#also if anyone hates on me for being bi but using the term gay i'll end you 👍🏻

[shinra-makonoid]

(cw dysphoria & sex life, wanted to ask some questions) You've posted in the past, that you're only into cis men and that you had relationships (and I also think you're a top). We're sorta in the same boat, while I'm bi, I'm more into men. I wanted to ask, how open are you with your partners? I'm afraid that any cis man who would date me would try to pressure me into PIV, because that's what nearly all FTM porn is about. And some T4T people online act so weird that I'm afraid to end up with a trans man who wouldn't act any better, but instead of "let me fuck your pussy", it'll be "pussy4pussy". And if I think further, it boils down to the same issue with hypothetically dating a woman. Some trans women also act weird about trans men, and cis women... either lesbian-leaning or I'll have to go to a bullshit circus called "het dating culture", though from this POV straight women who don't care much about natal penises feel the safest. Basically, I feel like most people who're open to dating trans men, only desire those parts of us that are "leftovers" or resemble our AGAB. I know it's my paranoia and dysphoria speaking, together with the experience of casual lying and manipulation/gaslighting, so I wanted to ask someone who seems to have more experience than me.

First of all, I don't think I have that much experience. I don't currently date anyone and I have no interest in pursuing anything in that regard because obviously I'm focusing on other stuff these months. I can't tell you anything about women either for obvious reasons.

I'm more ambivalent to trans men now as my thought process kinda changed. Like... I do think the T4T culture is often uncomfortable but it might also be a place where you feel safe, understood and secure. There aren't many cis people who are careful and/or who actually do the work themselves before dating you, so you will end up having to go about dumb stuff like the idea you can be a top. And like... Sure it can be done, but it's a hassle, and for my part it really makes me uncomfortable, which eliminates very quickly the person from the dating pool.

My last ex that I dated was a cis gay guy, who didn't ever think about dating a trans man before, and was shook when I told him I was one. He was a huge bottom so he was relieved when I told him I could top and all. But he was still a cis guy, and he told me he went to see porn to "see what it's like" and would talk about how he was okay/wanted to touch my parts and... Idk if it's dysphoria or if it's just him being awkward about it but that made me feel super uncomfortable because I do everything to not think about those parts of me and it's like everything about us was making me think of it. He didn't have any/much understanding or maturity in regards to what he would do/say would actually be harming me unless I specifically explained it to him and it was tiring. Is it a maturity issue or a cis issue exactly idk. But after that I reconsidered T4T mainly because these issues wouldn't arise, and in some way I'd be free of the pressure to perform at a "cis level".

I never got pressured to get PIV sex but I had one guy asking me several times if I'd be open to being pregnant at some point because he was gay but he was also a hardcore alt right and that was also uncomfortable. Usually cis people just assume you only have the PIV possibility and you have to do a whole explanation about how you can do it other ways and it's just boring. I hate that this is a subject, and I specifically hate this is the main subject everyone is worried about any time you discuss something a bit serious in terms of relationships. It is very superficial.

I'm super open about my desires (like being a top, a sadist, hearing the other guy moan etc) and what I don't want (being touched, pregnancy, piv etc), but it doesn't mean the cis partner actually understands it because it's often a bit too strange and most cis people are actually super vanilla.

Hope that it helps? Thanks anon for the ask.

#anon #ask

[readatrix]

I accepted an ARC of Our Share of the Night from Netgalley. This is my honest review. It's still January -- when I wrote this initially --

and I'm calling it now: It's highly unlikely I'll read a better horror novel in 2023. Our Share of the Night is an epic novel filled with body horror, trauma, friendship, familial love and hate. We meet Juan, a recent widower, traveling with his young son, Gaspar. Juan is filled with love for his son, but also anger, and the ability to hurt his son and anyone who gets in his way. Juan is a "medium" for an international cult that worships a dark, cruel god -- perhaps Darkness itself. He has been given no choice in this, having been purchased from his parents as a child. Juan has a heart defect that he knows will kill him sooner than later, and he knows this cult wants his son -- either as the new medium, or a new vessel for Juan. He's determined that neither will happen. The book encompasses a significant period of time, and a number of POV characters. Eventually we meet up with a slightly older Gaspar, who lives in an empty mansion with his father. He remembers little of the past. His father is often distant, and angry, and cruel. And sometimes perhaps insane. The reader is privy to much more than Gaspar is at this stage, seeing connections he can't, and the workings of the occult. He is unaware he's setting up a friend to be sacrificed. This portion of the book was extremely moving to me as Gaspar is abused by his father for reasons he can't understand. Juan commits a vicious act of cruelty and betrayal. I can only say that anyone who survived an abusive household will understand there are different types of horrors. One of those horrors is feeling unloved by a parent, and the shock when you realize you're not safe with them. Gaspar had a friend group that helps him through this time, and we follow their journeys almost as much as Gaspar's, as they learn to live with loss, and the pieces of the aforementioned other world that clings to them. The reader knows that Gaspar will eventually have to face the cult. Did I mention the cult is also family? Things you should know: This is a long book. Because I accepted a digital copy, I don't have page numbers, but depending on the source, it's between 600 and 730ish pages. It feels like the latter. You'll be spending lots of time here. If you just want the horror, and don't want to become involved, there are quicker books. The book has a lot of body horror, and general supernatural stuff, including doors leading to another very vicious world, but there are long stretches between these moments where it's more about a feeling of dread and various characters working through trauma. A number of times I would be jolted anew at how dark, and gross, the story could be. Our Share of the Night is a translated work from an Argentine author and is set in Argentina, and you will feel very immersed in this setting. The translation seemed smooth enough that I was rarely confused, but there were moments where I wondered if something was lost in translation.

Poets and poetry are mentioned A LOT! The almost constant backdrop is political unrest. I think a lot of what you need to know can be picked up from context, but politics do play a heavy role. The cult is run by rich people who exploit poor, often Indigenous, people. We spend time in London in the sixties, and Argentina the rest of the time, particularly in the 80s and 90s, and this portion has a focus on the AIDS crisis. The London portion might very well scratch a little bit of any serial killer itch you might have.  There's LGBTQ+ rep, but slurs and outdated terms abound. There are a two people who are called a couple, but also twins, who want to swap sexes, but there seems to be more of a supernatural/spiritual incentive than really being trans. At least 3 of the protagonists are gay or bi. An outdated term for people with Down Syndrome is used between friends. Not every question of plot point is wrapped up, and there's clearly room for another book. Which I would read! Our Share of the Night took me a couple weeks to read -- I read other books as well -- because I was so involved that I needed breaks from a very dark story. While most of the characters are varying degrees of evil, I did care about a few, and I imagine you will too. Others I wanted to suffer -- and suffer they did! I feel that I could read the book several times over and find additional layers and nuances I missed.

#our share of night #mariana enriquez #horror #argentina #body horror #book review #readatrix review #netgalley

[menalez]

i'm sorry if this is going to be long but i'm honestly a bit at my wits ends here. nearly a week ago, i was hit with the strongest realization in my life that i am prob a homosexual who's severely traumatized by everything that's happened to me and hence why it took me a very long time to come to terms with it. i held onto other labels like my life depended on it and although i used the lesbian label before, it was a couple of years ago and it was only for like a month or so before i doubted myself, freaked out, and went with another label. i thought, okay, that's it, i am done with that mess and can just move on with my life. idk what happened recently, but it was a combination of coming across a post by a straight woman who thought she was bi/les before realizing that being online destroyed her brain and made her think she wasn't attracted to men when she clearly was, and how she realized it finally because she noticed only being sexually aroused easily by men's bodies (like when they are topless at the beach or smth), plus a documentary i saw about gay conversion therapy that featured a gay man talking about how he was desperate to be normal and chased after marriage with a woman "with a vengeance" (a thought process i am very familiar with).... there's other things but i don't want this to get too long or triggering for other ppl so i'll stop here. but just like that, it hit me like a heavy truck that i was only into women this entire time and just hated myself so much. didn't helped that many people in my life, including perfect strangers, telling me that they think i'm actually gay. but then i see posts on yr blog about "so called lesbians coming out later in life are actually just bisexual" and now i'm like.... idk what to believe anymore. i wish i can talk about this with other lesbians about this and just let them all determine what i truly am, because the last thing i want to do is come out and then a man comes into my future and ~change everything~ lmao sounds so stupid when i wrote it like that but yeah. i don't want to hurt lesbians with this, but i also don't have to feel like living a lie anymore or keep trying to "heal: myself because anytime i try to do so, even if it's something as simple as looking at pictures or drawings of a p*nis, i feel so disgusted i want to throw up. i know for a fact that there has never been a moment in my life where i felt that real sexual desire over men or male bodies or anything like that, but all of that gets muddied when other factors have been thrown in due to my life events, if that makes sense. like i'm sorry if this sounds horrible but there is a part of me that hopes i am not a homosexual. i love gay men and lesbians just like anyone else, but i just don't want this to be true. i feel like my life has already been hard for other reasons, and putting this on top of everything else will be too much for me to handle and i'll just end up killing myself over it in the end. i want to live and be happy, but i'm just so conflicted over this topic.

just to clarify, i have never argued that the age in which a lesbian comes out means shes actually bisexual or not. i was complaining explicitly about how many bisexual women will use the label lesbian upon realising their same sex attraction later in life, will talk about having been into men etc but will say theyre lesbians *now*. i take issue with these women because i believe there are genuine lesbians who came out later in life being overshadowed by this phenomenon of bi women leaving their ex-husbands and then claiming to be lesbians bc they decided after 2 decades of dating men that they only want to date women (which is fine, but exclusively wanting to date women and exclusively being into women are overlapping yet different things). i think it harms actually "late bloomer lesbians" bc a lot, that ive seen, using that term are indeed bisexual not lesbians.

that said, i can understand your mindset and where you're coming from. but take it from me, rejecting your sexuality and wishing it away and trying to ignore it and trying to change it etc will simply not work. you may ultimately be wrong, sure, and for that reason i encourage you to take your time thinking over your life and analysing your feelings towards men if necessary, and only when you're sure of it declare what your sexuality is. sure, you may end up wrong somehow regardless, there's no guarantee that despite our certainty that we are the sexuality we believe ourselves to be. but if you push yourself into the closet and deny yourself and reject yourself bc of the off-chance that maybe just maybe you're actually bisexual with such a strong preference for women (despite having no history of being into men nor hints of that attraction to them) isn't going to help you either.

your fear does make sense. i went through similar when i was coming to terms with my sexuality and i absolutely did not want to be a lesbian. the thought of it literally put me into such a terrible state of panic, i would've much preferred to just be bi so that i could potentially have a socially acceptable life in my country. but no wishing and rejecting ourselves will change our sexuality, it'll simply make us more traumatised and unhappy. you seem fairly confident in your feelings to me, don't reject yourself with unlikely What Ifs.. as many other bi women said on this topic, there usually ARE signs of OSA throughout their lives, they just explain it away. if u have never & continue not to feel anything sexual towards male bodies, if u have never had a crush on a man including male celebs, etc then i think ur far more likely than not a lesbian. ignoring that will not change ur sexuality, but its up to u how u move forward with that. i can at least tell u that from my experience, accepting myself for who i am has changed my life positively and gave me a will to live that i was lacking in my life prior. its difficult to face discrimination and lesbophobia, but its even more difficult to still face some of that AND on top of it be rejecting urself and hating urself

[anonofseasons]

What are the characters sexuality’s?

I've been wondering if anyone would ask this, although I also slightly feared getting this ask because I don't have full answers for everyone. I'll answer what I can though! Read-more for length, but I'll preface this by saying that spirits tend to be queer more than they're not.

Vivian: Gay. Graham: Gay. Shannon: Aro, Ace. I went into detail in a previous post, but he's sex/romance positive, he just has never had any attraction of any kind. As for arousal, he knows what it is, and he's not familiar with experiencing it himself. Sophie: I previously said bi, but I think pan is more accurate. (I use both terms for myself, forgive me.) She sees herself as bi, given who she's dated and married, but I'd argue pan is more likely. Oh, and she's someone who doesn't know this about herself yet, but... She'd thrive in a poly relationship. Rhett: Definitely pansexual. El: I'm not 100% sure for him. Aro spectrum seems likely. Maybe pan otherwise? He finds characters in books attractive more than he finds real people and spirits attractive. He also reads a lot of smut scenes in books (what Vivian doesn't know can't hurt him!). I bet he's a monsterfucker. It would not surprise me. Howie: Pan, and uh, his physical adulthood will be filled with overlapping relationships/encounters. You know that curiosity he has? Well. It applies to this too! Lots of kink experimentation, although he'll happily embrace being vanilla when he's done figuring out his preferences. Beau: Uhhhh... I can't spoil much, given what I have planned for the prologue, so I'm settling for, "Bee likes men." Also... Bee is kinky later. Phineas: Pan. Poor man has not had a relationship in a long, long time though... Also I should mention he will not date humans. Never has, never will. He doesn't hate humans, although he may not be their biggest fan sometimes. He can't deal with the short lifespans. Mir: They're into women. There are other characters, but I figure since Phineas and Mir are coming up and I've mentioned them a few times, I'd include them on this list. Plus I haven't thought over this much for them. Haha.

[drawscripturestories]

My feelings on LGBTQ+

Sometimes I feel like I just need to vent my beliefs into the void, just so that people know what I'm feeling.

Today I want people to know what I'm feeling about LGBTQ+ stuff. My church's official stance is that there oughta be no sexual relations before marriage, and marriage is between a man and a woman. My church also maintains that there are two genders, regardless of what biology may say; it's a thing that was determined before we were born and will continue to be so long after we're dead.

And yes, I trust my church. Faith is a difficult thing to hold onto when everyone you see on the internet is telling you it's wrong, but I've just about managed to maintain it.

Of course, maybe before going further I ought to say what this does NOT mean:

This does not mean I hate everyone who identifies as Gay, Lesbian, Bi, Trans, or whatever other words you may prefer to use. These people deserve the basic human rights to live in a society that loves and tolerates them in the same way that all human beings ought to love each other. The second-greatest commandment in the bible is "love your neighbor", after all; second only to loving God, who also loves everyone, by the way.

This does not mean that I believe that Men should not be sensitive, caring, concerned with their appearance, or any other thing that is traditionally associated with the female gender, or vice versa. There is a big difference between the roles God intended for men and women and the human traditions that have built up around those roles since the beginning of time.

BUT this does not, in turn, mean that I want to let you all do LGBTQ+ stuff. I won't hate you for it, but... I know that sexual relationships outside marriage between a man and a woman can only lead to misery; in this life or the next; and I want to tell you all so bad, but... I'm afraid I'll only be met with terms like "TERF" and "Transphobe". Look at JK Rowling, for example. Can anyone here actually tell me what exactly she has said that has made her the sworn enemy of the LGBTQ+ community?

“If sex isn’t real, there’s no same-sex attraction. If sex isn’t real, the lived reality of women globally is erased. I know and love trans people, but erasing the concept of sex removes the ability of many to meaningfully discuss their lives. It isn’t hate to speak the truth. The idea that women like me, who’ve been empathetic to trans people for decades, feeling kinship because they’re vulnerable in the same way as women—i.e., to male violence—‘hate’ trans people because they think sex is real and has lived consequences—is a nonsense.”

She continued, “I respect every trans person’s right to live any way that feels authentic and comfortable to them. I’d march with you if you were discriminated against on the basis of being trans. At the same time, my life has been shaped by being female. I do not believe it’s hateful to say so.”

That last paragraph scares me because she practically outright said that she would support trans rights and the people of the internet still hate her.

JK Rowling never said she hated Trans people. She wasn't funding any hate groups, she just expressed her belief, like I'm doing, and the LGBTQ+ community wants to destroy her for it.

That's why I'm terrified to put this post out there.

But one of the virtues I chose to write on Gad's sword was "Truth", because that is more important than popularity. If I can't be honest with you all, then it's as good as standing by and letting a blind man walk off a cliff.

From my perspective, anyway. Form yours, I might be the conspiracy theorist connecting unrelated threads in his basement, or the old guy shouting "the end is nigh" at the street corner.

By all means, call someone out for outright abusing LGBTQ+ people, or for slinging hateful slurs or doing anything un-christlike. Just also be aware that some of us are just seeing you guys walking toward a cliff, real or imagined, and we want to warn you before you fall off and hit rock bottom.

[hazeday]

Previous reblog I'm not done talking about it actually. The thing at the end really bothers me n I checked and op is 17 so I'm not trying to have like, a serious debate with someone 7 years younger than me, that feels inappropriate. So I'm making my own post about it and like, again this isn't me trying to "own" op or anything I just like. Yeah ofc gay people want to "feel as powerful as cishets" that's the point. That's the point of equality that's what that means. Like I understand what the message here was meant to be but like arguing that someone who experiences homophobia making fun of someone conflating the trauma of that experience with being made fun of (probably almost exclusively online btw) with being bullied for talking about having multiple partners is trying to become their oppressors in doing so is an insane argument and one that I think personally is homophobic. Like that completely undermines the criticism that has been put forward about the polyam community from any gay person as "you're acting like your oppressors " I can't wrap my brain around that.

And another thing like the criticisms towards the polyam community are almost *always* valid and again this is coming from a polyam person. Because so much of the criticism is based AROUND polyam people claiming that experiencing negativity based on their relationship status (as in, having multiple partners) is the same as homophobia. Because it's not. I think it's also REALLY inappropriate to compare biphobia within the gay community to "aphobia" and "polyamphobia" or whatever because again these two things are modifiers in relationships, and not what define the relationship, they are not orientations. (you could argue that the lack of sexual attraction is an orientation but even if that's the case the experiences of being asexual vs being gay/bi are so wildly different and there is not *any* contest to argue about oppression between these two groups but I'm getting ahead of myself).

Whereas biphobia coming from gay ppl is rooted in internalized homophobia, and othering of our own members of our own community based on honestly a lot of misogynistic rhetoric (as everything ever when it comes down to LGBT shit no matter how micro the identity), the main issue that LGBT people take with ace/polyam people is *always* a claim to oppression on the same level or experiencing the complexities of relationships in an extremely similar way which is just blatantly false and insulting to history and a culture of people. You cannot claim *anything* to be the same as homo/biphobia. Because we have a term for the and it's homo/biphobia.

ANOTHER THING!!! Polyamory, as in having multiple partners, is SOOOO interconnected with gay culture like. Literally MOST people you'll meet who identify as polyam or participate in polyam relationship are LGBT. Because our movement has always been about free love and specifically empowering love that goes against what our oppressors tell us is the only way to love. And gay people fucking know that lol are you kidding me like a gay person telling someone they're weird for making claims to experiencing something similar to homophobia by being made fun of for being polyam is a crazy claim because that gay person probably DOES participate in polyam relationships or at the very LEAST is a lot more physically/emotionally affectionate with their friends because that's just gay culture. We make fun of people like that because they're comparing someone online saying they're ugly to being hate crimed. Because that's funny. And I'll die on that hill and I'll go kiss the multiple gay people I live with on the mouth afterwards. My god.

Anyway sorry holy shit I just like. Use your fucking brains y'all stop subdiving and subdiving and subdiving. Our enemy is our oppressors and our goal is autonomy in relationships and aphobia/making fun of polyam people based on those specific facets of their identity is not the same as homo/biphobia and anyone who says otherwise should be made fun of.

This goes without saying that this is double as true for cishets like. The audacity for op to weirdly imply there aren't cishet polyam people lmao hello. Yes you should make fun of those people. It has nothing to do with them having multiple partners it has to do with them being cishet and if being hetero/cisphobic makes me a gay person who just "wants to feel as powerful as homophobes" then brother call me a homophohe.

#sorry for the 5am rant just. jesus christ dudes its 2022 on tumblr #get this twitter shit out my face lmao #long post

[delusion-of-negation]

1/2 Can I add something to the slur debate? I hate how when you reject a word, people will accuse you of being eg: A terf when I reject the word "Queer" for personal reasons, including that I'm not American/English and I view it as being specific to that history, and it's just not a term I identify with. So do not like it used about me. I do not speak against people who've reclaimed it personally, and if it's their identity I'll use it for them. I just don't like it as a "World wide descriptor"

2/2 for anyone of any LGBTQIA+ identity. It also feels like it often is used in certain contexts, to erase divides in LGBTQIA+ identities, which need to be acknowledged and should be, because the experiences can be so different, not just from cis/het people, but also from within. I constantly have deal with ppl claiming "not using queer is terf behaviour" or have been and seen others be told "It's not a slur, we've reclaimed it" when that isn't how it works, since you can't speak for everyone.

[end of anons, sorry I can't format atm]

re

on the post, I mentioned how "once I had to censor the word schizo in a server, in the comment "I'm a schizo-spectrum person, and it's literally the word for our disorders, so banning all use of it doesn't make sense", and that's fucking ridiculous." and schizo is undoubtedly used as a slur, that doesn't mean you can go "I don't like it, so it's not the group term", as the post says, queer history, queer studies, etc, are very very established terms and fields, and not liking the word isn't going to change that. in that context, it is not a slur, it is not being used as a slur - like I said trying to have "X is a slur and Y is not" boxes where X and Y are specific words just isn't helpful or productive because that isn't how it works - it's not being used as a derogatory term towards LGBT+ people, just like gay isn't a slur when you say "gay people" but it is if you say "those fucking gay weirdos". you can dislike the word, just like you could dislike gay, if that had been used against you (as it has been for lots of us), and you've got every right to not want to be called it and you're not a terf for that, but you can't change established fields and the names for them based on your own comfort with one word. it's also not used to erase divides in any context I've seen - there's a lot of the overlap in issues faced by LGBT+ people, and while sometimes some issues are more often specific to one group, there's a fuck tonne of grey area. there's not really a situation where somebody can't face bigotry that's typically directed at a group they don't belong to - from mistaken identity to unique situations or circumstances, weird stuff happens in the world and there's a lot more overlap than is found by using lazy analysis that wants to put everyone in boxes. any two given bi people could have wildly different experiences from each other, and a bi person might have nearly identical experiences to a gay person, because everyone is an individual - there are trends, yes, but those trends aren't rules. some people find queer easier to say than LGBT+ when you're talking, some people study queer studies, some people have dealt with a lot of people using "LGBTQIABCDEFG alphabet people" type rhetoric and don't like LGBT+ as a result, and it's all just weird out there, and while people can try to be respectful of what is comfortable for you in an interpersonal dialogue, but if the whole world changed language based on what slurs each person wanted to ban then we would quickly run out of words to use at all. you're not a terf for your preferences but there was a whole online psyop pushed almost exclusively by terfs and exclus people in order to demonise ace, aro, trans, enby, etc, people, and that's why people say it's a terfy thing. that's the root of the discourse lately.

[kingsmanassemble]

Got into the habit of saying "not to be gay" as a joke to my sister and friends (the only ones who im out to) and now i've started saying "not to be gay, but he's kinda hot" and then having to remind myself that's not the gay part sweetie

#into #it's just a natural response now i say it so often lmfao #oops #to clarify i'm pretty sure i'm biromantic #but like 70:30 women:men #i have very specific taste in men #and 90% of that is matthew baynton tbh #jokes but i'm big into him #so my type is predominantly tall lanky dorky guys with nice smiles and good senses of humour #sometimes shorter chubbier guys with a sense of humour and nice eyes or smile #and i'm into a lot of fictional characters but i'm p aure that's bc they're fictional lmfao #there are only 3 actual real life men i have ever been #not counting like childhood crushes #i'm much more flexible with women and i have no idea why that is #but there we go 😂 #very random #and none of you needed to know this but #also if anyone hates on me for being bi but using the term gay i'll end you 👍🏻 #about me

[lgbtqia-stim-and-icons]

Is being a bi lesbian kind of like being ace and not aro? Because I'm ace and bi and I'm not sure what a bi lesbian is.

—

In response to @obamaonaunicorn's question, I'm going to be going over what I know about the bi lesbian identity. This is by no means an exhaustive explanation of the label, merely an overview based on my own experiences and knowledge. There's a lot to cover to fully answer this question, so I hope you don't mind if my answer becomes a bit of a ramble.

That said, though, I can answer your initial questions here:

1. Being a bi lesbian simply means you identify with the labels of both "bi" and "lesbian" for whatever reason.

2. And yes, this reason may include the Split Attraction Model. One of the primary reasons that someone may identify as a bi lesbian is that they are biromantic and homosexual, or homoromantic and bisexual, and simply find "bi lesbian" an easier way to communicate their identity.

More under the cut.

Now, the label of "bi lesbian" is a tricky one due to the recent discourse surrounding it. It has been in use since at least around 1973, but very well may have existed before then (if anyone's curious, send me a message and I'll direct you to a post with more history). The term comes from a time when "lesbian" was not as exclusionary as it is now, and referred to any woman who was attracted to other women (including mspec women). The reason this usage fell out of fashion was due to political lesbianism. Political lesbians were – to put it bluntly – transphobic misandrists who saw bisexuals as "men loving traitors" and trans people (especially trans women) as perverts or liars, so they excluded any attraction to men (or trans people) from their lesbianism. You see a lot of their views echoed in modern TERF views, which is part of why TERFs hate bi lesbians so much. But I digress.

Because the label of bi lesbian has not resurfaced very often until the past few years, there are many misconceptions about it, such as claiming that TERFs coined it (untrue, they're against it's usage) and that it's lesbophobic to respect it (also untrue, barely a few decades ago bi lesbians were known and respected members of the lesbian community).

With the progress that has been made in identity and LGBT+ communities, there is nowadays a greater understanding of labels and the personal intersections of identity – thus, there are a lot more known reasons for people to identify as a bi lesbian. (If you didn't understand that line, I'm just saying that nowadays there are many reasons that someone may identify as a bi lesbian, which is part of why the term has resurfaced.) Some of these reasons, with explanation and rebuttals towards hateful arguments, include:

1. Using the SAM.

There are women who are homosexual biromantic, or bisexual homoromantic, who use the term "bi lesbian" to neatly capsulate their sexuality without using such long terms all the time.

2. Not being attracted to all genders.

Some bi people aren't attracted to all genders, just more than one, so they use the term "bi lesbian" to describe how they're attracted to women and some enbies but not men. "Bi gay" is usually used to reflect the other side of this, where someone is attracted to men and some enbies but not women.

I have heard some people ask if it's enbyphobic for a bi person to not be attracted to some nonbinary people (in this example, those who are more masculine in gender, such as demiboys) based on their gender, and in my opinion, it is not. This isn't a case of "I don't like you because of your gender," it's a case of, "Because of your gender, I am physically incapable of experiencing attraction to you." It's similar to when a straight man finds out he was actually hitting on another man, not a woman like he originally thought. Innocent mistake, but now that he knows, his attraction is gone and he can't feel it anymore.

3. Not planning on acting on attraction to certain genders.

Even if a bi person is attracted to all genders, they may not be planning on acting on their attraction to men. Due to this preference, they use the term "bi lesbian" to signify that they're much more likely to choose their partners and live their life the same way a mono-attracted lesbian (a lesbian who isn't bi) would.

4. Using the historical meaning of the word "lesbian."

Again, "lesbian" used to refer to any woman who liked women – and this definition is still used sometimes, such as at Stonewall. So, some bi women will use the term "bi lesbian" because they're reclaiming the label that used to belong to them before exclusionists tried to take it from them.

5. A trans partner.

Sometimes, a lesbian dates someone who discovers – over the course of their relationship – that they are a trans man. These lesbians may lose attraction to them or they may not. Those who don't may chose to describe themselves as bi lesbians for the reason that this is the only guy they've ever been attracted to, and it's because they have already built up a relationship + bond.

Contrary to what some may say, it's not because they don't respect their partner's identity. Quite the opposite, actually! The "bi" part of "bi lesbian" signifies their very rare, conditional attraction to men (or specifically, a man).

6. Shifting sexuality.

Some people's sexuality changes over time. For those who change mostly or only between bi and lesbian, they may choose to call themselves a bi lesbian for simplicity or to avoid going into detail about their sexuality.

7. Community upbringing.

There are some instances where bisexuals have been mostly brought up in lesbian spaces or vice versa. The example that comes to mind is of a bisexual woman who spent most of her life interacting with other wlw – mainly lesbians – married a woman, and joined a lesbian group with her wife, but never stopped identifying as bisexual. This story, marking the intersection between community and personal sexuality, is one that has been echoed elsewhere (for example, I often meet people on the ace spectrum who feel more comfortable partaking in the aroallo community for various reasons, and many of these people identify as acespec aroallos – another "contradictory" identity. Or if you want an example unrelated to sexuality, some people who are not deaf partake in aspects of deaf culture, such as having sign [language] names, because they are intertwined with the community in ways such as being an interpreter or having deaf parents).

In short, the community that a person dedicates much of their time to may be important enough that they consider it part of who they are, even if they aren't personally part of the community.

That was... A lot (and there's more reasons I didn't cover). I hope it's understandable! If you have more questions, you can feel free to message me. And the offer for links to bi lesbian history still stands.

Tl;dr: There are many reasons why someone may identify as a bi lesbian. The people against bi lesbians usually have roots in transphobia, biphobia, and/or misandry.

{ID in alt text!}

Please don't add discourse to this post, it's merely meant to answer a question.

#submission #bi lesbian #lgbtq #lgbt #lgbtqia

[cat-sapphics]

i've been rethinking my stance on the blue/green "toothpaste" ocean mlm flag, as i've been for its usage and reblogging posts arguing for its inclusion since i started being active on this blog because that's what makes the most sense to me and i always side with what's the most logical.

but on the other hand, i've never been upset by anyone who is against it regardless of their sexuality, hateful or not. and that's a big deal for me, because discourse i disagree with usually angers me more than it should to be running into all the time.

i mean, i understand why. i still don't fully agree with its resemblance to the lesbian flag being "lesbophobic", especially because i've always set my stance on the sunset/ocean solidarity between the two monosexual groups. i think it's super cool as a bi person, and as someone who used to identify as a lesbian during this discourse not too long ago. but i do understand the lesbian community's priority on keeping their experiences unique as literally the only sexuality that does not include men. i can't say i'll stay consistent with this next point in every single case btw, but i also see reason in wanting to keep the 7-stripe, white-in-the-middle, gradient-fading-towards-white pattern that makes any given lesbian flag so recognizable.

but again, i'm bisexual, not a gay mlm and especially not a lesbian after all. and my views surrounding lgbt discourse usually tend to be a little exclusionary as a critical thinker (although i tend to hold that as a personal opinion and throw it aside when it's more necessary to just shut up and accept another's identity in order to not be thrown out myself, if that makes sense). so, i might start leaning against the usage of the ocean mlm flag, but only leaning. but just know, that i am not hateful or unaccepting of it.

if you're looking for other options, maybe try [this cinthean flag]!! the link leads to part of a thread explaining what i just said from a rightfully protective lesbian's point of view better than i probably did.

and if you're lazy, here's what the flag actually looks like (i think it's gorgeous and actually matches the lesbian one well in terms of colors):

feel free to send me an ask about this, regardless of whether you agree or disagree!! i'm completely open to discussion!! just keep it respectful, please. 💛

#pridecat rants #flag discourse #lgbt flag #pride flag #mlm flag discourse #toothpaste flag #ocean flag #lesbian flag #sunset flag #lgbt discourse #discourse

[xmoonlitxdreamx]

Ok here's my college AU post. Only the characters from Virtue's Last Reward are in this AU because I played it for way more hours than 999 and kind of got more attached to the characters, and i never played ztd. Also I literally only started and finished 999 and vlr like a month/2 weeks ago............. so sorry if stuff is like really random lsdkjfslkdfjsdf

Alsooooo I don't normally have headcanons for fandom stuff so I guess I don't really know what I'm doing?? Sorry if this isn't interesting at all lmao. Sigma is obviously my huge favorite so this is mostly about how all the characters relate to him I guess HAHA;;

oh also some slight nsfw text here bc the characters are in college and people are horny. just a heads up idk

Sigma

double majoring in electrical engineering and biology

Mostly goofs off and parties and gets trashed all the time, kind of skips class except to take exams

but somehow he's acing all his classes bc he's freakishly good at studying (memorizing)

also a horny fool...... sleeps around all the time...... mostly sleeps w girls

initially id's as straight but he flirts w guys a lot when he's drunk. later comes to terms w being bi

even tho he sleeps around a lot he actually rly likes romance & tenderness & is kinda lonely (but he wouldn't normally admit this idk)

Phi's cousin

Kyle's brother

Akane's lab partner

has a crush on Luna

later also has a crush on Junpei

Friends with Alice and Clover

wants to punch Dio

Luna

On some medical school route at the college, aiming to be a doctor

Kind of lived a sheltered childhood or smth so she doesn't go out partying much and mostly stays in, but she likes to go w everyone when they're partying it up even tho she doesn't really do anything

Has an extremely obvious crush on Sigma that Sigma somehow doesn't know about

She's friends w Phi, Alice, Clover, and Kyle, later friends with Junpei thru Sigma

She wouldn't say it but she doesn't like Dio.

Phi

Sigma's cousin and roommate

she and sigma get on each others' nerves a lot but ultimately rely on each other for a lot of stuff and are good friends

Friends with Luna, Alice, Clover, and Akane

Oh I guess she's Kyle's cousin too. Idk I never really thought about if they get long.

Idk at all what her major should be tho if anyone has any suggestions lmk.

Alice

Another one that idk what she's studying. Criminology??

In an open relationship w Clover, closest to Clover out of the whole cast

Friends-with-benefits w Sigma (men get pegged™)

Friends with Luna and Phi, sort of friends with Dio (and Kyle by extension) because they had a class together once but also kind of hates him because he's obnoxious.

Clover

Studying the same thing as whatever Alice is studying (criminology I guess? idk)

In an open relationship with Alice, closest to Alice out of the whole cast

sheeee's not really fwb w/ Sigma, she only ever does sexy stuff w him if Alice is there OR if Sigma's in feminine clothes (but even then the two of them are not really a thing idk)

Oh but on that note she and Sigma like to go partying together & she likes to dress him up in trendy/cute clothes when they go out bc it's fun

She's bi but greatly prefers girls and feminine people

Friends with Luna and Phi, but usually more quiet around them if Alice isn’t around

Dio

Psychology major

idk why he's in this friend group I guess he made his way in thru Alice lsdkfjssdf he's not particularly close or on good terms with anyone except Kyle tho. People don't really like him much bc he comes off really flippant and arrogant

Really desperate to be cool and popular, throws a lot of parties 

Friends with/has a crush on Kyle; usually his personality is more toned down when they're hanging out one-on-one

Kyle

Philosophy major

Doesn't really get along well w/ Sigma bc he thinks Sig's rly irresponsible and obnoxious

Sigma also doesn't rly like Kyle bc he thinks Kyle's rly pretentious

Friends-ish with Luna but also gets annoyed at her when she talks too much about Sigma

Friends with Akane, trusts her w a lot of stuff

Friends with/has a crush on Dio

He and Dio get along bc they're both constantly having existential/identity crises about being the uncool sibling in their family lgksdfslnglsdkfj

Doesn't really party with everyone

also i think he’s gay idk

Akane

Biology and neuroscience double major

Sigma's lab partnerJunpei's childhood friend

loves 2 roast sigma

she and phi are the roast sigma committee :)

Her personality here is most like she is in 999 because idk what she's like in ztd

Friends with Phi and maybe Luna? She’s not as connected to the rest of the cast.

oh but she’s friends with Kyle and listens to him rant about how everything sucks for him

Junpei

Biology and neuroscience double major

Childhood friends with Akane, used to have a crush on her but not rly anymore (sorry y'all sdlfsjldfk)

Meets Sigma thru Akane in the bio lab one day

he's bi, kind of inadvertently helps sigma work thru his sexuality too

Has a crush on Sigma

Becomes good friends with Luna

Is kinda friends with everyone else but not as close as they are to each other? idk

Idk I heard his personality in ztd is edgy so he's kinda edgy/closed off in personality here compared to 999??? Technically I guess his personality should be most similar to old man Tenmyouji since this is a vlr AU but honestly i'm just freestylin when i draw Junpei ksdjfsldfkj

Other notes:

There's not really a plot or anything in this AU other than just romance/relationship nonsense, hahaha;; This all is basically just so I can draw the vlr characters having a stupid fun time instead of being depressed on the moon.

Quark's not here because he's 10............ idk how he'd fit in here slkdjfskfsdj maybe Junpei babysits him

Also my endgame ship (?) in this whole nonsense AU is luna/sigma/junpei which i think literally no one ships except me but.......... you have to trust me.......... please trust me it's good................ i'll be doodling some stuff of them at some point hopefully.

Their dynamic is basically this:

w/ Sigma in the middle. (this pic is via someone on twitter, unfortunately i can't find the original tweet u_u)

altho luna and junpei are kind of intimate w each other i think when it's just the two of them together they're basically just good friends who trust each other a lot & they both rly love sigma. & sigma loves both of them

ANYWAY that’s basically everything, sorry it’s all nonsense & if you don’t vibe with some of this stuff that’s fine this is just for me;;; 

in conclusion: i want sigma to be loved and cherished and have a good time in college

#info #vlr #zero escape #vlr college au #blab #ze spoilers

[performativezippers]

Ok, I have 3 things. 1: happy birthday week! You and your wife are relationship goals, honestly. I love following you for your content, but you also give me so much hope for the future. 2: I'm loving the revelations tag game! What a fun idea. 3: A serious question for you. I'll include it in a second ask because it's kind of long and involved. And feel free to pass on answering if it's too much!! (And you can answer this publicly, if you want to)

(2/2) Do you have any advice (or know anyone who might) about possibly coming out to parents/family who are not necessarily violently homophobic, but very religious, in a "love the sinner hate the sin" mentality? They're ok with celibate gay people, & see it as a struggle to overcome, but someone living in a committed monogamous relationship is wrong to them. They say they love me no matter what. I've come out as an atheist & I almost believe them now. But I'm afraid being bi might be too much. 

HI FRIEND sorry this took me a while, but in my defense, i pulled a performativezippers and wrote too much. Mmkay, here be my advice. This be long cause I got into work mode.

First, do nothing if you don’t feel safe. Your safety, your body, your person, are the most important.

But, once that’s out of the way, let’s talk. So “love the sinner, hate the sin” is another way of saying “we disagree but I care about you,” and I think framing it that way can be more helpful. Let’s dig in.

x

Part 1: Start the Conversation, focus both on “we disagree” and on “I care about you and I hope you care about me too”

To do that, use “I” Statements – I know they’re lame, but honestly. They’re the best. Instead of saying “you’re wrong” or “that’s not right,” try using an “I” statement that shares (1) a feeling word, (2) a reason, and (3) a suggestion for the future. If they say “this isn’t what our religion teaches us is okay” or “marriage is between a man and a woman,” responding with an “I” statement can look something like this:

“I know that your religion is really important to you. And I’m happy to talk deeply with you about what this might mean for your faith and for mine. But right now I am [feeling words] afraid and worried that [reason] you are going to stop loving me and caring for me because of your religious beliefs. So next time I bring up my sexual orientation, [suggestion for the future] I hope that you can say something like ‘I don’t understand what that means, can you help me?’ or ‘That’s a new idea for me and it’s going to take some time before I know what my questions are,’ rather than starting the conversation with religion.”

If they use a term that doesn’t fit for you or feel good for you – if they call you “gay” when you’re bi, or call you an outdated term like “homosexual,” or use a slur, you can also use an “I” statement. Saying “that’s homophobic, don’t say that” doesn’t actually work because they probably don’t know why, and it’s likely to make them defensive rather than open to changing. Try following the same formula: “I want to say that I appreciate that you’re trying to meet me where I am and that you have questions about my sexual orientation, and I really want to have that conversation with you. But just now you used the word ‘homosexual’ and it’s important to me that you know that that word makes me feel [feelings word] uncomfortable and anxious [reason] because any time I have heard someone use that, that person has not been supportive or accepting of me. I hope that next time [suggestion for the future] you can use the term “bisexual” or “LGBT” instead because those terms make me feel like you’ve been listening to me and like you care about how I feel when we talk about this, even when we disagree.”

Try not to use one of these FAKE “I” statements: “I feel like you’re not listening” or “In my opinion you’re not trying.” Those are just opinions that you’re saying “I” in front of. A non-fake “I” statement there is something like: “I’m feeling [feelings word] sad and worried right now, because [reason] I have asked you to use the term ‘bisexual’ for me multiple times and you keep using the word ‘homosexual.’ That makes me feel [feelings word] erased and really small, and it makes me wonder if you [suggestion for the future] care enough to listen deeply to me even when we disagree.”

x

Part 2: How To Make Things BetterAnd then the second piece of advice I have is to think about what parts of this conflict can you try to fix and what parts are static or unchangeable.

Elements of this conflict:(I am making so many guesses here about them and you):

1. IDENTITY:

My identity is: religious (them) vs. not religious (you)

My primary community is: from my church or religious group (them) vs. not a religious community (you)

My primary community’s stance on gay stuff is: negative (them) vs. positive (you)

My generation is pretty good with queer stuff: nope (them) vs. yup (you)

2. KNOWLEDGE AND EXPERIENCE WITH THIS:

Knowledge: probably low knowledge of what it means to be queer (them) vs. high knowledge (you)

Knowing other queer people: don’t know many or any (them) vs. know a ton, even if only on the internet (you)

Comfort talking about this: low (them) vs. medium to high (you)

With my friends and primary community, I often talk about these issues. I’ve really had a chance to explore how I feel about this before now: nope (them) vs. yup (you)

3. FEAR/DESIRE:

Reason why you’re afraid of this: that my beloved child will go to hell or not be a part of my primary community (them) vs. that my beloved parents won’t love me anymore or won’t support me (you)

What I want out of this conversation is: for god to love you and you to go to heaven and be part of this community that matters so much to us (them) vs. for you to love me and me to be a part of this family while also being true to myself (you)

So. Some of these are super able to change, and others aren’t. People often try to focus on changing the identities but that’s a losing battle. Wanting them to be less religious or not a member of their generation is not going to work. It isn’t fair to them, and it’s likely to lead to fighting and hate on both sides.

What you need to focus on changing is “knowledge and experience with this,” and what you need to talk openly about and communicate about is “fear/desire.” Affirm that your identities are different and that’s okay. That doesn’t need to change. You’re not asking them to leave church or leave god. You’re asking them for something entirely different.

What you’re actually asking is for them to demonstrate, clearly and consistently, that they love you and see you and care about you, even if that conflicts with this closely-held identity.

And yes, it would be super fucking awesome if, through this journey, they change some of those identity things, so that maybe they find a church that’s more accepting, or they become one of those religious people who so strongly believes that god and jesus love each person just how they are. But that can’t be your goal, because that’s going to be their choice and their thing to grapple with. You can’t change their identity, and you shouldn’t try to. You’d be horrified if they asked you to change yours – give them that same grace and see what happens. Demand that they hold both things to be true: “I am a very religious person and I love my bisexual daughter” and then see what happens from there.

So, to work on their “knowledge and experience,” I recommend the following things:

Give them the info and website for PFLAG (Parents And Friends Of Lesbians And Gays)

Give them copies of This Is A Book For Parents Of Gay Kids and the related website MyKidIsGay.Com

If you know other folks with religious parents who are queer in your community, offer to set up a playdate so they can talk with each other about it

Try to find meet ups or events about LGBT stuff that is family-friendly and offer to bring them. Not to convert them to the cause, but so they can see and meet some actual queer people instead of just imagining what queer people are like

Give them time to digest. Give them these materials and then say, “I know you probably will need some time. How about we sit down a week from now and talk about all this?”

Tell them that you expect that they’ll make mistakes, and that’s okay. Offer to meet them where they are, if you can. Because they won’t know the difference between “homosexual” and “queer” and “LGBT” and “gay” and “bisexual” and lord knows they’ll probably ask you if you’re confused or if you’re a boy or if it’s a phase, because they likely don’t know better. Instead of getting mad, give them feedback (through feelings word/reason/suggestion). This thing about still caring even when you disagree goes both ways.

x

Take care of yourself. Educating someone else is hard. And when you’re in the marginalized group, it’s even harder and more exhausting. Take breaks, take care of yourself, and if you have straight siblings who are on your side or straight cousins or aunts or uncles or family friends who might know more than you do, ask them to jump in when you’re tired. Tap them in and take a nap, sometimes.

And never forget that you’re valid, that who you are is strong and powerful and just right, and that there’s nothing wrong with liking who you like, and not liking who you don’t like, and being who you are.

#p.zippers ask #p.zippers advice #lgbtq advice #queer advice #coming out #how do i tell my parents #conflict resolution

[dogsliampaynedoesntinstagram]

So I have a lot of somewhat diverging, incoherent thoughts about things you and your anons've said said, and I'll try to whip them into shape. 1) I wonder if there is a some gap between rational acknowledge and subconscious - bias (or if we're being impolite, homophobia) when it comes to these things. Of course, that can be rationalized away to an extent, but what I'm mainly talking about is the subconscious bias that Louis "reads" as gay to a majority of people and Harry does not. 1/

To use external examples, one of my favs from kpop is Zhou Mi from Super Junior M, and it’s pretty much an open secret in his fan base that he’s gay. He got a lot of flack when he and another member late-joined the group which can be attributed to overzealous fans and xenophobia, but Zhou Mi, unlike the other new group member, reads as less straight even in a non-Western context and still to this day (9+ years) gets more hate/is less popular. 2/

OTOH we have someone like Matt Bomer who is publically out, but still has a lot of straight female fans who are outright thirsty for him. They campaigned for him to be Christian Grey, and recently I saw someone describe him as “Can look, can’t touch”. To me, Bomer - and Harry (and Ziam) - doesn’t necessarily read as “straight” but more as “not-NOT straight” (the new Hollywood soft action hero) whereas Louis doesn’t get that benefit. 3/

This has very little to do with their actual sexuality, but again just subconscious bias. Unless if we’re able to acknowledge and confront our bias, oftentimes that can turn into discomfort and hate/anger, which might explain some of the over-the-top reactions we’ve seen in the past against Louis (and Zayn too - his otherness, in more obvious ways). 2) In terms of the straight female fans/queer female fans/desiring - desirability/triangulation of desire conversation– 4/ 

I just want to make a couple of observations (1) Queer female fans who make up a large part of L’s fanbase also include women / NB individuals who ARE attracted to men, as well as women / NB individuals who aren’t attracted to ANYONE. It felt worth mentioning to be factual and objective that actual ability to desire is not always the issue. Of the ones I follow who identify as bi/pan/other queer, a majority seem to express similar aesthetic reverence towards H and L instead of sexual. 5/

(2) I’ve seen at least one lesbian-identifying blogger recently who recently got a lesbian-identifying anon who said they would be happy to do [explicit sexual things] to Louis despite the fact she was a WLW and Louis is a MLM and the blogger agreed. So there might be something else going on there– But in terms of general fan response, similarly, over many fan polls, Zhou Mi’s fans often cited that they’d rather be his friend than date him. So it might have to do with how Louis/ZM are “read” 6/

3) In terms of your “There’s nothing wrong with a woman fantasising about Harry fucking her.” comment – I might be misinterpretting or overreading your intention with that statement, but it makes me uncomfortable for a few reasons. I respect why you’ve come to feeling this way and for other bloggers “shaming” women, but I inherently disagree because there’s other factors at play. 7/ 

 I think we can readily agree that men vocalizing their violently objectifying and sexualizing comments towards women, especially women they don’t know, is problematic (e.g. Adam going “I’d fuck [Celebrity A]” while joking with his friends, Brad saying, “Her face don’t do it for me, but I’d take her bare on her hands and knees.”) I know that are ways in which the relationship is inversed with Harry because he is white, male, rich, privileged, in an industry where that is the peak of power 8/ 

That being said, you yourself pointed out that One Direction, and many boy bands, are treated the same way that females in the industry are treated – objectified, devalued for the actual talents they are selling while being told their most valuable feature is their desirability. ESPECIALLY for Harry, who has been given this role despite his vehement objections. For many larries, who are queer women, the violent objection against other [straight] women sexualizing Harry might be commiseration 9/

–as they themselves are often subjected to sexualization and unwanted advances despite their own sexuality or feelings, which is another level on top of just harassment. I want to point out that that commiseration is *empathy* with someone they perceive as a victim of systemic homophobia (also something else they experience) and not necessarily internalized misogyny against women and what they feel as a requirement for reciprocity in order to express desire for another party. 10/

I agree you can’t help who you’re attracted to, and if the fantasy is between you and yourself, then no harm done. However, in my experience on Tumblr, many straight fans of Harry do take it the next level equivalent with the Adam/Brad example I created above, in a way that treats Harry like an object for their fantasies rather than a person with autonomy, and a person who’s expressed discomfort in the past for being made into this object. 11/12

I understand if you disagree with me, but I wanted to offer another perspective that’s more nuanced than “women hate that women have desire because of internalized misogyny which is why they’re angry when women express desire”. Anyway if you read this… uh thanks!

**************

Hi Discluded - thanks so much for your asks.  I think they’re really interesting.  I think your idea of people being seen as not-NOT-straight is a really useful way of looking at some of the different ways celebrities are read.  I think your comments will be really interesting to people who have been part of this discussion.  I’m only going to respond tot he last bit, about Harry and het fans.

I’m not sure I agree that Harry has vehemently objected to being the object of desire at this point in his career.  He definitely objected to being seen as someone with a huge desire for women, but that’s not quite the same thing.  While he’s put some boundaries up (including literally with his wardrobe), his album gave heterosexual fans everything they needed in order to feel desired by him.  I’m not saying I know how Harry feels about all this, but I am saying I’m very wary of other fans using a claim that they know Harry’s feelings as a way of bolstering their own reactions.

To your more substantive point - you end with motivations, why people might be objecting to fans who desire Harry. It’s not something I had touched on.  If I was going to give a reason for why I wouldn’t talk about internalised misogyny.  I would probably start with fandom dynamics - in this case Larries creating a ‘bad’ fan’ to differentiate themselvesselves from.  I agree that a feeling of empathy and experiencing their own boundaries is probably a factor for queer women (although I’m not sure I think that queer women are more likely than straight women to express objection to women desiring Harry).

I think that people can have very good reasons for why they respond the way they do and still end up reinforcing existing power structures in the way they express that response (a distinction that tumblr is quite bad at acknowledging).  It’s possible that queer women are responding to particular aspects of how particular women express their desire to Harry, but the easiest language to hand is language that shames women for having sexual desires. 

For women who are objecting to particular articulations of other women’s desire for Harry then the way to make it clear is to be specific. To name expressions and actions that are crossing the line, rather than focusing on women’s desire.

And while I don’t think it negates your main point since I’ve been thinking about the gendered nature of desire - I also wonder about the example you used.  The whole point of hetreosexuality (as like a social instituion) is that it’s not easily reversible.  The language around sex gives very little option but to portray men as active and easily ignores women’s consent.  I’m not sure that ‘Fuck me in that hat Harry’ in the tags is very similar to your example with Adam and Brad.  I’m not sure I think heterosexuality works that way.

Thanks for your thoughts - and I’d love to hear anything else you have to say.

#discluded #I checked before I replied publicly #It really is worth reading all the parts of the ask if you haven't

[nanigma]

Ive been meaning to apologize to you properly i really did not wanted to get under your skin but i have just word things real poorly which makes me sound real arrogant. Hope you can forgive me and if not i'll just get out of your way and wish you the best

First of all, “Gays are disgusting and should not exist” was NOT the intention. But using the word “insult” though true for some, was an insult in itself. For that I must apologise. Initially the ask was more than 5 times longer, but character limitations meant many cuts, changes and it got more blunt in order to fit. Then I got tired and sent it as is, I’m sorry for that too. So I have done what I should have in the last ask; split it (whether you intend to carry on reading or not). This is 1/6

2/6. Wouldn’t IS give the option for characters to choose from either gender if that were the case? They could exchange half the S-supports with ones of the same gender and keep the overall amount for constraint concerns, or laziness. The fact that it is made in Japan who still withholds traditionalism and by mostly older men who grew up in that environment supports this theory.     

3/6. Even for fictional characters fans like to delve into every aspect of characters as if they were real. It helps to know all about them to write about them. So I assumed your thoughts on Leo were concrete; doesn’t help that your analysis of characters are logical and that others say similar too, so it feels like heterosexuals are looked down on or overshadowed by LGBT that has taken the media by storm. This is where my questions arose from. I guess this is what LGBT community have felt.             

4/6. I don’t recall many LGBT events in the medieval era, but in the ancient times of Romans and Celts they existed as the norm. Since the subject was mostly about Leo I was asking in terms of royalty as well, for their line that must carry on it seems to make more sense for heterosexual relationships to be the norm - anything outside of that can go on whichever path they like because they aren’t restrained by royal duties or for some social barriers.

5/6. If I could change Camilla’s armour I would, along with Charlotte’s, Nyx, Kagero, Ophelia, the berserker and Oni classes and do something with Orochi’s top. I would also give F!Corrin leggings like her male counterpart, and make them better in the story that matches with their support conversations so people would stop bullying them. I blame the developers for that. But even if I could change it the damage is done, and people will continue to hate.

6/6. (It seems that you can only ask 5 times before waiting around an hour) And I guess I do have a case of homophobia, its something that I’m still trying to understand and get used to. Though not outright crushing, I do appreciate some of the same gender. Is this what you mean by “…fall in some place in-between.”? Then yes, this would relate to everyone. 

(Very long answer below the cut)

Like I said yesterday, I really appreciated this ask (series) and know how much courage it must have taken you to do so (yes, even on anon). I do admit, that some of the things you said really got under my skin, but that was mostly because it’s a very sensitive topic for me, not because your ask was particularly hostile. It was worded very.. unfortunately, true, but I could tell you weren’t outright malicious. You also caught me at a bad time I guess.

1) I didn’t actually think you were trying to say that, but I feel it’s the feeling behind the word “insult”. Of course, you didn’t intend that word either, butI didn’t back then. I just feel that being “offended” (only word I can find right now) by someone elses private headcanon (of a character being bi in this case), is, well, that person’s own problem.. As long they aren’t trying to force their headcanon on others, people are entitled to believe whatever they want about a character. If you really cannot deal with seeing someone elses’ headcanon, unfollow that person or ask them to tag the posts that talk about it. Ultimately, people should be able to talk about their interpretations on their private blogs, and it’s on you to avoid whatever you cannot deal with.

2) Again, whatever Intsys thinks or intended about the characters doesn’t affect my headcanons.. that’s literally the definition of it. Something that is canon to me, and not canon canon. I am sure they didn’t intend for Leon to be viewed as LGBT, but they know that catering to fangirls is a straight way to $$$, so they probably think of adding bi options in the first place as fanservice or something. I am definitely calling Death of the Author on this one. Their intentions matter zilch to me when I analyze the game. It’s only fair, since my opinion, on it’s own, matters zilch to them either, and I doubt I am going to convince them of making Leo bi in canon. My only way to respond is sharing headcanons which I feel make sense with the established facts… not rewriting the script. I don’t see how I am not allowed to do that because it’s not official canon. Most of fandom is build on headcanons, and I am sure you have your own ideas about a story that the author either didn’t specify or clearly didn’t intend. We are’t just mindlessly consuming media like gospel. Each and every one of us walks away with a different interpretation of it. And I think that can be very beautiful and sometimes even better than what happened in canon.

3) My thoughts on Leon, are that his relationships with men are very close in a way that’s more relaxed and feels more intimate to me than with many of his S-ranks. Part of that has to do with not being reminded of Camilla, but I also feel like there is something he shares with Takumi in particular that he doesn’t with anyone else. If you interpret it as friendship, that’s fine by me. I just think there’s something else to it, and I love being able to explore it in fandom. There are certainly people in the fandom that bash hetero couples, but I find a lot of the time those people are straight themselves and often in it to fetishize gay people/relationships anyway. But for those who don’t do this… you have to understand fandom is a tiny bubble compared to the mainstream audiences. It’s a safe haven for many, who can get pretty aggressive in defending what they believe is “their turf”. Because outside of it.. if you say a certain character is gay/bi/other you’ll get disbelief at best and outright hostility at worst. LGBT are alienated from many places, so they tend to be very concentrated wherever they aren’t. Doesn’t mean it’s a good thing to try and drive out others of course. I do have “straight” ships myself, and I am always annoyed when people try to prevent me from shipping them. (As you can tell, I am very adamant on being allowed to “do my own thing” no matter which side).

4) There were multiple non-straight monarchs in medieval times (though opinions vary of course and records are fragmented from those times). Like William II (either gay or ace) or Edward II (probably bi or gay) to name only English examples. Of course, producing an heir is always an issue for royalty, (or aristocrats in general) and it’s certainly interesting to think of Leon being faced with it, which more than one fic has explored in the past. He may deal with it like Philippe, Duke of Orléans did: Fathering kids in an arranged marriage while having male lovers. Or relying on Xander and his sisters (whose offspring are still considered royalty) to keep the line going. Birthright is the only scenario where he is outright forced to have an heir himself, and again, that doesn’t exclude potential lovers, though I admit I don’t imagine him taking one in that route.

5) So you agree the developer’s can be very frustrating sometimes haha;; Anyway, I mainly just pulled out Camilla as an example for unrealistic armour, because I am so used to people who pull the medieval argument being very selective when it comes to the stuff (such as certain GOT fans ardently defending the sexism as historical, but not batting an eye at shaved armpits and anachronistic dresses). My point was that Fates is in a fantasy world and does not adhere to medieval standards in multiple ways, nor does it have to since it’s explicitly not a historical documentary (though I do wish they’d tone down the fanservice too). It just can’t be judged by them, since it’s a product of the 21st century.

6) Being able to admit that is already a good sign, since it involves a lot of self-reflection. I am sure it’s hard to overcome one’s ingrained beliefs, and it takes a lot of time, but I think you are on the right track. So long as you try to keep an open mind about things and educate yourself I am sure you’ll continue to make progress. And yes, I think that most people experience some form of “attraction” (sexual or romantic) for either gender, just to varying degrees. I am glad I could explain this to you, and thank you for taking the time to consider it. 

#it's still friday somewhere in the world

[writinglgbtq]

Hello! I'm trying to write fantasy. I've been working on the world for ages -it's not finished yet, but oh, well- and it's medieval inspired, composed of various kingdoms, more or less advanced, but I'll focusing in two isolated islands (1/6)

that hate and despise culture. They're also extremely religious. Now, the thing is I want to include diverse characters with different sexualities. I was thinking about a bi mc, a lesbian and a quite minor gay character -or vice versa. (2/6)

There's also a species thay's mainly genderfluid. I want to know if this would be realistic or, on the contrary, unnatural. Also, and this is my worst fear, it is a really LGBT+phobic government, that defends heterosexuality (3/6)

as the only acceptable orientation. I'm afraid this could be aggresive for some people or make someone unconfortable, tho it seems necessary to the plot. If some of the characters are struggling with their sexuality but their friends are there(4/6)

for them to reinforce a positive message, and every time there's a hateful comment someone takes action or talks about how is okay being who you are even when people don't understand, would this make up for it? To be honest, I just wanna know (5/6)

up to what point I can make the society or a certain character homophobic/biphobic or whatever without being offensive to anyone, just as a source for the story, and if a positive message could help to balance it. (6/6)

There seem to be a lot of questions here so I'm going to address them one at a time.

The first question seems to be about a species that's mostly genderfluid. If this is a fantasy world, does it matter if it's realistic? I quite enjoy speculative fiction stories where gender isn't as much of a problem.

However, I'm kind of questioning the "LGBT+phobic government" as it relates to this genderfluid species? How exactly are the two related? If a species is almost entirely genderfluid, what does that mean for trans issues in the society? Really think about this dynamic especially.

Also, I’m not totally sure what it means to be against culture while also being super religious? It’s difficult for me to interpret. 

Since I have no idea about your plot, I can't say how necessary having a homophobic (using this as a blanket term) government is to it, but there are some issues arising as to why the government is super homophobic. From your question about genderfluidity in a species, I'm seeing concern from you about whether something is "realistic or unnatural," and my answer to that is that you define what's natural in a fantasy story. Why does the government think heterosexuality is the only acceptable orientation?

You're always going to make someone uncomfortable in any story, and it seems like you're trying to mitigate that somewhat, but since the government is homophobic in the extreme, how does standing up for oneself affect the characters.

As for the point up to which you can make the society or a certain character homophobic or otherwise, that's up to you. You're always going to offend someone (which I will never say is an excuse to be blatently offensive). I'm not going to say not to write something, but I will say write it with respect. Question yourself. Always question yourself. Stories tend to bend the rules, and the fact that you're even asking how to write this with respect shows some respect already.

If I didn't answer the question you were asking, feel free to send another ask to clarify.

Mod Anja

#long post #transphobic language #homophobia #fantasy #speculative fiction #writinglgbtq+ #mod anja #Anonymous