#and then you have the titans tower incident which is like... the opposite

[plutoslvr]

also because in canon, tim never LIKED jason. he was touchy about jason's legacy and his importance to bruce, but he didn't like jason as a person or as a robin. he had respect for jason the martyr. then lost any respect he was capable of having for revived jason when he showed up and was nothing but a loser asshole. the fanon relationship built off of that takes away from both of them. while tim and damian was just...mutual dislike and jealousy born out of circumstances. it's petty, but tim never hated damian for long. disliked, yeah, but that’s because damian was antagonistic. and damian didn’t hate tim for long, he was just insecure and protecting himself and tim was always a convenient target. their later dislike for each other didn’t change the fact that they were allies, brothers, it was purely a personal thing, y’know? also, damian’s a kid, and tim didn’t like him, but didn’t fault him for being a kid. wouldn’t leave him for dead. damian and tim properly brawled once and it solved like...half of their issues. they calmed down a lot after that. then in gates of gotham, they were...okay. anyway the point I was trying to make here is comparing tim & jason to tim & damian is an ignorant, unfair comparison to damian especially but also tim.

if i could force people to read something it'd be this because alot of people seem to think that tim and damian are perpetually stuck in red robin 2009 when they really aren't? their dislike of each other was because at that time their situations were incredibly strained, tim with the whole red robin and bruces death and his friends all dying thing and damian being in a new environment which he didnt know how to navigate or know the rules to. and yeah alot of times when they clashed was out of jealousy or pettiness, damian in red robin even says something along the lines of "you didn't accept me" because yeah at the time neither of them were in the space to try and fix their relationship. but then acting like their relationship hasn't improved since then is a silly idea because they have. whereas jason and tim dont have that mutual understanding or base for them to even begin to consider getting along. and a lot of times people like to bring up titans tower incident which is really funny to me since it's the complete opposite of how fanon portrays it BUT ANYWAY damian and tim and jason and tim are two very different relationships and you cant say that it "doesnt make sense" for someone to think damian and tim get along and jason and tim dont.

#long post sorry #tim drake #damian wayne #jason todd #zaf asks

[yvtro]

imo the more interesting tim&jason dynamic /is/ the "they're only like 2 years apart" one (esp wrt "jason was tim's robin"? seems (to me) to have more potential if it's like "this kid who is my age is doing cool shit, I want to do cool shit like them, because they're my age and that hits close to home") personally am genuinely unsure why "tim is a poor little meow meow" seems to be more popular despite how it fucks both their characterizations lol

i will answer to both of you here, as it's related to the same post!

just in case i want to say that there's plenty of aspects of tim's storyline that have lots of potential. and there certainly could be an interesting one involving jason too. alas.

i think in general fanon tim is just a poor little meow meow. it's really ironic how when he was introduced, the writers wanted to make him more "likable" than jay, and they didn't want batman to play a full-time dad, so in place of jay's insecurity and need for parental love tim gets two living parents and is, for the most part, self-assured. there's some canon progression which disturbs this status quo of course, but it's fanon that turned his storyline into one about neglect.

so apparently all writers should have done to make the new robin a fan favourite was keeping jason's struggles and just making tim wealthy. real "what's cool when you're rich but trash when you're poor?" moment. having attachment issues, apparently.

and don't get me wrong, there is place for meta about tim's parents being neglectful, even if the creators originally wanted to achieve the opposite. but i find the extent to which fanon pushes this idea and makes it his sole source of personality a bit astonishing, especially that canon tim, for the most part, doesn't share any of these issues. and personally, his initial motivations that stem from his fascination with vigilantism seem much more appealing to me.

as you said: "this kid who is my age is doing cool shit, I want to do cool shit like them, because they're my age and that hits close to home." maybe it's a bit simplified, but tim being just a child who gets himself into something much bigger than himself without really realising the consequences – and essentially both traumatising himself as a result (while also finding family, one does not exclude another) is a pretty fascinating concept.

and like. canon tim is plenty weird about jason, okay. so i think their confrontation at some point would be interesting. and probably awkward.

btw we don't actually get to see jason and tim's first interactions after jay's resurrection. i said it before, but for christ's sake, the teen titans tower incident is no longer canon, and for a good reason, especially that in that era jason is portrayed as having a psychotic break and tim hates his guts and calls him deranged?

how do you derive an enemy to caretaker trope from this is beyond me tbh. it sounds good in theory, right, because it refers to jay's inherent kindness, but you do have to make them "enemies" in the first place, or at least jason the aggressor – which you need to follow the ableist storyline for (i really doubt jason would actually care about tim much if he was more stable, and he definitely wouldn't want to hurt him), and all i can ask is: why. find something new.

i don't know, if there's any actually interesting tim & jason fanfics that don't follow these cliches you should let me know, because the majority of the tag definitely isn't for me.

#answered #okay i will tag it as #anti tim drake #just in case #jason todd #dc comics

[bistephs]

anyways y’all know how much i love under the hood / lost days but even with them it’s very clear how jason’s characterization as the “bad” robin is inseparable from his characterization post-resurrection. like i love red hood jason, i think he’s an incredibly interesting and compelling character, but even the “good” post-crisis red hood stories still depend so much on the reader accepting that jason was the violent, reckless robin, the robin with the “mean streak”, the robin who never deserved to be robin. the idea that jason was the “bad” robin and that that’s what led to him becoming red hood is so entrenched in red hood jason’s characterization (both post-crisis and n52) that it’s honestly hard to imagine what his character would look like without it.

#dc #jason todd #this is... bleh thought dump but also something that really sticks out to me #ok like. for example #one of the things i think lost days did really well w/ this (and i do think lost days did better with robin!jason than utrh) #is showing that jason's grudge against tim comes entirely from the fact that he sees tim as proof that bruce didn't care about him #because not only did bruce not kill joker but he also (seemingly) immediately replaced jason right after his death #jason doesn't give a shit about tim himself he cares that tim represents the final nail in the coffin of his relationship with bruce #and then you have the titans tower incident which is like... the opposite #iirc raven explicitly says at the end that jason was motivated purely by wanting to prove himself better than tim and bruce #which if you accept the 'bad robin' characterization- as opposed to tim & dick as the Good Robins- makes sense #jason was the robin who failed and he wants to prove himself better than the Good Robins and is jealous of them being Good Robins #but alas they are still innately better than him the Bad Robin and he can never measure up to them and that makes him Evil Crazy idk #like. for the record i have no problem with jason straight up hating tim #ESPECIALLY if it was portrayed as like. explicitly misdirected anger towards bruce that jason is projecting onto tim #despite tim having nothing to do with the drama between jason and bruce besides being The Symbol Of Bruce Not Caring About Jason #but as it is it's portrayed as jason being jealous that tim's better than him #which is again a characterization based off of the readers already having accepted that tim IS a better robin than jason was #and it's honestly really frustrating to still have all these character traits that are just entrenched in red hood jason at this point #that come from his 20 yr character assassination following his own violent death #like again. TO BE CLEAR. i am not saying every bad thing jason has ever done is just Bad Characterization #i'm saying that the reasoning behind a whole lot of his characterization (even the parts that i like!) are based on him being The Bad Robin #it's just frustrating! it's frustrating that this is something we're apparently Never Getting Away From #bc without it so much of his character and reasoning just doesn't make sense anymore

[vercnas-blog]

◤°░｡ ✕ HEADCANONS ; FAMILY ! ’ 〉

❛ &. ONE: valentin moon’s wealth can be attributed to many things, but the most prominent are his skills of intimidation and his multi-billion dollar company. violetta moon is the daughter of an oil titan and ex supermodel, inheriting both wealth and beauty. vaughn moon was born exactly four years before verena, and in that short amount of time he solidified his spot in the hierarchy. verena’s father hardly bothered with her during her formative years, valentin already sensing she would bring trouble. verena’s mother treated her like a pawn, and she was violetta’s favorite doll until she started acting up. to say the relationship between the moon family are strained is an understatement — their interactions with each other are nothing but a big game of chess. power and control are two of her parent’s favorite words, and the ways in which they exert the concepts over their children are more than questionable, dangerously teetering between discipline and abuse.           ❛ &. TWO: the moon’s have a famous party every korean new year. a rather extravagant event, verena’s entire family ( on both her mother and father’s sides ) fly in to new york to attend the party. since the moon’s used to live in seoul, now in the states verena’s extended family almost always stay in town for an entire week after. but it is never a joyful event. since both her parents were members of diadem imperium, the whole party often seems like a big competition between a group of people who have been trained to swallow their pride. cousins are pitted against each other as tensions arise about the proper heirs of the moon family business, which verena is not sure she wants a part of, anyway.     ❛ &. THREE: although verena and her brother grew up together and are relatively close in age, she was never close to vaughn. as children they were wildly different — vaughn never asked why and verena always wondered why not. he never had to battle with his ambition, that drive to be the very best never existing inside his heart like it used to in verena’s. when they grew up and vaugn went away to st andrews, their relationship became even more strained. her brother did a 180, going from poster child to problem child in a few short years where verena had to pay for every mistake he made. even now, tales and rumors of vaughn’s notorious legacy while he was in diadem imperium follow verena and people are often shocked by just how different she is from her wild brother.  ❛ &. FOUR: the rivalry between the moon family and the  seoung family is something verena has been aware of for as long as she can remember, although the reasoning behind such a strong distaste was never revealed to her. all she was taught to do was scoff at the mention of the seoung name, roll her eyes at the tales of them or their accomplishments, and never ever become even an acquaintance with anyone related to their family. and so when verena was faced with orion seoung, it was practically embedded into her dna to hate him. the fact that he seemed to be her polar opposite certainly made it easier, in fact, verena often feels her dislike towards the prideful male has little to do with their family rivalries and everything to do with their clashing personalities. she’s curious to know if orion was clued into what happened between their families, but the last thing verena would do is put herself in a position where he can hold power over her, no matter how much she wants the truth.   

◤°░｡ ✕ HEADCANONS ; APPERANCE ! ’ 〉

❛ &. FIVE: it’s no secret verena is generally considered short. at exactly five foot four, most people tend to tower over her. she’s grown to hate it, the unbalance just another thing feeding into her low opinion of herself. one of her biggest pet peeves is when someone brings up her height in and argument to add to the point as if it even correlates. she’s gotten used to good-natured teasing from friends, but verena is still weary whenever the topic is brought up.    ❛ &. SIX: instructed by her mother to never become a woman who values her appearance over her abilities, verena never learned to love or care for makeup. growing up she wasn’t allowed to use anything but blush, and so she never learned the skills needed to perfect a wing until she was much older. even now, free to do as she pleases ( for the most part ), it is rare to see verena with anything but a natural makeup look. part of it is truly her own lack of motivation or interest to learn, but a bigger part of her does it so as not to attract more attention to her outward appearance than she has to.  ❛ &. SEVEN: verena has always preferred to keep her hair long. as a little girl she would cry crocodile tears every time she was taken to get a hair cut, always afraid the hairdresser would take more than just the tips. even though verena often has her hair half up, she always tries to keep a part of it down from time to time just to see how much it has grown. after high school she chopped it to her shoulders once in an act of frustration, and she has been keeping it long ever since.

◤°░｡ ✕ HEADCANONS ; UNIVERSITY ! ’ 〉

❛ &. EIGHT: outside of diadem imperium, it is extremely hard for verena to make friends. closed off and bad at expressing her emotions, most people who come across verena in their lecture falsely perceive her to be rude. she only ever interacts with her classmates for group projects, not seeing the point in exerting the energy when she knows she’s not good at making friends. discussion classes are the only times her classmates get to see her come to life, verena having no shyness when it comes to debating, especially debating those whose confidence borders on cockiness.      ❛ &. NINE: double majoring in political science and finance, verena is doing everything that is expected of her from the moon family. and while she doesn’t find it all terribly boring, and even enjoys some aspects of her fields of study, if verena had been free of outside pressure she would have studied something like art history or classic literature. she has always had an affinity for the arts but no means of expressing it, the mere notion of a hidden passion laughable ( or punishable if her family ever found out ) so she’s kept it to herself.   ❛ &. TEN: as much as verena tries to find it, being a part of diadem imperium makes her feel important. in fact, at times it even makes her feel above others at the university just because of how exclusive it is, but the feeling is forbidden to her so it doesn’t last long. she likes that she can be a part of something much bigger than she is, something that existed before her and will continue to exist after she passes. and although she certainly doesn’t see eye to eye with every member, verena treasures the rules and laws they make as well as the things they do.    

◤°░｡ ✕ HEADCANONS ; TIDBITS ! ’ 〉

❛ &. ELEVEN: verena’s aesthetic includes the smell of parchment, tortoise shell glasses, neutrals, sensible shoes, charcoal smudges, freshly brewed coffee, the sound of a typewriter, crisp autumns, burnt orange, the distant sound of fireworks, the belated awareness when you first wake up, paper wrapped flowers, breezy nights, golden accents, bubble baths, big coats, classic literature, white sheets, lavender, city skylines, trembling hands, satin hair ribbons, monet paintings and old hollywood. ❛ &. TWELVE: verena is tragically allergic to pineapple, and only found out when someone informed her it isn’t normal for her tongue to go numb while eating it. when she is drunk and sipping on her preferred fruity cocktails, you have to physically stop verena from ordering something with pineapple and eating it anyway.  ❛ &. THRITEEN: struggling with irregular insomnia, it isn’t rare to find verena in a period of sleeplessness, especially if she’s particularly stressed. to keep people from worrying verena often keeps herself busy with cleaning or working, friends often commentating how productive she is instead of noticing how she hasn’t been sleeping. the only way to truly tell she has entered one of these periods of restlessness is when you catch her snoozing in the common room in the middle of the day.  ❛ &. FOURTEEN: verena has never broken a bone, although she has sprained her wrist twisting away from her mother’s grasp when she was young. after that incident they were careful not to grasp her so violently in public. verena is often skeptical whenever someone tries to rope her into a reckless feat, the fear of breaking a bone someday very real.  ❛ &. FIFTEEN: as a child verena wasn’t allowed to have any pets, and so to compensate the moon’s let her keep plants. now she is especially skilled at keeping houseplants alive, wherever she is living always full of them. succulents are her new obsession, and she tends to stop and buy one whenever she is out and spots someone selling.  ❛ &. SIXTEEN: verena absolutely loves baths. she prefers to take a shower before taking a bath for cleanliness purposes, but if given the option the girl will always choose baths. she has an assortment of products from bath bombs to bath salts and bubbles and she makes it a point to use one at least once a week. she lights candles when she bathes purely for the ambiance, although she finds candle light is surprisingly nice for some relaxing reading. ❛ &. SEVENTEEN: people are often shocked when profanity slips past verena’s tongue, so used to her usually mild mannered demeanor. but it is certainly not an uncommon occurrence, her preferred curse word being fuck just because of how versatile it is. often times when she is especially frustrated, verena will whisper a foreign stream of curses under her breath, usually directed at herself and not anyone else ( with the exception of orion ). 

#░▓╳┊: HER MIND'S LIKE A DIAMOND ── IN DEPTH ! ┘