#develop his dynamic with Izzy

[knightartorius]

i really want eds literacy to be a point of contention in his character arc.. i dont know why exactly (other than the fringe idea i have that ed has an interalized trauma related to his class and upbringing) but i want there to be some conflict thats internalized, but shines through because of some physical conflict

and i really dont want stede to be the one who teaches him how to read and write…yes that only leaves one other character who can, yes ed attempted to kill him in cold blood, oh well, i dont care, i want lucius to teach ed how to read!

or maybe because im just writing off the cuff, someone couldve saved lucius, and the entire crew is complicit in keeping him hidden from ed. frankly i think izzy understands how valuable having someone whos literate is—brother got his toe cut off and was like “should i summon the boy to take notes” (which is a strange ask of him, like why would ed want lucius taking notes? thats not something he did before, and thats also something stede did so it feels like izzy would despise having him there taking notes)—and wouldnt immediately rat or kill him off. maybe in an attempt to be more useful, izzy learns how to read and write himself

that being said if stede does teach ed to read, ill be just as happy and frankly no matter what happens ill be satisfied with the story because i like the characters so much

#kstposts #i wanna see ed so bad..we got a teaser but i need to see how he really acts and watch his persona fall when hes not in front of others #mmdnfhchdn #also yea this is an attempt to get some lucius izzy development #sorry but i love their dynamic and they should kiss

[sixstepsaway]

I don't get why people want to pretend Ed wasn't abusive. Why do people insist on making everything into binaries? Yes, Ed has been a victim of abuse. Yes, he has been abusive. Both things can be true. I love him because I think he's in interesting and I understand where his pain is coming from (even if I think S2 was a missed opportunity in terms of character development). But anyway, thank you for writing about this because maybe some folks genuinely don't recognize abusive trends.

I think it has a lot to do with the fandom culture of only being allowed to like "wholesome" ships.

Look at it this way: when season 1 was airing, Ed and Stede were, in fact, very wholesome. Sure, they had some moments of lesser wholesomeness, but overall they were pretty wholesome and sweet and gentle. They were sweet and finding love in middle age and it was adorable. They had a general stamp of fandom approval that they were, in fact, Wholesome And Good To Ship™.

If you look at other fandoms, you'll see a lot of times there's the Good And Acceptable Ship and then there's the Bad Ship (or ships) and the Bad Ship is always slapped with the "oh that's actually incest!" label when they've, idk, grown up together, or "oh it's abusive!" because one of them one time made a bad joke or something, or "power dynamics!" because one is 27 and one is 25 or one is short and the other is tall or whatever, and yeah sometimes the Bad Ship is actually toxic or whatever (which is not a reason to not ship and enjoy it!), but they're put in neat little boxes: Good and Bad.

And for a lot of people, those boxes keep them safe. Last year, someone who was an Izzy Hands fan got doxxed because...? They liked Izzy Hands and shipped him with... I don't know actually. Ed? Stede? It doesn't matter, all I know is they got doxxed.

The side of fandom that thinks you should only ship the Good Ship are toxic and downright dangerous. It's happened again and again in numerous fandoms and just keeps happening.

So when at the end of s1, Ed turned around and cut Izzy's toe off and fed it to him, I think a lot of people panicked because shit, now Ed was Bad too, and if he's Bad then you can't like him or relate to him or ship him with the Good guy of Stede, so what the fuck do you do?

Obvious answer: Blame Izzy. Izzy's already classed as Bad, so put all the responsibility on Izzy for Ed's darkness and then it's safe to ship Ed and Stede again and no one can call you an abuse apologist or whatever for liking them together.

(To be clear: Shipping says nothing about your real morality. This is very clear for many reasons, one of which is... spend thirty seconds watching fans of the Wholesome Ships dox people and abuse people online lol)

So they spent all this time saying Ed was just scared and lashing out, and now s2 has come along and Ed is... well, abusive, canonically.

And for most of us, that doesn't really matter. We can still enjoy Ed and Stede or Ed and Izzy, we can throw ourselves into fanworks and enjoy the show for the things we like, and we can critique the things we have issues with (my problem is not Ed being written as dark and twisty and having a villain arc, my problem is the show writing it badly, exploring it badly, and then handwaving it, because it's shitty writing) and still really enjoy the vibes we got from the show.

But for people who are scared because they spent all this time saying Izzy fans should kill themselves for liking an abuser, well... now they have a choice: either admit Ed is an abuser and admit that liking a character doesn't dictate your irl morality, nor does it say anything about you aside from what you enjoy in fiction, or excuse away his actions, insist he's just a lil meow meow and continue feeling safe in their little bubble.

In a lot of ways I can't blame people for wanting to duck and cover from it. I mean, look at the shit people get for liking characters who aren't perfect, or talking about the imperfections of characters, or just enjoying complex narratives!

But what genuinely concerns me isn't anything to do with the fiction really, it's when people look at Ed's behavior in 2x01 and 2x02 and go, "Nah he's fine," because oh, honey, no, you are making yourself so vulnerable to real life abuse. That is what worries me, which is why I answered that one ask saying Ed wasn't abusive, it felt important to point out why he is.

Anyway, that's what I think is happening here. I think people are just scared that if they admit their fave has multitudes and isn't a perfect character who never does any wrong, they'll get doxxed and abused and harassed online.

I get that.

#anonymous #ask

[ladyluscinia]

2x08 Reaction #7

Ok, last episode thing in this series I've finally circled around to being pissed about is framing Izzy as a mentor to Edward.

Because what the fuck.

When they had Stede do the whole "taught him everything he knows" bit in 2x05 I thought it was pure flattery, to the point I thought it was wild that Izzy even gave a little shrug like he might believe it. I thought we had established pretty clearly in S1 that Edward was the creative thinker and leader in their dynamic.

Izzy was useful - probably even essential - but he was the support. The tool. Good at the execution.

And he certainly seemed to know this. In 1x04 where they establish their pre-Stede dynamic, Izzy expects Edward to come up with a brilliant plan and tell him what to do. He only doubts him enough to try and take charge at the last possible second, seems mostly aware his own idea is "get shot fighting back instead of sitting and dying", and feels genuine regret for both having to shoot down Edward's first plan and insulting him at all once he saves them in the end.

Because Edward is brilliant. He's earned his place as the leader between them. As Blackbeard.

Which makes it absolutely infuriating that in pivoting him into a "wise mentor" role they have Ricky say to Izzy's face that he was the brains behind Blackbeard and Izzy doesn't even refute it??? Paired with killing him off as the mentor (supposedly), and paralleling him to Auntie as they really double down on the "mentor who has authority over strategy and is proud of you" thing, and the displays of respect in 2x07... it kinda feels like the show is saying Edward learned most or all of his shit from Izzy.

And, like... if they just meant swordfighting and getting an approving nod when he pulled off a complicated disarm that would be one thing, but they kept focusing on things like "brains of the operation" and "how to lead the crew as a Captain" lessons.

And Edward is so much less interesting if Izzy actually taught him how to be Blackbeard, or if he was doing things as Blackbeard for Izzy's approval.

Like I guess I'm glad they didn't flesh it out enough to make the implications fully textual so you can fudge them away from that direction, but they don't really tell you not to read it that way. The man is even giving emotional development advice for fuck's sake. The mentor thing is jarring enough because the authority and respect dynamic really never flowed in Izzy's direction, but it's also putting Izzy in a position where I feel like they are implying he made Edward the man he was for better and worse, and... no. Don't do that.

Stop giving Edward's anxiety-ridden henchman credit for his atrocities - he worked hard on those.

(Plus we literally already know the first authoritative figure in piracy he got round two of Daddy Issues and his fucked up ideas about piracy from. How many symbolic fathers pushing him in dark directions does one man need to kill / be visited by in purgatory / watch die before he can start addressing those???)

#our flag means death #ofmd s2 #ofmd s2 spoilers #ofmd 2x08 #izzy hands ofmd #blackbeard ofmd #ofmd critical #ladyluscinia

[bougiebutchbinch]

God, Ouizzy is just so fucking DELICIOUS.

Frenchie is the captain, Izzy his loyal second. The two of them, over the year that follows S2, develop a far, far healthier relationship than Ed and Izzy ever managed.

Frenchie isn't the Best Captain Ever - he's still soft about the gills, and though he's... intimately familiar with the horrors of the world, with a past he likes to keep locked up in that box in his mind where all the Bad Things go, he never particularly wanted to be a pirate. He cares more about his crew than obtaining massive wealth or leaving a fearsome legacy.

Izzy is so fucking okay with that, after everything.

Sure, Frenchie is a soft touch (in comparison to Ed 'kill all pets' Teach in the pre-Bonnet era). But he also respects Izzy's opinion and is learning that sometimes, it is important to enforce orders when you live aboard a vessel whose upkeep is all that stands between you and a watery grave. He uses Izzy as an enforcer and Bad Cop when necessary (as Izzy very much likes to be used), and is intelligent enough to figure out that Izzy is a major fucking asset so long as you don't make him be literally the only one aboard doing everyone else's job, or constantly make him fear for his crew's life.

As for how he feels about him... Well, Frenchie's still shaky on that.

Like. There was that time in the Kraken era, when Izzy was feverish and dying of leg-rot and smelled really fucking gross. One day Frenchie came down to bring him water and Izzy was... crying.

He tried to cover it up, putting on his usual tough act, telling Frenchie to fuck off. But after everything he did for the crew, Frenchie couldn't not comfort him. So he crawled onto the bed behind him and just... hugged him. For ages. Until Izzy's stiff body slowly melted into pliancy, conforming to the curve of Frenchie's arms.

They lay like that half the night, one of them sweating and rotting from the inside, the other spooned up behind him like he could suck the fever-heat out of his broken, shaky little body.

Izzy was out of it, by the end of the night. Totally out of it. Frenchie can't think why else he'd rolled in his embrace and given him a sleepy, sour kiss, that felt far too much like a goodbye.

Only... Izzy lived. He's Frenchie's trusted subordinate now, the two of them running their own ship, hunting down Ricky as part of Zheng's new fleet. And that kiss stretches between them, every hour of every day, an invisible, unspoken thread.

it meant nothing. Frenchie's sure it meant nothing. Izzy was dying! Practically hallucinating! Hell, it was probably intended for Ed.

But Frenchie can't stop thinking about it. Izzy doesn't particularly like physical contact, but Frenchie is THE person on the crew who he's most comfortable with, tactilely speaking. He lets Frenchie grab his hand or sling an arm around his shoulders or rest his head on his lap whenever he wants. And he's kinda cute in a grumpy old-man sorta way. And Frenchie maybe wants to kiss him again -

But he fucking knows Izzy's still reeling from everything that happened with The Kraken, even if, like Frenchie, Izzy refuses to confront half of it. He's uncomfortably aware of their power dynamic, and Izzy's rather disturbing (i.e., kinky but entirely unexplored) relationship with authority. The last thing he wants is to push in where he's not wanted - or, worse, become a bandage slapped over a poorly healed wound.

#

Though Izzy was slightly sceptical of Frenchie's abilities at first, he threw himself wholeheartedly behind his captaincy for multiple reasons. Firstly... Izzy had his stint at captain. Izzy knows he doesn't particularly, uh, suit that role. He got mutinied on faster than even Jack's record (fucking embarrassing; Izzy's glad he's dead, if only because he'd never live that down).

Secondly... Well, this lackadaisical, supersititious musician kid seemed like just another of Bonnet's frails at first - but during the Kraken Era, he came into his own. He was fucked up by Ed, badly, like all of them were. But though it left him with a big fucking locked box that he refuses to talk about with anyone, it showed Frenchie that he could step up to the task, and use his skillset of trickery and guile to protect those he cares about (like, pretending he killed Izzy to keep him safe from Ed).

Now, Izzy's pretty damn sure Frenchie can walk the necessary line between Bonnet's softness and the hardship required of pirates. And, better yet, he thinks Frenchie might know it too. And he wants to be right there at Frenchie's side, protecting him, every step of the way.

Plus, y'know. There's that whole thing where Frenchie (who, for as long as Izzy knew him, looked out for number one) carried him into the hidden space within the ships' walls and tended to him against Blackbeard's orders. Risking his life for Izzy's worthless one, which was (so they all presumed at the time) pretty much over anyway.

And suuuuuure, Izzy was delirious. But, uh. He was also really fucking impressed. In that moment, Frenchie went in his mind from being another 'crewmate Izzy had to protect' to a 'crewmate who is protecting him; who thinks of Izzy as an equal, worthy of kindness and compassion'. Hell, Izzy may have had emotions about it, as they lay tangled on Izzy's damp sickbed, awaiting his death. He has distinct memories of a kiss.

But that's all in the past. They left Stede and Ed in their inn and sailed away to start a better life with the rest of the crew - a fresh break, a clean start. Izzy doesn't want to know if The Kiss actually happened, or if it was just a fever dream (HAHAHAHAA IT'S EATING HIM UP INSIDE). But he's sure as hell NOT gonna ask.

Look what happened the last time he fell in love with his Captain, after all.

Anyway: they are THEE recipe for traumatised mutual pining <3

#ouizzy #izzy hands #ofmd frenchie #our flag means death #ofmd ficlet #izzy x frenchie #frenchie x izzy #ofmd fanfic #ofmd #THE ENDING WE DESERVED #WAS OUIZZY SAILING AWAY INTO THE SUNSET TOGETHER #ON THIS HILL I SHALL DIE #israel hands #frenchie #frenchie is just so!!!! :picks him up and squeezes him: #I know you are full of trauma but also so sweet and lovely and kind and - AHHH

[celluloidbroomcloset]

Since this was being discussed, I think it worthwhile to take a quick look at Calico Jack's character and the way in which he represents a facet of the toxic masculinity and internalized homophobia of piracy.

I've written before about Izzy's internalized homophobia and investment in the masculine hierarchy that despises men like Stede and Lucius, both of whom reject gender conformity and more naturally embrace the feminine aspects of their personalities. That Jack is Izzy's immediate choice to get Ed away from Stede speaks both volumes about Izzy and his assumptions about Ed, and about Jack himself.

When we first meet Jack, his entire persona is of a frat boy, an old friend of Ed's who wants to shoot, drink, fight, and fuck. In their first introduction, he refers to Stede as "the big gal"— a comment on Stede's perceived effeminacy, and highlighting Jack's inherent misogyny. Ed immediately laughs, dismissing it as a joke, though Stede is accustomed to being treated this way by other men like Jack (similar to Nigel's jokes about his "plumpness" and effeminacy). Already, Jack is indeed being typed as homophobic, with a contempt for "lesser," more effeminate men whom he can control and dominate.

The major indication of Jack's homosexuality is his statement about his dalliances with Ed, which he frames in the context of directly asking Stede if he and Ed are "buggering each other or what." It's the show's first explicit verbal reference to sex between men, but here it is framed as an act that men do to each other, disconnected from love, attraction, or even desire, because "anything goes at sea." The anything goes comment is what further highlights the undercurrents of Jack's homophobia—that sex between men is simply what happens at sea, often on ships with no women present. Once more, it is disconnected from any elements of desire or love, and while there's no indication that Jack would consider sex with anyone in romantic terms, he certainly doesn't consider sex with men to be romantic.

Izzy clearly understands homosexuality as an acceptable, normal part of piracy, but his initial horror at Stede and Ed having sex is rooted in the hierarchy of men, who penetrates whom (Stede, an effeminate man, penetrating Ed, a hypermasculine one, is unacceptable and has to be rectified via murder), and the relationship between sexuality and violence. Jack's role is an offshoot of this—he explicitly addresses homosexuality and Stede and Ed's relationship, but it remains formed in terms of what they are physically doing to each other, ignoring any facets of emotional or romantic connection. He further highlights Ed's own arrested development in his understanding of sexuality as violent games between men, with the insistence on playing whippies mirroring Ed's desire for Stede to stab him. Sexual contact is always violent, and it is always about who does what to whom. The only place for men like Stede is in being subdued, or in not participating at all.

Jack's homophobia is not rooted in the act of gay sex, but the meaning behind it, and the importance of who does what to whom. As I've mentioned here, sexual roles are about places in the masculine hierarchy, and sex itself is about power, not love or attraction. He dominates Ed in the whippies game, and he attempts to dominate Stede via a discussion of sex. The wedge which he tries to drive between Stede and Ed is based in his having had "dalliances" with Ed, with the implication that he is the more masculine man and therefore has a right to penetrate Ed.

Stede, once again, rejects the masculine hierarchy. He doesn't form his relationship to Ed on the basis of power dynamics, and openly states that he respects Ed's past as being Ed's business. Whether Ed has had sex with Jack is, to Stede, immaterial; just as he does not see stabbing as a sexual act, he does not see Ed's past with Jack as having bearing on their present. It is Ed's shame that makes the relationship with Jack important later on, not Stede's.

So Jack's internalized homophobia is a reflection of piracy's attitudes towards gay sex in general, and Ed's own shame about his desires and feelings. Jack was intended to bring Ed back into the fold of piracy, rejecting the more fluid gender and sexuality of Stede and the Revenge in favor of hypermasculinity and rigid sexual roles. The plan backfires, however, as Ed successfully embraces his softer feelings for a gentle man with no interest in exerting power over him.

#ofmd #our flag means death #stede bonnet #calico jack #edward teach #gif #ofmd meta

[bloomeng]

i made the joke earlier about how steddyhands fans tend to like edstede the least of all the pairs, and i just wanted to elaborate bc actually i do have more to say about this

when i first watched the show i didn't really participate in the fandom (so i don't know pre-s2 fandom drama), i was neutral about izzy and i suppose i liked edstede the most simply by default. in general in season 1 i thought their relationship was charming back when the show was still firmly in the realm of a comedy. then s2 happened...

i wouldn't say that s2 ruined edstede for me permanently because i still like them, but i will say that it definitely reshaped how i see their relationship. suddenly their relationship was stagnant, going in circles, and generally starting to feel more like active bad influences on each other. which is wild considering how in s1 the whole crux of it was that stede and ed were actively making each other more authentic people. i will say though that i personally feel the reason edstede fell flat to me in s2 was mostly due to ed's behavior and the way stede overlooks it. ed's behavior in s2 will always be one of my biggest complaints of s2 (the rest of the issues are more technical).

recently i've seen the opinion that edstede are now MORE problematic than edizzy, which i don't exactly agree with. i agree with the sentiment that with all the developments in s2 edstede feels worse, but i think that has more to do with the fact that their relationship issues are far more tangible to the majority of the audience. with edizzy their issues stem from an intense bond forged by a deep codependence that is pushed to extremes. simply put their dynamic is rare. (i want to quickly note that this doesn’t make their relationship better narratively; there’s a space for both in story telling and both are equally valuable.) edstede's issues on the other hand are more grounded, to the point where most people have experienced some level of their conflicts in their life whether that be firsthand or secondhand. so it's not that their problems are worse so much as more people have stronger reactions because they can relate directly. not saying people don't relate to edizzy, it's more about the scale to which people relate.

my famous example is breaking bad (spoilers for a decade-old series) but i think one of the reasons people hate skylar so much more than walt (besides the obvious misogyny) is that they can relate to the anger of being cheated on while it's harder to relate to the feeling of your husband secretly being a drug lord. like sure his thing on paper is ten times worse but audiences usually relate strongly to the things they personally relate to.

edizzy will always be worse on paper (the toe incident alone makes sure of that) but edstede now feels worse is what i'm getting at. and sure i know izzy emotionally matured leaps and bounds in s2 but unfortunately that doesn't fix edizzy. in order for it to actually be a healthy relationship they both need to grow, so yeah they're still firmly in the toxi yuri category.

anyway i actually do like them a whole lot, but they also make me angry on izzy and the crew's behalf. and on a personal level, i just tend to prefer non-canon ships because i feel like i have more wiggle room. that and if they're canon i'm usually satisfied with that canon so i don't find myself hyper-fixating as much. hence why i didn't really get into the fandom after s1, despite liking the show more at that point.

this is just my observation but i think a lot of the reasons people are now drifting from edstede and into the safety of non-canon ships is simply because s2 stripped their relationship of some of their whimsy. a lot of people are angry with ed and stede and are seeking refugee amongst ships that don’t feel like they have to confront the glaring holes in their relationship.

but these are just my musings i don’t speak for anyone but myself.

#ofmd #our flag means death #ofmd s2 #ofmd season 2 #stede bonnet #edward teach #izzy hands #i’m not tagging any variation of edstede bc i don’t want to put negativity on their pages when they’re just going about their day #even tho i wouldn’t necessarily call this negativity against the ship #but just to be safe #steddyhands #edizzy #txt #long post #ofmd critical

[piratecaptainscaptainpirates]

I really wish they'd had time to develop Ricky more, because I think he could have been such an interesting parallel for Stede. That's clearly what they were going for - Izzy's Pinocchio joke really drives it home - and the bones are there but I wish there was more.

Ricky's a lot like Stede, except in all the ways that matter, and that could be such an interesting dynamic. He really is endearingly pathetic when he's standing out in the rain just to talk to Stede, but he always condescends to people he perceives as "lesser" than him in a way that Stede never did even at the start. He acts like he's owed a shot at being a pirate just because Stede did it. He's shown to be a good, outside-the-box thinker in a similar way to Stede; in s2e6 when Zheng tells him he could "end piracy without firing a single shot," he repeats "shot" and you can see his plan in s2e7 coming together in his head. In the finale we get a sense others in his social class look down on him just like Stede; one of the officers says "who would have thought little Ricky Banes could do this" and it clearly hits a nerve, making him say "anyone with half a brain." Even with his limited screen time he seems to have a lot of similar traits and insecurities as Stede, just a bit to the left.

I really wish they'd had more time to build him up like I'm sure they originally planned, because the bones are damn compelling.

#ofmd #our flag means death #i really really want to like Ricky because I can see what they were trying to do and it's good shit!

[vroomvroomwee]

Izzy Hands is the perfect example of what Neil Gaiman was trying to tell us with the season 2 finale.

Look at it objectively. We got a canonical queer love story as the centre of the show, with Ed and Stede's relationship now developing to new levels both emotionally and physically. And YET, everyone is focused like a hawk on the weird, desperate, pathetic mess of a person that is Izzy Hands and his dynamic with the crew (particularly Ed, Stede, and Lucius).

With how uneventful it would be for us fans if aziracrow got together so easily and effortlessly. How so many of us are focused on characters like Muriel and Beelzebub themselves more than the actual canonical new queer romance that we got. Because it was just so easy. There was no flavour for us to taste, no cooking for us to digest, no spark, no sprinkle. After all, at the end of the day, the show is entertainment and it's there for us to watch and love and have fun, and the fun part is the angst, the pining, the affection and the drama that has us rooting for the characters. When that is done and over with, what then?

#it might just be my aroace ass loving the alterous in betweens of platonic and romantic relationships but who knows #good omens #goodomens #aziraphale #crowley #ineffable husbands #good omens 2 #ofmd #ourflagmeansdeath #our flag means death #izzy hands #stede bonnet #edward teach #gentlebeard #blackbonnet #ed x stede #edizzy #stizzy #beelzebub #muriel

[naranjapetrificada]

Izzy becomes a "real boy"

So obviously I haven't been able to shut up about the way Izzy has been written in season 2 and I stand by my disappointment and criticism, even knowing that the writers were given a herculean task of cramming 10 pounds of season into an 8 pound bag. Even knowing that, his "arc" such as it is has felt very off to a lot of people, present company included. I'm a cogitator at heart (thanks AuDHD!) and that can turn "make it make sense" into a prime directive sometimes. So here I am, trying once again.

I felt a particular way about Izzy after the end of season 1, which I would describe as "not especially strongly" because I primarily saw his character as a storytelling tool/useful foil more than anything else. But his presence and characterization in season 2 have been haunting me this time and not in a good way, because I've spent this season trying and failing to make it make sense. But something just occurred to me that I hope I can explain in a coherent way:

If season 1 Izzy was more a storytelling tool than anything else, maybe season 2 was an attempt to turn the puppet into a Real Boy. And if so, maybe things did not go as planned.

There are so, so many good posts going into the things that don't work about how Izzy has been handled this season, to the point that I'm not gonna try reinventing the wheel. Some of the reasons it hasn't worked for some of us include:

Much of his alleged growth apparently happening offscreen, most likely due to the reduced budget and episode count.

The lack of connective tissue between many of his scenes, some of which can be attributed to the previous point about corporate fuckery but other parts of which are hard to explain beyond "idk I guess the writers felt like it?"

The unfortunate connotations of sidelining nonwhite characters like Jim, who was the only character beyond the central pair to receive a detailed backstory, flashbacks, and a multi-episode character arc

The unchecked racialized comments he gets to drop about Edward (calling him a "wild dog" or seemingly mixing him up with Roach) that in season 1, would have resulted in violent retribution as a sign of the story's disapproval

The lines we get from Izzy that feel like they should have been said by other characters, and maybe that would have been based on the expectations of the show that we left season 1 with

The way it seems like Izzy's suffering is being used as a stand-in for actual moments of reflection or atonement, which is a pretty fucked up dynamic to set up as precursor to redemption

The way Izzy now gets to partake in the very behaviors he denigrated in Ed last season, which would be a cool and moving character beat if there was a single, solitary narrative acknowledgement in the harm caused by his treatment of Ed in s1e10. Ditto for him apparently just being cool with shit that once would have been his worst nightmare.

The fact that so many of these issues could have been addressed in a quick throwaway line or two that showed that the narrative understood what was wrong to reassure us all because by definition if a character is getting a redemption arc, it's because they did something wrong, right?

There's plenty more of course, but that's not why I made this post. I made this post because regardless of why the decision was made to handle Izzy this way this season, the attempt was made to flesh him out in ways that his role last season may not have been initially written for. Con's performance and certain production choices hinted at a depth to his character that may or may not have been on the page, but helped make for a pretty interesting season 1 antagonist.

For season 2 they decided to make Izzy a real boy, but the combination of a reduced budget, a lower episode count, and whatever creative darlings they couldn't seem to kill in order to give us more development of his transformation made sticking the landing impossible because we're lacking certain elements for basic comprehension.

Imagine you know almost nothing of the story of Pinocchio and someone starts up the Disney movie version of it for you but it's a weirdly edited version of it. There's no narration from Jiminy Cricket, mostly because there's no Jiminy Cricket at all. We see Geppetto crafting a wooden puppet, but not the part where he wishes for him to be a real boy, which makes it kinda weird to then see the part where the fairy brings him to life and says he can become a real boy but okay, let's go with it.

Now let's say the one thing you've always heard about the story is that Pinocchio's nose grows when he lies. So we get to the scene where he lies to the fairy but for whatever reason, his nose doesn't grow. No one comments on the inconsistency, and when you mention the nose thing all anyone wants to talk about is how great Pinocchio's nose looks.

Then Pinocchio goes to Pleasure Island and while the animation and acting seem great as usual, and the language of cinema appears to be setting up something dark on the horizon. Then Pinocchio's new friend Lampwick starts transforming into a donkey, this random well-dressed cricket shows up to admonish Pinocchio, and our puppet friend is randomly immune to the thing turning other kids into donkeys. No one comments on that either. Maybe Pinocchio even gloats about it a little, which seems like a weird storytelling decision that merits a follow up discussion later.

And I guess this is the part of this over-extended metaphor where you remember you have somewhere to be but you'll finish the film later, because as an audience we won't know how things shake out for season 2 Izzy until the finale. Presumably we'll still get the scene where he magically turns into a real boy, but there isn't exactly time for anything else like all that stuff with the whale. Maybe the real boy scene will happen, but for whatever reason the animator kept drawing him like the wooden puppet and every time you point it out no one will take you seriously.

Wouldn't that be a weird thing to experience?

#ofmd #our flag means death #ofmd s2 spoilers #ofmd s2 #ofmd meta #izzy hands #izzy critical #not really critical but that tag is useful for people's filters #ofmd season 2 #ofmd spoilers #ofmd season 2 spoilers #our flag means death spoilers #tbh I don't even understand how Izzy fans feel good about his arc #if this happened to a secondary character I loved I would be pretty upset

[meanbossart]

I love Izzy so much, I feel for him tremendously.

Can you tell us something about his future relationship, whatever it might be, with Grodderick? Or is it under wraps for spoilers? 👀

Sure! The details of their relationship are never relevant to the plot, it's more of a background thing that changes some very minor character interactions in ways I doubt one can predict by simply learning about it - I'll still leave it under a cut for anyone who wants to avoid it. I'll also skip certain story beats which allow their relationship to happen in the first place that are most definitely spoilers, and only talk about the actual dynamic between them and post-ANE events, so if details feel amiss, that's because they are.

So it's probably obvious that they're meant to develop a romantic relationship lol this happens after Grodderick gets somewhat "stuck" with Izzy around through certain circumstances. Izzantar, in his predicament, happens to be far more comfortable around him than anyone else because of his predisposition to feel safe around "slave" races. Now, that's obviously not a great start to any relationship, romantic or otherwise lol but it is what it is.

They grow a little closer through Grodderick's endless patience and sincere curiosity about a culture he isn't familiar with. Izzantar, despite his experiences, considers the underdark his home, he can only properly conceptualize of surface customs by comparing them to his own culture, and Grodderick is the only one willing to hear it without judgement - with the eventual wisecrack or pushback. But the way he does it is one Izzantar comfortable with.

Likewise Izzantar would probably defy Grod's own generalized negativity around the orc-ish side of his culture (and frankly be positively shocked it has any merit at all). It's a funny little game of "no, YOU have internalized hate" they keep playing between themselves by accident.

Another major point here is that Grodderick is a) the only person who sees Izzantar as an adult and b) someone who immediately recognizes him as someone with an anxiety disorder. With time he would help Izzy to calm the fuck down and not always assume the worse out of people. His company also allows Izzantar to feel more at ease in public settings in the surface as a drow, and Izzy's brazen company and completely unfiltered perspective is a breath of fresh air to Grodderick. He thinks he's funny, he recognizes and participates in his dry humor, he doesn't offend easy, and he's the furthest thing from a drow. This makes him an apt friend choice and later a romantic interest. Being hot and having cool tats helps LOL

Also they both like to partake in a little devil🌿 which is likely how their first meaningful interaction ever happens (Izzantar sees him smoking and is like "oh boy I could really fucking use some of that right now")

They probably starting fucking kind of casually. It's entirely on Izzantar to pursue him since Grodderick isn't interested in feeding a drow's ego, which is a funny interaction of its own where Izzantar just blows up frustrated that he won't make the first move, since he's used to being a very passive partner. Something along the lines of "WHY DON'T YOU WANT TO FUCK ME" probably comes out his mouth verbatim LOL they get over this non-misunderstanding quickly and Izzantar is just happy to have sex in a way that's completely the opposite of what's expected of him in the Underdark as a popular breeder. Obviously he also finds Grodderick profoundly attractive both for his confidence, smarts, appearance, and frankly his imposing presence because he's not immune to a little bad-boy charm.

I think they catch feelings around the same time as one another, and proceed to get on a long-term relationship.

Izzantar (this is post ANE and never mentioned) eventually sets shop somewhere as a jeweler. He gets a lot of business based on the fact that he's a drow and knowingly plays up the part of someone who's mystically more knowledgeable and skilled about precious stones and minerals than most because of his race (on top of his genuine talent). His bad attitude is also hysterically seen as charming drow bedside-manner and indicative of the quality of his work to wealthy clients.

He lets his hair grow out and for semi-plot-related-reasons starts passing as a female drow (also, he just likes it) Grodderick doesn't care either way. At that point they're living together and get a cat that Izzantar names Angkacha. To his despair, Grodderick nickanames it Chacha and it sticks. Izzy wants the cat to be a vicious killing machine but whenever he casts animal speak on it the cat's just like OOOO MAMA ME LOVE MAMA and he hates it (but not really, he would kill for this cat)

aaaand here's some old doodles of him from that point of his life! The last two have been uh cropped for uh reasons

#ask #izzantar godseck

[spinteresting]

After having an OFMD S2 marathon yesterday, I have some thoughts.

The first 3 episodes are really good. But they change the tone of the show a lot from what it was in season 1. And the following 5 episodes do not properly deal with the descent into darkness. They made Ed incredibly unlikable. And it wasn’t funny. Everything with Blackbeard and his crew felt very dark and serious.

I think the 2nd season would have worked better if they had kept a more comedic tone and not gone as dark as they did.

My favorite Ed/Stede moments in season 2 were stede begging Ed to wake up, mermaid, and when they reconnected at Anne and Mary’s place.

Nothing else was very compelling. They didn’t have many good moments together this season. And in fact, the show kept flashing back to their good moments in s1 instead of building their relationship further.

Despite kissing multiple times and implied sex, they really lacked any passion or tension. They didn’t seem to desire each other. There was no romance. It felt very flat.

I still love Lucius and Pete. I wish they had been given more screen time this season.

I still hate what they did with Jim and Olu. It made no sense with what we saw in season 1. They should have been poly this season, just adding another into their dynamic instead of changing it completely.

Episode 5 was my favorite. It was funny and the crew was featured significantly.

Episode 6 needed about 5 more minutes added to its runtime. I loved the concept though.

Episodes 7 and 8 were not good. They both had good moments, but overall they felt rushed and underdeveloped. And they felt disconnected from the rest of the season.

And the decision to kill Izzy is baffling. It makes even less sense when watching the whole season in one go. Nor does it read as “he’s not really dead” like Lucius’ death in season 1.

One other major weakness this season was the Prince Ricky character. He wasn’t funny and he really needed to be. The Badmintons in season 1 were hilarious and added so much to the comedy. Season 2 needed that with the antagonist.

The other major complaint I have about this season is that the writers mostly forgot it was supposed to be an ensemble show. The crew were not given as much time or development as in season 1, and that was one of the best things about the show. I loved all the B and C plots in season 1 and this season really needed that. It had a couple but they weren’t executed as well as the ones in season 1.

Overall this season also lacked in comedy. It was no where near as funny as season 1.

Season 1 of Our Flag Means Death set the bar really high, and season 2 just didn’t reach the same level.

#ofmd #our flag means death #izzy hands #stede bonnet #edward teach #lucius spriggs #black pete #jim jimenez #oluwande boodhari

[chuplayswithfire]

drive by theory for the show's progression, but i think the fact that Oluwande was voted to be captain by the crew is going to be relevant, not only in Stede needing to regain his crew's loyalty and trust after wholesale ditching them to go back to his old life, but also because it will propel Oluwande on a leadership pathway. I don't believe Stede has an official first mate, and a good compromise for the crew would be for Stede to formally appoint Oluwande as his first mate, and their first objective be to get back their missing people - Lucius, Frenchie, Jim, *and* Ed.

Oluwande is one of the protagonists of the first season, with Jim and Oluwande acting as a healthy counterpoint to Stede and Ed, highlighting the way that communication and trust can strengthen an intense romance and I think we'll see that continue as Oluwande develops - I'm hoping we'll also get his background and backstory, including what position he was in with Spanish Jackie's people to get Jim hired in the first place.

Plus, this then opens up the floor for a good compare contrast, where we'll see that Oluwande's compassion, care, lack of desire for power, and respect for the crew and the captain will be diametrically opposed to Izzy's cruelty, domineering attitude, hunger for power, and basic disrespect for the crew and the captain, highlighting his weaknesses as a first mate and hopefully awakening him to the reality that he's blinded himself to his own flaws and failings - Izzy *can't* remain as a first mate, but it would be good for his arc for him to be busted down to working crew man and have to work alongside others in a position of equality and build himself a place in the community of the Revenge's crew if he's planning to stay.

It would further both Oluwande and Ed's arcs, with Oluwande continuing to grow into himself and the respect of his community, and Ed seeing that things can change and dynamics can shift without bloodshed or violence *in* the pirate world. He can use the tools the Revenge has helped him find - talking it through as a crew - to help make changes that let him be the person he wants to be, rather than the person the world (and Izzy) demands that he be. He doesn't have to kill or banish Izzy to make him stop being such an intimate problem.

#oluwande boodhari #izzy hands #ofmd #ofmd meta #this is MOSTLY about olu but of course ed snuck his way in at the end #i really think first mate boodhari is gonna happen guys #our flag means death #edward teach

[dillyslinger]

Izzy has been at Ed’s heels catching scraps for YEARS. He loves Ed and it’s already been established in the first three episodes this season that he has come to Jesus on a few things regarding Ed and Stede. That Stede bringing the softer side out of Edward CLEARLY was not the worst possible thing (sure, it took Ed going full Kraken and making life hell for everyone on The Revenge for that to sink in, but he got there) and that his love of Edward, perhaps, DOES extend beyond the Blackbeard persona. He might not have even understood the KIND of love he had for Edward until seeing the mirror that is Stede held up to it.

And so, now it looks like we’re going to get a blossoming NEW dynamic between him and Stede, the OTHER man in love with Edward. His former competition. I say former, because I feel like Izzy might in fact have given up on Ed being his. He still loves him, but he loves him enough to accept that Stede is the one who will make him happy and he WANTS to see him happy. And it’s looking like there’s a possibility that viewing Stede through that lens might result in Izzy developing deeper feelings regarding him. Maybe he will find himself loving the one who makes the other one he loves happy. Maybe he’ll find himself caught in the middle of that while Ed struggles with how he mistreated his first mate and repairing things with Stede. Maybe Ed will see Izzy and Stede’s relationship growing and discover that a way to heal and make things right is to allow room for that. Maybe he’ll see that Izzy is learning to love in a way that is less possessive, controlling, repressed, and compartmentalized. That he’s growing to love Stede, even, and Ed has a deep understanding of what it means to love Stede, so it becomes something for them to bond through and heal through. Maybe the three of them come to some kind of understanding and it /isn’t/ totally incomprehensible that the three of them can move forward together somehow in a way that isn’t toxic. I’m not saying Steddyhands, necessarily, but a strong friendship built on love and good will.

Although, if banging out some of the sexual tension at first is necessary to move past it, be it the three of them or just Stizzy, I would be able to die happy. 😌

#Djenks into your hands I commend my spirit #our flag means death #izzy hands #ofmd s2 spoilers #ofmd s2 #edward teach #stede bonnet #steddyhands #stizzy

[butch-pyrate]

I really enjoy the concept of edizzy having a 24/7 D/s relationship, that of course they never talked about and maybe Ed never really understood what it was, hell maybe even Izzy didn't consciouslly know that it was the role he had placed himself in, and of course it all goes to shit - because how do you provide care for a person that you own, when you don't fully understand just how much you own them. How do you rely on a man to be a master to you, when he doesn't know that's the role you've assigned him.

Then maybe, down the line post S2 (were pretending like half of S2 didn't happen, I'm picking and choosing from what I liked lol), they finally do talk about It™. And of course, Stede plays a part in helping them create a healthy (or at least healthier) version of that dynamic, but it's not just Stede. I want it to also just be Edward and Izzy having grown as people. Edward having realized he had become his father and then working to getting better, developing more self control and allowing himself to experience the desire to control in a health(ier) and controlled fashion, where he can prove to himself (and Izzy) that he's capable of compassion along side cruelity and admitting to himself that he's allowed to have that duality and that it doesn't make him evil. Izzy realizing he has to communicate and ask for things he wants, the he has to endure the mortifying ordeal of being known. Izzy accepting that he can be owned but still own himself just as well, that he can demand respect from his captain while still being loyal to and dedicating himself to his captain.

#ofmd #izzy hands #our flag means death #edward teach #edizzy #blackhands #Steadyhands #Implied steadyhands at least #24/7 dynamic #k!nk tag

[lesbyers]

now that ofmd s2 is approaching, thoughts on ships? specifically blackhands lol

oh i have a lot of opinions and thoughts abt blackhands. i dont ship it as in i definitely would not want them to be together romantically but i am incredibly interested in and fascinated by their dynamic and i kind of love it. there’s this constant shifting power dynamic between them where izzy wants to control his own submission to ed. kind of like a devoted guard dog. i think he has a very strange love for him that is suffocating for ed, at least in this stage of his life. in some ways izzy is to ed what mary is to stede in that they represent the restrictive standard that one is supposed to live up to for the way of life they’re leading and while, although ascribing to it, are struggling with it themselves. i love mary and she was one of my faves so im hoping we get a similar look at izzy’s character next season. izzy’s devotion to not just ed, but the pirate’s way of life is fascinating and it hints at what he might have run away from or what he fought to get there and i really hope we get more insight into that. i also think there’s a hint of internalized homophobia to his character that i want to see developed, especially in regards to his view of masculinity as this is something that he and ed are constantly battling in the first season. i don’t particularly like izzy, at least in season one, (i don’t think we’re supposed to), but i am genuinely very excited to see where they take his character next season, especially in regards to stede and how he treats him seeing as he may see him as an extension of both ed’s love and pain.

#asks #anonymous #mabel post #ofmd #blackhands #izzy hands #meta #edward teach #stede bonnet #ofmd season 2 #david jenkins #taika waititi #rhys darby #con o'neill #israel hands

[celluloidbroomcloset]

I think it was always expected there would be bad faith Stede character reading. Stede and Ed were always fitting a specific fanon blorbo gay ship dynamic visually (I'll be honest enough to admit that was what initially drew me to watch the series) and ofc course people are diluting those characters to those character tropes. It's maddening, but there is nothing to do :/

Yes, and it's true of every fandom I've ever seen or been in. Interesting thing here is that, in a straight mainstream show, Stede and Ed would be queerbaiting. They'd be "best buddies who maybe possibly might kiss teehee" and everyone would be clamoring for it and it would never happen. This show has upended fandom expectations themselves and some people can't handle it, so they decide things like "Izzy is the real main character" or "the leads are Actually Bad."

Stede is complex. So's Ed. Neither of them are perfect and neither of them behave perfectly at all times. We love Stede and we hate it when he does shit like being cruel to Mary at her art opening or challenging Zheng to a fight, because we love him and we know he's good. What I hate is those people - and sometimes it's people who otherwise have good takes - seeing his behavior there and trying to argue that this is the direction he was always going or wanted to go because he's becoming "traditionally masculine," when the show clearly develops how that's not the man he truly is or wants to be.

#reply #ofmd #ofmd meta #stede bonnet