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clonehub · 1 month

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Making a separate post for this post:

From the top down, command clones handle the punishment and oversight necessary to maintain unit/battalion cohesion. Their authority means their praise and critiques weigh more in general than that coming from a lower ranked clone (doesn't mean that your buddy calling you a good soldier is totally useless, obviously).

They can mandate interventions and reconciliations, and they approve/deny transfer requests. Command clones are just as much a brother of the battalion as every other clone, but in the way that a parent is part of a family.

Command clones also lead many of the chants, marching, mourning, and victory songs clones sing before, during, and after battle. Morale starts with the commanders the same way (most) orders start with them.

In this sense, they're keepers of the culture and cohesion because they lead the battalions. There's a general (unspoken) guideline about the standard practices of a clone battalion, and each commander might have their own take on it. The ones who win a lot will sing more victory and march songs. Battalions focused more on relief might sing less mourning songs. Some might follow the commander's lead/lack thereof regarding interacting with civilians.

The medics take a fundamentally similar position to the commanders in regards to keepers of the culture. However, in many ways theirs is a more narrowly-focused, intimate series of interactions due to the nature of their job. Medics are the first witnesses of death, culturally. They can determine who lives or dies, and they have to do so with a keen sense of practicality and impartiality. They have to be level headed, fast, and efficient the same way a command clone must be.

But also, the medics are sworn to secrecy (another unspoken understanding of their job). They hear the ramblings of delirious, injured, semi-conscious, and sleep-walking clones. Troopers confess fears to their squads and then their medics, if need be. Even if a clone doesn't explicitly say what's bothering them, it can be inferred: jitteriness, seeking pain medication for long-healed injuries, seeking sleep aids, avoiding certain qusetions about certain injuries, etc.

So medics maintain cohesion on a more physical, but also more emotional level than command clones. Both roles are equally important! But they're different. Clones will go to their squadmates, their sergeants, and the medic before they resort to a command clone, who necessarily has to take a formal and more clinical (for lack of a better word) approach to conflict resolution since they need to keep everyone in line.

#ch posts #captain rex #star wars #fives #the clone wars #all the bros #commander cody #medic kix #tcw #swtcw #meta #tcw meta #headcanon #idk somethingggg about the necessarily different but fundamentally similar positions medics and CCs have #so much control over life and death..................

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coline7373 · 1 year

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When I say I dislike Anakin and Anakin/Padme...

You know what crept me out?

In Hostage Crisis of The Clone Wars, Anakin is chilling in Padme's office. He's supposed to be on a spiritual retreat but he prefers to try to convince her to go on a vacation with him.

First, no respect for her work. He's on a vacation. She's not.

Also, no respect for the importance of what she's actually doing. Which, knowing her, is probably saving people's lives. But that's less important than Anakin's vacation?

Second, no respect for his own mental health. Unless, of course, war and death by the millions is a fun time for him and not something he need to meditate over.

And third, he tries to convince her that if she really love him, she will goes along with that he wants (waaaaaaat) because, and I quote:

"Nothing is more important to me than my feelings for you."

I thought, for sure, when he started his phrase, he was going to say "nothing is more important to me than you". Which... clunky, but -okay.

But no.

"... my feelings..."

It's not Padme who matters.

It's Anakin's feelings for Padme.

(Which is so self-centered, self-serving, which resumes Anakin's motivation as a character sickeningly, which is Sith.)

If that doesn't tell you how wrong their romance is, I deeply encourage you to document yourself on what a healthy relationship looks like, because you may need it.

It's not romance.

It's poison.

#anakin skywalker #padme admidala #i watched this two weeks ago and i still think about it #how unhealthy #how creepy #what a horrible thing to say #star wars #star wars meta #the clone wars #tcw meta #the clone wars meta #anti anakin #salty hour #omg #like #how people are not screaming about this scene #its sickening

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hypersped · 7 months

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I honestly beleive that arla fett or some other ancient fett had blonde hair and its a recessive gene. When you make enough sentients from the same generic code you're bound to let recessive genes shine through, like blonde hair. Clones can have naturally blonde hair, but its rare. REX is a NATURAL BLOND

#tcw meta #tcw #rex #captain rex #clone trooper rex #clones #star wars the clone wars #sw #star wars #hes not a bottle blonde!!!#sw tcw #textpost #hcs #arla fett

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wantonlywindswept · 11 months

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so all of the fic where the GAR and Coruscant Guard don't get along because the GAR thinks Coruscant is a cushy gig and the Guard are in Literal Hell are

so fucking chefkiss

like it is a trope i will DEVOUR, i will unhinge my jaw and swallow that shit whole

but

what about an inverse?

what about a Guard that's the protecting soldier meme except real?

troopers on leave on Coruscant finally feel like they can relax from the war because they know the Guard has their back, and everyone knows that if you need a hand or an ear or a hug you can ask any Guard* and they are always the most patient helpful big brother types ever, they will listen and they will help and they will protecc

(*sole exception: fox**, who shoulders all of the pain and rage and condenses it into a tiny supernova of fury in his chest that he shoves down into a locked box of emotions, and one day he'll die

**except also very much including fox, who rages and rails and might throttle you for being an idiot but he'll also absolutely gut any aggressive natborn that even breathes in your direction)

so they still might think that Coruscant's a cakewalk compared to the frontlines but they're glad that they have brothers protecting the homefront too, they're glad that at least SOME of them can stay gentle and kind and at peace

of course then palpatine and the sith and all the corruption in the senate are exposed

(because TCW canon is for COWARDS and people who like being SAD)

and the GAR realizes all the shit that the Corries went through, all the ostracization and threats and abuse and pain

and it just

made them kind

#tcw #tcw meta #coruscant guard #commander fox #things i need to know:#is 'natborn' canon or fanon #and is calling the guard 'corries' canon or fanon #no i haven't finished watching the series yet #it is a STRUGGLE okay #tho i have switched to watching it chronologically #which makes the experience like 45% less infuriating #maybe 35%#the next in the list is a jar jar episode and i've been putting it off for a week #liz's tcw watch order: depends on how much i want to grind my teeth that day #but i did get to see baby domino squad and that was gr8 #99 deserves better 2k23

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coruscantguard · 1 year

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In Medstar II, Jedi Healer, the book opens with the following scene:

This is a memory Barriss is having of a prior mission, and it's a scene I can't get out of my head. Why? Well, first cause it's an amazing scene, and I love Barriss Offee so much, but second because I can't help but contrast it to her actions in "Brain Invaders"

Now, let's be real. OOC, her actions are absolutely because the writers didn't think that hard about it, and they wanted a cool parallel to Order 66. But I'm more interested in looking at this through an in-character perspective here. Specifically, how much her actions in "Brain Invaders" must have haunted her later.

See, that passage from Jedi Healer is essentially proof that Barriss normally would be expected not to kill Lt. Trap. And that's something I think Barriss would have been all too aware of after the whole Ord Cestus mission wrapped up.

Her actions here make sense. I doubt anyone would truly fault her for what happened here— again, Lt. Trap did pull a blaster on her, and he's absolutely got the size advantage in that fight as well. It makes sense that she did what she did, especially when you consider the fact that she's been fighting in a war.

But would Barriss blame herself? Personally, I think so. After all, she'd know very well that she could've done better. She'd know that this didn't have to end how it did. And— if we're bringing The Wrong Jedi into this— it wouldn't surprise me if canon Barriss ended up resenting the people around her for not blaming her as well.

(She killed one of Ahsoka's men— someone who Ahsoka said was a friend! She panicked, and instead of using the Force to push Trap off her, she used it to grab her lightsaber and gut him! Why is everyone acting like she didn't do anything wrong?)

(Yes, I am absolutely fucking grasping at straws right now for my post order 66 Barriss fic, I know that, shushhhhhh. Trying to make canon actually work is DIFFICULT OKAY. CANON IS COMPLETE AND TOTAL BULLSHIT. BARRISS DESERVED BETTER.)

#barriss offee #lieutenant trap #the clone wars #tcw #tcw meta #medstar ii: jedi healer #nat rambles #my meta

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battlekilt · 1 year

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I'm sorry, but for the most part, a lot of what the Kaminoans told Obi-Wan and others about the Clones...

Sounds like the scripted company-line we are taught in retail or when we are there to reassure a customer that the product they commissioned meets these unrealistic expectations.

Which when taken into the claim that Clones are somehow perfectly docile and completely obedient because of some genetic breeding is just... talking up the skills of their scientist. Human behavior isn't that easy to modify through genetics, not without careful observation, and expectation that alterations MIGHT be seen in the next, subsequent generation.

I wonder if for a moment Obi-Wan listened to Taun We try to tell him that these men, who came from a Mandalorian bounty hunter, were docile and completely obedient and thought, "Yeah, and I'm a Nautolan. Sure Jan." (Which, I immediately see Taun We blinked at him and saying, "My name is not... 'Jan'.")

But, this is where it actually gets darker to me than I see the line others follow:

When Rex says that they Clones are made to withstand everything... it sounds like a man who is reciting the company script, but has fooled himself into believing it. Why? I imagine it is because he needs to. He is holding himself, his brothers, his men—all of it together by a thread, and he needs to believe that he can handle everything.

#kilt's clonely meta #gffa meta #tcw meta #clone meta #kilt's writing #bucket's gffa meta #bucket's writing

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greetings-humans · 10 months

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everybody kept telling me

"dee, tcw starts as a kid's show but ends up as a war drama"

AND I DID NOT QUITE BELIEVE IT

I thought, well good, awesome, it'll be more realistic,

it'll be interesting, thought poor naive me.

I watched point rain yesterday (the second battle in geonosis, the one with ki adi and obi wan and anakin) and.

THAT WAS LITERALLY WAR???? at some point I literally felt like I was watching a war movie??? it sounded so much like war movies???

or that time when this clone said that it's a good thing the bugs can't aim but then they got him and his squad and THEY EXPLODED ON SCREEN???

ever since then I've been watching clones' dead bodies just,,, stay on screen. like.

*war drama intensifies*

#tcw #the clone wars #i know I'm late to the clone wars craze but some of us only got into star wars quite recently-#tcw meta #deelay words

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bbygirl-obi · 8 months

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What are your thoughts on the clones being child soldiers. Aren't most of them like 10 or so?

oh i totally get why people would have that interpretation. i don't think canon has said anything specific, so we don't know for sure.

but i personally think about the clones the same way i think about grogu from the mandalorian. grogu is from a species with a much longer lifespan than most humans, and he ages more slowly. so even though he's 50 years old, i don't think of him as having the same mental capacity of a 50-year-old adult human. i think the vast majority of the fandom agrees with me on this.

the clones are this same situation, but in reverse. their lifespan is shorter than the average human, and they age faster than the average human. i know they're cloned from a human, which is why i totally get if people don't think that way, but that's how i think about it. like, they have fully developed frontal lobes at their age, which your typical human 10-year-old does not.

the ethics of them being designed with this shorter lifespan are another matter, but at the end of the day: a 10-year-old clone, 10-year-old human, and 10-year-old grogu are all at vastly different stages of their life and should not be treated as if they were the same age physically or mentally.

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maemil · 1 year

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One thing I do find very interesting about both of said Barriss episodes (s2 e6&8) is the way they both kind of focus on attachments. In Weapons Factory when it seems like Ahsoka and Barriss are lost, Luminara is immediately ready to move on/let go, and Anakin is insistent that they keep searching. Then in Brain Invaders, Ahsoka chooses not to kill Barriss, even at her request.

Interestingly, both times the person being influenced by their attachments was right. Ahsoka and Barriss were still able to be helped, Barriss wasn't unsaveable. I don't know if it was an intentional choice to exhibit examples of why Anakin would keep choosing to ignore attachment rules, but it was interesting.

(Of course, in the very same episode Ahsoka refuses to kill Barriss, Anakin is force choking some guy for information because he's so worried about Ahsoka. So like... shock of shocks he's not doing great with it)

#my brother was very annoyed by how quickly luminara gave up on her padawan #im willing to cut the character some slack and put it some on writing instead #like it was rushed but theyre also only 20 minute episodes #imo if they had searched for a while and found nothing. with luminara pointing out they have a duty to continue on because staying here #searching futilely will potentially put them/their position/the war at risk #and anakin just unable to accept it no matter the genuine downsides to continuing to look (and inevitably being correct to keep going)#it would work fine as an ideological conflict between the 2 of them that doesnt paint luminara as so cold she wont even take a *sec* to loo #sw clone wars #tcw rewatch #tcw meta #the clone wars #clone wars

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adh-d2 · 13 days

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No but it's...

the way they naturally fall into eachother's roles when the other isn't there.

the instinctual head-tilt when Crosshair stabilized his rifle on Tech's shoulder, as if they'd done it a thousand times before.

It's the fact that Tech clearly told Phee all about his brother.

It's the sad, fond smile on Crosshair's face when Omega said Tech made her memorize all the plans ("of course he did").

It's the way Tech knew exactly where to look for that mirror.

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rights-for-redshirts · 2 years

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*gets back into star wars*

*attempts to engage critically with the material so I can make sure to be mindful of the sure-to-be-existing issues and the pain they cause people*

*gets hit with the "they did not think this or its implications through" to "god I HOPE they did not think this or its implications through" scale*

*stares at wall*

#sw #star wars #tcw #tcw meta

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wantonlywindswept · 7 months

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workshopping clone selkies

Hmmm, how do we think a selkie au might work for the clones?

I don't think I'd want them to all be one thing, animal forms are different according to personality or w/e, but from a 'we are making these people into soldiers' cloning a selkie would not necessarily make sense? Like that's a huge weak spot right there.

Maybe the Kaminoans just took the skins from the start? Mean route would be to destroy them, but maybe they just have silos or warehouses full of animal skins. Some of them are really unique or rare - it's just good recycling to sell off the skins of clones who die.

Or maybe they carry their skins with them, there's a compartment in their armor/kit to put them in. Maybe they leave them on the ships while they go to battle? Maybe the skins are a huge secret and the clones go to great lengths to keep the knowledge from their commanding officers. A more gentle version of the Kaminoans having them - maybe the Jedi are in charge of their clones' skins, and there are halls in the Temple where they're carefully and reverently kept safe.

Is this just a blatant excuse for Palpatine to have a beautiful vulptex skin hanging in his office that he encourages all of his visitors to admire but for some reason makes all of the Coruscant Guard clones stiff and uncomfortable and one time when Plo Koon has the misfortune of having to meet with the Chancellor he's extremely surprised when Commander Wolffe sees the skin and goes absolutely fucking feral?

...MAYBE SO.

#tcw #tcw meta #clone troopers #commander fox #commander wolffe #there was some beautiful fanart of those two I meant to reblog but lost track of with them and their respective animals #all of the baby cadets: choose/are given names that have no relation to their pelts to keep something of themselves secret #fox and wolffe: lol #anyway if people have ideas i would love to hear em!#selkie clones would be a terrible idea but by god i wanna see it anyway

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david-talks-sw · 8 months

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Debunking more myths in the GFFA: the Jedi and the clones.

I wrote a post debunking the various myths about how "the Jedi condone slavery", a while ago. Something I had omitted (because it's such a big topic) was the following two statements that concern the clone troopers' relations with the Jedi:

"The clones were genetically bred to have accelerated growth, so they're technically child soldiers."

"The clones were slaves of the Jedi."

Both the above statements are inaccurate, let's explore why.

"The clones were child soldiers"

Let's get the easy one out of the way first, because it's a logic that cuts both ways. If age is our only determination of the maturity of a Star Wars character, then Grogu is not a baby. He is aged 50, and is thus a middle-aged man.

Who cruelly eats the babies of a woman...

... and knowingly tortures animals for his own sadistic pleasure.

Of course, I'm kidding. Grogu's none of the above things.

The narrative frames him as a cute baby who does innocent baby stuff. Him eating the eggs is played off as comedic, as is him lifting with the frog. To this day, some fans still call him "Baby Yoda".

Conversely, despite the clones being 10/14-years-old, their actions, behaviors, way of thinking, sense of humor, morals etc, are all those of an adult.

Like, Ahsoka is technically older than Rex in this scene.

The scene doesn't portray them as peers, though. This isn't written as "a teen and a tween talking". No, Rex looks, acts and behaves like a grown-up and is thus framed as such by the narrative.

You can make the argument "they're child soldiers", but (unless you're doing so in bad faith) you'd also have to argue that "Grogu's an adult".

"The clones were the Jedi's slaves"

Nope. For all intents and purposes, they're in the same boat as the Jedi, who George Lucas stated multiple times had been drafted to fight in the war.

Again: both the Jedi (monk/diplomats untrained for fighting on a battlefield) and clones (literally bred en masse only to fight) are being forced to fight by Palpatine and the Senate.

Though, on paper, the clones were commissioned by Jedi Master Sifo-Dyas, it was actually done by the Sith (who either manipulated or assassinated Sifo-Dyas then stole his identity, depending on the continuity you choose to adhere to). The rest of the Jedi had no idea these clones were being created.

So while the clones are slaves... they're not owned by the Jedi.

They're the army of the Republic, they belong to the Senate. This isn't exactly a scoop, they refer to the clones as something to purchase...

... and manufacture.

As far as the Senate’s concerned, clones are property, like droids.

Like there's a whole subplot in The Bad Batch about this very point: after the war, the clones are decommissioned and left out to dry because they literally have no rights, they served their purpose.

The only trooper to ever canonically blame the Jedi for the clones' enslavement is Slick, who the narrative frames as having been bribed and manipulated by Asajj Ventress into betraying his comrades.

Also, the only canonical Jedi shown to ever be mean, dismissive or mistreating the clones in any way, is Pong Krell.

And it's eventually revealed he’s in fact a full-on traitor, hence why the story frames him as an antagonistic dick from the moment he's introduced. He doesn’t represent the Jedi in any way.

We know this because the other Jedi we’ve been shown are always prioritizing their clones’ lives over theirs, if given the chance.

Finally, if we wanna get even more specific... as Commander-in-Chief of the Grand Army of the Republic (GAR), the clones belong to Palpatine.

Palpatine who is a Sith Lord.

Palpatine who arranged for the creation of the clones and had them all injected with a chip that would activate upon hearing a code-word...

... and forced them to murder their Jedi without hesitation or remorse.

When you bear all that ⬆️ in mind and when you read this quote by George Lucas...

"The Jedi won't lead droids. Their whole basis is connecting with the life force. They'd just say, 'That's not the way we operate. We don't function with non-life-forms.” So if there is to be a Republic army, it would have to be an army of humans." - The Star Wars Archives: 1999-2005, 2020

... narratively-speaking, everything falls into place.

Sidious knows that:

If he orchestrates a war designed to thin the Jedi's numbers, corrupt their values and plunge the galaxy into chaos...

If he wants to draft the Jedi - peace-keeping diplomats who’d never willingly join the fray - to fight in his war...

... then the only way they won't resist the draft and abstain from fighting is if they think joining the conflict will save lives.

So he creates a set of cruel, sadistic villains for them to face, opponents who will target innocent civilians at every turn...

... and instead of lifeless droids, he prepares for the Jedi an army of men... living, mortal people who, despite being well-trained, will be completely out of their league when facing the likes of Dooku...

... Ventress...

... Grievous...

... Savage Opress...

... or the defoliator, a tank that annihilates organic matter.

Thus, in order to save as many clone and civilian lives, the Jedi join the fray despite knowing that doing so will corrupt their values.

And as the war rages on, a bond of respect is formed between the two groups.

Clearly, the Jedi don't like the fact that the Republic is using the clones to fight a war, but for that matter, they don't like being in a war, in fact they advocated against it.

However, it's happening regardless of their issues with the idea or personal philosophies. Said The Clone Wars writer Henry Gilroy:

"I’d rather not get into the Jedi’s philosophical issues about an army of living beings created to fight, but the Jedi are in a tough spot themselves, being peacekeepers turned warriors trying to save the Republic."

And bear in mind, the Jedi are basically space psychics, the clones are living beings that they can individually feel in the Force...

... so the Jedi feel every death but need to move on, regardless, only being able to mourn the troopers at the end of every battle.

We see this in the Legends continuity too, by the way.

(that is, when the writers actually try to engage with the narrative)

Also, if you ask the clones, they’re grateful the Jedi have their backs.

When Depa Billaba voices her concerns about how the war is impacting the Jedi's principles, troopers Grey and Styles are quick to make it clear how grateful they all are for the Jedi's involvement:

So the clones aren't the Jedi's slaves. If anything, they're both slaves of the Republic (considering how low the Jedi's status actually is in the hierarchy).

Only I'd argue the clones have it much, much worse.

The Senate sees the Jedi as "ugh, the holier-than-thou space-monk lapdogs who work for us"... but a Jedi has the option to give up that responsibility. They can leave the Order, no fuss or stigma.

A clone trooper cannot leave the GAR! If they do, they’re marked for treason and execution. Again, they’re not perceived as “people”.

And it doesn’t help that the Kaminoans, the clones’ very creators, see the troopers as products/units/merchandise. A notion that the Jedi are quick to correct whenever they get the chance.

How The Clone Wars writers describe the clones' relationship with the Jedi.

George Lucas hasn’t spoken much about this subject aside from the quote from further up. But to be fair... the Prequels aren’t about the clones’ dynamic with the Jedi, so it makes sense that he wouldn’t talk on that subject so much.

He did mention that part of The Clone Wars’ perks is that he could:

“Do stories about some of the individual clones and get to know them.”

But that’s as far as it gets.

So for this part, I'm just gonna let Dave Filoni, showrunner of The Clone Wars and the upcoming series Ahsoka, and TCW writer Henry Gilroy - both of whom worked closely with Lucas - take the wheel. They make themselves pretty clear on how the clone/Jedi dynamic is meant to be viewed.

Here’s Henry Gilroy:

"In my mind, the Jedi see the clones as individuals, living beings that have the same right to life as any other being, but understand that they have a job to do."

"The clones see the Jedi as their commanding officers on one hand, but also, at least subconsciously, they look to them for clues to social/moral behavior."

"Some clones may find themselves getting philosophical leadership from the Jedi that helps them answer some of the deeper questions of life."

"We thought this was a great opportunity to show how the Jedi interact with clones. Specifically, Yoda in a teaching role of the clones, who were socially new, who kind of grew up— who were created to fight, and he really broadened their horizons and helped them realize there was a great big universe out there that was bigger than just fighting and killing."

And here’s Dave Filoni’s comments:

"I truly believe that the Jedi try to humanize their clones and make them more individual, as Henry says."

"I think we saw that in Revenge of the Sith, when the Clones were colorful and named under the Jedi Generals, and then in the final shots of the film with Palpatine and Vader near the new Death Star, the ships are grey, the color and life is sucked out. The Stormtroopers are only numbers and identified by black and white armor or uniforms in A New Hope."

"The soldiers have become disposable to the Emperor."

"That is something the Jedi would never do."

"Yoda teaching the clones much like he taught Luke. ‘Cause that was kind of natural for [the Jedi], a natural instinct to take to these clones like they’re students."

None of the above quotes from two different writers of The Clone Wars, who had many interactions with George Lucas, frame the Jedi and the clones’ relationship in a negative way.

How much more proof do we need that "the clones were slaves of the Jedi” isn’t the intended narrative?

My point being that while the clones' ordeal is indeed horrible, the Jedi have nothing to do with it. The narrative of The Clone Wars always frames it as the fault of the Sith, the Senate and the Kaminoans.

If you go by the intended narrative, the Jedi were the clones' teachers and brothers-in-arms. The clones and the Jedi were not just comrades.

They were friends.

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jaguarys · 15 days

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Thinking a lot about how by the time TCW comes about Anakin has already committed a grievous sin, already committed a massacre, already chosen his side in some ways. The man Ahsoka knows, the only version of him she ever gets to know, is built on an assumption of purity he has already lost.

He has already begun to fall, and this slip contributes in so many ways to his inability to pull himself back. Because the only person other than Padmé he tells his crime to is Palpatine, because he's the only person who won't judge him (and that in and of itself is a measure of his immaturity–– because he deserved to be judged).

And this contributes so much to Palpatine's control because he has this piece of the puzzle, this ability to go "Oh, but what about this?" any time Anakin tries to pull back from Palpatine's confidence. Because they both know if he ever admitted it to the Order he'd forever lose their approval, and that's what matters most. So Palpatine has this advantage, because he knows more about Anakin than anyone else and Anakin doesn't feel he can confide in anyone else.

But the thing is: for so long, Anakin wants to be better, wants to amend himself for this sin and more than once wants to confess to Obi-Wan, but every single time Palpatine is able to go "Oh but he thinks he's so much better than you, he would never understand you, he would judge you and tell the Order and they'd cast you out" but... Obi-Wan would have forgiven him anything.

I think a lot about Obi-Wan being such a Perfect Jedi (in the eyes of everyone else if nothing else) and how much that hurts Anakin. Because every time he tries to pull himself back from the ledge this epitome of what it means to be a Jedi is just there in his face reminding him of his own failure

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