#jgy vs nmj

[lgbtlunaverse]

Nothing will dispell the "the curtains were just blue" myth faster than writing something yourself, because the amount of pretentious symbolism i am putting in my silly little fanfics is ridiculous. I mean SO much with these words, literally every single one of them. This fic has twenty five typos and zero correct uses of punctuation but if there's curtains you bet your ass I put thought into what colour they were.

#writing #fic writing #like this is stuff i'm doing for fun with my perfectionism meter turned down as far as i can get it #and i am still thinking about it A LOT #talk to me about how in red string fic jgy perceives the memory block both as syrup and as mud but nmj thinks it feels like blood #it's just a thing in their heads that mentally feels kind of thick and sticky but they both made something different of it #it's about issues with cleanliness / lies as a way to craft an illusion of a better lopking world vs the constant violence nmj lives in

[frodo-of-the-nine-fingers]

i think the actual disconnect between nie mingjue and jin guangyao is that nie mingjue is dying and knows he's dying and has to stick so so so closely to his morals and virtues or else it'll have been for nothing and then he'll have to come to terms with the fact that maybe he didn't actually have to die after all vs jin guangyao who wants to live, he wants to live and be safe and have all the things he was told he could never have-was told he was never good enough to have-and will do almost anything to make it so. and these are two like irreconcilable point of views right (and both Correct and Wrong at the same time) and so they can't understand each other because they aren't even having the same argument and neither of them can see that

#nie mingjue #jin guangyao #nieyao #it's good!!! #i think nmj never expected to survive the war against the wen too maybe so after he's both floundering and STILL dying #characters that didn't HAVE to die like that but did anyways because societal/family/narrative pressure etc >>>>>>> #⚰️ #I've been told it's real sweet to grow old #i think there's also this disconnect between the two of them in the story as a whole re that steinberg quote i posted earlier about kleos #nostos (glory seeking vs home coming) #where jgy is the kleos or glory seeker and nmj SHOULD be the nostos (@ #(and he IS to an extent) but also he ISNT because again he is dying-he knows hes dying you cant extract that from his character #and so there SHOULD be this conflict here from that but there just isnt because nmj isnt filling that role properly and i think that's part #of why jgy cant understand him #jgy is the kleos but nmj isnt a glory seeker (not outside of like the war and he's not doing that for glory etc) but he's also not nostos #he's theseus in the king must die #(sorry for referencing a bunch of shit in th tags pls pls pls ignore my rambling to myself about characters that are barely ever on page/ #screen and so we can never actually fully contextualize them because we dont actually know them but oh boy oh boy can we try) #so like what does a guy who will (allegedly) give up anyone and anything domestic to gain/retain status do against a guy who otherwise #would be the opposite and unwilling/unable to sacrifice anyone for these things do when said guy does neither 🤷‍♀️ #mine

[little-meowyao]

"He was twenty-three and I was thirteen going on thirty" what if I ate the walls, huh? What if I set the house on fire. What then

This is about CQL nieyao's age gap btw. And that JGY edit to All You Wanna Do

#jin guangyao #feral little meowyao #tragic saber man #nie mingjue #i'm unwell #i'm so unwell about this #i love dead dove as much as the next person #but like. cql nmj is pretty obviously psychosexually obessed with jgy #if you don't believe me go look at the fire palace scene vs the fire palace scene in nmj's memory #meanwhile jgy was no older than 16 when he went to work with nmj in cql #likely even younger #around nhs's age #i just. i just #hueuhioubeheheuuhehh #this drives me up the wall so much #genuinely #does someone have any grooming adjacent nieyao recs #please #i beg #i beg i plead

[thatswhatsushesaid]

i think about jin guangyao a normal amount

#mdzs shitposting #mdzs #cql #the untamed #jin guangyao #he did crimes??? good for him 😌 #i am of two minds on cql's decision to have him draw blood when he takes jin ling hostage #vs how he does it in the novel where jin ling is not injured in the process #because in cql we also get that moment where jgy shoves jin ling to safety #which imo demonstrates that he was being truthful when he stated that jin ling was in no real danger (his opinion anyway) #but then /gestures @ that blood on his throat :c #contrasted against meng yao's instinctive decision to hurl himself in between nmj and wzl's sword in cql #even knowing that nmj would probably still try to cut his head off afterwards #i do think meng yao kneeling before nmj fully expects to die in that moment #god i'm climbing the walls he's such a good character!!!

[labyrynth]

*opens jgy tag*

“the difference between WWX and JGY is that JGY is straight-up evil. he isn’t a victim of circumstance or anything, he was just BORN dirty evil. he had so many options and he GLEEFULLY chose to murder little boys and girls.”

“(unlike WWX, who is NEVER selfish and is ALWAYS selfless and ALWAYS knows what’s RIGHT and WWX saves CHILDREN’S LIVES. how many children did jgy save?? NONE.)”

…*closes jgy tag*

#mdzs talk #jgy tag #this…can’t even be called analysis adjacent #they couldn’t even bother with factual accuracy??? #like you’re really gonna sit there and claim that torturing hundreds of people to death wasnt selfish?? #that relishing in their suffering was for the greater good?? #you’re gonna sit there and pretend that jgy had power before nmj and jgs kicked it?? #you’re gonna sit there and pretend that the watchtowers don’t exist??? the hundreds to thousands of people who have benefitted #from the safety the watchtowers provide?? #quite frankly if number of children saved is the metric we’re working with here #jgy FAR surpasses wwx!!! #wwx’s total is one (1) child saved almost certainly dozens of children orphaned #and at least one child’s body desecrated in death! #and you’re gonna tell me that mister ‘the power is ALL MINE…! so how do we feel about public safety infrastructure?’ is the problem?? #god i’m so tempted to reply to op bc this POST #it sounds like they?? haven’t read the book at all? or seen any version of the show??? #i mean for crying out loud mdzs is not a story about ‘good guy wwx defeats the evil jgy and all is right with the world again’ #mdzs is not a story of good vs evil #and if that was your takeaway you should probably still be in school

[luobingmeis]

another shower another 20 minutes spent being both nmj’s and jgy’s defense attorney and the one putting them on trial

#i think abt 3zun ouroboros i cough up blood i’m a simple man #like. nmj has reasons to not trust jgy jgy has reasons to not trust nmj #they both hurt each other they are both victims #and lxc. is my wildcard who in trying to appease both of them #it can be called into question his stubbornness vs. mediation vs. etc etc etc #i lost my steam but the 3zuns who get it get it hope this helps <3

[wangxianficfinder]

In the mood for...

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1. Hi! I'm wondering if there's a fic like this?

(cql) fight where lwj lunges with his sword, and wwx doesn’t move, not thinking lwj would actually hurt, but lwj accidentally hurts him? @karinasnowwwx

Regrets by antebunny (G, 38k, wangxian, miscommunication, misundersandings, time travel fix-it, temporary character death, angst w/ happy ending, fluff, hurt/comfort)

Give Me What I Want by Jo Lasalle (Jo_Lasalle) (E, 60k, WangXian, Bad Guys Made Them Do It, Canon Divergence, Episode Related, Angst with a Happy Ending, Burial Mounds, fuck or die aftermath, Angst) the third fic in the series "Give what you like" has a scene like this

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2. hi!! i'd like to request fics that are similar to rather cruelly used and rather reserved by x_los.

i saw someone mention that they'd like specifics for these types of asks; i don't have something in particular in mind (i'd love to get any recs at all!), but some examples could be: this type of back-and-forth conversational humor; the sort of poetic way the prose is written; wwx grieving a-yuan before finding out he's alive; and/or how the confession/relationship is portrayed.

i especially liked the lines where wwx asks if lwj knew wwx loved him and lwj responds "sometimes, i knew," so fics where lwj or wwx sort of. suspect each other likes them/they sort of fall together naturally are also super welcome!

i know this is a lot but i tried to be as helpful as possible. no rec has to accomplish all of these, i just really liked that fic lol @kisskissgotohell

and having a marvelous time by varnes (E, 108k, WangXian, Yúnmèng Siblings, Sound of Music AU, (i know!!! i know. stay with me on this.), Slow Burn, Mutual Pining, Family Feels, spies to lovers???, Protective Siblings, Sometimes You Just Want Your Dads To Admit They’re Your Dads, Angst with a Happy Ending)

threadfic by saltyfeathers (Not rated, 49k, wangxian, chapters tagged individually)

Works by Vamillepudding

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3. so I've seen a lot of fics with variations of 'Xiao xingchen and song Lan join and/or ally with (while still being rogues) the YilingWei sect'. But what about fics where wwx ends up joining the sect Xiao xingchen and song Lan had planned to found? (And not in a 'wwx raised by another sect' type way, but like a diverging au).

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4. ITMF canonverse fics where Wangxian have to deal with prejudice over their relationship. Hey, I love a good everyone-is-super-supportive-except-for-YZY fic because they deserve it. But MZY's treatment alone makes it clear that homosexuality is looked down on & the lack of any pushback can get boring. I don't want anything that stops them getting together, but I want to read something where they have to deal with negative reactions, whether it's sneers & gossip or having to leave their sects @thispatternismine

Just As Much by Gemiblu (E, 23k, WangXian, Jealousy, Boys In Love, Homophobia, demonic cultivation bondage, Power Bottom WWX, Cockblocking, Semi-Public Sex, Crying During Sex, Intimacy, New World, Female Characters, Casual Intimacy, mentions of non-canon character death, description of violent acts, post marriage, Explicit Sexual Content, Kissing, Affection, supportive married couple, Pet Names, YLLZ WWX)

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5. can i request some xiyao fics? i recently got into that ship and i'd like to read some of yalls favorites :) preferably no lxc/jgy/nmj unless there's a focus on lxc/jgy, and no abo/mpreg/porn without plot please!

Meng Yao vs. the Board of the Homeowner's Association Series by Ariaste (M/T, 119k, WIP, XiYao, WangXian, Modern AU, Established Relationship, xiyao and wangxian are both already married, Family Feels, Domestic Fluff, Family Bonding, Slice of Life, Discussions of Past Trauma, wwx's canonical kinks, HOAverse) there's a reason it's recced all the time!

save the bees (ride a beekeeper) by Ariaste (T, 4k, LXC/JGY, modern, Fluff and Humor, Meet-Cute, Bees, Flirting)

ask until your heart gets it right by Stratisphyre (G, 6k, JYL/JZX, JZX & JGY, implied LXC/JGY, Canon Divergence, Fluff and Humor, Unreliable Narrator JZX, warning for JGS behaving exactly as expected, Meng Shi's canonically shitty situation, Minor surprise pairing at the end, Fix-It, Everyone Lives au)

a micro utopia born as the overture plays by tardigradeschool (T, 18k, JGY/LXC, wangxian, Canon Divergence, Fix-It, Marriage, Fluff, Scheming, Everyone Lives au, Kid Fic, Spanish translation by  finisterre12)

Marriage Principles series by Fahye (E, 38k, wangxian, LXC/JGY, canon divergence, arranged betrothal) LXC/JGY on the second part

Aftermath by KouriArashi (T, 57k, JYL/JZX, wangxian, LXC/JGY, JZX & JGY, JYL & WXX, Canon Divergence, Fix-It, Everybody Lives, Romance, Developing Relationship, Family, Sibling Bonding, Light Angst, Politics, Attempted Sexual Assault, some murder on occasion, People talking about their feelings, processing their trauma, The good shit)

Whispers in My Ears by tabulaxrasa (T, 3k, wangxian, implied LXC/JGY, Canon Divergence, LWJ stays at the Burial Mounds, Gossip, JGS is the worst, they have a son, Everyone lives, Podfic Available)

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6. Hey, thanks for your work as always! For the next in the mood for I'd love a compilation of high energy fics, just writing that is high spirited and fun or high energy and super engaging.

live from new york by varnes (E, 87k, WangXian, XuanLi, Modern AU, SNL AU, Slow Burn, Friends to Lovers, Pining, Getting Together, Happy Ending, Idiots in Love, and they were ROOMMATES, Frottage, Light Bondage, could not be lighter or gentler bondage)

The Scarlet Lotus by rainbowninja167 (M, 137k, WangXian, Marriage of Convenience, Secret Identity, Fix-It, Angst with a Happy Ending, It Gets Worse Before It Gets Better, Canon-Typical Violence, canon-typical war crimes, Yunmeng Bros, Slow Burn, Mutual Pining, Miscommunication)

kiss with a fist by daltoneering (E, 23k, WangXian, Modern AU, Secret Agents, Enemies to Lovers, Rivals to Lovers, Enemies With Benefits, Mutual Pining, Light Angst, Action & Romance, Action movie-typical violence, A HEIST, james bond inspired, Blood and Injury, Shooting Guns, please read a/n for further warnings!, (this is meant to be fun though I promise!))

Meng Yao vs. the Board of the Homeowner's Association Series by Ariaste (M/T, 119k, WIP, XiYao, WangXian, Modern AU, Established Relationship, xiyao and wangxian are both already married, Family Feels, Domestic Fluff, Family Bonding, Slice of Life, Discussions of Past Trauma, wwx's canonical kinks, HOAverse) (link in #5)

ID Bro Saga Series by Bowandtie (T, 39k, WangXian, Modern AU, dating app, Liberal use of emoji, 3zuns as bad friends forever, Slow Burn, super slow it's practically sous vide, Crack) Please read first!: Hey mods I suggested a fic (ID bro series) for no 6 for recent IMTF , I read this series a long time ago and was revisiting it and I found it had some (not much ) humor that is insensitive (like chapter 3 has a joke about Auschwitz). The author is clearly not a native english speaker and might be unaware, though they didn’t correct it though a comment kindly suggested it. I wanted to apologise, I must have overlooked. I don’t want to promote anything that is insensitive or might hurt anyone.

10 RMB lucky chickens by Raitelzen (T, 25k, XiCheng, WangXian, Modern AU, College/University, Neighbors, Chickens, mafia, Motorbike, Pathology Students, Angst, Emotional Hurt/Comfort, Mental Health Issues, Pre-Relationship) Last one is crack fic

ridiculous future bullshit Series by sami (T, 61k, WangXian, XiChengQing, Future Fic, in theory it follows on from an au, specifically The Same Moon Shines Series, in actuality I'm not committing to this that hard, Humour, immortals through history, Modern AU, Sort Of, University, outsider pov, Pride, Chaos Gremlin WWX)

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7. Hi! Looking for a fics where LWJ died, but WWX hasn't. Doesn't matter what caused his death - punishment, accident, or protecting someone - anything is okay. I wanna read sth about WWX's feelings about it. LWJ'S resurrection after years would be great too

In the new dawn by ballofstring (E, 9k, XiXian, WangXian, Canon-Typical Violence) warning: it's wwx/lxc pairing.

Moonlight by lunarvelle (E, 14k, WIP, WangXian, A/B/O Dynamics, Omega Verse, Alpha WWX, Omega LWJ, Bottom LWJ/Top WWX, Canon Divergence, YLLZ WWX, WWX Creates a Sect | Yílíng Wèi Sect, LWJ Has a YLLZ Kink, Submissive LWJ, Horror, Case Fic, Pining LWJ, Whump, Dark WWX, WangXian Get a Happy Ending, Age Difference, Angst with a Happy Ending, LWJ Whump)

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8. #itmf a fic similar to "after all i drifted ashore" by lingering_song, as in wwx does exactly what the cultivation world wants: give up the yin hufu and dissappear with his wen army and heretic powers; when the jins become the next wen sect, reign over all the others just as he said, and they come asking for help once again. i sincerely would prefer if wwx isnt forgiving to the ones that hunted him down after he down and betrayed him buy trying to lead a siege against him.

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9. hello!! could you please rec fics with the "secretly virgin wei ying lying about how amazing he is in bed and then getting fucked by lan zhan" trope?? or anything similar to it! i've been craving it so much but idk exactly how to find those through ao3 tags *cries*

thankyou so so much! hope you have a lovely day/night <3

Teach Me The Ways by likeafox (E, 58k, WangXian, Canon Divergence, The Porn Is the Plot)

Straight at the Sun by diamondbruise (E, 33k, WangXian, Canon Universe, no war though, Mutual Pining, Pining while fucking, Misunderstandings, First Time, Anal Sex, wwx desperately wants lwj's attention, lwj desperately wants to marry wwx, Miscommunication, Jealousy, in abundance, Happy Ending)

Lead Me On Through by vesna (mrsronweasley) (E, 54k, WangXian, Arranged Marriage, Practice Kissing, practice other things, horny boys in love, questionable logic, Questionable Choices, they're dumb but cute, but dumb, but really cute, slight knives, Happy Ending) I think this one also fits but I can't remember exactly. Has similar wwx you clown vibes though

Wei Laoshi, Poonslayer by FeelsForBreakfast (E, 6k, WangXian, Cloud Recesses Study Arc, POV LWJ, straight boy wwx, Loss of Virginity, Getting Together) op might want to check the sbwy tag, I feel that is where you would find that trope the most cause its Wei ying talking /lying abt being with girls lol

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10. Was rereading Beast of Gusu series, and as much as I love Foxxian/Dragonji fics (or any other combination of animals), can I get some more recs where only one half of WX is a shapshifter/non-human/etc? I've also read the tiger fic, the one where LWJ is cursed as a plant, and the one where everyone in the Burial Mounds is cursed as a monster, so you can skip those! Please and thank you!!

You are what you eat by deliciousblizzardshark (E, 17k, WangXian, Canon Divergence, Eldritch WWX, Horny LWJ, Body Horror, Possessionof a sort, Cannibalism, kind of, Mild Gore, Teeth, Fluff and Humor, Smut, Oral Sex, Anal Sex, Monster sex, Switching, Light BDSM, Rimming, Self-Lubrication, Seriousness treated Crackily, Implied/Referenced Torture, Dead WWX) eldritch horror creatures wwx but honestly a puppy really Also there's a shapeshifter comp as well! It includes more than just foxxian :)

find some comfort here by ScarlettStorm (E, 38k, WangXian, Modern AU with Magic, Fox WWX, animal rescuer lwj, Pacific Northwest setting, Adhd wwx, Established Relationship, Comedy, Smut, not just fox wwx but also foxboy wwx, to his own extreme horror, petting, both platonic and sexual, Scent Kink, Like a lot of scent kink, mildly telepathic sex, Blowjobs, Anal Fingering, Anal Sex, Sex Toys, Some A/B/O Dynamics, but in a non a/b/o world, No mpreg, yes self-lubrication, switch rights, Emotional Hurt/Comfort) WWX is a shapeshifter, LWJ is not

Uh, where can I find the LWJ is a plant mentioned in #10???

What We Grew in this Forsaken Place by Admiranda (T, 27k, wangxian, modern cultivation, shapeshifter LWJ, WWX has a fear of dogs, bunny crimes, genius WWX, unexpected pet owner WWX)

The Sun Will Rise series by vespertineflora (E, 129k, wangxian, Fantasy au, Fairy Tale au, Fairy Tale Elements, Human/Monster Romance, Tentacle Monsters, Plant Monsters, Tentacle Sex, vine sex, Vines, Monster LWJ, Human WWX, Mildly Dubious Consent Consensual Non-Con, Eventual Romance, Slow Romance, Happy Ending, Groping, Edgeplay, Hand Jobs, Anal Fingering, Anal Sex, Prostate Massage, First Time, Multiple Orgasms, WWX Has a Fear of Dogs, Homesickness, Angst, Hurt/Comfort, Loneliness, Canon-Typical Violence, WWX Has a Rape/Non-Con Kink, Light Bondage, Light Masochism, Overstimulation, BAMF WWX, Stabbing, Near Death, Poisoning, Protective LWJ, Seduction Aphrodisiacs, OFCs, Snow and Ice, Snowball Fight, Lost Love, Falling In Love, Drunken Kissing, Sex Pollen, Submission, Subspace, Multiple Penetration, Love Confessions, full body restraint, Emotional Sex, Reincarnation) OP from #10 here, someone asked for the Plant!LWJ fic I mentioned? It was this series

blossoms at the roadside by bleuett (T, 12k, WangXian, Different First Meeting, Getting Together, Tenderness, Gardens & Gardening, Happy Ending, a little sprinkle of touch starvation, wangxian going 0 to 100 in seconds, Hand Feeding) In the process of finding the other, there was also this one I remembered, and thought, why not include both?

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11. hello! i'm looking for established relationship modern au wangxian fics, please! bottom wwx/lwj top only 🙏🏽💖

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12. Itmf fics where wwx got good or excellent reputation!! @whateverweilanlovechild

It's so sad that there are no fics where Wei Ying got good reputation 😭. I'm changing my itmf, please do one on fics where Wei Wuxian is loved by a collective people, like people of yunmeng or people of yilling. Something like that?

❤️ The Absolutely True Story of the Yiling Patriarch: A Manifesto in Many Parts by aubreyli (T, 20k, wangxian, In-Universe RPF, Romance Novel, Post-Canon Fix-It, primarily drama-canon with cameos from novel-canon, The Absolutely True Story of the Yiling Patriarch: A Manifesto in Many Parts by aubreyli [Podfic] by Rhea314 (Rhea))

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13. Sorry I just put in a request but I started thinking about wen ning, which made me sad soooo do you have anything wen ning centric? Thank you so much, have a good day @twlaei

Truth, Like an Arrow by Nahiel (T, 3k, WangXian, Technically this is a death fic, but I don't think it's sad, Time Travel Fix-It, POV Outsider, Sort Of, I don't know this fic is weird, assisted second death, but i still don't think it's sad, wn thinks poorly of himself, the author doesn't share this opinion, CQL Verse) Short Wen Ning-centric time travel fix it

do not go gentle by RoseThorne (G, <1k, WN & WQ, WWX & WQ, LSZ & WQ, major character death, Canonical Character Death, Spirits, Ghosts, LWJ Plays Inquiry, Song: Inquiry, Protectiveness, Grief/Mourning, Love, Acceptance, Family, Angst, Podfic Welcome, Post-Canon, POV Third Person, POV WN)

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14. Hii I'm wondering if there are fics where wangxian gain some sort of power that changes events in canon? @karinasnowwwx

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15. hi <3 i'd love to ask if there are any new-ish fics about the core transfer going wrong? it's been a couple of years since i went looking, for stuff like 'impossible remains' by jengabears etc (could be much less angsty like the transfer simply not working ahaha)

Drowning in the Sun by Zelos (T, 8k, WangXian, Canon Divergence, Golden Core Transfer, Canon-Typical Violence, Brotherly Love, Sunshot Campaign, Family Dynamics, Grief/Mourning, Angst, Twin Prides of Yúnmèng Feels, Twin Prides of Yúnmèng Dynamics, [Podfic] Drowning in the Sun by flamingwell) I hope this meets what you're looking for. The transfer succeeds and everybody is alive, but Jiang Cheng was aware and paralyzed the whole time…

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16. Hello everyone, I’m in the mood for heartbreaking and saddest wangxian fics you know.

I want it to be wangxian centric, no yunmeng bros or JC focus and I don’t care if it’s canon compliant or au. I’m ok with omegaverse but not with omega LWJ.

Thank you all in advance and for all your hard work @kanrax-blog

Wei Wuxian Makes a Wish series by natcat5 (M, 119k, wangxian, major character death, underage, madoka magica au, modern w/ magic, time travel, high school au, body horror, self-harm, angst w/ bittersweet ending, time loop, mental instability, suicidal thoughts)

Concord by Deastar (T, 41k, WangXian, Arranged Marriage, Gūsū Lán Sect Rules, Depression, Canon Divergence, Angst with a Happy Ending)

我的皇后是農民 | sowing seeds in the cold palace by sweetlolixo (E, 78k, WangXian, Imperial Palace, Emperor LWJ, Imperial Consort WWX, Farmer WWX, Only WWX Could Have an Empress to Farmer Pipeline, Angst, Romance, Wingman LJY, Wife-chasing-LWJ, LWJ will grovel to the ends of the earth to make it up to WWX don't worry, Arranged Marriage, Best Boy A-Yuan, not LWJ friendly)

the heartlines on our hands by occultings (microcomets) (E, 47k, WangXian, Soulmates, Angst with a Happy Ending, Mutual Pining, First Time, Canon Divergence, Canonical Character Death)

in wild plums and river willows by SnowshadowAO3 (T, 17k, WangXian, Angst with a Hopeful Ending, Canon Universe, Grief/Mourning, descriptions of physical pain, alcohol mention, Fatherhood, The importance of legacy, Living for your dead love's semi-adopted child, Hurt/Comfort, Hallucinations vs. ghosts and not fully knowing the difference because you're grieving, Canon Temporary Character Death, Grief and love as inherent bedfellows)

总有一天; a place to hide (can’t find one near) by yiqie (E, 76k, WangXian, Modern AU, Pianist, Getting Together, Mental Health Issues, Suicide Attempt, Suicidal Thoughts, Depression, Hospitals, Overdosing, Eventual Happy Ending, Hurt/Comfort, Additional Warnings In Author's Note) mind the tags on this one

both are cathartic-sad

When the Words Stop Coming by mrcformoso (G, 7k, WangXian, Canon Compliant, POV WWX, POV LWJ, Cloud Recesses Study Arc, Pre-Sunshot Campaign, Burial Mounds Settlement Days, Canonical Character Death, Love Confessions, Rejection, LWJ is a Panicked Gay, Temporarily Unrequited Love, Trauma, WangXian Get a Happy Ending, Angst with a Happy Ending, Sad with a Happy Ending)

New Perspective by mrcformoso (T, 8k, WangXian, Angst, Hopeful Ending, Fatherhood, Regrets, Flashbacks, POV LWJ, LWJ-centric, Canonical Character Death - WWX, Pining LWJ, LWJ Has Feelings, LWJ Needs a Hug, Character Development, Dead WWX, Introspection, Feelings, LWJ is Bad at Feelings, Character Study, Regretful LWJ, Breaking Toxic Cycles, Canon Compliant, LWJ in Seclusion, Post-LWJ, in Seclusion, Child LSZ)

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17. Hello to you all! My semester just ended and now I'm free for a week probably? I do have hundreds of fics downloaded but yk it, it's never enough >ᴗ< so ITMF Nie Mingjue - Lan Xichen - Wei WuXian friendship. Well WWX's friendship with either of them is fine as well. It doesn't matter if it's older or younger WWX. Both canonverse as well as modern era fics are welcome ૮ ˶ᵔ ᵕ ᵔ˶ ა @tinyfoxpeach

Tumblr Fic by @shanastoryteller

Been There, Done That by FlautistsandPeonies (G, 34k, wangxian, NMJ & WWX & LXC, WN & WWX & WQ, LWJ & LXC & LQR, Canon Divergence, Time Travel, Not Everyone Dies au, WWX Canon Genius, Single Father WWX, Father-Son Relationship, NMJ/WWX/LXC Sworn Brotherhood, Sunshot Campaign, jc canon characteristics, YLLZ WWX, WIP)

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If you didn’t get an answer to your ask here, don’t forget to make use of @mdzs-kinkmeme and MDZS KINK MEME on Dreamwidth. Authors actually do use them for ideas. You may get what you order!***Your prompt doesn’t have to be kink! Fluff, crack, whatever - it’s all good!***

#wangxian #mdzs #wangxian fic recs #i'm in the mood for a fic #the untamed #wangxian fic search #wangxianficfinder #long post

[poorlittleyaoyao]

is jgy different in the books than in the untamed? sorry if u haven’t read them im kind of just assuming u have even tho i haven’t lol but i was wondering if his characterization has any major differences like how wwx in novel vs untamed they sort of sanitize him and take away any culpability and honestly some of his edge. just curious if there’s any major differences in his characterization between the two

I'm not the best person to answer because I've only read the first two volumes of MDZS. Short answer: Yes, he is different, and in fact gets the reverse of WWX's treatment: Drama JGY is more overtly villainous than Novel JGY. However, IMO it's a little more complicated than that!

(Novel enjoyers, please chime in if I'm forgetting or misrepresenting anything.)

A lot of JGY fans greatly prefer the novel and feel that The Untamed did him dirty, because a lot of the show's plot changes that make WWX look better make JGY look worse. Jin Zixuan's death is the most glaring one: in the novel, WWX really does lose control of WN because he overestimates his abilities, and it's a tragic accident. JGY and SMS's implied involvement in the Massacre at Nightless City also doesn't happen in the novel; that, too, was a devastated WWX wreaking havoc and/or losing control. The novel also establishes that JGY is subject to abuse within Jinlintai, so there's an element of duress that one can read into his actions under JGS. Novel NMJ behaves more aggressively towards JGY than he does in the show, so his murder doesn't have the same tinge of malice. (The novel timeline also has JGY and LXC meeting before JGY and NMJ, all during Sunshot, so there's that.) Additionally, the novel tells us that JGY is genuinely a very good leader once he's Chief Cultivator and has implemented policies that have improved the lives of regular people and contributed to political stability. We're also told more about his childhood and his love for his mother, and we learn that his relationship with QS is a tragic love story (he doesn't know they're related until after she's pregnant) rather than something he went through with anyway. So in the novel, he's got a lot of positive things going for him that censorship didn't allow to carry over into the show for fear of having too much moral ambiguity.

HOWEVER!!!

The thing about the novel (and why I don't vibe with it as much) is that it's very much WWX's story, whereas The Untamed spends wayyyyy more time with its supporting cast. You might've noticed that I said the word "told" a lot in the above paragraph, because... well, that's what happens. We're told things about JGY, but we don't see him as much, especially since the novel is focused on the post-timeskip era with the stuff in the past coming through non-linear flashbacks. You don't get to see Meng Yao being Just A Little Guy very much before he becomes the Kitten Thinks About Nothing But Murder All Day meme. Now, you also don't hear dramatic music telegraphing HEY!!! HEY!! VILLAINY IS AFOOT!! HEY!!! every time JGY does literally anything, but you do have everything filtered through WWX's unreliable narrator monologue, and he is out there saying some truly wild shit. (You also get less Xiyao. Like, it's there if you want it to be, but The Untamed really went all-in on that.)

For me, the show works better, because I am a sucker for corruption arcs where you see glimpses of the character before they start the atrocities. Seeing him be Just A Little Guy making the saddest meow meow faces when people were mean to him kept me from totally losing sympathy for/interest in him once things start getting squicky, because I had evidence that he wasn't always like that. Meanwhile, JGY's first big scene in the novel is the confrontation with QS (which already makes my skin crawl and is somehow WORSE in novel form), and I was just like "wow, this guy sucks" even though I knew the story and all the extenuating circumstances already. For others, the novel works better, because "first impressions and society's opinion are unreliable" is a major theme, so the reverse reveal combined with the fact that he demonstrably tries to improve people's lives as a leader is less expected and more satisfying.

So yeah! JGY is different, but the ways in which he is different are due to storytelling methods as well as to plot changes!

[sandumilfshou]

Fascinating how the people who hate Jiang Cheng so much are convinced we don’t know the canon but reduce every single character down to unbelievably boring one-note interpretations, WWX included. Everyone has many flaws! It’s a tragedy and if the love doesn’t exist there’s no point! But also the more I see completely random dumb shit get tossed around the more likely I am to go Actually Jiang Cheng Is The Perfect Man.

jiang cheng is a deeply flawed character mostly due to the expectations put on him by his parents who were legitimately neglectfully abusive towards him, not to mention the whole debacle with jfm's feelings towards him vs wwx and thats why i love him???? hes not perfect and that makes him INTERESTING? mxtx made so many three dimensional characters and EVERYONE is flawed - including lwj and wwx and lxc and jgy and nmj ... literally even jyl has flaws

but the more people hate against jc for dumbass reasons i too suddenly want to argue that hes perfect and has done no wrong actually

jiang cheng antis think theyre making a difference and they are! we're just doubling down on our jiang cheng loving!! you are FEEDING our fire, so please, keep posting!!

#jiang cheng

[evilhasnever]

man the replies and tags on my last reblog are so wild... people are so adamant that jgy and wwx have NOTHING in common, as if it offends them personally that the protagonist and the antagonist are intentional parallels to make a point about society (and not about their individual morality)

"jgy did it for himself" (nothing wrong with wanting to be respected/ not insulted everywhere he goes)

"jgy killed people for ambition" (no, he killed people for self preservation + everyone in the jianghu kills people for less?)

"jgy married his sister and killed his son" (the in/cest was accidental, he married her to protect her reputation instead of repudiating her, and he ALLEGEDLY killed his son, but this accusation is only raised by notorious gossip sect leader Yao in the novel, so ymmv)

"jgy never helped anyone else (unlike wwx)" This one is just WILD? Even ignoring all of the above, this one just shows you have not been paying attention to him. What about that time he won the war for the Sunshot forces, saved NMJ's life in Nightless city, saved Lan Xichen in hiding, rebuilt the Cloud Recesses, built the Watchtowers that saved thousands of commoners over the years (many more than some random night hunt by the gentry ever had), and single handedly gave a decade of peace and prosperity to the jianghu?

That is not to say he did not commit atrocities to protect himself (again, he was hardly the only one to do so) but... way to absolutely ignore all of the significant, enormous good he did. He saved so, so many more people than anyone else in the story. Tenfold, a hundredfold more. I have to assume not much thought was spared to JGY's motivations to have such an incomplete and two-dimensional view of him... I encourage you to think past the villain bias and go back to the actual story to fact check (and for what it's worth, if you've only seen CQL/The Untamed I assure you you don't have all the facts!)

The salient point is that mxtx makes these parallels between wwx and jgy on purpose, and none of it is about who is "good" or "bad" and what is "deserved". You do the story a disservice by flattening it to good vs bad., and besides it simply does not work if you read it that way: if the story were simply about good people winning and bad people getting their due, how do you explain what happened to XXC, WQ, WN, etc?





#food for thought #jgy apologism #jgy meta #listen #I know I shouldn't waste time on discourse when there is fic to be written but some of the BLATANT misinformation going around...

[lgbtlunaverse]

Life as a JGY stan is so hard because sometimes I want to make posts about the ways his very justified paranoia turns against him sometimes, rare moments where I think being more trusting or vulnerable would have helped but he felt like it couldnt, or talk about how his brutal survival instinct intersects with society's existing bigotries in a such a way that most of his violence is actually aimed at people lower on the ladder than him, with people like Jin Guangshan being the exception not the rule. Because he's a fascinating character and these parts of him are interesting!

But when I do that I have to live in perpetual fear of the moment that it escapes its target audience and someone takes it to go "Yeah he's a monster who fucked over everyone and is incapable of love! I wish he was killed earlier and his death was a thousand times more painful 🤪"

I mean, take my last example. Due to existing hierarchies it is, at any point, easier and safer for jgy to harm people less powerful than him instead of more powerful than him, even if the more powerful are the ones threatening his safety in the first place. Even knowing how it harms him and while working against it, Jin Guangyao is not immune to internalizing the mindset of the world he lives in. Even when killing Jin Guangshan- one man- it ends up costing the lives of 20 sex workers. You think I can bring up the sex workers in this fucking fandom? You think that will go over peacefully? The well has been so thoroughly poisoned here it feels like any conversation around morality automatically turns into a courtroom to determine a sentence for this fictional fucking character who's already dead.

#mdzs #meng yao #jin guangyao #complaining and whining about fandom #does fandom even know you can talk about morality in a way that's not adding up good person vs bad person tally points? #i think it's really fucking interesting how jgy is the person who's saved the most common people in the setting with the watchtowers #a politically unpopular move! this was a passion project he made becuase he wanted to help people! #and yet he's not afraid to take advantage of every bit of social capital he painstakingly gains to harm those below him either #i wish! that i could talk about that! #i also haaaate the 'incapable of love' thing on principle #morality is a choice! people don't need to FEEL love or empathy to not harm others #to use it as shorthand for 'evil' is reductive and fucking annoying #people hurt people they love all the time! #fandom does this in a similar way to nmj also. 'oh he can't empathise with other people' NOT THE PROBLEM. HE HAS A VERY DIFFERENT PROBLEM #what characters feel is very important to me from a 'studying blorbo' perspective but not in a debate about whether they're a good person

[xiyao-feels]

On the topic of WWX's privilege vs JGY's, there's this exchange with WQ after he's killed Jin Zixuan that always stands out to me:

He could neither shout nor move, rasping, “Why are you going to Koi Tower? I wasn’t the one who cursed him with Hundred Holes at all…”

Wen Qing, “But they have set their minds that it was you.”

Wei WuXian tried his best to think of ways to deal with this. Suddenly, he thought of something, “Then find the real person who set the curse! Jin ZiXun’s definitely gone to experts of cursing. The most common way to deal with these curses is to hit them back, let the effects rebound back to the one who placed the curse. Even if not all of the power could be rebounded, a large portion can. We can just look for someone who has the same curse marks on them!”

Wen Qing, “There’s no use.”

Wei WuXian, “Why not?”

Wen Qing, “There are so many people—where could we look for them? Set up a checkpoint on every street of every city and make everyone take off their clothes so that we can check?”

Wei WuXian protested, “Why not?”

Wen Qing, “Who’d be willing to set up these checkpoints for you? And for how long do you intend to search? We could perhaps find them after eight or ten years, but would those people be willing to wait?”

Wei WuXian, “But there are no rebounded curse marks on me!”

Wen Qing, “During today’s incident, did they ask you?”

Wei WuXian, “No.”

Wen Qing, “That’s right. They didn’t ask. They straight-up prepared to kill you. Do you understand now? They don’t need any proof. They don’t need you to find the truth either. Whether or not you have curse marks on your body doesn’t matter at all. You’re the YiLing Patriarch, the King of the Demonic Path. You specialize in dark curses, so it wouldn’t even be strange if you didn’t have curse marks on you. On top of that, you didn’t have to do it yourself. You could’ve gotten Wen-dogs, your slaves, to do it for you. It’s you no matter what. You won’t be able to deny it.”

(ER 77)

At this point WWX still feels on some level like he can defend himself with reason—not just from one person, but from the mob. He expects that something like finding the actual person who set the curse can be done, and while I don't think he's really thinking through how much work that would be, it suggests that he's not used to having to think through how much effort it would take, to prove himself innocent. Intuitively, he expects to be given the benefit of the doubt, not by everyone but by enough people; intuitively, he expects a situation where at least someone in authority is on his side.

And he's wrong, of course, as he realizes here, and as he learns even more deeply at Nightless City. But I think the fact that he has to learn it speaks a lot to what his experience of the world was, until this point.

And the thing about JGY is, he'd never have made this mistake, because he's never had the things that WWX did! He's never been given the benefit of the doubt, he knows not to expect support from any authority. Tbh we see him surviving only because he doesn't make this mistake: what do you think would have happened to him, if he'd turned himself in at Langya, if he'd tried to argue with NMJ after Sun Palace instead of fleeing?

There are a lot of scenes showing just how different their circumstances are, but this moment says a lot to me. Even now, even after everything that's happened, WWX still expects things to play out as though he's a favoured member of the Jiang sect; and he doesn't realize just how different things are for someone who's really outside the system.

#thatswhatsushesaid this one's for you

[tanoraqui]

You said nhs is a pantser not a planner. As in 'flying by the seat of'? Or is there another meaning?

That's it exactly! The 'planner vs pantser' dichotomy is a common idea in writer circles. Quoth Publishers Weekly:

Novelists tend to fall into two categories: “planners,” who develop outlines before they begin writing, and those who don’t, often referred to in self-publishing circles as “pantsers.” The term, which comes from the phrase “by the seat of your pants,” refers to novelists who work without any kind of synopsis, outline, or character development work done before they begin writing.

To literally copy the text of a post I made 3+ years ago:

hot take: Nie Huaisang is not actually good at Xanatos Gambits - elaborate planning, setting up dominoes or chess games or whatever metaphor you want and letting it all fall into place, every option a win. Nie Huaisang is very, very good at:

appearing nonthreatening

manipulating a scene, mostly via use of feigned helplessness and redirection

gathering information

throwing rocks at a hornet’s nests and then reacting very quickly to stay just slightly in control of the consequences, mostly using the tools above

That’s his modus operandi over and over. Getting Wei Wuxian resurrected - the biggest rock-to-a-hornet’s-nest of all. Sending Jin Guangyao a letter revealing Qin Su’s parentage, basically saying his days were numbered - yup. Getting Nie Mingjue’s body all together to storm off to the temple - yep. But I refuse to believe that he predicted the results of any of this well enough to plan - oh, the general scope, sure. WWX would go haring off to solve the mystery, almost certainly picking up LWJ because, you know, true love and righteousness. JGY would do something to overreach; that was clearly the goal of the letter. And NMJ would have the chance to get his own vengeance. But Nie Huaisang clearly made sure he was on the scene to manage the consequences of all of these - that’s not the actions of a man with masterful, predictive plans. That’s a very clever man with, like, alright plans, a decent sense of timing on when to land a political killing blow, who’s really good at winging it.

#random anon asks #mdzs #the untamed #nie huaisang

[thatswhatsushesaid]

did nie mingjue give jin guangyao a 'new life' after his mother's death?

okay i'm not trying to call out one post specifically or anything but this is definitely not the first post on this site to call jin guangyao the cruelest character in MDZS, and that is such a reach, especially when both xue yang and jin guangshan are, you know, right there. but i also want to dig into one of the points raised about jin guangyao and nie mingjue's relationship, and what they owe to each other, because i could not disagree with the principle assertion more.

so, did jin guangyao "[kill] the man who gave him a new life after his mother died"?

I assume we are discussing nie mingjue here and not jin guangshan lmfao.

okay, let's for the sake of argument assume your assertion that jin guangyao owes nie mingjue a life debt is correct. to be clear: I don't think it is. i do not think that meng yao owes nie mingjue a life debt when he comes into his service, nor do I think that he accrues one after receiving his courtesy name and title of lianfang-zun. but let's just pretend anyway.

JGY LIFE DEBTS OWED TO NMJ (STARTING TALLY): 1 - because nie mingjue gave him a job NMJ LIFE DEBTS OWED TO JGY (STARTING TALLY): 0 - how nice for him

I also want to emphasize that nie mingjue's attempt to help creates additional hardship for meng yao that he likely wouldn't have experienced if nie mingjue had stopped to ask him what he wanted before deciding he knew best. recall that he did not offer meng yao a promotion after overhearing his cultivators mocking his low birth: he just gave it to him, without considering how this promotion might (and in fact did) cause the bullying and harassment meng yao received from the nie sect cultivators to escalate. please also remember that meng yao does not ask mingjue for a letter of recommendation to take to jin guangshan to seek his recognition--he does not even want to leave! in fact he is explicitly telling lan xichen in that moment before nie mingjue interrupts their conversation that he feels obligated to remain with nie mingjue! it is nie mingjue who decides to send him off to jin guangshan with a letter of recommendation, and while meng yao expresses his immense gratitude for this gesture in the moment, it is so important to emphasize that he not only did not ask for this, but he was not asked if he wanted it, either. even then, the letter of recommendation that nie mingjue sends along with meng yao when he opts to release him from his service does not open any doors for meng yao at all. in fact, jin guangshan seems to use this as the perfect opportunity to eliminate another inconvenient bastard son during war time, and assigns meng yao--a weak and self-taught cultivator--to the front lines under a captain who not only beats and abuses him, but also forces him to come up with military strategies for the jin sect's successes, which he then takes the credit for when reporting to jin guangshan. if meng yao had not killed this captain, it's likely he would have died on the langye front during the sunshot campaign. meng yao gives himself a new life as jin guangyao and lianfang-zun because he is the one who kills wen ruohan during the battle for nightless city, and he does this entirely on his own (making use of deceit and trickery that nie mingjue finds dishonourable, in fact).

but anyway. after presumably giving meng yao this 'new life' in the form of the impromptu field promotion that meng yao did not ask for, meng yao repays his, um, debt (is that what we owe our employers when we are already providing them our labour?) to nie mingjue in full (??? only in full? he isn't, you know, maybe owed some change?) when he saves nie mingjue's life from wen ruohan at the battle of nightless city. and to save myself a lot of stress and frustration, let's all just collectively agree that, while the life-debt ratio of "giving someone a job" vs "risking your life to save else's" is absolutely not 1:1 in the real world, we're just. assuming it is, for the sake of this argument. the salient point is jin guangyao's ledger is now clear. he's back in the black, as it were.

JGY LIFE DEBTS OWED TO NMJ (UPDATED TALLY): 0 - he saved the life of the guy who gave him a job NMJ LIFE DEBTS OWED TO JGY (UPDATED TALLY): 0 - and the guy who gave jgy the job does not owe him anything in return for having his life saved, since jobs and lives are interchangeable and of equal value apparently

that's it, y'all, they're square.

except nie mingjue then explicitly attempts to murder meng yao/jin guangyao three times before jin guangyao even begins to play the song of spirit turmoil for him. which means we need a new scoreboard for keeping track of the mutual-murder attempts that define the rest of their relationship, beginning immediately post-sunshot campaign. here's where the mutual-murder attempt tally stands:

JGY'S ATTEMPTS TO MURDER NMJ (STARTING TALLY): 0 - he did literally the opposite of attempting to murder nie mingjue NMJ'S ATTEMPTS TO MURDER JGY (STARTING TALLY): 1 - nie mingjue tries to kill meng yao (who is not fighting back!!) with baxia, prior to being stopped by lan xichen (chapter 49)

that's explicit attempt #1! but if we believe that part of lan xichen's intent with all three of them swearing brotherhood to each other was to, in essence, provide jin guangyao and nie mingjue a clean slate upon which to rebuild trust in their relationship, then let's go ahead and reset that scoreboard. even though that is not how reconciliation between human beings actually works, particularly not when mutually-inflicted trauma is at work, but. whatever.

JGY'S ATTEMPTS TO MURDER NMJ (UPDATED TALLY): 0 - by the power vested in zewu-jun as the first jade of lan, apparently NMJ'S ATTEMPTS TO MURDER JGY (UPDATED TALLY): 0 - zewu-jun now pronounces u both even stevens, you may put baxia down. ..put it down, mingjue.

nie mingjue does not put baxia down, figuratively or literally. explicit attempt to murder jin guangyao #2 happens after they have sworn their binding oath of brotherhood to each other, and is the infamous "what else should I expect from the son of a prostitute" confrontation at the top of the jinlintai tower steps. nie mingjue literally kicks jin guangyao down 50 solid stone steps, which could easily have broken his neck or spine (or both). please note that this was an unprovoked act of violence against a much, much weaker cultivator whose only offence[1] against nie mingjue--arguably the strongest cultivator and martial artist of his generation--at this point was… saying words nie mingjue didn't like, and not killing xue yang when nie mingjue told him to. time to update the scoreboard again!

JGY'S ATTEMPTS TO MURDER NMJ (UPDATED TALLY): 0 - no, jin guangyao has not begun playing the song of spirit turmoil for nie mingjue yet! (chapter 104) [2] NMJ'S ATTEMPTS TO MURDER JGY (UPDATED TALLY): 1 - kicks nmj down the jinlintai steps, which, yes, is attempted murder (chapter 49)

which brings us to explicit murder attempt #3, which happens immediately after nie mingjue kicking him down the stairs. while jin guangyao is still recovering and picking himself up off the ground (in other words, not retaliating in any way or provoking further violence) nie mingjue unsheathes baxia to finish the job, and would absolutely have done so if lan xichen had not, yet again, intervened to protect jin guangyao. you know what time it is now.

JGY'S ATTEMPTS TO MURDER NMJ (UPDATED TALLY): 0 - nope, still has not begun playing the song of spirit turmoil between getting punted down the stairs and standing back up again NMJ'S ATTEMPTS TO MURDER JGY (UPDATED TALLY): 2 - yes, this is a second attempt at actual murder, I am not going to argue about this with anyone

all of this happens /gestures @ literally all of that, while jin guangyao is continuously traveling back and forth between jinlintai and qinghe to play the unaltered version of cleansing to help stabilize nie mingjue's qi. we know this because lan xichen explicitly tells us this in chapter 49, and nie mingjue agrees with him. we also know that this unaltered version of cleansing is having a positive impact on nie mingjue's spirit and his relationship with jin guangyao, because wei wuxian remarks on this while experiencing nie mingjue's memories in empathy. to be very clear: before jin guangyao has played the song of spirit turmoil for nie mingjue even one time, nie mingjue has already tried to kill jin guangyao three times. he is actively attempting to murder jin guangyao while jin guangyao is actively working together with lan xichen to repair their relationship and forestall nie mingjue's inevitable death by qi deviation. and we can go around in circles all day about whether jin guangyao ultimately kills nie mingjue solely because he is defending himself against a man who will not stop trying to kill him, or whether he's doing this because daddy said jump, or if it is a bit of both--I fall into the "it is always a bit of both" camp with jin guangyao--but that is actually beside the point.

the point: if we are keeping score about who has attempted to murder whom (and how frequently) by the time nmj ultimately kicks it, the final tally is nie mingjue 3 - jin guangyao 1. if we include his attempt to kill jin guangyao at the point of his qi deviation, the final tally becomes nie mingjue 4 - jin guangyao 1. so, even if i didn't disagree with the principle assertion made here, i would argue that jin guangyao not only squared that debt to nie mingjue years ago by saving him from wen ruohan, nie mingjue in fact now owes a life debt to jin guangyao for all the attempts to kill the guy who literally saved his life.

tl;dr these are the actions of a man who gave his subordinate a lot of trauma and anxiety, but not a new life.

[1] I am shelving any discussion of what meng yao does or doesn't owe nie mingjue within the context of his time spent undercover in wen ruohan's court because I feel there is nuance enough in that situation to justify its own post. meng yao and nie mingjue both deeply, irreparably traumatized each other in that situation and should never have been let within 6 li of each other ever again after the end of the war, much less pressured to swear brotherhood to each other. (grips lan xichen's shoulders, stares deeply into his beautiful eyes: wtf were you thinking, er-ge)

[2] even if I were to agree that he obtained the song of spirit turmoil in advance of the stairs incident and had already begun playing the song for nie mingjue (which I do not), it is clear that mingjue is improving, pre-stairs. this implies that jin guangyao, while he may have prepared a contingency plan, has not been putting any spiritual power into the portion of cleansing that contains the altered bars of the music. we know that he is capable of altering which parts of the song receive spiritual power because both wei wuxian and lan xichen confirm that this is possible in their (emotionally fraught, for poor xichen) conversation inside the cloud recesses library pavilion after the torn page is discovered. this, combined with the two to three month time frame that the altered song requires to trigger mingjue's qi deviation, plus the two month time frame that jin guangyao presents disingenuously to nie mingjue regarding xue yang, are clear textual evidence in support of my position. the music changes after the stairs.

#mdzs #mdzs meta #jin guangyao #meng yao #jin guangyao defence league #he did crimes??? good for him 😌 #I've been working on this draft for too long and so here u go #nie meangjue 🤯 #nmj critical

[fincalinde]

I’ve been rereading it’s worth it every time and that + the post abt mxy reminded me of how much I like your take on what happened! the way that… it’s not malicious on mxy’s part and at first he doesn’t even seem to realize how obvious he’s being, but he does eventually escalate to actual, unwelcome, come-ons towards jgy (the first scene when he checks on him and gives him heart eyes vs the “I’m yours” scene, is what I’m thinking here)

Thanks so much! I put a lot of thought into making MXY canon consistent, and I really wanted to capture how desperately vulnerable he is without minimising his behaviour. And off the back of this I've written an entire post about JGY and MXY exploring how JGY chooses to handle the MXY issue in canon, so here goes.

The relationship between JGY and MXY is a complicated one. JGY is the victim of MXY's inappropriate behaviour, but this isn't what could be considered a traditional perpetrator-victim dynamic. MXY is younger, less experienced, less powerful, and has at least one unspecified mental health condition. Even before JGY becomes clan leader, he has authority over MXY even if simply by virtue of being MXY's elder and quasi-mentor—and once JGY actually is clan leader, he literally has the power of life and death over MXY.

Before JGY is clan leader, he's in a much more awkward position because any harassment he receives from MXY either isn't going to be believed or no one is going to do anything about it. JGS isn't going to step in to protect JGY from the brother who is at Golden Carp Tower literally to reinforce how easily he can be replaced. It makes sense if JGY is, if not necessarily fending off open advances at this stage, then at least navigating treacherous waters. MXY is in awe of him and can't physically overpower him, but JGY is still forced to live with him.

Once JGY is clan leader, he has far more options. It's telling that he doesn't quietly dispose of MXY—which he could easily do. I'm actually going to digress and talk about JGY's many other illegitimate siblings for a moment, because I never really see them brought up and we know they are plentiful and many of them have perfectly respectable mothers. Like MXY, the very fact of their existence is absolutely a threat.

We get one extremely unreliable indication in the text that JGY might have killed off some of his other half-siblings. During the scene in which everyone turns on him and starts shouting baseless slander, one of the claims thrown out is that before he had his father killed he spent a couple of years quietly eliminating his various illegitimate and unacknowledged half-siblings. I don't for a moment think this is true or that we are intended to think this is true, considering other claims include JGY, a prostitute's son, only rising to power by sucking up to NMJ and LXC; and JGY deliberately orchestrating XXC's death for having the temerity to politely reject an invitation to join the Jin at a time when it was led by JGS.

So obviously this is nonsense. But, OK, it's not as though it's completely implausible that JGY might have wanted his half-siblings out of the way. He didn't intend for JZX to die but he certainly didn't hesitate to put him in danger. Let's take the least generous read possible and imagine that this demonstrably false gossip has a seed of truth: once he comes to power, JGY begins to quietly eliminate his other half-siblings to ensure no rivals emerge. We know JGY is ruthless. It makes sense that he'd be taking precautions.

But we also know JGY is not solely ruthless, and that he is also generous and loyal and repays his debts in his own fashion. Maybe he did bump off half-siblings out of fear that his enemies could rally behind one of them. But he doesn't have QS quietly killed, even though it would solve his incest problem, because he is so profoundly grateful that she treats him with respect and love and makes nothing of his background. And, more interestingly, he doesn't have MXY quietly killed either.

JGY is an efficient and capable man, but he has a habit of putting people who know just a little too much in out of the way places where he doesn't necessarily have to think about them but they remain as loose ends. I'm not necessarily saying my read is that JGY was definitely systematically killing off his siblings over the years, but I do think it's something he is in theory capable of (I support him), so the fact that MXY is kicked out without subsequently having a terrible and terribly convenient accident is notable. It's also consistent with his habit of not following through completely on eliminating risk of exposure (however small) if he feels affection and/or gratitude towards someone. See: NMJ, XY, QS, Sisi, etc.

I think it shows almost supernatural forbearance that MXY is deposited back at Mo Manor. He really could so easily have been killed. He knows about the Jin's experimentations in demonic cultivation, which makes him a liability, and has even seen WWX's notes. If JGY were really as ruthlessly pragmatic as so many in fandom seem to think, MXY would have died in a convenient accident not long after arriving back at Mo Manor. The only explanation is that JGY is genuinely fond of MXY, and in classic JGY fashion this means putting MXY in a miserable situation that's out of sight and out of mind so JGY can continue to flatter himself that he didn't kill him.

#ask #crashorpie #roquen meta #jin guangyao #mo xuanyu #once again: i support him #there's such complexity here and it always gets more interesting the deeper i dig

[luobingmeis]

maybe i am biased but not nie/yao “disguising fear as respect for years until you have a way out” but nie/yao “trying to curry favor to your terrified wits end until it rots into hatred”

anyways jgy holding nmj’s severed head can be so personal

#this is in reference to a very good piece i saw from the nighthaunt zine 👁 #but yeah if i think abt ny for too long i go a bit insane #and nmj sealed his fate when he locked jgy down the stairs but he was already dead #and then my/jgy was done in nmj’s eyes from the killing of the jin soldier #and frankly maybe i’m biased but at this point idc #i think my/jgy trying to win back nmj’s favor vs. nmj’s very staunch judgement/personal justice system #is so fun #bc. if it hasn’t been evident. i’ve been toiling with nmj lately #bc i have simultaneously been getting frustrated w/ readings of him but i am no where near an ‘apologist’ #bc frankly i could care less abt whether nmj was right or wrong #like i do not agree as a person w/ his actions but i also! do not care! #my own moral judgement doesn’t mean anything to me #what matters to me is 1) i love nmj #and 2) that nmj wasn’t just doing all of that bc like. idk he’s inherently malicious #it is that he has a very black and white/with me or against me way of justice #and it is that by which he views the world and governs himself #and if he deems u unjust then. well! that’s it! #PLUS the added thing that like. he cared for my and a huge reason /why/ he was so up in arms #after the killing of the jin soldier #is /because/ he considered himself incredibly close with my and that he was someone who could be trusted #and i think a lot abt nmj’s unfairness towards jgy #vs. the debt he believed he owed jgy post-sunshot (ie joining the brotherhood) #vs. wwx’s observation in empathy that for a time nieyao /seemed/ to get better #i want to shake jgy like a piggybank and find out if he was /always/ terrified of nmj after sunshot or if it ebbed and flowed #bc from nmj’s pov it does almost look like it’s gonna change before it reverts right back :) #and don’t even get me started on the song of clarity bc like. #was it just to finally get nmj out of jgy’s personal way. was it to get nmj out of the jin’s way. was it both! #i’ve been reading it as both lately not only bc it makes sense to me imo #but also bc jgy is the person who /would/ have both the personal amd ‘logistical’ reason to kill his da-ge #aka if nmj is out of the way than jgs will be pleased and jgy will be doing his duty making sure his father is pleased :)