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#not some transmisogynist dogwhistle
bitchmale · 5 months ago
the fact that tumblr has fully just unironically embraced the #notallmen mindset is sooooo funny i gotta hand it to the MRAs who infiltrated progressive spaces like u guys rly succeeded LMAO
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anhedonia2 · 2 years ago
in that article frederica mathewes-green emphasizes the trauma of women undergoing abortions they were coerced into by modern culture (to keep up with jobs and the like), but i think its very important to note how she never brings up the trauma of being forced to complete a pregnancy you do not wish to for whatever reason. also, who the hell is pressuring women to get abortions? in this current climate where abortions are so vehemently stigmatized (and even once more banned)?
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transfeminines · 11 months ago
i don’t have anything to say that hasn’t been said before and better but all the supportive posts i see rn should not stop in a few hours when this all dies down, or tomorrow, or a few days from now. tmes should always be supporting transfems, boosting our voices, and standing up for us. you, tme people reading this, have a responsibility to check yourselves and your friends for transmisogynistic rhetoric. you outnumber transfems on this site by at least 10 to 1, and it’s because of that that it’s so scary when once a week some tme will go full terf and we’re left wondering if it’s gonna be one of our mutuals next. 
reblogging warning posts, blocking terfs, not engaging with terfs, and checking your followers to make sure you don’t have transmisogynists in your notes is a good start but you need to do better. learn the dogwhistles. boost our donation posts. come to your transfem mutuals’ aid when they’re getting harassed. stop engaging with terfs. 
and again, stop reblogging terf posts even if you’re making fun of them or arguing with them. all you’re doing is spreading their rhetoric and exposing your vulnerable followers to their views. 
tme people don’t argue with me on this
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closet-keys · a year ago
you sign onto twitter
8 people are arguing about incomprehensible lgbt+ discourse, you don’t know any of them, but someone you know follows one of them
there’s an antisemitic hashtag in the trending list
JKR said something transmisogynist again and everyone responds the same ways they have every previous time it’s happened, including the percentage who claim it’s the first time they’re hearing of it
a republican politician openly condones something just wildly abhorrent and it has tens of thousands of retweets
Trump admin posts another fascist dogwhistle
liberals are tweeting ableist posts and memes about republicans
white people are being antiblack towards actual Black people while having #BlackLivesMatter in their bio
someone made a cake that does not look like a cake
20 leftists are vague-tweeting some horrific take by some other leftist, but you have no idea what it was and don’t particularly want to find out
a survivor is being harassed
a disabled person is being harassed
a woman of color is being harassed
a democratic politician is trying to co-opt the aesthetics of a Left movement while demonizing and misconstruing anyone actually involved in the movement
corporate accounts are attempting to be #relatable
someone just lost their job/home/income
someone left a vague and confusing comment on one of your tweets
two people you follow now hate each other but no one is saying why
you sign off of twitter
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copkillerlupin · 4 months ago
y'know this fandom has such a superficial idea of solidarity w trans women or just trans ppl in general. like, a lot of hp fic contains terf dogwhistles—eg conflating womanhood with menstruation*, or including the gender essentialism that jkr has put into her fantasy worldbuilding—and these fics are usually written by people with their pronouns and "anti-jkr" in their bio. it's like how so many people will put "terfs dni" in their bio and then reblog posts using terf rhetoric. actions speak louder than words, and if you perpetuate terf dogwhistles, putting she/her in your bio doesn't mean shit.
and because this is the internet and you have to really spell everything out otherwise someone is going to vastly misread what you are saying: i am not saying that anyone who parrots terf dogwhistles is malicious or automatically a bad person, hence why i used the term dogwhistle. that is what a dogwhistle is. it is supposed to seem innocuous, and a lot of people parrot it without knowing what they're really saying because they heard it from someone else. dogwhistles aren't going to be overtly and unambiguously anti-trans; it's not going to be "i hate trans women" or "i think killing trans people is good". it's going to be something you can reasonably get away with. if you asked a lot of people who say this shit what their opinions on trans people and terfs are, they would truly and honestly reply "i support trans people and condemn terfs", because they do genuinely think that they are being supportive of trans people. and that's nice and all, but trans people and especially transfem people are not going to feel safe around you if you parrot terf dogwhistles and talking points.
if you are going to engage with a book series that makes the vast majority of trans women viscerally uncomfortable (and btw i include myself in this criticism; i'm not saying that my hp blog is good and everyone elses is bad), at the very least learn to identify terf dogwhistles and don't perpetuate them. learn to identify crypto-terfs because i can, and every time some hp blogger gets outed as a terf, i'm ngl i did see it coming lol. you can tell when someone is either hiding being a terf or maybe isn't a terf but is in the process of becoming one, because of the kinds of rhetoric and phrases they will use.
*and i specifically phrase it this way because "womanhood is menstruation" is a dogwhistle, for instance using the phrase "being a woman" and using it as a euphemism for menstruation. stuff like "women menstruate and men don't menstruate" is just cisnormativity and incorrect, but not specifically a transmisogynistic dogwhistle out of context. i have to clarify this otherwise the terfs will get even madder over this post lmao
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jennyslateswife · 5 months ago
yknow with how much "q***r is a slur was started by terfs" is said you might expect to see terfs saying that and passing that around and yet...they dont...?? so it's kind of obvious that it's not true??
I'm TME, so I'm gonna try to talk about the whole "queer isn't a slur, you're a bad person if you think it is" thing more broadly while still touching on the TERF thing. But I wanna use this as an opportunity to get a lot of my thoughts on the matter out.
Firstly, queer started off as a slur before radical feminism, let alone trans exclusionary radical feminism, was a thing. Queer means strange, deviant, perverse, odd, or even ruined. Before it was used to disparage gay (and trans, though the things were equated at the time) people, it was used in a negative context.
You can't undo this definition of queer. So, queer has always been a slur. If it has always been a slur, TERFs couldn't have started it.
"Well, Queer Nation existed and thus we reclaimed queer! TERFs are trying to make it a slur AGAIN!" Okay, Dykes on Bikes is a thing... dyke is still a slur. Queer Nation employed EVERY slur in the anti-LGBT lexicon in their radical politics... you calling it the Fag community? No, okay then.
The reason why Queer Nation used the term queer and why we had phrases like "We're here, we're queer, get used to it" was BECAUSE of the words being a slur. The same reason why people held signs saying "Fags bash back." It wasn't so everyone could have free range to call everyone else queer or fag. It was to create discomfort.
Reclamation of a slur is always personal. You cannot reclaim a slur for someone else. There was no fixed point in time (I guess the AIDS Crisis, since we're utilizing QN and We're Here as teh argument) where a slur is suddenly neutralized. After Queer Nation, Matthew Shepard was murdered and his funeral was protested with signs that said "No Tears for Queers." Sooo... if queer STOPPED being a slur... bigots never got the fucking memo.
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So, on a base level, "TERFs are the reason you think queer is a slur" makes no fucking sense. Queer started off as a slur and never stopped being slur. A contingent of LGBT people have reclaimed it and a larger contingent of cishets have used it--offensively and to lovingly describe whatever quirk they think makes them LGBT now--but, again, personal reclamation exists only to reclaim it for ONE person, yourself, and no one else.
And beyond that... the reason why TERFs are mentioned here is to dehumanize trans women and use them as discourse pawns to silence people. TERF dogwhistles and arguments aren't bad because TERFs said them, they're bad because they hurt trans women. TERFs may have non-transmisogynistic beliefs like... women shouldn't be oppressed. That's a good belief that only gets bad when used to exclude and harm trans women.
So, even if TERFs believe queer is a slur... that isn't bad unless it's used to harm trans women. And... it doesn't?
People argue TERFs hate queer because it's more inclusive but... it's not. LGBT includes trans people. Queer excludes every single LGBT person, including trans women, who is traumatized by the word or simply does not reclaim it. Queer is less inclusive of LGBT people and specifically trans people than LGBT is. People who are hurt by the word queer are INFINITELY more vulnerable and likely more directly in the line of homophobic and transphobic harm than people who reclaim it are.
So, if you're using a term that excludes all of them or maybe includes them while it hurts them... you're not being inclusive.
There is no argument about queer not being a slur that helps trans women and hurts TERFs' cause of transmisogyny. Trans women are not some monolith who love the term queer. Many do not reclaim it or do not want to be referred to by it.
Sooooo, unlike all those arguments where people ARE genuinely pointing out transmisogynistic dogwhistles that don't seem to be a TERF talking point at face value but quickly devolve into anti-trans bullshit... "Hey, queer is a slur, please do not use it to refer to LGBT people without consent. And, no, calling it the queer community and then stopping when people ask you to as as sort of shoot first, ask questions later policy isn't good enough," does nothing of the sort.
Also, queer ISN'T trans inclusive. SO many fucking people say "queer and trans people" as if trans people are not inherently queer. Queer is more likely to be used to exclude LGBT people than the term LGBT is.
Queer is not inclusive. And queer is not radical, not anymore. And even if it somehow were radical, calling LGBT people a slur without consent wouldn't be a radical usage of it.
Calling LGBT people a slur they do not want to be called will never be radical.
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erandur · 4 months ago
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hey y’all i just realized this while going back through my blog, but the op of this video (and some other oblivion videos going around right now), kingpin-of-steel-act3, is a transmisogynist. i will not post screenshots because the posts are very upsetting, but searching the word “trans” on the blog turns up multiple posts using the accusations against chris chan as an excuse to misgender her, as well as other vile posts using transmisogynistic dogwhistles and repeating violent transmisogynistic rhetoric.
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meowm1x · a year ago
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[caption: “tme” belongs to the terfs now, sorry :/ stands for terf master extreme]
so i’ve saw some folk i follow get baity asks from anons, saying that “tme is a terf dogwhistle”. i want to warn folk that this is NOT the case. tme is a term meaning “transmisogyny exempt”, a term made by trans women to simply describe those who do not experience transmisogyny. terfs have since picked this up and have of course started yet another attack on trans women, confusing people by changing the meaning to something transmisogynistic (for example, “transmisogyny enthusiast”). do not listen to ANYONE who says this. it is a trans woman’s word first and foremost, not a terf one. please don’t buy into their stupid bullshit.
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mushroomsprites · 6 months ago
people saw "someone saying 'lesbians don't like men' can sometimes be a transmisogynistic dogwhistle, so make sure to do some digging to find out if the person saying it is actually a radfem or not because if they are, that changes the context of what they're saying & they need to be blocked/reported"
& took it to mean "every time any lesbian says the words 'lesbians don't like men,' that means they are unequivocally a TERF & no you shouldn't double-check, just make all the assumptions you want based off one single post :)"
& it absolutely shows lmfao
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beaky-peartree · 3 months ago
What is a tme and also what is a bi lesbian? I'm not being confrontational, I'm genuinely confused. Also, what are some TERF dog whistles to watch out for?
tme means transmisogyny exempt, so like trans men, cis men and women, afab nonbinaries, amab nonbinaries that aren't transfeminine, we don't experience transmisogyny. the inverse is tma which is transmisogyny applicable, so trans women and transfem amab nonbinary ppl. i know it can be uncomfortable and feel invasive having someone ask about your agab but it is an important factor in determining whether or not a person can be a target of transmisogyny.
Bi lesbians aren't a thing. Its origins stem from terfs who called lesbians willing to date trans women that, and now a bunch of people are trying to insist it's a legitimate identity as if it's not inherently contradictory. And you'll notice nobody tries to push this concept with gay men. Just lesbians.
As for terf dogwhistles, there's several and I'm sure after posting this I can find more detailed lists but off the top of my head:
TRA - trans rights activist (trans people and our allies don't tend to use this)
Biological women/bio women
Wombyn/womyn/womxn/adult female homosexual woman
TIM - trans identified male (derogatory term for trans women)
heavy emphasis on genital based discrimination
strong hatred for porn and sex workers/anti-kink/anti porn (there's non transmisogynists who are like this too and they should also be avoided)
Gender critical
Theres plenty more that I can find and if anyone else wants to add on go ahead
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rosetower · 5 months ago
don't reblog weirdos have some fucking decorum
saw a post made by a trans guy saying that "effeminate males" was a transmisogynistic terf dogwhistle, made a hoot about listening to transfems in his post, 3.5k notes, checked the notes, and apparently he had suicidebaited a transfem poster who disagreed w/him and then deleted the replies... ? in the notes of the post...?
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endlesslyunamusing · 6 months ago
please take a moment to see if the post about women that you want to reblog is written by a terf.
if I got a penny every time I read a subtly transmisogynist post by someone named some dumbshit like "naturalwoman" via someone who had "no idea" op was terf I would be rich.
please just have some awareness about context and subject matter and how seemingly positive posts can be dogwhistles.
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thepavi · 7 months ago
Your posts about theory, t*rfs and af*b folks being susceptible is smth that struck me and I'm even more aware how insidious they are. Thank you for pointing it out, I noticed how I would say 'I care about ppl that's enough' in the past too, it is not enough. What you said matters.
U can't even bring up concern and criticism of p*rn, sex w*rk with ur mind on all workers' safety and decriminalisation without them rubbing their disgusting tr*nsph*bic hands over it. Like I have seen ex-workers giving into their rhetoric and I feel almost fucking helpless because they weaponise l*ftist theory and invade our spaces and destroy the meaning of terms that tr*ns women used to protect themselves. They think they're confident and revolutionary and proud when they go "t*rfs do interact", crying wolf and mis*gyny and racism (when they're w*c) while their ideologies make tr*ns w*men's existence hell. I made a baity post once and it took no time for them to stink up my notes, telling me I was antif*minist for makin fun of how they praise themselves on boundaries and Not Catering to men while being virulent tr*nsph*bes and b*phobic in the same breath. One of em said "you'll be in my f*minism even if I am not in yours" while their header proudly said "bis*xuals aren't g*y". Keep it, go to hell, how dare you pretend to 'invite me in' only to offer me poison to eat?
(I censored some terms bc I deffo do not want them to find this ask. I just wanted to affirm what you said.)
Thank you for this message and I totally agree with you and everything you’re saying here, you elaborated on a point that I was definitely thinking about but didn’t convey as strongly in my initial post — This rhetoric seeps into so many edges of feminism, honestly like half the time I point out to a mutual that they were reblogging a post by a t*rf it’s something innocuously unrelated to trans issues, like something about the safety of sex work, normalizing pedophilia towards young girls, criticizing the porn industry, talking about silencing marginalized voices due to “minor disagreements” (lol), “joke” posts about hating men, etc. The dogwhistles are there but they’re hard to catch if you haven’t spent time listening to trans women and learning the talking points of trans exclusionary radical feminism. None of those points that I just listed are inherently bad, but when they’re coming from t*rfs it’s all being weaponized against trans women (and to some extent all trans people, but trans women are their primary targets). It’s why you need to be so careful and so educated when you’re engaging with this stuff, especially if you’re not a trans woman, because T*RF indoctrination is something that can really happen to any afab person since their rhetoric does go beyond just Hating Trans People, it’s overtly and covertly m transmisogynistic and they ideally want any AFAB person, even trans men, to assimilate into that worldview. Their rhetoric paints trans women as abusers, groomers, and manipulators of trans men, who are harmless “female” victims of male brainwashing and violence.
As a rule of thumb I do not publish anon hate (unless it’s really really funny) and I block weirdos in my notes because I do not believe in giving bigots a platform even if it’s to argue with them unless you very intentionally have formulated an argument and even then you need to be careful. Elevating their voices is never going to result in a positive outcome and far far too often people just make themselves look like fools by falling for bait and biting off more than they can chew and spreading nasty rhetoric to all of their followers. Plus it’s just more satisfying to refuse to let them get a word in lol. But yeah, if you could see what my notes and inbox looked like for the past few weeks it’s been insane, the amount of bitter assholes throwing around the worst bad faith misinterpretations of what I’m saying, completely insane accusations about trans people that are so removed from reality, hateful bullshit built on a foundation completely of bigotry, and just... constant attempts at trying to “upset” me with dumbshit insults that do not fucking matter because they are sent by anonymous strangers who are mad about something I said on the internet. It’s crazy the way they’ll dogpile people and I really do find it kind of hilarious and pathetic that they cannot recognize the incredible amount of social privilege they have over trans people and how willing they are to celebrate that and utilize it to try to threaten and silence those who speak up. As is the life for marginalized people I suppose. Also, the complete hypocrisy in the way they act like they love and support ALL FEMALES!!!!1!1!1!!1! but will straight up harass trans men including very often sexually (I know so many trans men who have been sexually harassed by t*rfs), threaten them, ntm the way that they will actively fight against trans men having specialized healthcare or a voice in reproductive health topics is not lost on me lol.
(Also, contrary to the trans men who’ve been bitching at me, a trans man, over my post, of fucking course I know that t*rfs cause damage to trans men as well, and I could write endless posts about my own experiences as a trans man who has been targeted by them, but that does not mean that trans men cannot be indoctrinated by t*rf rhetoric and are not susceptible to enacting transmisogyny — that rhetoric does indeed carve a space for them, even if it’s one that is damaging to them as trans people, because their ultimate goal is exterminating trans women and “uplifting” and “liberating” all “females.” Trans men very very much can and do fall for their shit. And we can still be targets. This is not a black and white issue but trans men’s position as people who were assigned female at birth makes their relationship to r*dical feminism way way different than any TMA person!)
But yeah, TL;DR the way these people sneak into rhetoric and use it to boost their arguments and how incredibly violent and hateful they are is so awful. I’m glad my post resonated with you and I’m sorry you’ve been a target to their BS before :/
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I’m replying to a few asks and replies at once. I tried to fix tumblr’s mangling of quotes and other punctuation, apologies if I mangled further. There are a few asks and replies I didn’t respond to because they were very similar to others included here, and a few I didn’t respond to because I accidentally hit the “back” button and tumblr lost my draft and I got confused about what I had and hadn’t responded to, but this covers what I felt was most important to respond to. 
Anonymous asked artthatremindsmeofhannibalnbc a question:
hi! not exactly sure if this is what that anon was talking about, but transphobes have used the term "bi lesbian" to describe lesbians who include trans women in their attraction. it’s separate from its use as a term for split attraction--that specific usage is extremely transphobic. but idk if that's what anon was talking about
Wow! I’m really glad you told me this. That is really messed up!
So yes, uh, I oppose the term in this usage. Lesbians who include trans women in their attraction are lesbians, no modifier needed.
Anonymous asked artthatremindsmeofhannibalnbc a question
bi lesbian literally originated as a term terfs used for cis lesbians who date trans women. no one who isn't affected by that sort of transmisogyny has any place calling using the term okay because people claim it means something else now because 1) ppl who aren't transfeminine using a transmisogynistic dogwhistle as an identity is incredibly poor taste, 2) most "mspec/bi/pan lesbians" now use it to justify fetishizing trans people who don't identify under the "woman & some non-binary" umbrella instead of just using bi, pan, or sapphic. ffs, sapphic as an umbrella term for all wlwnb exists for a reason without being offensive to trans people, bi people, and lesbians, and accomplishes anything positive that bi lesbian could claim to.
Well, shit. That sounds really fucked up. 
I am learning that there is a larger context to this discussion of which I was entirely ignorant. I apologize for replying without knowing the full story.
thislousytshirt replied to your ask post (this combines 3 replies):
people who do identify as bi-lesbian and mspec lesbian are certainly not terfs. terfs are all about lesbian purism. its not a transphobic phrase and it does not refer to lesbians who date trans women.
the reason being anti-mspec lesbian is terfy is that terfs are very invested in gatekeeping "lesbian" as a term, its sort of an adjacent goal to the transphobia
reasons that someone might identify as bi lesbian: they identify strongly with the word lesbian or identified solely as lesbian in the past but now consider themself bi as well. they mostly like girls but are into other genders as well. they are nonbinary and primarily attracted to girls but are also sometimes not a girl and therefore are bi as well. they are part of lesbian communities that include all wlw in the definition of lesbian.
Thank you for saying this. This is exactly the stuff I was thinking about when I made my original reply. 
doctor-creepy replied to your ask post:
there’s no such thing as being bi and a lesbian? choose one? you can be bi with a preference for women but you’re not a lesbian. lesbian = no attraction to men flat out. ever.
Okay, so. I put the above replies first because I want to make it clear that I realize that my previous post was ill-informed. That said... 
Look. I don’t know anything about you. But “choose one” is a phrase I have pretty much only heard from biphobes. And “lesbian = no attraction to men flat out. ever.” is a sentiment I have pretty much only heard from TERFs.
I apologize if this is simply a case of unfortunate word choice / phrasing, but it is this kind of sentiment that led me to suspect that opposition to these identities is biphobic and transphobic.
doctor-creepy replied to your ask post:
the fuck is it transphobic to only be attracted to womenn
I never said it was.
However, most of the time that I see people say “lesbians are only attracted to women” they mean “trans women aren’t women.” Which is transphobic.
eskamtrash replied to your ask post:
Sorry but isnt "bi lesbian" a lesbophobic and biphobic term in itself?? If youre lesbian you like women (cis and trans women ofc), if youre bi you like more than one gender. You cannot be both at the same time. Not trying to be confronting, but i dont get that term at all
Hi! As I mentioned, I only learned this term a couple of hours ago. I’m learning that there is a wider context of which I was unaware, and that it was ill-done of me to reply without knowing all of the background. 
However, the original information I found when I looked up the term made me think that some people identify this way. And I think that, whether I “get” the term or not, people can identify however they like. 
Yes, “lesbian” means a woman who likes women. In the term “bi lesbian,” “bi” is an adjective. It specifies a type of lesbian. In this case, a bi lesbian. It is not, in my opinion, inherently making any kind of statement on lesbianism, bisexuality, or anyone other than the person who uses this term for themselves. 
It could still be making that statement due to everything else going on in this discussion -- see above -- but again, other people’s identities aren’t for me to “get.” They’re for the people who identify that way. 
Anonymous asked artthatremindsmeofhannibalnbc a question:
hey! im sorry you are getting rude anons about this, you obviously care about other people and have the best intentions in your opinion on bi lesbians. the argument i see most for the validity of the term is so that lesbians with nonbinary partners or say, partners that come out as male later in their relationship have room in their identity to account for that BUT nuance and The Genders and people growing and changing have always been a part of life as a lesbian and the term "bi lesbian" is a little unnecessary and confusing in my opinion. I think calling it biphobic and lesphobic is a little unfair because that is not anyone's intention in using it, but it does muddy the water in a way it doesnt need to be muddied. anyways! love your blog and you seem cool, hope u have a nice day!
Thank you so much for this message. Your examples are exactly the sort of thing I was thinking about when I made my original reply.
amourduloup replied to your ask post
that doesn't make any sense! the term lesbian does not in itself exclude trans women/nb women, at all. lesbians are women attracted exclusively to women, which of course can include trans women and nb women. i don't understand the need for the term bi lesbian, and it's obviously a way to further alienate lesbians, and it reinforces the idea that lesbians are attracted to men. i'm bisexual so you can be sure this is not biphobic rhetoric, but i just don't understand this term or why it needs to exist.
replying because you said explanations are welcome, i don't mean any disrespect, only a disagreement.
Thank you for replying, it is absolutely welcome. 
I didn’t mean to suggest that the term lesbian excludes trans women or enby women. If it came off that way, I truly apologize. 
As far as I’m concerned, if people identify as bi lesbians, that is why the term exists. Honestly, if people don’t identify this way then yeah, I don’t know why it exists either. 
In a vacuum, I don’t see how it reinforces the idea that lesbians are attracted to men. I think it conveys that bi lesbians are attracted to men. However, this term doesn’t exist in a vacuum, and I once again apologize for my original ill-informed reply. 
The reason I suspected that opposition to the term is biphobic is because biphobes also say that the very existence of bisexual people is harmful to lesbians. Biphobes also say that bisexual people who are with or have only been with people of hetero genders are not queer and that their existence threatens other queer identities. 
The reason I suspected that opposition to the term is transphobic is because people who police lesbian identities -- or queer identities in general -- are usually transphobic. 
Anonymous asked artthatremindsmeofhannibalnbc a question:
hi! lesbian here! "bi lesbians" and "m-spec lesbians" as identities are damaging to lesbians because lesbian has functionally meant woman or woman-aligned person that's attracted to only women or woman-aligned people. this is by definition inclusive of trans women because they are women. it's not biphobic to say that lesbians are not bisexual and bisexuals are not lesbians. words mean things i also don't really understand why you think it's transphobic to not support "m-spec lesbians" (1/2)
(2/2) the lesbian identity already includes trans people?? trans lesbians exist and lesbians who have trans partners also exist?? lesbians are exclusively attracted to women and women-aligned people. it's lesbophobic to support identities that claim otherwise, and also inherently harmful to lesbians. it's not biphobic or transphobic to say that lesbian means lesbian.
Hi, thank you taking the time to explain this, I appreciate it.  
I didn’t mean to suggest that the lesbian identity doesn’t include trans people. I apologize if this is how I came off. 
I don’t think the term “bi lesbian” is saying that lesbians are bi. I think it’s saying that some people identify as bi lesbians. My understanding is that it’s a way to describe people who identify as lesbians who are also attracted to genders other than women. I don’t see how this undermines or threatens other lesbian identities, any more than the existence or queer identities undermines or threatens hetero identities. 
There are several examples above of reasons a person might identify as a bi lesbian. What do you think the people in these examples should call themselves if not bi lesbians?  
Anonymous asked artthatremindsmeofhannibalnbc a question:
I think the term bi lesbian is considered distasteful because it erases both the bi and the lesbian experience. Bi ppl face pressure to just pick one, lesbians face the opposite where ppl assume they haven't found the right man. As for bi lesbians having anything to do with trans ppl--you’re not less of a lesbian for being attracted to a trans woman, yknow? Speaking as a trans person, it's more alienating to see cis gay ppl (mlm or wlw) using the term bi to justify their attraction to trans ppl.
Hi. Thank you very much for sharing this with me. I’m really glad to know this point of view, and I’m glad you felt comfortable sharing it. I absolutely agree with you that if someone identifies as a “bi lesbian” because they mean “attracted to women and trans women” that’s fucked up and transphobic. 
Anonymous asked artthatremindsmeofhannibalnbc a question:
i dont want to "start discourse" or w/e but i just want to gently say nothing about that statement is "terfy" of involves the exclusion or opression of trans women at all. its between bi and lesbian identities. please dont call random unrelated community issues terfy /terf related unless they actively do those things . not everyone who isnt "inclusive" is a terf
It’s true that not everyone who isn’t inclusive is a TERF. However, TERFs are well-known for converting people to their point of view by making seemingly unambiguous statements that then escalate into excluding people based on their sexual identity and/or gender identity. It was that vibe that led me to say that it sounded TERF-y. 
What I am getting from this discussion is that: 
some people think the terms “bi lesbian” and “mspec lesbian” are lesbophobic because they think their very existence means that all lesbians are attracted to men 
some people think the terms are biphobic or lesbophobic because they conflate the two identities, suggests that bi people are really only attracted to one gender (in this case, women), suggests that lesbians are actually attracted to men, or some combination of the above 
some people think the terms are transphobic because it was invented by TERFs 
some people think the term is fine and inclusive of trans and nonbinary and that opposing it is transphobic 
that some people think the term is confusing but fine
plus probably a lot more that either isn’t represented here or I don’t understand 
My conclusion is that my original reply was ill-informed. I apologize for this, and am making a separate post to apologize without it being buried in this long post. 
I still believe that people can identify how they want and that it’s not my place to police them, that policing lesbian identities is usually transphobic, and that policing bi identities is usually biphobic. 
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I feel kinda stupid for this but why are those JK tweets bad? Is the whole 'sex isn't real' thing some sort of way to say that trans people aren't actually trans? I think her wording is throwing me off here and not being all that good at english doesn't help me
It’s no problem! Often these terf whistles are deliberately worded in a complicated way. It’s certainly a dogwhistle towards terfs that suggests although she supposedly supports trans women, she believes they belong in a different class to women and indeed, the tag #IStandWithJKRowling tag on Twitter is filled with terfs going on about how she “stood up against male violence” (amidst the kpop fancams spamming the tag, thank you kpop fans).
She then of course gets annoyed at the use of the term “people who menstruate” which is used to be inclusive of nb people and trans men.
She then got offended at the use of the term ‘terf’ and called it misogynistic before retweeting an article written by a transmisogynistic lesbian who calls it "a slur strongly affiliated with violent threats against lesbians (simply for being exclusively same-sex attracted)”. For the last time, asking that trans women are respected and safe in the community does not mean anyone is forcing you to date trans women. The article mainly complains about people being asked to give their pronouns in emails and blames trans women for it and denounces the term LGBTQ. There are valid discussions to be had about lesbophobia within the community but this ain’t it
One thing I find laughable in her series of tweets is that she claims she’s been empathetic towards trans people for decades which sounds incredibly manipulative, especially because she has never said a word publicly about trans people until she started supporting known terfs. Did she never mention her support of trans people because it wasn’t relevant to Harry’s journey?
mod a
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tsscat · a year ago
i dont mean to be annoying and am genuinely asking how do you know that op is a crypto fascist??? asking so i could know to spot it on other blogs
No that’s a good question! TLDR I found dog whistles in the tags but here’s the evidence in detail (TW for transphobia and antisemitism):
Ok the dead give away was the fact that most of this user’s posts were tagged with “trans jews” even though none of them had to do with trans people or Jewish people:
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Both Trans people and Jewish people are highly targeted by fascists and many rightwing conspiracies revolve around Trans people, Jewish people, and often both. So, using this tag specifically on meme posts indicates a rightwing dogwhistle (Not to mention specifically saying “Jews” rather than “Jewish people”, as the former is more derogatory when said by gentiles).
This tag is so often used by this user that it’s one of their top tags:
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In addition there’s also the url itself. In this case, “yourtypicallesbianman” hints at the fascist “ironic” humor that mocks marginalized people. I would not be surprised if this was specifically transmisogynistic.
I also was able to find more indicative earlier posts including a post that mocked BLM and a post of a tweet that explicitly states altright views and hopes for “4 more years of Trump”. I’d really wished I’d screenshotted them earlier tho because it seems as though they’ve caught wind of this and deleted them. I found these through looking through their tags, as they were often tagged under stuff like “blacklivesmatter”, “democrats” etc.
Also important note for anyone who’s read this far. I understand this may seem like a stretch to some people but the fact is that cryptofascists (fascists who pretend not to be fascists basically) try to be as subtle as possible to both appear “friendly” and signal to their fellow fascists that they are one of them. The point is to lure people who are not fascist and slowly groom them into fascists.
 I would not be calling out this person if I did not know for certain if they were a fascist but the evidence above, esp the “trans jews” tag makes it very clear that they are one.
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lunarssong · 3 months ago
i'm kinda hesitant to post the scs bc they're like my age and i don't want to callout-post them, but ohhhh my god i had. such an interaction the other day. like, peak exclus hypocrisy to the point it almost circled back around to hilarious
cw for queerphobia, biphobia, panphobia, transphobia, transmisogyny and also just misogyny in general, ableism, enbyphobia, etc
highlights include:
they took issue with me saying queer and were going "q slur" but. their url literally has the f slur. hello??
"i'm not being transphobic" as they spout dogwhistles, and also just
i got told i'm gay and not bi because i'm not attracted to women.... less than one post away from an ask mentioning a point i brought up using gender labels as an example where their response has an implied claim they support nonbinary people. how do you manage to acknowledge nonbinary people in one breath and then define them out of existence in the next
and then as a follow up somebody came in their inbox and called me biphobic because of some shit about feeling the need to label preferences. buddy i don't think completely not being attracted to a gender is a "preference" but okay. (also has the vibe of "your orientation isn't actually that, you just have internalized phobia")
also "well i'm autistic too so this gives me the right to insult my perception of your tone (i apologized in advance bc i get told a lot i sound hostile when i'm not) [shits on tone indicators like they're not sometimes helpful to even neurotypicals]", "bi isn't an umbrella term" (when it very literally is, both in reality and by any incorrect definition that acknowledges even just one nonbinary gender)
and of course. "hey so this ideology you bought into is literally part of the radfem/terf indoctrination/recruitment shit, like. a shit ton of them have seriously publicly admitted that it was a step for them" "you sound like a fucking cunt (actual quote), i'm not being transphobic and how dare you just toss around those words. anyway all nonbinary people are inherently included in gay men's attraction, you're wrong about your own orientation, fuck you you're blocked. moving on! time to rb a post about how it's very important to educate yourself on transmisogynistic dogwhistles—"
i think i'm probably going to put the screenshots in a reblog to this post with their url partially censored? and go through each one individually because there are just.. so many problems, holy shit, and they're posting this shit publicly anyways so. i feel like they've lost their right to not getting reposted by a peer whose orientation they directly tried to redefine lmao
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ihatecispeople · 10 months ago
hi, some of you might have seen me reblog from hydro//jinn (remove slashes). i want to apologise to my trans female followers and mutuals for the increased risk of harm this brought them - this blog interact with and follows transmisogynists, including one blog (that i caught) which itself interact directly with the 4 letter acronym associated group. today i saw a reblogged dogwhistle for transmisogyny and bioessentialism, and scrolling through the blog i caught several more posts. my negligence was reckless and unnecessary. i have blocked this blog and recommend you to do the same. i will work towards the goal of this not happening again
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guardsbian · 10 months ago
god I have to be so careful what I say I feel like people are gonna misunderstand if I don't spell out every single thing I say
when I say "leftist Tumblr has a bizarre habit of stealing memes from 4chan" I mean that in the most literal sense possible. I'm not some secret bigot or Leftist Hater it's just. for some reason people repurpose bigoted shit uncritically and it sucks <3
because suddenly people have to be told things like a pepe meme that literally originated from 4chan is ableist. or that a nordic "chad" being the ideologically pure person in a meme... originated from the alt-right. or that certain normalized slurs hurt trans women because the cis men that "normalized" the humorous use of said slurs are, obviously, horrendously transmisogynistic
so you both get people who are SO fucking tired and angry from having to explain the obvious to people, and just explode as a result, and people that are so used to this normalized content in circles that they consider safe that they're almost entirely unable to look for dogwhistles or nuance, and/or who become fervently defensive over things they find funny being examined critically whatsoever
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marsfacts · 5 months ago
hello! feel free to ignore this message if you don't feel like educating someone lmao but i genuinely dont understand how that post is a terf dogwhistle....facing misogyny and sexualisation as a child was quite damaging to me at least and i think many girls went through some sort of a "not like the other girls" phase bc femininity is forced down girls' throats all the time
oh wow oops, this from a while ago but i’m gonna answer it cause i’ve thought about that post since then & i think generally a lot of people aren’t necessarily aware of how terf rhetoric operates and how to identify it
the post that i reblogged calling that post a terf dogwhistle described the op as specifically a crypto-terf which is really important in this context, because the way that crypto-terfs work is through posting and spreading terf-adjacent/compatible posts while maintaining the guise of plausible deniability
for the most part, they’re not going to post/spread anything explicitly transmisogynistic, instead making sweeping statements about “men” or “males”, which to people in the know, includes OR even refers specifically to trans women, which is why often these posts spill out of terf circles
terfs know that lgb (& honestly sometimes trans masc) folks are often not going to be immediately receptive to blatant transmisogyny, but by maintaining an internet presence which slowly filters in terf-sympathetic talking points, they can slowly plant the seeds that can eventually lead towards terf radicalization if you’ve aready fallen into terf-adjacent circles
the original post was about the trauma of approaching puberty as a [cis] woman, and moving from a relatively genderless existence as a child towards increasing sexualization & objectification
and like, obviously this experience is traumatic! i experienced it as a transmasculine person who presented very feminine for most of my teenage years, and had a very complicated relationship to sex and my sexuality from a young age, in no small part because of my perception of myself as a “woman”
these kinds of posts would not circulate if they didn’t resonate with people, and a sympathetic reading of the situation would be that a cis woman made a personal post about her own experience of girlhood/womanhood which got circulated too widely and taken out of context/was never meant to encompass every experience of womanhood (ex. trans womanhood, women of color who never got to experience an ungendered/desxualized childhood, etc etc). obviously no post could ever apply to every woman in the world
i think what made many people suspicious of the post was that it began with “being a girl and hitting puberty is so traumatic”, which like yeah, okay. true in a lot of ways, but a pretty sweeping blanket statement about girlhood. but okay, maybe she did just make a post for her personal blog where she didn’t think too hard about wording and meant to be reflecting on her own experience which plenty of other cis women resonate with. i’m honestly not even arguing that that post is inaccurate, or that she’s responsible for considering every fact of every woman’s experiences in one post
MY skepticism about that post comes from
a) the knowledge of how crypto-terfs utilize plausible deniability
b) the fact that the first time i saw that posts was on a self-identified terf’s blog when i was checking to see if a different post was posted by a terf (it was), and so i knew it was circulating in terf circles and related directly to ideas they have about womanhood
c) the op of the post screenshotting the tags of a bunch of transmasc people relating their own similar experiences from a trans perspective, which she captioned with something along the lines of “go to therapy”
that was mostly what rang alarms bells for me, since terf’s position on trans men tends to be that they’re women wrestling with internalized misogyny
yeah, there were people also making inappropriate assumptions that the op was a closeted trans man because of her discomfort of being objectified & sexualized as a woman, which like. is definitely not what that post was about and a form of projection and ignores the fact that being a woman in this world genuinely does suck in a lot of ways, BUT a lot of the tags she screenshotted were straight up just trans men/transmascs relaying their own experiences of dysphoria once reaching puberty which is like. when many trans people’s dysphoria intensifies or begins
so like yeah, cis women do have complicated relationships to gender, do have the right to talk about their experience and trauma as women, and on its surface that post isn’t a 100% indicator that the op is a terf, but there’s a broader context and i think it’s important to familiarize yourself with how terfs operate and recruit because otherwise you’re leaving yourself vulnerable to absorbing their ideas
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