Consider this your opportunity to be an Astrology Bitch and go off about Leo Stede!
(signed, a Virgo sun, Cancer moon, Capricorn rising who simultaneously is and is not an Astrology Bitch, more of a Tarot Bitch tbh)
Okay! You asked for it lol.
I should start by saying that I'm an August Leo sun. Stede is a July Leo, as confirmed by the show:
July Leos are...different somehow? It's not a bad thing and it's not their fault, and if anybody else comes for them we August Leo's will throw down for our siblings, but there's something about the vibes! Maybe it's the Cancer proximity, idk. If anything my anecdata suggests that they're more well adjusted than the rest of us. 🦁❤️🦁
Anyway, I immediately sat up and noticed when they cut to the gravestones because it's second nature for me as an Astrology Gay. Obviously I didn't know Stede at the time and I don't actually know what went down as the character was developed, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if I learned that at least one person in the writers room was a fellow Astrology Gay.
So I completely forgot about his birthdate because a) ADHD and b) swooniest romance I'd ever seen, but I started thinking about it again when I showed up like a year late to the fandom and saw people talk about whether they were Ed coded or Stede coded. I am heavily, heavily Stede coded for neurodivergent reasons, but he also exhibits certain Very Leo traits that I recognized immediately.
Leo stereotypes:
Let's get the stereotypes out of the way because while they do apply sometimes (especially for Stede), there's no need to rehash them in detail.
Leadership, which he struggles with at first but a) takes up the mantle of it anyway and b) improves enough that by the end of the season the crew that wanted to mutiny saves his life.
Good hair. Nuff said.
The man has an auxiliary wardrobe for fucks sake.
His "theatrical instincts are finely honed" and while Izzy says it to encourage the fuckery, it's not a lie.
The Revenge
If an 18th century Leo was going to custom build a pirate ship and money was no object, they would 1000% build the Revenge. I could see arguing that a Taurus might build something similar, but honestly I'm not sure a Taurus would become a pirate by choice. Maybe a Taurus might build like, a pleasure yacht or something. A Libra might build a ship that's as good-looking as the Revenge but sharing expensive tastes isn't enough to convince me either. Stede's money allowed him to build and decorate luxuriously, but plenty of rich people used to comfort didn't have ships like the Revenge. As Nigel says during his tour, it's just so incredibly him.
Now for some feelings stuff:
Leos love it when other people are happy, and when we can be involved in fostering that at all for people we care about we are ON IT. Stede wants to create space for others to get what they need to make that happen. Literally in the first episode he talks about the Revenge as somewhere for his crew to work on their trauma and communicate their feelings.
The above is also an extension of Stede's instinctive generosity. Canon doesn't tell us where Ed got his clothes for the French boat party in episode 5, but given that Stede has an auxiliary wardrobe (which he shared with Ed almost immediately) the most likely scenario seems like he loaned (or maybe even gave!) it to Ed. Another possibility is that it was on the ship where Frenchie found his and Oluwande's outfits, but the purple jacket in particular seems very extra in a way that says "Stede" to me.
Speaking of episode 5, let's talk about the party game. Obviously the main takeaway is that Stede has enough of a handle on passive aggression to make the French assholes tear each other apart, but it's not just the passive aggression, it's in the delivery. With sufficient motivation (Ed's hurt feelings, if not his own) we see Stede command the room with confidence. He chooses his targets well. He knows just what to say to get them to agree to play the game at all. The fire wasn't part of the original plan but it shows just how powerful those hard-won skills are when he wants to apply them. (This doesn't feel like it merits its own bullet point but Leos are protective, ride-or-die friends, something else we see in this episode.)
Stede's love language, imo, is quality time. There are arguments for others (there's also a really good meta about his love language causing miscommunication with our touchy-feely boy Ed, if I can find the link I'll edit) but quality time seems the most appropriate to me. Another part of the whole generosity of spirit thing is that he seems to enjoy what a friend of mine called "engineering experiences" for people i.e. crafting activities and jam sessions for the crew. The most obvious of these is the treasure hunt for Ed, which of course comes out of his fear of Ed leaving, but it's also a way for them to spend time together. I'm not at all surprised that a lonely, bullied kid would grow up to value quality time.
I would also extend this to the clearly routine (but still extravagant) breakfast for two that we see Calico Jack crashing in episode 8. Not to mention the first breakfast he and Ed ever share up on the maintop in episode 4. It's not fancy, but he wakes Ed up to share in that moment because he's enjoying the sunrise and the marmalade, and I can't think of anything more Leo than enjoying something then immediately wanting to share it because someone else might enjoy it too.
Stede's not perfect of course, despite all those seemingly positive things I just said. In the way of some Leos he is frequently thoughtless, up to and including when he didn't make to the dock. I can't speak for every Leo but I have definitely accidentally flirted with/been read as flirting with people before, whether I was attracted to them or not. And yeah his quarters are nice but he could have used some of that space for more crew quarters, right? And how could a Leo possibly misread "what makes Ed happy is you" as badly as he did?
Well I may be an Astrology Binch but I mostly like it (and anything else that puts personalities into discrete groups) as an analysis tool. It's just a fun lens to examine behaviors through, IRL and with fictional characters. Also, the show is clearly trying to examine things like trauma and self-loathing in ways that are gonna inform character behavior way more than a hypothetical astrology enthusiast in the (admittedly pretty queer) writers room. But the vibes? The vibes are so there.
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thanks for sharing!
honestly this is so relatable. so for me growing up i was always taught (not explicitly but it was just the general vibe) that religious people are weird and stupid. like no one would ever openly say that, but it was often implied through jokes or like when someone would say that they were religious my family would give the side eye lol. and plus, yeah, its a government backed institution yikes.
and yet! i was baptised, we'd bake cakes for easter, when people would ask me what my religion was growing up id say orthodox, etc. like there was always this weird contradiction.
what you said about after school activities i also have a funny little story to share. so when i was 6-7 yrs old my parents signed me up for this like art club after school. and once this old lady showed up and started an embroidery club in the same classroom. and so when i got bored of drawing, i decided to go over to her and do embroidery. and i really liked it, so instead of sitting with the art club, id go to the emroidery lady.
and she was super religious and would always tell us stories about god. and i found it super annoying and in my head i was like "oof granny is loosing her mind". i specifically remember her telling us about the tower of babel and i sat there like "damn, she is so delusional". but i liked embroidery, so i stayed and didn't say anything.
and turned out, she was there illegally! she was this like orthodox missionary who snuck onto school properties to convert the kids. it was a huge scandal. so yeah, that incident made me even more prejudiced towards religious people. that and also the fact that my favourite book growing up was дорога уходит в даль, which is basically communist propaganda lol.
so yeah, it's strange. because whenever id go inside an orthodox church everything would feel so familiar and yet so foreign. i never felt like i belonged there and plus, as you said, no one ever explains to you like what to do or welcomes you in any way. like i don't want to sound entitled and im not saying that im owed anything, and maybe, hey, it's my own prejudice. but the only thing people tell you there is "we won't let you in dressed like that". and growing up it made me even more hostile. like i remember we went to visit a monastry in montenegro once and it was like 35 degrees outside and i was 12 and i was wearing shorts obviously. and like 3 people came up to me to tell me that im not allowed in. and i never got an explanation as to why. i mean yeah, modesty, whatever. but instead of being so judgemental towards a child, an explanation would be nice..? idk, that really put me off religion.
but then, here's the thing. when i was 14 i was being neurodivergent as usual and i got hyperfixated on religion. idk where that came from. but i told myself that i would research a new religion every week. so id borrow a bunch of books at the library evry week and i kept a journal detailing all my findings. i went to the lutheran church, i even found a hindu centre here and scheduled an appointment and borrowed one of their scriptures. like idk what was going on in my 14 year old brain but i was fearless and i would like show up to all these religious centres with my little notebook. and id even interview people... likeee.
anyway, one week i was researching orthodoxy. so again, i showed up to the orthodox church here, absolutely fearless, no headscarf, wearing my desigual jeans. and i went straight to the choir and asked if i could sing with them. i have no classical training in music btw, i know how to sing but like as a hobby, i know little to no theory. and, again, i don't know where this audacity came from, but i went straight up to the choir director and was like "im singing with y'all bitches". so i started going every sunday to sing, but id never stay until the end bc id get bored. and then i stopped all together after like maybe a year.
and again, i have no logical explanation as to why. i was just hyperfixated and decided that the church choir was my new thing. and i didn't make any friends there bc i was still prejudiced against religious people. i wouldn't pray, i didn't respect the dresscode. id just show up, not say hello to anyone, sing for like 30 minutes and leave. 💀💀 at that age i constantly felt like i was in some sort of bubble, like id always be half dissociating, id do things not understanding how or why, things would just happen, it was weird.
fast forward to this year, i went to church for easter with one of my friends just like to hang out. and i heard the choir for the first time in almost 10 years and fell in love again. i couldn't remember any of the hymns (probably because when i was 14 i was just so dissociated). but i was like i have to join again!
except now im more aware of my own surroundings and im more normal. so i didn't really know how to approach things. but i was like you know what, if 14 year old me could just show up and not explain anything to anyone, so can 24 year old me.
so the week after easter i came up to the choir director and asked if i could sing and she asked me if i was classically trained and i was like "oops no, but i sang with you guys 10 years ago". and then she asked me why i had stopped and i was a bit at a loss for words bc like idk why i stopped. and then i asked her what brought her here and she gestured at the ceiling. and that was our conversation.
and the thing is, now that im more aware and awake, singing there is even more fun. because i haven't read sheet music in 10 years. i didn't know i was capable of reading music. but i am! and it's this weird almost like spiritual feeling. because i look at the notes and even if ive never seen that particular hymn before, i know exactly what to sing. and my hand moves up and down and i nod to the rhythm. i don't know how, i don't know why i know all of these things, but i do. and it amazes me every time. like i look at something ive never seen before, but i can read it. idk how to explain this feeling. like imagine all of a sudden being able to read a foreign alphabet and you don't even know how you read it, you just do. it feels magical.
but yeah, i totally get what you say about churchgoers being mean. i always feel like an outsider or imposter in literally any social setting, so feeling like an alien at church isn't something that scares me. and i haven't talked to anyone there or made any friends. but just from the looks of it and the way people push and shove each other there like i can tell that i probably won't get along with any of them unfortunately. and there's always people shoving when queuing up for eucharist and there's always passive aggressiveness and everyone is always on edge. even in the choir like i rarely get the music sheets handed to me for some reason. like when they're distributed they often skip me and i don't understand why. it makes me feel like more of an impostor but tbh nowadays im so chill when it comes to self esteem i literally do not care. it's just annoying bc unless i literally grab the sheet out of the person's hand, i always have to look at someone else's. but yeah, little things like that give me the impression that the majority of people who go there are kind of mean.
and what you said about people all knowing each other is very true too. because literally everyone is always in their little groups. and if you're not childhood friends with someone, you can't make friends. again im neurodivergent so i just like struggle with making friends in general. but making friends at our church seems impossible. people are always huddling together and whispering and i just know i won't fit in. because at some point in their little conversations they always point at the ceiling and i just don't know enough about god or the church to be able to fit in with these sort of conversations, you know?
but anyway, as i said, i love going to church nevertheless. singing there makes me euphoric. i love the aesthetics, i love the drama. i love the over-the-top-ness of like people falling to their knees and crying and the priest talking about the devil. it's so cinematic, im obsessed. and if i don't "belong" there or if i don't have the right relationship with the church, so be it. i think it's better to look forward to church every week and to truly enjoy it, than to be mean and go there to ask for forgiveness 👀
@atomicanechka
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It's been wonderful being able to talk about these things for me too! I haven't really had the opportunity since Y7 came out, so I'm positively buzzing. And no worries about the tone of your post about Daigo's article haha, I appreciate it when issues are pointed that I might've missed otherwise since that's at least something actionable.
But I'm obviously not going to stop anyone from venting frustrations with the wiki or with Fandom as a platform; I frequently find myself frustrated too! It's one of the things that keeps people editing the wiki. I'm honestly fine with whatever as long as it's not accusing us of being fujoshi for the billionth time lol, but for better or worse I do like to clarify what we're trying to do if there's any confusion.
Speaking of, Mine's relationship tags are kind of a funny story! So a lot of them have these dotted underlines and question marks, right? You're supposed to be able to hover over underlined terms to see a short definition (on desktop) and click the question mark to see an article with all the definitions on mobile, since hover actions aren't possible on a touchscreen.
But since the article was and still is under construction, Fandom doesn't show the link to logged-out users. So I had no idea it just looks like we're saying the tag is ambiguous lol. It's up now though, so it's hopefully easier to understand what we're trying to do!
I just found it funny I specifically added that feature to reduce confusion. Half the grief we get over Mine's "romantic interest" tag is because people assume we're saying it's mutual (we chose the term to try and avoid the "mutual" connotations of "love interest," but I guess that didn't work out). I also thought it might help with somewhat esoteric tags like "co-parent" (which was put in place for Jo and Arakawa and then I kept thinking of others) and "surrogate son." Turns out it's tough to boil complex relationships down to one term!
I definitely have SO many questions about New Year's Day and I probably always will; for the space of only one night, it's a huge blank. I certainly do have to wonder if shipping Masato off to America was decided then and there. There's a lot that could possibly be expanded on in RGGO (further interactions between Arakawa and Jo included lol), so I've got hope for that too now that we're back to random events. I'd be really interested to see how you'd portray it someday!
Talking about Nakai and Tsutsumi reminded me, Nakai mentioned he read the whole script in a day so he "wouldn't do a disservice to Arakawa or Sawashiro's characters." That kind of stuck out to me precisely because there are so few scenes between them compared to like, Arakawa and Ichi, and they're all relatively low-impact in comparison.
Of course, it could be marketing on account of him and Tsutsumi getting to co-star again, or the scenes could simply have stood out to him more for that reason, or he could've had a different impression of the ratios having read the script rather than played the game. But the part of me that makes me want to go Off The Deep End speculating is kind of wondering if there were other scenes planned?
And absolutely! I'm not able to reblog often because the post editor's been crashing whenever I try to tag my posts, but I hope you know I love your work and I'll support pretty much anything you put out! I'm very excited to share my findings as well.
A lot of it's to do with Mine's relationship to Western culture vs. Japanese culture (his "westabooism," basically), so that's specific to him, but there a lot of interesting concepts and theories in Japanese psychology regarding familial bonds, met and unmet emotional needs. They work as an explanation for his probable feelings of alienation from Japanese culture, but I feel they would make for an interesting lens to examine the Arakawas through as well.
I actually hadn't ever considered the similarity with regard to Mine and Jo's dads, but that makes so much sense! If I were to take it a step further, I think feelings of "abandonment" by their fathers have had long-lasting effects on both them and Masato. Jo we've been talking about, his father was technically still "there," but he wasn't in his corner, which feels much the same as abandonment to a child.
I think Mine's internalized a lot of the same feelings even though his father never meant to abandon him (I guess Jo's may not have, necessarily; alcoholism can destroy a family whether the individual wants that to happen or not). Like, unfairness, displacement, lack of control, the loss of the only support you have and so on. I think dwelling on that is what sent Mine's mental state spiraling, and what made it imperative to just believe Daigo was "dead" to try and move on as soon as possible. He didn't want to be hurt the same way again.
It's also probably what he was projecting in his ridiculous villain speech during The Orphanage Scene; the reason offering kids support in the way Kiryu does is a form of "victimization" in his eyes, at that moment, is because that support can be ripped away from you at any time. The scene is kind of hilarious to me because it's like, "okay we need Mine to have a kick-the-dog moment, his actions have been too understandable," but I do get it from that angle.
Similarly, I think those feelings of abandonment are why Arakawa faces the brunt of Aoki's abuse, because it's like, "YOUR negligence is why I had to go through all of that." So I get why Jo, like your sister, wouldn't want the finger pointed at him, but at the same time… damn. Perhaps if Arakawa had never had that talk with Masato, things might've been different. I get the impression he wouldn't be able to endure keeping things to himself for as long as Jo, though, given things like the letter he sent Ichi in prison.
Oh, yeah, Jo is CRAZY protective of Masato too! "If anything happens to him, killing you a thousand times would be insufficient!" I think part of his overreaction to having Masato's money is also that if Ichi can't listen to orders that fundamental, who's to say he listened to the orders to keep Masato safe? I guess if you see Ichiban as incompetent to the point of almost being a malicious actor, you might think that.
I'm sooo so glad you've noticed the rest of those similarities haha, I've been rotating them around in my brain like a cube for ages. A Venn diagram would be so fun to see! That's such an insightful look at the differences between Mine and Jo's offices too. I was a little confused about the placement of the social spaces, or even that they're there, but if you look at it as clearly separate from his personal spaces, it does make sense.
Also, not to harp on the books in the offices too much, but I compared the textures a little earlier. Mine's are basically all (very expensive) encyclopedias and language phrasebooks in English, Italian, French, and German, in contrast to Jo's discrete hardcovers and series of art history books. They're probably all stock assets lol, but I think they're surprisingly good fits; Mine dumping considerable time, money, and energy into his fascination with Western culture and Jo being the type to not want people to know what he's reading totally works for me.
But yes! It's kind of funny, because Yokoyama wasn't much of a Mine fan in his early days, but I hope he and the others keep on writing characters like him. I think of it as Mine's "legacy" in a series where past characters aren't acknowledged too often; the most I can recall are that Hakuho mention in 4 and the fencing around the Touto roof perimeter.
Speaking of, I love Mine's missed shots in the finale specifically because he's an excellent marksman in his Okinawa character story. Why? How? Who Knows, He's Perfect. (Probably not as good of a shot as Daigo though lol)
And yeahhh, there are other interviews, but it ain't the same! It was the most in-depth one I know of. I think this is one of the only remnants, and I shall entrust it to you.
But yes, exactly! And I'm also glad Y7 introduced more people to them (myself included), Tsutsumi's my favorite actor of all time and Nakai's brilliant. They make a great combi! Of the things I've seen where they co-star, I think Princess Toyotomi and Hero SP are both solid; the latter is a special for a longer show, but I honestly didn't even notice lol. Musashi I wasn't personally able to get through even though I've read the book, so I'm not sure how it plays out between them.
Also I DIDN'T KNOW TORU DIED IN PURE??? That came out of nowhere oh my god T___T But if you're ever looking for anything rare, feel free to ask! I might know a guy (gender neutral) with a stash, Fly, Daddy, Fly included.
OH MAN MINE'S WIKI ENTRY I've definitely made my opinions about it known, but now knowing the truth behind it it's kind of funny and still so unfortunate. I'd almost want to recommend a section dedicated to the topic since it's such an integral part of his character, though I also understand wanting to keep the wiki strictly to factual information and to exclude speculation (or "speculation" anyhow- it's definitely more of a concrete situation, especially going off of the information provided in your pinned post on the topic. If anything, that sort of information would belong to the "Trivia" tab wouldn't it- but again, it's such a deep situation it can't really be summarized in one or two sentences) and the topic being too niche to have a page dedicated to it. It's nice to know that the subject isn't trying to be brushed under the rug though and it's just a matter of awkward formatting/incomplete work!
Furthermore on The New Years Event, I would LOVE RGGO to expand on the topic since they've been so liberal with the stories they make and the depth those stories add to the characters. Honestly, I was expecting Masato's card to have that as its accompanying character story, so it's unfortunate that he doesn't get it or any story as far as I'm aware (or maybe he does have one and my poor pull luck has just prevented me from getting the card to find out myself, but I've looked as much as I could and couldn't find an upload of it). Oh well, I guess it's the old "if you want something done you gotta do it yourself-" not that anything I could make could ever be up to scratch, so I'm glad I do have people interested in what I have in mind :)
About Nakai, I wouldn't feel wrong trying to accredit his comment to a time before he knew the full plot or saw the full game and was just debriefed on the general story/character relationships, and I also wouldn't put it past RGG to have deleted scenes/ideas (if those do exist, RGG please let me in your vault I'd like to take a peak...)!
The psychology of Mine is another topic I've been wanting to officially tackle for a while now, so I'm glad I have this chance to share some of what I have mental bullet points for.
Moreover, Mine's dad and how he "left" Mine undeniably impacted him significantly beyond physically leaving him alone, and it definitely manifests in The Orphanage Scene and his idea that killing Daigo would be "putting him out of his misery". In those instances, he sees Daigo and the orphans as victims of an unfair reality, Daigo being comatose, and the orphans having the endure the struggles of being orphans (and that added-on, projected anxiety that their comfortable lives now could vanish at any second like it did for Mine). Mine's mustache-twirling villainy is funny for its absurdity, but I also genuinely appreciate it since it lets us peak into his warps philosophy better. It doesn't justify his actions by any means, but it explains to us why he can justify his actions as from a place of love or pity as opposed to thoughtless evil.
To add on, Mine's relationship with his father, from what we're allowed to gather, was healthy and positive. Because of their positive relationship, the removal of such adds credence as to why Mine's desperate to get that love again. It especially makes sense considering Japan's horrendous attitude and negligence towards orphaned children that was even demonstrated during Mine's childhood while his father was alive.
And as an inverse aside, Jo's relationship with his dad was toxic, whether it was due to blatant abuse or combined negligence. It's fair to assume that Jo never got to experience genuine, secure love growing up, so as a result, it's not something he actively seeks out. He's been without it long enough that it's not something he necessarily craves like Mine who used to have it until it was taken from him.
Masato certainly makes it clear he felt isolated despite the efforts Jo and Arakawa repeatedly went through for him, and it's apparent it's an unfortunate side affect of internalized ableism. It definitely doesn't help anyone's case that Masato had seemingly been informed of the night of his birthday's events (from Arakawa's point of view, obviously), and it's clear that knowledge gives ammunition as to why he resents him.
You're right on Jo potentially seeing Ichi as a bad actor, it's not as if he has disdain for him for no reason! Like even if Ichiban hadn't taken Masato's money the way Jo could have imagined, the idea that Ichi can't be responsible in one avenue can easily lead back to Ichi having the potential to look after Masato, especially when he seems to be the one who predominately looks after him when he's tasked to.
I've already got my program open to make my little chart and have my reference pictures ready, so hopefully I can have that silly thing out soon haha- I'm glad you're interested in seeing it, and I hope other people will like to see it too! Jo and Mine really are my favorite antagonists, so it's funny (and I guess not surprising) that they have parallels to them.
To add on to that though, I think it's fun to look at the extra details, no matter how small; I'm probably more happy than I should be that you looked at their office's books, but I can't help be a fan of the details you found (whether they're generic models or not, I'm running with them- I've done more with less before lmao)! Mine having language books is definitely in-line with his interests, but Jo having art history books is weirdly endearing (and dare I say another point for "these are the same picture" comparing it to Mine's own love for art). Jo being so private to the point of blocking out the binds of the books he owns is so accurate to him and his secrecy, and the concept that he likes to read about art in his spare time is a new favorite concept for me.
Mine really isn't acknowledged much after 4; in comparison to Ryuji and Nishiki, he's remembered throughout the series the least (you can argue the same for Ryuji, but considering he gets a whole new life in Dead Souls, I think it's fair to say that makes up for the mainline series forgetting about him. Though I guess the same could be Mine getting a prominent role as Hijikata in Ishin... Definitely not as cool of a spot as to be a playable protagonist with a machine gun arm if I'm honest). In that, it's great that his likelihood can exist in future characters, and I hope they continue the trend of phenomenal antagonists in LaD8 and onward!
I'm eternally grateful for this frame you've gifted me thank you so much- Nakai's smile is such a blessing honestly, I'm glad if anything survived from the interview it can be this shot at least.
I've got Princess Toyotomi and Hero SP added to my watch list, DEFINITELY something I'll be excited to check out as a reward once I have all my important business taken care of this week! Honestly, I haven't seen Musashi either: while I was looking through their filmography I saw it was a project they did, but I've always been bad at watching long series so I didn't take the time to see their performance together.
For things I have seen though... yeah he dies SORRY IF THAT WAS HOW YOU FOUND OUT </3</3 Honestly I didn't expect myself to love the series as much as I did (admittedly it was predominately because of the leads and their relationship), but when it happened I was both- dare I say crushed- a little humored a little funny in a dark-comedy way.
And if you do have access to harder-to-get films, I'd absolutely be interested in hearing about it. One of Nakai's movies Good Morning Show has been haunting me for weeks: it sounds like such a fun movie yet I can't find it anywhere </3
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