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itsoneofthemuses · 10 months

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Thank you for answering my ask and posting your thoughts! I can definitely provide some more questions. I was inspired by the response and I have lots more thoughts :D I wrote way too much so feel free to divide up the different sections and post it however you like and answer only what you want.

All those examples you wrote about are so great. I love to see characters who are sometimes led by their emotions and then they use their head afterwards. I think it also tells us a lot of what is important to Lucy and why she sometimes loses her cool a bit. And I love that Lucy can act immature at times, but that does not mean she is immature. That she can react with anger when people opposes her, but that does not mean she gets angry every time someone disagrees with her. This makes her a very relatable character who is interesting to follow.

I agree that Lucy seems to be all over the place in season 4. She agrees to be Tim’s aide and I know others have written about that as she needing stability after Jackson’s death and I can definitely understand that. It might also explain why her emotional state is less consistent and why she seems to be less connected to herself and a bit less engaged with the people around her. I think there was an opportunity here to show her grieving her friend and everything their friendship gave her. That could have been more of a storyline instead of just being subtext to her actions in that season. What would you have liked to see for Lucy in season 4?

What do you think was the purpose of introducing Chris? Were they trying to give them a similar set-up as Angela and Wesley and flirt through disagreements? She is never really shown talking with Chris. Like you say there are conversations were they both state how they have completely different views on something and it is not resolved or brought up again. I am disappointed it seems like she did not care more about what it meant being a relationship with someone who she did not actually seem to care about. Especially after her last relationship ended because she did not appear to care enough about them. If she stayed in the relationship because she did not want more conflict and hurt in her life (while grieving Jackson) why could not that have been an explanation instead of «Chris is so great»?

What did you think of the choices made in the trial-prep episode? I guess they were trying to show Lucy healing through moving forward and leaving her trauma behind her. However, that is not how trauma works in my experience and I think it was a disservice to Lucy to make it so clean cut.

Also what do you think of her professional development in season 4? I feel like in season 4 she does not seem to have the same curiosity for different types of policing (and no mention of undercover-work for her until 4.22). I think introspection is really what have been missing in the last seasons with a lot of the characters. It is almost like since that they are not rookies anymore, they do not have anything new to learn or do not make mistakes in their police work that can help them grow and be better. They also had some interesting discussions about things they would want to change so they could do their job better in the previous seasons. The last seasons have been very plot-driven and I understand that the show had to evolve and it is harder to include «learning lessons» when they are no longer students, but still. I want to see characters grown both personally and professionally.

One more thing is that I feel a bit selfish voicing these concerns. So many people worked hard on this show and people spend their free time writing fics so we can get great entertainment. I do not want it to seem like I am diminishing their work. Sometimes I guess it helps voicing things to accept it and appreciate the things that are still great about the show :) Also I would love to hear peoples different opinions on this. I have not rewatched season 4 a lot either because it is not my favorite so people who know it better might have great examples to prove me wrong :)

I am also ready to get into season 5 more, if you are up for more asks :)

Thank you for answering my ask and posting your thoughts! I can definitely provide some more questions. I was inspired by the response and I have lots more thoughts :D I wrote way too much so feel free to divide up the different sections and post it however you like and answer only what you want.

Well, shit, anon, you really let me have it! I am not complaining, by the way. You are forcing my to think and articulate my jumbled thoughts which is great… But take pity on me, because I’m truly not sure how well I get my point across when given license to ramble about fictional characters that I care about far too much.

All those examples you wrote about are so great. I love to see characters who are sometimes led by their emotions and then they use their head afterwards. I think it also tells us a lot of what is important to Lucy and why she sometimes loses her cool a bit. And I love that Lucy can act immature at times, but that does not mean she is immature. That she can react with anger when people opposes her, but that does not mean she gets angry every time someone disagrees with her. This makes her a very relatable character who is interesting to follow.

I am glad you found something worthwhile in the two previous ask/answer! I think Lucy is eminently relatable, especially in S1 and S2, where (as a rookie) we get to learn so much about her and see her in a new environment, at a new job, and beginning this big new part of her life - so many people can understand being new to a job, trying to juggle friends and romantic relationships, family problems, while navigating adulthood. Angela, for all that she’s a bit of a mess, has been on the job for a decade. I don’t think Talia ever got a fair shake in terms of storylines. Tim is a great character in those early days, but I wouldn’t necessarily call him or Nolan relatable. And Jackson (RIP, you were the MVP all along) might be less relatable just because he was finding his way as a nepo baby dude.

I agree that Lucy seems to be all over the place in season 4. She agrees to be Tim’s aide and I know others have written about that as she needing stability after Jackson’s death and I can definitely understand that. It might also explain why her emotional state is less consistent and why she seems to be less connected to herself and a bit less engaged with the people around her. I think there was an opportunity here to show her grieving her friend and everything their friendship gave her. That could have been more of a storyline instead of just being subtext to her actions in that season. What would you have liked to see for Lucy in season 4?

Look, early on in S4, I was willing to cut the show a lot of slack. They had abruptly and unexpectedly lost a main cast member, they were still filming under pandemic conditions, and at some point during that season, they got the news that they were going to try introducing a spinoff. I was one of the people thinking that Lucy becoming Tim’s aide would be a soft reset and let them work together more like partners and deepen their bond while maintaining status quo until they could more calmly and clearly plan out the next arc. By mid-season, it felt like that was a pipe dream I once had. My problem with subtext in a show like The Rookie is that it is so open to interpretation that you may well be right - she’s subtly grieving, she’s isolated and withdrawn from friends (because, let’s face it, she has none in S4)... But that’s rarely, if ever, made clear. You could be right… Or you could be totally wrong. At some point, subtlety becomes ineffective if nobody understands what or why things are happening.

In S4, honestly, I would’ve liked to see Lucy dealing with her grief and taking risks - not ones that are stupid, but dangerous nonetheless. Angela is having a baby, so is Nyla (by the end), Nolan has ostensibly found love… Let Lucy feel the weight of being alone and grapple with taking on UC work (which they introduced and then basically dropped for most of S4?) while she’s barely trained. Let that same conversation that happened in S3 between Tim and Lucy and Nyla come up and let that be the conflict between Tim and Lucy in S3. His feelings about UC are clearly related to Isabel but his concern for Lucy is two-fold: she’s barely out of long sleeves and she’s taken hit after hit and had to keep going. Tim knows exactly what that’s like. And it doesn’t have to be Tim being over-protective or senior officer, this is hard won knowledge, just like when he told Lucy her scars made her a survivor.

That’s just one of many routes. I would have eliminated Chris and Ashley entirely, or used them very differently. Not even as a shipper but I honestly think they contributed nothing to S4 - they weren’t used for jealousy, they didn’t cause conflict, neither couple had particular chemistry. They were just… There.

What do you think was the purpose of introducing Chris? Were they trying to give them a similar set-up as Angela and Wesley and flirt through disagreements? She is never really shown talking with Chris. Like you say there are conversations were they both state how they have completely different views on something and it is not resolved or brought up again. I am disappointed it seems like she did not care more about what it meant being a relationship with someone who she did not actually seem to care about. Especially after her last relationship ended because she did not appear to care enough about them. If she stayed in the relationship because she did not want more conflict and hurt in her life (while grieving Jackson) why could not that have been an explanation instead of «Chris is so great»?

You know, I’ve discussed to death with many people what the purpose of Chris was. I haven’t actually come up with a good explanation because his introduction felt inorganic and, even worse, the set up of his relationship with Lucy was so poorly executed that I think they shot him in the foot right from the get-go. I do think they were trying to sprinkle a little of the “Angela and Wesley” flavour, as if all lawyers are naturally argumentative about everything. But, in my personal opinion, it didn’t work. It’s definitely annoying that Lucy seems to get into relationships she doesn’t care about (but I am convinced that what happened with Emmett only happened because the actor became unavailable).

I have settled on the idea that Chris and Ashley were, essentially, introduced to explain why Lucy and Tim couldn’t be together. “Of course they can’t date, they’re both in relationships, silly!” I literally see no other purpose to them - neither illuminated anything new about Lucy or Tim, respectively, and neither ended up sticking around so 🤷🏽‍♀️

What did you think of the choices made in the trial-prep episode? I guess they were trying to show Lucy healing through moving forward and leaving her trauma behind her. However, that is not how trauma works in my experience and I think it was a disservice to Lucy to make it so clean cut.

Oh, that was weird. That whole episode. Firstly, I have no idea why Tamara was there. She is Lucy’s teenage orphaned roommate so of course, she is Lucy’s sole emotional support! It was completely ridiculous and unprofessional that Chris would be working on Lucy’s prep and he should have recused himself. Apparently everyone in the office has seen the video so like… Why couldn’t one of the other junior ADAs have prepped her? If, for some dumb reason, they absolutely did not want Tim being there even though he was personally involved, why not have Angela support her? She suffered a similar trauma, she’s a woman, and she was there. Was she still on mat leave? No idea, I refuse to rewatch S4 so details are fuzzy. Or have Nyla be her support - she has been hurt, she’s served in a mentor role for Lucy, she was there.

Let’s move on from that. The episode actually starts off promisingly in some ways because we see Lucy struggling. It’s confirmation that this is a trauma she continues to struggle with (in The Rookie’s fucked up timeline, it has been maybe a year since Caleb happened, I think?). And then Chris hums the song, Lucy reacts strongly, Tamara is (as one might expect of a teenage roommate) locked out along with Chris the trauma-triggering boyfriend, and then Lucy emerges, on her own, and demands to see the video. Chris, who got a verbal lashing from Lucy in his introductory episode and apparently lost all backbone immediately after, caves (although I tend to agree that this was her experience and she was entitled to see the video on her own terms) and then Lucy just shrugs it off and goes to Chris’ for dinner.

Sure, okay. How does a day that starts out with Lucy appearing to experience disassociation, flashbacks, and PTSD symptoms end with her laughing with someone who triggered her again later in the day? Look, I’m not suggesting that people can’t process trauma, mental health, or their emotions/triggers however they want. In real life, people are complex and varied and resilient and unique. On TV where there is less time and space to explore those nuances, it very much looked to me like Lucy was casual and carefree by the end of the episode rather than emotionally exhausted and repeatedly subjected to extreme stressors regarding her trauma. But what do I know? Maybe the “subtext” is that Lucy is extraordinarily strong and can walk it off no problem because that’s what heroes do.

(in ending, I did not think much of the choices in that episode)

Also what do you think of her professional development in season 4? I feel like in season 4 she does not seem to have the same curiosity for different types of policing (and no mention of undercover-work for her until 4.22). I think introspection is really what have been missing in the last seasons with a lot of the characters. It is almost like since that they are not rookies anymore, they do not have anything new to learn or do not make mistakes in their police work that can help them grow and be better. They also had some interesting discussions about things they would want to change so they could do their job better in the previous seasons. The last seasons have been very plot-driven and I understand that the show had to evolve and it is harder to include «learning lessons» when they are no longer students, but still. I want to see characters grown both personally and professionally.

Woo, boy, did Lucy have professional development in S4? I don’t think she did. She was Tim’s aide and, as pointed out in the episode with Nyla’s wedding, she gets no credit for the arrests even if she played an instrumental role. I’m not actually sure how being sergeant’s aide is such a big deal when that’s the case. I would also like to point out that I’m not actually sure what Tim did as a sergeant. He was supposed to respond to high risk calls and be available as a supervisor on scene but, and maybe I’m remembering wrong, for most of S4, him and Lucy respond to regular ol’ whatever calls when there wasn’t something huge and ridiculous already happening in the episode.

I agree that none of the characters appear to have any self-awareness or display any particular insight or growth in S4. Nolan’s college classes and the professor who taught about racism and policing basically disappeared without a mention and they just stop talking about issues in policing entirely. The Rookie seemed to choose a cause, or whatever you want to call it, each season (racism in policing for S3) and they pivoted to… Women’s fertility in S4? Except their focus was egg freezing??? They talked about Black maternal health in a previous season and that was SO. MUCH. BETTER. I know a lot of people who have explored fertility options, mostly for the purpose of IVF admittedly, and it is an expensive, painful, and challenging choice to make. They didn’t discuss any of that. So overall, I would call it a fail, personally. Nevermind that Lucy’s dusty eggs and her concern with her mother crossing boundaries was basically ignored forever after.

I get that not being rookies anymore changed the dynamics, direction, and plot structure of the show. But I think there are ways to continue to grow and develop the characters and explore issues within policing that they did in previous seasons. Angela talked endlessly in S4 (in fact, I think that was her whole arc) about breast milk and being a mom. Why not encounter obstacles her rich husband couldn’t solve for her like the guilt of being a working mom? The danger involved in being a police officer and a parent? What about the discrimination around promotions when you’re a woman, of colour, and a mother (mat leave often means setbacks and missing opportunities)?

One more thing is that I feel a bit selfish voicing these concerns. So many people worked hard on this show and people spend their free time writing fics so we can get great entertainment. I do not want it to seem like I am diminishing their work. Sometimes I guess it helps voicing things to accept it and appreciate the things that are still great about the show :) Also I would love to hear peoples different opinions on this. I have not rewatched season 4 a lot either because it is not my favorite so people who know it better might have great examples to prove me wrong :)

I don’t think it’s selfish to voice these concerns or to discuss ways the show didn’t work well and ways it could work better. I don’t know, honestly, how things work behind the scenes on The Rookie. I don’t know what their writer’s room looks like, I don’t know how or when they break the season, I don’t know who contributes ideas and writing and direction, I don’t know how much control the show runner exerts, etc., etc. But there are a lot of things that, for me, didn’t work in S4. I don’t @ the writers, show runners, actors, or anyone involved in the show (I believe in strong, firm, clear boundaries between fandom and the actual production) regarding fanfic, ideas, etc. Occasionally, when I livetweet, I might tag someone in a positive comment, but that’s the extent of my involvement with the real people who are working on this show. In fandom spaces, I think discussion, criticism, and honest, respectful engagement are signs of investment in the show and characters which is a pretty big compliment.

If I didn’t love this dumb show (or the first three seasons, anyway), I wouldn’t still be here after all.