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#hp thoughts
Note
Any thoughts on the mystery behind the Veil of Death and the three brothers?
ana-lyz: So... What does it mean to be the Master of Death in HP universe? And like what does being MOD mean specifically for Harry?
Okay, funny thing is I got the first of your asks like an hour after I added to my drafts a post titled "Master of Death", so I was just thinking about it. And then I started answering it and you sent the second ask, so, great minds think alike, I guess.
Long post ahead:
The Veil, Death, and its Master
I'm going to cover what we know from the books, my opinions on it, and some of my evidence-based headcanons, since there is a lot of speculation on my part.
The Afterlife and the Veil
So, I wanna talk a bit about death, as it appears in the Harry Potter books. We know an afterlife exists in the HP world both when Harry dies and when he speaks to Nearly Headless Nick after Sirius dies.
I want to start with the scene in Deathly Hallows in the King's Cross limbo. Specifically these few sections:
Barely had the wish formed in his head than robes appeared a short distance away. He took them and put them on. They were soft, clean, and warm. It was extraordinary how they had appeared just like that, the moment he had wanted them. . . . He stood up, looking around. Was he in some great Room of Requirement?
(DH, 596)
“Where are we, exactly?” “Well, I was going to ask you that,” said Dumbledore, looking around. “Where would you say that we are?” Until Dumbledore had asked, Harry had not known. Now, however, he found that he had an answer ready to give. “It looks,” he said slowly, “like King’s Cross station. Except a lot cleaner and empty, and there are no trains as far as I can see.” “King’s Cross station!” Dumbledore was chuckling immoderately. “Good gracious, really?” “Well, where do you think we are?” asked Harry, a little defensively. “My dear boy, I have no idea. This is, as they say, your party.”
(DH, 601)
“Tell me one last thing,” said Harry. “Is this real? Or has this been happening inside my head?” Dumbledore beamed at him, and his voice sounded loud and strong in Harry’s ears even though the bright white mist was descending again, obscuring his figure. “Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?
(DH, 610)
I don't think this place Harry was in is the Afterlife, or even connected to the Afterlife. I think it is in Harry's head. Harry having complete control over it, actually calling it out as behaving like the Room of Requirement, Dumbledore not knowing where they are until Harry knows where they are, etc. All this doesn't fit with it being a limbo on the way to death and the figure there being the real Dumbledore. Dumbledore, throughout this scene, acts kind of strange, way more helpful and finally says all the right things Harry wants to hear.
Not-Dumbledore himself tells Harry he already knows everything he explains to him:
“Explain,” said Harry. “But you already know,” said Dumbledore. He twiddled his thumbs together
(DH, 597)
So, I truly believe it isn't really happening. That this isn't death and it isn't Dumbledore. throughout the scene, Dumbledore doesn't actually give Harry new information Harry couldn't guess on his own. He's just going over things Harry already knew and creating a nice narrative out of them. At some points, he asks Harry what he thinks, and only starts explaining once Harry knows the answer (or what he wants the answer to be). I think this is Harry's subconscious coping and not actual death.
Additionally, there's the disturbing baby Voldemort thing. Now, the real Voldemort is still alive, so contrary to what Not-Dumbledore says, it isn't actually Tom Riddle:
“Oh yes!” said Dumbledore. “Yes, he destroyed it. Your soul is whole, and completely your own, Harry.” “But then . . . ” Harry glanced over his shoulder to where the small, maimed creature trembled under the chair. “What is that, Professor?” “Something that is beyond either of our help,” said Dumbledore
(DH, 598)
What I believe it is, is the soul in the Horcrux in Harry. Separated from Harry's own soul within his mind. That's the only thing it can be, in my opinion. I don't believe the soul shards in the Horcruxes could pass into an afterlife, or even to limbo. They were created to be bound to life and passing away is against their very nature (unless, maybe, if you through them through the veil).
Besides all these oddities in the scene, it just doesn't make sense for Dumbledore to be there. Nearly Headless Nick gives some insight about death and the Afterlife:
“He will not come back,” repeated Nick quietly. “He will have . . . gone on.” “What d’you mean, ‘gone on’?” said Harry quickly. “Gone on where? Listen — what happens when you die, anyway? Where do you go? Why doesn’t everyone come back? Why isn’t this place full of ghosts? Why — ?” “I cannot answer,” said Nick. “You’re dead, aren’t you?” said Harry exasperatedly. “Who can answer better than you?” “I was afraid of death,” said Nick. “I chose to remain behind. I sometimes wonder whether I oughtn’t to have . . . Well, that is neither here nor there. . . . In fact, I am neither here nor there. . . .” He gave a small sad chuckle. “I know nothing of the secrets of death, Harry, for I chose my feeble imitation of life instead. I believe learned wizards study the matter in the Department of Mysteries —”
(OotP, 861)
From the way Nick speaks, ghosts are caught between life and death, part of them remains among the living while the rest moves on. Hhosts live in limbo, unable to be alive or dead. From his words, it also implies the properly dead, those who chose to move on, stay dead. They stay gone.
If that is the case, how could Dumbledore have come to greet Harry in limbo? He's dead, truly gone, and death has no exceptions. There is no reason Dumbledore could speak to Harry in limbo and his parents won't. Once you're dead, you reach the afterlife and there you stay.
So I don't think the white King's Cross in Harry's death vision was connected to the afterlife, nor was it the real Dumbledore there. So, what is the actual afterlife?
Well, we don't really know. But, I can cover what we do know about the nature of death in the HP universe.
From Nick's words, the afterlife is the better option, than becoming a ghost. Nick describes ghosts as imprints left behind, but imprints of what specifically?
I talked about this already when I discussed how to make Horcruxes, but in alchemy, everything is comprised of three things:
Sulfur - soul
Mercury - spirit (that binds the body and the soul)
Salt - body
A ghost doesn't have a body, and we know all that moves on to the afterlife is one's soul. Therefore, it stands to reason ghosts are an imprint of a soul, while the spirit leaves at the moment of death. That's what an Avada Kedavra does, it removes the spirit, the connection between the body and the soul. That's how it kills instantly and without a trace.
So, when someone passes into the afterlife, it's their soul that passes away.
What about the echoes of Harry's parents and Cedric in Voldemort's wand during the duel in the graveyard?
Well, they're dead, they moved on, so it can't be their soul. The figures aren't even described the same way as ghosts or diary Tom, figures we know are made of souls:
and then something much larger began to blossom from Voldemort’s wand tip, a great, grayish something, that looked as though it were made of the solidest, densest smoke. . . . It was a head . . . now a chest and arms . . . the torso of Cedric Diggory. the dense shadow of a second head, If ever Harry might have released his wand from shock, it would have been then, but instinct kept him clutching his wand tightly, so that the thread of golden light remained unbroken, even though the thick gray ghost of Cedric Diggory (was it a ghost? it looked so solid) emerged in its entirety from the end of Voldemort’s wand, as though it were squeezing itself out of a very narrow tunnel . . . and this shade of Cedric stood up, and looked up and down the golden thread of light, and spoke.
(GoF, 665-666)
Their bodies are buried, and Cedric's is just lying there, neither are they physical enough to be bodies. I believe this is their spirit. Remember what I said about the Killing Curse just now, it severs the tie, and as such, it keeps the spirit. So, Harry is speaking to his parents' spirit, the echoes of their lives, not souls.
Now, let's talk about the veil. The veil is one of the most fascinating things introduced in the books, and the way it is introduced is fascinating on its own, but that's for later. The veil is a physical archway into the world of the dead.
The concept of such an entrance exists in multiple mythologies. In Greek mythology, many heroes (Odysseus, Orpheus, Heracles, Theseus, etc.) all travel through the underworld in one way or another, this is why the hero's journey goes through the underworld, it's very common. In Mesopotamian mythology, Gilgamesh and Ishtar both travel to the underworld. The point is, a gateway into the afterlife you can travel through, is a concept humanity has been toying with for millennia.
What's interesting is that, like Thestrals, those who've seen death (Harry, Luna, and Neville) can hear whispers from it. They experience it differently from others who haven't witnessed death (Ron, Hermione, and Ginny) who feel unnerved by it (although, Neville and Luna react differently from Harry, but more on that later). Not much more can be said about it, except that unlike all these gates into the underworld from myths, the veil is meant to be a one-way ticket.
In general, the afterlife in the Wizarding World is a one-way passage. Once you're gone, you're gone. Hence the closest thing to proper necromancy they have is creating inferi, which are soulless since the soul can't be pulled back from the afterlife.
The veil was also there before the Ministry of Magic, which was built around it. My guess is that some ancient wizards made it, and how or why were forgotten over time.
As the Peverell brothers were born around the 1210s and the Ministry of Magic was founded in 1707, it's possible, that the same Peverells from the story have built the veil. I actually think it's quite likely.
Death Himself
The idea of death personified is just as old and prevalent in many myths and cultures as a gateway leading into the afterlife. Whether Death, as a being, exists in the Wizarding World, I'm uncertain, but I don't think it's likely.
God-like spirits like Death feel out of place in the world in a way. Like, having a pantheon of gods feels wrong for the world of Harry Potter. It feels out of place with the established lore and magic. We don't see any evidence of wizarding society having any kind of unique religion in which such beings exist. Death, in the tale, is also described as similar to a dementor, making the idea that the author based Death's appearance on that of a dementor plausible.
That being said, Death's similarity to dementors could be the other way around. As in, the dementors look like death because of their connection to him. And, Death from the Tale doesn't really act like a god. How he behaves and is spoken of in the Tale of the Three Brothers reminds me a lot of a fae-like creature. Like, a powerful being who's a trickster that twists your wishes into something that he can use against you.
However I look at it, I still don't feel a being like this would fit in the world of Harry Potter, it feels wrong to add gods (or fae) in there. We don't see any hint that such beings might exist, which makes me feel they don't. So, I don't really think a personification of Death as appearing in the tale actually exists, but they do have an afterlife, as established above.
The Peverells and the Hallows
So we all know the legend about the three Peverell brothers who cheated death and received his gifts. Dumbledore (the one Harry imagines in his death fever dram) is certain it went down a little differently. That the tale is to explain incredibly powerful magical artifacts made by extraordinary wizards:
“Oh yes, I think so. Whether they met Death on a lonely road . . . I think it more likely that the Peverell brothers were simply gifted, dangerous wizards who succeeded in creating those powerful objects. The story of them being Death’s own Hallows seems to me the sort of legend that might have sprung up around such creations.
(DH, 602)
While it's not really Dumbledore and more Harry's own mind, I agree with him the Peverell brothers were probably no run-of-the-mill wizards, and I agree it's unlikely they've met Death, as I don't believe he exists.
Now, all the Hallows have a sentience to them beyond just any magical artifact. Even the wand is more sentient than any other wand, which are already quite sentient ("the wand chooses the wizard").
The wand of the first brother is a Hallow I already wrote about how it chooses its master. It is a wand intrinsically connected with death, having a core of Thestral hair. (I wonder if a core from a Thestral would agree to work for a wizard who hasn't seen death, but I digress)
This wand is actually the least impressive Hallow, in my opinion. Even though it says to be unbeatable:
Naturally, with the Elder Wand as his weapon, he could not fail to win the duel that followed. Leaving his enemy dead upon the floor
(DH, 352)
Its user is beaten quite often, that's how the wand changes owners, after all. This wand's tendency for even more sentience than other wands is what is particularly unique about it. How it chooses its master repeatedly, and sometimes even decides it prefers another over its current master, something unheard of for any other wand.
The Resurrection Stone has the supposed ability to pull a soul imprint from the afterlife:
“Yet she was sad and cold, separated from him as by a veil. Though she had returned to the mortal world, she did not truly belong there and suffered.
(DH, 352)
Something that I just discussed above should be impossible. Once dead and in the afterlife, nothing comes back out. Harry uses it as well for the same purpose and describes them as being similar to Tom from the diary:
They were neither ghost nor truly flesh, he could see that. They resembled most closely the Riddle that had escaped from the diary so long ago, and he had been memory made nearly solid. less substantial than living bodies, but much more than ghosts, they moved toward him, and on each face, there was the same loving smile.
(DH, 589)
Because that's what the stone brings back, echoes of souls, but they aren't what Tom Riddle was in CoS.
“We are part of you,” said Sirius. “Invisible to anyone else.”
(DH, 590)
This line, made me believe the resurrection stone does something different than its name suggests and more similar to the lie Tom in the diary told Harry. They aren't souls, they're memories, echoes from within Harry himself. "Memory made solid"
Magic, in the world of Harry Potter, can't bring back someone who has moved on to the afterlife. It's a one-way ticket, as I've established before, once your soul moves on, that's it (if you try to resurrect someone immediately after they died and their soul hasn't yet moved on it's a different story). So I think, these shades are based on Harry's memories, and not actual souls brought back. It'll make more sense magically since his thoughts and memories are there, but the souls have gone on.
It also makes the tale of the second brother make more sense. He suffered because it wasn't really his wife that came back, but a shade based on his own memory. The tale said that she suffered, but I think it was Cadmus who suffered, not truly having her back. However, depending on how she died, her suffering might've been his memories of her that the stone resurrected, or the tale made it all up just like it made up Death.
The stone is just as picky about its master as the wand. It does not seem to have worked for anyone other than Cadmus Peverell and Harry himself. We don't hear of any Gaunts who used the stone, nor do we hear from Dumbledore he succeded in using it (I don't think it's actually Dumbledore in the conversation in King's Cross as I mentioned above). Regardless, I think the real Dumbledore probably did try to use it, and I will hazard a guess he failed. Since the stone didn't choose him.
The Cloak is unique in many ways. Lasting centuries, way longer than any invisibility cloak can, passing from parent to child for generations. It also does a better job of concealing you than another invisibility cloak, if, it still has its limits:
“...We are talking about a cloak that really and truly renders the wearer completely invisible, and endures eternally, giving constant and impenetrable concealment, no matter what spells are cast at it. How many cloaks have you ever seen like that, Miss Granger?”
(DH, 354)
The cloak is similar to the other Hallows in how picky it is regarding its master. The cloak wouldn't belong to anyone who just possesses it, it's not enough. It has to be passed willingly on the owner's deathbed, as they great death as an old friend. It means that in the books, no one but Harry could be its owner.
All artifacts are powerful, but they aren't capable of anything that breaks the laws of nature (as the stone doesn't really resurrect), they are also sentient and picky, but it isn't something beyond the capacity of wizards. Why, we know of four wizards who made three sentient magical artifacts already — The Hogwarts founders.
The four founders enchanted the sorting hat together, but more relevant to the discussion of the Hallows are the Book of Admittance and the Quill of Acceptance.
At the precise moment that a child first exhibits signs of magic, the Quill, which is believed to have been taken from an Augurey, floats up out of its inkpot and attempts to inscribe the name of that child upon the pages of the Book (Augurey feathers are known to repel ink and the inkpot is empty; nobody has ever managed to analyse precisely what the silvery fluid flowing from the enchanted Quill is). Those few who have observed the process (several headmasters and headmistresses have enjoyed spending quiet hours in the Book and Quill’s tower, hoping to catch them in action) agree that the Quill might be judged more lenient than the Book. A mere whiff of magic suffices for the Quill. The Book, however, will often snap shut, refusing to be written upon until it receives sufficiently dramatic evidence of magical ability.
(from pottermore)
The idea of multiple sentient, powerful magical artifacts that need to agree is something wizards are capable of. And that, I think, is the secret to becoming the Master of Death — having all 3 Hallows pick you. Just like the book and quill need to agree a student should be admitted to Hogwarts.
Master of Death
Or more specifically what does that actually mean and why I think even if someone retrieved all 3 Hallows they wouldn't have become the Master of Death if their name isn't Harry James Potter.
This is definitely more in the headcanon territory, but the first scene that really made me think about it is the one in the Death Chamber in the Department of Mysteries. Because I think Harry and death always had a weird connection, it might've been around before the failed killing curse, and it was definitely around before Harry mastered all 3 Hallows.
So, why do I think Harry was always bound to be the Master of Death, and even if Dumbledore or Voldemort had all the Hallows it wouldn't have helped them?
There, are a few things that led me to this conclusion.
First, as I mentioned above, the cloak can not belong to anyone other than Harry in the books. It means that no one but Harry could master all of the Deathly Hallows, regardless of what they did.
Second, This first scene in the Death Chamber with the veil. I'll copy parts of it below and ask you to note, as you read, that Harry, Neville, and Luna are the only three who can see Thestrals and therefore should react more to the veil:
“Who’s there?” said Harry, jumping down onto the bench below. There was no answering voice, but the veil continued to flutter and sway. “Careful!” whispered Hermione. ... He had the strangest feeling that there was someone standing right behind the veil on the other side of the archway. ... “Let’s go,” called Hermione from halfway up the stone steps. “This isn’t right, Harry, come on, let’s go. . . .” She sounded scared, much more scared than she had in the room where the brains swam, yet Harry thought the archway had a kind of beauty about it, old though it was. The gently rippling veil intrigued him; he felt a very strong inclination to climb up on the dais and walk through it. “Harry, let’s go, okay?” said Hermione more forcefully. “Okay,” he said, but he did not move. He had just heard something. There were faint whispering, murmuring noises coming from the other side of the veil. “What are you saying?” he said very loudly, so that the words echoed all around the surrounding stone benches. “Nobody’s talking, Harry!” said Hermione, now moving over to him. “Someone’s whispering behind there,” he said, moving out of her reach and continuing to frown at the veil. “Is that you, Ron?” “I’m here, mate,” said Ron, appearing around the side of the archway. “Can’t anyone else hear it?” Harry demanded, for the whispering and murmuring was becoming louder; without really meaning to put it there, he found his foot was on the dais. “I can hear them too,” breathed Luna, joining them around the side of the archway and gazing at the swaying veil. “There are people in there!” .... “Sirius,” Harry repeated, still gazing, mesmerized, at the continuously swaying veil. “Yeah . . .” ... On the other side, Ginny and Neville were staring, apparently entranced, at the veil too.
(OotP, 773-775)
The interesting to note:
Luna, who can see Thestrals, also hears the whispering. I assume Neville does too.
Ron, Hermione, and Ginny are mesmerized but unnerved by the veil. Ron and Hermione seem to fight this memorization in their fear for Harry as he nears the veil.
Harry is the only one who is drawn to the veil He is the only one that moved, the only one whose feet take him against his will to the dias with the veil.
Harry thinks of it as oddly beautiful.
He has an urge to pass through that no one else does. All of them are frozen in place.
Harry is so affected he needs to be reminded twice that he's there to save Sirius before he can draw himself away from the veil.
Third, later in the book, after Sirius fell through the veil, there's this part:
He had reached the floor, his breath coming in searing gasps. Sirius must be just behind the curtain, he, Harry, would pull him back out again. . . . But as he reached the ground and sprinted toward the dais, Lupin grabbed Harry around the chest, holding him back. “There’s nothing you can do, Harry —” “Get him, save him, he’s only just gone through!” “It’s too late, Harry —” “We can still reach him —” Harry struggled hard and viciously, but Lupin would not let go. . . . “There’s nothing you can do, Harry . . . nothing. . . . He’s gone.”
(OotP, 806)
Harry's instinct to go through the veil to get Sirius out is so odd. The way he thinks that he himself can pull him out, not anyone else, but he... I don't know, but, this scene is interesting. It almost makes me feel Harry could pull Sirius back out. He defied death already once and will defy it again in the 7th book, so why not? Why wouldn't he be able to pull someone back from beyond the veil if they fell through just now (the timing is relevant, I don't think Hary could pull, say, his parents out).
My headcanon is that in that very moment if Lupin let Harry pull Sirius out, it would've worked. Caused a pandemonium about the fact Harry can apparently resurrect the dead (even if it's not really what he did), but that it would've worked. (I actually really want to write a fic like this)
Fourth, throughout the 7th book, once Harry finds out about the Hallows, he can't let the thought go. He knows his cloak is one, he is convinced the stone is in the snitch Dumbledore left him, way before he opened it. He just has a sense about it, and a fixation on it that's almost instinct:
Dumbledore had left the sign of the Hallows for Hermione to decipher, and he had also, Harry remained convinced of it, left the Resurrection Stone hidden in the golden Snitch. Neither can live while the other survives. . . master of Death. . . Why didn’t Ron and Hermione understand? “‘The last enemy shall be destroyed is death,”’ Harry quoted calmly
(DH, 374-375)
So, these are my reasons why I believe Harry is the only character in the books that could or would be the MOD. It's just that he always was, in a way. The Hallows already chose him before he ever held any of them.
But what does it mean to be the Master of Death?
“Well, of course not,” said Xenophilius, maddeningly smug. “That is a children’s tale, told to amuse rather than to instruct. Those of us who understand these matters, however, recognize that the ancient story refers to three objects, or Hallows, which, if united, will make the possessor master of Death.” ... “When you say ‘master of Death’—” said Ron. “Master,” said Xenophilius, waving an airy hand. “Conqueror. Vanquisher. Whichever term you prefer.”
(DH, 353)
We don't really get much besides this. Along with what's written on James and Lily's grave:
The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
(DH, 283)
Harry believes all phrases, along with the prophecy are connected and lead him to believe he should become the Master of Death:
Three objects, or Hallows, which, if united, will make the possessor master of Death. . . Master. . . Conqueror. . . Vanquisher. . . The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. . . . And he saw himself, possessor of the Hallows, facing Voldemort, whose Horcruxes were no match. . . Neither can live while the other survives. . . Was this the answer?
(DH, 369-370)
So what can the Master of Death do? Death isn't a personified deity, what is defeating or contouring death mean? Does it mean immortality?
I don't know if I'll say full immortality, I think the Master of Death can die the same way Ignotus Peverell did. I think Ignotus Peverell was the first Master of Death, in a way, he at least represented the concept:
And then he greeted Death as an old friend, and went with him gladly, and, equals, they departed this life
(DH, 352)
He was death's equal, he could escape it and live a fulfilling life, before choosing to meet Death on his own terms. I think that's what it means, that Death won't find Harry until he is ready to move on, and when he finally chooses to move on, Death would greet him with open arms.
The crux of it is the choice. That death can't touch you until you choose to allow it. And those who become Masters of Death, would always eventually choose to greet death, as these are the type of people the 3 Hallows would choose. It's all about choices.
(For the record, yes, I think there could be more than one MOD, I think Ignotus was until his death, and then in the books, Harry is)
And considering how much emphasis is put on choices and intentions in the magic of this world, it seems only right to be so relevant here too.
Like with the Mirror or Erised, which only let someone who wanted to have the Philosopher's Stone but not use it, have it; the Hallows won't choose a master who wouldn't, eventually, be willing to accept death. Because mastering death, isn't only not dying, it's understanding it, and accepting it. Both the deaths of others and eventually your own.
Also, as I mentioned above, I headcanon that Harry could pull Sirius out the moment he fell in through the veil. I don't think anyone but Harry could. I believe, as a Master of Death, Harry is the only wizard (well, being) that can go into the afterlife, walk past the veil, and come back out. A Master of Death is the only one who the afterlife isn't a one-way ticket for.
(Although, I think it's possible that if you wear the invisibility cloak you might be able to pass into the veil and come out even without being the MOD, but, I wouldn't bet on it)
Summary of my thoughts
The afterlife exists in the Wizarding World and nothing that passes beyond the veil can return. It's a one-way ticket.
The scene in Deathly Hallows with Dumbledore in King's Cross station limbo didn't actually happen.
Death, as a deity of sorts most likely doesn't exist.
The Peverell brothers were powerful wizards who made the Deathly Hallows and perhaps the veil too.
The Resurrection stone can't bring a soul back from beyond the veil so it does the next best thing — reviving an illusion of a memory.
All 3 Deathly Hallows are very sentient magical artifacts like the sorting hat. Each of them is very picky when choosing its own master.
When all 3 Hallows choose the same master, this person is the Master of Death.
Being the Master of Death means the MOD won't die until the time of their choice. But the MOD will always choose to die eventually because that's the kind of person the Hallows would pick.
There can, over time, be more than one MOD (not at the same time though). And it's possible Ignotus Peverell was one, in a way.
The MOD might be the only person who can go into the veil and come back out.
The invisibility cloak might also allow you to make a trip into the veil and then back out.
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four2andnew · 9 months
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Canon Couples and the Random Heights I Assigned Them
Just because I recently re-read this post and it's on my mind. Here's what I think these canon couples' final heights came to be and some justifications behind my thought process, as well as some headcanons. Let's start with my OTP -
Harry (6'1") and Ginny (5'0")
I'm kinda obsessed with the idea that 17yo Harry being the same height as his 21yo deceased father would grow just a couple more inches
Ginny being 5ft fits with her being the noticeably "smallest one" in the DoM during OOTP and with Harry being able to easily look over her head during the infamous First Kiss scene in HBP, putting her head at chest height of Harry (as of HBP)
Ginny is the only one who knows about Harry's petty satisfaction when he ran into Draco Malfoy some years after the war and realized he had continued to grow and Malfoy hadn't
James (5'11") and Lily (5'8")
Because they're both tall enough to be considered "tall", but not the kind of tall that is shocking
Lily being 5'8" makes her tall enough to have to look down at 14yo Harry in the graveyard scene of GOF
Ron (6'5") and Hermione (5'8")
In order for Fred and George to be "shorter and stockier" than 14yo Ron, but still slightly over 6ft so as to shrink to 5'11" in DH, I have to assume Ron's final height came to be one that most people would put in the "Holy shit you're tall" category
I know I'm going to get shouted at for Hermione's height, because she's never described as particularly tall in the books HOWEVER she's never described as particularly short either, just shorter than Harry
This 9 inch height difference give Ron & Hermione the perfect height difference for Ron to comfortably rest his chin on her head without having to hunch over awkwardly like Harry does with Ginny, so I'm sticking to it
Arthur (5'11") and Molly (4'11")
I know the movies made Arthur short and round, but he was described as thin in the books and all the Weasley boys wind up being pretty tall, so they had to get that from somewhere.
Molly is consistently described as short and dumpy throughout the series, and while Ginny is often compared to Molly physically, I just like the idea that Ginny managed to grow that extra inch that Molly never did.
Draco (6'0") and Astoria (5'11")
we know in DH Draco was slightly taller than Harry at the Malfoy Manor scene (p.457, U.S. edition of DH), so if we assume the like linked post above that Harry was 5'11" during DH, then I'd put Draco at 6 foot.
we literally know nothing about Astoria (CC doesn't count), but I picked 5'11" because it is the curse of all tall women to wind up with men roughly the same height
Lucius (5'10") and Narcissa (5'10")
we know Harry and Narcissa are the same height in HBP, so I put her at 5'10"
correct me if I'm wrong, but Lucius is never described as particularly tall, while Narcissa is. And of course, tall for a woman is average for a man. I put Lucius to be around around the same height as Narcissa because I just don't see Lucius' personality allowing him to be with a woman taller than himself.
also, see the curse of tall women above
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sawiet · 3 months
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i never thought about it until i started reading fanfiction, but draco in the role of a healer is so amazing. such a profession requires a sharp mind and cold determination, but at the same time, you must have an infinitely large and kind heart to sacrifice your time and energy for the healing of another person. canonically, draco couldn't bear the thought of taking someone's life, and i believe he never did. the fact that he values life makes him even more beautiful in my eyes
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gummybearinthehouseee · 10 months
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ron: on a scale from one to ten, how bad of an idea do you think it would be if we got married?
harry: off the charts. lets do it.
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I think Harry James Potter would have such a different approach to devotion and romantic love.
You’re telling me the Boy-Who-Lived, the Savior of the Wizarding World, defeater of the Dark Lord wouldn’t feel so relieved that he only has to love and protect one person instead of the whole world? What a huge weight off his shoulders.
But slowly, he’d slip back into the pattern of feeling just as deeply as he did during his childhood, just concentrated on his partner.
It takes a certain special type of person to withstand that much devotion and attention all aimed at you, constantly. Because Harry was nothing if not vigilant about people’s behavior and reactions after living with the Dursleys and surviving an active war.
Exploring intimacy is something new to Harry, on top of it all, so besides having the emotional gauge used to caring for everyone all the time forever, he doesn’t have any sort of sense for how much is too much.
He loves like James, who loved like the sun, but Harry doesn’t seem to realize that too much love too fast will burn. He is all in and almost omnipresent. You don’t just get to sunbathe in his love, you’re under a magnifying glass that brings all the intensity of an active star onto you, multiplied. His love burns, and it takes a special kind of person to even be able to bear it, let alone to gaze upon his love.
The average person would char under this emotional hurricane, it’s not a healthy level of intensity for a well-adjusted adult with emotional regulation skills and normal boundaries. It’s not normal for someone to love someone so fiercely and to change their personality from loving all people to loving one person without losing a huge quantity of emotional range. Harry Potter has never been normal, however.
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Anyways this can be applied to any ship I just think it makes so much sense for Draco because he had that level of attentiveness directed at him from birth, and is vain enough to relish this insane level of devotion and honestly obsession from a partner. Of course he’s looked after so closely, he’s Draco Malfoy. And who wouldn’t adore all this attention, he’s got Harry Potter attending to his every whim. It’s decadence personified.
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mermaid886 · 5 months
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“I can totally imagine /insert actor’s name/ as Snape/Draco/Hagrid.”
No.
I’m sorry, but no.
Alan Rickman is Snape, anyone else will just be an embarrassment.
Tom Felton is Draco.
Robbie Coltrane was Hagrid.
“But eventually someone would have to take over the roles or the characters will never be in a show/movie again!”
*shrug*
“But-“
No.
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annabtg · 2 years
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Here's a thought:
Sirius has been getting so much shit for the Prank and putting Snape's life in danger, but in The Prince's Tale, when Lily is griping about Snape's friends, and with the Prank still fresh, Snape has a perfect window to badmouth Sirius - arguably, the latter trying to kill him should be even worse than Avery and Mulciber's dark magic.
And yet Snape does not even mention Sirius. All he complains about is James Potter, his sneaking around with Remus and his fancying Lily.
Do you think that maybe, the supposedly hideous Prank wasn't such a big deal after all? Just some information that Snape stupidly decided to put to the test?
Do you think that maybe Snape knows he was the one that fucked up, which is why he doesn't try to put the blame on Sirius?
Do you think that maybe he was never in much danger, which is why James supposedly saving him is all the more annoying to him - because it gives James a chance to boast about being a heroic saviour when maybe all he did was just pull Snape back from the immobilized tree?
Do you think that maybe he later plays it up for pity points, in front of Harry who has not the slightest idea of what had really happened, knowing that Remus is guilt-prone and Sirius has a reputation as an unhinged murderer?
Not saying that Sirius had any sort of innocent intention, but I'm inclined to think it was more like "why should I care to protect him? He's a big boy and he thinks he's smart; if he wants to see what's going on, let him have it" rather than a nefarious plan to actually get him killed or bitten.
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Real talk tho Moaning Myrtle is so miserable and sensitive about the fact that she’s dead (even though none of the other ghosts are so touchy/bothered by being dead) because she’s the ghost of a child. She’s still a child. She was a kid when she died. She never matured or grew up and her life was cut short. She never got to grow up or do anything fun or anything she wanted to. She’s depressed about that.
Also. Literally all of the other ghosts are adults. She never reached emotional maturity of adulthood so obvs being dead is a super touchy subject.
Imagine being stuck as a 13/14 year old for all of eternity. I’d be fucking pissy as hell and sensitive about that too
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basiatlu · 4 months
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What r your thoughts on a Ron and Draco friendship? I feel like when Harry and Hermione are both at work and one of them starts to feel lonely/bored that either Ron or Draco will show up at the other persons front door and pretend they are only there because they “promised Harry/Hermione I would check in on you” or some other lie. They would definitely argue the entire time and at first every single time they hang out both Harry and Hermione think “oh my god they hate each other and do nothing but fight we have to stop letting them cross paths before someone crosses a line” only to slowly realize that Ron and Draco are actually having the time of their lives together because they LOVE debating anything and everything. They love it. This is crack to them. Arguing is their weird love language with one another and the more tense and passionate the argument is then the more fun they are having, even when it looks like they’re both furious at one another.
They just get into full screaming arguments across Mollys kitchen table but the entire time they are sharing a tin of biscuits and taking turns making tea all without pausing their debate. They maintain that they hate each other if anyone asks, but you know that Draco is pacing the flat any time they have the other couple over, pretending to complain about “if she brings the Weasel you’d better tell him he’s not allowed on the furniture” all the whole bouncing excitedly on his toes and queueing up topics for debate in his mind.
On the other side you have Ron following Hermione around the house and griping “He’s not seriously bringing the ferret with him, is he? He’s such a posh twat, Hermione, it’s going to be miserable!” Meanwhile he’s just stocked up on his and Draco’s favorite sweets specifically for such an occasion.
Just—I can imagine the both of them being so steadfast in the idea of “no, I hate him, he’s awful” while completely unaware that actually they are pretty much best friends and love each others company lol. They’d bitch and complain and slander one another all day long but you just know if anyone did anything to the other they would be grabbing their wand and rushing to the defense. What do you think a friendship between them would look like?
Honestly? I feel similar on a lot of this!
In some iterations of Draco I can see him and Ron at first being really defensive and prodding like two cats forced to cohabitate the same room. There will be a lot of hissing and spitting and raised haunches but one day
Malfoy will say something dry and self-deprecating, and Ron will laugh before he realizes what's happened. And I think Harry being a butt of their jokes (in good taste) will bring them together. And when Draco gets enough tact to speak with Hermione in a respectful way, Ron will see he's actually got a good head on his shoulders.
It's when he comes for Christmas dinner at the Burrow for the 1st time, immediately starts asking George and Arthur about their respective hobbies and careers with earnest interest, goes to set the dining table in a display of elaborate housekeeping charms without being asked ("Because none of you ungrateful pests have done it already! Must she still wipe your chins for you too?"), compliments Molly by asking for second helpings of her cooking, and then when gifted a knitted scarf (a precursor, a warmup before the real Weasley sweater initiation to follow next year) Draco laughs in triumph and wears it immediately. Strikes a pose in front of Harry.
"Never got one of these, ey Potter? I'm special!"
And Ron has to admit that he's alright.
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kiefbowl · 2 years
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harry potter has a blood cast system, has an irish student obsessed with explosions, goblins with antisemetic archetypes that have a star of david in their workplace, literal slaves, changing characters from black to white in the film adaptation, hiding all the gay shit cause joanne was lying for clout. But sure HP is fine its normal just ignore all the racist/antisemetic/homophobic shit its ok copeium. Fucking moron
Okay so Harry Potter has a blood caste system as like…the story. It’s the thing the evilness is about, that can’t be news to you right? Like you’ve read it yeah? Voldemort is all about blood purity and Harry kills him. Harry is the good guy, remember? The hero of the story. He’s the one the books are named after. Also the slaves, meaning the house elves, is part of the old ways that need changing. Hermione who is an outsider represents the new and Ron who is from an old wizarding family represents the old in that argument, have you been to your English classes lately? Books do this all the time when they’re novels cause they use characters, settings, and imagery to convey a point or else the book might as well be a nonfiction essay.
Everything else is from the movies??? Have you only seen the movies? And no JKR was not hiding “all the gay shit” (what’s wrong with you) for clout. She couldn’t have an openly gay character when publishing books in the 90s for children, she wasn’t allowed. God only knows if she had Dumbledore drop a “by the way I’m gay” line you all would be like “all this gay shit isn’t queer enough” or whatever nonsense. Turns out being gay is a lot like being a normal person.
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Sirius Black was the best adult in Harry's life and I'm forever salty that we didn't get to see more of him
So, I love Sirius Black. He's a complex and interesting character that I love dearly. He's handsome, smart, brave, not as reckless as some fanon make him out to be, and above all else, he tried his best to be a good godfather to Harry.
I truly believe Sirius could've been an amazing father figure (more than he already was) to Harry if given the proper chance. And he's a much better parent to Harry than Arthur and Molly Weasley.
Here are some quotes along with my ramblings to prove it.
So, what I'm going to cover here are some quotes from Sirius and Harry that show their dynamic and how much Sirius cared and tried to be there for Harry. Also, I think Molyl and Hermione are wrong about Sirius seeing Harry as a James replacement.
“He came back to the country just because my scar twinged. He’ll probably come bursting right into the castle if I tell him someone’s entered me in the Triwizard Tournament —”
(GoF, page 290)
Harry wrote to Sirius at the beginning of GoF about his dream with Voldemort and his scar's reaction to it. Sirius left everything immediately to return to Britain — a place where he is hunted down and is a wanted man. All because he wants to be close to Harry, so he can spring up to protect him if the need arises.
Harry is correct in his assessment here.
“Poor old Snuffles,” said Ron, breathing deeply. “He must really like you, Harry. . . . Imagine having to live off rats.”
(GoF, page 534)
Ron is absolutely right. Sirius loves Harry more than pretty much anything. He would and does go incredibly far for Harry. I don't think Molly and Hermione are right about how Sirius sees Harry as James. He just doesn't.
He doesn't treat Harry as an equal to him, but as someone he needs to protect. Someone he is responsible to protect.
He stays around Hogwarts, eating rats in GoF so he can better protect Harry. He wouldn't have done the same with James because he treated James as an equal, not as someone he needed to protect.
“It’s not my fault you haven’t been told what the Order’s doing,” said Sirius calmly. “That’s your parents’ decision. Harry, on the other hand —” “It’s not down to you to decide what’s good for Harry!” said Mrs. Weasley sharply. Her normally kindly face looked dangerous. “You haven’t forgotten what Dumbledore said, I suppose?” “Which bit?” Sirius asked politely, but with an air as though readying himself for a fight. “The bit about not telling Harry more than he needs to know,” said Mrs. Weasley, placing a heavy emphasis on the last three words. Ron, Hermione, Fred, and George’s heads turned from Sirius to Mrs. Weasley as though following a tennis rally. Ginny was kneeling amid a pile of abandoned butterbeer corks, watching the conversation with her mouth slightly open. Lupin’s eyes were fixed on Sirius. “I don’t intend to tell him more than he needs to know, Molly,” said Sirius. “But as he was the one who saw Voldemort come back” (again, there was a collective shudder around the table at the name), “he has more right than most to —” “He’s not a member of the Order of the Phoenix!” said Mrs. Weasley. “He’s only fifteen and —” “— and he’s dealt with as much as most in the Order,” said Sirius, “and more than some —” “No one’s denying what he’s done!” said Mrs. Weasley, her voice rising, her fists trembling on the arms of her chair. “But he’s still —” “He’s not a child!” said Sirius impatiently. “He’s not an adult either!” said Mrs. Weasley, the color rising in her cheeks. “He’s not James, Sirius!” “I’m perfectly clear who he is, thanks, Molly,” said Sirius coldly. “I’m not sure you are!” said Mrs. Weasley. “Sometimes, the way you talk about him, it’s as though you think you’ve got your best friend back!” “What’s wrong with that?” said Harry. “What’s wrong, Harry, is that you are not your father, however much you might look like him!” said Mrs. Weasley, her eyes still boring into Sirius. “You are still at school and adults responsible for you should not forget it!” “Meaning I’m an irresponsible godfather?” demanded Sirius, his voice rising. “Meaning you’ve been known to act rashly, Sirius, which is why Dumbledore keeps reminding you to stay at home and —” “We’ll leave my instructions from Dumbledore out of this, if you please!” said Sirius loudly.
(OotP, page 88-89)
This above quote is a long one, but I love it. I mean, this shows a big contrast between Sirius' approach to parenting and Molly's. Sirius, while not seeing Harry as his equal, does see Harry as a capable wizard who deserves to know the full picture. Sirius knows Harry would be in more danger when ignorant and wants him as safe as possible. He thinks Harry deserves to know things that pertain to him, and I have to agree with him here. Keeping Harry in the dark is what eventually cost Sirius his life.
Molly, on the other hand, is intent on keeping Harry, Hermione, and her kids ignorant. She has the same intention as Sirius: to keep them safe. But she tries to keep them safe emotionally, even when this ignorance can and does place them in physical harm's way.
And Sirius is right. Harry is capable. And a 15-year-old shouldn't be treated the same as an 11-year-old child. And let's be real, Harry was never a regular child with how he grew up, and I think Sirius sees his maturity and treats him accordingly. Sirius actually gave Harry advice to not approach danger in GOF and Harry listened to him because Sirius treated him with respect, which works best with Harry who never really had parental figures.
“I don’t know,” said Sirius slowly, “I just don’t know . . . Karkaroff doesn’t strike me as the type who’d go back to Voldemort unless he knew Voldemort was powerful enough to protect him. But whoever put your name in that goblet did it for a reason, and I can’t help thinking the tournament would be a very good way to attack you and make it look like an accident.”
(GoF, page 334)
This is an expert from the Fireplace conversation Haryr had with Sirius before the first task. Sirius shares his theories with Harry because he needs him to know who to watch out for. Because everything he does is to keep Harry safe. And this is the same approach Sirius wishes he could take with Harry in OOTP. Because he knows it works. Keeping Harry informed means that if he does put himself in danger, at least he would inform Sirius about it; Which would allow Sirius to protect him.
I'm not copying all of them, but Sirius' letters to Harry throughout GOF are so caring and sweet. Harry deserved to have more of his godfather in his life:
Nice try, Harry. I'm back in the country and well hidden. I want you to keep me posted on everything that's going on at Hogwarts. Don't use Hedwig, keep changing owls, and don't worry about me, just watch out for yourself. Don't forget what I said about your scar. Sirius
(Gof, page 240)
This treatment encourages Harry to actually share everything with him and ask him for advice. Something he doesn't do with Dumbledore ever. (Harry actually doesn't like or trust Dumbledore all that much until book 6, it's usually Hermione who trusts Dumbledore fully)
“Sirius — how’re you doing?” ... “Never mind me, how are you?” said Sirius seriously.
(GoF, page 331)
Sirius again, shows his responsibility towards Harry's well-being over his own (both here and in the above letter).
Sirius is the only adult who actually talks to Harry about the Dursleys with sympathy:
“But if they do expel me,” said Harry, quietly, “can I come back here and live with you?” Sirius smiled sadly. “We’ll see.” “I’d feel a lot better about the hearing if I knew I didn’t have to go back to the Dursleys,” Harry pressed him. “They must be bad if you prefer this place,” said Sirius gloomily.
(OotP, page 116)
We know Sirius would love nothing more than for Harry to stay with him. He's lonely and bored at Grimmauld and would love to have Harry there. But at the same time, he doesn't want Harry expelled from Hogwarts and is trying not to be hopeful for it.
Sirius understands the Dursleys are awful, he just know the full scope, but it's more of a reaction than we get from most adults in this series. To me, it looks like Sirius is annoyed by how limited he is in helping Harry. He can't really do much about the Dursleys or their status as Harry's guardians.
“So you want me to say I’m not going to take part in the defense group?” he muttered finally. “Me? Certainly not!” said Sirius, looking surprised. “I think it’s an excellent idea!” “You do?” said Harry, his heart lifting. “Of course I do!” said Sirius. “D’you think your father and I would’ve lain down and taken orders from an old hag like Umbridge?” “But — last term all you did was tell me to be careful and not take risks —” “Last year all the evidence was that someone inside Hogwarts was trying to kill you, Harry!” said Sirius impatiently. “This year we know that there’s someone outside Hogwarts who’d like to kill us all, so I think learning to defend yourselves properly is a very good idea!” “And if we do get expelled?” Hermione asked, a quizzical look on her face. “Hermione, this whole thing was your idea!” said Harry, staring at her. “I know it was. . . . I just wondered what Sirius thought,” she said, shrugging. “Well, better expelled and able to defend yourselves than sitting safely in school without a clue,” said Sirius.
(OotP, page 371)
I love this scene as well. Sirius cares for Harry's safety first and foremost. Harry being safe is his top priority at every given point. And he's reasonable and logical and treats Harry like someone to protect, not like a friend.
Like, Harry when he has a problem and needs advice throughout books 4 and 5, he calls Sirius. He's Harry's go-to parental figure for advice, and Sirius takes his rule seriously. He gives the advice he honestly thinks is best and ensures Harry's safety and continued survival to the best of his ability.
“It matters because we don’t want to draw attention to the fact that Harry is having visions of things that are happening hundreds of miles away!” said Sirius angrily. “Have you any idea what the Ministry would make of that information?” Fred and George looked as though they could not care less what the Ministry made of anything. Ron was still white-faced and silent. Ginny said, “Somebody else could have told us. . . . We could have heard it somewhere other than Harry. . . .”
(OotP, pages 476-477)
Again, Harry's safety is Sirius' first priority above everyone else. Harry's happiness and privacy also take precedence over most other things. He doesn't want Harry under even more scrutiny from the ministry and the Wizarding World and protecting him from that is just as important to him.
To me, it feels like people who say he treats Harry like a James replacement didn't read the books....
“It must have been the aftermath of the vision, that’s all,” said Sirius. “You were still thinking of the dream or whatever it was and —” “It wasn’t that,” said Harry, shaking his head. “It was like something rose up inside me, like there’s a snake inside me —” “You need to sleep,” said Sirius firmly. “You’re going to have breakfast and then go upstairs to bed, and then you can go and see Arthur after lunch with the others. You’re in shock, Harry; you’re blaming yourself for something you only witnessed, and it’s lucky you did witness it or Arthur might have died. Just stop worrying. . . .” He clapped Harry on the shoulder and left the pantry, leaving Harry standing alone in the dark.
(OotP, pages 480-481)
And I love this too. How he tries to comfort Harry and make everything easier for him. When the rest of the Order were gossiping about how dangerous his connection to Voldemort is, Sirius is honestly trying to get Harry to worry about it less.
He might be lying here, but he is right about sending Harry to sleep after a sleepless night like they had. And he is right about Harry being in shock and needing the rest. I just, really like how much Sirius cares. Harry just doesn't have other adults in his life who care for him like Sirius does.
But some part of him realized, even as he fought to break free from Lupin, that Sirius had never kept him waiting before. . . . Sirius had risked everything, always, to see Harry, to help him. . . . If Sirius was not reappearing out of that archway when Harry was yelling for him as though his life depended on it, the only possible explanation was that he could not come back. . . . That he really was . . .
(OotP, page 808)
This. Scene. Just kills me.
Like, Harry understands how much Sirius cares about him, and how Sirius always puts him first. He knows the only way Sirius won't drop everything to come and when Harry calls for him is if he can't.
Because Sirius escaped Azkaban when he realized Harry might be in danger from Peter, not for his own safety, but for Harry’s. Sirius dropped everything and moved to live in a cave and eat rats when Harry's scar hurt. He stuck around Hogwarts and Hogsmead during the Triwizard Tournament, when it was crawling with ministry officials because Harry might need him. He was willing to do so much for Harry. And Harry knew this.
I think, given time, they could've had an amazing dynamic, and I wish we had more of Sirius and his care for Harry. That we saw more of his approach to parenting Harry.
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four2andnew · 9 months
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Look, I am a big proponent of the head canon that Harry first called Ginny "Gin" in ✨the heat of the moment✨ and the first time he slipped up and called her Gin in front of someone else, that someone happened to be one Arthur Weasley and he wanted the earth to open up and swallow him while Ginny cackled mercilessly at Harry's discomfort but also turned sixteen shades of a setting sun, 'cause that's her Dad, ya know?
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sawiet · 3 months
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harry has had so much shit going on in his life for years and he's known since he was eleven that some dark wizard was going to try to kill him until he got his way and yet he's had a normal life, playing quidditch, going on dates, worrying about school and being a normal teenager.
by those times draco had had one death threat in sixteen years and had simply forgotten about normal life and was going crazy with anxiety.
harry was used to being in danger and it became a normal part of his life. for draco it turned into a living hell because he was a hothouse kid. i like the difference.
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gummybearinthehouseee · 10 months
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ron: that's not funny
harry: i thought it was
hermione: you don't count. you started laughing in the middle of a funeral because you started thinking of a meme you saw on facebook
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Percy Weasley may be fully capable of getting top marks at Hogwarts but I’m POSITIVE he’d cry and hyperventilate over long division.
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nuninho2000 · 5 months
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9yr old Hermione had buck teeth and frizzy hair. JKR basically introduces her as a bully magnet, this kid would have taken a fair bit of grief from the ‘popular’ kids in her school because she was clever, loved books and loved answering questions correctly.
So imagine this girl, bullied and probably quite lonely (she didn’t make friends quickly at Hogwarts remember, even Harry and Ron weren’t really her friends until getting on for Halloween, 2 months into school). Imagine her reading Matilda and wishing oh so much to be like this girl, to have powers and be able to do these marvellous things. Then imagine that first flip of a page, the first flap of a cover, the first scuffle of the book beginning to move and so quickly gaining her mastery of it because she loves books and would never willingly damage one. She’d make herself be perfect at it as fast as possible.
Suddenly the bookish, shunned girl has a reason to keep to herself and away from the other kids. She can do things they can’t and she can naturally do summoning charms (although she doesn’t know that’s what she’s doing yet). Then imagine her in Professor Flitwick’s classroom. Being encouraged and praised for something she had already taught herself to do but had to keep secret. She nailed levitation and summoning charms so fast because she’d accidentally given herself a head start.
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