that Season 2 (Book 1? I’m not sure if they’re going by seasons or books) is laying down the groundwork for some of the characters. We know they’re doing that with Azula (and the Fire Lord fam as a whole), but it seems like they’re sort of doing the same with Katara, where they’re starting off with her being a traumatised, almost-shy 14 year old girl who comes into her own as the season progresses.
While I haven’t watched the show in it’s entirety — I probably should have before sending this ask in — I’m assuming this is all leading up to her confrontation with Pakku and role in defending the Northern Water Tribe towards the end of the season. And then that new found confidence in herself and her waterbending carries though to season 2, where we’ll (presumably) find a more fiery, outspoken Katara after I’m guessing a somewhat lengthy time jump?
Anyway — back to Suki. My question to you is, if I’m right in my theory about Katara (and all the others, tbh… I feel like what I said for K can apply to pretty much any of the gaang at this point), do you think the same could be said for Suki and her own development?
We see Suki at the start of ep 2 as a fierce yet slightly socially awkward, sheltered warrior who wants to leave her village and aid in the fight against the Fire Nation and travel the world. As it goes, she does leave her village, and perhaps becomes the confident and sassy (and awful at puns) girl we all know and love, all through her experiences aiding in the war and travelling the world?
Of course, this would mean that her development would largely happen off-screen… but even still, Suki was more familiar towards the end of the episode. She was the one who initiated the kiss, she made her feelings and mostly gratitude known to Sokka by giving him her fan, she told the gaang they had to leave.
It feels like that’s the route Albert Kim is going. He’s made it clear that it’s a re imagination and not a 1:1 adaptation. He clearly wants the show to have its own identity to some extent (e.g. the genocide actually being shown and basically being a mini prologue to the series) and this is his way of doing so through characterisation.
I’ve written way more than I intended, so sorry for this long winded tangent. But what I mean to ask is, do you think in season 2 we’ll see a Suki more similar to the og (while of course still being her own).
I’d love to know what you think! x
Ahh, this makes me so happy!! Thank you so much for enjoying this blog, and for sharing your thoughts and sending this ask! <3 (And absolutely no need to apologize for writing so much, either! Goodness knows I could go on forever about this stuff.)
I think you make a really good point about characterization in the LA, and the potential for certain traits (like Katara's fieriness) to develop more over time. And I've been thinking about it in terms of what we already know about LA Suki that could get built upon in later seasons.
I definitely think it would make sense for us to see Suki come out of her shell a bit more in season 2, although there are some things in the LA that make it hard for me to imagine Suki being quite as sassy as her animated counterpart, just because of the sort of foundation it gives us for her personality.
For one, there's Suki's interactions with her mother. If anyone were going to be on the receiving end of a teenage daughter's sass, even if that sass is buried too deep in shyness to come out around said daughter's crush, it would be her mother. And while we kinda sorta see Suki get a little petulant with Yukari (her delivery of "I'm not too young, I just haven't seen the world" is kind of a swipe? but is really very heartfelt), she overall seems like a well-behaved, obedient daughter. This isn't a King Triton/Ariel situation where you get the impression they've had this conversation a million times before and Yukari is exasperated by Suki always questioning her authority. In fact, it feels like the first time Yukari's even considered that Suki might want something more, and she seems pretty amenable to it, if the fact that she didn't storm into the dojo to break up Sokka and Suki's near-makeout session is any indication. So, even in these private moments where you'd assume Suki is more herself, there isn't much sass to be seen.
(Somewhat related to this, I had a funny sort of "Huh!" reaction to Yukari's, "Such a fierce warrior. And yet such a kind heart." Not that I don't think Suki is kind! It's just not one of the first words I would use to describe her. And not that I would've expected Yukari to say, "Such a fierce warrior. And yet also kind of a pill because you're always giving me lip." But that bit of dialogue is there for the audience's benefit; it was a choice the writers made to tell us what they think is important for us to know about Suki's character. So I had a moment of, "Oh, that's the takeaway we're supposed to have? Interesting...")
And then there's Suki's later interactions with Sokka. On the one hand, when they're training together, the romantic tension is through the roof; it's all very new and interesting for them and it makes sense that they'd still be a little shy about it. On the other hand, Suki gets comfortable enough around Sokka at this point to 1) remove her makeup, 2) have a deep conversation with him, and 3) touch him on the chest. We don't see her show the same awkwardness from earlier in the episode, but she also continues to be very serious. When Sokka pins her, and then she flips them over while he's mid-celebration, she follows up with a useful tip about fighting, and it's delivered completely straight (if a little breathless). No little jokes or jabs. No "Don't get cocky" or knowing smirks.
However, we are not completely without sass! There are a couple moments in particular that I feel have some of that familiar Suki flair.
First...
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Lookit her smirky little "come at me, bro" face! That face 100% says, "C'mon then, let's see it, if you're so tough." There's a playfulness here, too, which we know is very much a part of her relationship with Sokka in the animated show. (This Suki up here? I could easily see this Suki saying, "😠I'm an elite warrior who's trained for many years in the art of stealth... I think I could get you backstage!😁")
And then...
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The thing I love about this is that she's all, "Nuh uh, I don't think so" (her little head wiggle!), but a fraction of a second ago she was staring blatantly at that boy's mouth. Nice try, sweetheart, but you ain't foolin' anybody. (This Suki is the Suki who smacks her forehead when her boyfriend tells terrible puns to actor-Sokka but who later gazes at him adoringly when he absolutely loses his shit because actor-Sokka actually said "rocky relationship" on stage.)
So...I guess the tl;dr answer to your question is, kind of? I can't see LA Suki getting to "Sorry, Warden, you're my prisoner now" levels of sass, but that's not really the tone the LA is going for anyway. I think we'll see her being very bold (a la taking the initiative to kiss Sokka) and very compassionate (saving Appa—I hope!!), and it makes total sense that, next time we see her, she'll be way more confident than the girl who could barely say a single word to Sokka before attempting to strangle him by way of flirtation. I also hope we'll get to see more of her playfulness! Maybe even some successful flirting? Probably not as forward as "Look at you, sleeveless guy...been workin' out?" but I'd settle for a sly head tilt and a cheeky little grin. And based on what we know of her so far, I don't think that's too much to ask. ;)
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Why Did Suki Quickly Become Friends with Zuko, Mai, and Ty Lee
A common complaint people have about Suki’s character is the fact that she not only quickly became friends with Zuko, Mai, and Ty Lee while letting the latter into the Kyoshi Warriors, but also became Zuko’s bodyguard in the comics at Mai’s request, even though the Kyoshi Warriors have no ties to the Fire Nation and the Earth Kingdom needs help rebuilding.
For Zuko burned her village and only offered a meek apology when she pressed him about it while Mai and Ty Lee, even if they were instrumental in helping her, Sokka, and Hakoda escape the Boiling Rock, are never seen on screen or on panel actively rejecting the Fire Nation’s imperialist ideology or apologizing for the actions they took under Azula’s commands, acts that include helping Azula imprison the Kyoshi Warriors before using their identities to overthrow the Earth Kingdom.
So why is Suki so quick to forgive and befriend Zuko, Mai, and Ty Lee when they, on the surface, have done little to apologize for their past actions and Suki still vehemently dislikes Azula, Zuko, Mai, and Ty Lee’s former associate?
Well, in regards to Zuko, best explanation for Suki quickly forgaving him is that without him defecting to the Gaang, not only would she still be in the Boiling Rock getting tortured (deliberate starvation is torture), but also the Earth Kingdom would have been burned to ground since the Gaang would have never confronted Ozai before the Comet passed without Zuko telling them of Ozai's plans for genocide. 
Moreover, assuming Aang doesn't find a way to restore the Avatar State without the pointy rock, or he never finds Iroh and learns lightning redirection from him, Aang would have died to Ozai's lightning if he tried ever tried confronting Ozai, especially during Sozin's Comet. 
Additionally, even if Suki hadn't completely forgiven Zuko by the time the Kyoshi Warriors became his bodyguards, she is smart enough to realize that if Zuko dies: the old and disgraced, both in the Fire Nation and world at large, Iroh takes the throne with no guarantee he lives long enough to raise another heir to adulthood; the world goes back to war since no one in the other nations would find it acceptable to have Ozai or Azula on the throne; or the Fire Nation devolves into civil war, with the rest of the world suffering as the violence will mostly likely not be contained in the Fire Nation, and the Fire Nation would likely to be unable to continue paying reparations.
Meanwhile, I think the best explanation for Suki quickly forgiving Mai and Ty Lee, outside of them betraying Azula playing a key role in her and half of the Gaang's survival, as well as playing a major role in Azula's defeat, is the assumption that they were forced to do Azula's bidding the whole time under the threat of death, or worse, to themselves and/or their loved ones. 
For I know people hate it, but the comics strongly imply that Mai and Ty Lee were never really friends with Azula, only her coerced subjects who had no choice but to follow her unless they wanted to suffer.
So I guess once Mai and Ty Lee got to explain themselves to the Gaang and the Kyoshi Warriors, with Zuko providing context, I think Suki decided to let bygones be bygones. 
Especially since she knows first-hand that Azula is willing torture those who have "crossed" her, and Mai and Ty Lee, at least until Ty Lee was transferred over to the prison where the other Kyoshi Warriors where staying, got thrown into the tortious Boiling Rock when they disobeyed Azula to protect a loved one.
So to conclude, the reason why Suki is so quick to forgive Zuko, Mai, and Ty Lee while also allowing Ty Lee to join the Kyoshi Warriors and eventually become Zuko’s bodyguard is because: their actions at the end of the war were instrumental to her and the Earth Kingdom’s continued survival, she knows first-hand how scary Azula can be, and because she knows Zuko remaining on the throne is key to ensuring the post-war order remains in tact.
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ilikepjo24 · 5 months
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Sokka could have killed Azula if he wanted to, indeed. He could force her to retreat even more, cause I her to fall. He could stab her. He didn't. He retreated and let Zuko throw a fireball at her, one that she managed to avoid.
That says a lot about Sokka and about everyone else on that rooftop as well.
Sokka didn't want to kill Azula. He could. And it would be convenient for him a Team Avatar if he had. But despite her imprisoning his dad and girlfriend, and ruining his dobs plan and killing his best friend and almost harming his sister on multiple occasions, he still doesn't want to kill Azula.
However, I don't think it's about being a good person or anything like that. Sokka was never afraid to do sketchy shit if that's what needed to be done. He invaded the Fire Nation when they were at their weakest. He crashed airships, killing hundreds, without even giving it a second thought. He killed the Combustion man without flinching. He wouldn't be afraid to kill Azula if that's what he thought was necessary.
And yet, he didn't. There could be multiple reasons why. It could be that he feared if the most important person (by FN standards) in the elevator thingy was dead, the guards wouldn't hesitate to cut the line immediately. It could be that he thought they had a chance of capturing her and having a vulnerable hostage, since they had better numbers. It could be for Zuko's sake. As a brother, it's possible he wouldn't be interested in killing a little sister infront of her older brother.
As for Suki and Zuko... They don't hate Azula. Sokka just threw away an opportunity of getting rid of an enemy and none of his allies that saw it were bothered. No one said "wtf are you doing? Why would you do that? You could have saved us so much trouble!". They are not eager to see Azula dead despite her being their enemy. Suki doesn't hate Azula, even after Azula imprisoned her. And Zuko doesn't hate Azula either, so all the fics of him having Azula endure any kind of torture are ooc, and they need to be stopped.
No, seriously, stop it.
When it comes to Ty Lee, I noticed that she didn't react to her friend almost dying? I don't think it because Ty Lee doesn't care for Azula, so it's either that she didn't notice because she was busy, or that she had trust in Azula's abilities to make it out alive.
And Azula is... interesting. She either doesn't value her life, or she values it, but she values her duty more. There's no other option. Because how TF is half your foot touching sweet death, and then you just continue without flinching or being scared or anything? You just move on? Honestly, whether Azula doesn't care about being alive that much, or does care, but would still find it honorable to die on duty, it's still interesting. It creates lot of questions about Azula's mental state at the moment and about her dedication to her father and country. Where does it end?
If it's neither of the two, then Azula was just being an arrogant-ass motherfucker which also creates questions. Is it because she trusted her own abilities a lot? Is it because she believed Zuko wouldn't let her die? Is it because she thought Sokka wouldn't kill her? And why is that? Does she consider him soft, cause he didn't hurt her in the dobs, or does he consider him too weak to kill her? And is that because he's a "water tribe savage" or because he's a nonbender?
Every time Azula is on screen, there are so many things to analyze!!
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fantastic-nonsense · 2 years
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Sometimes I wonder if Zuko occasionally has moments where he remembers his friends are all basically Titans in their field and thinks "Man am I glad I chose their side."
Aang: the literal Avatar, mastered three elements in under a year
Katara: immensely creative waterbending prodigy (both offensively and defensively) who can heal and bloodbend
Toph: master earthbender who invented metalbending and held the Library up by a single spire with nothing but her bare hands, in the sand, at the age of 12
Suki: Leader of the Kyoshi Warriors at 16
Sokka: master tactician, strategist, and war leader who also more-or-less invented the Fire Nation's airships
Meanwhile Zuko isn't even the best firebender in his own family, for all that he's an expert swordsmaster, the Firelord, and leading his nation into a new era. It's got to be a humbling experience for him sometimes.
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The Boiling Rock is the The Rundown Job in ATLA verse and The Rundown Job is The Boiling Rock in Leverage universe. I said what I said.
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thebakingqueen5 · 2 years
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queer atla headcanons
aka me, a bisexual nonbinary mass of flesh, testing my gaydar
Aang: pansexual, goes by he/they, assumes everyone is pan unless given an indication otherwise, audibly gasped when Tenzin came out as straight, constantly argues with Katara over which flag (bi or pan) is prettier
Katara: bisexual and demisexual, she/her, came out to Aang while they were engaged by saying "Aang... I like boys and girls" and to this day has not gotten over the fact that he responded, "yeah ofc, doesn't everyone?", only identifies as bi because she doesn't like the pan flag's yellow
Sokka: bisexual, Zuko was his bi awakening, deals with some internalized biphobia poor bby but works through it eventually, bonded a lot with Katara over their sexuality crises
Suki: they/she but still considers themself cis, aggressively bisexual and poly-questioning, takes offense to being called an ally, she and Sokka facepainted each other's cheeks with the bi flag for their first pride parade and it is still one of their most cherished memories <3
Toph: goes by she/they mainly, doesn't care a ton about labels but identifies as ace and pan, knows every gay bar in the United Republic and drags Sokka to them often (Suki highly encourages this), uses neopronouns when they feel like it
Zuko: bisexual, so so so much internalized homophobia from the Fire Nation but he also works through it, comes out to Mai first after a few months of internal and her response is just "cool," had a gender crisis for a while there but is 99% sure he is cis... probably
Mai: queer but doesn't want to put a specific label on it, Ty Lee sees auras but Mai sees Gay^TM and is as a result never surprised when ppl come out, holes herself up in the palace every pride month (bc Zuko did declare it to be a thing after the war) bc of all the colors
Azula: thought she was bi at first but realizes she was a lesbian in denial when she gets the healing arc she deserved, calls everyone into the royal meeting room to say, "I am a lesbian" and the resounding response is "Yes aren't you and Ty Lee dating???", also takes offense to be calling an ally after she accepts her sexuality, spirits help you if you make a bigoted comment in her presence bc she is the embodiment of queer wrath
Ty Lee: lesbian, goes by she/her but is fine with any pronouns, claims to have a gaydar through auras but everyone knows that Mai helps her out, helps Azula come to terms with her sexuality and they are the most adorable gfs after Azula's healing arc,talks to Bosco abt her girl problems (and he is always very understanding)
feel free to disagree or agree with me but these are just my personal opinions and takes on each of the characters!
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straycatwandering · 3 months
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Thinking about ATLA and the meta we occasionally get around Toph not getting a life-changing field trip with Zuko.
Topf probably didn't need one on account of Zuko not having tried particularly hard to ruin her life. But you know who should definitely get their own Zuko field trip? Suki.
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What makes you think Azula was lying about hurting Suki? She took her clothes and somehow knew Sokka was her boyfriend and already traumatized about losing his first love
I mean, the episode itself basically screamed "AZULA IS LYING! SHE'S A LYING LIAR WHO LIES!" during that scene was a pretty good hint. She was fighting the Gaang to prevent them from going to finding her father before firebending came back, "warned" them about a trap waiting for them where Ozai was (which we know was bullshit), and only then does she suddenly go "By the way I have your girlfriend as my prisoner and she thinks you failed her!" to hurt Sokka - aka the one who was telling Aang and Toph to just ignore everything she said.
We literally see a few episodes later, and sure, she's in prison, but she's clearly not hurt. And more importantly, during their escape, when Suki says this is a rematch she had been waiting for, she is focused on TY LEE and on not letting her hit her once - which could suggest Ty Lee was the one to take down all the Kyoshi Warriors, with Chi blocking, like she did with the Terra Team in Ba Sing Se.
If Azula had done anything beyond just capturing and maybe taunting her over the defeat, don't you think Suki would have wanted to at least punch her in the face or something? Hell, she's more mad at Zuko than at Azula, since he burned her village.
Not to mention, Sokka taunted her in Ember Island Players over losing to Azula, and Suki just looks bothered by the mention of the defeat, not like she's reliving some terrible trauma. The writers could be insentitive at times, but I think even they wouldn't do something like "This character was tortured/raped in prison and her boyfriend makes fun of her for it."
As for Azula knowing Sokka and Suki were a thing, he LITERALLY told Ty Lee about it at the end of season 2, when she's trying to flirt with him. Plus I can totally see Suki going "My boyfriend is friends with the Avatar, and they'll kick your ass and save me" after her defeat.
(Seriously guys, "Dude that is friends with the Avatar and openly supports him is dating the leader of a group of warriors that also supports the Avatar openly" is not exactly top secret information that Azula would need to torture people to find out about).
Also I don't think she show is implying she knows about Yue and how much it affected Sokka. There's a literal war going on for longer than Azula has been alive, Sokka's home was one of the areas the Fire Nation attacked the most, and he has been traveling the world for months, meeting a ton of new people - it's practically mathematically garanteed that he lost someone at some point. Plus "I captured someone you care about and they lost all hope" is the kind of shit that would upset ANYONE, even if they never lost someone before that.
As for the whole "Azula stole her clothes" thing: The Northern Water Tribe stole clothes and armor of Fire Nation soldiers and the Gaang did the same thing in book 3, and Zuko was also made to wear inmate uniform like Suki. "This character had to take this off at some point" does not mean "They were abused while changing clothes."
For fucks sake people, we see Hakoda humiliate the warden and only be sent to his sell, we see guards mocking Sokka for wanting to beat up a prisoner (who just happened to be the traitor prince) as they see that as "new guy trying too hard" aka that's not something that usually happens in the boiling rock, and even the cooler is a punishment for picking up a fight not a place to throw prisoners in randomly. The ONE torture session we see in the boiling rock happens because an escape plan was discovered - and AZULA was the one to stop it, before she even knew what the hell was going on.
("But she visited Suki in the comics and it was implied that Suki was being starved!" Retcons don't fucking matter, we literally see in the show that Suki was fine, just sad to be imprisoned and away from everyone she knew. She was not tortured.)
Azula is no saint, but this "theory" that she tortured or raped Suki is nothing but fans being oddly fixated on the idea of this kids show secretly being Game Of Thrones.
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azulas-defense-lawyer · 4 months
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How do you think the Gaang would react if Iroh was forced to face a war crimes tribunal for his actions during the war?
firstly, i won't straight up say iroh has committed war crimes, because we have no real evidence regarding his actions in the war. we can speculate, but we don't know for sure because the show is intentionally vague when it comes to his actions during the war. the use of starvation as a weapon of war is a crime to my knowledge? however people argue that iroh's siege of ba sing se (somehow) didn't involve starving civilians, and it's never shown in universe anyway. the ATLA universe doesn't even have a code for war or a geneva convention, to our knowledge. that being said, i believe it was a plot of one of the episodes of book one where earth kingdom soldiers were hunting iroh down to imprison him and put him on trial (unless it was just a "let's capture the enemy type thing"), so we can assume there's some basis to put him on trial here.
now, onto the question at hand, i think initially they'd be shocked, especially toph. but i think katara and sokka are smart enough to know that he did commit wrongs he needs to be held accountable for. sokka in particular would be more pragmatic about it - the generals responsible for the fire nation aggression need to be held accountable, or at least there needs to be an example for the world...so, iroh. i think katara might not understand the full extent of his actions initially, but soon will understand why the earth kingdom needs justice, though she will urge for them not to be consumed by vengeance.
aang may also be ignorant to iroh's crimes at first, but will ultimately believe justice needs to be served for peace but also that iroh has taken actions to atone. i think the main thing is that aang would want to ensure the tribunal isn't unfair and that the death penalty isn't offered. after all, he was against killing ozai, who never doubted his nation's genocidal intentions, so aang definitely would be against any sort of death penalty toward iroh, who did ultimately see his nation's wrongs and (arguably) worked to right them. i can imagine him testifying in favor of iroh due to how iroh helped them in ba sing se and helped "liberate" ba sing se (however misguided the latter action was).
suki would probably support the tribunal, even if the death penalty was offered as punishment. after all, she's never been opposed to murder those she sees as criminal or as a threat to her island (via the unagi that she feeds 'em too). kyoshi island is a trading hub, she probably grew up hearing horror stories from earth kingdomers about the "dragon of the west" . she was eventually inspired to join the war effort by sokka, so we know she stands strictly against injustice, and may see iroh going free with no legal consequences as a crime in itself. she also never developed a bond with iroh in the first place.
i think toph and zuko, on the other hand, would be very opposed to this tribunal. toph bonded with iroh, and up until her joining with the gang, she was largely untouched by the war. she isn't ignorant to his actions in the war (when told no one has ever breached ba sing se's walls in one episode, she replied "what about the dragon of the west?"), but may not care or that it doesn't matter because he's changed. she'd side with zuko on this one.
zuko, of course, does everything he can after his redemption to make iroh happy. he is very close to his uncle, as we're all aware. he still has a bit of a temper, too. and in that episode we've spoken about in book one, he actively worked to prevent iroh being captured by earth kingdom forces. i think he'd be completely outraged at iroh being called a war criminal, or a tribunal being held for his uncle. he'd argue his uncle made some mistakes in the past, but that he ultimately helped win the war and should be absolved, or that any actions he took weren't that bad anyway. he'd try to push the blame onto ozai, or azulon, or perhaps he'd even offer to put his sister on trial (if we're talking comics zuko), but never his uncle. this issue may even provoke tensions, leading many to fear another war.
that being said, this is (mostly) assuming the gaang are their rational show counterparts, and not the comics.
and of course this is just my interpretation, it's up for debate.
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zuko-always-lies · 1 year
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Since the ATLA fandom always needs this reminder...
Characters which Azula captures over the course of the series:
1. Katara
2. Hakoda
3. Suki
4. Other Kyoshi Warriors
5. Ty Lee
6. Zuko
7. Bato
8. Tyro
9. Hui
10. Due
11. Tho
12. Mai
13. Tyro
14. The Mechanist
15. Pipsqueak
16. Iroh
17. King Kuei
18. Long Feng
19. Boso the Bear
20. Toph
Characters which Azula executes after capturing them:
None.
Maybe she’s not actually as ruthless or bloodthirsty as people make her out to be...
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balanceoflightanddark · 5 months
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How do you think the Gaang would react if Iroh was forced to face a war crimes tribunal for his actions during the war, particularly his actions during the Siege of Ba Sing Se?
Hmmm. Now THIS is an interesting question, particularly because what the Gaang sees of Iroh might not mesh well with what the world sees of Iroh. Zuko would probably fight tooth and nail to get Iroh out. Obviously. That's-that's in the character's DNA. Aang and Toph both had a heart-to-heart with Iroh, so they might not necessarily know him all too well from his "Dragon of the West" days. As for Katara and Sokka, they'd probably be the only ones who would be on the fence initially since they didn't really have too many good experiences with Iroh personally (aside from the "always did the right thing" from Katara bullshit), but I could see them being convinced by Aang since he was mostly right about Zuko's capability to turn over a new leaf. So as a whole, they'd probably be aghast at the idea of Iroh being put on a tribunal. Probably would argue that him freeing Ba Sing Se during Sozin's Comet should speak to his character.
Here's where things would get murky. They're not gonna have a war crime tribunal unless they find people to testify against Iroh. And Iroh HAD hurt a lot of people, particularly in the grueling 600 Days at Ba Sing Se. Sieges are by their very nature, nasty conflicts. Particularly since the zone they occupied was the Agrarian ring, which would've cut off both soldiers AND civilians from food since...well, that's how a siege works. Cutting off the city's food supply. While we don't have exact details, we also know that in general, Fire Nation military leaders don't have a lot of concern for civilian livelihood and there's nothing suggesting that Iroh would've been any different from this point in his life. So I could imagine there being a slew of civilians from Ba Sing Se and beyond, as well as Earth Kingdom soldiers reading a laundry list of what Iroh pulled.
Now comes the big question: with this in mind, would the Gaang still support Iroh? Sure, maybe Aang and Zuko since they're firm believers in second chances. But what about Sokka or Katara who didn't know Iroh personally like they did, but did know how bad the war affected the Southern Water Tribe and thus could sympathize with those Iroh hurt? Toph I can see being the most torn of all since while she would acknowledge that Iroh is not some monster, she also didn't think too highly of the Fire Nation as a whole. Remember, she was the one who thought they were all evil from birth (at least initially) and advocated for Ozai's death along with the other members of the Gaang. This is a hotbed for controversy amongst them all.
The only one I haven't mentioned yet though is Suki since I'm fairly certain she'd be dead set on Iroh seeing justice. Unlike Toph, Suki never really got to know Iroh and probably would've only had Zuko to vouche for him...you know. The guy that burned down her village. Besides that, she'd probably would've heard stories about the Dragon of the West and probably saw the full brunt of what the Fire Nation was doing in the Earth Kingdom since she and the rest of the Kyoshi Warriors were helping civilians getting out of harms way. Out of all of them, she'd probably be the biggest advocate for Iroh seeing justice. Which would put her at odds with Zuko, obviously. Though it would be an interesting position for the rest of the Gaang since Suki has been a trusted ally and since she'd be the biggest spokesperson for the Earth Kingdom among the team, her position would mean they can't just rule out Iroh walking.
I think the answer will boil down to whether or not they feel that justice is or is not due. Is there justice for punishing a man who regretted his ways? Would it be fair for the people he hurt to let him walk free? These are all pertinent and interesting questions not just for Iroh, but for the Fire Nation as a whole. Where does one draw the line at reconciliation and justice? Sure, the Fire Nation as a whole aren't irredeemable, but they hurt countless lives. Particularly those who stood to gain the most from it, like Ozai, Iroh, Azulon, or Sozin (not counting Azula or Zuko since...well they were kids and neither were initially in line for the throne). Now for me personally, I don't think Iroh had done enough to justify him walking free. But I'm not a character in the series and that's ultimately for the Gaang to decide.
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the-power-of-stuff · 1 month
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The Live-Action Sukka Manifesto that I Just Couldn't Keep in My Head
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So I've been marinating in my live-action Sukka thoughts for the past three days, and when someone sent me an anon asking if I had any thoughts about the changes, at first I went, "DO I EVER?!" and proceeded to dump my entire brain on the page.
But then I worried maybe the anon wouldn't want to see my entire brain and figured I'd make my own post with my Many, Many Thoughts, and reel it in a bit when I answer the ask. And then link here if they're interested in the dissertation.
I'll put all the excessive details and spoilery stuff under a cut, but I'll start by saying, I didn't hate it! And I was afraid that I would.
There were things that I was bummed or had mixed feelings about, but there was also a lot that I genuinely enjoyed. All the Sukka interactions were cute and still had some decent character development, and I had fun with the episode overall (I've watched it thrice mind you, and definitely have not given the rest of the series that kind of attention). And I didn't necessarily dislike the differences from the original; I think I've just taken more of a "that was an interesting interpretation" approach.
But I better start that cut now, because I'm about to go on and on about this. I'd love to know what others think, though!! Even if the opinions aren't the same as mine! Please feel free to comment, reblog, shoot me an ask. If nothing else, I'm excited that the LA has gotten people talking about ATLA again.
So, I want to start with Suki’s characterization, which overall I found to be delightful, even if it was a bit of a watered-down version of her animated self.
In the original show, Suki is confident, sassy, and doesn’t take shit from anybody. She’s proud to the point of almost being arrogant, and even a little mean. What we get in the LA is someone who’s still confident in terms of her status and her skills, and still proud of her heritage and her role in her community, but with significantly less sass. And while LA Suki still seems like someone who wouldn’t take anyone’s shit, we don’t actually see LA Suki deal with that much shit from anyone (because Sokka isn’t really giving her any). 
There is one moment in the show where her interaction with Sokka is a little contentious, which is when he tries to relate to her as a fellow guardian of his people. I think Suki’s question to Sokka about how is he protecting his village if he’s not there is meant to be a challenge to his swagger. However, the line is delivered with a softness that makes it seem as though Suki is, at least in part, genuinely curious. (This curiosity makes even more sense when we consider the fact that Suki’s eventually going to leave Kyoshi Island so she and her Warriors can take part in the war effort, and that she will have to contend with the question of “how do you do that without abandoning your people?” when coming to that decision. The LA lays a lot more of this groundwork than the animated show did: Suki outwardly expressing her desire to see the world, her mother’s secretive looks every time Suki gazes longingly at Sokka the possibilities…)
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Compare these two moments, for example. These are both scenes where Suki expresses disbelief at Sokka's claims about his warrior-hood. But in the LA, Suki speaks rather quietly and mildly, in contrast to the brash sarcasm of her animated counterpart. LA Suki is also tilting her head down and away, looking at Sokka indirectly. OG Suki is leaning in close, getting in his face, smirking derisively with her hands on her hips.  
I think there’s something to be said about the LA in general smoothing away certain personality traits that could be seen as negatives but that are actually strengths that are so narratively well-developed they occasionally show up as flaws (for instance, Katara’s fury, or lack thereof). Animated Suki is prideful and stubborn; she berates Sokka until he gives her sad puppy-dog eyes and has zero hesitation about making an example of him in front of her whole class. It’s a little ruthless, but these traits are also 1) what gets through Sokka’s thick skull (he, too, is prideful and stubborn), and 2) what makes her such a dedicated ambassador of Kyoshi and such a strong leader of the island’s Warriors at such a young age. I feel like the LA writers were afraid of making any of the protagonists seem too abrasive—everyone in the LA has had their edges sanded down, including Zuko, including Aang—and in general this tends to lead to less realistic representations of humanity and conflict, less satisfying character development arcs, and fewer opportunities for reflection and learning. 
That being said! I went into watching the LA with negative expectations about what we would see in terms of character development, and thus was pleasantly surprised. 
The LA removed the need for Suki to be as ruthlessly stubborn as she is in the animated show because LA Sokka’s skull is not so thick (and I'll get into that a bit more later). So what we get instead is a sheltered Suki with a helicopter mom who is so hilariously awkward that she has no idea how to interact with other humans. And, to be honest, I enjoyed this version of her so much that I even thought to myself, “I wish I’d thought of that!”
Suki is a straight-up weirdo in the LA and I love that for her. The way she puts Sokka in a chokehold and then looks at him after she sets him free like, “That was good flirting, yes? Would you like to be my boyfriend now?” And then her disappointment when Sokka walks away as if she’s thinking, “Why didn’t that go well, I thought boys loved getting put in chokeholds?” She is so precious, I just want to put her in my pocket. And this characterization might even be more broadly relatable than a super-confident Suki brimming with sass. Who among us hasn’t made a complete fool of ourselves in front of a crush by coming on way too strong and having no idea how to flirt? I mean…real. 
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And because Sokka is also mostly just making a fool of himself trying to impress a pretty and talented peer (instead of covering up his insecurities by wrapping himself in misogyny) this leaves room for the two of them to be attracted to each other right off the bat and for their interactions to be more overtly romantic throughout the entire episode. Which, avid shipper that I am, I have to admit I have been gobbling up for the past three days straight. This episode was an IV drip of romantic tropes hooked straight to every Sukka shipper’s veins. 
Shy glances from across the room? Check.
Walking in on the other person half-naked? Check. (Y’all, Suki looks Sokka up and down for a FULL TWENTY SECONDS yes I timed it from the moment she appears in the background, yes you should count it to see how long that really is. Talk about awkward.) 
Tripping so they end up falling into each other’s arms? Check.
Wide-eyed shock that turns into surprise thirst after being pinned to the ground? Check.
Shooting each other satisfied smirks as they kick ass side-by-side? Check.
Jumping in front of literal fire for each other? Check and check!
Like, I could live off this for the rest of the year. 
But look, there’s a lot that I love about the way Sokka and Suki’s relationship is portrayed in this episode besides those romantically indulgent tension-creating moments, and it has to do with Suki’s admiration and validation of Sokka. 
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Suki really looked at this boy with his mouth stuffed half-full of steamed bun and went, “Must have.”
With the removal of overt sexism from this episode (for better or worse), the story focused much more heavily on Sokka’s development as a leader. He still has that sort of posturing display of self-confidence that comes from inexperience and trying too hard to prove oneself (“Ferociously…deadly tiger whales…”), and while at first Suki seems put off by this and his attempts to liken himself to her (“I’m not just a warrior, I’m a Kyoshi warrior”) it doesn’t take her long to decide (*cough*after seeing him shirtless*cough*) that she doesn’t actually mind this behavior (and in fact maybe she kind of likes it because maybe it means he likes her and maybe it means she can show him how much she likes him by slicing the tops off all those melons with her fan). She seems genuinely interested in his boomerang and impressed that he hunts, and then later, she immediately takes interest in training him in the Kyoshi Warrior style. 
After they spar, she casually refers back to the fact that he’s his village’s protector, and this time, she does it without the disbelief and defensiveness. Because he’s finally stopped posturing. He opened himself up and gave himself over to Suki’s expertise, and in that way he proved that he has the will and desire—the heart—of a warrior. And Suki tells him so while touching him gently and gazing at him longingly in the soft golden glow of the late-afternoon sun. And as a die-hard Sokka stan, I love seeing him loved and appreciated like this. Adamantly. Ardently. The Sokka cheerleader in my head is going wild. “YEESSSS!! Our boy deserves this!!” Because we know that, in the animated show, he goes through a lot more struggle and self-doubt before he receives this kind of external validation. And while we also know that this makes for an incredibly satisfying growth arc, I gotta admit that it’s a fun bit of indulgence to watch Suki talk Sokka up directly to his face and then want to kiss him really bad. Y’know. As a treat.
That said, I'm very attached to and appreciative of the way their relationship is framed in the animated series. I love that their respect and affection for each other grows even after the disaster that is their first few interactions. In the LA, they are drawn to each other immediately, and the only barrier seems to be a bit of awkward stepping-in-it-ness. In the original, they have legitimate conflict, and they both have to give a little—Sokka becomes more humble, Suki becomes more tender—before they get to that point of potential romantic interest. And I think it says a lot about Sokka’s character and his desire to learn and grow that he is willing to humble himself in front of someone who, as far as he’s seen, has very little regard for him (slash has a good deal of animosity towards him). Giving himself over to Suki’s expertise costs him more in the animated show. But once he does, he and Suki learn and grow together. He shows Suki who he really is, shows her how dedicated and determined (and fun and a quick learner) he is, to the point that, by the end of the episode, she can allow herself to be vulnerable with him. And she does validate him in the original Kyoshi Warriors episode, just less directly than the LA. Her kiss on his cheek and “...but I’m a girl, too” is about forgiveness and acceptance and acknowledgement and respect, as much as or even more than it is about affection. There’s a little bit of romance, too, but it’s just little baby seeds of it, and it feels very natural to let those seeds germinate over time until we see Suki again later in the series. 
Which brings me to the live-action kiss. 
I’ll be honest, I was a little on the fence about the kiss. I want Sokka and Suki to kiss as much as possible in every conceivable universe. So there’s a part of me that was banging on the table and whistling with obscene joy. But the other part of me thought it was too much too soon. However, my hesitance pre-supposes some things about the second season (not least of which that there will be one), namely that it will handle the reunion with Suki and crossing the Serpent’s Pass anything like how it was done in the original. (Of course, one thing we now know for certain can't happen in a hypothetical LA season 2 is Suki pranking Sokka at the ferry station because he doesn't recognize her without her makeup. Do I love the expression on LA Sokka's face the first time he sees Suki's? Yes. Am I sad that this completely ruins their whole "You don't remember me? Maybe you'll remember this!" game? Also yes. But truthfully, I don't know if LA Suki would've been up to the prank, anyway. Not sassy enough. ;))
The Serpent’s Pass is one of my favorite episodes of all time, and that moment on the bluffs when Sokka and Suki are talking around Sokka’s loss, with the moon shining down on them all the while, and they almost kiss with the moon hanging between them in the background, and then Sokka pulls away without any other explanation besides, “I can’t”? That scene is so absurdly powerful and beautiful and an amazing moment of character development for them both, and I feel like it loses a lot of impact if they’ve already made out once. The fact that they kiss for the first time after that moonlit moment, when Sokka realizes that Suki doesn’t need protecting the way he thought she did, and in fact she was there to protect him, and he can finally just let go of this burden that he’s been carrying with him since Suki first mentioned she was joining them (slash since his dad put him in charge of an entire village at 13), and then and only then can he open his heart to what he feels for Suki, and in fact opens it so wide that he just cannot help but jam his mouth onto hers before she’s even finished talking…? I mean. C’mon. That’s poetry. But, again…loses impact if they’ve already had a first kiss.
But who knows what, if anything, they’ll actually do with that storyline. So for now, I’ll just enjoy my live-action Sukka kiss because, honestly, dream come true.    
Or almost a dream come true. Because there's a huge camelephant in the room that I haven't addressed yet, isn't there? The lack of Sokka in the Kyoshi Warrior uniform...
And I don’t think we can talk about the omission of Sokka’s Kyoshi Warrior uniform without talking about the omission of Sokka’s sexism. Because if Sokka isn’t sexist, then why do you have to put him in the dress and makeup of traditionally female warriors to make a point about how women are strong and capable, too? So here’s what I’ll say about that (and I know there’s a lot that people have said already, so I’ll try not to belabor the point.) I don’t think leaving out Sokka’s sexism was necessarily a detriment to his character arc. I do think, however, that leaving out Sokka’s sexism was a detriment to the message the show was trying to convey about sexism. 
Now, in the Northern Water Tribe episodes, the LA still gives us a message about fighting against the kind of systemic, institutionalized sexism that you might not be surprised to encounter within a very old-fashioned society or from a very old-fashioned gray-haired man. But what about the off-the-cuff, everyday kind of sexism that you might experience from an otherwise good person who is close to you? A person who loves you and would do anything for you but who gets carried away teasing you about “girly” things because of intrinsically-held biases that they’re not even that conscious of having? 
I think it’s important and meaningful for male and female audiences alike, and everyone in between, to see these different forms of sexism and misogyny—to see them, to recognize those behaviors in others and in ourselves, to be able to name them, and to have examples of fighting against them. We see the former kind—institutionalized, systemic—in Pakku. And we did see the latter kind—familiar, personal—in Sokka. And now that’s lost.
Not only that, but there’s the form of sexism that says boys aren’t allowed to do feminine things lest they relinquish their maleness. And in the animated show, we got to see Sokka combating this form of sexism, too. Not only does Suki show him that girls can be fierce warriors as well as boys, but he learns that wearing makeup and a dress does not make him any less of a young man.  
So, yes, I think the lack of Sokka in Kyoshi Warrior garb was a missed opportunity. And not just because Sokka looked really good in uniform and we all should have had the chance to see that, including and especially Suki. 
Alright, this is more than long enough, so I'll leave off with a moment from the LA that gave me great pleasure.
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I needed this moment, y'all. And I was so afraid it wouldn't happen. I needed Sokka being protective, I needed him using his newfound Kyoshi Warrior skills to fight, and I needed him jumping in front of fire for the girl who'd taught him. If we couldn't have Sokka in the Kyoshi Warrior uniform, at least we had this.
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kamipyre · 1 month
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resident inbox goblin is back. what's your character/oc's name? did you create it? if you did, what thought did you put into it? if you didn't, what did the author intend for it to mean? either way, do you have any particular meanings you've appended to the name?
ppl everyone @eternasci is back <3 <3 <3
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SYNNIE WELCOME BACK <3 <3 <3 
her name is suki nakamura! i think i have spoken about this before, but suki’s name can have two meanings: (1) beloved and in verb form ‘to like’ and (2) a derivation from the word ‘tsuki’ or moon. 
suki’s name is ironically also derived from both of her parents’ names: daisuke and mizuki. for me, it really emphasizes the fact that at least in her first character arc, she considers herself her parents’ daughter first, rather than being her own person– everything she does, even down to her own name is a reminder of her parents in this sense. this then makes her arc, i think, all the more obvious in that she needs to let go of her parents so that she can become her own person.
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tessenwarrior · 7 days
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thinking abt suki and femininity at this late hour, folks
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