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roguekhajiit · 21 days

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TW: Transphobia

I had my first ever encounter with a transphobic member of the LGBTQ community this week.

At work on Monday, I overheard some co-workers discussing Transgender Day of Visibility and how President Biden issued a statement acknowledging Trans Day. Since it just so happened to occur on the same day as Easter this year, my very close-minded co-workers took that and Biden's statement as evidence that Trans people are trying to take over Easter!

Now, I consider myself to be Non-binary (specifically Demi-girl/Agender), but I tend to fly under the radar, which is very helpful since I live in a very, very red state. It doesn't hurt that my normal sense of personal style is very casual and all black. So, I can wear traditionally "men's" pants, and no one pays much attention to me, which is the way I prefer it. I hate anything that draws attention to myself.

So, I bit my tongue and hyperfocused on my work. Then, when I went home, the non-binary gremlin in me just couldn't be contained anymore; I opened Reddit and made a post about how no one is going around trying to steal stolen holidays.

Now, I was fully anticipating pissed off Christians to rain their uninhibited fake outrage down onto the comment section (which happened) but I wasn't anticipating a self-identified 60 yr old gay man to come into my comments saying things like, "Why would you put a Trans holiday anywhere near a religious holiday knowing every seven years it's gonna land on said holiday" and "As a gay man I believe that the one part of our community is stifling the rest of us."

Tell me you're transphobic without telling me you're transphobic.

Now, since I can't just ignore the sheer inaccuracy of his math; according to Google from 2001 to 2100, Easter will only land on March 31st 5 times. Five times in an entire century. The last time Easter was on March 31st, it was 2013. So, 11 years ago, or over a decade ago. No one gave a shit in 2013 that Easter and Trans Day were on the same day. But let the president acknowledge it in a statement and everyone loses their fucking minds.

So, why would you avoid celebrating something important in your life on the off chance that it might coincide with someone's religious holiday? Of course, you wouldn't. If your birthday is on Christmas, do you no longer have a birthday?

"Next, why wouldn't you place it in the month of pride then each day of pride month could have a different day celebrating each letter of the lbgtq+ community."

Yes, that is what Pride Month is for, celebrating the diversity of the LGBTQ+ community. But are you gay only in June?

But sadly, even some in our diverse community isolate and vilify trans individuals just like what this old gay dinosaur is doing. For 15 years, a vast majority didn't know or even give a shit that Trans Day existed. That is until a president acknowledged it.

"May I point out there's no gay holidays that coincide with Yom kipper or Ramadan."

True, Yom Kippur and Ramadan don't coincide with any "gay holidays," but Shavout is directly in the middle of Pride Month. Any outrage there?

"So just piss off the Christian's so they have one more thing to hate us for. I find many in our community asking for acceptance while giving none, just my opinion and nothing more."

How very accepting of you to say, my lord.

"Maybe it's time we all in the gay community and cis people give the whole year to the Trans community."

But they aren't asking for the year, or even a month. They just want one day that is their own. And even members of our own LGBTQ+ community can't even give them that.

"I'm gay so I can't be transphobic."

Your statements say otherwise. Just because you're gay doesn't mean you are absolved of your transphobia.

Perhaps it's time we stop placating these dusty ass old gay dinosaurs and call them out on their hateful thinking. Their "I got mine" attitude only harms our communities. Just because you won the fight for same sex marriage doesn't mean you're safe. The fight for equality is never-ending.

More and more of us are having our rights stripped away right before our very eyes. Roe v. Wade has already been overturned, and they aren't going to stop there. They never planned to stop there. They are very methodically chipping away at our rights. Right now, they are focusing their efforts on the trans community, slowly outlawing their very existence. And while they have you distracted by that, they are quietly overturning same sex marriage laws. Your rights aren't safe and never will be safe as long as we have members in our communities who subscribe to this kind of thinking.

#trans community #trans day of visibility #transgender #trans rights #lgbtq community #lgbtq #lgbtq+#lgbt #lgbtqia #lgbtqia+#lgbtqplus #transphobes #reddit #nonbinary #demigirl #demisexual #agender

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transmascpetewentz · 6 months

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A Rant About Masculinity, Cisnormativity, And Cis Gay Men

I was going to write a longer post about my ex-mutual, but I feel no need to put him specifically on the spot here because the issue is so much larger than just him, and because I really hold no ill will against him that I don't hold against all the TEHMs that reblog from him in complete support of what he says despite him claiming to be a trans ally. I think that there are two main things that contribute to the existence of a blogger like him, those being the intersection of how society feminizes both gay & trans men, and how a lot of cis gay men will perform trans allyship to make themselves feel better while still participating in a deeply transphobic culture and taking no action that targets cisnormativity in the gay community.

This ex-mutual is a person whose opinions, actions, and activism (or lack thereof) exist in a weird position. He often goes between fetishizing trans men to erasing us, to policing how we talk about our history. When I asked him whether he was transphobic, he replied talking about how he wanted to have sex with trans men, but I saw that he also made a post around the same time where he tried to "call out" a gay trans man for "fetishizing trans men" by... replying to several photos of trans men with "they're just some guys."

As you can clearly tell by now, he seems to be far more interested in feeling right and in trying to find problematic subtext in the words and actions of gay trans men than he is actually protecting us and being an ally. This is quite common amongst cis gay men who want to be progressive while not taking a stance against the TEHMism and toxic masculinity that poisons the community. And the reason behind this pattern of behavior is really simple: these men, due to their relative privileges not just for being cis but often for things like being white, thin, and perisex, oftentimes have other friends with those privileges, and if you have a large group of privileged people with relatively few people who do not have those privileges, you will likely develop bigotry. So the simple reason that these types of cis gay men do not want to confront their transphobia is because they are surrounded by others who have fallen further down the transphobia pipeline who may abandon them if they call it out.

While things like cisnormativity and toxic masculinity among cis gay men definitely do them a lot more harm than good, many will still uphold these ideas due to the way that cisnormativity benefits them relative to trans men and their lack of exposure to intersectional queer liberation movements. In my opinion, this phenomenon is what is behind cis gay men's performative allyship. They'll go on and on about how valuable gay trans men are to gay culture, but will be actively hostile to gay culture that first developed among gay trans men. They'll go on long rants about how the "toothpaste flag" is the worst thing to happen to the gay community. They'll distance themselves from gay trans men in any way they can when we're real people and not just words on a screen.

And due to many cis gay men's performative allyship clashing with their personal interest in upholding cisnormativity, they'll try to compensate for that by policing gay trans men. They'll accuse us of being the real transphobes if we step out of line or if we tell them that they're being transphobic for using obvious dogwhistles. They'll call a vague group of gay trans men "women" and call us the real transphobes for "hearing someone say 'women' and thinking 'trans men.'"

This brings me to my next point. Due to a lot of cis gay men (especially mascs/gender conforming, though fem/gnc cis gay men aren't entirely exempt) feeling hostile to the idea of having their masculinity challenged, they may contribute to feminizing other gay men who they perceive not to be as masculine as them for any number of reasons. One of these reasons being transness. Not to vaguepost about my ex-mutual even more, but he literally made a post saying "isn't it annoying when women will comment under a picture of any man saying that he's trans and gay?" This guy literally calls himself a trans ally.

I don't think that headcanoning someone as gay and trans is particularly female behavior, [redacted]. but again, this isn't a callout post of my ex-mutual. This is merely an example of something I've seen quite a lot of. This is exactly the reason behind my statement "the transandrophobe/femphobe/misogynist venn diagram of cis gay men is a circle." Because it truly is a circle. Toxic masculinity and misogyny lead to wanting to separate oneself from women, which causes one to see trans men as potential women necessary to separate oneself from. And, many times, this will lead to a hatred of feminine men, as the misogynistic gay man will see feminine men as being like women.

I don't know if I'm onto something about there being something to do with severe, collective trauma in the gay community causing a sort of "crisis of masculinity" within the community. But as I keep thinking about this, I think I am realizing that there is a lot more to this issue than at first meets the eye. Something to think about.

#wentz.txt #long post #transandrophobia #queer discourse #tehms die faster challenge #this is one of my longest posts ever #intersectionality

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olderthannetfic · 8 months

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/726901861182996480/ a lot of the Richard Siken response is honestly so homophobic, trying to come up with some sinister reason for why a gay man would be interested in writing or reading sexy fanfic about attractive men in a TV show. There was a viral post going around here by some person with a Stranger Things username (not insinuating that fandom is especially weird or anything, just that I remember this person had one of the characters from that show as their username) that suggested he was a creep or groomer or something because he had not responded well to a teenager basically wanting him to do her homework for her, but “he happily writes fanfic of shows for her age demographic” (or something like that) which is both a truly bizarre description of Supernatural, a show that’s always been aimed at adults even if it also has a fair number of teenage fans, but also is really clearly trying to invoke some sort of Groomer Panic in a time when that’s rising as a form of violent homophobia toward LGBTQ+ people especially those who are AMAB. And it’s just such a bizarre statement: even if we were talking about a drama that was aimed at teenagers, in what ways is it “groomer” for an adult to watch this show (lol, on the website that is full of adults freaking out over kids’ shows) or for that adult to find the adult characters played by adult actors attractive enough to write sexy fanfic about them? It’s just really obviously reaching for an excuse to call a gay man a groomer.

In general, I feel like this website has a serious problem (it’s been the case at the very least since the panic over CMBYN, and before anyone gets pissy, I’m not talking about anyone taking issue with the content of the film itself, but the people making weird insinuations about gay/bi men for liking it or “the gay community” for embracing it or over the bi male novel author’s own sexuality or reasons for writing it, etc.) where a lot of people who are not gay/bi men think it’s okay for them to make weird homophobic assertions about it, and generally not bother to question their homophobic beliefs about gay and bi men, because they themselves are some other kind of LGBTQ+. I’m a cis lesbian and a lot of this particular seems to come from cis lesbians and bi women, often trying to couch it in a general sort of skepticism that women as a marginalized group might have toward men as a privileged group, but then it only ever seems to be directed at men who are also marginalized such as gay/bi men (and also MOC) and specifically for things that are a result of those marginalized identities and that don’t affect women — NOT a situation where a man is using his marginalized identity as an excuse for misogyny or anything like that. Anyway, people need to knock that shit off. Not every person in the LGBTQ+ community has the same experience, and being, say, a cis woman who is queer doesn’t necessarily make you any better of an authority on gay or bi men’s lives than cishet people if you aren’t making an effort to talk to them or read stuff by them or learn about their lives, and certainly doesn’t mean you can’t be homophobic toward them — just like how in turn, queer men can be bigoted toward lesbians and/or bi women. I don’t understand how people can be aware of other kinds of intra-LGBTQ+ bigotry — cis gay or bi people being transphobic, gay people being biphobic, etc. — and not be aware that this is also a thing that can happen from other LGBTQ+ people toward gay men.

And being ANY kind of queer absolutely does not give you a get out of jail free card for buying into and disseminating the moral panics about groomers, “kink at pride,” “drag is problematic and always sexual” etc. which are used by the right wing to hurt all of us. This was bad enough in like 2018 as part of the perennial brain worms people on this website have about Pride (that are because way too many of them don’t leave their houses and actually go to a Pride parade) or when people could plausibly believe that “groomer” was purely about shipping discourse and maybe the occasional actually kind of creepy older adult in fandom spaces who spends a little too much time glomming onto teens specifically. But in 2023 you don’t really have any excuse for not being aware of how those terms have broken containment and are now part of regular right-wing propaganda, and particularly a concerted right-wing campaign to try to re-mainstream homophobia in places where it had become socially taboo. Your discomfort around a real adult gay man just enjoying fanfiction, which does not affect you, is not justified and you need to work through that. Using terms like “groomer” for fucking fandom discourse when it’s come to mean what it does in the broader culture is just completely morally reprehensible. Get a fucking grip

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dueling-jesters · 17 days

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What are your thoughts on women romanticising or fetishising gay men via shipping. And when you draw the line when this happened. (Sorry for bad english)

Anyone who's been following me since I started this blog knows that I'm personally annoyed with the fetishization of gay people that has run rampant in fandom spaces for decades. Shipping on its own is completely fine, but I think it becomes something of an issue when people use it to implement harmful stereotypes or to hurt someone directly.

One way I often see is when some people will take two male characters and change their appearance and personalities to project heteropatriarchal standards upon them, essentially turning them into a stand-in for an abusive straight couple. This is, of course, an extreme example.

One related form of it is,via headcanon, the association of body type, personalities, and sexual positions (i.e., making the shorter or curvier male character more feminine, weak, and submissive). This oftentimes overlaps with fandom racism (making a darker-skinned character aggressive and abusive) and transphobia (people who have a trend of making all of their transmasculine-headcanoned characters soft, submissive bottoms exclusively paired with cis-male-headcanoned characters).

One of the most obvious indicators of someone doing this is if they are obsessed over whoever is the top and who is the bottom in a way that's one step from asking "But who really is the guy and who's the girl in the relationship?". This becomes incredibly apparent when a multishipper exclusively headcanons submissive/feminine bottoms and dominant/masculine tops, devoid of any variety or versatility. It's a telltale sign that someone may not care what gay people are actually like in reality.

This doesn't necessarily mean that top and bottom headcanons are inherently fetishizing, but rather, when there is an amalgamation of it being a fandom member's main priority in shipping alongside reinforcing heteronormative stereotypes.

I personally think it's fine for someone to be primarily focused on shipping characters in fandom. It's extremely common for lgbt+ fans to project their experiences onto characters or to otherwise feel connected to them through shipping-even if they're of a different gender/ orientation. (Cisgender, heterosexual fans can be avid shippers as well without harming gay people!) A fan lusting over a character and shipping through projection is not inherently problematic, either. Perhaps my stance is biased as I am guilty of both. There could be a grey area or situations that may seem suspicious if taken out of context.

The perpetrators of fetishization are not exclusively women, nor should they be blamed for it as a whole. Just as some gay people are homophobic, and some trans people are transphobic, there are occasionally members of our community who treat gayness and/or transness as an "othering" quality- whether they separate themselves from the rest of us in doing so, or if it's a form of internalized bigotry.

There are, of course, plenty of cisgender, heterosexual men who display a similar, dehumanizing attitude towards lesbians and bisexual women - whether through media or in-person. In its entirety, this is not a fandom-exclusive phenomenon.

Fetishizing behavior has been weaponized in harassment and abuse towards gay people. Essentially, the preconceived bigotries and assumptions one may have fuel harmful stereotypes cast upon fictional characters, which in turn reinforce one's beliefs and can result in one holding the same assumptions about actual people. I won't go into much detail, but I have personally experienced and witnessed sexual harassment from self-proclaimed allies and fellow members of the lgbt community due to fanfiction-influenced mindsets.

In many aspects, I think the fetishization of gay men in fandom runs parallel to the patriarchal gaze prevalent in similar spaces - although it can absolutely converge at times. It can definitely make someone who would otherwise participate as a fan, or even as a shipper, feel alienated.

#ace's answers #thanks for sending this ask in!#although i am curious to if there was anything specific that prompted you to ask me this?#i hope my answer makes sense! i have many thoughts on this topic but it was difficult to coalesce all of them together into a solid respons #long post #this might completely go over the heads of some...#others may be too scared to interact with this post for they know themselves very well to be crossing the line

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a-faggot-with-opinions · 9 months

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finding out the trans guy who made the mlm flag got (falsely) accused of being a rapist just because the flag looks kind like the lesbian flag (i mean the 7 and 5 stripe ones not the 6 stripe ones he also made) just makes me so depressed. I know if a cis guy made it that it wouldn't get half of the shit that it does.

seeing people repeatedly make jabs at trans men who like boys, calling us shit like "microseparatist gayboys" and tearing down anything that gets made by us or associated with us.... I love my other trans friends but sometimes i do wish there was a space where i could just be around other transmascs where I won't have to see us being falsely accused of rape for making some stripes in a row right next to people who say we don't face things like predator accusations...

I don't feel safe in my "community" anymore and it's breaking my heart. I was so excited to be out when I was 13 and now in my mid 20s I find myself wishing I was anything but what I am. Sometimes I want to look at these people and go "tell me where this alleged 'separatist' group is and I'll go there and stop 'tainting' your community with my transition". Even my love for other trans men is warped and demonized (because it couldn't be pure, it has to be somehow evil) or mocked as "pussy4pussy" (i'm meta4phallo)

Sorry for essentially venting in your inbox but reading those anons who are scared of being out in their own community and especially the anon who socially detransitioned because of "community" abuse/mistreatment. I'm so scared of that becoming my future and I really can't find any solution to it. I just want us all to be ok

Never apologize for venting in my inbox, or sending me a long ask about bad things. The more that transandrophobia can be documented, the less it can be ignored, and the worse its deniers will look. Thank you so much for sending me this, kind anon! (Under the cut there will be a short summary of a personal experience I had regarding sexual harassment, so if you don't want to see that, scroll past this post.)

Transandrophobia is rampant in gay communities, and homophobia + transandrophobia combined is horrible in the queer community at large. I've had multiple people lie about me, and while I've never been falsely accused of sexual harassment or assault, I have been accused of stalking and harassed over it, I've had people publicly speculate about my fetishes in front of me where I could see, with people defending the people doing that because the fetishes I "admitted" (fake screenshots) to "having" were "problematic."

Apparently that is okay to do now, because we're men and because we "chose" to be men that means we must be okay with being sexually harassed... (sarcasm)

Here's the thing. I've never heard the term "gayboy" used for a cis man, while it's used for trans men of all different ages, and while it's not inherently the most offensive term ever, its usage is infantilizing trans men and painting us as "gay man lite." We are not gay men lite, we are gay men. Them calling us separatists is really fucking weird because there are literally homosexual male separatists. They are called biphobic transphobic gay men and you can look them up here on Tumblr and find their blogs with hundreds of followers.

I wish I could crawl through the screen and punch those people who claim that false predator accusations are a transfem-only issue, because I've had it happen to me and so many other trans guys have had it happen to them too. Painting trans men as being predatory like a marginalized man stereotype and also a female invader into maleness at the same time is a very central piece of TEHM rhetoric and anyone who ignores that should be ashamed of themselves, because ignoring and erasing that such oppression exists is also a core piece of TEHM and also TERF rhetoric.

Every day I'm getting closer and closer to actually becoming a gay trans man separatist. Jesus fucking Christ. The rest of the world hates us and the rest of the queer community hates us too, and while I think that getting the queer community to unlearn their transphobia against us is important, I also think it is vital for us to have our own spaces to talk about our experiences without someone interrupting every 5 seconds saying "what about trans women?"

#asks #examples of transandrophobia #long post #transandrophobia #homophobia

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woomycritiques543 · 10 months

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maybe let actual trans people and gnc people say what they have an issue with instead of acting like…one episode of a cartoon on youtube that has people do drag is going to result in mass murder?

idk it’s just funny to me that you seem so upset over what you think episode 5 will be

Stereotypes have literally caused genocides in the past, multiple times! Jim Crow laws even came from stereotypes of people like me, people who are poc! Not just that, but the stereotypes being portayed in the newest episode, are the same stereotypes being used as an excuse to try to kill drag queens, and children, right now!

The episode is literally going to show Moxxie, in drag, as a "danger around children" by depicting him trying to harm someone in front of kids, the exact type of stereotypes that

When if the media stopped constantly representing drag queens as "a danger to children", would attacks like this would have happened?

Actually... NO! Because this happened because of generations of misrepresentation, generations of public misinformation.

This isn't about "this makes this happen". It's about representation. -and the fact that so many of you forget what representation is to benefit a cartoon made by a cis white passing woman is actually disgusting. This episode literally has stereotypes that can and will cause more problems for the lgbt+ community, same for how Angel Dust caused more people to sexualize gay men being molested because of people like Ralphielle, same for how the pilot and episode 4 of S2 caused more people to say the r slur. This shit effects people, universally, it's not a "you have to be ___ to see that something is causing issues" ordeal. Misrepresentation is a universal problem that effects literally all minorities, all of us! Drag queens being misrepresented as a "danger around kids" is why the laws trying to ban them are happening... in the first place! Representation effects the reputation of us all! So speculation or not, do I, and multiple people from the trans community who have now said the same thing, have a right to be concerned? Yes! Yes, we all do, stop gatekeeping because you want to get off to Moxxie's femininity. It's gross, and people do have a right to be concerned.

Stereotypes are not "harmless". They effect all of us, the more stereotypes show trans women as a "danger" to kids in the bathroom, the more that drag queens are seen as a "danger around kids." The more that black lives are seen as "savages." The more that people who are disabled are seen as "stupid and useless". All of the stereotypes in Helluva Boss are stereotypes created from generations of oppresion. None of this is "ok."

There are literal threads about stereotypes like this being wrong everywhere. This isn't "for" me to "look good online/white knight", that would involve making assumptions with no other says.

This is for them, to say what they've all been saying now for DECADES! Trans lives are not "a danger to kids", these stereotypes need to stop, not just for their safety, but for the safety of all the lgbt+ community against conservative stereotypes!

EDIT:

SPEAK OF THE DEVIL!

-and just to make it worse:

They even had the violence be done to the ONLY DARK SKINNED KID IN THE ENTIRE EPISODE!

HOLY SHIT Vivienne, this is some of the most unsubtle version of queerphobia in a cartoon that I have ever seen. Literally, all the episode does is fetishize Moxxie for being in drag, while he's meant to be disguised as a minor, while also literally, having even worse since Moxxie here isn't depicted as being a danger "around" kids like I thought he would be- he's a danger TO them! Which is even worse!

Because this year, an entire church full of children was attacked by transphobes for these exact assumptions about the drag community! These stereotypes have now gone too far, way too far, and now I wish that I begged harder for this episode to be post ponned because THIS YEAR Florida is planning to even cause physical harm to the drag community- for these exact stereotypes, that were originally created by conservatives... in the first place!

The Helluva Boss fandom even called the trans genocide "GOOD LAWS!" THEY'RE NOT EVEN BEING SUBTLE WITH THEIR TRANSPHOBIA ANYMORE!

This is literally how Vivziepop stans responded to my post trying to warn Spindlehorse to post pone this episode- they aren't just transphobic, Vivziepop stans actually want the trans community dead.

THIS EPISODE IS LITERALLY CAUSING MORE PEOPLE TO WANT THE TRANS COMMUNITY TO BE KILLED BY THESE LAWS! THIS IS A REAL FUCKING ORDEAL AND WE NEED TO STOP NORMALIZING THE STEREOTYPES IN THIS SHOW BEFORE THINGS GET ANY MORE OUT OF HAND!

Look. Stop turning your heads away and look at the harm the stereotypes from this show have now caused!

Again, for the last time, actually read my posts because so many of you said "But it's not going to be-" while not even looking at the previews, what I wrote, or anything! For fucks sake- Stop excusing Helluva Boss's stereotypes just because you want more episodes of a cartoon. These fictional characters are not more important than real people! It's a public show, and conservatives can and will see this episode it weaponize the imagery as a means to cause harm to us, the exact same way 4chan did so after episode 3 of S2. This shit is really getting out of hand. Which is all the reason why that my video on the Sallie May controversy will be released, Vivziepop will be held accountable, and I will make sure that not a single piece of vital info is excluded from that video in question.

#helluva boss #helluva boss criticism #tw transphobia #literally multiple people in different identities have now said that they dont like seeing their community being presented this way?#Not just with Vivziepop #But in general?#So maybe listen to them before coming after me for things people in the trans and drag community have now been verbally against MULTIPLE-#TIMES!#for YEARS now.#If we had this logic with all minorities and their civil rights my people would still be segregated smh. Gatekeeping solves nothing.

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lesbiansanemi · 3 months

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the projection of your internalized transphobia is literally radiating off of you. leave trans men alone holy fuck we can't even speak about our oppression without someone who isn't even a transfem yelling about how we're taking the spotlight or something. while many transfems actually pitch in and are glad that we talk about things that never get talked about in the trans community bc yes it is mostly passing binary white trans women who get the spotlight 99% of the time lmao. like not only are u speaking over trans men ur also speaking over trans women who benefit from these conversations. idek why i'm writing this tbh im just holding onto some small hope that maybe you'll listen but i really hope you just grow out of this separation type mentality abt other trans ppl. no ONE type of trans person should get the 'spotlight' literally everyone's trauma and ways of talking about our oppression deserve attention equally bc erasure is not cool or sexy. im sorry that it seems like u have trauma or something from ppl who happened to be trans men (im guessing transmeds?? but those literally affect trans men too lol) but literally what makes you think that making an over generalization that all trans men are violent misogynists or something is not transphobic??? like ur not owning the evil trans men ur literally just vilely transphobic. like i genuinely hope you realize that someday or something. for the record this isn't supposed to be hate, i just wish you guys would see how terrible you treat trans men, like ur literally pointing out someone's marginalized identity on why u hate them. idk man just... we are supposed to be allies not enemies. please just find it in yourself to see that. if you wouldn't make that overarching statement about other trans people/marginalized groups, then genuinely why is it okay to do to trans men? just think about that. have a good day.

1. You are putting words in my mouth I did not fucking say, and 2. You are ignoring the ones I did

I never said binary trans men couldn’t talk about the issues they face. I never once said that anywhere. I never once said I hated trans men. I never once said being a trans man made someone a “violent” misogynist

What I DID say was that the community of trans men had issues with misogyny (internalized or other) but that any time someone pointed that out, they were accused of being transphobic (exactly what you are doing right fucking now)

Criticizing a community for an issue within it is not “hating” them and it’s certainly not hateful or transphobic. You are the one reacting in such an extreme way to someone criticizing an aspect of your community. If I see misogyny (internal or otherwise) from trans women or genderfluid or non-binary ppl or or or I’m also going to point it out. I’m not “hating you” for your identity. I never said “hate” anywhere. You are blowing a valid criticism of your community way out of proportion to paint me as nothing but transphobic so you don’t have to consider your own biases

A lot of trans men ARE misogynistic (some internalized, some not). A lot of trans men ARE transmisogynistic. A lot of trans men (ESPECIALLY gay trans men) are lesbophobic

I’m saying this as a trans masc person who has tried interacting with your community and people in it a lot, and has dealt with these issues on multiple occasions in multiple ways

You are also proving my point that you don’t see afab nonbinary ppl as “””””really”””” trans in comparison to binary trans men from the way you’re talking to me. MY experiences don’t count, obviously. MY opinions on the trans community don’t matter because I’m not REALLY trans cuz I’m not a binary trans man and therefore basically cis, right? That’s what you’re implying, after all! I’m “talking over” the REAL trans people

As a trans masc person, saying “wow, this community has a lot of unchecked transmisogyny” is not speaking over transfems. Transfems have SAID this and pointed it out and you don’t fucking listen to them either

You’re right. We are supposed to be allies. But if we are to be, you need to accept that other marginalized subgroups within your community are sometimes going to point out that you have your own biases to examine, and when they do, maybe you should actually think about that and consider it rather than scream “YOU SAID SOMETHING NEGATIVE ABOUT ME THEREFORE YOU ARE OBVIOUSLY A RAGING BIGOT WHO FUCKING HATES ME BECAUSE OF MY IDENTITY” You can’t just accuse everyone of transphobia if they say something you don’t fucking like

And I’m not even gonna touch the “cis passing white trans women get 99% of the spotlight.” Like wow. Not even trying to hide the transmisogyny there bud huh. That is such a generalized blanket statement that is not true in ANY capacity. Also very funny of you to go on and on and on about how “spotlights” don’t and shouldn’t matter when it comes to oppression and then say that. You are just… proving my point. You want a reason to get bitchy about trans women so bad you will literally make them up

Don’t come into my inbox, do exactly what I was saying the community had a problem with, make assumptions about my so called “trauma with trans men”, accuse me of being “vilely transphobic”, and then tell me to have a good day

As I said in my original post, gay trans men be fucking normal about women for once, and don’t accuse everyone of being transphobic when they point out misogyny in your fucking community

#asks #kaz rambles #long post

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brickmail · 10 months

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Let’s talk about it

This is what you said

“omega men & alpha women r the closest fandoms can get to a trans person before they start getting scared…” to which I said a lot of omegaverse is written by trans people and they’re including trans and intersex omegas. Clearly you don’t read much.

You then said “thats where youre wrong because ive given omegaverse written by other queer ppl a chance multiple times and its still weird, convulated, borderline transphobic/misogynistic everytime. i dont know how to tell you this but trans people can have bad taste”… alright trans people can have bad taste but how is it “borderline transphobic/misogynistic” omegaverse falls into three categories omegas are oppressed, this is justified through biology and either is or isn’t being fought against OR everyone is equal.

So if you’re saying misogyny because they justify sexism through that argument doesn’t work for ALL Omegaverse stories. You can say some stories outright get rid of woman that could count if it were true of ALL stories but it isn’t. ANY genre can be weird and convoluted of the author is shit so that’s not a really argument either. And don’t say mpreg is misogynistic that’s actually transphobic.

If you want to quote transphobia it again DEPENDS on the author. Vampires and werewolves aren’t inherently transphobic even though most author don’t write about trans ww/v. Omegaverse doesn’t exclude anyone it’s a bag of tropes. The genders in omegaverse are add ons. If exclusion isn’t the problem then what is? Is it cis men getting pregnant and you feels that ignores trans men it’s not true of every omegaverse as already stated. And why do you hate the notion of cis men getting pregnant go on tell me what’s wrong with it outside of its gross or pregnancy is my squick. Go on I’m waiting actually explain myself. I don’t genuinely believe you know anything about this trope or how it’s evolved.

im going to give you the benefit of the doubt and elaborate on my beliefs even though this ask is insane and youre assuming i have a problem with men that can get pregnant when i am a man that can get pregnant 🫶

omegaverse is often times misogynistic because the works use misogyny trauma porn as a plot point while simultaneously replacing the women who face these issues in the real world with cis omega men. point blank period. this trivializes a serious world issue.

omegaverse is all-the-times transphobic because it blatantly fetishizes trans people, while disguising it by making up entirely new sex designations so nobody has to worry about getting called a chaser. meanwhile, because of this, we are also robbed of actual trans representation and trans stories in fandom. fundamentally, almost any omegaverse plot can be replaced by just making the characters trans. but that would require actually being thoughtful about the interpretations of the characters to not fall into transphobic stereotypes, which cis people do not care to do.

i would even go as far as to say omegaverse is homophobic in many cases! theyre making whether a character is a top or a bottom so ingrained in their personalities it shapes their entire sex. which is weird!! its such a big issue in fandom for people to change a characters entire personality just because they think theyre a bottom which is unrealistic to real life gay peoples experiences. omegaverse only contributes to this.

so, do i think people writing omegaverse are inherently morally bankrupt? no. in the case of trans people, theyre absolutely allowed to choose for themselves what bothers them and what doesnt. if theyre cool with it, good for them! but im trans, and im not, and ultimately that is up to me as the affected party.

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man-squared · 1 year

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Anyone who would like to can participate but I encourage people who whine on transandrophobia/transmisandry posts to do this exercise:

This exercise is for you to critically think about your own beliefs, values, and behaviors about trans people. Please answer or at least think on the questions below.

How does erasing transmascs help transfemmes? How does telling/thinking that a group of trans people don't significantly experience something help any amount of transfemmes?

How does creating a world with an ideology that transfemmes/trans women are the only populace that is significantly/meaningfully trans help transfemmes not be labeled as predators to all people? How does putting transfemmes on a pedestal of transness not help their hypervisibility, which in turn leads to transphobes only seeing transfemmes/women as the face of the trans movement (so then no transmascs/men exist to them)?

Why do you feel so comfortable pushing aside transmasc and other trans issues? Do you do this with nonbinary people? Do you do this with transneutral people? Do you do this to people not an the categories of transmasc/transfemme or tme/tma?

Why do you think that transfemmes can't experience transandrophobia? Why do you think that transmascs can't experience transmisogyny? Do you also believe that cis people or "passing" people can't experience transphobia? If not, have you watched any Western media? How many cis men have put on a dress as a joke or been played as one for being 'effeminate'? How many more-masculine women get harassed for being masculine, and what about the 3-article clothing laws that affected cis gay men and women as well as drag kings and queens and trans people? Do you think transphobes and bigots care about what you actually are when they are bigoted towards you?

What does significantly affect mean to you? Why does any experience with a said phenomenon not lead to someone being affected by it? Or in otherwords, why does a transmasc saying they are affected by something you believe only transfemmes are significantly affected by then not affect that transmasc in any significant way that needs to be addressed?

What characteristics save you from being significantly affected by any given bigotry?

If you believe that trans people who are transitioning towards masculinity or are perceived to be can never experience direct transmisogyny, then do you believe a closeted and cis-passing trasnfemme can? If so, why and how do you believe them to be different from each other?

Do you value stuff outside trans discourse the way you do trans discourse? Or in other words, is there any hypocrisy to your beliefs that when asserted on a different group of people, you wouldn't believe like you do towards trans people? If so, is that right? Does it make sense? Why does it apply differently elsewhere (and yes, you may find that your hypocrisy in different situations is correct and does follow your actual values)?

Do you believe stuff just because you are told to? And no, this isn't a jab at you in particular, everyone has problems with just believing everything they are told. We all do it, but we all still need to step back and critique our beliefs and values. Like why do you believe something? Is it just because someone told you to? Is it because it makes you feel better about yourself? Why?

Thank you for answering or skimming or reading if you did. Have a great rest of your day.

(Let me know if this looks formatted wrong or terribly. I used periods to separate sections because I am on the mobile app.)

#trans #trans theory #transandrophobia #transmisogyny #exorsexism #transphobia #trans community #long #man² #resources #trans resources #discussion

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st5lker · 1 year

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wild half-thought out rant since at this point im not seeing anyone on tumblr talk about this its more of a tiktok discourse thing but as someone who is gay the whole "genital preference" discourse and the way it comes from people who arent even outwardly transphobic or trans exclusionary is pretty wild to me. i can only talk about this while getting into tmi territory sorry so the rest is under a readmore

its usually transmascs especially younger ones propagating the whole idea that "its not transphobic to have genital preferences i wouldnt be offended if someone didnt want to sleep with me bc im afab" and even ignoring the way that that completely ignores how different this entire situation is for trans women, as a gay person who is very aware of and comfortable in what i am and am not attracted to it just doesnt ever make any sense to me. like i am attracted to men. point blank and period. im attracted to things that register as masculine or a feature of a man in my mind.

but like. i get the idea of where theyre coming from in that attraction is an instinctual reaction or whatever but like, sure im not "attracted" to vaginas in the sense that im not turned on by a picture of one and yes sometimes the idea of getting up close with one turns me off. but believe it or not i am still attracted to trans men and would still have sex with one because i register them as men? and in the same sense like, yeah im usually attracted to an isolated picture of a penis but like that usually comes with the idea in my mind that its attached to a man. looking at a trans woman's penis when im aware its a trans woman gives me the same hormonal reaction that looking at a cis woman's vagina does, in that... its nothing. because my mind registers that as a body part belonging to a woman. a person's genitals are one tiny part of their body and if thats the ONLY thing you can focus on when youre attracted to somebody then i really have to wonder if youre attracted to people or if you just see partners as like... sex toys with extra baggage attached

like i kind of get where theyre coming from, my brain is hardwired towards amab genitalia, but its also hardwired towards a lot of things other things too LMAO. its not like i have any particular inclination to get close and focus on afab genitalia the way i might with others but like... that doesnt mean its impossible to interact sexually with a trans man or even their genitals yknow. there are lots of ways to have sex. and like, is that to say im attracted to every single trans man or every one of them ticks the boxes that make me attracted to someone? no of course not but im far from attracted to every cis man either LOL. there are plenty of cis men who are far less attractive to me than the majority of trans men on testosterone lol and thats not even always about them being 'ugly' as much as it is them not being my type.

there are so many arguments people make about how alll trans peoples bodies are different and how you dont have to interact with trans genials and all that and while all of that is true and i just mentioned some of it i think honestly the core of the matter comes down to this: in most cases we are attracted to gender, not sex, and so we're attracted to the things that our brain pattern recognizes as matching with our orientation. and contrary to what a lot of transphobes believe if you are not actively trying to remind yourself of a trans person's AGAB every time you see them in most cases it is very easy to register them as their identity in your mind. the issue is not that youre not attracted to trans people, the issue is that you refuse to allow yourself to see trans people as anything other than the gender they were assigned at birth, and that conscious perception block is what is keeping your body from reacting to them as you would a member of your preferred gender.

#obviously its a lot more complicated than this in many cases #but as a gross generalization (which everyone is already doing anyways in this discourse) i think this sums up my feelings pretty well

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maxellminidisc · 2 years

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I really do not understand where this whole idea of lesbians and bisexual women branching off into individual identities and communities being a bad thing stemmed from but god it frustrates me as a bi woman/bi person in general and as a person who loves many many of my awesome big sexy lesbians friends.

Bisexual women and lesbians may have congregated as the same group once but we're not anymore, and thats FINE and its actually a good thing! Because despite the overlap in experiences as women who are attracted to women (and yes I am including trans women when I say women), bisexual women and lesbians still have significant differences in experience and marginalization unique to their attraction that need to be addressed as separate communites because being aware of these differences provides a basis for us to tackle said issues in a way that is specifically conscious and adapted to our individual communities and forms of opression. God I hope that makes sense lol

Like as a WHOLE community we ALL have overlap in experiencing homophobia or bigotry directed as us for not conforming to gender and expression the way cis heteronormative society wants us to (i.e butch lesbians, effeminate gay men, trans/non binary people who do not pass/choose not to pass, etc) but we all as individual communities in one, face individual types of marginalization that we need to talk about so that those who don't experience it in the broader community and outside of it understand us.

For example cishet society hates lesbians for NOT being attracted to men and being attracted to women instead, it hates gay men for being attracted to men and not women, bisexuals are scrutinized for the fact that we have fluid attraction, trans folks but particularly trans women are hated for being women despite the assigned gender that society expects for them to conform to and at the same time intertwine that specific transphobia with misogyny which thusly creates transmisogyny (I'm sorry of I phrased this badly, I would absolutely appreciate correction!), etc. It is incredibly important that we acknowledge those specific and DIFFERENT experiences that we are targeted with because other wise it'd be like being blind to each others suffering.

And in the case of lesbian and bisexual women, trying to lump us in as one big group again erases the history of opression lesbians specifically face and fought for being women who do not show attraction to men and for being women who love women and take joy in sexual and romantic pleasure in loving women, and to do so proudly, despite societies insistence that women have to be with men. For bisexual women it creates and perpetuates the god awful attitude that bisexuality as an identity is simply not enough all in its own. It is yet another unnecessary ammendment made to bisexuality because y'all dont want to question the internalized issues you may have with it. Lesbianism excluding the attraction to men is not a threat to those of us who have attraction to women ALONG SIDE an attraction to men in ANY capacity, that is literally what bisexuality is for and that's ENOUGH!!! Some bisexuals are drawn more to women than men, but still acknowledge that part of them is still attracted to men and guess what, THAT'S STILL BISEXUALITY AND ITS FINE!!!! There is literally 0 need to impose an attraction to men on to lesbians like AT ALL and acting like we have to go back to being the same group does exactly that.

And to top it off, lesbianism does not exclude nonbinary folks and trans women just as bisexuality doesn't exclude nonbinary and trans people as a whole; trying to lump us in together with attraction to non binary people as an excuse is fucking stupid and gross. Because again, you're perpetuating the lesbophobic belief that all lesbians are trans exclusionist and the biphobic belief that bisexuals are transphobic and limited or binary in their attraction.

I of course haven't even touched on the specific difference of how bisexuality and lesbianism differ in terms of social impact such as ipv, addiction, depression, etc. There are lots of studies and statistics that show the numbers are different between us and even between us and the rest of the community! Being able to be separate respected communities allows us to see the impact of biphobia and lesbophobia as two specific forms of oppression and find the right kind if help and resources for us to heal as lesbian or bisexual women!!!

Do you like not literally see how trying to make us one big group with 0 acknowledgement of how significant our difference are is harmful?

#anyway this has been in my brain for ages #i needed to let it out cause its frustrating seeing yall fuck with us as both separate communities and as allies #with this disingenuous badly vieled attempt at labeling ms/p*c lesbians as solidarity skdndkdksks #bi tag #📓

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transmascpetewentz · 8 months

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Syscourse jumpscare

While I normally don't post syscourse on this account, I felt the need to add to a conversation that's been happening recently (and one that's been ongoing for a while) regarding the term "sysmed" and its usage.

So, a little bit about my system that I rarely talk about on here: we're a polyfragmented DID system. I have been the host since about April, and I don't know most of the other system members very well. We have varying views on endogenic systems, leaning towards pro. I still haven't really decided what I think about this whole debate. Either way, we all can agree on the fact that the term "sysmed" is transphobic.

Transmedicalism isn't just "when people think you can't be trans without dysphoria." Transmedicalism, more than being a belief or a set of beliefs, is a societal attitude about transness and about gender as a whole. Modern transmedicalism is an intracommunity issue, but it is rooted in "science" such as the debunked theories of Blanchard. The difference, however, between Blanchard's "science" and the science around systems, is that Blanchard's "science" is complete bullshit. The gap between FTM "HSTS transsexuals" and "autohomoerotic transsexuals" is almost nonexistent because this "science" is based entirely on the stereotype that transness exists for sexual reasons.

Modern transmedicalism, while it harms everyone in the trans community, is mainly straight gender conforming transmascs trying to weaponize heterosexuality and gender conformity against femmes, gay transmascs, and other non-straight transmascs. Being feminine or attracted to men is seen as a sign of "trending," just like the debunked homophobic idea that being attracted to men made you a fetishist of male homosexuality before it. The history of transmedicalism cannot be divorced from this "science," which is something I've spoken about previously.

To compare this history to anti-endos being mean online is transphobic on so many levels. Anti-endos being mean online aren't what cause young gay trans men to hate themselves for not being attracted to women. Anti-endos being mean online don't spread an ideology that gets you denied T if you show any interest in men. Anti-endos being mean online are not in any way comparable to the severe, irreversible harm that the idea of autohomoeroticism has done to the gay trans male community.

Before the 1980s, there were not even words to describe us, because people didn't know we even existed. Those of us that lived before then just called themselves faggots. So many of our brothers lived their whole lives never realizing there was anyone else like them. The simple truth of the matter is that we live in a world that tries to erase our existence at every point it can, and this erasure is something that shapes how each and every one of us views and interacts with society.

Anti-endos being mean online, while I do not want to minimize the harm they can cause, did not do this. Anti-endos being mean online are traumatized people taking it out on the wrong demographic. They are not continuously silencing a group of people who have been subject to invisible violence for hundreds of years only to be written off as fetishists when people realized that we exist.

Obviously, transmedicalists are not the cause of gay trans men's oppression, and we have more in common with straight trans men than we are different. But transmedicalists are people who have fallen for some of these dangerous ideas, among others, that are rooted in gay trans men's oppression. Anti-endos being mean online are not directly contributing to oppression that is in any way comparable to this.

When I see systems who are cis or not planning to transition bodily use "sysmed" to describe anti-endos being mean, I can't help but be hurt. However valid your argument may be, if you do not experience transphobia, our suffering is not your gotcha. Our oppression is not a hypothetical "[x] is bad so everything that's bad is [x]." We are real people and our voices matter. Allow us to do the talking when it comes to our issues.

Anti-endos aren't off the hook either. If you are cis and you call a trans system transphobic for usage of "sysmed," that is not okay, and you are transphobic. If a trans system is using sysmed, I will still disagree with their usage of the word, but that is for trans people to discuss and sort out amongst ourselves. No matter how good your intentions may be, that is simply not your place.

If you're a trans system (traumagenic or otherwise) and disagree with anything I've said, feel free to reply to this post so we can discuss! This post is directed at cis systems and systems who do not experience transphobia in their daily lives. A system that does experience transphobia regularly who uses "sysmed" is very different from a system who does not who uses the term, and I guess that's the main point here.

#wentz.txt #long post #syscourse #pro endo

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jacquelinemerritt · 1 year

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Queer Media Review: Her Story (2016)

Originally posted September 1st, 2016

Honest, earnest, and representative, even to a fault.

This review is the first in a weekly series of pieces on queer and trans media. See them all here!

The importance of Her Story as a piece of queer representative media cannot be understated. In a time where the majority of films about trans women are cast and crewed by cisgender men and women, that Her Story was co-written and co-produced by Jen Richards and Laura Zak, a trans woman and cis queer woman, respectively, makes it unique, and lends the entire production a sense of honesty and earnestness that defines the series. Unfortunately, that earnestness is what leads to the biggest flaws of the series, near the end, though they are far from great enough to bring down the overall quality of this Emmy Nominated series.

Her Story begins by setting up its primary framing device: Allie (Laura Zak) is a journalist writing for a queer magazine called “Gay LA,” and she decides that she wants to write a story on the dating lives of trans women with Violet (Jen Richards) as her primary interview subject. They interview over coffee, and Violet establishes the “rules” (in the screenwriting sense) about trans women that will hold throughout the series (and reflect their existence in the actual world). It’s all done very playfully, however, and the scene serves to set up a burgeoning relationship between these two women, with Allie coyly flirting with Violet the entire time.

These two women clearly have romantic chemistry with one another, but it’s established around the same time that Violet is already in a committed relationship with Mark (Josh Wingate), with the primary conflict being both that Mark doesn’t want Violet seeing this woman and Violet being unsure of her own sexuality, having exclusively dated men since transitioning to life as woman.

While this relationship is the main focus of the series, a number of subplots are set up in the background as well. Paige (Angelica Ross), a civil rights attorney and Violet’s friend, is attempting to navigate a new relationship with James (Christian Ochoa) a (presumed) cis man who is unaware that Paige is trans, while Lisa (Caroline Whitney Smith) is attempting to discourage her friend Allie from dating Violet, arguing that it is impossible to be a lesbian and date someone who is a “former man,” misgendering Violet and using transphobic language against her. These two subplots coalesce wonderfully in a way I won’t spoil. Both of these subplots are given satisfactory endings which leave both Allie and Lisa with the opportunity for significant character growth if this series continues.

While the side stories are resolved well, the main story of Violet and Allie’s relationship is concluded rather clumsily, with Violet giving a speech on her character’s entire history in the fifth episode which feels like an attempt to make Violet representative of as many trans women as possible, rather than to build complexity into her character.

What’s more, Allie being present with Violet to receive the revelation is spurred on by a poorly designed coincidence that would seem to serve to alienate Violet further from one of her few friends, the lesbian punk rock artist Bad Penny (Elizabeth Frances). This is glossed over in favor of giving Allie an opportunity to learn Violet’s darkest secrets early on. It’s a weak bit of storytelling that both lessens the impact of Violet’s eventual coupling with Allie and sidelines the reality of Violet’s experiences in favor of pushing her into the story’s resolution (the latter of which I find particularly frustrating).

Nevertheless, these flaws aren’t enough to lessen the value of Her Story. Even with a weak resolution to the main story, the development of Allie and Violet’s relationship is honest, and watching Paige attempt to navigate the complex issue of whether or not to disclose that she’s trans to her love interest is incredibly compelling. That issue in particular is one that has been absent in almost all trans media created so far, despite being a very regular part of the trans experience dating. Seeing that conflict depicted on screen is both affirming and empowering, as is the complexity of Violet’s confusion over her own sexuality.

I would highly recommend Her Story as an honest depiction of navigating romance as a trans woman. It’s well-constructed, well-shot, and well-acted, and its flaws come nowhere near outweighing its strengths.

Rating: 4/5

Her Story can be viewed on the series’ official site, HerStoryShow.com.

Critical Eye Criticism is the work of Jacqueline Merritt, a trans woman, filmmaker, and critic. You can support her continued film criticism addiction on Patreon.

#queer media #trans media #transgender #indie #drama #comedy #dramedy #romantic dramedy #i uh #i think i hate her story now #like i guess it's fine enough as like #a story #but it is so representative of the worldview of middle class liberal trans women #and just #endlessly frustrating as part of that narrative #like the attempt to make 'violet' a stand-in for as many trans women as possible just feels alienating to me now #she does not feel like she comes from my community #instead she feels more akin to the few trans women being like #'hey! i wanna be part of the military industrial complex! stop discriminating against me! LET ME COMMIT WAR CRIMES!'#she feels nothing like all the broke queer fag trans girl commies i know now #most of whom are hardcore lesbians and wouldn't even flinch at being attracted to girls #i think i am legitimately too nice to this series #i guess it must have made me feel represented back then #but this shit is nothing i want to be associated with now #queer media reviews

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transamorousnetwork · 1 year

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What I Really Think About Transgender Women

Dear The Transamorous Network,

I asked a question in reply to one of your articles a few weeks ago. You never answered. I’ll try again.

When you say you’re attracted to trans women, what exactly do you mean? Are you attracted to all trans women, equally those who have underwent full GRS, those who have only used hormones, and those who have underwent no medical transition at all (and all other various stages and forms of medical and non-medical social transition)?

Also, are you attracted to them as women, or specifically as trans women?

I think a lot of trans people, myself at least anyway, would want a partner who desires them as their gender – not specifically because of their trans status. And obviously, for them as a person, not just a object of sexual desire due to their trans identity. One explanation I saw you give essentially amounted to saying that trans is a third gender, which to many trans people, again certainly myself, would seem transphobic. A trans woman is a woman, not a third gender. A trans man is a man, not a third gender. Your answer I saw about transamoury seemed to be at odds with respecting a trans person’s gender identity.

Thanks for the reply,

Curious

Hey Curious,

So sorry about missing your questions/comment the last time. I sometimes do that. It’s not intentional and I’m getting better at getting to these comments.

When I say I’m attracted to transgender women, I’m referring to many qualities. So this is going to be a long reply, I think. But I respect your questions, so I’m going to be thorough out of that respect. Please note that the order in which I offer these, has no bearing on what I consider priorities. I’ll try to make that more clear as I answer. Also, my answers may confront you or run counter to what you think, how you think about transgender women or how you think men should think about them. I’m just answering as clearly as I can, questions you’re asking that, frankly, are kind of hard to answer because a lot of the attraction is intrinsic. It’s also highly personal and nobody’s business…frankly.

Like, we don’t ask a heterosexual man “why are you attracted to cis-women?” It’s a nonsensical, question socially. It’s just accepted. But my attraction is somehow, some kind of aberration worthy of interrogation? Why?

You ask: When you say you’re attracted to trans women, what exactly do you mean?

What I mean, exactly, is highly layered and nuanced. There’s an innate attraction first and foremost and this can’t be overstated or really explained. It’s not dissimilar to someone who is heterosexual and therefore attracted intrinsically, innately to members of the opposite sex, or a gay man who is innately, intrinsically attracted to men because they are men, primarily.

In other words, the fact that they are transgender is a point of attraction to me that separates them completely from cis-women. And those transgender women who are trying to be “women” I’m not attracted to because those people IMO are trying to be something that they are not…something that, frankly, they are better than at a cosmological level.

But there are other aspects of transgender women I find attractive also. Qualities easier to put my finger on. And some not so easy to pin down. Of the trans women I’ve dated (and I’ve dated many) I find their characters/personalities highly attractive. This is probably the biggest thing besides the intrinsic attraction I mentioned above.

Even those who struggle with lack of self-acceptance possess characters/personalities underneath those mental issues, which I can perceive, characters/personalities which I find alluring.

For example, there’s a transgender woman who lives one block away from me. She’s a composer and musician. She doesn’t have to say a fucking thing and I can perceive this quality I’m talking about. In the summer she sits on her porch smoking a cigarette on her breaks. She’s not the most physically attractive woman, she has several, self-admitted mental health issues, she smokes and drinks (to excess in my opinion) and yet, there is still that “je ne sais quoi” characteristic about her that is soooooo freaking alluring that is beyond my intrinsic attraction to her. It really goes beyond words to describe. And IMO, that aspect of her – of transgender women in general – does NOT exist in cis-women.

There’s a perseverance (obviously), a stick-to-it-tiveness some transgender women possess that I find highly attractive. After all, such a personal journey, undertaken often at tremendous cost, time, health risk and potential risk of social ostracization would engender these qualities in anyone IMO. But the transgender woman’s journey is unique in this way, again in my opinion. It creates a very secure, spiritually strong, somewhat intense energy I enjoy being around. Like an authenticity, which I too possess.

I like the fact that transgender women’s experiences cause them to cultivate an “I don’t take any shit from people” attitude also. I know this doesn’t exist in every trans woman, but, again, those I end up dating have such facets in their personality and I enjoy and respect that because, again, I’m that way.

The kind of transgender woman I am attracted to tends to be highly intelligent, self-reflective and thoughtful. This is not the same as formal academically instilled “intelligence”. It’s different. It’s like a self-awareness, a self-possessiveness that draws me in. You could say it’s an “energy signature”.

Those I’ve dated also tend to possess talents similar to mine (artistic or otherwise creative) as well. So there’s that.

Beyond all this, I’m attracted to how transgender women look, particularly those on HRT. I’m not referring to just young women either. And definitely not only “passable” ones. In fact, I prefer those who don’t necessarily pass over those who do. That’s because, for me, I find the blend resulting from a physiologically male body, “tempered” by HRT far, far FAR more attractive than (pardon me) fleshy, soft cis women. Which is why I am not interested in transgender women who use some processes to try to look like that fleshy, soft curvy form cis women have. Again, transgender women are transgender women. As such they are inherently distinct and preferable as far as I’m concerned. If I wanted to be with a cis-woman, I’d choose that. So passibility isn’t something I’m necessarily interested in. Not that I don’t appreciate that kind of beauty in certain transgender women. I do. But it’s not a priority for me. And certainly not part of my selection criteria.

I actually find more mature transgender women, physically, more attractive. Personality-wise too. Age tempers their personalities I think and I find that alluring.

Ok that’s the first question. The second is actually several I think:

Are you attracted to all trans women, equally those who have underwent full GRS, those who have only used hormones, and those who have underwent no medical transition at all (and all other various stages and forms of medical and non-medical social transition)?

In short. Yes.

To elaborate: I think my previous answer supports my short answer above. Attraction is attraction to me. But I do have preferences like everyone does. But that doesn’t change my attraction. It does, however, affect my selection. That’s different from attraction. I think you understand that distinction.

Your next question I answered already, but I want to highlight this, because it’s very, very important. I think you get this (perhaps from a different perspective though) because you singled out this topic as a separate question. You ask:

Also, are you attracted to them as women, or specifically as trans women?

Specifically as trans women for several reasons. For one, because that’s what they are. Secondly, “trans” is an expansion of what it means to be human. It is an evolution closer to the true aspect of human spirit in each being, which is BOTH male AND female, expressed across many lifetimes. So I see trans women as a separate, evolved and therefore advanced aspect of human expression. It is not a “third” gender. It’s transgender: they help transition humanity out of the gender paradigm. In my spiritual experience, this is a critical MUST if humanity is to evolve further.

So I venerate them because of this. There’s a lot more I can say about this relative to how trans women think about themselves, particularly those trying to be “women”, but that’s beyond the scope of your question, I think. I’m attracted to them because they are trans women.

I get that doesn’t fit with what you think. To me, that’s ok. We don’t have to think alike. Can you be ok with someone who thinks differently than you? I can.

I now want to respond to the last paragraph of your comment. I hope you’ve read this far and see that I’m quite consistent in my answers. I’m very clear about what I know. I may express it differently over time as my ability to express it improves. Ok, here’s what you wrote:

I agree. Many trans people do think the way you described here. But NONE of the trans women I dated do. I respect your opinion and the opinion of those other trans people who feel this way. The trouble I have with this, given my spiritual experience, is, humanity is constantly expanding. What it is, how it looks and how it expresses itself signifies EVOLUTION. Thinking there’s only “man” and “woman” is a very narrow, limited way of seeing the vast quality of what it is animating human consciousness. To reiterate, I get some trans people struggle with someone accepting them as trans. The problem, in my opinion, is that’s because they, themselves are not accepting their trans status. Instead of seeing it as an expression of evolution, they are trying to “fit in” to a socio-defined construct, which is outdated and has been for millennia.

Back to the basic question: It’s like, do cis-women get bunged up because the guys that are attracted to them are PRIMARILY SIN QUA NON women?

Of course not. They (the women) don’t even give it a thought. Because they accept that they are women. They’re not trying to be something else.

Does a gay man get bunged up with another gay man expressing their attraction because they are PRIMARILY, SIN QUA NON male?

No. They give it no consideration. They accept what they are expressing as male.

I wonder if trans women (and trans people in general) struggle with their status because they are allowing social indoctrination wrt GENDER to create lack of self acceptance among and within them. Given that I work with transgender women, from a spiritual, core, essential nature level, I have suspicion that this is the case. I don’t have enough cases to say this definitively, though. So, don’t take my words for it. And don’t be offended over everything I have shared.

You be you! Including your ideas, thoughts and beliefs. There’s plenty of room on the planet for trans women like yourself (given how you’ve described your views) to exist, find love and joy and freedom and all that, and for guys like me to do the same.

Thanks for writing and, again, apologies for missing your previous comment!

Perry

PS – notice that I did not once mention anything about sexual desire or performance. Also, I’m surprised some transgender people are so quick to throw around the “transphobic” claim, often in contexts it has no place being uttered. For example, you can see, I hope it’s obvious, that I very much do not exhibit a “dislike of or strong prejudice against transgender people”, which is the dictionary definition of “transphobic”. For me, it’s quite the opposite.

I wonder if those who sling that term around are like POC who throw around “racist” with no real justification. Reminder: I’m a non-binary person of color. My conjecture about those who sling such terms is, they are insecurity looking for a place to place the blame for their insecurity. So they attack people with the T word or the R word, often at times when it’s completely unjustified, indeed, when the facts show exactly the opposite happening, in order to soothe an underlying lack of self-acceptance. What I’ve expressed here is NOT transphobia. It’s trans-attraction/transamory which is completely the opposite.

#transgender #transsexual #transamorous network #transisbeautiful #transattraction #transamory #transisbeauty #transisbetter #thisiswhattranslookslike #pre op mtf #transgender mtf #mtf positivity #trans #trap

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lie-where-i-land · 2 years

Text

Transphobes other than TERFS

Writing a cohesive post about identifying radfems and terfs got me thinking about transphobes and their different faces. As someone put it to me in conversation, people miss-apply terms like terf when the person in question isn't even a feminist. She wasn't wrong; the word we use for folks like that is just "transphobe." But I've been mulling this over, and I've realized that just as many people have a general understanding that terfs are bad but can't really explain what they look like outside the most egregious examples, many people have little experience identifying what I have previously called "garden variety transphobia." More than one person I spoke to recently was surprised when I described the sort of transphobia I experience from inside and outside the queer community. I don't say this to make anyone feel bad; as I've said before, it's functionally impossible to know everything or to be invested in every problem everywhere all at once. So I've put together another post about another type of transphobia.

Keep in mind, I will be talking here mostly about trans men, and my experience as a trans man. I can't say I speak for all trans men, and I definitely can't speak for all other trans folks. I'm not trying to say anyone has it better or worse that anyone else. Other trans folks are welcome to add on about their experiences that might parallel this situation - especially trans women.

To start off, I'm going to say that I generally dislike bringing up fandom in the same conversation as other issues. I feel like saying "oh this happens in fandom too" cheapens the original message of the discussion. On the other hand, I've noticed some people acting like behavior and experiences offline are the only ones that "count" - both in terms of what you're allowed to feel hurt by, and what you're allowed to get away with. Additionally, I was prompted to write this by a fandom-related post I saw, which is adjacent in function to the terf posts I talked about previously (innocuous posts to draw people in to their blogs, and engage them in deeper transphobic conversation). See below:

I'm sure more than one of you has seen the sims gaming section, which some popular bloggers screenshotted and have been mocking. That's how the whole post came to my attention. This is why I'm bringing up fandom and media. A lot of people are talking about queer fetishization in the media and in fan spaces, and while some people are trying to do that in good faith, it quickly becomes obvious that some are not.

So how does trans-man hating connect to vent posting about fandom? I’m going to try and break down how transphobes describe and smear trans men, how they slip it into discussions of fan behavior, and transphobia lives on in the cis-gay community.

There are a group of folks on tumblr who call themselves TEHMS (trans exclusionary homosexual males) - effectively, gay guys that don’t consider trans guys to be men and don’t consider us to be gay the same way they are. Offline, we would just call these guys transphobes.

The post above is pretty absurd. But I first want to draw people’s attention to the bullet points about height and femininity. When we consider writing about gay characters, I would challenge people to think about what a man looks like. Is there any set definition of what a man is? Do men like baseball? Must he have a beard? Hair on his asscheeks? Hands that span a certain width? My point in saying this is that if you go to a gay bar and look at the people you find there, you will not find two people that look the same, sound the same, or have the same interests. I find it real funny that "short man" must mean a lady is writing a self-insert character. Look, I'm short for a man (even among other trans men). But my cis partner is not much taller than me, he is not white, and he's very much not "female coded" for being 5'5." Trying to apply these standards to cis guys shows how dumb they are, and it reeks of the same selective biases as "no fats, no femmes, no asians."

The other thing is the focus on authors like Albertalli. Albertalli is a queer author, who was forced to out herself after some extreme community gatekeeping. The language here describing her makes it clear that this fellow doesn't see her as queer, or perceives that she came out falsely as a ploy to ... idk, she hasn't shared her evil manifesto with me /sarcasm. This, in combination with a title like "straight/bi women fetizishing men" is what tipped me off that a post like this is really about having a dig at trans men.

So I hop over to this fellow's blog. My suspicions are almost immediately confirmed by the blog heading:

"actual homosexual, actual opinions." So... as opposed to the fake homosexuals with invalid opinions? Who exactly are these fake homosexuals? If we were gonna compare this to how radfems and terfs talk, using phrases like "real woman" and "actual lesbian" as a way to covertly identify themselves to each other as trans-women exclusionary, one can see that the "fake homosexuals" here are gay trans men. It gets even better, just wait.

This guy is actually pretty transparent about it. His blog is stuffed with this crap - usually, I have to hunt for it. Immediately, I find posts like this:

note how he uses "TiFs." This is an acronym that stands for "trans-identified females." Trans-identified female is a transphobic term for a trans man (TiM is the term many transphobes use for trans women). It is transphobic because it focuses on the sex we were assigned at birth, and positions our gender identity as being of lesser significance. It's misgendering to bring up the fact that our genitals and other bodily characteristics do not match cis folks', that gender affirming medical therapies may never achieve a physique like our cis counterparts, and to use a term that heavily implies that transness is the mental aberration of perverts who can never truly be or satisfy cis gays.

Other things to note about this post: the strong aversion to porn. Note the claim that porn is not realistic and doesn't portray real world social or relationship dynamics. This is technically true, but look at what he uses this kernel of truth to say. That cis gay adult actors are simply earning a paycheck by shooting scenes with trans men - that no cis gay man would date or sleep with a trans man, and that a cis gay man cannot genuinely be attracted to a trans man. Note also that he refers here to a bisexual adult actor. The assertion here is that the actor is bisexual and not gay, because only cis men are men, that gay men can only be attracted to cis maleness, and that the bodies of trans men are not male but female.

But wait! There's more. Further down I find another post about homophobia. Let's take a look.

Obviously this person is in a vulnerable position and has experienced homophobia in their community. I'm gonna start by saying that individuals are the experts on their lived experiences, and it's likely true that this person has a keen sense for detecting homophobia. However, it's not true that being cis or being white is a magical protective factor against all harm, and it's disingenuous for him to say so - when people say that being a person of color or being trans makes life hard, they mean that it has a unique impact on their lives and the sort of bigotry they face, not that it erases how other people are suffering. But looking at this tells me how this person was radicalized to think like this: vulnerable people who lack support are most at risk for radicalization (and cult-like indoctrination in general). Transphobes are good at poking around for weak links, and exploiting people's pain. They position themselves as the only safe harbor for storm-battered ships, and teach people that anyone else seeking shelter alongside them is their enemy.

I want to draw your attention now to the second paragraph. Look at how he describes trans men/ afab genderqueer folks. We're straight (and therefore trying to coerce gay men into relationships, or to spy on their lives for voyeuristic pleasure). We have bad hair and ugly clothes, and no social life (aside from our physical bodies, we must be immature and unappealing). We use "ratself" pronouns. For what it's worth, there's nothing wrong with neopronouns, and genderqueerness doesn't need to fit inside existing binaries or be a neutral third category, but it's very telling that this dude picks something he thinks is unflattering in an attempt to make us look mentally unwell. And it's worth addressing how this is ableist. Mental illness or neurodivergence does not invalidate someone's gender. How paternalistic to say that we must all be little confused girls, who should be prevented from mutilating ourselves, cured of the delusion that we're men, and prevented from sexually traumatizing ... our willing cis gay partners? make it make sense, because this sounds more like someone under the effects of heatstroke than any cohesive ideology.

In the context of writing (professionally and in fandom) how does this manifest? Well, refer to the first post about writing gay characters, and this:

Rhetoric like this is interested in finding Those That Don't Belong, and Those With Bad Intentions. I will say first that I am very much not interested in sorting the chaff from the wheat here, when the consequence is that in trying to remove the chaff, we forcibly out queer writers. And that really is the end result here. Trying to figure out if someone is writing something for the wrong reasons will only lead to picking people's lives apart. Look, I'm not even a fan of Albertalli's writing; I'm rather outside the target age demographic for high school meet-cute lit. But I think claiming a queer woman is fetishizing other queer folks fails to use Occam's Razor (forget the razor, it's a bit like trying to shave your legs with an orbit sander - why is an orbit sander your tool of choice??). Try going through some more plausible options first: her writing is good but you don't personally like it, her writing is bad and you don't like it, or she has some rather natural spots in her writing that lack the insight a gay man might have (let's face it, even with plenty of research, I don't think I could write about a Finnish character as well as someone who lives in Finland; that doesn't mean I can't get pretty close or do a respectful job researching).

What does this have to do with trans and genderqueer people specifically? Well, there are still people talking about the "plague of fujoshis" in fandom. I don't deny that there have been many fans who have behaved inappropriately. Between showing explicit rpf to actors/singers/youtubers; stalking, doxxing, and grabbing people's asses at cons; and either not doing enough research or challenging biases about sexuality/gender and how that impacts how they interact with fandom, there is plenty to talk about. But when we have been talking about bad fan behavior for over ten years now (I've been on this site a long time, I'm showing my age)...

Look. We have got to address bad behavior on a case by case basis. Because making sweeping statements about "Why People are Really Writing This (It Must be For Fetish Purposes)" only ever leads to Becky Albertalli situations. We are asking people to out themselves, or be labeled a fujoshi. And here's the thing about calling people fujoshis. That term has been totally co-opted by TEHMs like the guy that wrote the posts I've been examining to insult trans men. Why? Because fujoshi is an unflattering term for a straight slash fan. And to transphobes, trans men are straight girls who are sick in the head, fetishizing real gay men and traumatizing them by forcing ourselves upon them:

I'm not saying anyone who says "look, X gives me bad vibes" is being transphobic. I'm not saying we should not be discussing how to be more respectful to queer and genderqueer folks online and offline (I am the (gender)queer folks we're talking about). However, I want people to be aware that even if you haven't personally seen it, this is a line of rhetoric that has old deep roots in ridiculing anyone who violates cishet norms in their personal or fannish life. And look, I used a fandom/writing post as an example because that's what came across my dash first, but there are legitimately people calling gay trans men "fujos" for loving other men. This is not just a fandom issue, but the least we can do is not give it fandom airtime.

I'm blurring out usernames and the like because I don't know this guy, he seems like the sort of asshole I don't want on my blog, and I'm not writing this as a callout or something. I'm writing this to illustrate how people (even people inside the queer community) talk about specifically trans men, so that people can be more aware of falling into prey to certain logical fallacies or lending power to transphobes.

[good to reblog]

#transphobia #trans #queer #transmasc #trans men #gay #good to reblog #trans tolkien

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