#makes me think there was at least a part of him that related to wwx

[symphonyofsilence]

It never ceases to baffle me how the fandom can use a certain logic to achieve one desired conclusion (see: MXTX wouldn't make an openly gay character in a homophobic world a harasser, so MXY hasn't actually harassed JGY) even if it goes against the text itself (MXY admitting in his diaries that he has harassed fellow Jin disciples) while the same logic doesn't work for them the other way around in the favor of the character they don't like (while MXTX would not do the aforementioned case, she would, however, make the character that is the son of a sex worker, and continuously discriminated against, considered dirty, belittled and ridiculed for it throughout the story a groomer who led a teenager MXY on so he could later accuse him of harassment) while this too, goes against the text (again, MXY admitting he has harassed someone in his diaries (he might have very well mentioned Jiggy in his diaries but not as Jin Guangyao, or Lianfang-Zun, Sect leader, or Xiandu or anything that WWX would know. but with the name MXY would call his older brother. maybe "ge" or something. then, if he had mentioned him in an inappropriate way, WWX wouldn't have made the connection that MXY was talking about his real brother), the text offering nothing to prove the contrary, JGY most likely wanting to avoid any rumors that would relate him to incest, the text going out of its way to give us info about JGY's nonexistent sex life in 3 different occasions, even though we had no business knowing about it, the first mention being literally in his introduction, when it's said that he's known for being extremely loyal to his wife, unlike other men in his position (showing us that he's traumatized by his father's behavior and would never repeat it), then at the Guanyin temple when he says that he's never touched QS after finding out the truth (if he's loyal to Qin Su, and hasn't touched QS for more than a decade, then by now he's essentially reset to factory settings and is a virgin again), then when his mother is offended again and Xue Yang offers that he should fuck the offenders' moms and JGY says that he's not in such habits and Xue Yang confirms that yes, that's not JGY's ways. Even when they're being openly villainous and have nothing to hide from each other. and I don't think it would be too much of a reach to think that a teenager in a brothel who looks notably like his mom and would be considered a "pretty boy" in ancient times with no child services would not be a stranger to nasty looks from grown men and thus would have trauma related to grooming.)

of course, the logic is flawed in general. Because MXY has allegedly committed harassment in one form or another and JGY did force a group of sex workers to rape his father to death, and then to continue even after his death, and then killed them all. Because the cycle of violence is one of the recurring themes in the book. And is broken by only a handful of characters, and even then in some of their cases not in all aspects.

And I won't even open the can of worms that is the Yunmeng Shuangjie. (because apparently, JC is toxic and bad for WWX even pre-time-skip because...he jokes around with his brother?...but WWX is not toxic and bad for JC when he jokes around with his brother? (this has a simple reason, and that is that nobody is toxic and bad for someone else due to joking around in a harmless way, especially among siblings.) And JC and WWX have a toxic relationship and can only break up because JC just keeps nagging WWX, while WWX causing trouble for JC & their sect every second of the day because he does whatever he wants and says whatever he wants in front of whoever he wants is not stressful for JC. (again, The Yunmeng bros themselves enjoy this dynamic. Or at least think the other parts of their relationship is worth putting up with these annoyances. WWX annoys JC every chance he gets and actively kickstarts JC's naggings. JC's life is dull and dark and boring without WWX's shenanigans and the dramas he causes. He himself thinks that having WWX in his life is worth the trouble. JC makes WWX more responsible, while WWX makes JC more carefree. they're good for each other.)

So as we saw, usually, when a certain logic doesn't work both ways it's because it's flawed. make sure to not use a certain logic in your determination to defend a character that should technically work for the character you hate, too.

#mdzs #CQL #the grandmaster of demonic cultivation #the untamed #modao zushi #tgod #jin guangyao #Meng yao #mo xuanyu #jiang cheng #wei wuxian #jiang wanyin #wei ying #twin prides of yunmeng #yunmeng bros #yunmeng shuangjie #my two cents

[fincalinde]

lwj, for the meme?

Not the Lan bro I was expecting but here goes!

a song that reminds me of them

This doesn't remind me of him because I wouldn't want to ruin it for myself, but I can imagine a sad montage of interregnum LWJ set to I Am Stretched On Your Grave. Anyway, my proper answer is Frostrósir by Eivør. It's in Faroese, which I do not speak, but I pinched something from here:

Each sigh from a lonely soul Every word that was formed without sound Now seems like a frostbitten affair Dressed in the guise of lifeless flowers

what they smell like

We have an answer to this in canon and it's sandalwood, so I don't have much to add.

an otp

I mean, it is the central point of the novel. But even aside from that, LWJ is consistently only ever interested in WWX. I'm not saying he shouldn't be interpreted as gay, but I am saying that even if he is gay it's secondary to his actual sexual identity which is Weiyingsexual. I'm not treading any new ground here.

Personally I don't find Wangxian interesting, but I at least believe they love each other and are compatible in the sense that they are both selfish in slightly different ways that mesh well for their own private universe. Not so great for others in their orbit, but part of that is authorial fiat so I try to be fair about what I hold against them.

I don't think CQL successfully executed the changes it made to Wangxian in having them click and partner up from the beginning, but I do think it was necessary to at least attempt to rebalance the relationship. In MDZS, WWX genuinely does not reciprocate LWJ's feelings in his first life beyond a very deeply buried and not particularly inevitable spark. His first life is really centred on his relationships with JC and JYL and they are the tragic 'romance' (in the traditional sense). LWJ only gets upgraded during the second life. Kind of awkward to do your sweeping romance if it isn't a romance in the 35+ episodes of flashbacks, so I don't blame them for trying. And I do like the Colin Firth vibes WYB brought to his LWJ.

a notp

Aside from not finding the idea of LWJ with anyone else convincing, let me take the opportunity to pettily sideswipe at Chengxian and shoving LWJ in to make it what? Wangchengxian? Is that what it's called? Either way, nooooooo thank you. You can't get much more fraternal than WWX and JC's idiot bickering, and even if they weren't such classic stupid boys together, JC and LWJ loathe one another with the kind of loathing that does not give way to a rendition of I've Grown Accustomed To Her Face. (Incidentally, in the original stage version Eliza walks out on Higgins never to return, and it is awesome.)

favorite platonic/familial relationships

Obviously it's his relationship with LXC (and by extension LQR?). Just absolutely fascinating. Their rapport is very sweet, as is LXC's protectiveness and gentle trolling. LWJ is not a particularly good didi, but LXC both doesn't notice and doesn't mind.

Actually, someone once made a meme for me in relation to this, let me dust it off and drag it out:

More seriously, though he was also raised with harsh discipline, in comparative terms LWJ is the spoilt baby of the family. As is often the result when we encounter morally rigid characters in MDZS, he is also in many respects hypocritical. Clearly I have a lot of negative things to say about him as a brother to LXC, but I'm not interested in demonising him and what's really interesting about it is that by and large this uneven dynamic works for the Twin Jades. Right up until it doesn't.

When LXC really needs LWJ to come through for him, he just doesn't. I'm not even talking about LWJ's behaviour leading up to and during the Temple, which is objectionable in the sense that he refuses to give JGY the benefit of the doubt that LXC extends to WWX. No, I'm talking about the fact that he bods off for literal months after LXC has just been through the worst experience of his life and lost his closest friend and partner. And I don't want to hear it about LXC being the elder and having a responsibility to take care of LWJ. LWJ owes consideration to his big brother and clan leader, even if that consideration might take a different form.

Here's a thought experiment. After WWX's first death, when LWJ has been whipped 33 times by the discipline whip and dragged himself to rescue LSZ and branded himself in drunken grief, can you imagine LXC bodding off for three months without a word to have picnics with JGY? It's inconceivable isn't it.

I didn't intend for this section to become a hit piece on LWJ and he obviously does love his brother, but in terms of actions it is somewhat of a one way street. The fact that LXC has no other expectations doesn't protect LWJ from my croc-hatted judgement face.

a headcanon that is popular in the fandom but that i disagree with

Righteous LWJ. Oh, please. In MDZS, righteousness goes hand in hand with hypocrisy, and though I doubt MXTX the human being intended LWJ to be read as thoroughly selfish, the (translation of) the text she wrote is a depiction of a profoundly selfish man. And that's not a bad thing, because his selfishness coupled with the occasions when he is genuinely altruistic makes him more interesting than if he really were a moralising ice cube with a ribbon tied around it.

the position they sleep in

Official Lan Position, and postcanon I probably don't want to know.

a crossover au i’d love to see them in

I'm going to be lazy and suggest X-Men AU again just because his secondary power would definitely be organic diamond form like Emma Frost. I don't think he'd also be a telepath, but the idea of that is funny because he could read WWX's mind and know for certain that WWX isn't (currently) into him. But as a serious answer, organic diamond form as a secondary power and then primary power the same as Alison Blaire. I see no reason why his mutant name wouldn't be Dazzler too.

my favorite outfit they’ve ever worn

I think he only has like one outfit. I'm sorry, I'm not cool enough to be able to distinguish between different varieties of plain white robes. In CQL I prefer first life LWJ because they put that massive ornament on second life LWJ's head to make him look older and taller but actually they created an unfortunate perspective effect where he just looks even shorter.

#ask #crashorpie #roquen meta #me when i'm discussing lwj: CRITICAL DIDI FAILURE #me when i'm writing fic from lxc's perspective: precious tragic didi i would die for him

[admirableadmiranda]

Don't get me wrong. I just looove all of MDZS. Be it novel or any adaptation. But I just find WWX to be so passive when it comes to the rest of the cultivation world. Like he annihilated a great part of the Wen Sect as revenge to what they did to the Jiang sect. But when it came down to his new family he just went like: it's all in the past. Blah blah blah. I know its part of his character but honestly I find it unrealistic for anyone to react like that. Lol, im suprised he had unrest after his death for 13 years and for what?! being a good person. I think that WWX a great protagnist but his was too heavy of a price to pay he feels too perfect and too good and although that great. I kinda feel a little odd how easy he lets stuff go. Personally, the cultivation world is horrible and unjust that I see no good in it at all. He didn't even know Wen Yuan survived until the end of the story. Likd c'mon at least destroy some more major sects. 🥺😔

Anon, this sort of attitude towards the events of the story is one that I do not find particularly pleasing and a sign of usually missing the point and themes of the story. There is no small amount of thought and intent that MXTX put into making Wei Wuxian the sort of protagonist he is and it makes the book better for it.

Wei Wuxian is not the sort of person who would casually kill uninvolved people for being associated with those who did once hurt him before, and to suggest he should have is to drag him down to the levels of Jin Guangyao, blackening him beyond repair or respect for his character. To call him passive is to ignore the very nature of what he sees and why his choice actually changes something.

Let's for a moment, go ahead and consider what Modaozushi looks like if he does do that. If instead of choosing to not take vengeance on everyone and sundry, he instead brings the storm of fire and vengeance the clans fear because if it were them in his position they would do that.

Let's see why it's such a worse story than Modaozushi itself is.

Wei Wuxian: misunderstood person who was labelled as a villain before his death and had his reputation trashed to hell and back to cover up their shame at their actions, comes back and decides to wreak vengeance on the clans, wipe out some major clans in return, right as they did to him and the Wen Remnants, down to even the innocent children had they seen him.

These major clans would be the Lan, the Nie, the Jin and the Jiang.

So our story instead of beginning with us seeing that there's something off about the story we're told and the character we meet, he instead at best lets the Lan boys die trying to fight the arm. Sizhui is dead. His whole efforts that ended in his death the first time are utterly wasted now. But that doesn't seem to be something people consider when blithely suggesting that he should wipe out some major clans, especially since he's very quick to remind us that the children are innocent of what came before them in canon!

But I digress, we are not telling Modaozushi the actual brilliant story, we are telling MDZS the flat revenge story.

So Wei Wuxian kills or lets die all the Lan juniors that were trying to fight the arm and this is now fine because it's what the clans did to him. The next people he would run into is Jin Ling! The son of his beloved Shijie. But he's a Jin and part of the Jin clan and children are not immune from his revenge and Jin Ling is not kind to him when they first meet.

So Jin Ling will die. Then yes, we will finally have someone involved who was actually at the siege; Jiang Cheng. Who now will have a good reason to want to kill Wei Wuxian as he just killed Jin Ling in cold blood because he is related to a clan that led a siege on him in his past life.

Since he has to kill the people in the major clans and eradicate them, Lan Wangji can't live either. Too bad, so sad, no sweet romance, we're here for a vengeance plot. Whether it happens in Mo Manor or Dafan Mountain, it would be a rough fight, but well, Wei Wuxian is here to kill the major clans so Lan Wangji has to die.

Nie Huaisang pulled a lot of strings and helped him come back to life, as well as the fact that his Nie Clan is very visibly, tangibly no longer the same clan that Nie Mingjue led against him. But it's a major clan, with people connected to those that hurt him. No gratitude for any of this, Wei Wuxian can kill all of them.

At this point he probably ends up dying in another siege by Jin and Lan hands that is in fact entirely justified because what you are advocating for is him wiping out any clans that were involved in any way no matter the situation and while yes, I know that when people are saying this they're going "Of course Wei Wuxian would let the children, and Nie Huaisang, and Lan Wangji live, because he's not a bad guy", but that's not what they're saying.

What they and you are advocating for is the cycles of vengeance and killing to continue on and on and on. What you want is not an actual act of justice or change that will lead to a better world, but yet more senseless bloodlust. No one in this world is completely unconnected from this.

Wei Wuxian takes not a passive action, but an active one. He has not forgotten what came before, but he chooses where to place his anger and when to act on it. He wants nothing to do with Jiang Cheng and actively runs away from him multiple times. The only time he talks to Lan Qiren at all is in the cave during the Second Siege and after that continues to ignore him as much as he wants.

He calls out the people who are trying to blame him for what happened, he makes it very clear that he will not shoulder their blame for no reason, he still defends them because as much as he personally may not like them, no one deserves what Jin Guangyao tried to do to them.

Do you not realize that, anon? Do you not realize that the same choice to give his all to protect the Wen Remnants despite their connection to the people who wiped out the Jiang clan before is the one he keeps taking in his second life? By all means the Jiang revenge is the outlier here. He doesn't do that again and it is very connected with the trauma of the burial mounds and the beginning of an all out war when he does. Wei Wuxian is not being passive, he is continuing to make the same choices he did before because what the actual decision he is making is that no one deserves to die for a name.

You want here for Wei Wuxian to be judge, jury and executioner. You want him to go out and kill a bunch of nameless people because they share a name with people who sieged him thirteen years before. It's not a good thing. It's still mob mentality. You aren't making him stronger or more righteous to kill more people, you're just erasing the very message that the story carries.

What good would happen if he decided to actually go do as a lot of people want and massacre a bunch of great Clans? Would it fix the societal problems that led to his death the first time? Would it bring back the Wen Remnants and make it so that nothing bad happened the first time?

Or would it just respark the war and cycles of hatred that have plagued him and his generation since they were children and ensure that there will be no such thing as peace in any lifetime?

Wei Wuxian and the Wen Remnants are left with a unique choice in their lifetimes, something that many people do not get. They get to look their killers in the eye, during a time where they could let them be killed and the people around them expect it, and save their lives anyway regardless of their history. They say "You killed me, but your right to live is more important to me than my justified anger. I will keep you alive when I could stand by and do nothing." That is not passive. That is not naive.

I strongly suggest that you consider why it is that you think the story is not as good because Wei Wuxian didn't do exactly what you would have done in that situation. He's not a blank self insert who does actions that don't make sense, we see this pattern of choices play out multiple times.

Why do you conflate justice with death? Who determined that the only way to get get revenge is to bury them? Wei Wuxian's revenge is far better served by him getting everything he ever wanted, a life where he is at peace and loved, with no more battles to fight.

I think that's a much more valuable story than any amount of extraneous murder would have ever been.

#mdzs #wei wuxian #asks #anon #anon asks #seriously the focus on WWX having not murdered enough people is getting really annoying #and yes I would call it murder in this situation #given that people are not advocating for maybe things to have turned out differently at nightless city or the first siege #but for him to come back and kill whole major clans because their leaders were involved in the killing of the last wens #did the Jin being the most openly villanous clan and being the only ones to wipe out clans entirely go over your head? #did the fact that the Wen were becoming aggressive and attacking people for no reason escape you that this was a bad thing? #they actually had a justified reason to go to war #where it fell apart was what should have happened in peacetime #but seriously I do not approve of the fandom trend of saying WWX should kill more people #I already have to convince people that he's not like JGY or XY for the killing he does in canon without y'all making my job harder

[marquisguyun]

mdzs/cql ask meme: 1, 2, 6, 12, 25 :)))

1. which adaptations have you seen/watched? which one do you like best and why?

I’ve watched both the donghua and CQL (and read the book and some of the manhua). I’m not sure if I have a definitive answer to which visual adaptation is better? The donghua is gorgeous, especially all the demonic cultivation in the third season (plus it was my first mdzs adaptation, my first danmei of any kind actually). I do really enjoy CQL tho, and there are things I like and dislike about both adaptations. That answer is a total cop out but it’s also the truth 😂

2. top 5 favorite characters? what specifically do you like about each one?

Okay so I thought I had this, no problem, and then I counted again and realized I had six characters lmao... I’m not doing this in order bc that’s too many decisions to deal with

1. Wei Wuxian - What can I say, I love a tragic hero! I am intrigued by how smart he is (inventing demonic cultivation, lure flags, etc) but also how he makes mistakes and does some really fucked up stuff even tho he has good intentions. A great complex character!

2. Lan Wangji - I mean who doesn't like Hanguang-jun? He's a badass and a romantic, plus he's stubborn as shit. I really appreciate his relationships with the juniors. I also think his whole teenage angst about liking wwx is fantastic, and also him being super horny and dominant... I am a fan of novel dynamics for wangxian's sex life lol

3. Xue Yang & Xiao Xingchen - I am a slut for a good tragedy and for messed up characters! Plus I love identity porn. Yi City and XueXiao were basically tailored to my personal taste.

4. Lan Sizhui - He's just a good boy! And I like the added complexity of his identity.

5. Jiang Cheng - Honestly it took me a little while to latch onto him as hard, but he grew on me steadily. I originally mostly thought about him in relation to WWX, but damn he's been through a lot! Raising his nephew and running his sect on his own after he's lost everything? Really fucking sad and angry about it? That's good shit!

Also want to note that I like all of these characters in all adaptations, but their actors all did a fantastic job in cql and really added to my love for the characters, especially Wang Haoxuan as Xue Yang and Wang Zuocheng as Jiang Cheng!

6. unpopular opinions?

1. I don’t hate Jiang Cheng or Lan Qiren? those can be pretty unpopular opinions

2. I’m a white American and my reading of danmei is definitely colored by my different experiences/worldview... I try to be aware of that as much as I can be and to read meta by Chinese disaspora (EDIT: I wrote this like a year ago and idk where I was going with this, but I think I was trying to say something about how I try to make sure my opinions aren't culturally insensitive? Bc some of the takes you see definitely are)

12. do you like any other of mxtx's works? is mdzs your first of hers or did you watch/read the others first?

It’s less obvious on tumblr bc there’s less content I come across compared to twt but your girl is a Scum Villain main lmao (EDIT: That was written a year ago when I started answering this ask. One of the advantages to twt's whole mess is that there's more scum villain content on tumblr now!!)

That said, I have read all three MXTX novels, watched all three donghuas, watched CQL, and read at least part of all three manhuas (rip sv manhua)

my order of watching/reading (with some overlap) was something like: watched mdzs donghua s1-2 >>> read mdzs novel >>> watched cql >>> started scumbag system >>> started heaven official’s blessing donghua >>> read scum villain >>> read what little there is of the sv manhua >>> waited several months?? and then read tgcf >>> dabbled with mdzs and tgcf manhuas >>> watched mdzs donghua s3

25. queer headcanons? 

- I definitely see Wei Wuxian as bi, altho I can understand reading him as a gay man who isn’t actually attracted at all to the women he flirts with - On the other hand, 90% of the time I see Lan Wangji as gay. The other 10% is me going “but what if Wei Ying was a girl tho”

I don’t think I have a lot of definitive non canon queer headcanons for mdzs honestly? There are definitely ones I enjoy and ones I don’t really see, but a lot of times I’m just happy to be taken along for the ride of other people’s headcanons for a fic or meta. Here are a few I’ve enjoyed:

- Asexual Jiang Cheng - Bisexual Jiang Fengmian (in love with Wei Changze) - Trans headcanons/AUs for various characters

#mdzs+ #mdzs #cql #clearing out the old drafts #besides the notes i added really the only thing that still needed done was why i liked the characters #apparently i was too lazy to finish that a year ago

[thecolorsofwater]

Kind of incoherent

But I'm wondering whether there's something to be said about the danger of trying to force a family on people in the show/novel. Trying to put the jiang family in context - yzy vs jfm and the kids on who is family and I think I'm going to end up on all of the families.

I think the easiest way to start is wen yuan, maybe.

I run into a lot of 'wwx isn't really a-yuan's parent' discourse, and I absolutely think this is valid in that wwx does none of the 'parenty' bits of 'taking care of child, providing for them, being stable so child can explore the world', but I also want to think about that without invalidating the way that wwx is part of his larger, communal, family. He's been accepted by the surviving Wen elders for 2 generations and given a sort of claim to kinship. And the important thing is that while we as a fandom often tend to use this to invalidate WY's original family, wwx doesn't need to in order to say 'this is family'.

and sort of comparing that to lwj, who does need to invalidate - or at least to hide - wy's family, to claim him as lsz instead of wy. And how that could be a terrible thing and a rejection of wy's identity, especially since the whole - IDEK what MXTX does with her weird memory issues with everyone - and that the reason it's not is that all parts of this new, cobbled-together family want to be together and are willing to make whatever compromises are needed to make it work.

Which, of course, is why the Lan family as a whole works

Because even if lwj and lxc have bad parents, everyone they regularly interact with in the Lan clan seems to be willing to work with them, to get things done, and to do their best for them as a family. It could be argued it’s actually the absence of their toxic parents which makes the family seem as united as it is, and we can argue till the cows come home about if the Lan (and especially LQR) are overly restrictive, but no one seems to argue that lqr doesn’t love and want his nephews – not just around but in his family. Or that lxc and lwj don’t want both each other and their uncle – and the rest of their sect, including, eventually, wy/lsz.

Which of course is why I needed to go back to wen yuan before I could address the truly fucked up Jiang family

Because where this started was my thinking about yzy and her refusal to accept wwx into her family. And the way that no one in that family seems to know where they do - or where they want to - stand in relation to the family as a whole.

It's - the thing is that it isn't just a 'jfm wants to adopt wwx and his wife says no'. Because it's honestly not clear to me that jfm does want to adopt him. He wants him around as a reminder of wwx' birth family, and he wants to spoil him, but (speaking without doing the research to be sure if this is on point) I'm not actually sure he wants to be wwx's parent. More importantly, I'm not convinced jfm wants to be anyone's parent.

So we end up with a family where:

Yzy definitely wants jyl and jwy/jc (toxic as she can be about it) as her family. Arguments can be made about whether she wants jfm or just wants him to stop fucking up and would be happy if he did that by vanishing, but she def. doesn’t want wwx in her family.

Jfm arguably might not want any of yzy, jyl, or jc – though we absolutely see some evidence that he’s trying to at least fulfill social pressures to be head of household and father. Definitely does want wwx, but maybe not as family. And you know, I don’t think he’s talked about this to his wife at all because she also doesn’t seem sure whether wwx is supposed to be her adopted kid who she’s trying to reject or an uppity servant who she’s trying to put in his place.

Jyl wants both wwx and jc as her brothers. Uncertain if she wants her parents or if she’d go non-contact if she had the option.

Jc wants everyone and wants them all to love each other, but is super confused about how that should/could work out, especially with wwx. I would honestly be both shocked and disbelieving if someone said jc had any sort of coherent idea of how his dream family was supposed to look beyond ‘nice to each other’ and ‘sometimes evidence of affection, maybe’?

Wwx is almost as confused as jc. He pretty clearly loves jc and jyl, but also … doesn’t call them siblings. Doesn’t seem sure what to make of jyl calling them siblings. Social structure absolutely makes this even more complicated as wwx is left going ‘they’re both inferior to me bc I’m the most awesome cultivator and thus I need to protect them and they’re my social superiors’. And that’s before we add yzy and jfm.

Unlike wy, wwx is super attached to his birth parents – or at least, the idea of them and his memories of them. He wouldn’t want to be a Jiang, because he’s a Wei. How much of that is self-protection in response to yzy, idk, but even if yzy had a change of heart during the Cloud Recesses arc when we first meet wwx and went ‘let’s adopt this’ I think he’d say no. And with the way he calls jfm ‘uncle’ – I think I remember this anyway – I don’t know that he wants to be jfm’s kid either. Even if he hadn’t seen how jfm treats his actual kids.

this in relation to my guilty reddit aita pleasure and the number of truly awful 'my family member is forcing this person into my family' stories and much as I love the Yunmeng Trio as 3 Jiang sibs … I don’t think there’s a way for the family to work, and I don’t think it’s just yzy who is the reason.

(trying not to be too biased in the above, but I am willing to be corrected if I’ve screwed anything up)

Which brings me to the Jin.

And my initial thought with them about how, without wanting to invalidate MY/JGY’s very understandable desire to have a father who would recognize him, he’s doing the same thing to his father and his father’s wife that jfm is doing to yzy. And how maybe the Jiang family is meant to be a lesson – and another way in which jgy and wwx are mirroring each other – about the danger of trying to force people to be your family. And JGS (may he rot) makes it clear that it doesn’t matter whether yzy’s fears are right and wwx is jfm’s son.

Because unlike jfm, who can be believed when he says ‘that’s my friend’s son, not mine’, JGS makes no attempt to say ‘that’s not my bio kid’. But he still gets to say ‘that’s not family’ (and so does his wife, little though we see of her) and I kind of think we’re supposed look at him and –beyond thinking he has dreadful sexual ethics even before he commits explicit rape – think about how responsibility to his children might actually mean not bringing them into a household where they’re not wanted.

Like – it’s cute to imagine JZX and JGY trying to be siblings and it’s absolutely the ‘proper Chinese wife’s place’ to accept their husband’s children (currently reading Exemplary Women of China, which is a great translation of 列女傳 the 18 BCE set of ‘what a good woman looks like’ stories and it’s got a lot of ‘good wives accept their husband’s concubine’s kids or their stepkids’ stories), but also I don’t think MXTX is asking readers to just accept misogynistic social standards and say ‘the husband sows and the wife reaps’ (though, see the Nie family who I hope to get to later…)

So despite what ms thinks and tells her son, JGS isn’t necessarily supposed to bring his bio-children home (or, he absolutely is by social rules, but MXTX doesn’t necessarily seem to agree that that’s the right thing to do). And if he does, then realistically – by standard social norms – he should bring his mother too (which if we’re being cynical is obviously why ms might have wanted a child by him). But given how positively we’re shown ms in canon, it wouldn’t make sense for the answer to be as simple as ‘then don’t visit prostitutes’ (though, like, ‘don’t cheat on your spouse; either get her on board or keep it to yourself’ is definitely a reasonable option, especially since men could divorce their wives ….)

And idek what Mo Xuanyu is meant to show. I mean, we’re obviously not supposed to think ‘bring the kid home and then later kick him out’ is okay. But was bringing him into Lanling to learn cultivation in the first place good? Bad? Would that have been the right choice is JGS hadn’t been a dick about it?

Which leads us to the Nie, who I absolutely cannot be unbiased about because I love them

I love that the Nie are our canonical ‘look, non-blood sibs can work’ family. And also our ‘ but seriously, guys, don’t do this’ family.

Nmj and nhs, who have canonically different mothers (even if it’s only Word of God that nhs’ mum is a concubine rather than a second wife) are our obvious ‘here’s the right way of doing – I can’t even call it marital infidelity but kids by multiple women’. But we don’t see what that looks like and we don’t understand it – which makes perfect sense since we’re seeing it from the perspective of wwx, who fundamentally doesn’t have a clear sense of what family should look like

And nmj is also at the center of yet another ‘don’t try to make a family work when not everyone agrees’ with jgy in 3-zun. Where even if we all agree that nmj wants to have a working relationship with jgy, I think it’s obvious (does anyone remember that awesome tumblr post about the vows and comparing 3-zun with our historical examples? I’m writing this at work and don’t have that on me … ) that nmj was absolutely not ready for the type of relationship that 3-zun is at the time when lxc talked him into it.

And 3-zun is also at the center of yet another ‘doomed triad’ (wow mxtx likes those) with nhs, jgy, and lxc. Which is one of those that manages somehow to do both. It’s a great set of ‘brothers’. Lxc and jgy really do seem to like nhs (although maybe … less so … by the end). Nhs really does seem happy to have extra ‘siblings’. I mean, the fact that he calls them all his brothers and they let him is actually a huge sign of affection from everyone involved. And yet – well.

We all know how this story ends, don’t we?

#untamed #ramblings #meta

[vrishchikawrites]

Could I have a prompt? 🥺🥺 So WWX is taking bath in the Cold Pond to heal from the wounds by the discipline paddle (which I assume he was punished being clothed in his Black robe or in his Gusu Lan disciple robes or Head disciple Jiangs robes whichever fits). Before going to CR, wwx is whipped by mdm yu and LWJ notices wwx’s raw red scars and many scars across his back kinda overlapping and not yet being healed because maybe MDM yu sealed his core or something. LWJ, or with LXC saw WWX’s many crisscrossing scars and realize they’re still raw and kinda risking for infection because when mdm yu unseals his spiritual energy before going to CR, WWX never thought of healing it. Cue LWJ and LXC gets horrified and ask WWX why he had many scars on his back (or other parts of his body can also be included!) no pressure 💕 I love your writing! ❤️���️

Anyway, it is set during the period in which WWX studies at CR. Lån Qiren, who is obviously not eyeing Wei Wuxian just in case the boy creates some trouble ends up realizing that he is too non chalant about  not eating (because the food there is for rabbits) and WWX is like "Oh, yeah. Nah its fine, I've been worse".

This one has trigger warnings for child abuse, negligence, and issues related to eating habits. Keep that in mind before proceeding. Nothing graphic, but I wanted to warn nonetheless.

I've merged two prompts here.

Please remember that prompts are closed. Also, remember I do not write self-deprication. All prompts that require WWX to have low self-esteem are not going to be written, apologies but the subject is very uncomfortable for me and I don't believe it is canon accurate anyways.

On to the prompt fill.

"That Wei child is entirely too careless." 

Lan Qiren closes his eyes and prays for patience. That boy has been a menace ever since he stepped into Cloud Recesses. Brilliant but wily and mischievous with absolutely no regard for rules. 

"What has he done?" He asks gruffly, reading over the reports from the kitchen staff. Cloud Recesses always monitors the food intake of their guests to make sure everyone is well-fed and no one is consuming more than their due. It wouldn't do for young cultivators to fall ill in their care, after all. 

The primary healer, a matron of some age, had brought the reports instead of the kitchen manager, which was quite unusual, "He forgets meals. Goes without food for days. Survives on small bits of fruit."

Xichen, who has been working on his own reports, raises his head and looks concerned. 

Lan Qiren crosses his arms, feeling a growing sense of ire, "He dislikes our meals." He's not the first one to skip meals because he considers them 'bland' and 'boring'. It's likely the child has been sneaking down to Caiyi town to have more extravagant meals. 

"I checked with our ward team. When he goes days without eating, he doesn't make any trips to Caiyi town either."

Lan Qiren pauses and studies her. Lan Mingyun nods curtly, "When I first noticed this behavior, I immediately put him on my list." Her list of children with food-related issues, he assumes, "His eating habits are very erratic, erratic enough that I wish to assign one of our senior disciples to keep an eye on him."

"You're that worried?" Lan Xichen asks in surprise while Lan Qiren frowns. It isn't unusual to do so but he wonders if it is really necessary.

"As far as I know, the child lived on the streets for quite a few years," She says and Lan Qiren narrows his eyes, inwardly reprimanding himself. He had forgotten about that aspect of Wei Wuxian's history, "The link between early childhood trauma and behavioural problems are well known to us."

Lan Xichen frowns, "I'll ask Wangji to keep an eye on him."

He glances at his nephew sharply, "Why Wangji?" He demands because surely someone else would be better.

"From what I understand, Wei-gongzi will not welcome an assigned senior. He seems to be someone who brushes injuries or illnesses off. He likes Wangji and will be more willing to accept his company."

While the argument is reasonable, Lan Qiren is loath to involve his precious nephew in this. He's already so bothered by the boy. 

But.

He thinks of Wei Wuxian with his sharp eyes and lingering smile and nods. 

---

Wangji listens to Xichen patiently even as his fingers curl into fists under his sleeves. 

He doesn't like Wei Wuxian. The boy is too disruptive, too bold, too distracting-

Too beautiful.

He doesn't like him, but that doesn't mean he's content to ignore his well-being. When Xichen asks him to keep an eye on Wei Ying's eating habits and general behavior, Wangji agrees. 

It will be taxing for him, but he agrees.  

What he doesn't anticipate is… everything that follows. When he starts consciously looking for them, the signs are alarming. Wei Ying doesn't just skip meals whenever he gets too distracted, he picks at the food even when he is eating. While Wangji is comforted to know the boy frequently seeks something richly flavored at Caiyi Town, he doesn't do it often enough to compensate.

There are also some concerning behaviors in the Jiang contingent. Upon closer inspection, it is clear that while Wei Ying does break the rules, the other Jiang Sect disciples are often complicit. Including Jiang Wanyin. 

They not only let their da-shixiong take the blame for all of their actions, but also encourage it. Wei Ying seems disconcertingly accustomed to it. He makes a scene while being punished but seems alright within an hour. 

Jiang Wanyin encourages mischief and reprimands him in turns. 

Wangji doesn't understand this.

"Xiongzhang, I am concerned," Xichen looks up from his tea, his attention immediately on Wangji, unwavering and comforting, "Wei Ying," He takes a moment to form his thoughts, "I am uncertain. I believe he is in an unsafe environment."

Xichen sets his tea aside, "How so?"

"I happened upon a conversation," He grimaces because it is eavesdropping even if his intentions are noble, "Jiang Wanyin and Nie Huaisang requested and encouraged him to get alcohol into Cloud Recesses. When he complained about the punishment, Jiang Wanyin said 'at least, it wasn't Zidian'."

His brother sucks in a sharp breath, "Zidian? Madam Yu? Spiritual weapon? A high-grade weapon typically used against enemies?"

Wangji dips his head. 

"I'll ask uncle to stop assigning corporal punishments." Lan Xichen says, "They won't have the desired effect in any case and we don't want to damage him permanently. Tomorrow, ask him to practice Cultivation in the Cold Pond as punishment."

Wangji nods, "I'll assign Jiang Wanyin and Nie Huaisang proper punishment as well."

"Wait until we have a better grasp on the situation." Xichen says solemnly, "If we act too quickly, things will escalate and may cause more harm to Wei-gongzi."

Wangji is reluctant because his sense of justice is not satisfied. He remembers how the Jiang disciples encouraged Wei Ying to accept punishment on their behalf. And then to know Jiang Wanyin was also complicit…

"We must approach this cautiously, Wangji."

He nods.

---

Red, irritated, scarred.

Wangji swallows as he sees the state of Wei Ying's back as the Jiang disciple steps into the Cold Pond. There are so many whip scars on his back, so many that have barely begun to heal, that he feels nauseous. 

"Wei Ying," He struggles to keep his tone neutral, "Your back." He cannot imagine the agony that Wei Ying would've suffered when he took more punishment on it the other day. 

Wei Ying glances at him and grins, "Aiya, Lan Zhan, is that concern I see on your pretty face?" He asks, spinning around eagerly, "Concern for little old me?"

His back is out of sight and the way Wei Wuxian is leaning towards him is meant to distract and fluster.

Wangji… suddenly understands. Wei Ying is naturally playful and mischievous, but he uses his personality for disguise and manipulation as well. Not maliciously, but in a way that harms him.

"Wei Ying," Wangji refuses to be moved. There is a significant shift in his mind. He no longer feels annoyed by the person before him. If anything, he feels furious. 

He feels protective.

"Wei Ying, your back."

The Jiang disciple shrugs, "Punishment, you know how it is." 

"For what?" He demands, catching Wei Ying's elbow and turning him around. The willingness to touch him stuns Wei Ying momentarily, enough for Wangji to get a good look at the brutal devastation written on Wei Ying's back. 

Wei Ying clears his throat and shrugs, "It's more of a preemptive punishment? Madam Yu knew I would cause trouble here, of course." He chuckles.

"Preemptive punishment?" He asks softly, the very notion troubling him. 

Wei Ying shrugs again but doesn't attempt to explain when it is clear Wangji isn't willing to indulge him.

"Wei Ying,"

"Lan Zhan," Wei Ying starts to move towards the shore, "Don't worry about things that don't concern you. Your head will forever be burdened if you do."

Wangji feels something in him recoil at such a blunt dismissal. 

"Doesn't concern me? How can it not concern me?" He wants to ask but is unable to. 

Wei Ying has made him very uncomfortable with his forward personality and near constant teasing, but Wangji has seen the genuine offer of friendship underneath it all. 

He has always spurned it. 

As Wei Ying climbs onto the shore, his wounds red against his naturally pale skin, Wangji makes a decision, "Would you not feel concerned if it were me?" He asks but he already knows the answer.

He already knows this man enough.

"Of course," Wei Ying says and shrugs on his robes, hiding a wince but unable to help his body's reaction to pain, "But you and I are different." He glances over his shoulder at Wangji, "I consider you my friend," He says, "But you don't consider me yours."

His breath stills at the acceptance in Wei Ying's tone.

"And that's alright." The Jiang disciple waves and walks away, "Don't worry too much, Lan Zhan. This one isn't weak. The wounds will heal within a few days."

---

"The facts are these - Wei-gongzi is punished preemptively with Zidian, often enough that there are deep scars on his back," Lan Xichen explains, "I assume it is his Golden Core keeping him from sustaining permanent damage."

Lan Qiren is still bristling at the very thought of preemptive punishment. What a ridiculous notion! Of course, the child doesn't care about rules and upsetting people! He has already been punished enough to excuse everything but outright treason.  

How is such a method effective? How does it correct a child's misbehavior? 

"The Jiang Sect disciples are accustomed to their da-shixiong being punished in their stead. They actively encourage it. Jiang Wanyin has asked Wei-gongzi to sneak in alcohol. And he refused to come forward when Wei-gongzi was punished." Xichen takes a deep breath, "I believe any lingering issues he may have because of his early days as a street orphan-"

"Are ignored," Lan Qiren concludes grimly, "It is no wonder the child has such strong cultivation. He is facing strife constantly."

"Is there a way to rescue him?" Wangji asks after being grimly silent for the entire meeting, "Get him away from the Jiang Sect?"

Lan Qiren eyes him, "Wangji, the situation is complicated. He's still the Jiang Head Disciple and sects don't just part with their high ranking disciples."

Xichen smiles sympathetically, "We'll find a way to pressure Jiang-zongzhu into taking action. He'll lose face if the other Sects know how his lady is treating their Head Disciple." He shakes his head at Wangji's expression, "Let us think about it. Meanwhile, you just need to be there for your friend, Wangji."

Lan Qiren arches a brow, "Friend? Wangji, I thought you disliked the boy."

Wangji purses his lips, a stubborn light entering his eyes, "Wei Ying is my friend." He insists, resolve lining his every word. 

He looks at Xichen, who just looked amused, "According to Wei-gongzi, he considers Wangji a friend and will be very concerned if Wangji was in a similar situation," He huffs, "But Wangji doesn't consider Wei-gongzi his friend, so there's no need for Wangji to worry."

Lan Qiren closes his eyes and rubs his forehead in an uncharacteristic display of frustration, "That boy is a singular menace."

---

Wangji pursues friendship with all the dedication in his being. He learns to cook savory dishes and gives them to Wei Ying every day. Wei Ying, unable and utterly unwilling to deny, eats it all. 

He glares the Jiang disciples into submission whenever they attempt to draw Wei Ying into mischief. The Jiang Head Disciple is fully exempt from corporal punishment. Instead, he spends hours in the library either copying rules, rewriting classics, or transcribing Buddhist texts. 

All of these activities prove to be much more effective punishments.

Meanwhile, Lan Qiren attends a Discussion Conference and has word with Jiang Fengmian. 

The response is a gentle order from the Jiang-zongzhu for Wei Ying. He asks his disciple to remain in Cloud Recesses for Musical Cultivation training. He also mentions it is time for Jiang Wanyin to take up Head Disciple responsibilities and learn true leadership. 

Wei Ying eyes the smiling Lan Xichen and impassive Lan Qiren sharply but doesn't say anything.

In two years time, the distance between Wei Ying and the Jiang Sect grows. The distance between Wei Ying and Lan Zhan ceases to exist. 

Just like that, Wei Wuxian's destiny changes.

#short prompts #wei wuxian #lan wangji #anti jiang sect #anti madam yu #anti jiang wanyin

[tonyglowheart]

same anon about the chinese terms; i keep thinking clan = extended family. wwx is adopted right? cause i keep thinking that by how fandom does it and the clan term says that's right to my brain

Nooooo think of this more like a feudal system (I don't know historical fuedal systems well enough dont quote me) or like... idk, Game of Thrones, everyone knows game of thrones now right? I don’t know Game of Thrones either, just imagine a... game of thrones-esque setting

So you have the Clan, right, and the main family of the clan? the uhh what are they, the starks, the lannisters, the whoever else. You have the main family at the center of that. But then you also have all sorts of servants and soldiers and retainers and whatever. In a feudal system you have knights and stuff. They all technically “belong with” the clan/are under the banner of the main family, but are not literally members of the family, are not adopted into the main family tree, etc. A royal companion of a royal heir in real life history, for example, could even be raised alongside the heir, attend the same classes, participate in the same activities, and they could be close as brothers. But the royal companion does not become the literal adopted sibling of the royal heir. It’s like how you might be friends with your boss, and they might consider you like family, but while the boss-employee relationship exists they’re still your boss, and there’s still that power dynamic & positional difference there.

“Traditionally,” or like, in what can be considered established xianxia/wuxia canon, you have cultivation sects that are more like apprenticeship or... guilds I guess? I only know vaguely about historical guilds, so I’m more borrowing their idea than quoting them exactly. You have masters and you have apprentices, and journeymen, etc, and apprentices can hone their still and “go up in rank” so to speak, work their way up to being a full master in the guild. It’s an organizational grouping that creates close bonds but is not necessarily a family in the nuclear family sense or like the family tree or clan sense. But MDZS cultivation families are structured much more like nobility/gentry, even if they came from humble origins, where you have the whole... core family + also the accompanying people who are under the family’s banner and thus “part of the Clan” as far as considering the clan as like, a political organization also goes. But not literal adoption into the family. 

Within wuxia/xianxia, sect-mates are actually considered more marriagable prospects than outsiders, and a lot of the romances in the dramas might be about a shixiong and a shimei or whatever. (If you think about them as a professional collective that does have close personal bonds, like a guild might, then it makes sense; you spend a lot of time around these people so you know them well already, plus if your sect has proprietary techniques you would keep that inside the sect. it’d be like if you had a childhood sweetheart, like in PotC with Will Turner and Elizabeth Swan). 

“Wei Wuxian is adopted” is the absolute Anglophone myth of the century and the bane of my existence lmao, because he’s NOT. People use it to discourse about all sorts of things and justify all sort of other things, but his standing in relation to the Jiang family is much more nuanced and complicated than “he’s adopted.” He’s a cultivator, so he’s not just a normal servant, and he’s also the head disciple, plus he can be considered, at the very least, a sort of “royal companion” to Jiang Cheng and Jiang Yanli even, so he does have an advanced place compared to your average Yunmeng Jiang disciple. But, like how in PotC Will was raised alongside Elizabeth, that doesn’t make them automatically adopted. Even Jiang Yanli declaring Wei Wuxian her did doesn’t mean that he is, or that he is to her, per se. Before anyone throws rocks at me - I’m not saying she doesn’t consider him like a brother, or that they’re not close. But that assertion had a very specific purpose. As mentioned, your sect-mates are actually considered to be very marriagable prospects, and Madam Jin was suggesting it would be improper for Jiang Yanli to be alone with Wei Wuxian, who is considered a potential prospect for her. Jiang Yanli’s assertion that Wei Wuxian is her didi stops the reasoning behind the suggestions of impropriety in its tracks. But that doesn’t mean she considers him literally adopted into her whole family tree, it’s not getting into that territory, it’s an interpersonal declaration between her and WWX. It also doesn’t then automatically mean that JC should see WWX as a brother in a literal adopted sense either, which I’ve seen some people argue lmao.

Plus, if Wei Wuxian were adopted, his name most likely should have changed and he should have the Jiang name; if MXTX had decided that WWX were actually adopted but kept his own name, then MXTX should have made a note about it, like she did with Madam Yu. It’s the kind of thing that’s like, you would expect it to be remarked on at least, like it should be lampshaded if nothing else.

So, yes a clan kind of would be an extended family usually, but I thiiink even in historical terms, the like retainers or generational servants would be considered as “belonging to” the Clan, since a Clan is also kind of a political organization as well socially speaking, especially if we’re talking about nobility or landed gentry, but not literally part of the family tree - main or otherwise.

Add to that, that in MDZS, MXTX plays around with clan & the idea of a cultivation collective/organization, so a clan functions both as a clan (family), clan (political), and clan (cultivation organization organized around the schools of cultivation established the founding families).

Maybe a good example? Think of Gusu Lan. They make very clear the distinction of “inner disciple” and “outer disciple.” They all belong to Gusu Lan, but “inner disciples” - i.e. members of the family tree who can trace their ancestry to Lan An, are differentiated from outer disciples, who are part of the clan, but that doesn’t make them adopted into the family tree. Lan Sizhui, who IS adopted into the family line/tree/lineage, has both the Lan name and the cloud-scroll forehead ribbon.

Wei Wuxian being adopted actually would have made things even more complicated for YMJ imo lmao, and I think YMJ/JC would have had to do more extreme stuff to buy back into being deemed “proper” or pious by society or by like, Confucian(?) standards after WWX went rogue, and also he’d have more social obligation to eradicate WWX and his work in order to like regain honor for the family & sect. If he’d been adopted, then YMJ would have been much more closely tied to WWX, and like WWX “defecting” already is still seen as partly YMJ’s responsibility/fault, either for like... idk not bringing him up right, or for cultivating a snake in their midst, and so it’d be their responsibility to “clean up their mess” so to speak. If WWX had been adopted, he might well have carried YMJ down with him too when he chose to defect, much like how the main branch of Qishan Wen carried the whole extended clan down with them. 

#asks answered #Anonymous #not necessarily directed at u specifically but pls no more takes predicated on the assumption that wwx is adopted lmao.. he simply is Not #mdzs #mo dao zu shi #(but yeah the idea of like... you're responsible for your clan & that includes their sins & transgressions and so it's your responsibility #to like address that and right the wrongs sometimes by eradicating them yourself - that's like a way to show that you recognize what they're #doing is reprehensible and taking responsibility which like earns back some of the honor lost by your kinsman's transgressions #it's related to or stems from the idea of collective responsibility vs like individualistic responsibility and also how your kinsman's > #morality might reflect on yours. which like isn't a foreign concept to EN ppl cmon think about it. you judge ppl for their family too) #but yeah god no wei wuxian is not adopted and like. translating it as clan doesn't mean that either #it just means.. please widen your horizon of understanding of interpersonal structures beyond a nuclear family kind of structure #even European history which a lot of EN stuff is based on had these kinds of kinship structures or other close relations not based solely #on bloodlines

[robininthelabyrinth]

how do you think things would have went if lwj had confessed to wwx in the cave that they go stuck at

Yu Ziyuan was not going to start laughing, and neither was Jiang Fengmian, no matter how much he was clearly being tempted to.

She gave him a dirty look to remind him when it looked like he was weakening.

The Lan boy – they called him the Second Jade of Lan, and he certainly seemed very admirable – was being very earnest at the moment, after all, and it would undoubtedly ruin relations between their two sects if they were to laugh in his face.

And, yes, Yu Ziyuan will admit in the privacy of her own mind – she also finds this solemn little monologue absolutely adorable.

It was as if a pure white rabbit encountering its first springtime had abruptly taken human form and come to petition them for permission to frolic in the fields.

Wei Wuxian’s fields, to be specific.

Lan Wangji’s confession – it could really only be described that way – was a little oblique, but the facts of the matter were still fairly clear: he believed that he had taken advantage of Wei Wuxian during their time during the Xuanwu cave, at a time when the latter individual was not in sound mind, a matter that was causing him some great distress. He wished to make clear his faults and would accept any punishment they wished to bestow upon him, while at the same time seeking to make clear that his feelings were no less real because of the ungentlemanly way he had gone about expressing them.

Really, it was a well-fashioned apology in every way, shape, and form.

The only problem was that the “taking advantage” to which Lan Wangji referred was, apparently, a love confession and a single stolen kiss.

Not even fully on the lips, no less.

Wei Wuxian had apparently responded with, “Cool,” before promptly fainting from blood loss.

That sounded very much like the ridiculous head disciple Yu Ziyuan was familiar with.

The one who’d been talking their ears off about Lan Wangji for – she didn’t want to know how long.

Lan Wangji, of course, had taken it as a devastating rejection, but was soldiering on regardless.

He’d gotten to the part of the speech where he emphasized once again that he was willing to take responsibility –

“What if responsibility meant marrying the person you have dishonored?” Yu Ziyuan wondered aloud, and this time it was Jiang Fengmian’s turn to give her the dirty look.

Lan Wangji was now the color of a tomato, but again, very earnestly, indicated that he would be more than willing, but that he would never go against Wei Wuxian’s wishes, no matter what the situation.

“Don’t worry,” Jiang Fengmian said. “It –”

“Tell me he hasn’t gone –” Wei Wuxian burst through the door shouting, only the immediately change to “Oh, Lan Zhan! You’re still here! Good!” as if he thought that was in any way smooth.

Yu Ziyuan was not going to laugh.

“…yes, he’s still here,” Jiang Fengmian said dryly. “As I was saying, Lan Wangji, stealing a kiss and confessing your affections does not count as a transgression so severe that it requires marriage –”

“It totally does,” Wei Wuxian interrupted, his eyes suddenly very bright. “Sorry, Lan Zhan. It’s the rules. And we all know how the Lan sect feels about rules –”

“Wei Wuxian,” Yu Ziyuan said, making a sincere effort to sound stern. She folded her hands together in front of her. Willpower, Ziyuan, you can do this without breaking into giggles. “One man’s punishment cannot be another’s, whereas a marriage is a mutual pact. For a marriage to be a suitable punishment, it would be necessary for the crime to be committed by both parties, while here the only person who has done anything is Lan Wangji.”

Wei Wuxian had always been a bright boy; he understood her meaning immediately.

He immediately turned to Lan Wangji, grabbed his hands, and said, “Lan Zhan, I like you,” and then he kissed him right on the lips.

At least he had better aim than the Lan boy did.

Jiang Fengmian looked at Yu Ziyuan with an amused expression, which she returned – no matter how much they fought, they had been married for the better part of two decades – and they politely waited a few minutes for the blushing and staring into each other’s eyes and sweet whispering to subside.

“Lan Wangji,” Jiang Fengmian said after a while, “while I know that you are eager to return to your family, perhaps you should consider either staying a little longer –”

“Or going and returning with an elder of your family as soon as reasonably possible,” Yu Ziyuan said dryly. The Cloud Recesses had been burned, but the Lan sect was far from depleted. “Someone suitable to arrange a marriage.”

It might be wartime, yes, but certain matters should be arranged at once.

(Jiang Fengmian might need to put off that shopping trip he’d been planning, but that would be fine. They could send Jiang Yanli on her own, while he stayed behind…)

#mdzs #wangxian #lan wangji #wei wuxian #madame yu #yu ziyuan #jiang fengmian #my fic #my fics #the reference to the yao fic is incidental #thedeathlyscar

[agendratum]

ok so

as usual after finishing an arc of mdzs my head is full, many thoughts. so let’s talk about the guanyin temple confrontation.

first thing that i kept paying attention to were actually the changes made in order to turn it into live-action. so in cql they had to make the gray-gray characters, the “there are no good or bad guys, just people and their circumstances” characters (unless you’re jgs, than yeah you’re a bad guy and everyone agrees on that actually) into slightly more black and white characters. by the end of cql we are lured into this fake sense of security, “haha, we know who the bad guy is!” (then a year passes and here you are, now a jgy apologist), by the end of mdzs, you just know that, well, decisions were made, unfortunate decisions, by many different people. 

cql had to make wwx into a bit nicer version of himself. the good protagonist couldn’t lose control and accidentally kill a bunch of people, and then kill another bunch of people fully willingly, cause his sister just died and that was the last connection he had to the idea that something still matters in this world. no, out protagonist should be... like a little bit nicer than that. so they lifted some of that responsibility for atrocities off him, but they couldn’t just evaporate it, could they? they had to put it somewhere. they put it on jgy. after all he’s the big bad in the end of the story, well, the only surviving person from all people that could be considered big bads, he’s the one that “did every terrible deed imaginable”. he could take that responsibility, they had to make his grayness into a slightly darker shade anyway.

i am actually kinda surprised by how different my reaction to jgy was in mdzs. obviously, there is a year difference between me watching cql and me reading this part of mdzs, and over that year i changed my opinion on jgy 5 thousand times and joined the camp “actually meng yao deserves all the best things in the world”, but anyway. when i was watching cql i was like, oh my god, can someone just kill him already, before he does something bad again, before more bullcrap comes out of his mouth, and also stop yelling at this kid about all the “valid” reasons to why you killed his dad. in mdzs my reaction to jgy’s confessions was like, “huh. he has a point”.

now don’t get me wrong there, some shitty things were done, but the thing is, the things he did really made sense from his point of view, from this position and life experience he really had no other way to go. i especially was convinced by his reasoning to why he couldn’t cancel his engagement with qin su. not only he would suffer from this story, because he already went through so much to make this marriage possible, but also qin su’s parents and herself would most likely suffer, their public image would be destroyed, only jgs wouldn’t lose anything. and you could feel the hatred and bitterness he felt towards his father talking about this, and everyone in the temple could agree with that, because he “just forgot he made another child”, he didn’t even notice.

another interesting detail for me was lxc saying, “it’s not that i didn’t know that you did some of these things, it’s that i thought you had a good reason for doing them”. so yeah, a reminder, lxc isn’t blind and he isn’t an idiot. he trusted a person he thought he knew better than anyone else, and he believed in this person. the problem, i think, is that “a good reason” is different for lxc and for jgy. lxc would understand a righteous reason, doing something for the greater good. working for wen ruohan? that was explainable. they all were fighting in a war, fighting for the better, brighter future, and meng yao’s contribution to that future was immeasurable. what if he killed some people there? he had a good reason in lxc’s eyes. but meng yao had other good reasons in his life, some of these reasons lxc never had to deal with in his life. survival, for example, is one of them. meng yao’s early years were very different from lxc’s. not to say that lxc’s life was easy, but it was never truly unstable. meng yao had to learn how to survive in a world where no one wanted him. he lived with one dream, promised to him by his mother, a future where he wouldn’t have to suffer anymore, where he wouldn’t have to smile at people he hated, please every one of their desires so they wouldn’t harm him. and then he entered this life promised to him and he still had to survive, but now in a luxurious man-eats-man world of lanling jin.

meng yao’s life really was this unstoppable ball of snow rolling down the mountain, and every decision he made just made the ball bigger and it would just roll faster. there is even a moment where jgy accuses lxc of being naive. lxc isn’t really naive, of course, it was said in the heat of the moment, but it is a fact that lxc was never kicked down a staircase, never had to crawl back up, and the thing is, at the bottom of the staircase, there are other good reasons to do things.

and in a way lxc understood that jgy in his position really didn’t have any other choices, he just couldn’t find peace in this mindset. he kept repeated through that part, “and yet, and yet, you shouldn’t have done that, you should have...” and he never said what exactly jgy should have done. because lxc doesn’t know. jgy doesn’t know. no one knows. what choices were better? how could he fix all that and still survive? in a way, lxc saying that reminded me of wangxian farewell in the burial mounds. when lwj asks, “you really indent to keep going like this?” and wwx, who wished, who longed for another solution, for some way out, asked him, “what else can i do? what method can i choose to resolve this, not use this technique and still protect people i want to protect?” and lwj didn’t have an answer. lxc didn’t have an answer either.

another amazing thing about guanyin temple confrontation, is that it’s very heavily wwx’s pov. most on the novel is his pov of course, but there were a loot of his thoughts in this arc. and he was rather understanding towards jgy. not in a way “i agree with every reasoning behind every decision you made” but in a way “i understand that you had your reasons, but all of them will become irrelevant really soon, they already are, because the crowd will only remember you as a son of a whore who did every terrible deed imaginable, and all the good deeds will be forgotten” 

now his thoughts on nhs, or who he suspected nhs to be, were way less nice. especially compared to live action, nhs didn’t make such an impression on me as he made through wwx’s thought process in the end of guanyin temple arc. of course, wwx is no sect leader yao, he is not the one to jump to conclusions, he just noticed that if you put some facts together, they actually start making a lot of sense, and formed a full picture. but he didn’t have any proof, so he kept it mostly to himself. yet he still thought for a moment about nhs as someone who didn’t care about collateral damage that much, who was ready to sacrifice lives of juniors, sect leaders, anyone, if it would add to jgy’s kill count and make his fall and destruction even more disastrous. not that those are not the things that happened in live action, but you know, when wwx put it all together like that in one paragraph, i really felt it. like, oof, dude it’s ROUGH. and not even jgy’s death was enough, as nhs basically admitted to stealing meng shi’s body and planning to repay jgy for what he did to nmj’s body. yikes

i mean i still support nhs in everything he does, but yikes

also side note, glad that the dead cats situation finally became clear for me. this whole year i was so confused about who left all these dead cats for juniors to find. i thought maybe xue yang did?? to lure wwx?? so apparently it was also nhs. good to know.

another detail, probably the last one my brain can generate for now, that pained me a great deal was my poor child jin ling. i already cried about some things related to him and this arc, but there was another little one in the very end here, after jgy died. jin ling realised, that there were now three people, wwx, wn and jgy, his little uncle, that were responsible for his parents’ death. people he had every right and reason to hate. all three of them. and yet he couldn’t hate any of them. he couldn’t avenge his parents, that died so long ago he couldn’t remember them, because all three people responsible for what happened, had something, some reasons, some circumstances, that made them really not the bad guys in jin ling’s life. and they all cared about him, protected him. how could he hate them? how could he not? and in this way this poor child repeats, unfortunately, his uncle’s curse. to have someone he wants to hate so much but just simply can’t. it warms my heart at least that jin ling has a much better support system than jc had when he had to live through that experience. so there is hope.

#not rereading this #ok that's a lit i'll for sure reread this later #lie* #yana reads mdzs #and writes long long long metas #meta #the untamed

[plan-d-to-i]

1-people forget that in the universe MXTX created it is stated that YZY's situation is not normal, it is a patriarcal society so wives don't keept their names nor do whatever the fuck they want and they certainly don't humiliate their husband without even being told off, she's uniquely horrible and JFM is uniquely spineless. i always think JFM did love and worried about WWX but that last interaction he threw him under the bus to appease JC so his last memory would cement that he did love him

2- bc he didn't have more time to keep trying to make him understand and i always wonder how things with JC could have been fixed, easiest would be having had the balls to get rid off YZY early but if he divorced her (or got her killed lol) would JC have been different? or would he resent him even more for not protecting his mother? idk i feel like JFM was cursed from the moment he accepted to marry her and i can't help feeling bad for him

LOVE THIS. So I agree w like 99.9999% only my feelings over JFM change every five minutes. I never hate him but I vacillate wildly between i feel like he could've done more and ig he was himself a trapped in that situation so it's unfair to hold him fully accountable.

Madam Yu is an undeniably violently abusive woman who has married a kind, non-confrontational man. Most of JFM's flaws are only seen as 'flaws' instead of qualities because they framed as ineffective against someone as rank as her. I wouldn't even say he's spineless, because he does cancel YanLi's engagement for fear that it will make her as unhappy as his own marriage made him & effectively stands against his wife's demand on top of also passing on a very beneficial alliance w Jin Clan. (In fact Jin GuangShan is way more reluctant at the thought of taking this news to Madam Jin.)

Abusive relationships have their own dynamics so it's hard watching from the outside how JFM's resignation to his circumstances and avoidance are ineffective against, someone like YZY who materializes like a storm cloud to rain her venom down on everyone, especially WWX. Because WWX is not only bearing the scars piled on his back from YZY's whippings/'discipline' but he's trapped in a perpetual balancing act between JFM, YZY, jc and to an extent Yanli. He has to make JFM proud/see the value in keeping him around & at least in the beginning of his stay with the Jiangs we know he always tries to eat/take less than he needs, but he can't be so good & talented that jc feels threatened or set Madam Yu off. At the same time Yanli rewards him with soup and affection when he takes the fall for jc his first day there. This definitely establishes a pattern wherein WWX sees his usefulness within the Jiang sect in diverting punishment for the failings of those around him, especially jc, to himself. She also repeatedly asks him to just accept jc’s shifty behavior as a representative of his affection... bc she's a huge fucking enabler, which probably doesn’t bode well for how she’s come to interpret affection.

As for YZY she's the only one who paints herself a victim, when it's clear she's the instigator of the conflicts!!!! She’s literally the bad guy, boss, fly in the ointment etc. There's a lot of gaslighting in her interactions with JFM so I'm confused as to why people think that of everyone she's the reliable narrator or some poor sad victim of an uninterested husband??? She clearly does as she pleases in Lotus Pier, yells at JFM in front of Servants, accuses him of fathering a child with his friend's wife, she whips the head disciple for imagined infractions with a spiritual weapon! and pretty much just chills w her ladies when she isn't busy spewing venom wherever she goes. WITH NO REPRECUSSIONS. If JFM had been a woman and YZY the man I'm sure all her cringe stans would be frothing at the mouth to drag her(yzy) to hell by the balls.

People love to accuse JFM of favoritism towards WWX or showing him more affection. To me it's clear that for JMF, WWX is simply an extension of his father/friend & ultimately a subordinate in the Jiang household. JFM clearly cares about jc, it's not his fault that jc doesn't get it, and it's not his fault that YZY is always poisoning their relationship. JFM for his part is still trying to guide jc towards how he's meant to occupy his future position as Clan leader, quite gently too considering jiang cheng was berating WWX for saving their allies... I’m sure if anything JFM hoped WWX’s morality and sense of right and wrong would rub off a bit on jc & why wouldn't you want someone immensely talented and loyal and devoted to the well being of your son and family around?? JFM did a nice thing getting WWX off the streets but that doesn’t mean he also didn’t think WWX could be a good friend to jc who when WWX is first brought to Lotus Pier has ZERO friends, and was likely to remain with zero friends considering his personality. Only someone like WWX who is forced by circumstances, & his kind nature & gratitude to the Jiangs would be in a position to befriend him. So I think it's laughable to say JFM favors WWS when WWX was the sacrificial lamb friend/pet JFM gifted his son. Not to mention that the only person who says JFM doesn't properly value jc is again YZY. Ofc jc takes to like a duck to water because he's cut from the same cloth as his rancid mother and it's much easier to blame WWX for all his failings and misfortunes than to take a good hard look at himself or ever take responsibility for anything. jc doesn't do self reflection. There isn't any scenario where jc would have been a good person. He's lacking basic human empathy. His view of the world has him as its center. He can only relate to things as they concern and affect him and he doesn't even possess a modicum of honor that might keep such selfish impulses at bay.

To conclude, I totally agree. JFM cursed himself the moment he let himself be coerced by YZY and her Clan into marrying a person whose character and values he knew ran so deeply counter to his and his Clan's own. Sure enough under the control of jiang cheng, the original spirit in which Jiang clan was established is gone. It's a place devoid of warmth that people are scared to visit lest they be confronted w the screams of people being flayed alive.

#mdzs #jiang cheng #jiang family #yu ziyuan #madam yu #jiang yanli #the jiangs suck #WHY DID I MAKE THIS SO LONG FFFFF #I tried to edit it down 138431 times #this was edited 2000 times #I obviously consider YZY to be the shittiest shit to ever be shit on the face of the earth #and I think this is v JFM favorable at least it's meant to be but as always I cast a lot of shade all the way around

[ouyangzizhensdad]

Perhaps you'd like a an ask that's not discourse related? If so, then I wanted to ask you if you know what jin zixuan thought of jin guangyao?

Hi anon,

I appreciate your non-discourse-related ask 😉. Your question made me realise that the novel seems to explicitly avoid giving us any real sense of what Jin Zixuan thought of Jin Guangyao, or how he reacted to the ways other people treated JGY. It seems that JZX remained unaware at the time that Meng Yao came on his birthday--and literally got kicked out. At Phoenix Mountain, JZX stops being mentioned after JGY appears and while his mother mistreats him--he’s only brought back into the narration at the very end to scream at JYL. JZX is also absent the night that WWX goes to Jinlintai to confront the Jins about Qiongqi path and in the direct aftermath. But let’s dig for crumbs and make sense of gaps, and let’s see what we can infer from them.

We know that, originally, Jin Zixuan was the epitome of the proud Jin: “The ways of the Jin Sect were proud, and Jin Zixuan inherited every single drop of this. With his high standards, he had been unsatisfied with this engagement since a long time ago.“ We could wonder if the circumstances of JGY’s birth would have been something JZX would have judged him for. We know that he took offense to WWX’s persona, although it is not spelled out exactly what offended him specifically: “Because of this engagement, Jin Zixuan had no positive impressions of the YunmengJiang Sect, and had frowned upon Wei Wuxian’s behavior since some time ago.“ However, it’s unclear whether the circumstances of WWX’s birth influenced how he perceived his behaviour. All we know for sure is that two other Jin family members--his father and Jin Zixun--never forgot about it and brought it up. We also know that in the past, JZX felt comfortable ignoring people’s good will towards him if he felt he was motivated in his view of them, as he did with JYL in the past:

Jin-furen had brought him to Lotus Pier a couple of times. Neither Wei Wuxian nor Jiang Cheng liked to play with him; only Jiang Yanli wanted to feed him the food that she made. Jin Zixuan, however, didn’t really like to pay her any attention.

At the same time, we do know that JZX had a sense of righteousness, what with him standing up against Wen Chao at Dusk-Creek Mountain. Likewise, we see with the soup incident that at least when it comes to a low-level cultivator who is a servant, a good deed done towards him without trying to gain his gratitude is enough to earn his respect, and for JZX to take action to raise the standing of that person:

Cleverly, the woman never acknowledged anything, but instead denied it ambiguously, her cheeks flushed, making it sound as though she was the one who did it, but didn’t want Jin Zixuan to know how much trouble she went through. And thus, Jin Zixuan didn’t force her to admit it any longer. However, in action, he had began to respect the cultivator. He began to pay attention to her, even raising her from a servant to a guest cultivator.

JZX even tells JYL: “Don’t think that just because you come from a powerful sect that you can steal and trample other people’s feelings. Some people, even if they come from poor backgrounds, their character are much better than the former’s. Please watch your conduct.” This underlines that, regardless of his upbringing, and perhaps even views that he might have held at some point in his life, at this point JZX seemed to want to judge others based on their character rather than their background. Of course, we can wonder if that reserve of good will would have extended to his half-brother, especially one that could try to take his place as the heir. However, considering the circumstances, from JGY’s birth to JGS’s decision to give him a name that did not align him with the same generation as JZX, we can wonder if anyone ever perceived then JGY as someone who could potentially become the next sect leader, as seen in this exchange between WWX and JC:

Jiang Cheng smirked, “Don’t carry your sword, then. It doesn’t matter. But don’t provoke Jin Zixuan from now on. He’s Jin Guangshan’s only son, after all. The future leader of the LanlingJin Sect will be him. If you beat him up, what should I, the sect leader, do? Beat him up with you? Or punish you?”

Wei Wuxian, “Isn’t Jin Guangyao here now? Jin Guangyao seems so much better than him.”

Jiang Cheng finished wiping his sword. After he scrutinized it for a while, he finally put Sandu back into its sheath, “So what, if he’s better? No matter how much better he is, no matter how clever, he could only be a servant who greets the guests. That’s all there is to his life. He can’t compare with Jin Zixuan.”

At Phoenix Mountain, while we do not see JZX say anything out of line to JGY, he is present while his mother and Jin Zixun disrespect him: and we get no reaction written for him while that takes place--he’s mostly licking his wounded pride. We also know that this disrespect by his family towards JGY was the norm, so we have to assume that JZX would have been a witness to it in other situations. In the context of that specific scene, it’s difficult to to infer something concrete from that silence: is it agreement? complicity? a certain indifference to JGY’s situation? an unwillingness of rock the boat or to seem to publicly challenge his mother? or simply him just being too self-absorbed by his romantic woes?

The next scene that would have made for an interesting case study is the night WWX comes to confront the Jins about the camp at Qiongqi Path. However, JZX is absent that night. Conveniently, or as a means to maintain a sense of ambiguity between him and WWX, we thereby do not know how JZX feels about what happened. He is also absent during the aftermath:  “At midnight, in the Golden Pavilion on JinlinTai sat over fifty sect leaders from sects of all sizes. Jin Guangshan sat in the foremost seat. Jin Zixuan was away [...].” (interesting that CQL added JZX to that scene). Which means he is not there to react to the mistreatment of JGY by others or to react to the way JGY is clearly lying for the purposes of manipulating the general opinion on WWX and save the Jin’s reputation.

We also do not get to witness the conversation that leads JZX to come to Qiongqi Path to try to stop Jin Zixun. All we get is a sentence of dialogue from JZX explaining that he thought JGY looked strange which prompted JZX tp questioned him questions (we of course know that JGY was purposefully acting that way to get JZX to go to Qionqqi Path, so it’s hard to take that as a sign of clear familiarity between them that would have allowed JZX to read hidden emotions from him). Did JZX ask out of specific concern for or suspicions of JGY? We don’t know! It is interesting to note though that, in this scene, Jin Zixun refers to JGY as “A-Yao”, which the narration contextualises by telling us that Jin Zixun started calling him in a more intimate manner despite the original contemps he had held for him. However, when JZX mentions JGY to Jin Zixun, he calls him “Jin Guangyao” (for reference, Jin Zixun calls JZX “Zixuan”).

All in all, we get very little from looking at JZX. However, there is something to be said in the absence of any specific grievances expressed by JGY towards him in terms of framing how JZX may have acted towards him when they were both at Jinlintai. Indeed, when Jin Ling asks JGY why he arranged for his father to go to Qiongqi path, meeting his death, JGY mentions the unfairness of the situation of both sons, but never brings up anything JZX did specifically to him. And we know that JGY has a great memory which allows him to hold grudges.

Suddenly, Jin Ling screamed, “Why?!” He stood up from beside Jiang Cheng. Eyes red, he rushed toward Jin Guangyao as he shouted, “Why did you have to do this?!”

Nie Huaisang hurried to pull back Jin Ling, who seemed as though he wanted to fight with Jin Guangyao. Jin Guangyao returned the question, “Why?” He turned to Jin Ling, “A-Ling, then could you tell me why? Why is it that even if I face everyone with a smile, I might not even receive the lowest form of respect, while even though your father was extremely arrogant, people flocked to him? Could you tell me why we were born from the same person but your father could relax at home with the love of his life playing with his child, while I never even dared be alone for long with my wife, shivering out of fright at first glance of my son? And I was ordered to do such a thing by my father as if it was natural—to kill an extremely dangerous figure who could flip out and conjure up a bloody massacre with his corpses anytime!

“Why is it that even though we were born on the same day, Jin Guangshan could host a grand banquet for one son, and watch with his own eyes how his subordinate kicked his other son down Jinlintai, from the first stair to the last!”

He finally revealed the hatred hidden deep within him. It wasn’t directed at neither Jin Zixuan nor Wei Wuxian, but rather his own father.

As a result, we might infer that, at the very least, JZX never directly acted towards JGY in a way that reflected how JGS or Jin Zixun (at some point) treated him. At the same time, it’s difficult to suggest that he stood up for him when other people disrespected him, and we know that JZX’s mother disrespected JGY in lieu of directing her anger toward the real culprit, her awful husband. Little seems to suggest that they grew intimate after JGY came to Jinlintai. It’s really hard to divine, as a result, what JZX might have thought of JGY.

The most interesting thing to take away from this is that it seems absolutely deliberate on MXTX’s part to show us as little as possible in terms of interactions between JZX and JGY. We can speculate as to why that is: to separate JZX from the machinations of this sect? to avoid giving us more ammunition to guess that JGY was behind JZX’s death? to ensure that WWX remains ambiguous towards JZX? or just as a means to avoid having to figure out how to work this dynamic into already complicated scenes and character relationships? etc.

#mdzs meta #mdzs #jzx #jin zixuan #jgy #jin guangyao

[canary3d-obsessed]

Restless Rewatch: The Untamed, Episode 23, second part

(Masterpost) (Other Canary Stuff)

Warning: Spoilers for All 50 Episodes!

Nature Abhors a (Power) Vacuum

Jin Guangshan, Nie Mingjue, and Lan Xichen have gathered to decide what to do about the remaining Wen people and also what to do about the Yin metal. They have not invited Jiang Cheng to this discussion, or blowhard Clan Leader Yao, despite those clans having been hit particularly hard by the Wens in the course of the war. 

The three of them have a conversation about what to do with the Wen captives, showing their different attitudes towards killing.

Jin Guangshan: Killing is awesome, particularly in project management. It's just so efficient. Nie Mingjue: Killing is necessary, and a little bit fun, too. Lan Xichen: Killing is necessary, sadly, but we can randomly spare some women or old people, as a token sign that we’re not monsters. Kind of like when you have a fancy dinner and include a tofu dish for the vegetarians. Nie Mingjue: Nobody likes tofu, Xichen.

Jin Guangshan says he's looking for the Yin Iron and that they can't let any Wens or "ambitious people" get a hold of it. By ambitious people he means Wei Wuxian, not himself and his murder kid. Lan Xichen realizes this right away but doesn't, you know, do anything to contradict him.  Jin Guangshan says he's asked "A-Yao" to look into it. Which is smart, because A-Yao is already in cahoots with Xue Yang, who actually has the piece of Yin Iron they're looking for.

Getting Jiggy With It

Then Jin Guangshan introduces Meng Yao, now renamed Jin Guangyao, in a weird twist on generation names. He has given him the name of a sibling or cousin of his own generation (starting with Guang), rather than a name of the next generation (starting with Zi). JGS says that JGY just recently learned about about being related to him, although we know perfectly well that's not true. 

And they both talk like he appreciates JGY's efficiency and helpfulness, but that's not why JGS has him at his side. He has taken him in because he is a steel-eyed murder bot, not in spite of it. 

(OP does not believe that Jin Guangyao could have been a good person if only his dad had let him hold Jin Ling that one time, as some have argued. Dude killed his own child because there was a chance he might be disabled in a way that could lead to gossip. Dude is a stone cold killer.)

(more after the cut)

In the language of CDrama costume (which is not, precisely, the language of actual historical clothing), Jin Guangyao has chosen to dress as a minister instead of as a chevalier. This is partly an artifact of his mother's ideas about a gentleman. It also suggests that he’s content with the sort of career that's available to a bastard of a noble house--not inheriting the noble title, but having enough favor to rise in power. 

It may also be a ruse to make him seem like he's not a strong cultivator and not a strong fighter, when in fact he is both, at least by the time he’s throwing death chords at Jiang Cheng, much later in the show. 

Mingjue makes all kinds of grumpy faces and snarky remarks to let everyone know that he fucking hates Jin Guangyao.  Xichen agrees to his “nice refugee camp with only a little death” plan, with no qualifications.

Now we get to see Jin Guangyao's manipulation of Lan Xichen. Lan Xichen says that Nie Mingjue wants a plan that’s more killy, because he believes in punishing evil. JGY deliberately misunderstands this, pretending that Lan Xichen said he, JGY, is evil, kind of forcing LXC to reassure him and take his side in an argument that isn’t actually happening. 

They have a little handholding while bowing, and then after Lan Xichen leaves, Jin Guangyao puts on his evil face and has all the prisoners killed behind the big closed door.  

This is done in such a violent fashion that the blood apparently flows up several stairs to the door, and over the tall raised threshold, before flowing downward toward the camera. Some evil is so extreme that even traditional Chinese doorway architecture can’t stop it.

Run To the Rock

Then we go outside to where Wei Wuxian is standing on a rocky outcropping, thinking it would be a good strategic spot to choose if he's ever in a battle where he wants to commit suicide right quick.

Lan Wangji comes to join him and admire the view, not knowing yet that this view, or one a whole lot like it, is going to be seared into his memory for most of his life.

Lan Wangji is becoming more and more committed to Wei Wuxian, more and more inexorably joined to him, but he still doesn't agree with him. So they each have this comfort in each others' presence at the same time as being massively in conflict.

Wei Wuxian asks him what he thinks of all the politicking and murdering. Who is good and who is evil? LWJ doesn't answer because WWX is leaking black smoke, so he grabs him and tells him to concentrate.  Lan Wangji is, incidentally, wearing Princess-Leia quantities of lip gloss.

Lan Wangji asks if Wei Wuxian would like to learn a new tune, "Absterge" according to Netflix. The fuck? [op looks it up in the dictionary]. "To cleanse, especially by wiping." Also known as aftercare. Netflix. Honey. This word is MIDDLE FRENCH. Will you knock it the fuck off?

So anyway, instead of answering his question about who is good and who is evil, LWJ asks if he wants to learn a song called "Cleansing." Wei Wuxian says “hey babe, are you fucking kidding me?” 

His actual words are "you doubt me too?" meaning "you think I also took the missing 4th chunk of Yin iron to make my ugly tiger amulet, rather than obviously having used that giant sword I pulled out of the turtle?"  

Lan Wangji mentally replays Wen Ruohan's questions in his head--the questions he barked at Wei Wuxian right before choking him unconscious--which Lan Wangji also feels entitled to know the answers to. Fuck you, Lan Wangji. He answers WWX with "when did you forge your amulet?" Which is his way of saying "yes, I doubt you."

Wei Wuxian kindly refrains from saying "while we were on a break, bitch" and instead tells him the exact truth--I found a yin iron sword in the turtle--but says it in his patented "make it sound like a lie" way. 

LWJ keeps grilling him, eventually coming out and saying dude, you knew the sword was Yin iron, why did you need to use it?

This is the crucial question--why WWX broke his first promise, to Lan Yi, which was to try to get rid of the Yin Iron. He won’t tell anyone the answer, which is that he needs to use it because he can't cultivate normally, because he lost his golden core. He made a lot of promises before that happened, and he probably expected to keep them. But without his core, everything changed; without his core, he’s a different person, so it’s maybe not fair to expect him to honor his previous promises. 

I’m reminded of my grandfather, who was the oldest son of an old southern US family, with lots of expectations as the firstborn. He went off to WWI as a soldier, expecting to die. He didn’t die, and so from that point on, he regarded his life as a gift. He felt could do whatever he wanted with it, and let go of expectations from before the war. He moved to Paris and took up with a glamorous divorcee 7 years older than him (my Grandma, eventually). 

The actual point of that story, other than OP having cool grandparents, is that when you think you’re going to die, and then you don’t die, your ideas about what you owe to people can change quite a bit. Wei Wuxian expected to die in the Burial Mounds; he expected to die at Nightless City; he expects it, over and over, and each time he doesn’t die, he gets further and further from being what everyone else wants him to be. And--a lot like soldiers returning from a war-- NOBODY in his life knows how to talk to him about it. 

Wei Wuxian tells Lan Wangji to back off, Lan Wangji says why aren't you letting me help you, and they are once again on the edge of the same fight they keep having. Lan Wangji does some impassioned arm holding while Wei Wuxian says he's not like Wen Ruohan. 

Romantic Duet #1

The argument is interrupted by screams and killing, so they go to check it out, and find the Jins hunting down some prisoners for sport. They arrive in time to save two people. Yay?

Jin ZIxun acts like a jerk, as always. The new element is that per Jin Guangshan, anyone concerned with Yin Iron shouldn't be alive.  He says that the Lan and Nie clans agreed, and challenges Wei Wuxian. Lan Wangji stops him from responding, grabbing his wrist.

The Jins leave and Wei Wuxian refers back to their earlier conversation, saying there will be more resentful spirits now and that "Rest" is the music to play, not "Cleansing."

He gives Lan Wangji a long look and then pointedly removes Lan Wangji’s hand from his wrist, by holding his hand, which is some next-level mixed signaling. Lan Wangji totally deserves it at this point, though. He keeps pushing and pushing WWX about his cultivation method, but he refuses to discuss the underlying morality of it, or the morality of the killing going on right in front of them. 

WWX walks off, leaving LWJ to stew in his own juices surrounded by a bunch of fresh corpses. 

Lan Wangji fails his saving throw against the guilt trip, and sits his ass down to play Rest, just like Wei Ying told him to. So switchy!  Wei Wuxian, out of sight but not out of earshot, hears him and accompanies him on Chenqing.

This scene is slightly ridiculous and a whole lot sublime. Ridiculous because it's their first time playing music together, so it's a super slow, romantic, extended scene, but they're surrounded by corpses. And not the helpful, friendly, third-wheel-on-a-date type of corpses.

It's sublime because the occasion of their first beautiful, literally magical duet is an argument. And they are joining together to play beautiful romantic music - as a service for the dead. And they are doing it while they are on literally opposite sides of a literal killing field. And Lan Wangji is sitting literally in the middle of a wide open road; the sort of road that they will both reject, metaphorically, later in the show. There is so much about their conflict and their journey that is encapsulated in this one musical moment.

Lan Wangji, by playing the song Wei Wuxian said was needed, is telling WWX that he took his words to heart, that he is listening, even though they're at odds.

WWX, by stopping and playing with him, is acknowledging this. And by settling the dead souls together, they are both reinforcing their dedication to doing what's right even as they both struggle with knowing what that is.

When Other Friendships Have Been Forgot, Ours Will Still Be Hot

Now we have the sworn brothers thing. I understand, plot wise, why this has to happen, but why would Nie Mingjue ever agree to this? Lan Xichen's puppy eyes are just that persuasive?

If they ever crack your spine, drop a line If they ever cut your throat, write a note If you’re ever in a mill and get sawed in half, I won’t laugh (HA HA HA HA)

Tedious Party Time

Now there's a cultivation party, which is about as excruciating to watch as it would be to attend.

Everyone is lining up to praise Jin Guangshan. To be fair, he did provide shelter for most of the smaller clans while the war was going on. So being grateful is appropriate, but Clan Leader Yao practically breaks his own neck kissing Jin ass. Yao says JGY’s contribution was the greatest of the war, adding, "fuck Wei Wuxian; everything is his fault."

The Jiangs show up wearing mourning belts that show off their itty bitty waists, and Jin Guangshan makes shifty eyes like a cartoon landlord when he sees them arrive.

JGS praises Jiang Cheng, and asks when his fancy clan-leader ceremony is going to happen. Jiang Cheng says he's still in mourning so it's not appropriate. JGS is like “Oh...yeah," as if he totally forgot about all the Yunmeng slaughter, and talks up his friendship with Jiang Fengmian. He acts comforting while WWX manages not to barf.

Then the Lan clan shows up and there is nice encouraging chit chat between LXC and JC...

...and just, SO MUCH mournful staring between Lan Wangji and Wei Wuxian.

Then the Nies arrive.  Jin Guangshan tells Nie Mingjue he's late, and that everyone's waiting for him. That might be true in the script but it’s clearly bullshit on the screen, where the Lans and the Jiangs are still milling around looking for the coat room.

Nie Mingjue--who, let's remember, JUST swore to be brothers with Jin Guangyao--looks at him like he's something that fell off a garbage truck.  Lan Xichen jumps in to maximize the discomfort by pointing out that Jin Guangyao should address Nie Mingjue as Big Daddy Da-ge from now on.

Then the Jins offer Nie Mingjue the giant fire throne because...he's the leader of the Sunshot campaign, I guess? Of course it's all a manipulation tactic, designed to make him say he won't sit there, so that JGS can elevate himself to head cultivator, or something? And sit in front of the throne but not on it? Cultivator succession seems kinda arbitrary. 

I swear to god, it wasn't until I was clipping this episode that I realized Wen Ruohan had two thrones and they're in different rooms from each other.

Finally everyone goes to sit down, but because there hasn't been enough fucking awkwardness, JGY stops WWX to ask him what's on his mind. WWX asks him why he's not carrying his sword, which made me laugh and laugh. Wei Wuxian must have been just waiting for a chance to ask someone else that question for a change. 

Jin Guangyao says he threw it away, because it was just a random sword, but he really means he had it made into a sneaky murder belt, that he will be using again in 13 to 16 years. They both fake-laugh and trade Mean Girls insults pretend to like each other. 

Everyone wanders around toasting each other. Lan Wangji goes to find Wei Wuxian, after first making sure that his hair looks good.  

Wei Wuxian is lying around on the steps, sprawling and drinking wine, and not, incidentally, looking for Lan Wangji. He continues to not seek him out and Lan Wangji continues to chase after him.

Wei Wuxian says "how about playing Cleansing?" but Lan Wangji says he's learning a new score. It looks like it's going to be another argument, but then Wei Wuxian smiles and kind of praises Lan Wangji for being stubborn. 

Awkward Marriage Proposal

Just then everyone inside starts cheering for Jin Guangshan to give a speech. Jin Guangshan is making a move to marry Jiang Yanli to his son, which is a big time power grab, given that the Jiang Clan is 1. vulnerable and depleted 2. has control of the Yin tiger amulet.

We get a very rare glimpse into Jiang Cheng’s inner mind, where he thinks that saying yes isn’t a great idea, but isn’t sure what to do. This marriage would make his sister happy, but could destroy the Jiang Clan's independence.

Fortunately, Wei Wuxian joins the party just in time to fuck up Jin Guanshan’s plans. Will this teach Jin Guangshan not to invite Wei Wuxian to parties? It will not.  

Soundtrack: Friendship, by Cole Porter (from “Anything Goes”)

Bonus:

#the untamed #the untamed gifs #wangxian #restless rewatch the untamed #canary3d-original #my gifs #words:2750

[the-untamed-obsession]

Can you do if ever.. JC + LXC and WWX + LWJ and last but not the least Sizhui ( I enjoyed the part 2 of the fic ) having a fight with you but they make it up to you?

GUESS WHO’S GONNA DO THIS FOR ALL THE OTHERS 🥲 THATS RIGHT! Me ^w^ anyway I hope you like it💖 I REALLY enjoyed writing this!

First Fight P1!

Sizhui:

You two rarely argue, it’s a blessing. But when you do, it can be mildly intense. 

Usually, your arguments always consist of you worrying about him and him thinking you’re underestimating him.

Your first argument was just that. You were worried he would get himself killed if he wasn’t careful. He got upset and assured you he’d be fine but you didn’t let up, practically begging him to stay with you. He got angry because he thought you didn’t believe in his abilities.

It was pretty intense. You two weren’t SCREAMING at each other, but you’d gotten pretty loud. 

You two didn’t speak to each other for about 3 days. Your friends hated it and you often went to Wei Wuxian to complain. He helped ease your worries, claiming Sizhui was more than capable and you had nothing to worry about. 

Both of you met up and apologized. You apologized for making it seem like you didn’t believe in him while he apologized for yelling at you and getting angry. 

Jiang Cheng + Lan Xichen

Never. You three usually never argue BECAUSE Lan Xichen is usually there to stop you. Without him, you two would probably argue quite a bit. But they’re always small meaningless arguments. Nothing ever serious.

If the two of you were left alone, you would only have minor arguments. Mainly about you telling him to lighten up since he often came off really strict, even though he was clan leader. They were never concerning and he often got over them rather quickly. 

Your first argument, between all 3 of you, happened because of this diplomatic mission thing. Both of them had to go to a nearby clan and try to build a healthy relationship. They wanted you to attend but you were nervous. Unfortunately, the argument got quite heated very quickly. There had been a huge misunderstanding. You were too scared to attend but both of them thought you had been ashamed of your relationship. Jiang Cheng got angry while Lan Xichen fell silent, unable to say anything. He was human after all and he couldn’t stop every argument. 

It was pretty intense. You and Jiang Cheng were screaming at each other and Lan Xichen tried to stop it but somehow got caught up and started arguing with you too. He did try to defend you as well, which in turn made the argument between him and Jiang Cheng for a minute. It wasn’t pretty at all, instead it was rather explosive.

You three didn’t speak to each other for at least a week. It was so bad that Lan Wangji had to step in, trying to help every way he could. He talked to his brother, while Wei Wuxian talked to you, and attempted to talk to Jiang Cheng.

Wei Wuxian and Lan Wangji came to you to figure out what really happened since Jiang Cheng and Lan Xichen refused to talk further on the matter. While you talked with the two, you quickly figured out everything was caused by a simple misunderstanding. You met with your boyfriends not too long after the talk and explained that you were never ashamed of them, just nervous because you’d be up against so many officials. You weren’t a noble by any means and you didn’t want to look bad on them. Of course, they assured you that wasn’t the case at all and that they loved you no matter what anyone thought. This became the main reason you three worked on communication, such a terrifying argument came from such a small misunderstanding.

Lan Wangi + Wei Wuxian

Arguments are not only rare, but pretty unheard of. Wei Wuxian doesn’t often take things to heart, so he’ll just get over something quickly, while Lan Wangji doesn’t argue. You also don’t let things get to you, so anything that COULD be a potential argument can’t ever come to be. You three are just good at communication. 

If you were to have any type of argument it would probably be related to Wei Wuxian’s ability to just start conflict. He’s pretty good at it and usually doesn’t think before he taunts someone. 

Your first ever argument was pretty stupid but it turned into a catastrophe very quickly. It started with you saying you wished you could’ve seen his swordsmanship back in the day. Wei Wuxian explained that he chose not to use Suibian after he’d given up his golden core to his sworn brother. Your experiences with Jiang Cheng were less than desirable so you’d always had a deep dislike for the man. You’d offhandedly mentioned that giving his core to Jiang Cheng was a waste and it would’ve been better if he’d kept it. Of course, this was one of those things Wei Wuxian just couldn’t let go, so it quickly turned into an argument. It got worse and worse and when Lan Wangji tried to stop you two, both of you spewed out some less than nice things at him as well. So he inadvertently ended up getting pulled into the argument too.

You and Wei Wuxian refused to speak to each other and Lan Wangji found it kind of hard to try to help you two, he was upset and hurt too. After three days, the anxiety set in for all of you. You three had ALWAYS be together and so not talking for three days was just odd. It became harder to sleep and time felt like it barely moved during the day. 

Eventually, you all caved and quickly went to find each other. The first thing you did was hug each other and start profusely apologizing. Then you all sat down and talked it out. Wei Wuxian understands why you and Lan Wangji would harbor negative feelings for Jiang Cheng, but at the same time he still loved and cared for his sworn brother. You agreed that you may have been a little bit upset, but you would try to respect him regardless. Jiang Cheng had been through a lot, so his feelings were also valid. You and Wei Wuxian also apologized to Lan Wangji for hurting him when he was only trying to help. He immediately accepted your apologies and added he understood you were both just angry and would never mean to say such things. You three definitely spent the next week trying to make it up to each other.

#mdzs x reader #mdzs headcanons #mdzs reader insert #mdzs #mdzs sizhui #mdzs sizhui x reader #lan sizhui #sizhui x reader #jiang cheng x reader #mdzs jiang cheng #jiang cheng #lan xichen #lan xichen x reader #mdzs lan xichen x reader #mdzs lan xichen #wei wuxian #wei ying #wei wuxian x reader #mdzs wei wuxian x reader #lan zhan #lan wangji #lan wangji x reader #mdzs lan wangji #mdzs lan wangji x reader

[uzunofu]

A lot of fics about the golden core transfer angst rubbed me the wrong way, but I could never figure out why. I think I just did.

The loss of a golden core was never Wei Wuxian's tragedy.

It was Jiang Cheng's.

When JC loses his golden core, he is very obviously traumatized — this fandom's favorite word for both him and WWX. Part of it is the whole shebang with the Lotus Pier massacre and his parents' death, but it's also the golden core itself. He loses his will to live. He defined himself by his status as a cultivator, and now that he isn't, he doesn't know how to go on. He doesn't want to redefine himself.

When WWX loses his golden core, he adapts. Yes, he wasn't given time to be hurt or distraught because he had to fight for his life immediately after. Still, he adapts, he finds a way to remain a cultivator, he founds a way to remain a cultivator. And it's not inferior by any means: he is just as strong, just as durable, and even though in terms of weapons carrying a sword is easier than lugging around a few corpses, his new weapons are the ultimate AOE attack. The limits of his cultivation path are unknown yet, which means it's possible it could be used to achieve immortality or at least prolong one's life, so his lifespan being shortened is not a guarantee.

WWX's low point isn't caused by his lack of a golden core. No one knew about it; no one truly cared about him not carrying a sword because it was just another excuse to knock him down. Ultimately, it was always about him being too powerful to exist, not being under control by the likes of JGS, and daring to hold such power when he's just the son of a servant. WWX's low point is about mob mentality and how you can't win against a mob without resorting to their own methods. He chooses moral high ground and dies for it, but he dies as himself, not twisted into a scheming resentful creature.

JC's low point, however, is related to his golden core and to his tendency to blame WWX for everything. After Lotus Pier — it was WWX's fault that the Wens came, and it was because he tried to help WWX that he lost his core. At the First Siege — it was WWX's fault for abandoning him and standing up for the Wens, for killing JZX, for causing JYL's death. In the Guanyin temple — it was WWX's fault for showing him up again, for making all JC's achievements owed to WWX's grace.

That is why the golden core reveal comes so late into the book. Sure, it explains WWX's "arrogance" post-Sunshot, but the scene isn't meant to be angst fodder for poor WWX who lost so much and suffered in silence; it's meant to be evidence that WWX gave so much of himself without holding it over JC's head or ever intending for him to know, found a way to move forward, and doesn't think about it anymore. It's meant to contrast them, one looking to the future, the other one stuck in the past.

(Is the angst in those fics good? Yes. Is there a reason that angst isn't in the book? Also yes.)

#mdzs #mdzs meta #wei wuxian #jiang cheng #golden core transfer #golden core reveal #don't get me wrong i love me a good angsty fic #but when people go 'she skipped all the good bits'... #guys. guys. there's a reason why those bits were skipped #and it's not just an unexpected plot twist for shock value that could've been revealed earlier #it's thematically relevant #to both their character arcs #if i invented the wheel here then welp sorry #i'm sure someone out there has already written about this

[crossdressingdeath]

I feel like there are times I'm kind of baffled when JC or Madam Yu are on screen in the dongua or really any form of adaptations since as characters I just can't empathize nor sympathize with because I just don't relate to them as a person. I'm sure for others people pitied or felt bad and some even recognize some similar traits they see in JC.

Their anger felt comical borderline ridiculous and how their grudge persists on a person long after their dead seems funny to me.

I remembered when JC mentioned how his father carried WWX but never him and it was just this one significant memory that really lingered on his mind or how he tries to gaslight WWX and always bring in debt just like his mother.

It seems funny because I don't know if JC is the result of either a nature vs nurture thing but these characters have this really persistent image or memory and have this grudge go on for years like damn I can't do it. I would gets too exhausted because the mental gymnastics I'd have to go through after an encounter with someone to vilify would legit make me age quicker.

I rememberer couple days ago I fought with my sister for touching my stuff and got really upset but the next day the incident was over.

The funny thing is I'm pretty sure JC doesn't dwell on the fact that JFM picked WWX up that one time; he was just upset when it happened. Which... would have been a lot more understandable if JFM didn't ever pick JC up, but in actuality JFM did pick JC up; only a handful of times, but still more than he picks up WWX. JC just didn't want to share.

I think what you're missing is that for the most part we're not supposed to sympathize or empathize with characters like YZY and JC, or at least not with their response to what they're feeling. They're bad people! Like... I can empathize with JC's certainty that his father hates him, but the fact that he blames the one person involved who is entirely blameless I... can't empathize with. The thing is that not every character is supposed to be sympathized with. We're not supposed to think JC has a point when he gets WWX killed, or that YZY has a point when she abuses WWX because she hated his dead mother. They're antagonists, and not every antagonist is a sympathetic one. And even sympathetic antagonists aren't usually sympathetic all the time. So yeah, the point of JC and YZY's presence isn't to sympathize with them; in fact quite the opposite. They're horrible, cruel, selfish people who make WWX's life miserable for no reason, we're not supposed to think they might have a point or (with some exceptions like after the fall of Lotus Pier) sympathize with them!

#mdzs #lotus mom #grapehate #asks #anon

[twolonesomestars]

BJYX III

Japan Trip

This is a compilation post explaining the Japan trip and related theories (along with my own thoughts). Most of the theories in here are well-known. If you know the general gist of the Japan trip, you probably won’t see anything new.

Warning: This is all fake. Don’t take what I say to heart. These are just my random thoughts.

Extremely long post. Please beware.

-

All my explanations and thoughts will be bracketed and italicized: [like this]. If you would like to just read about the theories, ignore the bracketed and italicized bits.

I suggest reading all of the theories first and creating your own opinion on the trip before reading my commentary, especially if you’re a new fan. (AKA ignore the bracketed & italicized parts for now).

[One last thing before I start (and a test for those who want to read the theories first… ignore this for now): I believe this Japan trip changed their relationship… In that, I believe they began their romantic relationship after this trip. A quick timeline mention: truthfully, their relationship before and during CQL filming isn’t too important for this theory. However, I do believe that there was some sort of confession from WYB at the end of filming, which may have played a role in XZ’s decision to take the trip to Japan. I’ll provide my reasoning later in the post. All my explanations and thoughts are going to be based on these particular assumptions; although, I will try to include rebuttals & explanations based on countering arguments.]

-

OUTLINE

DATES

PRE-JAPAN TRIP

Character Bleed Changed Phone Number

MID-JAPAN TRIP

XZ’s 180911 Post + Story

POST-JAPAN TRIP

XZ’s 180913 Post & Story XZ’s 181119 Post WYB’s 181119 Post Time Gap WYB’s 190322 Post

FINAL THOUGHTS

-

Let’s get into it!

-

DATES:

180416 - 180823 Filming for CQL

180908 - 180912 XZ’s Japan trip

180913 - XZ posted his 521st Weibo post & 18th Weibo story

181005 - XZ’s Birthday

181119 @ 17:42 - XZ’s Japan trip post

181119 @ 18:47 - WYB’s response post

190322 - WYB’s Rome trip post

-

PRE-JAPAN TRIP:

Character Bleed

XZ’s reasoning behind his Japan trip in this interview @ 9:31

XZ explicitly says, “I told myself I had to walk out of it.” His reasoning being, “[I had to] leave him there. [I had to] return him to the one he loves.”

You can unpack a lot from that. I got two main things from it:

(“I had to walk out of it”): you can assume that XZ took everything from WWX and made it his own, including, and specifically, WWX’s love for LWJ. Essentially, by the end of filming, XZ himself was in love with LWJ.

(“return him to the one he loves”): XZ separates himself very clearly from WWX. He points out his reasoning to walk it off is him wanting to return WWX to the one he loves… the implication is that he figured out he doesn’t love the one WWX loves.

[The reason I think there was some sort of confession at the end of filming that pushed XZ to take this trip and figure himself out is because he already knew he loved LWJ. I think he may have attributed any romantic feelings he felt towards WYB to the fact that he plays the character he loves. So, if WYB confessed to wanting to pursue a romantic relationship with him, it makes sense that XZ would hesitate. I doubt he’d want to lead WYB on just to later realize all of his feelings were for LWJ and not him. I’m sure XZ would’ve walked off WWX eventually, but I think he did it as quickly as he could to give a certain person (and himself) answers.

Obviously, I don’t know how XZ goes about with his acting, so these are all just random assumptions.]

-

Changed Phone Number

I’ve gotten a few asks wanting me to clarify and give my opinion on the rumor about XZ changing his number and WYB asking around for it. I’ve heard two versions of this:

The first version has two variations:

XZ changed his number sometime after his DDU appearance in 2017 and before CQL began shooting, and WYB was asking the CQL crew for it.

XZ changed his number during CQL filming sometime, and WYB was asking the CQL crew for it.

The second version is that XZ changed his number before he left to Japan and WYB was asking around for it for months (who he was asking was undefined).

A related rumor I want to note: a fan who was at the airport when XZ was waiting for his flight to Japan supposedly saw him not answering his phone.

Let me clarify the relationship between WeChat & phone numbers:

In WeChat, every registered user gets a WeChat ID. There are three main ways people can add someone: (1) have the person’s WeChat ID (2) have the person’s phone number (3) have access to the person’s QR code. For (1) and (2), the other person must enable the option to be found via WeChat ID or phone number in order for you to find them. You can also choose to not show your phone number at all, so even if someone adds you via (1) or (3), they may still not have access to your number depending on your settings. To sum it up, you do NOT need to know another person’s phone number to message them on WeChat. Practically everyone in China uses WeChat as their main social messaging application… you can send messages (text & voice) and you can call (voice-only & video). People don’t use their actual given numbers to message or call too much (ex. iPhone messaging/ Facetime); phone numbers are typically used when making accounts on various social media apps, online payment, etc.

There’s a pretty well-backed up theory that WYB asked one of his DDU co-hosts (specifically DZW) if he could get XZ’s WeChat ID for him during/ after filming the episode with XNINE. If this theory is true, we can only be sure that he got XZ’s WeChat ID, not that he got his phone number.

If you do want to change your number or WeChat ID (prior to 2020, you could only change your WeChat ID once per account), you can simply go into the WeChat settings and update; this process won’t change your WeChat account and it won’t affect any of your contacts or chat history. If you want to stop receiving messages & calls from someone, you can either block or delete them from your contacts on the app.

I’m pointing all of this out because I’m pretty sure most of XZ’s & WYB’s communication takes place in WeChat. WYB has said in several interviews that he now prefers his phone and wifi access; he’s also said that he can’t go without WeChat now.

[I honestly don’t think this rumor is real. But, out of the two versions, I’d say the first version (either variation) makes more sense than the second version.

I have three reasons for thinking the second version is the most unlikely:

It’d be easier to block the other person for however long you need (and then unblock them or delete them depending on your choice later) rather than going through the hassle of changing your number. Remember when WYB’s phone number got leaked and he had to change it (August 2019)? He asked people to not use his number to log into accounts; he even mentioned that he would need to change all of them, which would be a large hassle. Sure, there could be circumstances where you’d want to change your phone number… but I don’t think this situation is that extreme, especially since it was supposedly at the airport before his trip and before he decided.

I don’t think XZ’s the type of person to leave someone hanging, no matter how much internal turmoil he may be dealing with, and especially not when that someone is close to him. I believe he’d at least inform others that he’ll be out of range and to not message or call him. Not to mention, if he told WYB to not contact him for the next couple of days, I’d like to believe WYB would respect that wish, whether he knew the reason or not. Since I do think that WYB confessed prior to the Japan trip, I believe he knew. But, even if he didn’t, he has integrity and self-respect. He’s going to respect others’ wishes, and even more so if he respects the other person… and he does respect XZ.

The theory specifically points out “months” … WYB literally celebrated XZ’s birthday with him about three weeks after this trip.

As for the first version:

Variation #1 implies that this happened at the start of filming/ bootcamp; it also implies that WYB got XZ’s number after he contacted him on WeChat. One assumption I have is: I don’t think celebrities/ people in the industry exchange phone numbers much, just their WeChat IDs. This is why I don’t think XZ & WYB exchanged numbers when they first met, only their WeChat IDs. As for WYB asking the crew for XZ’s number… if he already had XZ’s previous number, I kinda doubt he’d go around asking others when he could just ask XZ himself.

Variation #2 probably makes the most sense out of all three, and even then it’s a bit of a stretch. This variation implies that it’s a few months into filming, at which point XZ & WYB were extremely close. I doubt he’d be too nervous to ask XZ directly for his new number. The only rebuttal I could think of for this is that perhaps WYB asking around instead of asking XZ himself was him being coquettish.

In the end, this rumor doesn’t make too much sense to me. But take it as you will.]

-

MID-JAPAN TRIP:

XZ’s 180911 Post + Story

We know that he kept deleting his Weibo posts before the number could reach *520. (*520 & 521 are both kadian for “I love you” even though 520 is more widely used.)

XZ posted his 520th post on 180911 (right in the middle of his trip). It was an ad for AHC. AHC is the first brand both WYB & XZ shared and spoke for; I believe WYB stopped his spokesperson duties on 180829 & XZ began his on 180907.

XZ posted his 17th story, also on 180911, of him on a ferry during the trip.

[I burst out laughing when I realized he posted an ad for his 520th post. He kept deleting posts to make sure he stayed away from #520; he could’ve easily deleted another post to make the ad his 519th. A lot of solo fans were looking forward to his 520th post being dedicated to them (exhibit 1), and then he did that. Sly as per usual. And the 17th story... leading up to the 18th. I think XZ pretty much knew/ made his choice/ accepted his feelings by this point, which is why he posted like this.]

-

POST-JAPAN TRIP:

XZ’s 180913 Post & Story

XZ posted this video on Weibo on 180913. It was his *521th post & *18th story. (*52118 = “wo ai ni yi bo” A BXG posted about counting XZ’s posts to find these numbers.)

His caption was:

以为在拍照的找🤣... (夏天的风结束了，假期也结束了🌿🌿🎋)

which roughly translates to:

“I thought I was posing for a photo🤣... (The summer wind is over, the holiday is also over 🌿🌿🎋)”

There are several theories about the caption.

the emojis:

The bamboo emoji refers to WYB. In this behind the scenes footage, XZ compares WYB’s face to a bamboo stick.

the words:

XZ is referring to the season ending and the weather in the video where the wind is blowing across his face.

When XZ states that both the summer wind and his holiday are over, he is implying that he has left the character he became that summer (WWX) behind and moving forward.

XZ is referring to the song Summer Wind (夏天的风) by Liu Rui Qi (刘瑞琦). I’m not going to go too deep into this; the lyrics in question are:

夏天的风 我永远记得 清清楚楚地说你爱我 我看见你酷酷的笑容 也有腼腆的时候

roughly translates to

The summer wind, I will always remember [you] saying clearly that you love me. I saw your cool smile [yet] there are times when you are shy.

Interpretations are: (line 1) “summer wind” & “always remember” - XZ is reminiscing on the things that have happened that summer when CQL was filmed. (line 2) “saying clearly… you love me” - a confession from a certain someone… we know of one on camera: “zhan-ge didi ai ni.” (lines 3-4) “cool smile” & “shy” - these adjectives fit a person we know.

[I didn't find out about half of these caption theories until way later, and once I had already formed my opinion on this trip. A lot of it seems like a stretch, but all the theories make some sort of sense. Meh, there’s a lot you can do with a caption, so just take it all in.

Personally, I didn’t pay attention to the caption too much. I knew about the lyrics, but I purposely avoided them precisely because they were lyrics; you can do a lot with them. I finally explored it for this post, and I actually like it a lot; it’s very sweet. I’m still leaning towards the reference being unlikely; however, XZ is very sneaky, so I wouldn’t put it past him. I also knew about the bamboo reference, but I never gave it much thought. I didn’t think that one scene of them joking around was enough to say that he used the emoji to refer to WYB. Though, if it was actually a reference, there’s definitely more to it that we don’t know about. Ultimately, for this one, my decision was based on the basics: the kadian (and later reinforced by the whole AHC ad post).]

-

XZ’s 181119 Post @ 17:42

A major theory for this post comes from his caption:

“一些存货... 现代人即将拥有姓名 [’silent giggling’ emoji]... ”

roughly translates to

“some stock [photos]... modern man will soon be named...”

The main focus here is the “modern man.”

Once the behind the scenes footage and interviews began releasing, BXG started noticing how WYB got whenever XZ mentioned LWJ. His facial expressions always changed… immediate frowns. BXG speculated that WYB was trying to show himself as separate from his character, but XZ didn’t take notice. The character LWJ is figuratively and literally from the past; the actor on the other hand is from modern society. Thus, XZ mentioning modern man was taken to be a reference to XZ’s love for the actor alone, not the character.

[To those who have sent asks about the “modern man” quote, I hope this clears it up. My interpretation of it is the same. At the end of the day, XZ most definitely separated the two.]

Another theory for this one is that the horizontal middle row pictures spell out “王一博” going from left to right.

王 (“wáng”)

The lines on the building look like the character

He could’ve meant “look towards,” which is what he’s doing in the picture. It is a different character (“望”), and has a slightly different pronunciation (“wàng”)

He could’ve meant “going in one direction,” referring to the arrow on the sign, which is a different character (“往”), and has a slightly different pronunciation (“wǎng”)

一 (yī)

The image looks like the character

博 (bó)

Another meaning for “博” is “extensive” or “rich” which you can take the design on the outside of the to be

The building is a museum, whose word (“博物馆”) begins with “博”

[For the spelling, my interpretations were all of the #1s. (I’ll explain a little bit more when we get to WYB’s 190322 post.)]

One last theory about this post: BXG then witnessed XZ editing his post in real time to change the position of the first two pictures. There’s a theory that he saw this post (below) from the previous day and changed the positions to match.

OP talking about the switch here and below.

[I was so enamored by this theory until I actually went looking for it. The post of WYB’s pictures is from a fan, and while I don’t doubt that they saw more of fans’ posts back then, this one wasn’t tagged or anything. It could easily have been XZ’s artist side popping up. But, maybe XZ was lurking on his private account. Even though it’s one of the more iffy ones, it’s such a cute theory that I actually don’t mind believing it.]

This is a side note and not part of the actual theory: On my search for all things related to this trip, I noticed one of WYB’s posts where he did a similar thing.

This was in June 2018, so before XZ’s post. Mayhaps inspiration.

-

WYB’s 181119 Post @ 18:47

WYB posted exactly *1:05 hours after XZ posted. (*105 = 10/5, XZ’s birthday)

His caption was “冒个泡”

He was using internet slang; it can be vaguely translated to “I am here.” In context, he’s using the slang to refer to him not posting for a long time; he’s ‘showing his presence.’

Notable Things:

He posted the day prior on 181118; it wasn’t an ad, but it wasn’t exactly personal either.

He posted a picture of himself with his DDU brothers during a trip on 181104.

He had not posted a selfie since 181004. (Back then, he updated personal posts once or twice a week, whether it was a selfie or something about his life, such as what show he was watching. The month & a half time gap between personal posts would’ve been unusual.)

The caption & selfie work as a response to XZ’s “modern man will soon be named.”

Another thing fans were intrigued about was the time stamp on the photo, 180525.

WYB never really posts throwbacks, especially with selfies, yet he did one here to a date in the middle of CQL filming. He also usually never adds the date to his photos.

Isn’t it interesting that he captions the post with slang that tells people he’s back from a break, but uses an old photo instead of a new one? If someone’s announcing that they’re coming back from a break (especially a celebrity), wouldn’t it make more sense to post a recent photo rather than an old one (in this case, one from 6 months ago)? And, why even bother including the date in the first place?

[I can’t believe I barely noticed that WYB posted 1:05 hours after XZ. What in the world WYB? I’m losing my mind. It’s down to the damn minute, and their minutes weren’t a “0” or “5” multiple either. I usually try to pass off a lot of things regarding YiZhan (especially kadian) as coincidences, but what even is this? If it wasn’t intentional… What kind of connection do these two share?

Yes, I do think this was WYB’s response. The throwback picture was probably the most telling for me; him including the date he took the photo was like a flashing sign saying: ‘hey look at this date. it’s important.’ And when you add the caption into the mix, it’s taken to another level. I feel the combination of hints in and related to the post is too much and too telling to be coincidental.]

-

Time Gap

There’s an interesting time gap between the two XZ’s posts (180913 & 181119). There are a few theories about what could’ve happened in those two months. Some of the ones I’ve seen and heard are:

XZ & WYB could’ve been taking that time to tell their parents and settle things with their agencies

XZ & WYB could’ve begun dating exclusively after XZ’s return

Both of these theories imply that everything got settled or made official around 181119.

[I never really thought about the time gap between the posts… mostly because I kept forgetting there even was one. They’re both ridiculously romantic so I don’t doubt that 181119 is something of importance to them. I think it’s especially proving that both of them did a throwback to the same seemingly important time period.]

-

WYB’s 190322 Post

This post is pretty similar to XZ’s 181119 throwback post to the Japan trip. The theory for this one is that WYB spelled out “肖战” using the vertical middle row, going from top to bottom.

肖 - The tree looks like the top part of the “肖” character; the branches look like the bottom part of it.

战 - Since WYB placed an image of the entire Roman colosseum (where gladiator battles took place) in the last spot, he may have been alluding to how “战” means “battle” or “fight” (similar to how XZ may have been alluding to the meaning of “博” instead of getting a picture of the character).

WYB filmed the DDU episode on 3/22; I don’t believe there’s another significance to the date.

[WYB spelling out the “肖” using the first two pictures backs up my thinking that XZ spelled out the “王” and “一” characters in his first two pictures. This also leads me to think that both of them alluded to each other’s last character rather than spelling it out in their third pictures.]

-

FINAL THOUGHTS:

[The reason I like this overall theory a lot is because I think the happenings really fit with the things they’ve told us in interviews and suit their personalities. It makes sense to me that XZ would want to take some time to think about it; it makes sense to me that WYB was probably the one who took the first step.

As for the theories about the details… some of them are really out there, but all of them are fun to consider. As usual, take everything with a grain of salt.]

Some of these posts & events have several theories (i.e. XZ’s summer wind caption); they aren’t mutually exclusive… more than one can be true at the same time.

I tried to be as neutral as I could when explaining these theories. I tried to include counters and other possibilities, but I’m sure some bias came out. Just take it all in and take it for what it is.

My intention with this post was to put everything into perspective and give a good timeline. (As well as get everything in one place.) If you’re interested in my thoughts, feel free to go back and read the italicized & bracketed parts (if you hadn’t already).

-

The following is something I want to say about these theories and the BXG community in general:

Every theory has inconsistencies and exaggerations… that’s what makes it a theory. As long as we discuss things knowing this fact, that’s all that matters. We’re here to have fun, not to prove what’s right or wrong.

I love seeing the various theories everyone in this community puts out, no matter how different or similar they are to the ones I like/ believe in. It’s fun to look into these things with different perspectives. Don’t feel burdened if you believe in a less popular theory. Besides, we will never know anything for sure.

Be kind. And, have a good time.

-

Once again, this is all fake. I do not personally know XZ & WYB, and I will never know anything about them; this includes the intricacies of whatever relationship they share. So, CPN.

#don't ask me why it took so long lol #japan trip #yizhan #bjyx