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captainwidowspring · 1 year

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Hello again CaptainWidowSpring,

I am UsernamesSuck_44 on Ao3, and what I'd like to ask you about has pretty much nothing to do with Marvel's Civil War, but it is something that I want your opinion on, because you've proven to be an incredible analyst, so I'm moving it to here. With that said, what I'm going to talk about is a real-world thing with genuine controversy, so if you don't feel comfortable talking about it, then ignore everything I'm about to write.

Over the last 2 months we've had an incredibly in-depth and analytical discussion about Wanda Maximoff and her actions across the MCU, and I loved every bit of what we've said. But now I'd like to ask you about the... controversy surrounding the character, and Elizabeth Olsen herself. As you most likely know, in the comics Wanda is half-Romani (though she is generally drawn as lighter-skinned), and I'm told she is Jewish. The MCU version of the character is neither of these things, so some people have gotten angry at Marvel for supposedly whitewashing the character. Do you think there is any merit to that?

That's only part of what I'd like to ask about though, and this is the part I'm really concerned about. Now, there's no denying that Elizabeth Olsen is a wonderful actress, and without her we wouldn't have the amazing character that is MCU Wanda. But even aside from the whitewashing accusation, there is some controversy around Olsen herself. You may have heard about it before, but I'm gonna recap anyway: on three separate occasions Lizzie has used a certain Romani word that could be seen as a racial slur to describe Wanda. She said it twice during the promotional tour for Age of Ultron: once in an interview, which you can find on YouTube by searching "Elizabeth Olsen is racist", and once that is not on camera but is still well-documented; she appeared once on the Graham Norton Show when promoting AoU, and allegedly she said that word again, and Norton told her it was offensive. I don't know what her reaction to that was, because none of this is on camera, since it was all edited out of the episode. I think it's worth pointing out that Lizzie has never been back on Graham Norton's show in the 8 years since. The third time was on a podcast when promoting WandaVision; she used the word again to describe Wanda's Halloween costume. All three times people have gotten angry and accused her of being a racist. Here are a few examples:

https://www.mic.com/p/as-a-romani-witch-i-cant-stand-wandavision-63495123https://www.tumblr.com/earnestdesire/644224777695952896/trigger-warning-g-slurhttps://imperiuswrecked.tumblr.com/post/683507607922720768/if-you-are-still-defending-elizabeth-olsen-to-thishttps://www.tumblr.com/tonkysexist

I can't exactly say these people are wrong for feeling offended, as they certainly have a right to feel attacked. Even just asking about this feels wrong, because it could be seen as me saying "Elizabeth Olsen is racist and her character is offensive. Help me deny those facts."

So what do you think about this? Were Olsen's remarks racist? Was it done out of bigotry, or ignorance? If it was ignorance is that even a valid excuse? Does MCU Wanda represent cultural erasure? Even if this isn't as awful of a thing as I'm worrying, what would happen if she said it (or God forbid, something worse) again on a future press tour? Should I even be questioning this instead of just writing her off entirely like a lot of people have? Do I even have the authority to be talking about this? I don't want to stop loving Wanda, because I feel a very deep connection with her, but knowing that she might be rooted in bigotry and racism does put a damper on my enthusiasm.

Again, if you don't feel comfortable talking about such a sensitive topic, then feel free to just ignore this entirely.

You are not wrong for being desirous of more information about these accusations. It is quite good to not blindly accept such charges, as pondering them enables one to gain a better understanding of the situation. Anyone can be so reflective, this allows for many different perspectives on the situation. Indeed, it is quite beneficial to engage in critical thinking.

I do not think Elizabeth Olsen's comments were racist. Here is why. For one thing, it is likely that she quite simply didn't know that some people consider the g-word to be a slur; it is often seen as just another way to describe the Roma people. And the term is not exactly uncommon; there is a breed of horse called the Gypsy Vanner, for example. And while she has been told of some people's dislike of that word, she might have just forgotten due to the amount of time that has passed since then, especially if the word continued to have no negative connotations for her.

But also, she clearly was not using the word with malicious intent. She was just using the word like any other adjective. For example, some people have gotten upset that, during the interviews for Age of Ultron, when describing Wanda and Pietro's lifestyle, she used the g-word in conjunction with the word vagabond: and they have taken this to mean that Olsen views the Roma as thieves. I do not think this is the case, however. First of all, while vagabond can mean thief, it can also just mean a person who wanders from place to place, and this conceivably could be the definition she was using. And while she does at times talk about how Wanda and Pietro had to steal things, she emphasized that they did so because they had to, not because they were bad people or particularly predisposed to thievery: so in any case the g-word was in no way intended as a conveyance of negativity.

And on the Graham Norton Show, after Norton told Olsen that he found the word offensive, apparently Jeremy Renner and Mark Ruffalo, who were with her, started chanting it. Olsen did not join them, so it appears that she is perfectly willing to not say the word if it offends people.

I read an article about the subject that I thought provided a good perspective, and here are two quotes from that article:

"There is the risk, of course, that we stumble into the realm of the 'noble savage' and over-idealize the Roma or our fictionalized notions of gypsies in the process, much like people often do with Native Americans…But clearly this is not the same thing as being a 'nasty racist.' Imagining that the American Indians were all peaceful and at one with nature may be inaccurate and naïve, but it’s not in the same ballpark as thinking they’re subhuman."

"Is Stevie Nicks—who described herself in a recent NPR interview as a 'freewheeling, roller-skating witch that I am'—a racist for her song ‘Gypsy?’ Do the lyrics strike you as a slanderous assault on the Roma people? No more than Olsen’s excited discussion of her cool 'Gypsy' costume. Context matters. So does empathy. Either one without the other and we risk falling prey to the whims of outrage and offense and, yes, of being an asshole for no reason, too."

Perhaps Olsen could be be a bit more careful about using that word in the future because of how upsetting it is for some people, but at the same time it is understandable how she would not see that word as bad, especially since some Roma actually prefer that word. If she said it again and it sparked great displeasure, the best thing to do would be to explain the situation to her. I agree with Valkyrieandstrangeridingaragorn, I think there must be intention for it to be racist, attacking someone for something they genuinely did not know was disagreeable is not very helpful.

Now for Wanda. The good news is, MCU Wanda does not represent cultural erasure, and is not rooted in bigotry and racism.

As you noted, some people are upset that Wanda was not clearly shown to be Jewish or Roma. The thing about this is, there’s really no indication that she wasn’t these things either. Her religious status is not brought up at all, so it is open to interpretation. As for her ethnicity, what is made clear by the movies is that she is Sokovian, so she is Eastern European. But this does not mean she is not Roma: and as we know from the word Olsen used, such a thing was definitely a consideration for her character. And there are hints of it in places, like how Wanda dressed up as a Sokovian Fortune Teller in WandaVision, fortunetelling is a traditional Roma occupation. And in any case, the MCU does not always bring up the religious status and ethnicity of its characters. For example, Steve is Irish and a Christian: but the fact that he is Irish never came up in any of his appearances, and the only reference to his religion was the line in The Avengers when he said, “There’s only one God, ma’am, and I’m pretty sure He doesn’t dress like that,” which isn't very informative. Not focusing on a character’s cultural identity is not something new to the MCU, they are often unable to figure out how to work such a thing into their stories.

And if Steve's cultural background was not explored in any of his appearances, when he has had more screen time at this point than Wanda has, it is really not surprising that the same thing happened to Wanda. There being no mentions of Wanda being Jewish is not really surprising, as such a thing has never played a major role in any of her comic stories either. Really the only thing that connected her to Judaism was the fact that she was Magneto's daughter for a time, and he is a Jew. But that has since been retconned, and in any case, she did not meet Magneto until she was an adult. As for Wanda's race, it has been retconned several times. She and Pietro were white Europeans until 1974, and then they became Americans until 1979. It is at this point that they became the children of Magneto and Magda, which is where the Romani heritage appeared. Then around 2014, they were retconned back into being the biological children of the Maximoffs, who were white Europeans. So the European heritage is definitely there, portraying Wanda as European is not at all inaccurate. And again, Wanda's background is not something that the MCU has paid much attention to, so it is not surprising that her being Roma was never significantly acknowledged.

And there is nothing wrong with casting Olsen as Wanda; she deserves the role, being quite talented in it. And despite Wanda's race being retconned multiple times, as you noted she has generally been drawn as white or white-passing, so casting a white person to play her was a natural choice. And there are plenty of other actors who look like their characters but are not the exact same race, that is not a new phenomenon. Indeed, such a standard of representation would be difficult to maintain, and very restrictive. Olsen being cast as Wanda is not whitewashing.

Here are a few other good sources on the matter:

https://mdccanon.tumblr.com/post/693769772228345856/well-for-wandavision-i-guess-it-was-more-for-the

https://mdccanon.tumblr.com/post/694330356578516992/the-problem-with-elizabeth-olsen-and-not-chris

#elizabeth olsen #wanda maximoff #pro wanda maximoff #long post #answering asks

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anotherwellkeptsecret · 6 years

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earnestdesire replied to your post “Can we get a comic where Sherlock calls John Daddy and John gets all...”

Personally, I like the idea of Sherlock referring to John as "Daddy" when he's talking to Rosie, and John just... reacting... inappropriately.

I AM IN LOVE???!??!??!??????????????????

#earnestdesire

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janetsnakehole02 · 2 years

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Every time I see someone praising Wandavision for it’s “unique storytelling” I want to fucking SCREAM because after knowing what I know about how harmful this show’s tropes are to the Romani people I can’t enjoy it. I just can’t. And it’s out here getting nominated for Emmys and PCAs and a bunch of awards all while profiting off of their trauma. That’s so FUCKING despicable it makes my blood boil. The way Elizabeth Olsen said the most racist shit about Wanda’s Halloween costume and it’s still out here getting praise because the creators don’t care enough to educate themselves. They turned a Romani Jewish character INTO A WHITE ONE. And no one’s batting a fucking eye?!?! And as if that isn’t bad enough on its own, they started making references to her Romani heritage in a show that’s about the whitewashed version of her. If you don’t know anything about this I highly recommend checking out @earnestdesire who is Romani and has written extensively about the racist tropes Wandavision has perpetuated. It’s not okay to erase the voices of a group of people that already has so little of it in the world around us to begin with so PLEASE educate yourselves it’ll really help

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mcufandomhatespeopleofcolor · 3 years

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I am I supposed to hate mcu Wanda because she's whitewashed or is it okay to like her anyway?

hi anon!

it is hard to hear that something you like is also, under your nose, horrible and bigoted in some way, shape, or form. i hope i do not come off as harsh here, but i also want to be firm. but i also might not be the best person to speak on this topic (so i'll link this: earnestdesire, a romani marvel fan, has a wonderfully in-depth post for folks with the same conflicted feelings as you. check it out!)

mostly-- i'm also concerned that you're asking us for permission to enjoy mcu wanda. we cannot decide what you are "supposed" to feel for you. and anyway, who's ever in control about what they feel about anything? like her, hate her, whatever. what you feel is not what i personally care about. imo it is your actions that matter more.

there is something to be said for critical consumption, sure. (saying this is also not a get-out-of-jail-free card or excuse for harmful behavior.) there is also something to be said about how consuming something, in some way, supports that same something. (this can be easily remedied through pirating. not that we, ever, would support the heinous crimes of pirating, ever... who would even watch movies online illegally.. the horrors.. oh.. my...)

like her or hate her, this is something that can be agreed on: we should want better for mcu wanda. we should want more than what the mcu "gave" us by taking away from and disregarding marginalized communities.

so, to reiterate a few things from this post (also by earnestdesire!): do something.

help raise awareness of mcu wanda's whitewashedness, and the way the mcu uses her to promote antiromanism, anti-semitism, and racism. when you can, bring up the issue with actors, with writers, with directors. do what you can to amplify the issue. bring it up with other fans, your friends, make it a topic that is known, an issue that will not die out.

take this elaboration with a grain of salt (it's mostly my opinion, so anyone lmk if i'm overstepping, or if there's an issue i couldn't catch):

feel whatever you want about her. educate yourself, and come to your own terms with it. take care of yourself through the whole process because the process can be hard. and of course it's hard: this is something you love, which is also doing harm. it's okay for it to be hard. and be careful not to try justifying it. whatever you feel at the end, you will have put thought into it, and you will be aware of the harm it perpetuates, and you will be better off for it. whatever you feel, you will be able to, to some extent, prevent yourself from perpetuating that same harm where you might have been unaware of it before.

your actions, however small the effect might be, still have an effect.

it's not so much about whether it's okay or not to like something harmful. guilt is not the goal here. it's about what you do with that knowledge. it's about thinking on how you approach that thing, and interact with that thing, while also taking into consideration how that might effect the lives of minorities in or out of your life -- and then applying that thought process to your actions.

so you like a form of media that is harmful, in some way, to a minority. this happens all the time. at this point it's like, whatever to me. it's the mcu, big whoop. i care more about this: what are you doing to try and ease that harm? not solve it, you are not atlas, you are not marvel, you do not order the mouse, and solving the mcu's bigotry is not your responsibility. but how do you help, in some way, to ease that harm? how do you help decrease the amount of fandom racism in mcu wanda spaces? moreover, how do you help decrease antiromanism?

the issue of wanda's whitewashing is not about your, or anybody else's, guilt. (this is not to say it is meaningless, but it is also not the focus.) it is about the harm mcu wanda has done, and about decreasing our perpetuity of that harm, and others' perpetuity, where we can, however we can.

like her or hate her. whatever you do, just don't ignore her.

- mod wynn

#mod wynn #asks #anonymous #wanda maximoff #whoops! got carried away here.#(post is very long when taking into consideration the posts i linked as well. sorry anon)#anyway; followers feel free to add on!#and lmk if i misconstrued anything :]

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letoscrawls · 3 years

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@/earnestdesire is romani and has several very well written posts about the anti romani problems

i saw your other ask but i’m posting this anyway in case anyone’s interested!

#ask

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stony-ao3-feed · 4 years

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Look Up at the Stars

Read it on AO3

by earnestdesire

Tony Stark isn't Iron Man, except for the ways he always will be. Steve Rogers isn't Captain America, except for the ways he can't help trying.

Tony Stark is a part-time professor with a precocious teenage student named Peter Parker Rogers. Peter's father is a police officer, and the sexiest thing Tony has ever seen. Peter is a genius, Tony is a moron, and Rogers is really, really overprotective. That would all be fine (really, it's fine, Tony is handling it, Jesus) until the criminal organization who once kidnapped Tony decides to try again.

Steve Rogers knows better than to cross professional boundaries. His son's professor: Out of bounds. Billionaire inventor of most of his team's best tech: Out of bounds. The victim he's assigned to protect: WAY out of bounds. Steve is captain of the best Strategic Response team in the NYPD, so he's used to navigating dangerous terrain.

Tony doesn't really do boundaries. He's trying, but Steve Rogers keeps blurring all the lines.

Steve may not be a genius, but he knows chemistry when he feels it. Probably. He'll need to keep Tony Stark alive if he wants to test that hypothesis.

***

SPOILERS IN THE TAGS

Words: 5282, Chapters: 2/?, Language: English

Fandoms: The Avengers (Marvel) - All Media Types, The Avengers (Marvel Movies), Marvel Cinematic Universe, The Avengers - Ambiguous Fandom, Marvel

Rating: Mature

Warnings: Graphic Depictions Of Violence, Major Character Death

Characters: Tony Stark, Steve Rogers, Peter Parker, Pepper Potts, James "Rhodey" Rhodes, Natasha Romanov (Marvel), Clint Barton, Phil Coulson, Pietro Maximoff, Wanda Maximoff, Sam Wilson (Marvel), Vision (Marvel), Sharon Carter (Marvel), Indries Moomji, Thor (Marvel), Bruce Banner

Relationships: Steve Rogers/Tony Stark, Happy Hogan/Pepper Potts, Clint Barton/Phil Coulson, James "Bucky" Barnes/Sam Wilson, Wanda Maximoff/Vision, Carol Danvers/James "Rhodey" Rhodes, Maria Hill/Natasha Romanov, Peter Parker & Steve Rogers & Tony Stark

Additional Tags: Police Officer Steve Rogers, Teacher Tony Stark, High School Student Peter Parker, Alternate Universe - No Powers, Organized Crime, Past Pepper Potts/Tony Stark, Past Sharon Carter/Steve Rogers, Bisexual Steve Rogers, Bisexual Tony Stark, Canon-Typical Sexist Language, Canon-Typical Violence, Howard Stark's A+ Parenting, Trans Steve Rogers, Kidnapping, Avengers Family, POV Alternating

Read it on AO3

#stony #fanfiction #ao3feed #superhusbands #stevetony

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ao3feed-sambucky · 4 years

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Look Up at the Stars

read it on the AO3 at https://ift.tt/34GvrbH

by earnestdesire

Tony Stark isn't Iron Man, except for the ways he always will be. Steve Rogers isn't Captain America, except for the ways he can't help trying.

Tony doesn't really do boundaries. He's trying, but Steve Rogers keeps blurring all the lines.

Steve may not be a genius, but he knows chemistry when he feels it. Probably. He'll need to keep Tony Stark alive if he wants to test that hypothesis.

***

SPOILERS IN THE TAGS

Words: 5282, Chapters: 2/?, Language: English

Fandoms: The Avengers (Marvel) - All Media Types, The Avengers (Marvel Movies), Marvel Cinematic Universe, The Avengers - Ambiguous Fandom, Marvel

Rating: Mature

Warnings: Graphic Depictions Of Violence, Major Character Death

read it on the AO3 at https://ift.tt/34GvrbH

#Bucky #Captain America #Winter Soldier #Sam Wilson #James Barnes #Falcon #SamBucky #BuckySam #IFTTT

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practicefortheheart · 4 years

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Also, I'm writing a long-form fanfic that is canon compliant (with the seven novels) right now. I use earnestdesire on a03, and it's called "Harry Potter & the Rest of the Story." You can check it out, if you like subscribing to stuff. No pressure! (...Obviously.) I also have a Sherlock fic you might like, since it's a soulmate fic. Love your work!

I’ll have a look at those too! :)

#drarry #drarry fic recs #sherlock fic recs #heeeeeyyeaaaaah

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ao3feed-stony · 4 years

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Look Up at the Stars

by earnestdesire

Tony Stark isn't Iron Man, except for the ways he always will be. Steve Rogers isn't Captain America, except for the ways he can't help trying.

Tony doesn't really do boundaries. He's trying, but Steve Rogers keeps blurring all the lines.

Steve may not be a genius, but he knows chemistry when he feels it. Probably. He'll need to keep Tony Stark alive if he wants to test that hypothesis.

***

SPOILERS IN THE TAGS

Words: 5282, Chapters: 2/?, Language: English

Fandoms: The Avengers (Marvel) - All Media Types, The Avengers (Marvel Movies), Marvel Cinematic Universe, The Avengers - Ambiguous Fandom, Marvel

Rating: Mature

Warnings: Graphic Depictions Of Violence, Major Character Death

source https://archiveofourown.org/works/26175859

#stony #steve rogers #tony stark #iron man #captain america #fan fiction #ao3 stony feed #stony fan

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ao3feed-harrydraco · 4 years

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by earnestdesire

Harry Potter lost his wife less than a year ago.

He's still the youngest Head Auror in history. He's still father to three wonderful, unpredictable, indomitable children. He's still an uncle, a godfather, a best friend, a surrogate son. He's still the Boy Who Lived Twice.

Harry Potter is still alive. Somehow. And so is Draco Malfoy.

--- EXCLUSIVE! BREAKING NEWS!

The Wizarding World is abuzz with news that HERMIONE GRANGER-WEASLEY (closest confidant of the Boy Who Lived, magical rights attorney, and pregnant with her third child) has signed a contract with IPSWITCH PUBLISHERS. The beautiful and brainy Ms. G-W is writing the PENULTIMATE HISTORICAL ACCOUNT of the Battle of Hogwarts, including interviews with all the most prominent DARK ARTS DESTROYERS. Surely the private Mr. Potter will grant her an exclusive interview? We wish her a pint of Felix Felicis, although the BRIGHTEST WITCH OF OUR AGE is unlikely to need it. Preorder your copy from Flourish & Blott's today!

Words: 2657, Chapters: 1/?, Language: English

Fandoms: Harry Potter - J. K. Rowling

Rating: Mature

Warnings: Major Character Death, Rape/Non-Con, Underage

Categories: F/F, F/M, M/M

Characters: Harry Potter, Draco Malfoy, Hermione Granger, Ron Weasley, Potter-Weasley Family, Scorpius Malfoy, Teddy Lupin, Pansy Parkinson, Blaise Zabini, Neville Longbottom, Luna Lovegood, Angelina Johnson, Alicia Spinnet

Relationships: Draco Malfoy/Harry Potter, Harry Potter/Ginny Weasley, Hermione Granger/Ron Weasley, Angelina Johnson/George Weasley, Teddy Lupin/Victoire Weasley, Astoria Greengrass/Original Male Character(s), Audrey Weasley/Percy Weasley, Fleur Delacour/Bill Weasley, Arthur Weasley/Molly Weasley, Pansy Parkinson/Blaise Zabini, Millicent Bulstrode/Flora Carrow, Alicia Spinnet/Original Female Character(s), Neville Longbottom/Original Female Character(s), Luna Lovegood/Rolf Scamander

Additional Tags: Past Harry Potter/Ginny Weasley, Past Astoria Greengrass/Draco Malfoy, Scorpius Malfoy & Albus Severus Potter Friendship, Widower Harry Potter, Demisexual Harry Potter, Gay Draco Malfoy, Harry Potter Next Generation, Harry Potter is a Good Parent, Draco Malfoy is a Good Parent, Consensual Infidelity, Auror Harry Potter, Potions Master Draco Malfoy, Draco Malfoy & Pansy Parkinson Friendship, Pregnancy, Professor Neville Longbottom, Slow Burn, Past Child Abuse, Past Rape/Non-con, Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder - PTSD, Eventual Happy Ending

#ao3feed #fanfic #drarry #harry/draco #ao3feed-harrydraco #ao3

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ao3feed-harryginny · 4 years

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Harry Potter & the Rest of the Story

by earnestdesire

Harry Potter lost his wife less than a year ago.

Harry Potter is still alive. Somehow. And so is Draco Malfoy.

--- EXCLUSIVE! BREAKING NEWS!

Words: 2657, Chapters: 1/?, Language: English

Fandoms: Harry Potter - J. K. Rowling

Rating: Mature

Warnings: Major Character Death, Rape/Non-Con, Underage

Categories: F/F, F/M, M/M

Read it on the AO3 at https://ift.tt/37hS8k4

#Harry Potter #Ginny Weasley #HarryGinny #Hinny #ao3feed #fanfic

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ao3feed-scarletvision · 4 years

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Look Up at the Stars

by earnestdesire

Tony Stark isn't Iron Man, except for the ways he always will be. Steve Rogers isn't Captain America, except for the ways he can't help trying.

Tony doesn't really do boundaries. He's trying, but Steve Rogers keeps blurring all the lines.

Steve may not be a genius, but he knows chemistry when he feels it. Probably. He'll need to keep Tony Stark alive if he wants to test that hypothesis.

***

SPOILERS IN THE TAGS

Words: 5282, Chapters: 2/?, Language: English

Fandoms: The Avengers (Marvel) - All Media Types, The Avengers (Marvel Movies), Marvel Cinematic Universe, The Avengers - Ambiguous Fandom, Marvel

Rating: Mature

Warnings: Graphic Depictions Of Violence, Major Character Death

from AO3 works tagged 'Wanda Maximoff/Vision' https://ift.tt/34GvrbH via IFTTT

#scarlet vision #scarletvision #the vision #wanda maximoff #scarlet witch #IFTTT

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