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silverwhittlingknife · 1 year

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I noticed something in a lot of your Dick and Tim fics. It's probably so obvious, but you always write that Tim is watching Dick. In your newest one, Tim's watching Dick, in The Return Tim's watching Dick, and you even write that Tim is always watching him. Is Tim trying to read Dick? Trying to understand? Or does he understand him by watching? What is he trying to figure out by watching Dick? What does that say about Tim? I really hope this is intentional lmao because I would be embarrassed. Maybe this is just something so obvious that I'm just getting now.

YES IT’S ON PURPOSE <333 Anon. Anon. I'm so sorry this answer took forever, but listen, this was a really delightful ask <333 I think about this a lot. I really love origin stories—I like stories that resonate through a character’s history.

And for me, a whole lot of what interests me about Dick and Tim is that theme of watching and being watched. Seeing and being seen.

"Watch me on the trapeze, Tim. I'm going to do my act...'specially for you." | "Timmy, don't look." | "I turned away... I couldn't watch. Then I heard you crying and I turned back... I'm sorry, Dick. I didn't want to hurt you by telling you all this." Dick's watching me. Gauging my reactions. (Tim watching Dick watching Tim!) | "I'm taking off the blindfold." "No!" | "I can't see him. You can't see him. But I know Robin. And Robin's always there when you need him." | I love that kid. Too much to let him see me like this. (But Tim spots him anyway.)

Spotlights and lighthouses and cameras and photographs. Blindness and vision and masks and detective work and trust.

I'm going to try to be coherent about this but it's gonna be incoherent sdfsf BUT I'M GOING TO TRY so. Below the cut, a really long grab-bag of my rambling on vision and watchers and watching.

Tim + watching / Dick + being watched / different dynamics

Tim's origin story

Being watched goes with vulnerability/exposure

Incomplete list of moments with Dick and Tim and vision

Tim + watching

The first time we see Tim's face in LPoD: a close-up on his eyes looking for Dick, a close-up on his eyes at the moment that he sees Dick, a pullback to his face at the moment of recognition, a pullback to his face + his camera (you could maybe even argue that Tim comes into existence at the moment that he sees Dick, like, conceptually. the act of seeing is his defining characteristic. it is the thing that makes his character happen. he is the kid who's watching.)

Tim's a very vision-centric character: he's first introduced as a camera, then as a pair of binoculars, then as a pair of eyes. His whole backstory is about watching: watching Dick's parents die, watching Dick on TV, watching Batman and Robin. I've grabbed a few panels above with Tim watching Dick but there are so many more. His major deductions are all vision-based: he sees Dick-the-acrobat and later recognizes Dick-as-Robin; he sees Bruce-in-the-past and recognizes him as Bruce-of-our-time; the climactic moment in Red Robin is about going into a dark cave with a torch so he can see what's there.

And he's a detective. He pries into secrets. He analyzes people. He's a worrywart and a fusser who always wants to understand what's going on with other people. In a lot of those panels where Tim's watching Dick, his inner monologue is busy deducing Dick's emotions and trying to psychoanalyze him. Tim's caring and watchful and intuitive... but all those qualities also make him very very intrusive.

Dick + being watched

Dick performing acrobatics for Bruce, Donna, and Tim in Detective Comics 38 (his first appearance), New Teen Titans 16, Batman 441, and Nightwing 88 (where he reflects he's glad to be back in the hot glare of the spotlight)

Dick's a detective too, of course - Tim deliberately mirrors Dick, both in-universe and out-of-universe. But also Dick's a performer who loves being watched and also wants to control how he's seen. He gets a kick out of showing off, making puns, kicking ass, taking names, and he gets a kick out of having an appreciative audience. And he's got a kind of yearning for recognition - it hurts, when Bruce won't look at him, and in fights with Bruce, Babs, Roy, he'll often bring up the past, trying to get them to acknowledge a shared history.

At the same time, he's a very private person who withdraws and hides and pushes people away when he's upset. Right before Tim shows up, Dick's just ghosted the Titans because he's having emotional turmoil and doesn't want to have it in front of them, and they're trying to respect his wishes... but that solitude doesn't last long, because then Tim tracks him down. Tim will do this again when Dick's having an emotional crisis and trying to avoid everybody in Nightwing 110.

Possible dynamics

Tim watches Dick in Robin 11, while silently analyzing Dick's anxieties about Two-Face

"The watcher and the person being watched" is a dynamic that really interests me, partly because it can be so complicated?

You can see in Dick and Tim their very first roles: enthusiastic performer and the enthusiastic audience member. Dick likes to perform and show off and entertain; Tim likes to watch; those are roles they both easily slide into and they have a lot of fun together! But also you can look at the harsher side: the crime victim and the voyeur, the amateur photographer and the guy who hates being photographed. Dick's intensely private about his vulnerabilities; Tim's intrusive and watchful and constantly trying to figure out how other people tick. Sometimes Tim's the caring friend who watches Dick closely, reads him well, understands him; sometimes he's the nosy mini-detective who pries into Dick's secrets. And that's just two different ways of describing the same thing!

One of the things that kinda fascinates me about Dick and Tim's relationship is that in a lot of ways it's built on a bunch of low-key boundary violations. A lot of their early relationship is driven by Tim's desire to know more about Dick vs. Dick's reluctance to get close to anyone from Gotham; Tim's often out-of-line, but without his pushiness, it's hard to see how they would've developed a relationship at all. Later on, their friendlier relationship is marked by Dick teasing and low-key bullying Tim; it's pretty obvious that Tim isn't actually bothered by this, but it does involve Dick ignoring whatever Tim's claiming he doesn't like ("Quit it!" "Shh").

And one of the aspects of those boundary-violations is that Tim has a habit of witnessing things that Dick would prefer that nobody see. Tim's a witness to Dick's first and most miserable tragedy; he sees the aftermath of some of Dick's fights with Bruce; he's there when Donna dies. And he's sharp and observant and analytical, and I like to imagine this as being something Dick's not entirely comfortable with.

When Dick first meets Tim, it's before he's learned to wear a mask. And Tim spends a lot of time trying to see through Dick's masks, and he's pretty good at it, and a lot of that prying comes from love and care, because one of the ways that Tim shows love and respect and admiration is by trying to absorb absolutely everything about you, like a little sponge. But there's also something unsparing and even threatening about the search for the truth of someone else. It can be comforting or threatening, to know someone's watching you.

And I love how all that complexity is wrapped up in Tim's origin story? Both the giddy childish "Watch me on the trapeze" and then the awful grim reality of what Tim actually sees as a result and then the difficult connection when Dick and Alfred finally get Tim to explain how he knows their secret identities.

Tim's origin story

Tim (recounting his origin story in LPoD): My parents held me back as the thing moved to you. I cried out to warn you. (Two panels where we see just Tim's eyes, as he watches a crying Dick. He sees Batman approach and start trying to comfort Dick.)

I think fiction sometimes presents "being understood / seen / known" as an uncomplicatedly good thing, and there's nothing wrong with that! But I like complications, and I like the way Tim's origin story frames that moment of witnessing as difficult and fraught. Tim doesn't want to tell Dick how he knows their secret identities because he thinks it'll hurt Dick to know it: I don't want to hurt you, Dick, and I'm really afraid I might. And he's not wrong. It is painful; it does hurt; it's not something Dick's happy to know.

Dick's a very private person, and there's a painful intimacy to Tim's origin story - it's not Tim's fault he was there, but at the same time, it's not like Dick chose to have the most traumatic moment of his life on stage in front of an audience of strangers, you know? It's kind of a violation. In NTT/NT/Nightwing, Dick's pretty violently hostile to photographers, and he's intensely private about trauma in general, and I like to imagine this as partly a reaction to that foundational trauma of losing the most important people in his life and also doing it publicly.

And Tim's part of that audience. And he sees the worst part, the part that Dick can't talk about. He sees the bodies and the blood. He has nightmares about it for years. He hears Dick crying and sees him holding onto his parents' bodies. Not at all the kind of first impression Dick would want to make. Not at all the kind of person he wants to be seen as. And that understanding can be painful, because it's so close to the bone, and when Tim's just a stranger, it's upsetting, because Tim knows things that Dick would never have chosen for him to know. Their few conversations about it are awkward partly because Tim's thirteen and awkward... but at the same time, it's not Tim's fault so much as the situation! There's no way for Tim to talk about what he saw that wouldn't be uncomfortable for Dick.

... And yet, and yet. Tim's also one of the last people to see the Graysons alive. He sees Dick and his parents together; he even takes a picture with them. He remembers the whole thing so vividly he'll recognize Dick's somersault years later. He sees the grief. And so I think of that connection as kind of a metaphor for witnessing. Tim sees these things and they become real; Dick can't hide from them; in the act of being seen he's caught, he's in a spotlight, all the grief made real. You can't hide, that way. And Tim's got this unforgiving memory; he won't ever forget; he won't ever stop knowing.

But then, too: Dick's seen, he's known. Even at the very beginning, when Tim doesn't know enough to understand what he knows, he knows the important things.

So that shared memory is a barrier and a bond between them. It can be a source of discomfort or a source of comfort. And that's how I think about Tim watching Dick in general - it's complicated, and sometimes Dick's glad of it, and sometimes he resents it, and also it just is, it's a fact of Tim, that Tim watches. It's notable when he's not watching, when he's turned away.

Being watched goes with vulnerability/exposure

So I'm going to talk about the fraught feeling of being watched more in a little bit, but first: I think it's fascinating that Dick likes screwing around with games where Tim can't see!

Here's Nightwing 25 - Dick's come up with the idea of trainsurfing while blindfolded:

Tim: Are you sure this is such a good idea? Dick: Shh! Listen. Tune into the changing sounds and - Tim: I'm not so - Dick: JUMP!

Here's Robin 49 - clambering through a tunnel into No Man's Land:

Dick: Hard not to think about the river. All the water above us. And bugs. This tunnels' probably full of 'em. And rats. Big ones. Big blind rats with teeth as long as -

Here's Gotham Knights 9 - ambushing Tim in a sorta game of hide-and-seek:

Dick: Gotcha! Tim: Augh!

I feel like mmm I don't want to emphasize power dynamics too much because it's easy to overplay it BUT when I think about headcanons it's interesting to me to think about how maybe when Tim can't see, Dick's more in charge / in control, and so he feels more comfortable and less vulnerable, and that's often when he's most relaxed and playing around the most?

Whereas the moments when Tim's looking at him are often a bit more fraught, as here in Lonely Place of Dying:

Tim: I'm sorry, Dick. I really am. I didn't want to hurt you by telling you all this. Dick... Dick: It's all right, Tim. No matter how old you are, there are some things you never forget. Or get over. (Silent panel: Tim's watching Dick as Dick turns away and stares into the window.)

Or here in Nightwing 6, when Tim wakes him up from a nightmare:

Dick (internally, imagining a kid falling): He shouts to me. He always shouts to me. I never hear what he says. Tim: Nightwing! Wake up!

Or here in Gotham Knights 26, when Bruce is accused of murder:

(Silent panel where Tim's watching Dick.) Tim: I'm sorry. This must be hard for you. Dick: Me? Why? Tim: Well, I mean, it'd be one thing if we really knew he was innocent, but as it is - Dick: Wait, what? Stop right there. What are you saying, Tim?

Here's Tim spotting him before he can get away in Nightwing 110:

Dick (watching Tim from a distance, internally): Still, Timmy played it through nice and clean. Disarmed the perps, protected and avoided the cops. Kept any civilians from getting shot. God, I love that kid. Too much to let him see me like this. Tim: Hey! (appearing on the roof above him, fake-cheerful) You weren't gonna leave without saying hi, were you? Dick (looking away, very quietly): Hey, Timmy. Tim: Look at you, man! Back on both feet! Think you're done stopping bullets with your body for a while? Dick: Hope springs eternal. (Silent panel with Tim watching Dick, who's turned away.) Tim: You okay, Dick? Dick: I'm fine. Tim: Well, where're you staying these days? Dick: With some people.

Of course, sometimes Tim's watchfulness is frustrating but also a comfort, as in Detective Comics 874:

Tim (watching Dick, who's looking away): Are you listening to me, Batman? I'm saying the gas the Dealer used on you was powerful stuff. Dick: I'm fine, Red Robin. Besides...you're here now. Tim: You're not fine. And with or without me, you shouldn't be out on patrol ye - Dick: Sshhh. Here they come.

(Later in the comic, Dick mentally concedes that Tim's right that he hasn't really recovered from the gas, and Tim saves him from drowning when he's hallucinating. So Dick feels kind of exposed by the scrutiny, but also... he invited Tim along, so there's trust there, too - Tim's perceptiveness can be a good thing, too, when things are serious.)

Incomplete summary of moments with Dick and Tim and vision

I think I already mentioned a lot of these but here is my LIST

almost the first thing that Dick says to Tim is "watch me on the trapeze, Tim" and then Tim does and he basically never stops watching;

Tim watches Dick's parents die and watches Dick sobbing on-stage and watches him on TV and recognizes him by seeing a particular trick because he's dreamed about Dick doing the trick in his recurring nightmares about that night;

in New Titans 65 which is their very first team-up comic after Tim's origin, Dick's training pre-Robin Tim and gives him a test about watching for details and later Tim's takeaway is "I saw how [the Titans] listened to you";

there's a moment in Showcase '93 12 which is just Tim watching Dick and analyzing what's going on with him and there's another moment in Prodigal which is the same thing;

in Nightwing 6 Tim sneaks into Dick's apartment and hides in the dark and Dick spots him and tackles him; one of their most important bonding comics is Nightwing 25, where Dick insists on blindfolding him to get him to rely less on vision; when they sneak into No Man's Land they're in the dark and Tim can't see again and Dick's teasing him;

there are multiple moments when Tim can't see Dick for a bit and panics about his safety, in Nightwing 25, in No Man's Land, in Transference, in Bruce Wayne: Murderer;

Tim's there watching when Dick's wedding to Kory falls apart and he's there watching when Bruce and Dick fight and he's there watching when Donna dies and he's watching when Dick and Bruce swing together on the night before Infinite Crisis, and when Dick goes down and almost dies in Infinite Crisis we cut to Tim watching and seeing it happen and screaming;

there are multiple moments which are just silent panels of them staring at each other trying to figure out what's going on with each other or having a stand-off - in Bruce Wayne: Murderer, in Resurrection, in Red Robin;

in the aftermath of Donna's death there's a panel where Dick's watching Tim from a distance and not approaching;

in the aftermath of Blockbuster Dick spends half the comic just staring at Tim from a distance and hiding himself because "I love that kid - too much to let him see me like this," but Tim sees him anyway and chases him down and then they lie to each other and *ranting* LISTEN TO ME the whole comic is about Dick trying to AVOID being SEEN both literally but also METAPHORICALLY AND --!!!

(the only thing i'm even as halfway obsessive about for them is the heights thing because also there are a bunch of moments involving falling or Tim being anxious about heights and worried that he'll fall or Dick will fall)

In conclusion

Consider the progression in all these moments where Tim's watching an upset Dick and worrying about him!! From reaching out instinctively-but-pointlessly when he's too far away in the LPoD flashback, to almost reaching out in LPoD but hesitating, to putting a hand on Dick's back to walk him back to the Cave in Gotham Knights 10, to physically dragging him clear of the water in Batman: Black Mirror!

In conclusion I don't have a conclusion but basically YES, "watching Dick" is a core Tim characteristic as far as I'm concerned, and Tim watches Dick a lot and that can mean all kinds of things from admiration to nosy intrusiveness to worry to care to gratitude to trying-to-figure-out-what's-going-on-with-him, and sometimes Dick's resentful and sometimes he's relieved and sometimes he's playful and sometimes it's a mix of all those feelings.

And at first it's always Tim watching Dick, but later you've got Dick watching Tim too, and there's that moment where Dick's secretly watching him fight but Tim spots him in Nightwing 110 and there's a silent panel where Dick's watching him in Resurrection and at the very end of Robin there's a scene where Dick's secretly watching him fight but Tim spots him and in the very last issue of Red Robin Dick's watching the end of the confrontation with Boomerang and in Prodigal Dick's the one who notices his face is bruised and aaaaaaah

Anyway I think they're neat <3

#ask tag #hi anon this is SO old i'm so sorry sdfsfs #if you're still here hi!! <333 #this was such a validating ask to get because as you can probably tell i think about the vision thing constantly #also this is SO long oh man. sorry i just started typing and it went on and on sdfdsf #dick grayson #tim drake #dick & tim #it's like. it's just endlessly fascinating to me because the paparazzi/photography stuff is one of dick's biggest triggers #and tim's introduced as a surreptitious amateur photographer #so there's no WAY they will ever get along #but then there's the Meaningful Photo from before the show #that low-key shows that tim's freaky obsessiveness comes from a place of genuine caring & this moment of real connection #so you have early days!dick kinda vibrating back and forth between 'I DON'T WANT HIM MAKE HIM GO AWAY'#vs. those moments when he IS getting attached to tim kinda against his will sdfsdf #and just. the dichotomy between paying attention as a form of love vs. being watched as a kind of violation and exposure #and that both are kinda the same thing?? and dick deeply craves the first and deeply hates the second #tim shows up being all I REMEMBER and what he remembers is exactly what dick was demanding bruce remember in b416 #but /also/ he remembers /everything/ 'i remember it all' he remembers the graysons dying in incredibly painful detail #and like. kid!tim is very tactless & has only two switches of 'TELL HIM NOTHING' and 'if forced to speak then overshare'#but the tactlessness is a fixable problem and the remembering is /not/#it's not like it's any better for tim to keep his mouth shut & dick to just be painfully /aware/ that he's thinking abt the graysons dying #bc ofc /tim/ remembering forces /dick/ to remember #but!! but also. you know. maybe that remembering /isn't/ entirely a bad thing #and dick's feelings about it can change over time #anyway tim's not the only person that dick has this kind of conflict with - wally & roy sometimes chase him down when he's withdrawing too #and he often doesn't really appreciate it from them either #and dick's not the only person who gets subjected to tim's particular brand of intrusive caring #conner's not thrilled about the dna thing & ives would be within his rights to resent the stalking even though he doesn't #but i am obviously personally most fond of the ways this plays out with dick & tim

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random-human-being2311 · 3 months

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there is just something so beautiful about songs about the joy you get from such mundane things.

like singing about how the weather's sunny or the weather's rainy but in a way so heartfelt and uplifting the song stays with you, close to your heart for years to come even if you don't know its name

like singing about how much you love your best friends. not because they recently did something that particularly amazes you but just appreciating them being there for you and just generally genuinely making you happy

the most mundane everyday things can become the most meaningful and heartfelt and it's probably just because I'm aroace but I feel that they're so much more genuine than songs about how happy you are because you and your romantic partner got back together or something

i remember seeing a youtube comment a short while back that was along the lines of "I know that usually it's only love songs that are meaningful but this song is the exception" and just thinking dear god how sad must this person's life be if they can't find beauty in anything other than something to do with love. Have you never just stared at a bird perched in a tree singing? Never seen a painting so full of colours that compliment each other in such a way that they each make the others look brighter but it never becomes a clashing over-the-top mess but a harmony of rainbows? Never just eaten a really good meal?

I would trade a thousand shallow, boring, generic songs about romance or heartbreak in exchange for one song about the beauty in the mundane things we take for granted.

#aroace #ace #aro #aromantic #asexual #yes this was originally about the beatles how could you tell #but don't think this was ever intended to be EXCLUSIVELY about them #I just first had this thought when listening to Here Comes The Sun and Mr Blue Sky and Friends Will Be Friends #that one commenter ALONE drove me to make this how the heck could you think that love songs are automatically the most meaningful like tf??#I just don't understand it at all in any way #my whole life I've thought they're the most shallow and meaningless and repetitive #honestly though for my whole life I've been very obviously aroace even if I didn't know it so take that with a grain of salt #oh also shoutout to the beatles song Rain #it's a personal favourite of mine because I'm a weirdo (/affectionate) who likes rainy weather #so just hearing a song about rain where it's happy and the rain is a positive thing is just like damn this song was designed for me #I mean even if it weren't for that I'd probably still love Rain because it's a bop #dear god I need to stop putting so many tags on everything #the beatles #queen band #electric light orchestra #yes i know the irony of making a post about how there are things much better than love songs and then tagging the beatles #I may be autistic but I'm not THAT bad at picking up on social cues #ok that was a lie I AM that bad #but this one specific time I'm not #that one's ramblings

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lhma · 9 months

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Hi everyone! I don't really 'talk' on here a lot (introvert yay), but I just really wanted to thank everyone for all the super lovely comments/tags I've seen on the artwork I've posted so far (because you all say the nicest things and it feels weird not saying anything back??) I've finished more work than I ever have just because it's so fun to share (and fangirl) on here with others who love him. So thanks for the motivation & being so nice! 💚

#this is just a group of lovely people the vibes are great #appreciate you all!#even tho it might sound silly drawing is a very personal and meaningful thing to me #so to see others enjoy it means a lot #❤️#käärijä

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jopzer · 7 months

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okay. i have finally finished my rewatch and i think i've finally made sense of my thoughts vis a vis ted and jamie's relationship.

i think it's very interesting that the exact moment ted pulls away from being directly involved in jamie's development is when he realizes that what jamie needs is a father. like in season one and arguably the first half of season two he is very hands on in trying to get jamie to realize his potential/the error of his ways but like. things are noticeably different after he sees him and james through the door, and then after wembley they do not really interact again in a meaningful way until mom city. roy literally picks it up as ted sets it down, like. he can't be what jamie needs he doesn't Want to, he can barely even handle what he feels for henry like we see in mom city, he's not picking up a bonus son you know

i really do think it's a very interesting way to handle their relationship specifically. they're so so intertwined in their character arcs and they're constantly setting each other's off but they can't really meet in the middle because ted can't/won't connect with him on that level. they're a son without a father and a father without a son and they can't click into that relationship because ted pulls away from him the minute it becomes clear that's what jamie needs, and we see it come full circle and see why in his monologue during mom city

#beebles #ted lasso #jamie tartt #idk it FASCINATES MEEEE #i think it's also very meaningful that we see ted give jamie dog shit advice about his dad in this same episode #because ted hasn't engaged with jamie much and he Doesn't know the extent of james' fuckery #and ted's own daddy issues are clouding it too like #he spent so long with sharon learning how to forgive his father for what he did #why Wouldn't jamie benefit from that same forgiveness you know??#but we are all in agreement that it was dogshit advice.#and it was dogshit advice precisely because he won't engage with jamie on that level #and i think whether or not jamie even wants ted to fill that role is very debatable #i love their weird relationship #they're not father and son to me they're mother and daughter #and the tying jamie and henry together was also fucking fascinating btw #like when they interact in s1 whatever that episode is #and then in we'll never have paris when henry is playing with them it's him and jamie that are celebrating together first #and he's wearing jamie's number???#so jamie gets to haunt ted for the rest of henry's soccer career?????#fascinating stuff. fascinating stuff.#you'll literally never get away from the sound of that boy who loved you ted.#because that's exactly what they do they haunt each other's arcs

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posycore · 2 years

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that episode where abed just projects his abondonment issues on a baby bird to heal his inner child and its especially rewarding because he did it alone and the baby bird lived and flew away even though it didnt have its mom or abed anymore and maybe abed is down a few friends but if the bird can do it maybe he can too and maybe saying goodbye doesnt have to feel like falling maybe it can feel like flying away and sorry im crying

#ik its nice to say fuck canon and pretend troy never left and i support that #but i also am really attached to post-troy-leaving abed and all the character study we get of him #him having solo quests or being paired with one of the new characters always turned so meaningful to me #i love happy endings and fixing canon but i also have a lot of grief related trauma and im very attached to seeing abed go through it too #sometimes life is like that! sometimes you do lose people! but that doesnt mean no happy ending is possible!#ME AND ABED AGAINST THE WORLD DW BB WE CAN DO THIS TOGETHER #trobed #troy barnes #abed nadir #troy and abed

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elbiotipo · 1 year

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the funniest thing about Roko's Basilisk in my opinion is that it isn't even supposed to be torturing YOU, just a simulation of you AIs have recreated based on records of you (because as we all know gods AIs can recreate long-dead people perfectly, don't ya know) and you're supposed to care because they're copies of you? lmao??????

it's like if some dude I didn't know about made a sim of me and tortured it because I didn't donate to his kickstarter I saw that one time

#roko's basilisk #cosas mias #I mean lesswrongers seem to believe a copy of you is the SAME as you #which never made sense to me at all no matter how much jargon they threw at me #even assuming 'copying' a person is possible in any meaningful sense #(they are very much into that mind = software thinking)

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solradguy · 7 months

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Mr. Rad Guy, I've wanted to get your opinion on something for a while now, and finally snagged what I was looking for on twitter. I normally don't pay any of those transphobic Bridget discourse peddlers any mind, but they bring up her appearence in the canon pachinko game Vastege as supposed "proof" that Strive's story direction for her is a contradictory retcon. This game's plot takes place just three months before Xrd's, and they claim that through her voicelines she is still insisting sternly that she's a man and not to call her cute, but also that she STILL hasn't broken her village's superstition at this point in time. This is the only image they ever have as so-called evidence, so I wanted to see if you know if these lines are legitimately in the game, scrapped content, or made up altogether. I don't trust these lunatics as far as I can throw them when it comes to telling the whole truth 🤨

This screenshot is from same manuscript of dialog that is in the lore server archives and in the GG VXT archive pack that I compiled and uploaded to Archive.org. As far as I know, these lines were all used in the game and no unused lines have been (or even could be) datamined. Two of the lines here are highlighted so I'm assuming they're the ones these dorks are using to try to prove their point. I've translated them.

First line:

I want to break the village's rule/law*, and return to the village as a young man.

*In the official localizations I think they might translate this as "tradition" or "superstition" instead of rule or law.

"Young man" in that line is 男の子 (otokonoko). Do not let anyone convince you Bridget is using the other otokonoko there (男の娘；"young man with a feminine aesthetic"). They like to do that a lot, argue that it's the one that uses 娘.

Second line:

Cute is uncalled for... I'm a man.

In conclusion: Yes. Bridget is using almost 1:1 recycled dialog in Vastedge that she used in XX and the spinoffs. The Twitter grifters' Google Translating was correct this time.

Vastedge's plot may take place only 3 months before Xrd, but Vastedge itself came out in 2013—8 entire years before Strive released in 2021. A lot can change in 3 months in real life, but after almost a decade most people are entirely different altogether (wrt Daisuke and his plot decisions). Also it's a friggin pachislot machine lmfao Like, are people really expecting something as earth shattering as a character as irrelevant to the general plot like Bridget suddenly stopping all of the action to explore her identity on a slot machine? I have no patience for these people anymore. They're just stupid and arguing because they have no hobbies.

There's also the fact that Daisuke originally planned for Bridget to be a cis girl until the very last minute. So if anything her coming out in Strive was just returning to the starting concept. He mentions this in the interview in the back of Artworks of Guilty Gear X 2000-2004. Translation by fairymisao.

(27)---The character Bridget, introduced in Guilty Gear XX, looks like a girl but is actually a boy, right? What was your intention in deciding on creating this kind of character? Ishiwatari: The creation of Bridget as a boy happened at the very last second; during development I was drawing him as purely a girl. It's just that when there is a need to give a worldly backbone (to the game), in order for me to try to not forget each character, and in order to revive the character, I give them my very heart. As a result, the creation of Bridget as actually a boy instead of a girl was because I thought he could become my alter ego. [...]

It's also important to note that Vastedge was the first thing ASW made for Guilty Gear after getting the full rights to the IP back from Sega after the Sega-Sammy merger in 2011 (which they had started to lose a bit before Overture's release in 2004). They were absolutely more focused on making something that would generate income and looked flashy than they were a compelling cinematic experience.

#asks #bridget discourse #long post #VXT doesn't really offer anything meaningful for any of the characters outside of the immediate main cast tbh #Friggin Zappa and Jam both have more lines than Bridget does in VXT #Like I do actually enjoy Bridget as a character. She's fun and lighthearted in a cast of very serious & gritty characters #But My God are people vastly overestimating just important she was to anything at all until Strive #I mean come on she was introduced in XX. You know. The series with 3 story writers that isn't even canon?#Also I apologize if my tone comes across as hostile. It's not directed towards you I promise lol #The people on Twitter still arguing against this shit AFTER A YEAR have sent me more than 20 death threats *because of the Brisket meme*#My patience for them is thinner than wet tissue paper #They have no genuine human connections and it really shows #They weren't even good/entertaining death threats!!!#Anyway whipping this out into cyberspace and then going to sleep nighty night

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artheresy · 3 months

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Part One (Astral Express

Random post ideas I got, but I'm just listing my opinions on aspects of the HSR designs, including things I may dislike or would at least change about certain playable HSR design, because I am currently planning some of my own designs/redesigns to use for future art

Disclaimer!! I am not a professional character designer, I am not saying any of my ideas for them are objectively better, and I am not bashing any of these designs. I actually like most if not literally all of the playable designs so far! This is just my lil opinions of how I would change them

The List part 1:

Stelle: I actually like the turquoise band around her thigh, I just don't like how they didn't take the opportunity to sprinkle in some more of that color into her design. She had a lot of little details in her outfit, especially the back of her coat, so there's a lot of places where a few splashes of turquoise could be added whether in those little details or in some of her other adornments just so that the band stands out less . I think I would change more than just that ofc, but that's one of the things about her that stood out the most to me. Also honestly? Maybe I would scale down the sheer amount of detail she has on her back (which as someone who has tried to draw her from the back view o h my g o d), and add some more detail on her sides like her arms and her legs maybe? I dunno, I think her design is really really nice, but there are places the amount of details could be more evenly spread to.

March 7th: While I don't mind her design that is especially center around her top half, March definitely has a clutter design particularly around her waist when you look at her full body in detail. Clutter that manages to mix in some odd color choices too/ I'd probably clean it up, or better place the little bits of clutter to feel like it matches more and change up the colors in order to at least go with the rest of her outfit. Like the gold makes sense, not only with her details of golden buttons throughout her design but also the golden ticket she holds showing she is passenger of the Astral Express, but why the black fabric? How is it supposed to work in terms of construction with the rest of her outfit, I'd keep her black to only the little accented bands on her thigh and neck rather than anything big on her waist. Why is the thing holding her camera orange, why does she have this random bright green button, why does she have seemingly two different belts?? I think March would have a better sense of what goes together than that. Overall, still an adorable design.

Dan Heng: He is very nicely designed, and I think a lot of his personality comes through in it, way better than any alternative for him. I feel like I can get a better sense of his nature and overall how he feels and who he is in it. The one unfortunate aspect of his design for me though is that it feels a bit... bland? for a lack of better word. Not that he's devoid of details or anything, very nice to see him not having a particularly busy design, but a lot of those meaningful details tend to be pushed to his back or his arms. I would probably bring a few more of the details that can be to the front or maybe add more? It just feels as though there is something lacking in the design, maybe more on a coloration front than construction. Speaking of coloration, I'd likely change the way the details around his waist are colored, all the same hue and yet different shades also getting an ombre? It's a little messy, but not a big issue to be honest. That's just my view of it though, still love his design for how much it really lets his character shine through unlike Another One which I will eventually get into and explain my thoughts on in the Luofu post.

Himeko: Listen, she's beautiful, she's gorgeous. I absolutely adore her and her color palette especially, it's such a nice blend of elements with the gold all mixed in. However, her silhouette is awful like it's so messy, and I really dislike how weighed down she feels. I wish she looked just a bit different, wish her clothes looked a bit lighter. She's a Nameless, she's their navigator, she's the one who repaired the Astral Express herself!! I wish she had more details to reflect all of that, and I already have ideas for how it could be done that would end up alleviating some of the weight placed on her with all of those heavy, layered fabrics. Additionally, I think there's a better way to highlight those elements while still making her look elegant, gorgeous, and ornate. Yeah, I love Himeko, I do like her currently design a lot, but I think more could be done to show off more sides of her. She's the one I probably have the clearest image for so far. Like I can imagine her in a nice set of slacks, a deep brown tone that goes well with her coat, and either on the sides or the front of the bottom, they have slits revealing these ruffles showing through similar to the ruffles of her coat sleeves. They have golden adornments along them, very sleek and fitting her figure well to keep with a very elegant appearance. Perhaps she has suspenders as well, maybe only one side to fit with their habit of asymmetrical designs. All with a nice white blouse or even some kind of button up, buttons popped open and collar folded in a more fashionable style. Even more hammering on the asymmetry, maybe for side where she actually wears her coat, the sleeve is much shorter to not interfere with the jacket's ruffles. I don't know, that's just a little idea of changing up the construction of her outfit that I had, but I'll see how it looks on paper when I draw it.

Welt: Okay listen, I need to look up more about his lore before I can truly say anything about him. Looking at his design, and with what I do know about him, I do adore it. His color palette here with the grey tones making up the majority of it for his upper body with the accents of an almost like cool toned brown and the darker shades of grey and black coming in. It's so nicely balanced, I don't feel like he had too many elements or too many overlapping fabrics that complicate the shape. It's a competent design, and while I think someone with more knowledge on him could find more places to add details, with what I know about him, I do really like the way he looks. If I were to change one thing... I would give him more wrinkles. I know why his physical appearance doesn't match what his true age is, but I still think he deserves a few more wrinkles PLEASE that's the only way I can think to truly elevate him at the moment, give him a few more wrinkles he'd look so good with them. Whenever I see art of people giving him more wrinkles I ascend... Okay well, I can think of something I would do color wise, but I'm still on the fence about it.

I think I'll leave things there for now. I don't have as much to say on these designs in particular. I think generally they're pretty solid, and even with the ones I can think of more changes for like Himeko's, I still greatly adore a lot of elements from it. The Astral Express' base designs definitely aren't the ones I have a lot of gripes with or things to say aside from suggestions for Himeko, we'll get to those eventually (those ones in particular are Serval and DH IL, both for primarily character reasons rather than aesthetic reasons like some other opinions I have.) But yeah, the next post will be for the Stellaron Hunters since I couldn't fit them into this so look out for that!

#sorry again about welt's part being weaker #I really need to redownload honkai and get back into it #but yeah uh #when i get my hands on talking about dh il I will have a lot to say #His standard 4 star design is sm better character wise than his dh il design and I will DIE on that hill #the only way you can take me off of it is with my head on a stick im so serious #and i'll get into why later I promise #it's very very character focused not like aesthetics #bc honestly? love the aesthetics and ornate details of it I like the meaningful things hidden within it #but uh... lots of problems with how dan hengs character doesnt shine through AT ALL in that design esp in one of the most important aspects #like this design connects to a big reveal about dh and his past and how he feels about certain things #and yet the design doesnt convey anything more than the bare minimum and its such wasted potential to me #anyways #enough of that #i will be drawing these eventually #so stayed turned #hsr #honkai star rail #hsr stelle #hsr trailblazer #hsr march 7th #dan heng #hsr welt yang #hsr himeko #jaxie rambles #<- gonna start organizing posts with that tag to more easily find stuff or even to mute it if people want me to shut up XD

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