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#petition for more murderous women in s2
enitsirk · 2 years
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Mary 🎨💖
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leianaberrie · 2 years
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I’m just thinking about this tweet from Plec. She basically used KC to generate buzz for Legacies. She hates KC and the fandom. but doesn’t it speak volumes how despite her dislike for the ship and fandom she can still “service” them for views and clout? But never did that with any of Bonnie ships? This is why when I see other fandoms like KC’ers say “plec hates them the most” i’m like where? Plec hates no ship or no fandom more than the ones involving Bonnie. She could give DE’rs a rainkiss cause they begged for it for years. She could give KC a one night stand and a cross over cause the fandom petition for it. But she couldn’t give this same “service” to any of Bonnie’s popular ships. She couldn’t put her dislike for Bonkai aside and milk its growing popularity on her dying show like she was able to do for KC. And this is why Plec is called racist.
I’m all for a show that doesn’t romanticize, encourage or support women being paired with toxic murderous men but when you have a show where this only applies to a Black character it doesn’t come across as some feminist stance, it comes across as “othering” Black women. And saying-without-saying-it that only white girls are special enough to have their princess moments.
Big bad murdering 1000 year old hybrid Klaus becomes a hopeless romantic around Caroline and Cami because they’re just oh so special pretty blonde women. Big bad murderous vampire Kol could become a romantic for the 16 year old white girl cause she’s oh so special. Had Kai stayed on tvd you can bet he would’ve suddenly become boyfriend material to some white witch/girl.
Even though I hate Damon and don’t ship him at all with Bonnie, I have no doubt if Bonnie was white we would’ve saw a hookup between Bonnie and Damon even if DE was still going to be endgame. We would’ve saw more scene between Bonnie and Klaus/Kol and Bonkai definitely would’ve had some sort of hookup. Even if Plec would’ve gave BK the KC treatment and ignore the ship till it was convenient for her to milk it for clout.
I don’t know if this was all Plec or if the network was also behind this anti-Bonnie agenda. But it’s gross and I will always be bitterly upset over what they did to Bonnie.
I think it's primarily Plec. While Kevin isn't woke by any definition (it was his idea to set the show's flashbacks in the Confederacy), he appeared to be someone who won't... waste a character or a potential relationship just because of prejudice. He will be insensitive to issues, but he won't go out of his way to sideline an important character out of pettiness. You only need to compare how Bonnie was portrayed in s2 versus s3. In s2, she had a romance with Jeremy, which had problematic elements but it existed. She interacted with all the members of the group, her feelings about helping vampires vs protecting the town from them was explored, etc. In s3, she's cheated on, and her relationship ends, she becomes almost entirely a plot device who only appears when it's plot relevant. She doesn't even get to speak about how she feels about what happened to Abby - that privilege is given to Caroline. Or compare how Tyler was written in s2, and how much praise and enthusiasm Kevin had for his storyline, to what happened in s3 and following.
At the same time, TheCW network was inherently racist at that time. (They've got better, or probably just smarter). TV tropes talks about it here: On a less pleasant note, the launch of this network was the death knell for African-American-cast sitcoms on network television for several years, as it removed UPN, the only broadcast network that was still committed to running those types of programming. So it was a case of like attracting like. Plec's writing was racist which fit TheCW's portfolio.
And it should go without saying, but I 100% agree with everything you said about Othering Black Women when the rules only ever apply to the ships they like or want.
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mana-liz · 3 years
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just some random TUA questions & thoughts
- Why doesn't the soundtrack contain any songs of MCR? too obvious to use?
- I need a whole spin-off which shows us Klaus’ time in vietnam (and somehow Dave survives that spin-off)
- Why are there so many fics with trans!Diego? Not that I don’t love those (I do love them) but I was wondering why most trans fics in the TUA fandom seem to be centered around Diego
- How is it that most of the time I completely forget that Reggie has been revealed as a freaking alien? I mean, how do you just forget something like that??
- Thanks to meta posts about abuse I’m now mostly over my initial dislike of Luther. He probably will never be a fav of mine, but I can’t believe that I just went with the superficial dislike/judgement when I watched s1 without considering his abuse and trauma. So yay for me for growing up some more.
- I’m confused by s1: why does Klaus suddenly have a coat when with Cha-Cha and Hazel? They kidnapped him when he was just in a towel. But then during the interrogation they have his coat with his drugs and his “special chocolate”. Where did that come from??
- i'm like living for descriptions of Five in the fandom that go like "pre-pubescent senior citizen", "big little bro", "58-year old teenager", "little (murder) gremlin".... those always make me laugh
- aye_of_newt's amazing verse From the Brink made me realise what I think the siblings are missing in the show (besides therapy): friends and I mean really just some people who aren't there as their love interests. If I remember correctly the only people who even remotely fill that role in the show are just.... the other cops Diego interacts with in s1 and Elliott? Ray and Klaus may also count since they didn’t know about their relation through Allison when they meet, but other than that? Thus my petition for s3: give them some friends
- Ben I love you but I get an aneurism every time I see you bend that book in s1e2
- I liked Lila more before she became a love interest for Diego. Like during the mental asylum scenes & the escape I totally liked her and the weird friendship she had with Diego, but then they charged up the sexual tension and I dunno why. maybe I wanted to see a sibling find a friend during the 60s instead of a love interest, maybe I'm a little bit salty that in s2 they totally forgot pPtch exists (regardless of her and Diego being no longer being lovers, she was still important to him and suddenly she’s forgotten?), maybe because I just felt like they rushed them "falling in love with each other" that I disliked (I think the other romances during the 60s were better written, if only because there was enough time (implied) that they had time to get to know each other and fall in love with each other. Like I dunno if they were "friends" during the whole stay of Diego but there was nothing romantic/sexual between them there and then just a few moments after they are at Elliott’s and bam there's sexual tension and talk of "love" urgh! Also Lila's relationship with the UA and her status as one of the 43 would be more interesting if her and Diego would have been just friends and there wasn't the need to "switch sides because they fell in love" and the "we're not actually related right?" situation made me gag
- Speaking of Diego, I hope he goes back to having short hair in s3. He just looks like a hobo to me... no offense, I just prefer the short hair.
- I also need a spin-off which focuses on Allison’s time in the 60s. the whole civil rights thing, more Ray, and Odessa! Odessa had so little screen time but she made a big impression on me. I’d love to learn more about her and the other women in her shop.
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remembertae · 7 years
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Crazy Ex-Girlfriend “When Will Josh and His Friend Leave Me Alone?”
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S2 E4 Nov. 11, 2016
WRITTEN BY: Erin Ehrlich SYNOPSIS Paralegal/mom Paula is unexpectedly pregnant and ready to drop out of the law school that recently accepted her. Husband Scott suggests she consider her "options", but Paula immediately rejects having an abortion. "I am a mother of two...Those options are for teenagers the month after winter formal." Scott then recommends Paula speak to her best friend and colleague Rebecca, who is younger and may understand her situation better. But knowing Rebecca's still reeling from two recent break-ups, Paula hesitates to confide in her pal.
The law firm where Paula and Rebecca work is representing Miss Douche, a company opening a new facility. Looking to rebrand herself in the wake of her humiliating break-ups, Rebecca obsessively campaigns to become Miss Douche's new spokeswoman. Since this creates a professional conflict of interest, she outsources her lawyerly duties to Paula. As a harried Paula labors over her presentation to a city planning board, Scott takes on more housework to prove they can manage a newborn and law school. But his disastrous attempts at cooking and childcare only solidify Paula's resolve to ditch her dream of becoming a lawyer. While Rebecca competes in the Miss Douche competition, nervous Paula presents her case to the city planning manager. He quickly figures out she isn't an actual attorney. But, she nevertheless impresses him with her thorough presentation. He grants her petition and recommends she pursue a career in law. We next see Paula lying in bed. Scott brings a cup of tea and encourages her to rest, then tells her he ordered a pizza for dinner in lieu of cooking. A doorbell rings and we hear teenage son Brendan yell, "Mom, I'll get it since you just had an abortion." But instead of being the pizza guy, it's Rebecca. She visits Paula in her room and asks about her calling in sick to work. Now past her obsession with becoming Miss Douche, a concerned Rebecca wonders what's been going on with Paula. Paula replies, "I had a thing. I figured it out. I'm just so happy to see you!" KEEPING IT REAL QUOTIENT The most common trope I've encountered in the 42 abortion episodes I've reviewed for this site is that, way more often than not, when a pregnant character considers termination someone in her world either judges her or tries talking her out of it. Usually this opposition comes in the form of an overzealous fetus father, but it could also be a child who longs for a baby sibling (see Dawson's Creek, The Facts of Life) or even a small-town physician who just can't bring himself to perform the procedure (Everwood). The point is, TV would have us believe that most women seeking abortion do not enjoy universal, non-judgmental support from the partners, family and friends in whom they confide. Exceptions to this rule include programs in which the pregnant woman was raped (Scandal, Miss Fisher's Murder Mysteries, Jessica Jones), Maude, and this episode. Just like Maude, Paula is an older mom, a woman who has assumed she is past her baby birthing years. In both cases, neither woman is subject to moralizing guilt trips from "concerned" loved ones. Each woman's husband is totally fine with their choosing to abort (and both men advocate for that choice once they realize it's what would make their mate happiest). And just like Maude, Paula's ambivalence toward abortion is completely internal and wholly based on stigma. She never speaks of ethical misgivings. Instead, she associates abortion with confused teenagers. I love this detail about Paula believing moms don't abort because it gets to the heart of another, grossly inaccurate TV trope - while most women who seek abortion on TV are childless, 59% of those who seek abortion in real life are moms. Paula is the norm, though she is convinced otherwise. I love that Scott so swiftly decides abortion is worth considering, despite their Catholicism. My favorite line from the episode is when he says, "There are options, you know. We just won't mention it to Father Brah, and he won't tell God." I suspect this is how many people of faith approach abortion when it suddenly appears as the best choice in a difficult situation. But I think it's easier for men to have that take-it-or-leave-it attitude toward abortion because it only matters to them when they've impregnated someone by accident. For sexually active, fertile, heterosexual adult women, the question, "What would I do if I got pregnant?" is always at the back of our minds. Many of us order our lives around the pursuit of either getting pregnant or having sex without conceiving. And when abortion becomes a serious option for those of us who don't want to have a baby, we then wonder how all the women in our lives would react (especially those who have struggled to get pregnant intentionally*). Given all that, it makes perfect sense to me that Paula doesn't tell Rebecca. When I was waiting to have my abortion, I found it way easier to confide in guy friends because I knew they wouldn't be openly judgmental. And while it seems unlikely Rebecca would ever judge Paula harshly for choosing to terminate, this specific sort of confidence would seem to throw off the balance of their dynamic in which Paula perennially mothers this much younger, very self-absorbed friend. And though it should go without saying, Paula's choice to abort makes perfect sense. She had no intention of expanding her family. Her well-established dream of becoming a lawyer cannot come to fruition if she chooses to have a baby. Plus she has the unquestioning support of her family. GRADE B+ Though it is refreshing to see a character choose abortion without facing judgment from loved ones, I do wish this story had been a bit more specific about the reasons behind Paula's ambivalence. Does she think abortion is immoral or does she think it's just plain tacky? Her comment about teenagers makes me think the latter is more the case, and that mindset is very true-to-life. I would love to see a show delve deeper into that sort of discussion about abortion stigma. * See Sex and the City and Bojack Horseman for interesting discussions on this topic - by Tara
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extraposts23 · 6 years
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Female fighter. Dont reblog.
It seems like an offense to women to not use their skills. For instance, Katrina Law has experience in dancing and has a black belt in Tae Kwon Do, Muay Tai and Krav Maga. She is capable of learning the fight choreography that they need her to do. Katie Cassidy has also proven herself capable of learning the fight choreography they have had her do.
The fights for women are hardly ever well choreographed and when they are they are always shown as being less brutal as the men. Why is it that only men are allowed to have brutal fights with Oliver/Green Arrow? Women can be just as brutal as men. Yet they show Nyssa as nothing more than a baton twirling ballerina. That is offensive. Edit: Another point by someone else.
Apparently, the idea of having a woman as a the main villain would then bring about the theory that it would turn into Oliver being a woman beater as if he has not beaten woman on the show before. Apparently, the idea that having a woman win or be the big bad would result in us thinking that Oliver is a woman beater? It's not always cut and dry plus if they had numerous female villains then you guys will complain he's a women beater.[these sentences are the same] But the fact that he has already defeated the various female bad guys; low-level women on the show does not count as him beating on women? How is it any different? And the fact that Oliver in the comics seemingly does not have female bad guys; big bads ( correct me if I’m wrong I believe he does and could have been used. Or used his low-level female bads as big bads in the show) is a reason to not have a female big bad in the show. As if the show has not stolen characters from Batman, so they cannot use some of other characters as big bads?
Thea – Was not a fighter, to begin with but yet after a few months with Merlyn is all the sudden a martial arts expert. Capable of taking on and very nearly besting Merlyn. She defeated Anarchy, who beat Oliver twice. Apparently, because she is the daughter of Merlyn and the sister of Oliver she is an MA expert or at least now portrayed as one. She even beat Oliver arguably, since he was attempting to teach her, lecture her. And she had Blood lust.
Shado - Was the daughter of Yao Fei who was a Martial arts expert. She was also an expert capable of wiping the floor with Slade. With no explanation of how she became that aside from that she is Yao Fei's daughter and that he taught her. But what happened to this badass female, martial arts fighter? She was killed off because we cannot have a woman, who was clearly the only one at Oliver's present day level, who can beat Oliver. Certainly not a woman. She was killed off to further some lame “choice” story arc for the supposed hero.
Dinah Laurel Lance– (One of the worst offenses of the show given who her character is supposed to be. She is Dinah Laurel Lance aka the Black Canary). One of the best fighters in the DC universe, but has been dumbed down and reduced in skill. I say that because she is supposed to be Black Canary. Oliver’s partner. Not talking about having to be a love interest. Talking about being his crime fighting partner and equal. That is the character. She was clearly shown to be able to fight in S1-2, capable of throwing a punch and taking down men with swift efficient moves but gets dumbed down to the point where she cannot even know how to do that anymore. To the point where she needs to learn how to throw a punch. Now it has been said that self-defense classes are not enough to be able to survive on the streets. Okay, but she was clearly adept enough to fight in self-defense in the first place. So instead of simply adding on to that skill she already had. Instead of having WildCat add to those skills, hone them and make her into the Martial Arts badass that she should be she gets reduced in skill. Supposedly they did it, took away that skill because they wanted it to look real. She gets reduced in skill to a weak woman who cannot fight at all. It has also been said that her body type the character and actress means that she should not be able to be that good.
For one thing Thea is just as petite and thin as her, and Thea was trained by Merlyn and Oliver; later on. Yet Thea is shown to use many badass moves and take down goons bigger than her but gets no crap for that. Secondly, Shado is also just as thin and petite. Shado wiped the floor with Slade; a man twice her size. She is also treated like she has no right to fight for her city. As if only Oliver is allowed to fight for the City. Then bitches to her that she needs more training. But refuses to actually train her!
Sara- Who has far more actual fight training than Oliver, nonstop training via the League of Assassins. As opposed to his ridiculous globe hopping non training. She who should be his equal (because of the way her fighting is portrayed, her training. Nothing to do with the who is the better Black Canary.) of not his better, can't be allowed to beat him. Even in the tie in comic 2.5, she beat him in a fight but that is never actually acknowledged on the show. She can beat Merlyn, after 2 extra years of training with Ra's Al Ghul himself. But cannot beat Oliver? The fact that she was mind controlled via the Dominators should have made Sara more dangerous, harder to defeat. In the crossover when she was mind controlled she logically should have been even more difficult to beat.
Cupid- She bested Oliver in season two, arguably, because she technically got him down and had him handcuffed to a train rail. But yet this is brushed off as he was holding back or he still won the fight. Even though she did beat him canonically. So if that is true.
If a former member of the Swat team can is allowed to beat Oliver but Nyssa; a lifetime member of the LOA, trained since birth cannot be allowed to beat him once? However, if it is not true that she beat him then it simply serves to prove that no woman has been allowed to beat the white male hero. (You don’t need parentheses only use them in a quote not to emphasize something same with uppercase.)
Huntress- Another in S1, possibly S2, that has sort of come close to being able to defeat Oliver. Or rather being on his level. But she was written off, and her skills yet again being brushed off as being emotional, or not thinking clearly or reckless. Also got treated like she has no idea what killing is, even though she went on a murder spree with both the triad and her father's family. But only Oliver knows what killing means because he has killed. As if the people he killed were more important, rather that he was killing it was more important.
China White- The only woman we have ever gotten closest to beating Oliver in a fight. Though technically tying him. She was also not allowed to beat him. Even though she clearly had some sort of natural skill.
Katana/Tatsu Yamishiro- To an extent. In Season 3 she was shown to be a badass swords woman. Also in the comics, she is an expert martial artist. But when it came time for the team to escape in S3 in Nanda Parbat, they reduced her to having to have Flash rescue her and then she simply walks away to disappear after killing her husband. They shoehorned her in the Flash rescuing the team in Nanda Parbat simply to have a small crossover that really served no purpose, it made zero sense for the reason that Flash is the fastest man alive and could deal with the entire situation in a few minutes if not seconds; Save the team, stop Ra's and stop the whole league. Plus the show has always prided itself on being grounded, and the fact that there was, in fact, a deleted scene of Katana escaping herself. Kicking the crap out of the League members and saving the team. A scene that would have made more sense given the grounded theme of the show and not have to have a shoehorned Flash scene. They reduced her to needing to be saved when she should have been able to escape herself.
Add link.
Nyssa Raatko Al Ghul - One of the two worst offenses in the show. A lesbian woman. A woman who has clearly been shown to have been training since she was a child. Trained by Ra's Al Ghul, her own admission in S3 episode 4. Trained to torture, however being the Heir to the Demon I really doubt that is the only thing her father taught her or even that he only had her train with one master/mentor.
In the Arrow dossier book that was released recently, it is stated that she trained Sara, so I would think that a lot of the moves that Sara knows Nyssa knows. But we have never seen that. Every time we have seen Nyssa fight it’s no more than a baton twirler. She has been regulated to nothing more than a baton twirling ballerina. Which could be construed as insulting to some women, because that is saying that women can not be that good, or rather that we can not be as good as men.
We have seen brutal fights between Oliver and the male villains but hardly ever between the women and him, most especially him and Nyssa. When she was introduced in S2 it was stated that her skills were supposed to be well matched to Oliver. Yet we never got to see that. She only landed maybe one or two punches and that was it. Yet when he fights the men it always lasts longer and is more brutal. She fended off both Merlyn and Oliver the two best fighters on the show at the same time. But this was brushed off as Oliver was holding back and not going in for the kill. She defeated Merlyn himself in S3 brushed off as everyone has done that, alone; a man that Oliver lost to twice. This was before Oliver was even trained by the League. Now granted the actual fight was a bit lame; bad choreography. However, it canonically happened. She defeated Merlyn and held off Oliver and Merlyn at the same time, and before Merlyn intervened she had the upper hand. but between S2 and 3 she cannot be allowed to beat Oliver once?
She even held her own in the male fight or group fight before she is literally dragged away to be the stand in Talia. Then in the latter half of season three, she gets beat by Oliver/Al Sah-him just so she can be used as a stand in Talia for the blatant Batman Bride/Son of the Demon story ripoff. What is even more horrible about the treatment of Nyssa and her fighting is that they have basically made it that women are weak and emotional and cannot win the fight because of that. Then to make matters worse Nyssa escapes a dungeon she herself admitted she got herself into. At least she can admit to and take the consequences, which is more than can be said of the white hero who walked away after S3 like he had done nothing wrong. then she goes to Oliver and asks her husband for help? All we hear throughout this episode is I cannot beat him and you cannot beat me and you cannot beat him. Nyssa is literally reduced to needing a big strong man/husband to fight for her. A woman is reduced to needing a big strong man to fight her battles for her. Disgusting and sexist. As if a woman cannot be allowed to defeat her own enemy. One she sparred with before and held her own against.
Now it was stated that she had been starved or malnourished in the cell. However, Nyssa herself was the one turning away the food. It is also stated that or explained that she could not defeat Merlyn because of the fact that he had been using the Lazarus Pit because it made him stronger. That doesn't match up with Oliver being able to defeat Ra's as he had been using the Pit for decades, nor should he have been able to defeat Merlyn for the same reason. Instead of letting a lesbian Asian woman( Just say Asian) fight and win her own battles, no we get the white male, husband, and hero taking over and fighting in the place of the weak woman. All for the sake of that he is the hero and too horribly parallel the season one rooftop fight between Merlyn and Oliver.
It was not even a fight Oliver hit him like once or twice and Merlyn went down. They ripped away Nyssa's agency for a crappy attempt at a season one fight rehash. Then after Nyssa becomes after this, instant friends with Oliver, a man who is responsible for the majority of what happened to her. A man who has never shown her any kind of respect.
Now if they are stating that Shado has that level of skill because she is Yao Fei's daughter, and Thea is supposedly that good because she is Oliver's sister and Merlyn's daughter. Then why not have Nyssa be that good since she is Ra's Al Ghul's daughter? Why can’t she be allowed to have that same natural skill? Again her personality and skills are brushed off as being reckless, naive, and with a lot to learn. Her defeat of Merlyn is also brushed off as it’s not that big of a deal since Thea did it, but the fact that Oliver sort of did it is, in fact, a big deal. It’s only a thing if Oliver does it but if a woman does then it’s nothing.
I would like to point out that both Nyssa and Laurel; two women who were considered emotional and reckless, were clear headed enough to see that Thea was not the one responsible for Sara's death. And neither took revenge on her, even though Oliver thought that both emotional women would. Laurel went after Merlyn, the one rightfully responsible, even though she couldn't beat him. Point being she went after the one truly to blame. All the while Oliver put his own personal issues in the way, his ego. When going to rescue a mass murderer, because he could not stand that someone beat him!
Her losses are also brushed off as she is not really a villain. when people are confronted with the fact that she is, in fact, the closest thing to a high-level female villain we have ever gotten. She may be a guest character but so was The Huntress and China White. They were the closest to being the ones to actually beat Oliver. I state this because it was season one and two and that was as close as a brutal fight as we have ever gotten with women. She is a guest star, but so is Merlyn, even in S1 regardless of the fact that he turned out to be the big bad. He was a guest star. All the characters are guest stars! Merlyn I believe it was is when a villain became a regular. Nyssa has been back plenty of times and could very well have been shown to have brutal fights.
Someone once said that it; “Would have been stupid for Oliver’s character to lose to Ra’s daughter” (If this is a direct quote then it needs a source if not then remove the parentheses and the quote doesn't fit with your paragraph. I think you mean something other than what you say. Since he was going to be the Batman stand in Heir to the Demon. Why? Ra’s did not care about Oliver until Nyssa came back to the LOA and told Ra’s that Oliver was protecting Merlyn. He may have been on Ra’s’ radar but in no way did he care. In season 2 Ra’s agenda was only for Sara to return. Since the LOA thought Merlyn was dead until Moria told them otherwise. Ra’s still did not care about Oliver until after the duel because of a prophecy that is utterly illogical. So how would Nyssa defeating Oliver in season 2 or once in the beginning half of season 3 where Ra’s never even cared about Oliver have been stupid?
Edit: Adding the fact that Arrow completely took away Nyssa’s agency in her return during season four. The fight that happened between Oliver and Merlyn should have been between Nyssa and Merlyn. For all the shit that The 100 got for killing off Lexa; the killing your gays trope. They did do one thing right, one thing that Arrow failed at. They gave Lexa agency in her fight with Roan. She specifically states; “I am commander and no one fights for me.”. (needs a source.) Knowing full well she might not be good enough and may die. The writers let her fight her own battle. Arrow went the sexist route and had Nyssa’s big strong husband step in to fight for his weak wife/woman. Making a woman look weak and unable to win her own battles.
All for the sake of that moronic attempt to parallel the season one fight between Oliver and Merlyn; and failing miserably at it. That even takes into account the fact that by letting Oliver fight for her Nyssa would not have really earned the title and probably no one would be loyal to her for that reason. Instead of giving Nyssa the ability to defeat Merlyn, the same natural skill that Oliver has, or even allowing her to have gotten better and then be able to fight and win against either of them. They went the sexist route and made her need a big strong man to help her.
Edit: new point brought by someone else. Apparently, Nyssa could not have been allowed to fight and win her own battles because Oliver is the hero. Apparently, allowing a woman fighter agency, allowing a woman to win for a change would do nothing for the show.
As if they the writers could not come up with a way to have Nyssa and Oliver team up against Merlyn or have Nyssa get The Lotus with Oliver. That it absolutely had to happen the way it did in the episode because it had to be Oliver the one to fight Merlyn and make Nyssa look weak. Apparently, her looking weak, her needing her big strong husband was needed, was necessary in order to keep Merlyn, an overused character around a bit longer.
A character that really serves no purpose throughout the rest of the show. Everything that he has told them could have been learned from Nyssa, a woman who grew up in the LOA. As if keeping Merlyn around for no reason other than the fact that he is played by John Barrowman is a nonsense reason that in no way furthers the story or Oliver. Because the character serves no purpose on the show anymore. He lost his purpose in season three. Edit: Also see the post on the fact that she is not actually Nyssa but in fact Talia.
Edit: ( might be repeating myself) It is stated that, by some fans who love Nyssa and by some who like her and agree that she should be more of a struggle for Oliver in a fight, that the reason that she has lost repeatedly is that she is grieving for Sara, or that she loves Sara so much that she was distracted by it in her in the episode. But can we not see her overcome that? Can we not see her return a better fighter and be able to keep emotions out of it? Because by using that as in excuse it plays into that women are simply emotional and cannot be good fighters because of it. Oliver actually states that in season four to Thea some lecture about men being better fighters being able to keep feelings out of it. Then later Thea is capable of doing so. So why can’t Laurel and Nyssa? Especially if their intent was to make Laurel into her comic counterpart who is a fantastic fighter.
Now Flash did what Arrow was utterly incapable of doing in regards to two villain fighters. They did it with gorillas! The Flash was not part of the actual fight at all. That proves that you can have two side characters fight and not have the main character involved in the fight. But Nyssa can’t be allowed to fight Merlyn and win because Oliver has to be involved.
Nyssa now recently was brought back to ( get this ) fight her sister. In S5 finale. She was actually allowed to fight her own battle ( perhaps a bone tossed at the fans who were upset that she was not allowed to fight her own battle in S4. However note that the person she is allowed to fight on her own is a woman. Also a off hand comment upon returning to the group in S5 when speaking to Merlyn that he “ would try” to cut her throat. But yet no actual fight allowed to happen to prove that off hand hinted comment.
Black Siren- Who in Flash was capable of defeating Flash. She had some martial arts skills. And her powers were extremely powerful and destructive. She is capable of leveling buildings and making ears bleed. It’s stated in Flash that had she kept it up she could have killed Flash. Yet in Arrow, her powers are reduced. Oliver and Felicity survive a close-up attack of her powers with no protection when earlier Curtis himself states that their ear protection is useless. In other words, there is no way that Oliver or Felicity should have survived that, or at least gotten away with no hearing loss. Where was the bleeding of the ears in Arrow? Then when the new Canary shows up? Dinah Drake ( not talking about her character only her powers), her cry is more powerful? They reduced Black Siren's powers in order to make The Arrow look good.
Talia Al Ghul- Now possibly the second worse  female character treated on this show. She is the older sister of Nyssa in this universe. She canonically ( said only, not shown) trained Oliver and the Season 6  villain Prometheus. Also trained by her father Ra's Al ghul . She should we would think be on level with Merlyn or even Oliver. But she was also nerfed in skill. None of these fighting skills she supposedly taught Oliver were ever portrayed. In fact the opposite. She was used for speech only. And the ONLY fight she was for a viewer bait sister fight. And a ridiculously horrible choreographed one at that. This supposed badass female fighter goes down in one or two hits. And that is legit the end of her fighting in the show as of her introduction.
Oliver- Was only trained by Slade for a few months between S1-2, Shado's words. Trained by Shado with the bow before she is killed off. Slade went insane. Yao Fei only taught Oliver that he needed to kill to survive on the island. Nothing more, because he was working ( unwillingly) with the bad guys for the majority of the season, then was killed off. Then Maseo never taught him anything because he was more concerned about keeping Oliver in line and protecting his family. Tatsu hated his guts and only taught him that breathing technique. This is all proven via S3 -4 and now S5 fights. Oliver has gotten his butt kicked by a martial arts guy in a market place in S3. Now if he was trained by Maseo then that guy would never had been an issue. Even Maseo repeatedly kicking the crap out of Oliver for attempting escape.
Had Oliver been extensively trained by Shado or Yao Fei then Maseo would never have been an issue. Then in S4 Oliver gets his ass handed to him by a petty drug dealer. Literally thrown off a building by said drug dealer. As bad as it was to Oliver die hards, it canonically happened. I.E he was not trained very well and if he was trained extensively then he is clearly not as good as people think. Then gets stabbed by Conklin in S4, defeats him but the guy was the same level as Oliver. and Oliver was wounded. Oliver only ever uses the same neck snap move over and over again as if that is the only move he knows. Then most importantly. In S5; the final year of Oliver's journey, Oliver is facing off against Russian thugs. Russian thugs who clearly have no martial skills that we have seen. These guys are literally just throwing nothing more than boxing punches, and lifting Oliver off the ground and slamming him on the ground like WWE people. Even Kovar ( the main flash back baddie.) is not even any kind of special fighter, he is a boxer. And he wiped the floor with Oliver; a man who was supposedly extensively trained by Yao fei, Shado, Slade and Maseo in fighting.
Now if Oliver was then these Russian guys, this Kovar would be nothing. A guy literally walked up behind Oliver and hit him over the head with a gun. Where were the heightened senses? He got gang beat by some Russian guys who did nothing but throw him to the ground and repeatedly kick him. Where was his extensive training then? Oliver walked into a trap in an alleyway and the same thing happened. They threw him up against a wall and then the ground and he got beat up. Where was the fight skill then? The supposed natural skill. Plus Sara, Oliver, Maseo, Merlyn, and Al Owal; all were given brutal, LOA style fighting that proves how great they are. Nyssa has not been given that courtesy.
And now they, the writers/EPs are bringing in Talia Al Ghul or should we say the real Nyssa since they have flipped the back stories. Further proof that they have used Nyssa as a stand in Talia. That they have simply made her Talia. To be Oliver's Flash Back Russian trainer. He will be trained by a former member of the LOA. A woman who is decades old and a warrior, clearly if they are having her train him to fight. So essentially Talia will have given Oliver LOA training, possibly, and he will have then lost to Merlyln later on in S1. Or possibly she will have only taught him some acrobatic moves since in S5 Prometheus used a flip that Oliver learned from Talia. In other words, they are scrambling to explain how Olivier became oh so good in the present since they have failed to explain that in the last 2 seasons.
Add more female characters if can think of any.
What is interesting is that Anarchy, a man beat Oliver twice. We have no idea where he got his skill from, his fighting. Now if we are talking about some people being better than others, having natural skill, then anarchy's defeat of Oliver should have never been questioned. It should have been accepted as someone having natural Skill and simply being better than the hero. However, it was fixed quickly. Why, because die-hard Oliver fans complained that this guy cannot be allowed to beat Oliver; a man who was trained by Ra's and the LOA, Oliver beat Ra's, Oliver has X amount of years of experience and training. Then the actor has a talk with the Eps and the next time we see the two together Oliver throws him into a wall or some such like Oliver is on steroids. This is interesting to me because the Stunt Coordinator James Bamford went so far as to state that some people are just better than others. I mean Anarchy's fighting could very well be construed as natural skill. It’s interesting that when it involves a man's fighting and losing, then if people complain then it’s adjusted and fixed because we cannot have a man/hero lose. But when it concerns a woman, then it is simply brushed off as she cannot possibly be that good. Or that she is simply not on that level.
I would like to point out that a few of these women have also faced off against Slades Mirakuru soldiers. It was not just Oliver that did that. Nyssa, Sara and arguably Laurel. In fact given Sara's LOA background she should have been able to hold her ground against Super Slade; in the lair when Oliver fights with her escrima sticks. Given that she has way more training than him.
The only ones on the show who have been canonically allowed to beat Oliver have always been men; Slade, Merlyn, Damien Darhk, Ra's and Prometheus.
S1 - Merlyn.
S2 - Slade Wilson.
S3 - Ra's Al Ghul. (For a unoriginal batman ripoff.)
S4 - Damien Darhk.
S5 - Prometheus.
Even the Flash. Though I would like to state that it is about time they acknowledged this fact. There is no way that Oliver would have defeated Flash. There were a few instances where Oliver would have lost both his arms in that first fight, dislocation or broken.
It was stated in the S5 crossover that Flash has in fact canonically beat Oliver. The following. Oliver Queen AkA Green Arrow has canonically lost to the Flash in a fight. He never once beat Flash. The first fight in the S3 crossover was a tie. The second fight when Oliver challenged him to see who would win, Oliver lost.
As per the S5 crossover bar scene. Legends episode 2x07   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCp82DaAfPg 
Oliver: “I’m just saying next time I’m going to get you.”
Barry: “I’m just saying I beat you twice.”
Oliver: “The first was a tie.”
Barry, while smirking : “ And the second?”
Oliver: “There were no witnesses.”
The closest thing we have ever gotten to a high-level female villain has been Nyssa. Being the daughter of the demon. But she was simply not allowed to be on their level because she is a woman and emotional. It is also worth noting that in S6 currently we have yet again a male big bad, a man by the name of Richard Dragon. All this after the Eps claim they were all for a female big bad and were planning one.
We could have had one or two female main Villains.
Nyssa is an obvious one; They could have actually adapted Nyssa’s comic storyline, leaving out the craziness. Hell Sara was dating the daughter of the demon, the heir they could have gone with that she was dating Ra’s herself. Instead of running from Ra’s and the LOA; leaving behind the daughter, it could have been Sara running from the girlfriend who was the leader. Actually made her more like her comic counterpart. Perhaps instead of ripping off and copying The Bride of the Demon storyline. They could have had Ra’s and Oliver team up against Nyssa since the writers were already adamant about ripping off Batman’s story or have Nyssa be the main big bad and only keep the allusion to Ra’s, have her be the second in command. Or last and even better have her be Ra’s like her comic counterpart, and Oliver had to face and defeat her, and kept the crazy bit and left out the part about her being a lesbian. (I only say that; her not being a lesbian in this situation, as a way to make her the bad guy without doing the crazy lesbian trope like they did on Battlestar Galactica.)
Talia that they are bringing in(Reword this and update it as the season has ended.), granted it’s possible that she will turn out to be the one behind or rather responsible for Prometheus, maybe manipulating whoever Prometheus really is into fighting Oliver, using X person’s rage. Maybe to get back at Oliver for Ra’s death. In which case it will be a rip off of The Dark Knight Rises.
There is also Shado they could have used instead of using her, a badass fighter, as a prop to fulfill some lame “choice” arc to then make Slade go crazy. All they had to do was leave out the “rape” part of her Arrow comic story.
China White a main bad guy.
Huntress a main bad guy. There are female villains, in Huntress situation, a comic anti hero perhaps, but a villain on the show. It could have been done but they refused to try.
Isabel Rochev (need more on her)
They could have used Slade’s daughter, the real ravager.
Actually made Waller a main threat. Imagine Oliver having to face off against the Wall as a main bad guy. Take everything they tried to do in the flashbacks with her and him and put it in the present. Added into that the stuff with her and him in the present. No woman has been allowed to defeat Oliver. Because the trend has always been women are weaker than men in fighting. It has also been stated that he has to win because he is the title character, or because he is the hero.
That is nonsense. Because Flash and Supergirl has also constantly lost fights to lesser level villains. It has nothing to do with being the title character. Even Daredevil on Netflix has lost to lesser/lower level villains or rather been bested for a time. He even lost a sparring match to Electra.
Supergirl lost to:
Voltrox.
Banshee.
She lost to the alien in the fight ring.
Sort of against Bizzaro.
Sort of to Indigo.
Alex if you think of her as the bad guy when she was controlled, and she wiped the floor with Supergirl in training and she is not the main.
Flash has lost to:
Cold and Heatwave. (When they tag teamed him)
Cold by himself.
Girder. (The steel guy.)
Cold, Heatwave, Weather Wizard, and Deathbolt. (When They tag teamed him.) All of those being low-level villains.
In conclusion, the writers have used women as fools and weaklings. Their inability to fight is either brushed off as them being not as good,  Not on the others level or not having natural skills (you don’t need parentheses). Or if a woman like Nyssa or China White gets close to beating Oliver it gets brushed off again as he was not trying or he was holding back or it was a fluke. In the case of Nyssa and even Laurel, its brushed off as simply a woman who is emotional. As if women cannot be as good as or better than a man because they are weaker and emotional. Which is the repeated trend on Arrow. Not to mention sexist. Further proof is that we have never been given a female villain, big bad female villain. We have never seen a woman be able to defeat Oliver and there be nothing he can do about it. Like with Ra's. Oliver lost to him twice, technically 3 times since that last battle was ridiculous since Oliver was on his knees and beaten, and only defeated Ra's by using the same trick that he used on him. Oliver admitted that he couldn't beat Ra's. But then with the power of love managed to use the same trick on him.
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