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sealofreconciliation · 2 years

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Fates: was the story as bad as people say?: a response (Conquest 1/3)

Link to the original post here, link to playthrough with english patch here, link to fateswartable here.

I already responded to Odo's issues with Corrin choosing Nohr during my response to the Prologue section of these analyses (linked here), so i'll only respond to new points brought up.

> Conquest starts with Corrin telling Ryoma to pull back his forces despite being in Hoshidan territory. I realize this mirrors Birthright but the situation is different here and doesn't really work as a result; where does Corrin expect Ryoma to pull back to, exactly?

Corrin also tries to convince Xander to retreat just a few lines later. They thought they'd be able to put a stop to the conflict then and there, so they're telling Ryoma to go back to the capital.

> Camilla then says this:

> Camilla: I agree with Leo. After all, we've done nothing wrong. Why should we flee? You're one of us, Corrin. that's worth fighting for!

> Camilla, please, you're there with an invasion force.

Camilla never said that:

> Camilla: Yeah. We cannot make any mistakes. Kamui is our ally... Kamui is our sister.

> If you'll recall, Yukimura previously excused Corrin of any potential wrongdoing in chapter five as well, making this the second chapter in a row he's done so now. The game wanting to pardon Corrin for wrongdoings, intentional as well as unintentional, will be a recurring theme in Conquest.

He just thought about whether Mikoto may or may not have been content with Corrin's choice. Yukimura wondering whether Mikoto, and no one else, would have forgiven Corrin for their betrayal post-mortem hardly pardons them for their betrayal now, especially given how he immediately says that it doesn't matter what Mikoto might have thought about this situation and that he's going to stop Corrin.

>For now, let's appreciate how strange Yukimura's line is in that he (correctly, as shown later) assumes Mikoto is fine with the protagonist rejoining the side that kidnapped them and murdered her husband, among other things. If Mikoto was a good person and a noble queen, as the game has shown and led us to believe, then it's strange she wouldn't be a touch more concerned about the imminent invasion of her nation, now ruled by her step children.

That just means she's either merciful or deeply loves Corrin, regardless of their mistakes. That's just more characterization for Mikoto, which tracks given how she's portrayed throughout the rest of the game, and it even makes sense for Yukimura to know that, since he was apparently pretty good friends with her and should know her pretty well.

>Xander: WHAT?!

>Xander, this happened just a few chapters ago as well. Garon also released Hans who killed Gunter, and Corrin themselves confirmed the sword they were given exploded and would've killed them if not for Mikoto. What did you actually think was going to happen?

Telling Xander to kill Corrin for disobeying a direct order and telling him to kill Corrin for asking a slightly inflammatory question are two very different things, Corrin has no way to prove that Hans killed Gunter or that Garon ordered him to do so, and Garon just lied through his teeth that he didn't know the Gangalri was anything other than a normal sword. Xander's shock here is completely justified.

>Iago is taunting the Nohrian royals and seems to be having the time of his life, even suggesting that Xander might be a traitor too. I don't quite understand why he's so intent on having them all killed.

The only time Iago mentions the rest of the Nohrian family during this scene is him telling Camilla and Elise that Garon's decree is absolute and there's nothing they can do to stop him:

> Camilla: That’s…! Father, please stop!!

> Elise: It can’t be…! Something like execution… It’s too much!

> Macbeth: You mustn’t, Lady Elise, Lady Camilla. This is the king’s decree.

Not even princesses can overturn it.

If anything, he's warning them not to try and interfere lest they get themselves killed. Sure, he taunts Xander for disobeying an order from Garon, but that's far from wanting the whole family dead.

> In Birthright he could act as sadistic as he wanted because Corrin was an enemy, but here it seems as though he wants nothing more than for Corrin to die almost as if it was personal, but Corrin has been locked up their entire life, so that seems unlikely.

Iago isn't THAT antagonistic towards Corrin:

> Marx: ...If Kamui was on Hoshido’s side,

why would she act without regard to her own life?

> Macbeth: Hmph…

> Even so, we must consider the possibility that it was all an act.

> Macbeth: And yet she is suspicious of the king… It seems something of Hoshido was imbued in her?

> King Garon, there is a high possibility that she is a pawn of Hoshido.

He's just suspicious of them. He even states during his monologue at the end of the chapter that he sent the Faceless after Corrin because he doesn't trust their loyalty after they spent time in Hoshido:

> Macbeth: It pains me to understand why, all of a sudden, he would keep the stolen child of Hoshido alive.

> This begins the trend in Conquest of praising Corrin to an even more extreme degree than what we saw in Birthright. It's an example of Corrin's "mystical charisma", which the game even made a personal skill, which dictates that anyone remotely sympathetic must love the protagonist no matter what they do; Kilma's faith in Corrin is undeserved, but perhaps even more so is Corrin's faith in themselves.

Kilma gives slightly more of a justification for trusting Corrin in the og script:

> Clear: Yes. Mademoiselle Kamui…

I feel a strange attraction to you that I haven’t felt from anyone up until now.

> Even if King Garon said the same thing, I wouldn’t believe him.

> But, your words are followed through with action…

> It seems I believe your way of seeing things.

> ...Perhaps you are still the hero that can change the world.

The main reason Kilma gives for trusting Corrin in this instance is the fact that they backed up their words (they just wanted to negotiate a ceasefire with the Ice Tribe until they got enough clout to free them from Nohr) with action (spared every enemy soldier despite being attacked first instead of killing everyone like any other random soldier would have done). Additionally, Kilma knows about the Yato's prophecy and that whoever it chooses is destined to save the world. Kilma's belief in Corrin is pretty justified given all that.

Also, Kilma really doesn't have much of a choice here; he and his clansmen can either go back to rebelling, at which point Garon sends someone much less interested in the clan's survival to deal with them, or they can trust that a member of Nohrian royalty can one day gain enough power to free them. The second one is much more promising than the first.

>Corrin has no clout to fulfill their promise to the Ice Tribe; do they expect Garon will let them handle domestic disputes and dictate relationships with conquered peoples within Nohr? No. The Ice Tribe is forgotten after this.

Their plan is all but stated to be to gain enough clout to do exactly what you say:

> Kamui: Instead, I’m sure we can change the ways of this country with our own power.

> And I’m committed to take this country in the direction it needs to in order to grant the Ice Clan its own autonomy eventually.

> Xander says that was "unnecessarily cruel" even for Iago, but Iago is so incredibly vocal about wanting Corrin executed for treason that the line doesn't really work.

> Macbeth: …But King Garon, it seems as though Lady Kamui didn’t go there alone.

> Kamui: …!

> Marx: Macbeth, that’s unnecessary…

Treehouse added the “cruel even for you” part, i assume in order to make Iago more unlikable.

> However, despite Garon's earlier evil monologue, he seems to have forgotten all about the "Corrin must suffer!" business and instead gives them a new mission to Notre Sagesse. I realize Garon might be thinking of working Corrin to the bone, using them and tormenting them at the same time, but if torturing Corrin is important enough for Garon to hold an evil speech over it, you'd think he'd jump at the opportunity to punish the protagonist for not obeying his commands to the letter last time.

Garon's plan is to make Corrin into a suitable vessel for Anankos by making them go through what he did, which is to be completely overwhelmed with negative emotions, such as sorrow or regret:

> Garon: This is an order.

> Make Kamui suffer. But do not kill her.

> Do not.

> Macbeth: Eh… T- That- why…?

> Garon: Good… What is most important to me is to dominate Hoshido.

> Compared to that, Kamui is but a trifle.

> But at that time, it is what Divine Hydra desired.

> Kamui’s soul… her very flesh and blood.

> She is but livestock, fodder, to whet the appetite. She must not die…

> If Kamui obeys me, I will not need to try.

> She does not want to fight the enemy, she does not want to kill the enemy, so I will make her kill them.

> Her suffering, her blood is but fodder… in preparation for the best of sacrifices.

Sending them on missions where they're forced to do bad things works just as well as torturing them in terms of messing with their psyche, and sending Corrin to do his dirty work is a win/win for him; either Corrin succeeds and Garon gets more power, along with Corrin's negative emotions being amplified, or they fail and a possible threat is eliminated. His intentions make perfect sense.

> ...But why are they here? They're deep, deep behind enemy lines, inside a huge fort (which apparently isn't manned?) with a person they distrust enough to kidnap against the royal family's wishes. If these people are radicals, wouldn't they just kill Azura?

They could easily want to torture her before killing her. They hate Nohrians enough that they'd kidnap an honorary member of Hoshidan royalty just because she was born in Nohr; i don't doubt they'd want to make her suffer before killing her.

> Takumi clearly hates Nohr and Corrin's betrayal makes it even more personal, but the game starts a worrying trend here: it makes Takumi out to be unreasonable compared to Corrin. Takumi is a young prince whose nation is being attacked for no discernable reason, his mother and many others were murdered in front of him and then Corrin decides to go back to Nohr, yet he's being portrayed like an unreasonable zealot, which will only get worse as the game progresses.

All of Takumi's lines during this chapter (except the CG cutscene because i couldn't find that translated anywhere but also it's only 2 or 3 lines, i doubt it was anything important):

> Hinata: Lord Takumi, the Nohr army seems to have taken a defensive position at the harbor!

> Takumi: …An ambush, is it? Well, I expected no less of them.

> We won’t run away with our tails between our legs. It’s what they want.

> Oboro: But their forces aren’t so large. An easy victory is possible.

> Takumi: That’s right. But be on your guard.

I don’t want to lose to that traitor…

> ...We will win. This is Hoshido’s justice.

If Corrin attacks Takumi personally (the translator for fateswartable didn't cover this dialogue so i had to use Linkmstr's playthrough, timestamp is 33:40, CQ chapter 10):

> Takumi: !!

> Kamui...

> Kamui: Takumi...

> Takumi: ...Who would've thought we'd meet in a place like this...

> Eh, Mister Back-Stabbing Prince?

> You seem to be pretty carefree considering what you did to Hoshido.

> Kamui: I'm sorry... I don't have anything i could say in return to that.

> Takumi: Oh? It looks like even you can be apologetic.

> ...Then fall by my hand right here, and die while regretting your mistakes!

At the end of the chapter:

> Takumi: Damn it…!

> With this much damage, an invasion is impossible…!

> Kamui: That’s right. You all… lost this battle.

Please pull back your forces from this harbor.

If you leave quietly, I can guarantee you will leave with your life.

> Takumi: Hmph… How kind of you.

> I don’t trust the promises of the barbaric Nohr army.

> Kamui: Please don’t think everyone in Nohr is barbaric.

> We don’t do things like killing an enemy who can’t fight back.

> Takumi: What…?

> Were the Hoshido people who died in that attack not innocent?

> And then you took Mother from us.

> How the hell are you any different than cowardly savages?

> Camilla: My… Be silent and listen, rude child.

Please take back those words. Otherwise…

> Kamui: No… I’ll handle this, Camilla. Takumi’s words are reasonable.

Takumi only starts acting unreasonably after Anankos starts amplifying his negative emotions, and if anything is portrayed as being in the right prior to that, since Corrin concedes to his arguments both times they talk. I'm very interested in knowing how someone can interpret that as the game trying to portray Takumi as an unreasonable zealot in a way that isn't a massive reach.

> So, Corrin can end fights without killing or seriously injuring a single person; the Ice Tribe fight wasn't an isolated incident. One question though: how?! Look, I won't pretend I know anything about fighting, but even I know not a single person dying in a battle like this is inconceivable.

I'd give you that point if they were invading with a larger army, but Corrin's team of a little over a dozen people IS all they're working with, and they're all well-trained too; they should know where to strike to disable instead of kill, and that's disregarding that there's at least two healers on the team to fix any broken limbs and/or potentially fatal injuries so that the Hoshidans can still move.

> This is such a bizarre thing to include in the game which really serves no other purpose than to make Corrin look good and, again, excuse them of any potential wrongdoing for choosing the aggressors' side in the conflict.

It's included in the game so as to not contradict Corrin's character; as you pointed out yourself in your prologue analysis, Corrin doesn't like needless killing, at least of people they deem innocent, so of course they'll try to spare people if at all possible.

> This miraculous skill of not killing your opponents even when fighting at a disadvantage is never used in Birthright.

They spare the Ice Tribe soldiers in BR Chapter 17, much in the same way they did in chapters 8 and 11 of CQ:

> Flora: Lord Kamui… You helped the people of the clan… Why…

I'll grant you that Corrin not even trying to spare the vast majority of the enemy soldiers they fight in BR is weird and contradicts their characterization in the prologue, but for what little it's worth, there are a scant few scenes of them trying to solve things peacefully, like with the wolfskin before they started attacking and wouldn't back down even if injured, the Ice Tribe, and when they ask Hans's troops to stand down after the latter's death. It's not enough to solve that issue, but it's something, i suppose.

> Now, no doubt Ryoma is here because of Iago...but how? How did Iago leak this information to Ryoma, and how did Ryoma know how to act on it? What's more, how did Ryoma get here so fast? Finally, can't Iago surround the palace if he knows Ryoma will be there?

I'll give you the first point, but as for the second one: we don't have any timeframe for when Ryoma got the intel, when he headed out, where he was when he got the info, when Iago snitched, or how long it took for Corrin's team to go from wherever they were to Makrath. For all we know, Ryoma took a long time to reach the palace.

As for the third one, Iago was told by Garon to make Corrin suffer by making them fight and kill people they don't want to kill. Sending in the army to kill Ryoma does nothing but ruin the entire point of his plan, and is likely to get him executed if Garon finds out.

> Even if we remove the logistics from the equation here, Ryoma comes across as an idiot for moving this far behind enemy lines presumably without much support,

He's superhuman and brought a small platoon with him, under the assumption that no one knew he was there. As far as he knew, he was going to be fine until the time came to fight Corrin, and he knows it.

Also, it's not so much him being stupid as it is him being brash. He took Corrin's betrayal very poorly and wants to drag them back to Hoshido personally, so he's going to jump at the opportunity to do just that. Him being impulsive is a very consistent part of his character.

> Ryoma wishes to bargain: medicine for Corrin's return to Hoshido. You might suspect me to write about this in greater detail, but no; I think this is a reasonable demand from Ryoma and one way to avoid any fighting.

In what world is “go back to Hoshido, whose citizenship hates Nohrians so much that a small group of soldiers kidnapped a member of royalty so they could torture and kill her and have done the same to anyone of Nohrian descent living there, or else i kill all your friends here and now and drag you back there by force” in any way a reasonable demand, especially when Corrin's group has barely done anything to the Hoshidans yet and were just minding their own business before being ambushed and given a blatantly unfair ultimatum? Why is one of the only morally questionable decisions Hoshido makes in any of the routes being swept under the rug so easily in this post?

> The bigger question is honestly why Corrin doesn't accept; they've been quick to play the martyr before, and fighting would put a lot more people in danger, including Elise since she's in a bad state and needs immediate medical attention. It's not like going back to Hoshido is a death sentence, either. Corrin choosing to fight instead of making sure Elise gets the medicine as quickly as possible seems strangely out of character, and dare I say a wasted opportunity to flesh out the conflict better by making us see more of Hoshido, especially when it's not at its best.

I already pointed out why going back to Hoshido would be a very bad idea in my previous point, but regarding the main point here: Corrin made a promise to Kilma and is generally convinced at this point that they can change Nohr from the inside. Going back to Hoshido not only means breaking his promise with the Ice Tribe but also giving up on the goal he's had for the last few chapters to go back to their home country where, at best, they're going to be kept jailed for the remainder of the war because of their blatant betrayal and as such will be unable to do anything to help anyone, and at worst they'll get kidnapped and killed by rogue soldiers like what almost happened to Azura, but this time without anyone to bail them out, all because Ryoma's so upset at them for siding with Nohr that he used Elise's life as a bargaining chip to give them a hilariously one-sided ultimatum during an unprovoked ambush. Agreeing to Ryoma's terms at this point would have been hardcore character assassination, not the other way around, and incredibly stupid of them besides, since they have no way of knowing Ryoma would even keep up his end of the bargain once they surrendered.

> Chapter 13 has Corrin accept another mission for Garon, which is to put down the Cheve rebellion, and a very important question must be raised: what is Corrin's goal? Peace, of course, but how will they get there?

Clout-chasing. It sounds weird when i put it like that, but their entire goal at this point is basically just to get back into Garon's good graces in the hopes that they'll be given actual power to start changing things in Nohr, which is a lost cause because Garon only cares about Corrin insofar as they can be Anankos's next vessel, but they have no way of knowing that. Completing some missions for Garon is as good a way as any of gaining some clout with him as far as Corrin's concerned.

>and yet we've had both Kilma and the Sage saying that Corrin has the kindness and charisma to pull it off after having known them for five minutes.

Corrin spared Kilma's troops, is already considered royalty in Nohr, Kilma knows about the Yato and that whoever it chooses will save the world one day, and the only other choice he has is to doom his tribe to destruction. He's thoroughly justified in believing Corrin, and so is the sage, since he can see into the future.

> This continues what we saw in chapter 10, where Takumi is portrayed as unreasonable and Corrin just, and the attacks are only meant to emphasize that.

Anankos has clearly already started to fuck with Takumi's mind heavily at this point in the story. This is the first time in the story where he starts acting genuinely unhinged, what with him attacking the group completely unprovoked, refusing to stand down even when Corrin tries to talk things out with him, trying to kill Elise for no other reason than because she annoyed him, starting a completely pointless fight that only serves to make the Cheve resistance easy prey for Hans and his troops, and his last line has him say that he hopes that the pain in his head will stop if he kills them. Takumi is acting completely differently from the person he was in the prologue and, to a lesser extent, the person he was just three chapters ago, and the game acknowledges this mental degradation, along with foreshadowing that there's more to it than just Takumi being a sore loser. It's not meant to paint Corrin as just.

> At this point Corrin has no plan for how to quell this rebellion "peacefully" and doesn't even know why the people of Cheve are rebelling in the first place.

More baseless claims. Corrin never states that they don't know why Cheve is rebelling, they could have easily been told why on the way there, and it's heavily implied by their dialogue that they were going to try a repeat of what happened with the Ice Tribe, minus having to fight them first, prior to Takumi attacking them.

> Corrin is willfully ignoring everything Nohr has done, even telling Takumi to just go back to Hoshido, almost as if he should wait his turn, since Nohr is invading Hoshido as well. The protagonist is acting strangely detached from the conflict they're part of, as if all of these invasions and rebellions are just big misunderstandings.

Corrin never said that:

> Kamui: Please stop, Takumi! I won’t fight Hoshido soldiers!

>I only came to end the rebellion in Chevalier.

So, this is a pointless battle…

Later:

>Kamui: You’re wrong! It’s not like that, Takumi!

>We don’t have to kill each other, we can come to an understanding!

>Please just, listen to me…

Corrin telling Takumi to go back to Hoshido and that he has no business being there is tone-deaf, but that's entirely the localization team's fault. In the actual script, they're only asking Takumi to stop resorting to violence as his first and only option, something they're proven right in due to the fact that their being forced to debilitate the rebels in self-defense made a decent amount of them incapable of running away when Hans shows up. They also never ignore what Nohr did, in either version tbh.

> There is something to be said about Corrin refusing to do anything here despite risking their life to oppose Garon in the prologue. Even if you argue that the situation is different here, this feels like character regression and it does not paint Corrin in a good light,

I find it hard to see this as a regression instead of a progression; Corrin has now gone from being willing to pointlessly throw their life away for the sake of trying to save a few innocent people, even when the only thing that'll change as a result is them getting themselves killed along with the victims, throwing away any chances they could have had of actually making things better for anyone just because they couldn't be pragmatic, into someone who's aware that openly disobeying a direct order will only get them killed along with whoever the innocent victims are, ending any possibilities of them changing things in Nohr, and trying to more subtly undermine Garon throughout the story, since that's all they CAN do. It's a perfectly sensible development for them as a character from how they were in the prologue.

> and it makes people calling the protagonist kind and capable of ushering in a new era of peace ridiculous in retrospect.

Complete non-sequitur. Someone being kind and/or intending to bring peace to the land isn't in any way contradicted by them also not being willing to commit suicide for no good reason, especially when they know that doing so means never being able to bring peace to anyone or anything because they'll be dead.

> Since the Rainbow Sage knew everything about past, present and future, I guess he thought all the people in Cheve dying without Corrin doing anything wasn't enough to taint his image of the main character as a fantastic person.

If he can see the future, then he also knows Corrin does succeed in their dreams of bringing peace to Nohrshido, even if at a high cost; given that trying to stop Hans would most assuredly have meant even more people die at the end of CQ, yeah, i can see why the Sage would be understanding of their situation.

> By now you'd be forgiven for assuming Corrin has forgotten about the events of the prologue. Sumeragi's death, kidnapping, execution of prisoners of war, Gunter's death, the Faceless incursions, the sword, the invasion of Hoshido, and now this. There is idealism, and then there's willfull ignorance.

Translations get weird at this point, round 2:

Fateswartable:

> …That being said, coming here immediately after what happened in Chevalier, I can’t bring myself to enjoy the show.

> I wonder what Father thinks.

> If I have the time, it might be good to ask him who have Ganz his orders.

> I don’t think there was a mistake though…

Linkmstr playthrough (CQ chapter 14, timestamp 2:30):

> ...Even though he told me to have fun, i can't exactly bring myself to enjoy the show right after i saw such a scene back at the Chevalier Duchy.

> ...Just what could Father be thinking.

> If there's time, maybe i'll ask him about the order he gave Ganz.

> I just simply can't accept that way of doing things...

At best, Corrin wants to confront Garon about why he gave Hans the order, and at worst he's already almost certain that Garon was responsible for the order but wants to make sure, which is mostly hopeful thinking that maybe Garon wasn't that far gone.

Regarding Gunter, the translations get weird round 3:

Fateswartable:

> Kamui: Eeeh… you’re assisting me?

> ...Didn’t you try to kill me at the Infinite Chasm?

> Ganzu: That was inexcusable… Somehow, please forgive my rudeness of that time.

> That was because of everything King Garon told me about you.

Linkmstr CQ chapter 13, timestamp 6:25

> Kamui: So you'll be assisting me...

> ...Even though you attempted to murder me at the Infinite Chasm?

> Ganz: I apologize for that... Please excuse my behavior from that day.

> It was all to test you, as instructed by King Garon.

I'll happily give Odo that, assuming that the latter translation is correct, Corrin should have had a much bigger reaction to the confirmation that Garon ordered Gunter's death than just taking it in stride like they do, but i'll be charitable to Fates and assume that the first one is correct and Hans only blamed himself for trying to kill Corrin, not Garon, at which point i'm fine with them still assuming Hans lied to them at the Bottomless Canyon.

Lastly, ignoring translations, nearly everything Odo just listed can be chalked down to pragmatism on Garon's part (except Gunter's death and the sword, but Corrin has already been convinced that both of those weren't Garon's fault at this point in the story); telling Hans to kill a bunch of civilians for the incredibly flimsy reason that they might rebel against Nohr one day, when all the actual rebels had already been beaten, isn't pragmatic; it's cruelty for cruelty's sake, and borderline self-defeating, since that means they can't tax the people living there anymore. Corrin has every reason to suspect foul play here, especially when Garon has been perfectly willing to accept non-lethal methods as long as the rebellions stopped before; why would he change his mind now?

> We know who is singing, yet the game is doing a poor job of convincing us Corrin and the rest don't. I'm assuming the "disguise" is to explain why Azura can continue traveling with Corrin without Iago or Garon executing her, which like I just said is not convincing, but I also don't see what the point of making Corrin this clueless is either.

The game doesn't convey this well at all, i'll give you that, but i actually think it makes quite a bit of sense for the people there not to recognize Azura; she's not the only blue-haired woman in the continent, she's wearing a different outfit with a veil covering her face, her dancing is completely different from how she normally dances (intense and flamboyant instead of calm and composed), she starts the show by covering herself with water and then the entire stage near the end, she changes the timbre of her voice for this song specifically, along with singing it in a faster tempo than she usually does, and last but not least, everyone there was really far away from the stage, meaning she'd just look like a blue blob from where they're standing, nevermind everything else she did to make it less obvious that it was her on stage.

> By this point it seems Nohr can do anything it wants everywhere for whatever reason, and because we know so little of the world, we don't know how other countries react or even how many there are. It is a wonder there even are neutral countries in this world to begin with considering how cartoonishly tyrannical Nohr is.

The other countries are barely countries; they're tiny in both size and resources, couldn't hope to stop either Nohr or Hoshido if they decide to do something there, are called principalities in the JP version, and the only neutral countries left at this point in the story are either neutral in all but name (Wind and Fire Tribes) or haven't been conquered primarily due to their lack of any useful resources or territory they could give Nohr (Izumo and Nestra). Every other country in the game that we know of (that'd be actually worth the time and effort spent conquering it) has either already allied with one of the big two or is in the process of being conquered.

> It is, in essence, what Corrin has been doing up until this point; things have just worked out until Cheve, where they didn't know how to act when something didn't magically resolve itself.

Corrin has NEVER tried to indirectly undermine one of Garon's orders until this convo with Leo; the closest they ever came to doing so was completing their missions without killing people, which Garon never told them not to do and didn't care about them having done so even when he did find out. “Follow orders while trying to minimize casualties” and “pretend to follow orders while secretely undermining them” are two very different things.

Also, the only times things “magically resolve themselves” were when the Rainbow Sage killed himself (debatable since i'm almost certain Corrin would have just worked up the courage to kill him themselves if given a few more minutes) and Hans went on a state-approved killing spree and there was nothing Corrin could do to stop him; they fought off Iago's Faceless ambush, convinced Kilma to stand down through their actions and words, rescued Azura from her captives, repelled an attempted invasion of Nohr, kicked the Hoshidans out of Notre Sagesse, stood up for themselves when Ryoma tried to re-re-re-kidnap them, and beat the Cheve resistance into submission. This is a phenomenally bad faith reading of Corrin's resolve throughout the story.

> What happened to the Corrin we saw in chapter two? Now that they are more powerful, have more allies and have seen more of Nohr's cruelties, they suddenly allow bad things to take place in front of them without putting up a fight.

They grew up and learned that throwing their life away for no reason other than a heavy conscience, while perhaps making for a cute epitaph on their grave, helps no one, especially when most of the allies you're talking about are either loyal to Garon or to people who are themselves loyal to Garon; trying to do anything there would mean fighting almost all of their allies along with the army, and i don't fancy their odds in that fight.

> It's not a good look for a protagonist who's meant to be so kind, just and charismatic that people can't help but place their lives and dreams in their hands.

It's called pragmatism; being kind, just and charismatic doesn't mean killing yourself by trying to solo an army and then, even if they succeed, getting executed for their troubles, along with the few people left alive dying anyways when someone else shows up to finish the job.

> The game even goes so far as to prevent Corrin from killing a single nameless individual over the span of multiple fights just so they can preserve some moral high ground.

It would have been pretty hard to convince Kilma that they want to help the clan if they tried saying that while stepping on the still-fresh corpses of his clansmen; so would convincing people that the Nohrian army is trying to change it's ways if it DIDN'T change it's ways.

Besides, again, it's just a natural development for Corrin's character to not want to kill people if at all possible; there are a lot of explanations for that plot point besides “the writers want to give Corrin the moral high ground lol”, and i find it curious that Odo immediately jumped to the worst possible interpretation of the developer's intentions for these scenes.

> What has really been achieved thus far in the plot? Corrin's sword got a power-up, they put down a rebellion in a corner of Nohr which will never be mentioned again, we know Takumi is being possessed, and Hans killed a lot of innocent people when putting down another rebellion.

For the second time: something not being brought up again doesn't make it irrelevant, especially when a lot of this serves as character development for Corrin:

Corrin managed to reach a compromise between helping Garon in order to gain enough clout to change Nohr and still sticking to their morality when dealing with the Ice Tribe, faltered when given an order that directly contradicted their desire to not kill people, but got away with it the first time, had said idea completely broken the third time around when Garon proved himself willing to kill a bunch of civilians for little to no reason and there was nothing they could do about it without killing themselves, and found a new compromise with Leo by partially following Garon's orders and partially undermining them and trying to minimize the collateral damage, represented by the Yato finally growing in power at the same time as Corrin grew as a character. This is all pretty important character growth for Corrin.

> It's hard to find sympathy for supposed good guys shrugging at all the evil things Garon does and saying "yeah I don't get it either but what can you do?". This is a game that tries to paint both sets of siblings as different but equal, forced to fight each other under unfortunate circumstances, but one sides supports Garon.

“Supports Garon” is a funny way to spell “the Nohrian siblings know that they're not powerful enough to challenge Garon directly and would be executed if they disobeyed. As such, they try to undermine him whenever they can get away with it, even if they can only make small changes, and Xander alone has deluded himself into thinking Garon will come back if he just follows orders, but even then he still joins the rest of the siblings in disobeying him in secret whenever he gives really fucked-up orders”. I'd count being forced to work for a tyrant under threat of death as a pretty unfortunate circumstance.

> I'm sure Leo meant it when he and the other siblings try undermining their father when possible, but as both the massacre in Cheve and the hunt for songstresses in Cyrkensia show, and as the game will continue to demonstrate, the impact they can have is often minimal at best.

It's still better than doing nothing; it's the best they can possibly do, as a matter of fact, without just gulping down the years they spent growing up with and adoring the guy and just deciding to kill him, which risks them being executed for treason if found out and would destabilize the country even if it worked.

> However, while on the topic of villains, I do wonder why Hans attributed the slaughter in Cheve to Corrin which pleases Garon, when he clearly doesn't like the protagonist. He's quick to attack all the royals at the end of the game, and I don't think Hans is playing some 4D chess here. It's just...odd.

He didn't:

> Garon: Kamui. Word of Chevalier has reached my ears.

> You not only eradicated the rebels, but the unarmed citizens of the town.

> Kamui: Um- Father. About that-

> Garon: Well done, Kamui.

> Kamui: Eh…

> Garon: To hear that your troops devastated Chevalier made me very proud.

> The buds of rebellion should be picked before they bloom.

> You have also finally come around to see things my way.

> To hear that you got rid of the rebels, I was happy, even if I did not see it myself.

> Ganz also praised the Nohr royal family’s behavior.

He got reports from random soldiers, and since Corrin was in charge of the troops during that mission and didn't stop them, he attributed the slaughter to them. Hans just praised the royal family for something, presumably dealing with the armed soldiers first so the rest of the troops could safely execute the civilians.

I'll get to the whole “Hans and Iago attack the team” thing later (spoilers: it's stupid), but aside from that, Hans, just like Iago, also doesn't really seem to have anything against Corrin in the original script. Hell, he's even enthusiastic to be serving under them when they reunite before Cheve.

>The reason why people wish for gray morality in Fates is simply because the game at times tries to convince you that this is a nuanced conflict, usually through Xander, and yet we are constantly shown the opposite.

Xander's only line so far that tries to portray the conflict as nuanced is his speech at the end of BR, and even that's more just a general “there's no justice to be found in the middle of war” sentiment rather than him defending Nohr. The game rarely tries to portray the conflict as being more nuanced than it is otherwise.

And that's the response. Odo's a little too eager to portray Corrin as poorly-written, to the point of ignoring their characterization and/or development, along with criticizing them for not killing themselves for no reason; tries too hard to frame it as if the game is trying to demonize Takumi despite knowing he's been possessed; bizzarely decides to brush one of Hoshido's only morally fucked-up actions in the story completely under the rug and tries to portray it as if holding an innocent girl's life hostage is a reasonable demand; wants the characters in the game to see every morally questionable decision Garon makes as evil, even ones they don't know/have no reason to assume he had anything to do with and/or could be easily excused as pragmatism during war and calls the characters unsympathetic for not seeing it that way, even though he knows that they'd be killed if they disobeyed and already try to undermine him as much as they can; otherwise, this just shares most of the issues i already outlined in my previous posts.

See y'all next time.

#fe conquest #xander fire emblem #ryoma fire emblem #corrin fire emblem #fire emblem fates #fire emblem #reddit #story analysis

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emblemxeno · 3 years

Text

Edelgard’s Weird Family History

It’s honestly exasperating talking about Edelgard’s Brady Bunch family but like... let me explain in detail why it irritates me with a comparison to a similar situation in FE Fates. Here’s a small thesis on Garon’s concubines in Fates.

Fates Concubines

“Garon had lots of concubines who were vying for power and his favor. There were many children sired by Garon who lost their lives in various ways, the most notable of which being involved in concubine feuds and murdering one another. Along with this, Xander’s mother Queen Katerina was well loved and respected. Because of this, the second queen, Arete, and her daughter Azura were treated badly by the other concubines and Nohrian aristocracy. All of this was relatively unknown among the Nohrian common folk. The Nohrian siblings’ dynamic and way of life was shaped by these experiences.”

Supporting the Thesis

How do we know the concubines existed? They are confirmed by all of the Nohr siblings.

How do we know they were vying for power? Many of the Nohrian siblings’ supports confirm this, among which are Camilla/Niles and Leo/Elise.

How do we know there were once more siblings and that they lost their lives in various ways? The JP version of Leo/Elise confirms the concubines had their children kill each other, while the Fates drama CDs confirm that other siblings were lost by execution, falling in battle or getting captured by Hoshido.

How do we know that Arete and Azura were mistreated? Azura and the Nohr siblings confirm this, and Azura’s entire personality is a result of people treating her badly during her childhood.

How is this unknown among the common folk? Both Niles (Niles/Camilla) and Laslow (Drama CDs) reveal they never knew that such a thing occurred and react with shock when they learn. Not only that, but the common people and the Nohrian nobility are basically cut off from each other, the former living in an underground city/shutting themselves away and just trying to survive, while the latter lives above ground.

How do we know that these experiences shaped the dynamic of the Nohrian siblings? Many supports and story moments show this. Xander’s denial and inability to question things in fear of risking his family is because of his relationship with Garon and his regret of losing his other siblings. Camilla’s desire for love resulting in her unconditionally giving love to Corrin and her retainers is a result of her mom only loving her as a tool. Leo’s need for affection and validation from the family he has left (specifically from Camilla) is a result of being aware from a young age that he wasn’t loved by his mother. Elise’s pure and innocent outlook contrasts this because her mom was the least involved in the concubine feuds.

There are multiple sources and dialogue in Fates that you can use to support the initial analysis. Let’s try to do the same with Edelgard’s family.

Edelgard’s Family History

“Ionius had many consorts but had married for political reasons. He sired eleven children, his 9th child being Edelgard. Edelgard’s mother was Anselma, who Ionius had met at the officer’s academy on a romantic evening at the Goddess Tower. They fell in love, but Anselma was content with remaining a consort. Then Ionius tried to consolidate power to throne by taking power away from the Seven Noble Houses and consort kin such as Arundel. In the ensuing power struggle, House Hrym was destroyed, leading the other houses as well as Arundel to start an insurrection. During this time, Arundel took Anselma and Edelgard to Faerghus to escape political strife. Edelgard then returns to the Empire and is then experimented on by order of Those Who Slither in the Dark and the Nobles of Adrestia. All of Edelgard’s siblings were crippled by disease, went insane or died. Ionius could do nothing but watch in horror as all of this happened. As a result, Edelgard bore a second Crest and swore to create a world where such meaningless sacrifice is never again sanctioned, for the sake of her family.”

Supporting the Thesis.

Who exactly did Ionius marry for political reasons? Beats me. Why would he have to marry for political reasons as the emperor? Was Ionius unpopular and needed to do something to fix that? I don’t know. Nothing ever clarifies that.

Why does Edelgard say that her father and mother met at the officer’s academy, when it’s noted that Edelgard is the first Hresvelg in ages to attend? Is the word ages being exaggerated here? I don’t know.

Why is Ionius taking power away from consort kin including Arundel when it would no doubt negatively affect the one that he loves, Anselma? I don’t know. Maybe love wasn’t as big of a deal for him as political power was?

Why is only Edelgard noted to be taken away from the Empire’s political problems, and nothing is said of her siblings during this time, even by her? Who knows. Where does Ionius’ wife, the empress, go during all this? Who knows.

Why are the Adrestian nobles ordering experiments to make a stronger emperor when they just took away power from the throne? The best answer that I could give is that they want a powerful emperor they can control, but nothing really supports that part of the theory because Edelgard and the nobles mutually hate each other. Couldn’t the nobles just do what they want to do if the emperor was made that politically impotent? Probably! Then if what Edelgard said was true, why didn’t they do it already? I don’t know!

Why does no one but Edelgard and Hubert acknowledge the existence of the other imperial royal kids? Wouldn’t her noble classmates like Ferdinand at least be aware of them, especially if there were that many siblings older than Edelgard? No fucking clue.

If Edelgard swore she would change the world where such things wouldn’t happen again, why is she working with the perpetrators? Because she needs their power to topple the church. But why would she need to topple the church when the church preaches against abusing power blessed by the goddess i.e. Crests and tries its best to treat everyone equally? No fucking idea.

Conclusion

See what I mean? Edelgard’s family history is so damn sloppy. Some important aspects go unexplained and other important aspects are contradicted. In contrast, with the Nohrian royal family’s internal politics and power feuds, where everything noted to be important is supported by the text with no major contradictions in sight.

But the worst part is, that even if you go with my approach and say “Edelgard is a known fucking liar and information that solely comes from her mouth shouldn’t be taken at face value” well... then you’re left with ‘well if Edelgard did lie then what’s the real truth’ and you don’t get answers because the game doesn’t care despite those things being integral to the main cast of two routes.

Plus you have to suspend your disbelief that Edelgard is such a genius that she’s able to construct an entire false history regarding Adrestia’s hit sitcom “How I Met Your Consort Mother”. And Edelgard has her moments yes, but I don’t think she’s really that smart. Or maybe she is and I just can’t wrap my head around it.

So, yeah. Pick your poison. Suspend disbelief that Edelgard is such a fucking genius and/or liar or resign to the fact that the game’s writing can be really sloppy. Or pick both.

Or pick none, and believe that Edelgard is actually telling the truth about everything in regards to her family and what happened to them, with explanations that would make even a hardcore Watsonian like me dizzy with confusion.

#fire emblem #fire emblem three houses #fe3h #fire emblem fates #fe14 #fire emblem if #fire emblem discourse #edelgard discourse #long post #meta #storytelling

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the-worst-fe-player · 4 years

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☕ everything about fates and the drama give us an essay king

Lamo thank you to king/queen/royalty

Okay so I'm gonna break this down into segments and header it with a different colour some will he shorter than others. Also sorry if I spell names of county wrong and rember this is just my opinion

Story

Also heads up I played it in this order conquest -> rev -> birthrights I know I should have swapped rev and birthrights but it was really expensive and I was like 14

Fates story is not the best but deffently not as bad as some people said. Overall I'll be honst I liked conquest story but not birthrights which I know most people have the opposite oppion on but like I found conquest to be more fun I enjoyed the idea of sneaking around garons back with your siblings and being powerless at times to stop a lot of the things like the massacre where scarlet dies and ryoma death there where moments I just groaned at the screen but apart from that I had more fun. Birthrights I'll be real the story kind of bored me i only really found certain parts interesting but my favourite moment from fates actually came from birthrights and it was the Xander fight where he killed elise and then let corrin kill him it was tragic and sad and I live for angst ngl. rev story I don't remember to much sorry I mostly fouced on the characters ngl but that sence with the kid turning into the faceless was really cool and also the one with makoto and she fucks with you and the doors but idk if that's classed as story or gameplay but either way that was sick

Gameplay

Fates gameplay was soild as fuck I will die on this hill. The pair up was cool, the skills and classes where sick and the character balancing minor some major problems *cough xander ryoma takumi cough* was pretty cool and corrin is not nearly as broken as Robin or byleth. I like to play conquest the most because I'm a maschoist lol but even though most of revs maps where gimmicks I love them there so iconic, tbh most of fates maps are like I understand most of fates criticism but the maps, apart from rev as not everyone likes gimmicks, I just dont understand

Phoenix mode

Honstly play the game how you want to if that's on normal Phoenix go a head I dont care you play the game how you want to. Like yeah Phoenix mode may take away all the difficulty but casual took away perma death and that's the most played game mode because that's what people want and if people want Phoenix then just let them have it doesn't bother me I will never play it but I dont care if others do.

Corrin

Okay so I actually like corrin and before you look away I will explain why I think their dislikes and why I do like them and think how they could be improved

I think the promblem people have with Corrin is that they dont have enough personilty to be a regular character but they have to much that they can't be an avatar if you know what I mean. Like with Robin they deffently had a personily but they weren't the main character chrom was so it wasn't in your face as much yeah they made some important decisions whitch often did nothing but at the end of the day it lopped back to chrom and this is something corrin cant do everything has to be about corrin as there the main lord. But corrin is kind they dont want to kill common soldiers and that's never really addressed (as far as I can remember) why corrin wont kill like the sibling bit make sense but the common solider whitch could have killed there spouse is just frustrating at times and something not many people feel while playing. Corrin would have worked better if they wasn't a self insert that went against the average players emotions. But yeah I do feel people are to harsh on corrin as well though like with the whole not earning the Yaot witch is like they kind of did though it was the fact that who ever held the yaot would bring the world peace and they did it was there destiny to do so to fight in a war and mabey kill there family but even then I don't see people giving the three houses leaders shit for there wepons and they did less all they did was be born from a group of people that committed genocide! But also many people say nothing bad happens to them but at least in conquest and birthrights corrin suffers, in conquest the blood of what you think are your siblings are on your hands one forced to commit sucide and the other painful possed and then there the amount of murder they just had to watch and then birthrights watching elise die for them and xander pretty much letting corrin kill him and everything else like bruh this shit is sad and is also the reson I pray fe stops using self inserts and goes back to the older ways

Translation

Why! Why! Who thought that was a good idea Xander what did they do to him 🥺 I haven't finshed reading a direct translation of fates yet but its like so much better then the English version if you have the chance to read through it's worth it so much. Also same with three houses it wasn't as bad but like certain scenes are better like the really cringy reponse el had to dimitri on gronder feild actually makes sense and just especially if you like crimson flower as out of all the routs edelgard and cf feels like it got changed the most its just interesting ngl anyway onto fates again

The petting game

I know I would hate it as I already hate the wake the slug a bug up and the "you didn't blow niles hard enough" stuff but it was also optional so like idk i don't really have an oppion

Fan service (camilla)

I like big tits (as long as there not mine lol) as much as the next person who also likes that stuff but even I'll admit It was way to much at times especially the did you miss you big sister part like I enjoy camillas character I'm a sucker for a character with a tragic backstory, loves there family, cares for others a bit to much and could bench press me but the times where she was just fan severse sucked.

Paying for everything sprealty

I hate it:(

Characters

Leo♥️leo♥️leo♥️

Overall I like the majority of characters, here are my top 3 favs girls and boy

Best girls : Charlotte, orochi and Nyx

Best boys: leo, saizo and laslow (idk if he counts if not Forrest)

I always see people being like (x) was wasted in fates i wished they were in a different game but literally 3/4 of the cast have that said about them so like do yall hate the cast or love it :/

My overall oppion

I have mixed oppions over all I do like fates conquest is one of my favourite fe and I hope mabey in twenty years it will get re made with a better translation and some adjustments to corrin and the story

Thank you for the ask sorry this is so long and sorry if it makes no sense

#ask #anon #fire emblem fates #fire emblem meta #long post

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under-the-white-star · 4 years

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The Fire Emblem Fates routes especially revelations make a lot more sense after reading TV Tropes Fridge Brilliance section but Conquest is still the most idiotic route in the game. Anyway did you know that in Japan it is common practice to adopt non related and even adults for influence or one without a capable for centuries! So it makes sense it’s called birthright and not bloodline.

It maybe would have been more interesting if Sakura had been the daughter of Mikoto and Sumeragi. (she’s the youngest, so she is born after Mikoto’s arrival in Hoshido.)

Yeah conquest has not a lof of senses.

I mean since when a invasion is a peaceful solution? and people says that Birthright is the same but no, they don’t invade Nohr, they attack for stop Garon and his madness, they try to reason Xander, Camilla and Leo.

They have a plan. They try to reach the capital with not a lot of deaths.

But in conquest, how much people are dead for Azura’s stupid plan? Especially when Birthright shows us ANOTHER WAY to show the truth, when Azura uses it on Léo. Without killing anyone for get to a throne.

Ryoma is willing to give FREE food to Nohr (and people are angry about that)

yeah he didn’t do before. why? Why he should have done it before? When Norh has KILLED the king and kidnapped one of the royal children? That’s a freaking casus belli.

And people say “but it’s Garon’s fault, not Nohr’s fault” Yeah but Garon is still king of Nohr and want to invade Hoshido. If Nohr has problems, it’s because of Garon. So if they had removed the problem and give back the kidnapped child, Hoshido would have re-opened the commerce.

Hoshido is the PACIFIST nation and it’s CANON!! (it is said by the creators of the game themself) they never wanted war or stufff.

Also they may have kidnapped Azura but remember that Nohr has kidnapped Corrin FIRST. They kidnapped Azura in the hope to exchange her for Corrin. So then you can blame Garon to not have accepted to return Corrin, because if he had done it, he would have had his daugther back.

(Also this kidnapping may have saved Azura’s life seen how she was treated in Nohr!)

Also

1) Takumi is racist ONLY in the localisation, not in the V.O but seen what nohr did to his family, can you blame him? Also after have begin to knew them in Revelation, he has a changement of opinion and becomes more open and friendly.

So it’s was just anger and distrust? Yep.

The localisation has madea lot of nonsense XD

People say “but Corrin abandon her family in Birthright!! They grow up with them!! THEY’RE her family!” Yes but she not lived with them and we don’t really know how much Corrin could see their siblings. (The fortress seems to be far away of the capital)

And Yes! Leo and Elise didn’t know the truth about her and they really believe that Corrin was their sister. Elise accepts Corrin’s choice in Birthright and in Revelation and gets along nicely with the Hoshidians in Revelations too, but acts like a spoiled brat in Conquest....toward Sakura who never deserved that. Same for Leo.

But Camilla and Xander KNEW since the beginning and have lied to her. They say that it change nothing for them. Yes but it change a lot for Corrin because the trust is then shattered. And then come the doubt. And then the anger.

It’s easy to not see it, or easy to not think about it, as player, and just choose what we prefer, but if we think about Corrin’s feelings? they lovedtheir nohr family, they believed in them, they trusted them and then?

Xander says that he knew their origin since the beginning, that they had been kidnapped and all. He knew about Mikoto’s murder (so the murder of Corrin’s MOTHER) too since he was here just after the queen’s death. (he must have been aware, Léo must have understood it and told him)

Can you imagine what Corrin has felt at this moment? “How much they have lied to me then”? Corrin could even doubt about their affection since they lied since the beginning. “did they really loved me?”

It’s the point. I think. In Birthright, this shattered trust is so strong that Corrin can’t accept these lies from Nohr anymore. They are angry and they have all right to be. In Revelations, they suffer and refuse to fight their two family so they run away. Here, sadness seems to be stronger.

Yeah some things have no coherence and some routes contradict the others.

“we must invade Hoshido, and let Garon sits on the throne and then our siblings will see the truth” (conquest)

“hey Leo, look at the ball of glass! You’ll see the truth” (Birthright)

okay Azura okay

#Anonymous

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the-emblem-of-fire · 6 years

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What would all of the FE Fates royals favorite Disney movies be?

Disney and Fire Emblem? YES PLEASE!!!

Ryoma - Surprise surprise, Ryoma’s favorite Disney movie is Mulan. Not only does he have a better understanding of the culture, he really enjoys the symbolism and metaphors. He’ll be able to discern cultural differences and enjoys looking at the architecture of Chinese buildings. Additionally, the serious undertones of warfare strike closely to his heart, and he is also interested in the historical time-frame that the film takes place in.

Sakura - Sakura’s favorite happens to be the world’s first full-length animated feature film; Snow White and the Seven Dwarves. She rarely comes across people in books that resemble her so closely. While being sweet and soft-spoken, Snow White can also be stern when the situation calls for it, much like when she works as a healer. Seeing another gentle, caring princess that looks for the good in others makes her feel more self-confident.

Xander - The crown prince of Nohr prefers live action to animation, so when he sees Disney’s Chronicles of Narnia, he is instantly intrigued by the world’s similarity to his own. He is also fascinated by that world’s concept of magic, and finds the differences something to think about, and if you watch the series with him, you’ll be in for some long discussions. It won’t be long before he picks up the books to read.

Hinoka - Flying like the wind, it’s no surprise that Hinoka’s favorite movie is Pocahontas. She admires the heroine for staying true to herself even though circumstances were hard. She also likes the glimpse into this world’s history, its native peoples, imperialism, and colonialism. She’ll be left with lots of questions about this world’s discovery.

Camilla - This independent woman certainly appreciates Brave. She sympathizes with the bond between mother and daughter while also supporting the heroine’s freedom of choice. Not only does the landscape, culture, and music remind her a little of her own home, but she agrees with the notion that it’s up to each individual to change their own fate. And that yes, weapons can be allowed on the table.

Takumi - Not that he would ever, ever admit it, but Takumi is secret fan of Disney movies, and probably one of the biggest ones at that. His all-time favorite? Brother Bear. Maybe it was the bond between the siblings. Maybe it was the themes of revenge, acceptance, and what it truly means to be a brother. Whatever the case, he’ll be ecstatic to join in when it’s your movie of choice.

Elise - This girl just has to be the one to love Frozen. She can’t help it, the numbers are just so CATCHY! If they aren’t overplayed already, she’ll be singing each song by heart to the point that she drives everyone around her up a wall! But it’s sweet when she empathizes with Anna, a sprightly princess like herself, and she takes up the meaning of being a sister to heart.

Corrin - Corrin, whether male or female, brother or sister, really empathizes with Disney’s Tangled. There is something so familiar about Rapunzel’s sense of longing to go outside, the desire to be accepted by a parent who does not have her best interest at heart, the origin of her past being kept secret, and the need to be free of her tower, that it actually manages to make Corrin cry. But in the end, it makes them feel better knowing that everything turned out well for her.

Leo - He thinks that unrealistic representations of talking, animated characters is beneath him, but he reconsidered himself when he first saw The Lion King. It was taken after a critically acclaimed play? He wanted to know more. It surprised him when he discovered that he was enjoying the movie, especially as he tried to predict the plot. The murder of a king, the usurped throne, and the rightful ruler appealed to him so much that you sometimes catch him humming “I Just Can’t Wait to be King.” He would deny it until the end of time.

#fe #fe fates #Disney #disney movies #fe camilla #fe leo #fe sakura #fe takumi #fe elise #fe ryoma #fe hinoka #fire emblem birthright #fire emblem #fe marx #fire emblem xander

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thesummonerofaskr · 6 years

Text

Salt 2: Tharja

Rant under the read more.

Oh Tharja. How I hate thee. Let me count the ways. I was ready to do a rant upon this character back during the Enduring Love gauntlet after she won, the only character to take two wins after multiple gauntlets and prove that people absolutely enjoy psychopaths more then they love to admit. And I mean... I like psychopathic characters to a degree as well. I’m just more aware that if half of these characters I like were real, they would deserve to die in horrible, painful manners. But Tharja... Tharja doesn’t click with me. I don’t find her entertaining. Still, I decided not to do the rant then because I figured it would prove nothing. She took her second win and surely wouldn’t be in another gauntlet for a while, right?

Well now we have Winter Vs. New Years. And since as with any gauntlets they do internal eliminations first, we already have a million people predicting that the final match will come down to Winter!Tharja vs. NewYears!Camilla. And needless to say, while I am loathe to admit it, I do understand the anger and frustration that comes from the fact that the reason these two characters are so popular has less to do with personality and more to do with their physical assets. Because a lot of people who play this game consist of two groups, those groups being prepubescent straight men and prepubescent lesbians who see big tits and immediately rate that character high because “daaaaaaaaaaaaaaayum!” Meanwhile Faye from Shadows of Valentia has a similar personality with a more modest character design, yet notice how many people despise her because she isn’t built like a supermodel. A good number of these people who hate also like Tharja and/or Camilla. You wanna talk about double standards?

Now to be fair I know there are reasons to like Tharja. I like Camilla. And Faye, while cute, doesn’t get a lot of writing outside of her obsession for Alm. But if I had to take any of these girls in real life, it would definitely be Faye because she’s not ready to murder Celica for her man. That being said, though, why do I hate Tharja personally? I like Camilla. I like Henry. I even like Peri. It doesn’t get more problematic then Xander’s literal problematic servant. What’s my beef with Tharja?

Well for starters her personality doesn’t appeal to me. Tharja is dark and broody. She intentionally acts this way because she doesn’t care for social contact and because she feels it is the way a harbinger of death, destruction, and doom is meant to act, heavily contrasted with her fellow Dark Mage in Awakening in Henry whom is upbeat, cheerful, and has a bad joke or pun at the ready even while committing horrible acts of atrocity. Both are morally bankrupt as far as ethics go, but who sounds like the more entertaining character out of the two? Camilla may be as obsessive as Tharja, but she’s also got more charm in her unbridled and unquestionable love for her family as well as her adoration for children and animals. Tharja’s just kinda... dull to me. She’s either dull or scheming. All of her good acts feel forced because it doesn’t seem like the character she is. It’s similar to Peri’s support with Odin. Most of her supports involve her being heavily problematic and being scolded for her practical murder fetish, yet when Odin does it, she’s apparently leading a group designed to rehabilitate the disorderly such as her. I love Peri for being more entertaining, but she’s a psychotic bratty womanchild! Where the fuck did that come from?! But for Tharja, that’s nearly every support she has. The only one where you could see her being that nice is with her stalker crush Robin. Speaking of which...

My second gripe is that it’s never explained why exactly she’s obsessed with Robin. Nor is there any real way to headcanon it either. I once posited it might have something to do with Grima, but was then reminded that Tharja is willing to destroy Grima for Robin, meaning she cares for the man more then the dragon. So why is that so? I don’t know. Nobody does. Compare that to her expy in Fates, Rhajat. Corrin saves Rhajat when she’s a little girl from a life-ending experience. Then they save her again during the Faceless rampage. Rhajat was already smitten the first time, but the second time around sealed her obsession for Corrin. Camilla’s obsession? As she explains in her support with Niles (another popular character whom I despise, go figure), she saw Corrin as a scared, lonely child who now had the entire world against them as a Hoshidan in Nohr. During the Concubine Wars, she was a living weapon against her half-siblings, unloved by her own mother and hunted by her other family until the bloodshed ended and she was able to live peacefully with Xander, Leo, and Elise. She doesn’t want Corrin to feel as alone as she did and so she utterly smothers them with affection. She knows that her other three siblings can handle themselves since they also lived through those bloody times, but Corrin is this sweet, naive person who can’t even murder Hoshidan prisoners on King Garon’s orders. Clearly they need more affection and more time to grow in Camilla’s eyes. Faye doesn’t have as much writing either, but there’s at least enough to headcanon why she’s obsessed with Alm. She might’ve had a regular old crush on Alm as a child, but then Slayde comes to Ram Village ready to kill Kliff, Gray, and Tobin as well as her, though it’s implied in his dialogue and the dialogue of his men that she was also considered a target for rape! Because God knows the women can’t be spared in pre-Tellius Fire Emblem stories.That would naturally be a very traumatic experience that was delayed long enough for Mycen to come save them by Alm acting like this brave hero, charging out and punching Slayde in the face despite the fact that it would’ve cost both him and Celica dearly if Mycen didn’t show when he did. Psychologically speaking, Faye could very well see Alm as an anchoring point, something comforting to her now scarred psyche, and thus that dependency manifested itself into an obsessive desire that causes her to become more and more unhinged when she goes into battle alongside Alm and the others in the name of the Deliverance. But if I keep going on about how much I like Faye and how much I wish she’d gotten more development, we’ll lose the topic completely, so onto the final reason I hate Tharja.

You know what all of these characters I like do that Tharja doesn’t? They respect their children. Camilla loves children. Faye doesn’t have children as far as I know, but I imagine she would love them even if she does disappear for days on end because of that mangled psyche of her’s. Henry and Peri both end up surprisingly good parents despite their usual disturbing behavior. Even Niles, whom I stated above I do not like, is a good father... well as good as a Fates parent can be. Tharja, however? Tharja openly experiments with magic on her daughter. And here’s the thing. We’re not counting the Tharja in the future who went mad with grief and started experimenting on Noire to “make her stronger” or whatever. In Noire’s support with her father, she’s come down with a runny nose and it’s Tharja who cursed her with it. Progressing further reveals that he tried to get her to undo the hex only for her to move it to him as well. Noire gets upset because that was how it was even in the future and thus it seemed to her that nothing was changing, so by their A-Support, her father goes balls to the wall and takes all of Tharja’s cursing implements, which makes Tharja chase him around violently and this... lifts Noire’s spirits because it’s different. I’ve seen people try to defend this by saying “it’ll make Noire stronger,” but that is often used as an excuse by abusers to defend what they do to their children in real life. It hits too close to home and I find it absolutely disgusting that this is used by some of her fans to excuse her actions. A few others have mentioned it should be taken as goofy, but again this is a character who seemingly values tradition over mischief. I doubt that she meant her anger to be taken as if in jest. So as far as I’m concerned, she did it because she knew she could, because she knew Noire had taken it before, and because she figured Noire made an easy guinea pig, making her a shitty mother and a disgusting human being.

I can forgive a psychotic personality in fiction. I can forgive obsessiveness. I can forgive violence, especially since I can be quite an aggressive person myself. I can forgive a lot of things in fiction as long as the characters are entertaining. I don’t expect to make people like Peri or Camilla if they hate them. If either of those two were real, I imagine the former would need to be put to death immediately and the latter put in a psyche ward at least if not put to death as well. But Tharja isn’t just dull, uninteresting, and morally bankrupt. She also represents how disgusting some people will get in order to defend her. You can tell me how disgusting I am for liking Peri because “I’m woobifying a serial murderer,” even though I haven’t called her anything short of disturbed and monstrous, but I won’t try to turn around and convince you that it’s not her fault since her father raised her to kill people and encouraged her as a child to murder her butlers and maids since it made her happy. He should be put to death too, sure, but Peri is far too broken to realistically save and only Fates’ stock writing could even hope to try. I’m not gonna tell you to dislike Tharja if you’re reading this and like her. I only hope you have proper reasons to like her whilst accepting that she isn’t a hero, she isn’t a nice person, and she isn’t morally just in her actions.

Or you could like her because she has big tits, I guess. Seems to be the go-to reason for Tharja/Camilla fans.

#ooc #michele rants #character hate #not gonna tag the character's name #but it is in the title #sorry to all the fans if it shows up regardless

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someobscurereference · 7 years

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hey so i love your fe stuff! its soo good! but ive noticed that most of it is either gen or takes place after the relationships have gotten together (which is fine, i love that) but it did make me curious if youd be willing to share some of your headcanons (for odin/niles/leo, camilla/beruka/selena, and xander/laslow) for how they got together/developed feelings for one another? im very curious about your take on it bc i love your characterization! thank u so much for writing such beautiful fics

Aww, thank you, anon!! FE13/14 isn’t as popular as it probably once was and I definitely joined the writing fic for it part of the fandom pretty late, so I’m so pleased to hear that you enjoy my fics! Thank you!!

Secondly, anon….This is gonna be mega long and I hope you’re prepared for that, lmao (Also if you had any other questions or anything, don’t be afraid to send another ask!)

I don’t know if I have any “set in stone” headcanons for how any of these three pairs get together because I’m a multishipper who loves AUs, but if we’re talking about canon FE14 universe, I definitely have some thoughts as to how that’s going to go.

I’m gonna blabble a lot now

Odin/Niles/Leo

I actually feel like Odin would have the easiest time accepting dating people anyone, even if they’re a prince or a coworker or two people at once or he feels he has to travel to another dimension in a few years.

Like, he’s very? Pragmatic? Not necessarily 24/7 (because he loves to tell tales and exaggerate and roleplay) but Big Decisions. Like in Hidden Truths DLC, when Laslow and Selena are questioning where they should go when it’s time to leave Nohr–their home dimension with their family’s graves or to return to the world where their parents are still alive–iirc, Odin is the first one to say “We can worry about this later, we just have to deal with this now.” It’s not that he doesn’t care as much, because he super does, but I think he like? Compartmentalizes a little more? In the FE13 Future Past DLC, when he and Inigo are stuck on one side of the bridge and Brady and Yarne are on the other, Owain talks through what’s going to happen if they try to cross the bridge until he gets to the conclusion, “If you go and I stay behind, the most people in this scenario live and we still succeed, even if that means my death.” When Inigo cuts the brige with both of them on one side, Owain says, “We don’t both have to die!” Now part of this is Owain/Odin’s dramatic personality and the (probably unhealthy) self-sacrificing tendencies he almost certainly had during his years before jumping through time and even some time after, even Inigo acknowledges that Owain’s plan was probably the best way to get the gemstone to Ylisse (though not the best plan for Owain’s life.) He’s also the one who adjusts most to living in Nohr, by which I mean his homesickness and memories of Ylisse seem to weigh on him the least. While he admits to Selena in their Supports that he also is unable to sleep at night from his memories, Selena and Laslow’s Supports with him are more about their problems with missing home and he has become a kind of shoulder to lean on between the three of them.

Anyway all of this is basically evidence to say that Odin is pretty reasonable and levelheaded when not indulging in his imagination (which was almost definitely a coping mechanism of some kind in his younger years, though it may have become a bit more of an innocent hobby by the time he’s in Nohr… though I don’t want this to get dark, OTL)

ANYWAY! I think Odin is has the easiest time adjusting between all three of the Time Travel Trio, but I don’t know if he’s necessarily the one to make the first move in anything? If anything, it would have to be all three make a move at the same time (through some circumstance) or Niles/Leo get together first (even though Niles thinks his purpose in life is to “serve” Leo until he dies via their Supports and Leo probably wouldn’t want to put anyone in a weird position considering his status). I’ve written past stuff where Odin gets confident and does something bold like sit in Laslow’s lap and kiss him while Laslow bemoans never having a first kiss, and while I think Odin could catch onto moves being made on him and be down for it, I don’t think he’d be as likely to do something as bold as that for Niles/Leo like he would for someone he’s known years and years, like Laslow or Selena.

The thing about Niles is that… Idk, I don’t think he views himself as garbage? (Unless there’s a support I don’t remember.) But he definitely thinks of himself as “lower” than Leo, who he views as having saved his life and literally is the start to “good” memories in Nile’s mind. I’m not sure he’d ever make a move on Leo and compromise that relationship he values so highly unless it was something he felt Leo needed or something out of his control. (Like doing something to save Leo’s life and Leo is like “Hey do you have Feelings for me” and Niles, broken out in a cold sweat, hands shaking, answers “I mean Yes, but it doesn’t have to be weird…. unless u want that.”

For Leo, I don’t think he really thinks about love unless it’s right there in his face. Either because he’s thinking about marriage for political reasons/someone else is getting married or because Niles/Odin is hanging around a lot and he’s like “What is this Feeling, it’s highly inconvenient but I cannot deny it exists”. (Also another thing about him is that he’s probably a little uncomfortable with Nile’s… Pedestal, I guess? For him. Like, he knows Niles values him a lot and vice versa but when Niles is like “You’re the reason my life is good and I will serve you until I Die For You,” Leo is like “I don’t know what to say but I guess ‘Thank you’ is the right response.” So he probably wouldn’t want to take advantage of Nile’s feelings either.)

(The thing about all the Royal Nohrian Sibs is that they are under the watchful eye of Garon for most of their life, and that’s a huge influence on what they are or aren’t willing to do in terms of romance until the Big Slime is no longer an issue for them. So that’s a major factor as well.)

I think Niles and Odin make a great team, but Niles is initially very suspicious when Odin/Selena/Laslow show up out of the blue and even when he trusts Odin later on, he does use that suspicion as a little jab on Odin’s origins in their C-Support when they’re having an annoyed argument. They both apologize to each other later with Odin conceding that Niles was right and his actions weren’t out of line, and while Nile’s is like, “Aw, I shouldn’t have done that, Lord Leo trusts you and that’s enough for me,” the secretiveness of Odin’s past is like. An undercurrent in their relationship on both their parts for a long time. (While meanwhile Leo does not give a single fuck what you did or who you were before you met him so long as he knows what kind of person you are now.)

So with all this I can absolutely see Niles and Leo getting together and Odin being supportive from the sidelines for a Long Time as Niles/Leo either pine a little secretly (maybe separately) or they don’t really realize their own feelings for Odin or the idea all three of them could be a thing until later. (Bc Odin is not gonna intrude on something he feels he shouldn’t and when it’s a better idea not to.) (However, if that opportunity appears and everything is Chill, Odin is absolutely Hell Yeah, down for it.)

(This didn’t really come up anywhere before but? Leo and Odin’s supports?? Are so Much????? Like, Leo doesn’t want to send Odin out on any more “adventures” he used to because according to Leo: “uh that was to be a dick to you and I literally Cannot imagine living without you now because you’re so Valuable to me, so you can’t go on any Mega Dangerous missions, sorry.” He says he wont’ keep Odin from being his own person and leaving Nohr but that he honestly wishes Odin would stay and if he does leave, all the victories afterwards will be a little “bittersweet” without Odin there. Also if Odin does leave, Leo asks that he use his title as Leo’s retainer still so there will always be that “connection” between them.

Like??? Holy shit??

It was here that Leo struck me as the type of person to want Niles and Odin by his side literally Forever in whatever form that relationship may be, even if nothing romantic ever comes from it.)

Camilla/Beruka/Selena

My girl!! Selena!!! I love her!!!! I’ve probably written the least about Selena (I have like one unfinished Selena/Laslow/Odin fic on my computer and that’s probably it besides maybe a tiny Selena/Noire thing I wrote 2 sentences of and never finished either) but!! I think about her a lot and I love my girl!!

I rambled a lot with Odin/Niles/Leo so to cut to the chase here a bit more, Camilla/Beruka/Selena probably comes from Selena’s need to be validated and prove that she’s the Best. Camilla always reassures Selena that she’s “darling, powerful, and obedient,” which are qualities Camilla values a lot in a retainer. I think Camilla, for all her ruthlessness, also has a lot of love in her heart and so she is a little smitten with Selena (and Beruka) from the start because of these qualities they share. Camilla gets melancholy when she thinks about how Selena might leave her one day and wants Selena to know she is Camilla’s. I don’t think Camilla would ever do or say anything about her feelings while under the watchful eye of Garon because she’s not stupid and she knows what will happen if she tries to get too close to anyone while he’s within reach, but she’s not lying. When she says she loves Selena and Beruka, she really does mean it, even if her meaning gets lost in the context of all the other times she says she loves Corrin and Elise and her other siblings and such.

(As a side note, Camilla and Selena’s C-Support is so fucking funny to me because Selena is like “hey I’m your favorite, right?” and Camilla is straight up like “I would rather murder you than you leave” and Selena’s like “that’s not….what I wanted you to say…”. Camilla is so fucking Extra??? I love it. Though she’s honestly very scary too, so that element of humor is one I’m taking with grain of salt because Camilla is also truthful in her violence. Their B-Support is similar.)

This same drive to be the Best is what causes Selena and Beruka to butt heads in their C-Support, but they show they understand each other well by calling out each other’s complexities and flaws while arguing. Later, they show they care about each other by apologizing in the B-Support, and it’s shown for all her emotionless attitude, Selena can get Beruka to smile the tiniest bit while supporting her and telling Beruka that she should do the things she loves, even if that thing is work, and that Selena is her friend. (Beruka’s questioning of “Should I really bury myself in my work?” also shows that she took Selena’s earlier words of “What even makes you You if all you do is your work/only do things for money?”. So Selena’s views do impact Beruka.)

I’m rereading their A support right now and?? It’s so sweet? Selena wants to get matching jewelry for all three of them as a symbol of their connection (and for when Selena leaves) and Beruka accepts this, despite Selena requesting she not get something that doubles as a weapon, and also says she wouldn’t wear the matching jewelry if Selena were gone because it would be “lonely” and she’d only wear it if Selena were there so she wouldn’t lose it. Like? They value each other a lot. Beruka indulges Selena in this and by extension says she’s “enjoying” herself as well–something Beruka rarely does at all.

Beruka is a little more hesitant around Camilla, but that’s likely a response to Camilla being her employer and Beruka placing so much value in her work. It’s a complicated situation for someone who isn’t as casual as Selena or Odin are with their Lord/Lady. Beruka admits she would betray Camilla if offered something better from another employer, but that possibility is so unlikely because she doesn’t think she could find anyone she trusts as much as Camilla. For an assassin, trust is a big deal. Camilla is a huge part of Beruka’s heart even if Beruka doesn’t recognize it the same way someone else might. Camilla, on her part, is pleased but orders Beruka not to throw herself away in the process because Beruka means a lot to her. Their relationship is a bit different than Camilla and Selena’s or Selena and Beruka’s because of their unique dynamic and how seriously Beruka takes herself. Camilla is somewhat less affectionate when alone with Beruka, most likely because it makes Beruka uncomfortable. The affection is still there; Beruka just doesn’t yearn for it as much and so Camilla backs off a bit. Beruka is very truthful about the realities of life–both Beruka’s job and how she’ll probably stick with Camilla forever, even if she doesn’t explicitly say so. They’re good.

I’m getting off track again, sorry. I love character analysis. ANYWAY!

Camilla/Selena/Beruka would probably get together all at the same time because Camilla wouldn’t want anyone to misunderstand or feel left out (even if Beruka would insist she didn’t feel anything about it, she probably would.) Selena would probably push about being the Best Retainer again and Camilla would say something like, “Oh, but I love you both equally” and pull Beruka and Selena close. Selena would probably grumble something like “but do you really?” or “but who do you love more?” or something, letting a little jealousy take hold. Camilla probably wouldn’t stand for this, both on the basis that she loves them equally and that this has been probably going on for years.

To be honest, I could see them kind of… falling into it. Like Camilla kissing Selena’s forehead or cheek, leaving a big lipstick mark behind and while Selena sputters, face red and brain reeling, Camilla does the same thing to Beruka.

“Wha–What’s that supposed to mean?” Selena asks, eyes rolling in her head and steam coming from her ears.

“I told you,” Camilla says simply. “You are both my precious, darling retainers.”

Beruka, eyes closed in thought: “Hm.”

And before anybody can do anything else, Camilla’s like, “okay, chop-chop, we have things to do, people to kill” and they just go about doing their daily jobs and fighting battles. And anytime Selena or even Beruka tries to question it, Camilla’s like, “I told you, I love you both” and kisses their cheek again. Eventually maybe Beruka and Selena talk a little among themselves, but honestly I really see them falling into it after that. Kissing their foreheads every time they separate (never the mouth in the beginning, unless Selena or Beruka initiate because this isn’t supposed to be a pressured thing). Selena and Beruka heading off to their own rooms at night and Camilla telling them they can stay with her if they want. Selena’s a bit rowdy, but I think she’d be content with starting off like this just because it’s Camilla. (She might confront someone if anyone else tried to pull this move.)

(I take most C-A Supports for all party members as having really happened in-game eventually, so this might even be after Beruka’s support with Odin where he tries to help her understand her own emotions through mimicking facial expressions and looking within herself and stuff via lying about magic spells. So Beruka might discover a bit more about herself here too, like “Hmm, is this what love feels like? It must be.” Even though she’d probably been feeling it for a while and not recognizing it.)

Xander/Laslow

The thing about Xander/Laslow is that while Camilla and Leo have varying levels of more freedom between the two of them, Xander is The Crown Prince. He’s the one to take the throne. He has do what’s best for the people, and he’s always going to put Nohr before himself. On the flipside, Laslow is a flirt but he knows how fickle life can be and often laments the fleeting connections between people as they only have a short time in this world (he gets super melancholy in some of his supports; he hides his sadness a lot but it’s there), and I don’t think he’d want to jeopardize his relationship with Xander or put him in a bad position either. Plus, he’s super-duper homesick, so he wouldn’t want to start anything he felt he couldn’t finish either.

I really think there’d have to be a big catalyst for their relationship to begin. One of two things probably has to happen.

1. Something really relieves Xander of his pressures as King and makes him relaxed enough to maybe request a kiss or courtship from Laslow one day, if/when Laslow ever feels he wants it, no pressure (though I don’t know what this event would be; Xander feels LOT of responsibility. Duty chains him more than anything. Even if he feels mentally exhausted by everything and restraining his feelings on top of that, he’s always going to be stuck unless something forces him to move or slackens that grip.) (Laslow, in turn, is also chained by what he feels is his obligation and memories to return to Ylisse some day, so he’s stuck a bit too.)

2. Like in Home (Is Where The Heart Is) (spoilers), Xander realizes if he doesn’t do something, he will lose Laslow forever In This Moment, Right Now and (as this is a huge fear) Goes For It via Kiss of Life or pouring his feelings out. (I really think Xander is the type of person to make huge declarations of devotion and love while Laslow melts into a huge blushing puddle in the corner while crying from being overwhelmed.)

They would mutually pine. A Lot.

I’ve written a lot less for them but I’ve written so much already and I think at least one of these two events are really the needed qualifications for a Xander/Laslow relationship to happen in canon universe. (There are other AUs on ao3 that are super good and probably do a better job of imagination than I will here, so :p)

All three relationships probably have an undercurrent of Devotion For My Lord/Lady because they are all retainers/royals first and foremost and jobs come first, but that’s an interesting dynamic to work around in itself.

Even if were only friendship between them all, I really like how Odin/Selena/Laslow are so willing to say, “MY Lord/Lady is the best one!” (I’m mostly thinking of the Beach DLC where everyone fought for that beach trip, whether or not their Lord/Lady wanted it.) They love the Royal Nohrians so much, no matter the context.

(RIP Me, this is super long and I just spent the last 2 hours writing it. If there was anything you wanted me to expand on, let me know! I’m a blabber mouth.)

#fe14 #my text #death mention #odin/niles/leo #camilla/beruka/selena #xanlow #long post #you can probably spot who i love the most throughout this wall of text #but i love them all so much #there are lots of fics i'll never write but i think about fe so much

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autobee23 · 7 years

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Why did you feel the need to put "" around evil? Nohr (or at least Garon) was directly involved in murdering Mikoto and Sumeragi, and has been actively attacking Hoshido for at least a decade with plans for an outright invasion. Plans that are currently being set right the fuck in motion during the decision. By Xander who is leading the damn thing. Also what was Corrin if not a (unknowing) prisoner of war? Your post sounds like Ryouma is a mean old bigot while Xander is a sad innocent puppy.

I put evil in quotation because Corrin could go back to their Nohrian siblings or not pick a side, and in Ryoma’s POV he felt like he has shown the truth to Corrin that Nohr was not good people as they were meant to believe.

The Nohrian siblings, other than Xander, weren’t aware that Corrin was a prisoner of war, they assumed that their father found this orphan child and kept them far away to keep them safe, I believe in the Nohr Drama CD Leo mentions it, but I can’t remember on the top of my head.

Xander follows Garon’s orders yes, but he doesn’t agree with them 100%, he stated in his support with Corrin that he didn’t like some of the orders his father gave him and felt heavy on his heart, so he trained with his sword in a way to help him stay sane because in his support with Nyx she told him that he was on the brink of losing his sanity–hence where it’s connected in Birthright when he wasn’t thinking logically throughout the storyline, he was emotionally unstable because this sibling he has loved and taken care of flat out said “your father is evil and we have to kill him”, while Xander is suspicious of his father’s orders and decisions, he is stubborn to believe his father is not the same man anymore, unless you do Conquest and Revelation he sees the truth, but he doesn’t see it in Birthright until he is dying from his duel with Corrin.

I actually love both the Hoshidans and Nohrians equally, and I was just stating what their body language was giving me and for playing the game over a thousand hours, I think I know what I’m saying.

#anon #answer #fire emblem #I thought I made that post as neutral as possible #guess not #ah well #have my long speech

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adashofstarshine · 7 years

Text

Questions Leftover

Here’s the first of my FE14 musing posts in the wake of finishing Revelation I’m aware I don’t have the whole picture, not having played Birthright. (I read the script.) However I have a lot of questions left over that I don’t think the game answered. If you know the answers to any of these, feel free to educate me.

(Possibly part one of two when I remember other questions.)

SPOILERS BELOW

1) How old is anyone? I’m mostly asking for the Nohr siblings because they’re the ones I care about most, but I imagine their ages mirror the Hoshido siblings. I didn’t find a single age. I’m going to say they’re all in their twenties for now.

2) What exactly is Corrin ruling over at the end? If Valla is at the bottom of the canyon and is sealed away, what exactly are they ruling?

3) What happened to Queen Arete in Nohr? I assumed she was murdered because people didn’t like her as much as the previous Queen.

4) Why didn’t Nohr or Hoshido invade the other whilst their super powerful royals were busy in in Valla?

5) Why didn’t Garon stop Xander and Leo leaving? Was he just too mad in the end to stop them doing anything? Iago and Hans could have just ambushed them on the way to joining Corrin.

6) What did Zola do to Leo to make him the one who kills/tries to kill him in every route? He doesn’t get to in Birthright but he tries. I’ve decided to headcanon that Zola was friends with his mother and causes too many bad memories.

7) Are there anymore details about the concubine war anywhere? I know there was a difference in translation when it came to mentioning children killing each other. However there seems to be a lot more detail around in the fandom than I’ve seen in game. (Would like to talk about this because I...may have a fanfiction in the works.)

8) When do parents actually visit their children in the Baby Void? Do only the units you don’t use get to visit? How do they even get into the baby void? How does it work, how do they choose a section to put baby in? Are there people you can employ as nannies in there?

9) How did Inigo, Owain, and the lady I’ve forgotten the name of again get there? Did they fall out the wrong portal and decide welp, we live here now, time to change name and class? Also (I’ve only seen pictures so this may not be right) did Saizo give birth to Gaius? How does he end up in Ylisse? That portal from the free Awakening DLC?

10) If Garon was ever a better father why did he let the concubine war happen? When did he stop being a good father? When he got possessed? What order did anything happen? (I’m still miffed we never the Nohr sibling mothers.)

11) Has Nohr always been evil or is Garon the cause? The capital city looks like a hellscape, it looks deliberately set up as ‘evil country’. We know there’s extreme suffering amongst its people but how long as this been happening? Was the invasion of Hoshido once to get some more land to grow more food on or was it always for destruction purposes?

12) Who are the Gods exactly? We know there are dragons about, including the Dusk and Dawn Dragons, plus Anankos. However very few people actually seem religious enough to believe in them. (I can only think of Forrest off the top of my head.) Which is why Anankos angry? Did the dragon gods do their typical act of giving the humans some shiny things, some bloodlines and then vanishing off? Because I guess that means FE14 has some contingency with other FEs if so. However who were they protecting the humans against by blessing them this time? Other dragons I guess.

13) What makes Dragon Veins? Did the dragons make the world and leave them there? Are they places dragons have walked? Considering they are a gimmick for this game in particular, they weren’t explained much.

14) How did Garon know Corrin could turn into a dragon? I assume that’s why they’re in their own little fort. If it was to stop them being found by Hoshido, it would be better to hide them in the capital.

15) Where does Azura go? Is she going to crop up in another game, is that why her ending quote is always mystery. She’s not dead she doesn’t have to vanish.

16) How does the army travel and camp? Do they warp to and from Fort Corrin, if not when do they go to Fort Corrin, is it where they go when they make camp and then return to the same place? If so how do they get the stock for their shops? Is there a troop assigned to collecting groceries wherever they go? Or does dragon magic make that?

#Dash plays FE:Revelation #Dash plays FE:Conquest

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fatesdeepdive · 2 years

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Entry 80: Oops! All Supports Volume #13

Ah, Supports. Because I wrote all these Paralogue recaps months ago, this is 95% of what I actually do for this blog.

Support: Leo/Xander

C: During a war meeting, Leo raises his hand to say something but pulls it down, because he knows that Xander's opinions are more valid.

B: Leo tells Xander that he became a mage because he could never be as good at sword-fighting as Xander.

A: Xander says that, before Leo became a mage, Xander feared him overcoming him, because Leo's inferiority complex made him train so much harder. According to Xander, Leo nipping at his heels made him stronger. Leo decides to speak up to Xander in the future.

Review: Pretty good, showing Leo’s inferiority complex and Xander being a good older brother. I also enjoy Xander pointing out that yeah, of course he’s better at fighting than Leo, he’s like ten years more experienced.

Support: Arthur/Effie

C: Arthur says he isn't a good enough bodyguard for Elise when compared to Effie, who dedicates every moment of her life for Elise. Effie says not to worry, because Arthur is Elise's hero.

B: Effie tells Arthur he isn't there enough for Elise because he's always busy helping other people.

A: Arthur decides to focus only on Elise. Effie tells him to go back to getting cats out of trees.

S: Arthur orders a ring, but it is mistakenly delivered to Effie, leading to a wacky proposal. Effie initially declines, because she's basically married to Elise already, but ultimately accepts.

Review: Arthur, as always, is a treat, and makes this Support great, even if there isn’t much going on in it.

Support: Camilla/Selena

C: Selena asks Camilla if she's her favorite. Camilla says that Selena is strong and cute., but refuses to say she's the best.

B: Selena asks why Camilla chose her as a retainer. Camilla says it was because she has a weakness for lovely girls, and also that she's good at fighting and devoted. Selena asks if Camilla would be sad if she went back to Ylisse; Camilla says that wouldn't happen because she'd cut off Selena's legs first.

A: Camilla talks about how Selena is hers and hers alone and how she is sad about the idea of Selena leaving her. Selena says she'll tell Camilla before she leaves.

Review: Camilla sure is heterosexual in this conversation. Setting that aside, this one is fine, but I feel like there are too many supports where the Awakening trio talk about leaving.

Support: Benny/Beruka

C: Benny and Beruka talk about how they're both quiet and awkward. It is quiet and awkward.

B: Benny tries to talk to Beruka again and she threatens to kill him.

A: Benny keeps talking to Beruka says that he wouldn't go down easy if she tried to kill him.

S: Benny and Beruka sit in silence until he proposes.

Review: Shockingly pairing off the quiet characters results in a boring Support.

Support: Jakob/Peri

C: Peri orders Jakob to make her tea because he's a butler. Jakob says no so she threatens to kill everyone in the camp. Jakob points out she would be executed, so she calls him a meanie.

B: Peri says she hates Jakob because he's mean for saying murder is wrong. Jakob says he doesn't hate her because she's a good soldier. Peri decides she loves him.

A: Peri offers to cook for Jakob, which she's good at because of her knife skills honed on the murder of innocents. Jakob says she confuses him and Peri replies that she's perfectly normal.

S: Peri proposes and Jakob accepts. Peri decides that he's her butler now because husbands are basically the same thing.

Review: On one hand, Jakob is always entertaining. On the other, Peri. So overall, it’s fine.

Support: Camilla/Silas

C: Camilla asks Silas to deliver a message to Corrin about how she loves them.

B: Silas informs Camilla that Corrin didn't really care about the message, on account of Camilla saying the same thing to them a hundred times a day. Camilla reveals the tragic backstory of the time she baked Corrin cookies and Corrin didn't get a chance to eat them.

A: Silas reveals that he fell in love with Camilla when he was a child.

S: Silas proposes and Camilla rejects him because she thinks Corrin will be jealous. She accepts when Silas reveals he got Corrin's blessing. The duo argues over who gets to tell Corrin about the engagement.

Review: You know how I’ve been consistently disappointed by Silas’s lackluster backstory and the non-existent explanation for his obsession with Corrin? Well here you go, here’s the answer, he followed Corrin to the end of the line because he was thirsty for Camilla. Now, that may not be what the writers intended, but that’s how this Support comes across and at least it’s an answer.

Support: Elise/Niles

C: Elise doesn't want to go to a war meeting because everyone treats her like a kid and she doesn't understand what anyone talks about. Niles recommends she studies and acts like an adult.

B: Elise goes, but the others tell her she doesn't need to show up because she's a child. Niles tells her that her problem is that she both wants to be an adult and the young little sister, and that they still think of her as a child because she acts like one.

A: Elise gives a good suggestion at the war council and is praised by her siblings. Elise says she'll rely on Niles because he gives hard advice.

S: Elise marries Niles because he doesn't sugarcoat things.

Review: A pretty good Support. Niles is surprisingly laid back in this one; at first I was wincing at the idea of him doing his normal creep routine towards a child, but instead he’s a sensible, intelligent advisor.

Support: Laslow/Nyx

C: Laslow asks Nyx out. She says no because A: she doesn't like crowds, and B: she's a monster.

B: Laslow finds an isolated cafe. Nyx says he should leave her alone because she's a monster. Laslow reveals that he left people for dead, meaning he's a monster too.

A: Nyx says Laslow isn't a monster because he's one of her allies. Laslow says the same.

S: Laslow asks Nyx if anything is a universal constant. The answer is love love is a universal constant.

Review: This was a very by the numbers, very predictable Support, but still Laslow talking about his past is always nice.

Support: Camilla/Elise

C: Elise asks Camilla how she can be mature like her. Specifically, how to be curvy like her.

B: Camilla advises Elise to be kind and forgiving, except with enemies fucking kill them dead. She also recommends to eat properly, exercise, and get plenty of sleep for big tiddies.

A: Elise says she wants to be like Camilla and confirms she dyed part of her hair purple to be like her sister. Camilla says Elise's innocence inspires the rest of them to fight harder and that Elise shouldn't fight change.

Review: This is a dumb Support. Shouled we show Elise being insecure when measuring up to her older sister? Nah just have her ask how to have big boobies hahaha. Camilla is good in it, at least.

Support: Midori/Siegbert

C: Siegbert reads a book on military tactics. Midori asks him why they can't just talk their enemies into surrendering or trade things other than lives. Siegbert says that some men who are fine with violence. Like most of his family, for example.

B: Siegbert is stressed about the war, so Midori offers medicine. I am, no joke, writing this entry on 4/20, which is fitting. Siegbert says he doesn't need dank kush because he has kind companions like Midori to cheer him up.

A: Midori makes Siegbert a calming incense. Out of cow shit. S: Siegbert is stressed out, so Midori tells him to rest, because she loves him.

Review: This one is lackluster and unfocused. Still, I’m digging Siegbert. Monarchies are bullshit, but setting that aside he’ll be a better king than any other Nohrian royal.

#fire emblem #fire emblem fates

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fatesdeepdive · 3 years

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Entry 16: I Really Hate Camilla

First off, castle stuff. In addition to a bunch of new statues, we can upgrade a few old buildings. It’s nice, but not super interesting and not really worth devoting the first several lines of this entry to. On to the supports.

Support: Azama/Mozu

C: Azama tries to talk to Mozu and she immediately runs away, because she’s heard rumors about Azama being awful.

B: Mozu runs away again, screaming that she’s afraid Azama will make fun of her clothes or accent. Azama revels in knowing all of Mozu’s insecurities.

A: Azama catches Mozu, but doesn’t make fun of her, because it was more fun watching her freak out and run away.

S: Mozu talked to other townsfolk about Azama being awful, making new friends along the way. Which makes Azama tormenting her good, I guess. Azama tells her he finds her weirdly irresistible and they get together.

Review: This is the worst S-Rank I’ve seen thus far. Setting that aside, this conversation is fine. Mozu treating Azama like a normal person would is fun and Azama reveling in her fear is in character.

Support: Hinoka/Kaden

C: Kaden grooms the army’s pegasi. He is very good at it, impressing Hinoka.

B: Kaden teaches Hinoka pegasi grooming, emphasizing the importance of love.

A: Hinoka offers Kaden a ride on her pegasus.

S: Hinoka gives Kaden a brush made from her pegasus’s hair. The two of them get together because they’re both kind people.

Review: This one is okay, but a bit bland because it has no conflict.

Birthright Chapter 13: Another Hope

The gang arrives in Cheve. Camilla shows up and hugs Corrin. The camera...makes some decisions during this cutscene that made me realize that I hate Camilla’s design even more. First off, I just realized that she doesn’t wear pants. She rides around on dragons in her underwear, which must be incredibly uncomfortable. Secondly, why is there a random strap between her breasts?

Camilla acts nice for like ten seconds before attacking us. She rants about how the Hoshidans stole Corrin, ignoring the fact that Corrin told her ten seconds ago that she left because Garon is evil. Hans runs in and the battle begins. From her boss perch, Camilla mentions that she loves Corrin and wants to hold her body like a baby after she murders her.

So, are you starting to understand why I hate Camilla? Xander’s a prick, but at least he isn’t creepy. Every single line from Camilla is this obsessive, uncomfortable, incestuous horseshit. I don’t want Corrin to go near her, even in Conquest, because Camilla’s treatment of Corrin makes my skin crawl. And don’t pretend it’s supposed to be maternal and not sexual, when the anime cutscene that starts this chapter cuts between her ass, crotch, and boobs before showing her face. Camilla is supposed to be the mommy dom fanservice waifu for the player to jerk off to, and Corrin is supposed to be an extension of the player. I really, really, do not like Camilla.

This chapter is filled with houses the player can visit to get short bits of dialogue and good items. The villagers the player speaks to mention a resistance leader named Scarlet and her powerful new recruit. The chapter also features Dragon Veins which can be used to call down lightning on enemies; one can be used to make fighting Hans easier, but I didn’t see it and just took him out with Corrin and Takumi. Hans’s defeat quote is actually “Not again...”, which is fitting because he already died like ten chapters ago. Twice, if I remember correctly. And he shows up again after this, because Hans is apparently immortal.

Camilla is accompanied by her two retainers, an assassin named Beruka and Severa from Fire Emblem Awakening, because apparently all of Lucina’s crew work for Nohr now. Can’t wait for the chapter where Cynthia helps Leo burn down a children's hospital. Camilla actually used one of the Dragon Veins and almost killed two of my units, which is a nice bit of design. She ultimately went down to Setsuna and I beat the chapter with little effort.

After the battle, Camilla insists that Corrin be the one to kill her, because Camilla exists for the sole purpose of making Corrin uncomfortable. Corrin spares her and explains that Garon tried to blow her up, something that I guess Xander kept a secret, because he’s an asshole. Camilla is about to turn sides when Leo shows up and tells us to stop trying to gaslight her. Camilla protects Corrin from Hans and Leo shouts that he will erase Corrin from his heart. If Corrin is a boy, he actually gets a really nice line where he refers to himself as Camilla’s only younger brother, cutting Corrin out for betraying Nohr.

A random general shows up and kicks Leo’s ass. The game tries to keep his identity secret by covering his face and having his name by ???, but he is very clearly voiced by Matt Mercer, meaning that it's obvious that he’s actually Azama in disguise. Scarlet and the other members of the resistance show up and scare off Leo, Hans, and Camilla. The chapter ends with the general unmasking himself, revealing that he’s actually Ryoma. Who would be a terrible general because of his poor defense growths.

#camilla fire emblem #corrin fire emblem #corrin x camilla #fire emblem #Fire Emblem Fates #fe 14 #fire emblem birthright #ryoma fire emblem

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fatesdeepdive · 3 years

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Entry 7: The Hardest Choice

Chapter 6: The Path Is Yours

We rush into the battlefield from the future vision prologue and find Xander and Ryoma dueling. Xander, after making sure Corrin is okay, announces that Nohr is invading Hoshido to show off their strength. He points out that ending things quickly will prevent unnecessary bloodshed, which is a fair point. But, you know what else would prevent unnecessary bloodshed? Not invading Hoshido.

The two families argue over ownership of Corrin and she is forced to choose a side. Stand with her genetic family and fight to defend Hoshido from violent invaders, or stand with her adoptive family and invade a neighboring country, slaughtering countless civilians in the process. Or play the DLC route. Or go play Super Smash Bros.

And I mean, is this even a choice? Nohr is evil. Like, insanely evil. Ten minutes ago they blew up a marketplace and killed dozens of children. They’re invading Hoshido for shits and giggles and we’re supposed to side with them? Corrin’s supposed to be a good person, why the fuck would she ever join Nohr’s army?

And it’s not like Corrin has any love for Nohr as a country. She spent fifteen years in prison, she doesn’t know the people. Hell, she hates how Nohr looks and feels. Garon murdered her parents, kidnapped her, held her captive, and tried to murder her. Twice.

There is only one reason to join Nohr: love for Xander, Camila, Leo, and Elise. And that’s a relatable reason, standing by your family even if they’re evil. But, it feels cowardly to kill innocent people just because you don’t want to fight your family.

No, not cowardly. Evil. This is a choice between good and evil, with both sides holding up signs saying which they are. And that’s part of the problem with this game. Nohr is so ridiculously evil and Hoshido is so ridiculously good. At this point, we have seen no justification for any evil Nohr does. They’re evil for the point of evil. And even when Hoshido does shady things, like kidnapping Azura or having a mind control barrier, the game glosses over it to avoid having the good guys be morally grey. And let’s be honest, it’s kinda infuriating that Intelligent Systems, a Japanese company, made a game where the most explicitly Japanese kingdom in the franchise is pure good and the European kingdom is cartoonishly evil.

This game tries to paint this as a choice between two families, and that doesn’t work. Painting it as a choice between two families lessens the impact of siding with Nohr to protect your family. Plus, again, the Hoshidans are strangers. Hoshido is not Corrin’s home and the Hoshidan royals are not her family. The only one who was given enough screen time to feel like family was Mikoto, and she’s dead. Maybe it’s a cultural thing, but I really don’t give a shit about Corrin’s blood. I’m not choosing Birthright because I want Corrin to claim her Birthright, I’m choosing it because Nohr is cartoonishly evil.

And here’s the kicker, the ultimate reason to choose Hoshido: Garon tried to murder Corrin. Twice. First with Hans at the bridge, then again with the bomb at the plaza. Choosing Nohr is suicidally stupid. I know Corrin’s naive, but this is just idiotic.

And Corrin doesn’t even bring this up. She doesn’t shout to Xander, “Hans attempted to murder me as we were fleeing the Bottomless Canyon, apparently working under orders from King Garon. I do not feel safe returning to Nohr.”

No, she doesn’t explain jack shit. She lets Xander think she’s betraying him, when in reality she’s just doing the right thing. Corrin is an imbecile and it makes this game painfully dumb.

Birthright Chapter 6: In The White Light

We chose Hoshido. Right away, the chapter title screen changes, going from the mix of white lilies and black roses from earlier chapters to just white lilies. The text boxes also get a new blueish tint. Corrin tells Xander to withdraw his troops and that she’s siding with Hoshido.

Xander says that Corrin must be brainwashed. He reveals that he’s known all along that Garon kidnapped Corrin as a child. Something that he kept from Corrin, because he’s a great older brother. He tells Corrin that they are family, regardless of blood, and that Garon will forgive her. The first one of those is true, but the other is laughable. Has he ever met Garon?

Corrin tells Xander about Garon blowing up the plaza, killing dozens of innocent people, and endangering her life. Corrin calls Garon evil and Xander, apparently ignoring the whole mass murder thing, gets pissed. Corrin asks him to join her and Xander attacks her. Prick.

Side note, the music in this scene is fantastic. It reminds me of the Midmire theme from Awakening and really feels hopeless. Xander beats the shit out of Corrin and Ryoma runs in to save her. The two princes duel, and the battle begins. Also, Jakob shows up.

Ryoma, Hinoka, and Tamuki join Corrin as the two families battle. Interestingly, those three are listed as being part of a different army on the bottom screen, implying that they won’t be around after this battle.

Ryoma

The crown prince of Hoshido. A swordmaster with impeccable strength, skill, and speed. His personal skill, Bushido, makes him fight better when supported by low level units, fitting his honorable Samurai aesthetic. His armor looks cool, but he has crazy, Raditz length hair and this weird horned crown that I dislike. He carries this cool lightning katana called Ranjito. Personality wise, he seems a bit dull. He’s a loyal, protective prince, but at first glance there isn’t much more there.

Hinoka

Corrin’s older sister and a Sky Knight. Her personal skill buffs damage of nearby allies. I kinda like her tomboy haircut and lack of a ridiculously big bust, she looks more like a normal person than most Fates characters. She seems really protective of Corrin and her homeland. Also, I kinda hate her voice.

Takumi

Corrin’s brother, an archer. Who is a prick. A massive prick. He has a massive attack stat for an archer and wields a custom bow that shoots arrows made of light. His design isn’t too interesting, aside from the ponytail that looks weird because it’s cut off by the edge of the screen in his portrait. Personality wise, Takumi is a prick. He’s the best written character in the game, from what I remember. But he’s still a prick.

Also, I suppose I should discuss the Nohrian royals now, because by the time I play Fates my perception will be clouded by the events of Birthright.

Xander

The honorable prince of Nohr. Our protector turned enemy. A Paladin reminiscent of Camus, Selena, and Mustafa from past games, willing to stand by his country even if it is evil. Stat wise, Xander is an absolute tank. His personal skill is called Chivalry, a parallel to Ryoma’s Bushido. It boosts him when fighting enemies with full health. I love Xander’s design, the black and purple with an ascot that makes him look both intimidating and regal, the small black cwon, and that face. He looks like a man tormented by his own actions. I love Xander’s personality, this honorable man who, when forced to choose between his family and his morals, chose the former. He’s actually a good parallel to Corrin, now that I think about it. That said, he is a bit dumb, and trying to kill Corrin was a dick move.

Camila

Ugh. Camila. She’s a new class called Malig Knight, basically a Wyvern Rider with magic abilities. Her personal skill boosts the damage done by allies. Her design...sigh...her design is very, very, very fanservicey, with massive titties and exposed cleavage. Camila is a fanservice character, which is a trend in Fire Emblem that I’m not fond of. Personality wise she’s...creepily obsessed with Corrin, to the point of being kinda incestuous. Ugh. Camila was this game’s breakout character and that’s really disappointing, because she’s probably the worst of the royals in my opinion.

Leo

Leo’s a Dark Knight with a personal skill called Pragmatic that boosts damage against already injured foes. I like how his armor looks; the collar is a bit much, but it’s kinda charming. Also, he looks like he’s Xander’s brother, which is something that they forgot to do with the rest of the royals. Personality wise, he seems to be the only character in this family that isn’t a gigantic moron, which is refreshing. The trick with faking Kaze and Rinkah’s deaths was nefarious, but kind, which is a trait I like in a character.

Elise

The other moe healer little sister, now on horseback. Her personal skill reduces damage done to nearby allies. Design wise, she looks adorable. So adorable that she should not be a soldier and should not have children. I do like the pigtails, although it is weird that they’re both purple and blonde. She’s a bit more forceful in her personality than Sakura, which is good. She’s cute but not boring.

The battle, if you can even call it that, was basically just a quick fight between Ryoma and Xander. After the Nohrians retreat without saying anything, Corrin swears to stand with Hoshido, even though it's the hardest choice she’s ever made. Even though, as we’ve discussed, it isn’t a hard choice at all.

Also, the intro plays again. Nothing is different this time, but it does play again. After that pointless interruption, Lilith shows up again. Remember Lilith? She was important a few chapters ago. And then wasn’t mentioned again until this moment. Lilith takes us into the Astral Plane, introducing us to a new mechanic: My Castle. Which we will get into, next time.

#fire emblem #fire emblem fates #fe 14 #corrin fe #xander fe #ryoma fe #takumi fe #hinoka fe #camilla fe #elise fe #leo fe #fire emblem 14 #fire emblem birthright

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fatesdeepdive · 3 years

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Entry 54: Demigod Shit Magnet

Got a lot of stuff to talk about, no time for intro.

Class Profile - Ninja

The Nohrian thief class and base class of Saizo, Kaze, Kagero, and Asugi. Has good speed and skill and that's about it. Wields shurikens, which make them work best for inflicting debuffs. Also oddly good at mage killing. Oddly enough, the game considers them to be the Hoshido version of a Cavalier. Their first skill, Locktouch, is a utility skill that allows them to open chests and doors without a key. Their second skill, Poison Strike, deals 20% damage to enemies after battle but cannot kill, helping establish their niche of injuring enemies from a distance so stronger units can come in and finish them off. Ninjas can promote to Master Ninjas or Mechanists. I like the Ninja design a lot; the light armor fits well and the scarves, headbands, and arm knife thingies look cool.

Class Profile - Oni Savage

This game’s version of the Barbarian class and Hoshidan rival to the Fighter class. Wields axes, can promote into Oni Chieftain or Blacksmith. Weirdly, Rinkah is the only Oni Savage in the game, making the fact that it has two exclusive promotion classes weird. Oni Savages have great strength, hp, and defense, countered by atrocious luck, skill, and resistance. They can do good damage, assuming they can hit anything, or act as a wall, assuming they don’t die instantly to magic or a crit. Their first skill, Seal Resistance, lowers an enemy’s resistance after combat. I do not know why this was given to this class. Their other skill, Shove, is a utility skill that can be used to move a neighboring unit one space away. I actually like the Oni Savage design, despite it being ripe for fanservice, because the male and female designs are similar. My problem isn’t barbarians being shirtless, it’s when the game does stupid shit like have the female version of a class wear a thong while the male wears pants. The mask and beads worn by generic Oni Savages are also a nice touch.

Class Profile - Monk/Shrine Maiden

This game’s version of the Priest and Cleric classes, Hoshidan versions of the Troubadour class. Sakura and Mitama are Shine Maidens, while Azama is a Monk. Oddly enough, despite this game mostly getting rid of gender-locked classes, these two remain separate. They’re basically the same class, though. Both wield staves, have the same skills, and have good speed, luck and resistance, hampered by awful defense and HP. Oddly, Shrine Maiden has 5% better magic, while Monk instead has 10% better skill. Regardless, the job of these classes is to avoid combat and heal allies using staves. These classes can promote into Onmyojis and either Great Masters or Priestesses. Their first skill, Miracle, gives them a luck-based chance to survive a fatal blow with 1 HP. Their second skill, Rally Luck, boosts the Luck of nearby allies for a few turns. They also secretly have a 10% extra crit evade. I enjoy the simple, modest designs, which fit with the class’s aesthetic.

Conquest Chapter 8: Cold Reception

As Felicia leads the group to her village, Moron and Silas are separated by a blizzard. Moron faints from the cold and is rescued by Kilma, the Ice Tribe’s leader. Moron begins to introduce himself, but Silas reminds him that they’re here to crush a rebellion. Corrin bemoans the fact that everything is so morally grey. Honestly, I wouldn’t call this route morally grey, so much as it’s the same black and white shit as Birthright with Moron being to stupid to understand he’s on the evil side.

Kilma says he only let Moron into the village because he carries Yato, the sword prophecized to save the world. Kilma introduces Moron to his daughter, Flora. The fact that Flora and Felicia are the daughters of the head of a small country colonized by Nohr is kinda weird. Garon conquered the Ice Tribe, took the daughters captive, and forced them to work as servants for his other kidnapped prince.

Felicia and Elise show up and Elise blurts out that they’re there to suppress Kilma’s rebellion. Elis is an idiot. Flora sounds the alarm and the Ice Tribe rushes in to fight the Nohrians. Flora calls Felicia ignorant and says war is the only language Nohr understands.

This chapter uses the same map as Chapter 17 of Birthright. The gimmick of this chapter is centered on five villages spread around the map. A pair of enemy soldiers will try to go to the villages to summon reinforcements, while the player can visit them to get gold. At the start of turn two, Odin and Niles show up to save us, acting on orders from Leo. Moron has to convince them to not kill everyone brutally, because Odin’s a chunibiyo and Niles is genuinely morally grey.

Odin

Owain from Awakening, now a Dark Mage instead of Myrmidon and pretending to be an evil wizard instead of a legendary hero. He also switches his costume to this tight, garish yellow outfit with a v-neck that stretches to his crotch. I’d complain if it was any character other than Odin; for Odin, it fits. I did like Owain in Awakening, but I will admit his schtick can get old. His personal skill gives him a boosted crit rate when using a named weapon with a name more than 12 letters long, something ridiculous that fits perfectly for a guy obsessed with legendary weapons and powerful spells. Also, he can reclass into a Samurai, a Hoshidan class, which makes sense given his class in Awakening.

Niles

Leo’s other retainer, a sadistic Outlaw. His personal skill, Kidnap, works the same as Orochi’s capture. Conquest is a bit harder than Birthright, though, so I’m afraid I won’t be grabbing another Kenshi. Fun fact, Niles is the only non-promoted bow user in all of Nohr. Niles’s design isn’t half bad; I like the eyepatch, white hair, and hood, although I’d like to note that it’s a bit odd that the sadistic criminal has a noticeably darker skin tone.

Flora apologizes to Moron for standing by her actions, calls Felicia a moron, and tells Jakob she wishes she was meeting him under better circumstances. Felicia’s battle quote with Jakob is especially interesting, confirming she was a hostage and hinting that she has feelings for him. Kilma prays for forgiveness for fighting Felicia and says Moron deceived him.

Moron spares Kilma. In fact, he wins the battle without killing anyone. Somehow. Moron has Elise treat the enemy wounded. Kilma is shocked by Moron’s kindness. Moron negotiates a deal where the Ice Tribe stops rebelling in return for more autonomy, something he has the authority to do that totally won’t be ignored by the child kidnapping mass murderer Garon. Kilma says that Moron might be the legendary hero after all. Flora apologizes for defending her people from an invading army who kidnapped her and her sister as a child and swears fealty to Moron.

So, here’s my problem with Conquest. Nohr is evil. Garon is evil. But Moron is good. So every chapter has him win battles without violence or negotiate people into working with him. Rather than having Moron struggle with his morality, it has him keep his hands clean, even as he conquers neighboring nations for the glory of a brutal dictatorship. It’s idiotic. And it will only get more idiotic as this game goes on. But first, we have some Supports to read.

Support: Corrin/Odin

C: Corrin finds Odin posing. Odin says his stance needs a unique name. Corrin gets annoyed by Odin and walks away.

B: Odin asks Corrin to name his pose. Corrin says they need tome to think of a name.

A: Corrin tries to hide from Odin. Odin tracks them down and annoys Corrin for a while. Eventually, Odin comes up with a dumb name for his pose: Shadow Glitter. Corrin is relieved that they don't have to talk to Odin anymore.

S: Odin asks Corrin to marry him. Corrin gets tired of his long-winded proposal and demands he get to the point. Odin gives a heartfelt proposal and immediately gets back on his bullshit.

Review: Not bad. Odin toes the line between funny and annoying and seeing Corrin get sick of his bullshit is a good dose of realism. This is also one of the only times Corrin isn’t ridiculously friendly. Also, by marrying Odin, Corrin joins yet another royal family.

Support: Elise/Effie

C: Elise asks Effie to go on a walk with her, but Effie is full from eating and asks Elise to roll her like a barrel.

B: Effie uses Elise as a dumbell. The two of them reminisce about how they met: Elise snuck down to the underground and befriended Effie and, when the guards tried to take Elise back, Effie tried to fight em off.

A: Effie talks about how she trained for years to become a castle guard so she could protect Elise.

Review: This is what Corrin and Silas’s relationship should have been. That is, free from dumb bullshit about Corrin having the memory of a goldfish. Lore is always good in Supports and this does a great job establishing Elise and Effie’s friendship, while also having some great comedy bits.

Support: Felicia/Niles

C: Felicia spills some soup on Niles. Niles begins stripping seductively. Felicia offers to take his clothes to the laundry.

B: Felicia offers to give Felicia a special, heavenly dessert. Niles assumes she's coming on to him. Felicia gives Niles a cookie.

A: Niles mocks Felicia for not understanding his double entendres. After finding out about Felicia's childhood as a hostage, he apologizes.

S: Niles proposes.

Review: A fun, kinda dumb comedic Support.

Support: Arthur/Mozu

C: Arthur finds Mozu analyzing the soil around camp. Mozu rambles about how farming is awesome.

B: Arthur helps Mozu plow a field. Mozu corrects his form. A: While Arthur is plowing, a heard of dragons fly over and shit all over him. Mozu is overjoyed because dragon droppings are great fertilizer. Also, I'd like to note a script error in this Support: dragons and wyverns are not the same thing. Wyverns are the mounts with animal-level intelligence, dragons are ancient magic beings that can transform into humans. Unless a flock of demigods flew by to shit on Arthur, the game means wyverns.

S: Arthur proposes by giving Mozu a special flower that is supposed to be planted by a husband and wife. Mozu accepts because Arthur's bad luck is a good source of fertilizer.

Review: The start of this Support is a bit bland, but Arthur getting covered in shit is great.

#fire emblem fates #flora fire emblem #owain fire emblem #odin fire emblem #niles fire emblem #corrin fire emblem #fire emblem conquest #nohr

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