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randomnameless · 3 months

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Reverse uno card : Jugdral edition

2014 : "yay, i can't wait for a Judgral remake, with updated graphics!!!"

2024 : "gods please no remake"

What happened in ten years to make me dread the remake I would have sold my soul for back in the days?

Well... IS's policies and new writing, mainly.

While I was joking about "Genealogy of the Holy Self Insert" in 2015, I still had faith in eventual Jugdral remakes. Sure, we were in the big Fateswakening era where the only things I could frown at IS were the "writings" worshipping self inserts (Ryoma being jealous of Corn's talents, when Corn was like, 5?) - but I still had hope for a more "serious" FE, and I first I was very delighted by FE15 - no self insert, a more "serious" setting, no hyperbolic time chambers to try to explain in watsonian words why second gens exist, etc...

But there was still something ringing dead wrong with FE15, which I only noticed thanks to FE16 and its years of discourse - at one point, IS's writing went in a certain direction that makes it impossible, imo, for us to have a "correct" Jugdral remake, as long as IS still follows this direction.

I'm not talking about uwufest - even if it is part of the larger problem - but back in FE15, I remember being really pissed at the schizophrenia of the plot : saying one thing and the inverse at the same time.

The narration reminds us of the classic Kaga lesson : whatever madness exists in dragon/gods, a greater madness/evil lurks in the heart of men.

And yet, we have the Hero (who was so cajoled by the plot that, at times, you have to wonder if Alm wasn't the devs's self insert, he's lavished with praises almost as extensively as Ike was!) saying nonsense - without being contradicted by characters at all (or when Celica does it, she admits later she's wrong) - like Duma being responsible, mainly, for the events that transpired in Valentia and, novelty that wouldn't have been in the original game since the character was made for the remake, Berkut's fall and madness.

By that point in the game, the player saw that Berkut hunts low class people for what he sees and perceives as sport, is the textbook classicist asshat noble, but has a lot of pression on his shoulders due to his role of being the heir of the Empire, pression that isn't alleviated at all by his Uncle who mocks him and refuses to give him a third chance... to fight against a person said uncle very well knows cannot be defeated by Berkut himself, especially as said Uncle pretended to "care" for him, only to pit him against his trueborn son whom he names his heir just before dying.

Point is : Berkut feels betrayed by Rudy and goes mad - because of this betrayal : Rudolph named him heir when he fully knew Alm was alive and was the true heir he always wanted, in Berkut's eyes, no matter what he did, it wouldn't have mattered to Rudolph since Rudolph planned on giving Alm his throne since day 1 - of course, without telling him a thing and making him believe he would one day become Emperor.

Is it Duma's fault that Berkut went off the deep-end in Part 4? Because Rudolph's shit gambit involved playing with the life of his nephew and crush it in a bid to have Alm unify the continent against Duma ? Or... it's just Rudolph being an asshole, not curbing the worst of his nephew tendencies (and in a larger part, of Rigel in general) ?

Now, Rinea. She too, is called one of Duma's victims, and yet, who pushed her in Duma's magic pyre that turns women in witches? Duma himself?

No.

Berkut, who already, when pissed tells her "silence woman" pushes his fiancée and love of his life in a pyre to sacrifice her, because in his grief and rage (caused by Rudy!!!) Rinea is only a pawn to be sacrificed to gain more power to kill Alm. Sure sure, Berkut is redeemed in death and Rinea - in a classic Kaga style writing that wasn't here made by Kaga since this plot is basically new so where the fuck does this sexism come from - forgives him and they both die and ascend to another plane of existence.

The point is, despite what Alm says, Berkut and Rinea's fates weren't caused by Duma's degeneration - but by Rudolph and Berkut's own actions.

Heck, I remember when I was sort of live-blogging my run back then, Desaix's greed and lust for power wasn't fueled by Mila's apathy : it wasn't Mila who burnt Celica's house and tried to cook Conrad, it was Desaix, and why Desaix did it? Because he wanted to become king. That's it, and that's all.

So why FE15 - while giving the Kaga message - still tries its hardest to pin the blame of everything "wrong that happened" on... dragon gods, refusing to acknowledge the own responsibilities of humans in their suffering?

I think we had that lunar dialogue at the end of FE15 (or in part 4?) where Clive (i think?) tells Alm without gods giving their blessings, people in Valentia will starve, and Alm saying that may be so, but ultimately Valentia will survive and work hard through those upcoming harsh times to demonstrate how humans, when they work together, can achieve things without needing to rely on Gods - basically, King Alm tells his people to starve now because Humanity will come out stronger afterwards, since they will have learnt to grow their own food without needing magic dragon blessings to make the ground fertile.

... yeah. That's definitely going to work.

FE15 took the Kaga lesson to try to hammer some "humanity fuck yeah!" Square JRPG message and it completely messed up what FE2 tried to say.

(I confess, retconning Duma'n'Mila in dragon gods like Naga from Archanea was a big part in this shitstorm - that was also retconned to explain Grima from FE13! - i mean Duma'n'Mila have to die because they're degenerating, but they didn't get the memo from Gotoh living overseas that degeneration can be stopped by using dragonstones, instead of being a fatality that must be dealt with death...)

Humans cannot be held responsible for what they did, everything BaD that happened is somehow due to the influence of dragon-gods : even if it means "suffering" and sacrificing a part of your population, this choice is a good one to get rid of the obviously nefarious influence of dragon-gods.

So, is it so surprising that FE16 - the most popular title in the franchise uwu - went in the same direction?

Even if it tried to mitigate the "gods BaD" spiel because the avatar - Billy - is the Goddess reborn, the thing is the CoS - aka the dragon - is blamed for humanity's mistakes through each route (AM dodges the question completely) and all routes end up with the dragon going away (her skull being cracked open, or she retires, or she dies off-screen, or she dies because the plot commands so unless you want, as the player, to shag her).

"But in VW, Claude reconsiders his initial stance!"

And yet, it is only off-screen that he seemingly becomes aware that Fodlan people are not superpals with Almyra because Almyra raids them, not because Rhea told them Almyrans are BaD, that's why he tries to negotiate - off-screen and post-game - some sort of ceasefire between the two parties, or at least make it so Almyra doesn't try to raid Fodlan every Thursday for their weekly dick measuring contest.

No matter the ending, Rhea retires and in the worst support, muses on her failings for "having turned a blind eye" to Fodlan and its people in her quest to resurrect Sothis : aka, Rhea (and the game, since Billy doesn't tell her anything) believes Fodlan's state is due to her inaction and not, you know, the action of the humans who lived in the continent and ruined it of their own volition.

Which is also what fuels the endless discourse about what kind of power she has - or not : Rhea BaD for using her power, but also BaD for not using it and letting humans to their own devices.

Supreme Leader's memetastic line from the trailers ring even more true : in Fodlan, Crusts are to blame for everything. For Adrestian being attracted to young women because otherwise without crests they surely wouldn't seek to bed a 12 years old Doro, for Miklan trying to murder his younger brother (and not because, at least FE16 wise, Miklan is a terrible person who is very jealous and not afraid to kill even a child to get what he feels like he deserves), and for people basically killing their wives/letting their daughters die to get a "suitable" heir.

Humanity/Humans can get a pass for doing horrible things (Berkut burning his fiancée alive) because those horrible things can sort of be linked to "dragon-gods", and so, the blame exclusively lays at their feet.

I am always reminded of that Obi-Wan reply to Anakin when Ani accuses him of having turned Padmé "against" him, Obi-Wan basically tells him he brought this upon himself.

Now, what would Obi-Wan tell a non-recruited Doro who blames the Goddess for the War, the leader she is actually protecting, started?

Billy is no Obi-Wan, so we are left in this limbo where characters are telling you everything wrong that happens in Fodlan is due to "dragon blood" aka their existence and presence, even dragons who blame themselves for "being blind" - but not once do we have the Kaga message, or an Obi-Wan reminding people that they have to take responsability for their own actions : Hanneman will blame crests (dragons) for having killed his sister, but not the man who forced her (marital abuse?) to bear him many heirs until one was "good enough" for him.

Claude blames dragons for creating, both literal and metaphorical walls between Fodlan and Almyra - and it's only in his best ending, after the game credits and off-screen that he seems to realise that those walls were built by Almyrans raiders.

"enough about the fodlan rant, what about jugdral?"

Jugdral was sort of unique for not having a giant eldritch abomination as a boss, unlike the later FE8, we never fight Loptyr in his "original" form, Loptyr is fought through his host, Julius.

And I love Jugdral because unlike Fodlan, the local evil death cult might stage a few skirmishes and manipulations here and there, but Jugdral people are... asses, in general.

Elliot will mount an army to seduce Raquie while Eldie is away - and it's not because Manfroy told him to seduce her, no, Elliot does it from his own will.

Reptor'n'Langobalt'n'Andrei rebel against Kurth and Azmur? Sure, Arvis is pulling some of their strings, but Reptor'n'Langobalt are ambitious, even without Manfroy whispering anything.

Arvis pulls out his gambit... with Manfroy's help (and blackmail?), but also because he genuinely thinks he can sacrifice lives to make HIS world a reality because HE has great ideas about how the world should be and will torch anyone who opposes him.

F!Lewyn, as much as I dislike the character, reminds the cast that while Travant's actions might seem justified to him and to the Thracian people, he is still a man who assaulted a bunch of randoms + non-combattants in a desert, amushed them and slaughtered them : no matter his reasons and how justified he was, Travant is still a criminal to Jugdral people.

In Jugdral, people do things and have to take responsability for it - Oldvis basically dies after losing everything he had - by Seliph's hand (and with his own participation!!) because Oldvis has to take responsability for what he did in Barhara. Ditto for Travant, who accepts to die if it means the peninsula will be united (tfw his son doesn't understand what he meant !).

Dragon blood and Dragon people are never blamed for the shitty state Jugdral is in in the 1st or even 2nd gen, if Danan turned Isaach in giant brothel, it's not Julius-Loptyr who asked him to do so, nor Manfroy.

At least, that was the case for the pre FE15/FEH/FE16 Jugdral.

Now...

While I want to blame FE16 for this shift, I know the roots are more ancient (FE15?), IS's writing seems to favour a certain narrative, aka people having sad and or complicated fates because of their brands and Holy Blood - when the ONLY case of having a fate tied to Holy Blood was the Curse of the Gae Bolg, aka a sibling quarrel between Dain and Noba that will eventually "curse" Noba descendants, but through the events of the game we know that curse is more like a prophecy : Quan doesn't die because he had Noba Holy Blood, Quan dies because Travant kills him in Yied. Why Travant kills him? FE5 reveals Quan and his forefathers are basically letting Thracians starve and refuse to "give" them arable lands, or even export food.

Now, did Travant kill Quan because Quan had major Noba Holy Blood, or because Quan (and his forefather)'s policies made Thracians so desperate that their king feels like he has to resort to murder to "save" his people?

The issue is more complicated than "he has Noba HB so I had to kill him".

Come FEH and we had, in 2018 (before FE16 but after FE15) this :

My blood has granted me gifts, it's true. I have expended every effort to be worthy of those gifts. That same blood makes it impossible for me to live a peaceful life. That's a lesson I learned from my mother...

Now, even if I was dissecting and hc'ing and posting about Saias a lot for 5 years, I fully understand Saias is a character with maybe 20 lines in FE5, so you can only dissect the script and theorise and read between invisible lines to get something about the character.

But this?

It might be a reference to Cowen's last words who basically tells him his job is to "pass on" his Fjalar HB, and how having major Fjalar HB was the reason why Manfroy tried to kill him when he was younger (his mother Aida died to protect him).

And yet, FEH here seems to imply Aida died because Saias had Fjalar HB, and not, y'know, died because Manfroy wanted to kill him due to this HB.

It wasn't HB who killed Aida, but Manfroy!

FE5 never reveals why - but if Fjalar HB was the reason why Manfroy targeted Saias, then why the fuck wasn't Oldvis iced earlier, since he has the same brand and blood?

In a way, Saias blaming HB here as the "reason" why his mother died and why he cannot live a "peaceful life" is similar to a Leif who would blame Quan'n'Ethlyn for being the reason why Travant and the Empire were after his life : what is to blame, their "blood" that makes people want to kill them, or the fuckers who want to kill them?

Granted those lines from FEH completely miss the point of Saias as a character - FE5!wise Saias is in a class that cannot use fire magic, when his HB automatically gives him the highest rank in fire magic, and he is funnily enough the only character who "retreats" in his death quote -> Saias doesn't "expend" every effort to be worthy of HB, he hides and doesn't use the abilities given by said HB!

We can say, mkay, this was just FEH trying to fit their "gods and their influence BaD" narrative and missing the real culprits, aka humans themselves (Manfroy is one!) - from FE15 - in Jugdral, even if it meant retconning a character no one cares about.

But then, last year, we had Galzus' FB :

You speak of the blood of the Sword Saint Od. Perhaps. Is that the reason you have been set on a path of violence and bloodshed?

Nyx says Galzus' "curse" isn't tied to his HB, but it's basically his regret at not having been able to save his daughter.

So far, it's completely the inverse of what I decried, so this was a good FB, right?

There is no doubt that the blood within you compels you to lead a cruel life. However, the loss of your daughter was the wedge that split your life into pieces and let the curse in.

Damn it Nyx, why???

Why Galzus's brand "compels him" to lead a cruel life - when it was just established that Galzus fell to despair and became a mercenary who kills for money after the loss of his daughter?

Before losing Mareeta, Galzus, at least per this FB, wasn't killing people right and left as the merc he now is (or was in FE5).

Now, much like Saias...

Why was Galzus left to roam around Jugdral with a toddler to begin with?

I had a daughter. When my wife died, I brought my daughter with me as I traveled around Jugdral.

This FB establishes that Galzus settled with Mareeta's biomom for a while, but when she died he "traveled around". Why Galzus couldn't return "home" and had to "travel around"?

You know the Ribaut family was devastated by our own House Isaach.

Timeline wise : Ribaut is already demolished during the prologue of FE4, and Mareeta is no older than Leif himself, which means she was born after Galzus' grandfather and Ayra's brother, aka, his uncle, beheaded his dad and demolished his kingdom. Galzus, in exile, had Mareeta, and then had to "travel around" Jugdral because his home had already been demolished by "House Isaach" -

Note how Ayra talks about the Ribaut (i prefer rivough but meh) family when she talks about her very own sister - Galzus' mother. Jugdral family trees being what they are, Shanan, Larcei, Scatach and Galzus are actually cousins, Galzus is Ayra's own nephew, just like Shanan!

Anyways, in FE4, the reason given behind Ribaut's destruction is their attack on Darna, so the Isaachian royals killed them.

Galzus' "cruel life" wasn't compelled by his HB, Galzus' life took a turn for the worst when his Uncle and Grandpa knocked at his door and slaughtered his entire family, destroying their Kingdom.

So why FEH tried to fit his backstory in some sort of "dragon blood is to blame" Fodlan narrative?? They at least acknowledge the bad blood (lel) between Isaach's royal family and Ribaut's, hell, Ayra even wants to say Mareeta is a part of Isaach's royal family in her FB with her son, so it's not to whitewash the Isaachian royal family because their units are more popular and would sell more...

Contrary to Saias, Galzus's writing and his FB seem to have been made by people who cared and didn't completely ignore what the character was about so... why this emphasis on his HB ??

Are we bound in post FE16 releases to have, at least with the current writing team, the excuse of "dragon blood is to blame" ? Galzus cannot blame the Isaachian Royal Family or even the slavers for his (and his daugher's!) fate, but he can blame his HB, aka, a non-entity?

Will HB be now used as a "responsibility free" card, because the fate a character suffers or their actions are only tied to said HB? Arvis will get a pass because his HB compelled him to save the world (tfw Victor prefered to "seduce" women instead), Lewyn will be lightly chided by his mom instead of receiving the beatdown he has in FE4 because his HB now makes him unable to stay in place? Ditto for Ced, Karin won't chew him out for abandoning his mother and sister because his HB compelled him to travel around, so in the end, dragons are to blame for him abandoning his sister and mother?

That's what I'm the most afraid in future Jugdral remakes, that had humans characters with human flaws in a crapsack/shitty verse, the insertion in a future remake of a very Squenix "but aksuhally gods and church bad" when Jugdral is the pinnacle of "the world sucks because people living in this world suck". No need for secret sects manipulating everything in the shadows like FE16's Agarthans, Chagall is a horrible person without needing Manfroy's help, and Hilda will not say "Holy Blood is to blame" when she tortures Tailte to death.

When Tailte is caught and Hilda'd, it's because she participated (or even commited) in parricide, and because her camp/army lost the battle. She doesn't die because of her HB, she dies because Hilda kills her, most likely, for having killed Reptor (Hilda wants to avenge her "father" when fought, i'm pretty sure she means her father in law aka Reptor!).

As befits a game called "Genealogy of the Holy War", people aren't targeted because of their HB, but they are targeted because they are part of a genealogy - see the Leif comparison earlier on : Leif is hunted because he is Quan's son, even if he doesn't have Noba major blood. Seliph is hunted because he is Siggy'n'Deedee's son, not because of his Baldo HB.

In FE4, Manfroy tells Julius Arvis was a thorn at their side because "Fjalar's ways" ran too strong in him - implying he had some moral fiber that would make him oppose the return of Loptyr (but those same "ways" didn't prevent him from torching his own brother and conquering the world...) - I will have to check the translation and og script, but was Saias targeted because he had Fjalar HB, or because he could develop the same moral fiber Arvis does in his later years, or just, because he is Arvis's son? Cowen seems to suggest it is FB, but we know Fjalar HB cannot harm Loptyr so... what was the true reason?

Blaming dragon-gods reduces the complexity of Jugdral's setting and characters - and in a post FEH world where tropes win character contests and sell a lot of alts if they are flanderised enough + a post FE15/16 world where characters, to be likeable enough, have to ditch their responsibilities or at least have the plot elude them to pin them instead on vague and non-important (gacha wise) gods, what is going to happen to Jugdral?

Fanfics are fanfics and people are free to write whatever they want - but I wonder (especially after Nopes and the plethora of 'golden endings' fics that ended up with the CoS as the big bad lol) if fics where Mareeta and Ced blaming their HB for their various hardships is going to become the new canon...

I seriously hope it will never, and it if happens then...

I guess I'll still yell at cloud and nerd about the 1990s versions of those games, completely ignoring the new releases (save for maybe updated artwork).

Tl;Dr : FEH makes me afraid Judgral remakes will borrow the "humanity fuck yeah" page from FE15 and FE16 and put the blame of Jugdral's shitty situation from Jugdralians to... Holy Blood and "dragon-gods", completely missing and rewritting the point of those games. IS already said "fig" to Kaga once or thrice, but this might become the most contentious "fig" they ever give him if they decided to write a Jugdral remake this way.

#rant #heroes salt #fe series salt #at least the few last games #FE17 is a breath of fresh air #will it become the new standard or will we have more and more shit like those FBs?#jugdral stuff #at this point i'm afraid of that fandom syndrome #where you put much more thoughts and love and care about a setting than its own authors #so when said authors develop it you're disappointed #because you feel like it's a downgrade to what it was before #like star wars maybe?#i'm very worried about the writing of future games especially since the faux issues raised in Fodlan games apparently #made people want more writting as consistent as pudding #as long as has a veneer of being solid and realistic

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