#discussion of transphobia

[dogin8]

what it feels like explaining why you shouldn’t buy the fucking harry potter game

#JK Rowling die 🕯🕯🕯🕯🕯 #discussion of transphobia

[toa-arania]

So. I've seen a fair few posts recently making what I consider to be good points about the various forms of transphobia that trans men and trans women face in different ways. And then... They get accompanied by things pitting us against each other. So here's my conclusion as a trans woman: TMA and TME is a stupid distinction that reinforces the gender binary and serves no purpose other than to divide us. Hell, transmisogyny and transandrophobia just aren't helpful terms. We experience transphobia in different ways but it's all fucking transphobia. Arguing over who has it worse just makes us easier targets. We cannot afford to turn on each other like this. Please everyone just calm the fuck down, recognise that other people experience transphobia differently, and recognise that dismissing different experiences of transphobia as an infringement on each other's spaces is the exact tactics transphobes use against us. Fucking stop.

#transgender #discussion of transphobia #hellsite discourse #transmisogyny #transandrophobia #non binary erasure #because that is also an effect of this

[technoxenoholic]

"i don't believe this person is REALLY trans, for xyz reasons, so i'm not going to use the pronouns that they said they want people to use for them. i'm going to use [the pronouns associated with their assigned sex] instead"

whether they're trans or not doesn't even matter. a completely 100% cisgender and otherwise gender-conforming man can use she/her if she wants. a completely 100% cisgender and otherwise gender-conforming woman can use he/him if he wants. anyone can use they/them or it/its or any other pronoun you can imagine. yes, even if they're suffering from mental illness. yes, even if they're genuinely horrible people.

who fucking cares if someone is "really trans"? just use the fucking pronouns that people want you to use for them! treating anything as an acceptable justification to use the wrong pronouns for someone (short of protecting that person from potential harm) is intolerable.

i genuinely don't care how horrible or how "crazy" you think someone is. there are plenty of other equally horrible or mentally ill people whose pronouns that i know, without having to ask, that you do respect -- because their pronouns align with their sex/gender/etc in the way you expect them to. and that makes you look like a hypocrite and an asshole who is perfectly happy to wield misgendering as a looming threat against trans/gnc/etc people to make them "behave".

#stfu blue #discussion of misgendering #discussion of transphobia #discussion of ableism #pronouns #will tag if needed #people who use it/its for horrible people or mentally ill people don't think i forgot about you. i hate your guts even more

[considermygenderminecrafted]

Blanant transphobia, dangerous ableism, complete failure to address rampant racism on the site.

They're Amazon's baby for sure.

#discussion of transphobia #discussion of racism #discussion of ableism

[rjalker]

[ID: The "corporate wants you to find the difference between this picture and this picture", meme, edited so one paper says:

"cis people saying they won't respect a trans person's pronouns because it makes them uncomfortable"

and the other says, "trans people saying they won't respect a trans person's pronouns because it makes them uncomfortable".

In the second panel, the character has been edited to be wearing a black and yellow pronoun pin that reads, "my pronouns are it/its".

The dialogue reads, "It's the same transmisia.".

End ID.]

stop acting like it/its pronouns are special and the exception to "all the ways not to be transmisic".

Respecting people's pronouns means you respect people's pronouns no matter what their pronouns are or your feelings on the matter. End of line.

#described images #discussion of transphobia #discussion of exorsexism #discussion of misgendering #it/its pronouns #ititspronouns #sigh

[mallory-likes-whales]

An argument I have seen a lot of is that "trans women are women, but are a different kind of women than real women". I find this argument interesting, not compelling or effective, but nonetheless interesting.

It's interesting because it shows that the speaker believes that cis women are a singular monolith, and that the only exception to this monolith is trans women. This shows a pretty glaring lack of understanding about how things work in real life.

The main thing that separates people is how they are raised and treated. How people are raised and treated is based on two things: who is being raised, and who is raising them. This sets the baseline of who people turn out to be.

Let's say, hypothetically, you have a cis man, and a cis woman. Following the assumption that all men are a monolith and all women are a monolith, there are only two people in the whole world, and billions of each of them. That's absurd, right? That's the sort of statement that leads to "the king and queen of England aren't starving! World hunger is solved!" It's absurd.

Why is it absurd? Because class, wealth, parental quality, race, nationality, etc. impact people also. Yeah! Trans women's experiences differ from cis women's! So do black and white women. So do British and Japanese women. So do rich and poor women. Yeah! Because "real women" are imaginary. There's no standard woman. If I knew more I'd probably be able to identify which kind of fucked up that idea is, but my level of knowledge extends only as far as "ethnocentric".

So yeah, sure, trans women have different experiences.

So do all women

#the great plagues #trans #transgender #tw transphobia #discussion of transphobia

[nonbinarymlm]

The thing is, most people (in the US and Western countries at least, that’s where my experience is from) have some forms of privilege some forms of oppression. This isn’t saying everyone is equally oppressed and privileged, but most people have privilege in at least one way and oppression in at least one way.

And if you experience oppression in some ways and privilege, it’s much easier to see your oppression then you privilege.

Privilege is largely invisible to those who have it. Oppression grates against you all the time. So it’s much easier to see the forms of oppression you experience then the forms of privilege.

That’s why it’s so important for us all to listen to each other and not play Oppression Olympics. You can face very real oppression that really affects your life, and still learn a lot from other people who face other forms of oppression that you don’t. We have to listen to each other. In the queer community especially I think this is important, because there’s so many different ways to be oppressed and to be privileged.

#oppression #privilege #lgbtq #intersectionality #inter community discussion #discussion #discourse #homophobia #transphobia #racism #classism #intersexism #etc etc #white queers #cis gays #male privilege #white privilege #able-bodied privilege #and many more #thoughts #loving queue

[pizzaback]

the thing about the transphobe effectively complaining that trans women are better than her at skateboarding truly does not bode well for the perception of trans women in other mixed sex sports. like to be clear skateboarding is a sport where “sex” segregation is very often meaningless (this particular transphobe has participated in men’s skating competitions in the past despite being a cisgender woman) and the “biological advantages” in skateboarding include things like being shorter which is a trait not typically associated with trans women (this is at least part of why she has placed behind children in competitions btw aside from that she also sucks at her job and why children are allowed to compete with adults in these events in the first place). if transphobes are starting panics around the supposed “biological advantages” that trans women allegedly have in “sex” segregated sports and applying that to sports that are typically mixed-sex this is an omen of ill fortune for trans women in like equestrian sports and many TMAs just for instance. like i have no doubt this is going to continue, continue to be absolutely absurd, and it’s not going to matter how blatantly absurd it is because the point is to drive trans people out of public spaces, not to even the playing field in sports.

#op #transphobia discussion #transmisogyny discussion

[genderkoolaid]

I'm not of the mind that all marginalized men are oppressed because of their gender, but rather that gender always plays a role in oppression and it's irresponsible to only focus on that when discussing marginalized women. gender is a huge way of exerting control over people's bodies, personal identities, and personal relationships, so it's always going to be shaped by marginalization + marginalization also gets shaped by the gender of the person experiencing it in any given situation

#also discussing cis marginalized men's experiences w gendered violence doesnt mean they can't be held accountable for misogyny/transphobia #m. #transandrophobia

[vivi266]

November 29, 2022

The Lemkin Institute for Genocide Prevention voices its concern over the growing number of laws introduced in the United States that target transgender individuals and the transgender community. Anti-trans hostility in the US has become a staple of the Republican Party’s election strategy and is clearly being used to stoke voters’ fears of a changing world by raising the specter of a malevolent polluting force tied to liberalism, cosmopolitanism, and democracy. The Lemkin Institute believes that the so-called “gender critical movement” that is behind these laws is a fascist movement furthering a specifically genocidal ideology that seeks the complete eradication of trans identity from the world.

#transphobia #transmisogyny #genocide #transphobia discussion #transmisogyny discussion #state violence

[rebellum]

nooo i wrote a whole RESPONSE to this but then tumblr app crashed and then I had to type the whole thing out AGAIN on my computer and then in that time period the op turned reblogs off. Since they turned reblogs off, I decided to cover up their name, in order to kinda respect that.

my response:

No. It is important to create new words in order to discuss specific phenomena. That’s why words like homophobia, lesbophobia, transphobia, misogyny, transmisogyny, exorsexism, and transandrophobia were invented. 

Sure, lesbophobia is covered under “homophobia”, but lesbophobia is an important word for describing how misogyny and homophobia affect women’s experiences of homophobia. Transmisogyny is covered under “transphobia”, but it’s useful to have a term that specifically describes how trans fems experience the intersection of transphobia and misogyny, not just for being trans, but for being specifically trans feminine, and the ways that expectations of womanhood, femininity, manhood, and masculinity factor into their oppression because of their assigned sex at birth, their presentation, and their gender. Exorsexism is covered under “transphobia”, but it’s useful to have a term to describe how transphobia affects specifically people outside of the gender binary. Misogynoir is covered under misogyny, but the term was created to specifically describe how Black women experience the intersections of racism and misogyny. Of course my explanations here are a little reductive, each one of these examples has much more to it than what I listed. 

In a similar vein, transandrophobia is useful for understanding how transphobia, homophobia, misogyny, and the meta-epistemologies of those discourses affect trans mascs, not just for being trans, but for being trans masc. Oppression, both systemic and on individual levels of discrimination and prejudice, works differently for people depending on the intersections of their identity (assigned sex at birth, assigned gender at birth, presentation, gender identity, race, culture, ability, etc). 

So transandrophobia is useful for discussing specifics like:

The idea of “lost lesbians” and “the trans cult tricking little girls into mutilating their bodies”

The rhetoric of violence around testosterone-based HRT. There is the incorrect idea that people who take T become more violent because they are becoming more masculine. 

This association of masculinity with violence, and how that affects trans mascs. For trans people regardless of gender, proximity to masculinity puts people in danger in queer spaces. People are treated worse if they are trans masc, trans fem and don’t pass well enough to the surrounding people, or nonbinary and not sufficiently ‘safely’ androgynous (skinny, hairless, and white, with no prominent secondary sex characteristics). 

How trans mascs are treated differently when they come out, or when they start to transition. Many people find that people are colder to them, they experience higher rates of abuse, and if they are trans men they are told to not talk about their experiences because ‘they are men and can’t possibly understand misogyny’. The voices of people who aren’t trans masc often end up being listened to more about trans masc experiences, than the people who have actually lived through those experiences. Like, people are shitty to trans people that are masculine specifically because they are masculine.

Corrective rape 

Many people, even in feminist and trans spaces, believe that a man’s gender cannot factor into his experiences of oppression. Eg believe that the fact that they are men is irrelevant to trans men’s experiences, believe that a Black man’s masculinity has nothing to do with how he experiences racial oppression, etc. There are even some vocal people who believe that men cannot be oppressed, and that trans men cannot be oppressed, specifically because being men means they CAN’T experience oppression. 

The idea that trans men transition in order to try to escape misogyny 

Discrimination in reproductive healthcare 

A lot more, it would take ages to list the different kinds of transandrophobia

I also noticed you said “continue to feel its effects if they don’t pass”. But that idea is part of the issue: trans mascs continue to experience oppression for being trans masc when they DO pass. Even if someone is well passing, and stealth, they still directly experience discrimination for being trans masc through things like access barriers to reproductive healthcare, higher rates of abuse, sexual assault, etc. 

So transandrophobia (trans andro + phobia, not trans +androphobia as some people against the concept seem to believe) is, like other specific terminologies of oppression, really useful as shorthand for the specific forms of oppression people face not just for being trans, but for being trans masc.

#transandrophobia #transphobia discussion

[dogin8]

TERF rhetoric of "BE AFRAID OF TRANS PEOPLE THEY ARE PREDATORS AND A DANGER TO YOU" is word for word the same ideology behind racism and segregation.

And both are propaganda for purposes of making the oppression of said groups palatable to the public.

Because The government wants you to believe Trans people are predators so that you will turn a blind eye at the repeated violations of Trans people's rights that they are committing.

Because 'All cops are bastards' until you scream to call the police on a trans women quietly minding her own business in the women's room.

#discussion of terfs #discussion of transphobia #and this is not to take ANY agency away from TERFs many of whom go out of their way to be hateful spiteful people #but yknow. just wanted to point out that they're also gullible and easily falling for propaganda #discussions of racism #politics #and because TERFs keep interacting with my fucking posts #PLEASE go away #STOP TRYING TO CONVINCE ME THAT TRANSPHOBIA IS BASED ON ANY LOGIC #IT'S FUCKING NOT SO SHUT UP WORK ON YOURSELF GET BETTER FRIENDS AND BETTER VIEWS

[transmascpetewentz]

"It's just transphobia" and "it's just misogyny:" two sides of the transandrophobic coin that tries to force trans men into binaries that we do not belong in

#wentz.txt #transandrophobia #intersectional feminism #<- transandrophobia = intersection of transphobia and misogyny against transmascs #if it was just transphobia then it wouldn't share all these characteristics with misogyny to #and if it was just misogyny then cis women wouldn't have systemic power over transmascs which they do lmao #radfems say 'it's just misogyny' and neo radfems say 'it's just transphobia' #both are reducing a complex form of oppression and shared experiences to fit into a neat little box and shut down actual discussion

[technoxenoholic]

"thank you for not referring to this [misgendering] with [correct pronouns], i find calling people [correct pronouns] confusing"

i hope you choke on your drink

#stfu blue #discussion of misgendering #discussion of transphobia #discussion of exorsexism #the instance i saw was about they/them #but i've seen it before about other pronouns. just not this explicitly phrased

[pocketsizedquasar]

TPOC-Prioritized writings on anti-transmasculinity / transandrophobia

transandrophobia / anti-transmasculinity are both theories that have been spearheaded primarily by trans poc, particularly Black transmascs and transfemmes.

unfortunately, as with Everything created by queer and trans poc, particularly Black queer ppl, white trans ppl (regardless of gender, and regardless of whether they "believe" in this form of oppression or not) have coopted these theories and dominated these conversations, such that both "sides" of the "discourse" are divorced entirely from the racial connotations in which these theories were created, and the ways in which they were created specifically as an intervention against white feminism, and to highlight the ways multiple marginalizations affect the marginalization of masculinity. these are theories that explicitly interact with and can only be understood in conjunction with transmisogyny, as well as other oppressions like racism and misogynoir.

*"anti-transmasculinity" as a term and theory was coined by Black trans folks (some of whom's writings are linked below), and is specifically a theory within the context of Black transfeminism antiBlackness, and transmisogynoir, and cannot be divorced from that context. i try be very intentional about my use of the terms 'anti-transmasculinity' and 'transandrophobia' in different places here, because i do not want to dilute the former’s very particular context.

anyway, here's a list of miscellaneous writings on the subjects, with a priority for collecting writing from trans poc (not all of the authors are tpoc, but this list was intended to prioritize tpoc voices). the intention of this is not to be a be-all end-all on the subject, nor exalt any one of these individuals or pieces as exclusively ~correct~ or whatever, but to combat the whitewashed nature of these discussions online, and raise awareness to the myriad of people speaking on this subject. (nor do i claim to speak for any of them, or claim that any of them speak for me. i tried to make sure i didn't platform blatant racists, zionists, transmisogynists, or other bigots, but i'm not pretending to be 100% accurate about that.)

they aren't in any particular order (except the first one, which i think is an extremely foundational text for anti-transmasculinity theory as delineated by its creators, within the context of antiblackness and transmisogyny, and necessary reading to understand anti-transmasculinity as a theory). I tried to group all the links from the same authors together.

This is a non-exhaustive list! I will likely come back and add more writings as I find them. please feel free to recommend to me any works to include (including your own! especially if you yourself are a Black trans person or a trans POC).

Now with an Archived Read-more Link!

Racial-Class Paternalism and the Trojan Horse of Anti-transmasculinity by Nsámbu Za Suékama. if you read nothing else from this list, read this.

“But even as TME struggles escape the mainstream imagination, they persist, and are often both fueling and being fueled by the war on trans women and transfeminine people. Nothing makes this clearer than in how a Western binary system triangulates that war with Anti-transmasculinity. This is why I say that Anti-transmasculinity is a Trojan horse for Transmisogyny. Like the wooden horse in the Greek myth, it might not seem like what it is, for its actual contents and character are invisible, but at the heart of it, there is a violent campaign going on that is key to how the West aims to lay seige to its civilizational "enemies." And, like the walls of the city of Troy, materialist transfeminism has fortified the opposition to Western domination, in such a way that to overcome the stronghold requires a new strategy for the Man, one that follows up the open and vicious attacks on TMA people with a different, more hidden form of warfare.”

“today’s gender paternalism frames any manhood and masculine embodiment outside of (western) cisheteronormativity as not just biologically illegitimate but also the result of a barbaric threat to civilization. And who typically figures as the face of that barbarism but the Black trans woman? Materialist transfeminism has to theorize Anti-transmasculinity.”

"Non-Men", maGes, and Black Masculinities by genderfugitive / disrupthehuman

One such argument, which is really a collection of arguments but can be consolidated into one, is that trans men are attempting to take a place alongside cis men in the hierarchy of patriarchy. In other words, while they may not have been so before naming themselves as trans men, they are aspiring to be oppressors. This employs a number of rhetorical devices that I have identified before including the idea that trans men are “betraying” cis womanhood and therefore should be seen as threats unless they act as footsoldiers for transmisogyny. The problem with this is that it treats trans manhoods as embodiments that exist as something which merely aspires to be cis manhood.

"For Those Seeking Fight or Flight: Black Trans*feminist Nihilism" / primer on transmisogynoir by genderfugitive / disrupthehuman (not about anti-transmaculinity specifically (though it does come up), but a very good + important read on Black transfeminism & transmisogynoir, so I'm including it)

anti-transmasculinity needs its own theorizing outside of general "transphobia" by genderfugitive / disrupthehuman

anti-transmasculinity & antiblackness inherently linked (& another) both by genderfugitive / disrupthehuman

There is a hidden epidemic of violence against transmasculine people by Orion Rodriguez

a thread master post linking to multiple threads about anti transmasculinity by Salem L. Void / thewarmvoid

a thread on anti-transmasculinity as an epistemic injustice (translated) originally by magicspeedwagon in French; English translation by Salem L. Void / thewarmvoid

Not transmasc invisibility, but erasure by Salem L. Void / thewarmvoid

Girlboy Boygirl Blues - antitransmasculinity as a denial of individual history & more by Salem L. Void / thewarmvoid

"irl we just kiss" - ‘transmasc vs transfem’ discourse & reactionary ‘boys vs girls’ politics in trans spaces by Salem L. Void / thewarmvoid

transmascs & being treated as predatory by Salem L. Void / thewarmvoid

transmasc mental health statistics by Salem L. Void / thewarmvoid

violent anti-transmasculine hate crimes by Salem L. Void / thewarmvoid

thread on examples of systemic anti-transmasculinity by magicspeedwagon

a thread on anti-transmasculinity and its erasure by storyjunkie

anti transmasculinity & transmisogyny and the degendering of Black people by afrodykee

anti transmasculinity & transmisogyny cannot be theorized in opposition to each other by afrodykee

white transfeminism's anti-transmasculinity by afrodykee

Black trans people & erasure of TPOC voices from the trans community by thatspookyagent

transmasculine nonwhite expereince by thatspookyagent

trans men being silenced by thatspookyagent

queer POC being pushed out of conversations by thatspookyagent

cis women's harm to trans men by novascotioducktoller w/ addition about TMOC by thatspookyagent

medical violence in anti transmasculinity by Caleb / sethpuertoluna

example of medical anti transmasculinity by Dominick / transguyenergy

response to inclusion of a trans man in an ad (thread) by Dominick / transguyenergy

anti-transmasculinity around periods by Dominick / transguyenergy

anti-transmasculinity towards pregnant trans men by Dominick / transguyenergy

transitioning as a transmasc of color by gendercriminals

white (cis) women & racist transandrophobia by dead-lavender-society

transandrophobia as an indigenous trans man by petrichorvoices

examples of transandrophobia by transvermin

the “lost lesbian” narrative & antitransmasculinity by vaguefiend

cis women & transandrophobia by vaguefiend

intersectionality & transandrophobia by visible-schizo-spectrum

more transandrophobia from cis women by cock-holliday

tl;dr : there’s LOTS of theory and discussions out there abt anti-transmasculinity, transandrophobia, how these things relate to other forms of transphobia, how it interacts with other marginalizations, most especially race, and the ways in which it affects transmascs. this information is everywhere. it’s out there. y’all (white ppl) are just refusing to engage with it.

#trans #lgbtq #queer #transphobia #transandrophobia #anti transmasculinity #transmisogyny #racism #long post #quasartalks #been compliling this for ages but i think it's finally at a point where i feel comfortable posting it #like i said though it is very much subject to change! i would love to add more things to this #it is extremely shitty that discussions on antitransmasculinity and transandrophobia have been dominated on here by racist yt ppl and their #token trans poc that they so clearly are just using as a shield against when ppl call them out on aforementioned racism. #anyway. dont bother clowning on this post i will just block <3 #so much of this 'discourse' boils down to: transmascs and trans men (esp transmascs of color) saying: 'hey i experience this thing' #and other ppl (esp white ppl!) going 'no you don't.' it's so blatant lmao #it's just the complete denial of our Authority to talk about our own experiences. we are not trusted to be authorities on our own lives. #which. where have i heard that before. smells like racism. smells like misogyny. #also bc ppl can't read: none of this means transmascs have it worse than transfemmes; that transfemmes oppress transmascs; or that these #-experiences ONLY happen to transmascs. those are all extremely bad faith readings of these discussions. #AND ALSO to the (especially white) transmascs who also can't read and take these discussions as excuses to be racist & transmisogynist: #we cannot combat transandrophobia & anti transmasculinity without combating transmisogyny. they are linked. #anyway. good night

[rjalker]

Like people literally just take all the factual statements about how trans women and AMAB nonbinary are oppressed by misogyny and then turn those statements around so they can use //the opposite// form of that statement to oppress trans men and AFAB nonbinary people and it's like, no people, that's not how this works.

This is real life, this is not a video game. Misogyny is not a status effect you can become immune to by activating the Trans Your Gender ability.

Misogynyists do not stop oppressing you just because you're not actually a woman. If you were assigned female at birth, literally all they care about is your assigned sex at birth. They do not give two shits about your actual gender identity.

#misogyny #feminism #I'm just copying and pasting the tags from the other post because I'm lazy okay #trans inclusive feminism #transphobia #exorsexism #transandrophobia #mispergeny #discussion of misogyny #discussion of exorsexism #discussion of transandrophobia #treiphobia #transandromisia #discussion of transphobia #discussion of treiphobia #discussion of mispergeny #trans #transgender #nonbinary #misogyny is systemic