*Poll inspired by typical ambiguity in the new audio story Victory of the Doctor, which on an unrelated note is amazing!
Evidence for each argument beneath the cut!
Open marriage
The Doctor's wedding to Marilyn Monroe occurs in A Christmas Carol, when he storms off to a chapel with lipstick marks on his face. “I’ll just go and get married then, shall I? See how you like that. Marilyn? Get your coat!”
While he wasn't yet with River then, he maintains this relationship afterwards, apparently with River involved. In the mini-episode Good Night, the Doctor enters the TARDIS with a euphonium, calling over his shoulder, “River! I’ll see you later! Tell Marilyn she’s too late, she’ll have to use the biplane. Take care!”
Another piece of evidence comes from The Wedding of River Song, when they're passive-aggressively flirting.
“Hallucinogenic lipstick. Works wonders on President Kennedy. And Cleopatra was a real pushover.”
“I always thought so.”
“She mentioned you.”
“What did she say?”
“Put down that gun.”
“Did you?”
“Eventually.”
“Oh, they're flirting. Do I have to watch this?” (from Kovarian)
I've never understood the innuendo (please tell me what I'm missing), but Kovarian does, and as we know from The Husbands of River Song, the Doctor and River are both married to Cleopatra, so… it's definitely something.
There's also that diary page in The Eternity Clock game that suggests the Doctor, River, and Jim the Fish got blackout drunk at karaoke night and started “some sort of religion of love” which went on to last for centuries.
Serial cheaters
“How can you be engaged, in a manner of speaking?” The Doctor is jealous in Flesh and Stone before he's even kissed her, which doesn't set him up as a person who'd be interested in an open marriage.
“No, wait. That's your husband? That's who you're married to? Not anybody else?” In The Husbands of River Song, the Doctor is clearly not expecting the other husbands. Culminating in the same episode…
“So, King Hydroflax?”
“Oh, how many times? I married the diamond!”
“So you say.”
“Elizabeth the First!”
“Ramone!”
“Marilyn Monroe!”
“Stephen Fry!”
“Cleopatra!”
“Same thing!”
It appears he is well aware of her other spouses (and that she's aware of his); so perhaps his surprise was more that didn't expect her to be so flagrant about them. It makes him insecure (“I posed as his nurse. Took me a week.” “To fall in love?” “It's the easiest lie you can tell a man. They'll automatically believe any story they're the hero of.”) enough to start an argument about it.
River also expresses her jealousy as an obvious fact, as seen in The Day of the Doctor Novelization (written by Moffat who (along with Alex!!) knows the character best):
“Ow!”
“Madame de Pompadour?”
“Jealous?”
“Of course I’m jealous. Keep your hands off her.”
In The Name of the Doctor, we learn that the Doctor, who has had a number of... sexually-charged moments with Clara (including, but not limited to, Victorian Clara), has avoided telling her that River is his wife. Vastra is uncomfortable with having to introduce them, having “gone a darker shade of green.”
“The Doctor might have mentioned me?”
“Oh, yeah. Oh yeah, of course he has. Professor Song! Sorry, it's just I never realized you were a woman.” (from Clara)
Actually both
This could mean many things (i.e. open marriage with boundaries which are violated), but potentially, all the same evidence from prior arguments! With a shade of “Our lives are back to front.”
In the mini-episodes First Night/Last Night, when River, having burst into the TARDIS and pretended to faint, mistakes her past self for another woman the Doctor's hiding from her, she openly expresses jealousy.
“Doctor. Have you brought someone else here? Does anyone agree to wear that dress? Where is she!”
“River, think it through!”
“This happened the last time we were here. You brought someone else!”
“No I didn’t!”
“Yes you did, I heard you talking to her!”
However, when a third and significantly older version of River makes the same mistake, she no longer expresses jealousy, but rather curiosity, which could at least signal a shift in how she sees their marriage.
Maybe there was a conversation that happened. Maybe it slipped the Doctor's mind when he forgot Clara.
Actually neither
This could also mean multiple things, but one of those things is this. The Doctor is a widower from the start. Likewise, River is well aware of Doctor's death on Trenzalore, “of course River would know, she's always known,” having been raised to prevent those events, and having refused to be bound by that destiny.
How can fidelity be defined the same way for time travelers? Everyone's spouses are dead somewhen. River understands the paradox of her husband's existence better than anyone. To quote The Day of the Doctor Novelization yet again…
‘Because you live in a time machine. All of history is still happening outside those doors. On a good night that means everyone you ever met is still alive and you can’t wait to see them again. On a bad night, it means everyone’s dead, and you want to charge around the universe, pretending you can do something about that.’ She looked up at me. ‘I know which version of you I prefer.’
And there she was, so alive again. I remembered her, twisted, burnt and dead, in the depths of The Library. ‘What if there are people who died because of me?’ I asked. ‘What if there are people I should have saved?’
‘People die. All people, everywhere. We grieve and we move on. That is how we respect the dead. That is how we forgive ourselves in their presence and their absence.’
Please feel free to add anything I missed!
19 notes
·
View notes
Hi there! <3
I re-watched Halloween Ends yesterday because I was upset and I needed Corey to save me, lmfao, and I wanted to ask you something that I've been wondering about.
So, I have no way of getting the novelisation of the movie anytime soon, and you're kinda my only frame of reference for it; so I hope you don't mind me asking you this.
When Corey is on his revenge killing spree, he kills those bullies at the mechanic shop. And Ronald is there. And then Ronald comes out to help the kids because of Terry. And only because of that. So, that makes me wonder...
Did Corey plan on killing Ronald after he was done with the kids? Is that something that was elaborated on in the novel?
Because I keep wondering about that, since Corey pretty much killed everyone that ever wronged him during that night, and Ronald was right there; but Corey didn't kill him (or didn't get the chance to, at least). Terry shot him by accident. But Corey killed his mom, of course. So, it'd make sense if he had at least planned on going after Ronald as well; even though he never actively wronged Corey (only passively, if we look at the way he just sat and watched while Joan abused Corey right in front of him, for example). But more so for completion's sake, y'know? They were on generally good terms, after all. I mean, in your latest post about the novel, you quoted that Ronald is "the loveliest thing" in Corey's life, according to Rohan. So, that makes me wonder all the more.
OH, and... I fought with myself to include this point, but anyway- Corey takes the mask off when Ronald comes to help the kids, so that Ronald can see his face and know it's him. And it clearly disarms Ronald immediately and is the reason why Terry accidentally shot him instead of Corey, because he shielded him instinctively. Thus, I keep wondering if Corey meant for that to happen or if he took the mask off in order to assure Ronald that he wasn't actually in danger...
It's such a seemingly insignificant thing that I'm thinking about far too much, but it's been bothering me that I don't know, and I was curious if the novel said anything about that at all, or if they just brushed over it there, as well. If they did, I'll just make up my own mind, of course, hdsfdjkfsk
Anyway, I'm very sorry for rambling on about this, gosh! I love your blog(s) and everything you have to say about Corey and Rohan, you're awesome!!! Thank you for your detailed posts all the time, they keep me going!
Take care! <3
ahhh hi !! thank you so much for sending this ask !! i love talking about this sort of thing more than anything lol and i’m sorry this took a little longer than i expected to reply, i was double checking like every ronald scene in the novel and cross-referencing that with behind-the-scenes details from making of, and re-watching the movie (i didn’t have to do that last one but like you, i needed emotional support from corey too 💗)
WARNING for discussions about (canon-typical) violence, murder, child abuse, abusive households, mentions of suicide and self-harm, and spoilers for the novelisation.
TL;DR – the novelisation does not elaborate on corey's intentions in any huge amount of detail, but it does provide some insight into a few different possibilities for ronald and corey’s relationship and what that would mean for corey's intentions.
general relationship
the novelisation actually gives some really specific details about the cunningham-prevo backstory, but also leaves a lot of aspects vague too.
joan married ronald when corey was 15, and she made it clear to ronald that he would "remain firmly on the sidelines when it came to corey's upbringing" which ronald "gladly" agreed to. so from the very beginning, ronald accepts he isn't going to be an active parent to corey, which maybe means he didn't believe he would do a good job anyway, or maybe he agreed it wasn't his place to parent corey in the same way joan does.
also, corey was already a teenager, he didn't need parenting in the same way a younger child would, which is partly why i think joan waited until corey was older to get remarried, because although being a single parent is difficult, she wouldn't want someone else in the picture as a father-figure for corey.
i don't personally see corey and ronald having a super close relationship, but there are multiple instances that show they are at least comfortable and familiar with each other (in line with what rohan said).
corey had a job before working for ronald, so we know ronald didn't have to give him a job. i hc that corey really wanted to do something stimulating instead of call centre work, and ronald agreed despite joan's grievances over it.
ronald doesn't seem too angry at him for being late, even though it is a regular occurrence (third time in a month).would he be so lenient on anyone who wasn't his stepson?
the gifting of the motorbike is a huge moment of course. that's a big gesture which, in the novelisation, also comes with some stilted bonding when ronald reminiscences that he used to "get laid [...], if you can believe it".
they have their united front moment over dinner when joan is trying to work a reaction out of them and neither gives her what she wants.
a smaller but still significant gesture is that corey uses dumbbells and a pull-up bar in his room to workout, which ronald bought him for christmas. very much feels like an attempt to help corey rebuild his self-confidence.
honestly though, rohan's comment about ronald being the "loveliest" thing in corey's life is probably right, especially as corey's life has been incredibly insular. as the town pariah with an abusive mom, his stepdad being cool about him being late for work is probably one of the best parts of his day.
but then on the other hand, there are moments which do not characterise their relationship very well, including multiple instances of ronald "ignoring" joan's abusive behaviour and not intervening.
to reiterate a previous point: ronald very willingly obliges joan's wishes of not "interfering" with corey's upbringing. her unfounded criticism and distrust of doctors, the school system and anyone other than her taking care of corey should have been a huge red flag (if, of course, any of that behaviour could have been inferred prior to their marriage).
ronald's passivity at being side-lined by his wife, allowing her to continue an unhealthy and unbounded relationship with corey.
when joan is berating corey for "sneaking around" and seeing allyson (the slap/kiss scene), she questions ronald as to whether he knew about the motorcycle, to which ronald stays completely out of it and doesn't answer her, despite her being furious with corey.
however it is a really difficult family dynamic to navigate, with so much nuance. i'm reluctant to say if ronald is a "good" or "bad" stepdad, or whether their father-son relationship is "good" or "bad", simply because their circumstances are so trying and complex. yes, joan has abused corey for a long time, but that abuse also extends to ronald in many ways too, resulting in him allowing (or enabling) joan's abusive behaviour in a flawed attempt to maintain the (toxic) status quo of the household.
did corey intend to kill ronald?
like i mentioned, there isn't any elaboration about corey's intentions in the novel, either through narration or extra dialogue. the scene happens almost exactly as it does in the film, with a few alterations and added background details. it's the surrounding details and plot differences that change my opinion.
i think movie!corey would have killed ronald if he had to. he knew ronald would be at home or at the yard, both of which were places he intended to go (to kill momma and the bullies). i'm not sure he had the same desire to kill ronald as he does the others, especially if he sees ronald in a good light, but to tie up loose ends he might do what is "necessary". i do find it very interesting that he lets ronald see his face though, and i can't decide if that is as a reassurance (he wouldn't kill ronald and ronald should know that) or because it just didn't matter (he's going to kill ronald so even if he sees corey's face, he won't be a liability to worry about).
however, i don't think novel!corey intended to kill ronald. in the novel, despite all of the extensive set-up of joan being abusive and corey's repressed desires to hurt her (and arguably ronald), there's no suggestion that corey planned to go back home as part of his spree and kill joan. if he wasn't going to kill joan after everything she did, i really don't think he'd have plans to kill ronald.
that's not to say there aren't implication in the novel that corey would hurt ronald too. there's a scene after the slap/kiss where corey can hear joan and ronald arguing about him, and once they've gone to bed corey gets a knife and stands outside their room, but ultimately doesn't go in. it isn't specified whether he wants to hurts just joan, or ronald as well.
michael's mask
ahh so when i was re-reading the scrapyard massacre in the novel to try and answer whether corey letting ronald see that it is him was a way of corey saying "you don't have to be scared of me" or even "you should be scared of me", i've come to a different conclusion about the mask.
“Who did this to you?” [Ronald] asked.
“Him,” Margo said, pointing across the street.
Ronald turned to find Corey twenty feet away on the other side of the fence, pulling Michael’s mask over his head.
"Corey?" he muttered in disbelief.
the way the novel reads, i think that when corey puts the mask on in front of ronald, it's the first time he puts the mask on at all. if that is the case, it adds a whole other level to the transition between corey's kills as himself (or as the scarecrow) and his kills "as michael".
earlier, billy's sees "corey's shape wearing his prevo jumpsuit". it's fair enough that billy would assume it's corey without seeing his face, because they know that corey is there, but there's no mention of the mask either.
then, the way it describes ronald seeing corey put on the mask doesn't really indicate that corey was making sure ronald saw it was him. he's already "pulling on the mask" by the time ronald looks over at him; he wasn't waiting for ronald to look he was already doing it.
alternatively, the movie shows corey very deliberately stood there, waiting for ronald to see him and recognise him before he puts the mask on. i'm leaning towards it not being a gesture of reassurance but more of a last show of humanity to someone corey cares about -- "it's me, and i appreciate that you always treated me well, but this is the monster they've made me into".
in both versions, ronald jumps up to stop terry shooting corey. whether he was intending to shield corey or was just getting up to try and talk terry down, i think it says a lot about ronald as a character. he has been very passive this whole time, especially in scenes that take place at home, but in this moment he takes an authorative position to try and diffuse the situation. there's a scared kid with a gun, and his own stepson who he's starting to think might have done something awful, but this doesn't have to continue -- they can talk about it and calm down and whatever it is that has happened can be worked out.
15 notes
·
View notes
you get it so much i could genuinely spend hours talking about bakugo and midoriya’s characters and their development and how genuinely well written they are and then an exploration of their dynamic on top of that and why it’s one of the best in media atm AND I MEAN THAT but people are so busy tripping over themselves to be like ‘UHHH ☝🏼😂 MHA IS CRINGE’ or the fans themselves absolutely butchering the characters (bakugo in particular is like a toxic wasteland now do not approach do not stop within a 10 mile radius etc) that it’s pointless and it makes me so MADDDD anyway hiiii corey i put mha in ur inbox do u still think im hot
YES YES YES!!! EXACTLY HELLA!!!
and like... as far as midoriya and bakugou are concerned, they're like... forced into almost Every fic i read :/ like i'm out here looking for class a being a family fics without midoriya or bakugou trauma or hero worship is that SO MUCH TO ASK!!! i'll be under the denki-centric tag bc he's my special lil boy and like bakugou being in most of them i Get bc of the bakusquad bUT like denki is Also Smart and, imo, understand his quirk better than midoriya, so why do we need to force midoriya in there to explain how denki's quirk works tO HIM??? or like. people will bring up midoriya's past in like every fic that isn't about him or bakugou's kidnapping (which like fair ik that was traumatic for literally everyone but i'm not looking for balugou fics) and i'm just. i want sero hanta fics. not sero is worried about midoriya fics.
oof okay i have a lot to say apparently. am a lil bitter bc my favorite characters are denki, sero, kodai, and ojirou (and the bakusquad like i LOVE kiri) and finding they centric fics without just... let's talk about bakugou and midoiya is HARD they have PLENTY of they centric fics!!! i don;t mind them Being in other fics, but like... do we Haveto mention how amazing and special they are in Every Fic??? like... they're not the only ones who work hard and made it into class a??? so did literally everyone else??? midoriya isn't the only one who was bullied or gets anxious sometimes (and people make him like... weirdly anxious too like must protect him and i'm just... ugh) and midoriya isn't the only sunshine in class a (horikoshi literally said that denki is the glue that holds the class together but, no, everyne go ahead and make it mido...) and bakugou isn't the only one who's experienced something traumatic nor is he the only one who cares about others but is bad at showing it. and they aren't the only contenders for #1 hero and anyone in class a could beat them in a spar like... i don't think they're unbeatable??? denki could beat them. ojirou could beat them. satou could beat them. shouji. hagakure. kouda. aoyama. sero. mina. jirou. the list goes on. and they could beat all the people i just listed any day too!!! it just... it doesn't always have to be like "gosh i'll never be a hero like deku" like??? you got in the Same class he did.
ahem. anyways. uhhhhhh i LOVE midoriya and bakugou. hate the way fans act like they're the only characters that matter. yes this angry rant is bc i was looking for denki centric fics the other day and most of them were more midoriya centric even though that wasn't tagged and denki centric was. when you're reading a fic about the trauma of someone other than mido and baku and then one of them has to take over and be like "listen to My trauma" and suddenly it's aboyt THem.
oKAY DONE FOR REAL
anyways hella i still think you're hot in fact i think it makes you Even Hotter
(also no shame i literally made the password to last week's vocab quiz "SERO HANTA" like in all caps bc of the leaks and bc i love him.)
sorry about the angry rant about the two main characters do you still think i'm hot-
14 notes
·
View notes
ok now u got me thinking. aki coming back as the Cold devil. or the Winter devil. or the Snow Storm devil. and he looks the same as he did when he was human but his irises are like a powder blue and there’s always snow in his hair and his lashes. and contrast that with falling in love with you again who he thinks of as so warm and kind and loving….. thawing him….. much to think about - 🍊
the same year the gun devil was eliminated, japan experienced a particularly hard winter season — perhaps that's why he was reborn as the snow devil. when he first opened his eyes, he was met with a dark and cloudy sky, he could hear the lull of the ocean, his ears were still ringing from the hum of a chainsaw and the only thing he can remember is his first name, and particularly not his last.
public safety is quick to follow through on the reports of a humanoid-looking devil wandering the outskirts of hokkaido, leaving a trail of frozen water and dead trees in his path. upon capturing him, since he seemed to not pose much of a threat, he's escorted to the headquarters in tokyo rather than slain.
once the devil gets there, he's apathetic, quiet. doesn't speak unless spoken to. his skin is pale, his lips are chapped, his eyes are a pretty shade of blue and his eyelashes are pure white. he'd pass as a human if it wasn't for the twist of icicles sticking out from his head like horns, covering his hair and his shoulders in tiny droplets of snow, or for the intricate marks on his skin, faint tattoos in the shape of snowflakes.
he looks familiar. like someone who's face was in the obituaries a while ago.
in the mail, you get an unexpected letter from public safety. it includes train tickets, and it's telling you to come to tokyo on urgent business. the minute you've arrived, some devil hunters explain the situation: you need to have a look at this devil — the snow storm devil — and tell them everything you might know about it.
of course, you've never heard of such a thing before. you don't know anything about devils, how are you supposed to give them any valuable information? but when the hunters unlock the cell for you, when you take a step inside and they tell you, don't worry, just keep your distance and you won't get hurt right as they flick the lights on, you realize exactly why you were called here.
it's him.
it's aki, this devil looks exactly like aki, his hair is long and dark and messy, he's got the same face as aki and the same voice as aki when he opens his mouth to ask who you are. he doesn't get to finish his sentence and tell you how damn familiar you look to him because you're already running over, reaching out to touch him even though the devil hunters are yelling at you from the other side of the door, telling you it's too dangerous.
and his skin is cold, he's freezing. you grip his hands, you wrap your arms around him and hug him and it's aki.
aki isn't sure why, but right then, he feels like crying. he's felt nothing but coldness since he came to this place, but you feel so, so warm. his heart twists in his chest, he hugs you back even though he doesn't really know why. he could kill you, he could press his palm to your back and watch you freeze until you're nothing but dust and ice. but he doesn't.
he holds you close, he breathes frost-filled air into the nape of your neck. his body shakes, you mutter into his ear that you've missed him. you pull away, and there's a look in his eyes that's familiar, it's one you've always known.
and yet, when you nervously ask him if he knows who you are, if he remembers you, aki answers honestly, and it's the most the devil has ever spoken: "I don't. But I feel like I should. I'm sorry."
61 notes
·
View notes