#create compelling characters

[acearohippo]

MDZS: gives us a perfectly happy, wonderfully written WangXian that hits all the Good™ Romance™ tropes while keeping the development grounded and genuine.

Me: *crying, instead, over Jiang Cheng/Nie Huaisang and Nie Mingjue/Meng Yao (Jin Guangyao)/Lan Xichen, clutching them tightly to bosom over the (also fantastically written) tragedy of their past traumas ripping them apart and leaving them scarred and alone and bitter without any supports to lean on*

#mxtx deserves all the awards for creating such fleshed out and compelling side characters and antagonists and deuteragonists #the biggest tragedy of mdzs is watching the slow trainwreck of these outside characters be destroyed #as main couple wangxian get the redemption and happy ending they absolutely deserve #i don't know how I'm going to survive the other two series tgcf and svsss #jiang cheng #nie huaiseng #lan xichen #nie mingjue #meng yao #jin guangyao #wei wuxian #lan wangji #mdzs #sangcheng #chengsang #3zun #nielan #xiyao #nieyao

[nav-ix]

breaking news: recently-dead saddest girl in the world is daughter of long-dead angriest woman in the universe

#actually though i feel like that's part of what's so compelling about wake #step 1: establish that only a really REALLY vengeful angry hateful soul could stick around so long as a revenant #step 2: create a character who's internal engine is fueled by such an ever burning furnace of white-hot hate #so much so that it manifests on the reader's end as so so obvious that this is maybe the angriest woman who ever lived. #step 3: ??? (aka put her in a hate-fueled polycule so toxic that stone cold fox pyrrha dve still winces longingly about it 20yrs later) #step 4: profit (lesbians are obsessed) #like yeah. ok. i guess that's what you could call a relatable character #tlt #the locked tomb #gtn #gideon the ninth #htn #harrow the ninth #ntn #nona the ninth

[gremlin-pattie]

consider: genderbent sunny ‘mac and dennis move to the suburbs’

i think it would be fun to switch their roles from what they were in the original episode. denise goes insane being stuck inside the house while mac gets increasingly exhausted/on edge from work. imagine indignant housewife denise… ouagh. she would be absolutely feral. mac would be lucky to make it out alive. and think about them sleeping next to each other in the big bed at the end of the episode…

edit: @aanalytic wrote an amazing fic based on this concept! you can read it here

#idk who exactly created this au but i am obsessed with it #it’s so compelling #in the same way as the original show but also different #because characters and dynamics change based on gender expectations etc #it’s so fun discussing this and seeing art of it #iasip #mac and dennis move to the suburbs #genderbent sunny #macdennis #dennis reynolds #mac mcdonald #it’s always sunny in philadelphia #iasip genderbent au

[fubuwu]

Fuck it. I'm gonna bite the bait just to say that there were many instances where jc clearly trated wwx like a brother/friend in the BOOK, aka the canon text in case anyone was confused or have seemed to have selectively forgotten about.

From the part where jc scoffs at the prospect of wwx getting together with a servant. Laughing and proclaiming that he was treated better than he was (in reference to his own sister peeling his lotus seeds for him which she didn't do for jc).

Then there was him standing up for him on NUMEROUS occasions throughout the book. Such as before the LP Massacre. He could have let his mother beat wwx senseless, but he tried to stop her from doing so, begging and crying even for her to stop and take the punishment for him. Despite the risk it took to do so.

Not to mention the excuses he made to the rest of the cw after the war when he stood up for wwx and shrugged off his casual and overly familiar demeanour.

Then ofc there was the sacrifice he made for wwx (which he didn't have to do as the only male sect heir) whilst they were on the run from the Wens that ultimately led up to the events in the novel..

The Cloud Recesses era.. the part after jfm gave away his dogs and jc steadily welcomed wwx in his life, willing to scare away any dogs that threatened him..

These are all things a nasty, homophobic rich man would NEVER do for his servant if he only saw them as such.

If he was classist as you all seem to think he is, then he would never dream of doing all the above CANON EVENTS for wwx's sake. Js.

These were all in the book. To ignore them, that means you are ignoring mxtx's work and you clearly did not understand the complicated relationship wwx and jc had.

Because it was made clear throughout the text that jc never saw him as a servant. They shared a room, went to school together and made HUGE sacrifices for eachother. So much so, that their relationship pissed of jc's mother.

If you ignore that then you are ignoring a VERY IMPORTANT part of the text. And I have to wonder if y'all only came into the fandom for the mlm relationship between wwx and lwj and not the the story. Clearly, y'all are selectively ignoring some very IMPORTANT facts. Js. This book is MORE than just a bl........

And if that's the case, then you have no place arguing jc canon facts. Js.

#canon jiang cheng #jiang cheng #mxtx mdzs #mo dao zu shi #This tired argument..... #Why do antis willfully ignore the most important part of the text???? #The part that leads up to the canon events?? #And inevitably the story???? #Are they threatened because lwj isn't a main part of it??? #It's not our fault or problem that lwj hardly had as big of an influence to the main plot as jc did #Shrugs #Fyi I'm not ignoring the mlm aspect of the book #This was some groundbreaking work for the gay community with compelling characters that broke these stereotypes #But by boiling down the book to just the mlm aspect and focusing only on the mlm relationship is doing this work a disservice #Especially when there is so much more to this book than just romance #I feel like people only focus on that aspect of the book #And that's a bit boring imo. It is perfectly okay for you explore to other aspects of the book. It won't make you hate wngxian any less. #You can appreciate the interesting mlm relationship mxtx created whilst enjoying the non romantic aspect of the story #The other characters included #It is not that hard #Js.

[skunkes]

My issue is I do have feelings i want to make into art but I'm stupid and dont know how to filter them into beautiful visual symbolism and meaning also if I could do this u better believe I'd be making crazy fanart of thistle dungeon meshi

#talkys #i wish i cld do fanart but i cant do funny fandom sequential art or beautiful illustration with substance #this post wasn't made abt thistle they were an afterthought #my main thing is i usually have 0 ideas for art and when i do have emotions/experiences to draw from ideo where to start #to create something Meaningful #idk symbols idk composition #-> if i knew this it wld also be easier and more compelling to make art for media i enjoy #anyway ill always be repeating my mantra about not having an artist's brain. or creativity. sucks #i got stuck with the wrong art niche now im cursed to be a commission and Draw Character Standing There artist forever #i keep wanting SO BADLYYYYY to make a full art piece about [something specific that has been bubbling in my mind] but i cant #im not creative. i dont even know where to start. i dont even know how to compare it to something else. im stupid.

[irenespring]

Possible House MD AU Project Plan

Someone stop me from making my next project a House MD/School for Good and Evil AU. I think SGE is such a fascinating world (and so much darker than I think people realize, especially people who are only familiar with the movie, there are two genocides in the first three books). I've been obsessed with it since before the third book was published and it is so much fun to adapt characters into. The possible project would be Hilson based, and involve some teacher characters from the actual SGE books.

I did this project with SVU a couple years ago and it was SO MUCH FUN. And all my readers were like "okay I have no idea what SGE is but I trust you" and ended up like "I care about this so much what the fuck is going on at the murder school how will the characters escape." I think the same reason it worked for SVU could make it work for House, though obviously it will be different because the characters are different and have different reactions to things. The issue is I only attempted such a crazy AU after like fifty works published in SVU, compared to what will be seven for House.

So bear with me, here are three possible options:

Everyone (Cuddy, Wilson, House, most side characters) are already in Good, but from vastly different backgrounds. This worked for the SVU AU because I think Good is the more interesting and more horrifying school (at least in Evil you're allowed to be gay). Wilson would be the character from "Woods Beyond" or outside the traditional fairytale realm, from a small village, Gavaldon. House is from an upper-class backgrounds within the fairytale realm. House already knew about the evils of Good, and really doesn't want to be there, because it's what his father trained him for. Wilson realizes he's gay and therefore doomed unless he and House (with help from Cuddy) can escape.

House is sorted into Evil, Wilson is sorted into Good. Mainly focuses on how unjust the sorting system can be, since in the books illustrated that a lot of Evil students were abused as children, which spurred on their behavior. Focuses on whether or not someone can be different from what is assumed (Wilson hates the restrictions and fear in Good, House doesn't want to be Evil).

SGE traditional AU: Wilson is sorted into Evil, House is sorted into Good. They are both from Gavaldon, where they were codependent friends (Wilson was the golden boy, House was the outcast). Everyone is shocked, especially them. But like what happens in the books, they both learn that yeah...maybe there is some truth to the sorting. Wilson does like not having to pretend to be perfect and conform to societal rules, and also having an outlet for his inner mean-streak. House likes not being immediately treated as a monster and learning healing potions. They plan to wait out the school and live together with magic in the woods. Except that House hates Good's rules too, and Wilson discovers about 75% of Evil's students die. Things reach a boiling point when House and Wilson are discovered, and House refuses to apologize. Then they must find a way to escape before they are summarily destroyed.

#house md #hatecrimes md #fanfiction #alternate universe #fanfic writing #gregory house #james wilson #hilson #school for good and evil #I just remembered SGE exists and feel compelled to write about it #It's such an interesting fantasy dystopia and it is clear the author created it that way on accident #There is so much creepy horror-adjacent writing to be done #It would but the characters in so many Situations #However the premise is so bizarre I would need to bet on having enough readers trust me from past work that it wouldn't suck #Or readers who are just morbidly interested in whatever crazy nonsense is going on over there #I PROMISE IT WOULD BE COHERENT AND FUN

[mirrorofliterature]

anyway enough about booker. and nicky and joe I adore you but let's talk about nile and andy (quynh snuck in too I can't help it).

- nile is such a well-crafted character and kiki layne is an amazing actress. she is just a really competent, compassionate and brave woman. I adore reading fanfic from her perspective because she's got such a cool perspective on life.

- andromache the scythian: so pretty. has gone through so much but is still so strong.

they're likeable, complex and interesting characters that are highly competent, I love fic about them, what's not to love?

personally, my favourite character is quynh because I'm an angst fiend and her long journey of recovery she would need to undergo after coming from the Iron Maiden just gets me... but I am also a big fan of:

- Nile centric fics. I don't ship Book of Nile so that does slim it down a little, but I adore post-canon fics exploring her settling into her mortality. One of my favourites is actually a canon divergence focusing on Nile and her brother: pure genius.

- Andromaquynh reunion fics

- Andy and Quynh meeting Nicky and Joe.

- Queer Quartet shenanigans

#of course statistically a lot of the fic I read is kaysanova because that's just what's out there #however whenever there is a new quynh or nile fic that catches my interest? that's always a joyful occasion #the old guard #andromache the scythian #nile freeman #quynh #I think the movie does a really good job of exploring and developing their characters so there's not much that I feel compelled to create #however post-canon or pre-canon fics of them #particularly character studies? yes #andromaquynh

[zincbot]

i kind of love barry. autistic king

#scavengers reign #scavengers reign spoilers #(in the tags) #okay so sam didn't die but the following events were Much more interesting #the parasite creating compulsions? so cool #i would have loved to see an example done with a local fauna #but i can imagine it works similarly. compelled to build a nest etc etc #also terrence's death was so brutal but i Loved the visuals and sound for the quick snapping and twisting of the plant #carnivorous plant!! yayy!!! #very cool death #but yeah barry. i enjoy him #azi's my favourite surviving 'main' character at this time and i like seeing her and barry interact. #azi's like. trying to be softer especially contrasted with kris who is kind of similar to her. in a way that makes her want to be #Less like that and lean into her softer side. very good #azi's humming is also my favourite thing ever soured as it is by levi's death (right after they learned to sing)

[bahoreal]

like as much as i love a really really good piece of media that's beautifully done and everything aligns exactly how i want it to, honestly flawed or just-not-quite fulfilling media fills me with this ravenous sort of love for what could have been that makes me create until i literally run out of inspiration like.... theres something about Just missing the mark that completely converts me to loving a piece of media. idk what this says about me.

#like i love good omens but it was perfect. theres nothing to fix #i love wangxian but they get their happy ending #xiyao and songxiao died tragically and that fills me with passion for them!!! #shiwang are split by hundreds of years and still love each other and that makes me want to SCREAM i LOVE IT #anyway i watch things with canon together queer characters and im just like cool love thst for them! but it doesnt make me want to #create endless fic and art because it all went Well you know. #i love things that are a bit broken ♥️ they're just so compelling #if ted lasso was good i never would have written 100k+ for it x

[dakeus-art]

Cairana, a paladin NPC for my campaign

#I don't draw all my npcs for obvious reasons but yknow #buff women #I created her and I was compelled to draw her #my dnd campaign #dnd #dungeons and dragons #character design #dnd npc #digital art #art #my art

[team7-headquarter]

I'm kinda curious about the period of time when Minato was Hokage, because there's so much you could say about Konoha depending on it. It could be that I don't remember what the manga says about it too, but anyway.

We know that before Minato was Hokage, the discrimination towards jinchuurikis was high. We know it from Kushina's story. After Minato, the jinchuurikis discrimination was not exactly as bad as it could have been (and the bar is soooo low) in physical terms, but the level of sheer isolation was ridiculous. Sure, Kushina had guards and she lived in a tower with a perimeter drawn around it, one that she couldn't surpass. The difference is that Kushina knew why she was being isolated, there was someone willing to teach her about it right from the start, a family member even if distant, someone with the same experience.

All Naruto knew is that he was unwanted. He had no family, no one was willing to guide him. No, not even Iruka. I'm talking about before in the manga, before Iruka realized how much Naruto needed him and did something about it.

If that was before and after, how was it during the time Minato was Hokage?

Did Minato push for Kushina to become Hokage? Was the idea rejected? Did he get angry? It was her dream after all. Or did they realize it would be impossible so they pushed Minato to go for it? Were they sad about the idea of Kushina having to live her dream through Minato, because they wouldn't let her go for it? When did Kushina give up and change her goal in life?

Did Minato tell anyone about his plan on how to get rid of the jinchuuriki discrimination? Did he talk about it with Kushina? We know that they planned Naruto's birth and tried to make it as safe as possible. When the time to seal Kurama within Naruto came, they both knew how Konoha would treat Naruto. Minato wanted Naruto to be viewed as the son of a hero, but his wishes were thrown aside as soon as his body was cold enough.

With no law to protect the jinchuuriki of the kyubi, I wonder how bold the people of Konoha were in their discrimination against Kushina while Minato was Hokage. Times were different, Minato was highly respected and feared, but how many times did he have to tell someone to mind their words? How many times did he catch Kushina avoiding a certain restaurant or a street? Did he ever feel a slight of resentment against his home for the way they treated his wife? His pregnant wife?

Were there rumors of the child being a monster for being the son of a jinchuuriki? It could be that some Konoha parents telling their kids to not play with the little Uzumaki/Namikaze was a thing before Naruto was even born?

From what I've seen, Konoha has no gentleness for kids of prestigious lineages. Being a child of a powerful shinobi makes your life worse, in fact. A million times over: it happened to Sasuke, to Neji, it happened to Kakashi in the generation before them, it happened to Itachi in the in-between.

I don't think that being the son of the hokage would have saved Naruto for being mistreated by the village. Not when his mother was a jinchuuriki.

It just makes me wonder, you know?

In the time he had, how did Minato try to change things to protect his family?

Was it a matter of needing more time? Or there wasn't a plan at all?

#I've realized this reads as if I'm harshly criticizing Minato #as always the problem is not within the character but the plot holes in the story itself #Kishimoto clearly presents Minato as a man who loves his family but not always does the best for them #he struggles balancing his duty to konoha and his role as a father and a husband #it is a fact that he failed to protect Naruto #but the lack on information about his time as a hokage makes it seems like he waa failing his family before Naruto was even born #it contradicts what we saw of him in the newest Naruto one-shot #he created the rasengan to protect Kushina and help her be free and safe #he reacued her when she was kidnapped #he stood up for her #they seemed to love each other deeply and Kushina had the temper to chase after him if she thought he was avoiding her for example #sealing kurama within naruto was really bad but in the end he had little time and there were on a big crisis #I wonder what type of pressure was put on him while he was Hokage #even when he was really smart and dangerous and whatever he still was young #he failed his genin team too #I'm sorry but all those pieces are not in Minato's favor #which makes him a great character for being complex and compelling #but anyway #maybe I am criticizing Minato but not in bad faith okay? #minato namikaze #kushina uzumaki #naruto uzumaki #naruto #naruto shippuden #naruto classic

[colorisbyshe]

The “I am writing a lady gay version of the Odyssey but also I haven’t read the Odyssey” book is really the perfect encapsulation of everything wrong with society’s modern obsession with retelling, rebooting, sidequeling, sequeling, prequeling, and reimagining beloved stories while (sometimes, not always) sprinkling in diversity (or in most cases “diversity’ where maybe minorities are on the screen or page but aren’t really having their unique experiences represented).

There is zero effort to understand what made the original good, they just come in with the bluster of “The name and concept is recognizable enough, so I can just capitalize on that and make it my own.” Not realizing that to make it your own, you need to realize... who owned it first? What made it special in the first place?

And if you are reimagining it for the sake of reclaiming the story for gay girls or people of color or a trans kid or WHOMEVER, do you understand how the text originally treated them? Because reclamation requires understanding that. You can’t take back the power if you do not understand what the power is. You cannot wield a weapon you do not know--not proficiently.

This lackadaisical attitude shows disrespect both to the original text AND to the people you’re supposedly reclaiming it for, flaunting a disrespect for what they can respectively contribute to the new, remixed story, demonstrating you see both the IP and the {insert marginalized group} as just tags you can slap on to advertise your story, now as fully fleshed out entities.

And often this lack of respect and curiosity for the depths of what this new idea can offer ends up being either entirely flat, offensive because you didn’t think through all the implications of what you’ve done (like putting marginalized people in positions of power, especially those with real histories of horrific acts), or just... nothing like the thing you’re mimicking. So it makes it clear that you could’ve just... written about gay girls in the Bronze Era WITHOUT invoking the fucking Odyssey.

This is a fucking epidemic, btw. Like... from Star Wars to Jurassic Park to less beloved/classic things like Bridgerton which raceswapped and then thought it was progressive to have a black man be raped by a white woman and like... kept that as one of their main romantic couples?

The two fold problem of “Why do you need your story to be based on THIS property or THIS Period if you know nothing about it?” and “Why do you need THIS character to suddenly represent THIS Marginalized group in THIS context” is something modern storytellers just... can’t seem to grapple with??

And it’s just like.... write something original. Make sure you have something to actually say. Why can’t you just do that?

#are you just using marginalized characters for brownie points #so people are less liekly to notice your mediocrity #or are you actually creating compelling stories

[amethysttribble]

I think a solid marker of identifying a truly complex, compelling, and unique character is seeing the frequency and scale of how OOC they are written in fanfic

#Example 1: Luffy #Example 2: Feanor #Example 3: Venti #(which is was inspired this post) #I’m guilty of it- why do you think I avoid writing Feanor and luffy like the plague? #fanfiction en masse just cannot abide truly unique character and that’s fine #as a genre rather and again- that’s fine this is doll playing most of the time BUT #like… if a character has more than two layers of stuff going on it is almost entirely lost en masse #if they can’t fit a ‘fanfic comedia d’artte’ role because the original author truly wrote someone unique? it’s already fucking over #and this is not to say that less unique complex or layered characters aren’t compelling #they are very obviously #but when an author truly creates a character who is just THEMSELVES and fits no role… #what to say but I want to do that one day #it is rare and very hard to replicate #also Venti is not nearly as much that as Luffy and Feanor askfkfks #those two are… literary marvels tbh #venti is on the same level as say Gintoki #still means they’re massively ooc in most fics lol #Tribble post

[the-darklings]

Hello, I love your fics and I've noticed that a lot of your stories despite being reader fics are very character driven. Not just for the og characters but for the OC themselves.

It's done so well that I wanted to ask if you have any steps for writing such enticing character driven stories or does it just come naturally?

It comes naturally, and stems from the fact that, at my core, I'm an absolute character-driven story writer and reader.

I can put up with okay writing and a mediocre plot, but you have to have good characters for me. It's a deal breaker. I always joke that my favourite thing to do when I write is simply have two characters sit and talk - that's it. If the characters are interesting and compelling, it doesn't matter if they're not doing anything "exciting" it will still be engaging to read about.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that plot, prose, and world-building are not just as important - they are! - but for me, characters are key. And that's because, for me, at least, stories are for people by people. Therefore, characters will always be the thing people remember. Think about your favourite stories for a moment - no matter what the medium is - what comes to mind first? I would bet 9/10 times it's the characters. If I say Star Wars, chances are that even if you've never seen a scrap of those films/shows etc, you still know Darth Vader. You know Luke Skywalker. You know Batman. You know the Joker. That's because we identify with people, aka the characters. They're the reason we love storytelling. The best stories in the world are so popular because they have characters that outlive or/and outshine their own canon.

I guess for that reason, it's always funny to me when I see people get snobby about people's OCs, especially canon/OC ships. And even more so, x reader fics. As if they're somehow "lesser". But take a second to remember something important: every single character you love is someone else's OC that's been given a wider audience. That's all.

#basically to anyone fearing they're being cringe or their original voice doesn't matter: don't listen. #it absolutely does. #i just love people!!! and i love characters!!! i especially love really grey and morally corrupt characters!!! #i love it when characters are messy and irrational #when they frustrate me and compel me #i like it when there's friction and overlap with people #i love it when characters make me question myself. #and i know a lot of people aren't like that #they care for plot/writing more etc. #but for me every character is a piece that can/should be utalised #think about why side characters are often so popular #it's because we want to know more. because we - as readers/viewers - project ourselves onto them #that's also why books tend to be better than movies usually. because it takes a rare talent to translate intimate thoughts onto screen #visual mediums are limiting!!! as someone who works with visual storytelling let me tell you: #prose is a gift because you can create such a bond and connection with readers. with prose you get to burrow into character's brain #with prose you are letting readers in on characters' most intimate feelings/hopes/fears/frustrations aka things WE feel and relate to #asks

[saturnsorbits]

Watching the newer episodes of MHA is just making me dislike Deku more…

If I was Bakugo I’d be fucking fuming he got OFA, too.

#saturnsays #His character progression is fucking awful; man. #He’s ‘smart’ but lacks critical thinking skills. #Barely shows any emotion that isn’t crying; feeling sorry for himself or randomly extreamly mad - which often comes too late. #He doesn’t learn anything… And all his self worth is now tied totally to the fact he has a quirk. #I’m sorry; but being ‘Nice™️’ just isn’t enough to make him even remotely compelling. #He hasn’t even got that charming edge that they usually give other ‘Golden Boy’ MC’s. #Where is his arc? What has he endured? How has he changed? What are his wants and needs? #Why do we care about him and his story? #All I’m saying is if I would have handed Deku in as a character study for my degree - I would have failed it. #(The fandom has created a better nuanced version of Sero - A literal background character - than the canon has for its main damn character.) #Anyway… It’s 9am and I chose violence this morning.

[myrmica]

my reading of lifesteal season 4 is so personal and involved at this point that even if i was going to post more character analysis i would not know where to start. it would require footnotes to documents that don't exist. listen to luddites and lambs by everything everything and you'll get half of it though

#m #lifesteal #there is just such a compelling and clear thematic line between like. okay #first you need to just accept for me the idea that zam as a character is defined by being trapped running both towards and away from #the same object (mapicc) #and then you have to take mapicc as interchangeable with pain in general but specifically an inescapable normalcy of pain #which is caught up in something zam wants and knows he wants which is the “pure/natural” idyllic version of lifesteal #where every fight is fair competition #and what mapicc has done to hurt him more than the actual stalking and murder and all of that is that mapicc refused to fight him on even #ground (by literally invading and destroying his home so that everything becomes battlefield) in a way that offends his most deeply #held values. AND THEN he reads vitalasy's use of the exploits as trying to take that same thing he fundamentally values about lifesteal #away and he gets incredibly angry with vitalasy for hurting the server itself (pvp becomes functionally obsolete for a while there) #so he plays out the eclipse betrayal framing it in his own mind as another situation where he is the victim and vitalasy is the #manipulator/aggressor and falls back into the kind of jumpy paranoid behavior we as the viewer haven't actually seen from him in a very #long time now (late into eclipse when mapicc isn't an active threat anymore he really does stop jumping at shadows the way he used to) #and seems comforted by the familiarity of it if anything. because what vitalasy was asking of him that made him panic and reject it so #badly was to create a new pattern and step out onto unknown ground but he can't do it #and he retreats back to what he knows. so vitalasy isn't WRONG to read what zam does as victimizing himself #and forcing vitalasy into a villain role that is literally what he is doing #but vitalasy on the other end still has his own entire set of things he is not dealing with #and so the relationship created by these two people is doomed by their inability to look themselves in the eye more than any of the actual #facts of the relationship itself #and the thing zam wants lifesteal to be is not and has never been real. the thing vitalasy wants lifesteal to be is also antithetical to #its nature they are both wrong #but zam is wrong in that he wants to return to an idealized imagined past that does not actually exist #(see also vague historical allusions in his castle and his name and him trying after vi's death to cast off violence completely and return #to the land somehow. and the association created incidentally between stone tools and rudimentary technology) #and vitalasy is wrong in that he's trying to create something entirely new that nobody but him actually wants via the exploit #(see the way that once the exploit is 'out of the box' it can't be put back in and the course of the season is set in motion and any attemp #s to fight it and change that course are futile as allegorical to sudden technological advancement being met with violent opposition)