j:DFLFDKF oKAY, huge Pebbles fan here. It's finally nice to see someone who also wants to beat Suns within every inch of his life. I actually like his character too! He's not necessarily a bad person or doesn't care about his friend. It's just his mindset is toxic and he end up dragging Pebbles down with him. He was not a health mentor for Pebbles.
Pebbles was not in a good place mentally and was spiraling hard. Then Suns hands HIM INFORMATION ON HOW tO KIlL hIMSELF?!! SFJ:K BOYO, YoU STupID?!
In the majority of interactions, we see betweeen FP and Suns... Suns needles him when he's vulnerable, fails to use his singular emotional braincell when consoling his friend, and then gives him the how-to-shoot yourself list while assuming Pebbles wouldn't attempt it?? Don't get me wrong. Pebbles isn't excused from choices.
The difference is Pebbles is young for an iterator. He's quite obviously still reeling from his literal creators/parents leaving their entire species to rot. We don't know a whole lot about Suns, but my assumption is his natural reaction to the mass ascension was cynicism. This is not a healthy attitude to project onto your mentee who's in a vulnerable state. Suns was old enough to know better. Pebbles not so much.
(Okay I know Pebbles is probably older than the average human, but his attitude has always reminded me of a young adult. Like old enough to have more or less developed his world views, but still young enough to rash decisions and not understand the implications of them until it's too late. Canonically, he's still hasn't fully matured if we consider iterators losing their perception of godhood part of growing as people. That or Pebbles just needed to be humbled Iterators may not experience enough in life to be humbled considering they're immobile calculators. So, Pebbles being stuck in that phase for longer than you'd expect isn't uncalled for.)
I don't know if I expressed any of this correctly and will probably make plenty of people mad because I'm misunderstanding Suns character or something. OH WELL HeRE"S thE RAMBLE!
i'mma actually shove you into the main tag i agree with all of this That much GJKSCKLSDMGLK PEOPLE LOOKIT THIS PEBS FAN, THEY KNOW WHAS GOOD, GOT IT ALL FIGURED OUT!!!!
if anythin, i'll be standin with ya dude. fuck Suns gang rise up. like we two have basically the same idea of Suns wtf,,,
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I have seen a lot of people say that in s3 Crowley will be sulking and depressed while Muriel, Nina and Maggie will try to help him. Like they will kinda have a found family thing going on. And while i see that happening.
I also want let Crowley be angry. I want to see him go batshit
I see it going like this:
The first days or weeks (or even months) after Aziraphale left Crowley does sulk and drink himself into oblivion. No body sees him for weeks. Until one evening when he is looking into the sky he decides fuck it. Because "Clearly that angel doesn't give a shit about me, so why should i give a shit about him"
And from there it goes downhill. Crowley now does all the shit hell wants him to do and more. Drugs, drinking, smoking, tempting, bribery, getting into bar fights, tormenting, hooking up with every third person he sees, becoming an genuine asshole and every other shity thing a demon can do. Basically leading the most self destructive lifestyle that would have had a human dead within a month. But lucky him since human mortality doesn't apply to him.
He will let that hot anger consume him and motivate him to do more and more shity things. His goal will be to become unrecognisable from the Crowley he was.
Perhaps he will also get a new hairstyle (one he haven't had before) and then change the Bentley into a modern hot red sport car and change his whole closet.
Perhaps after a while one night he will pull up to the bookshop (he haven't seen it in months) and Nina (she stayed late at work) won't even recognize him at first, but when she does she is relieved to finally see him! But that's until he pulls out a fuel can and walks inside the bookshop.
Muriel would of course would be there, but a quick miracle would probably knock them out. Then he is spilling the fuel everywhere and with a snap of his fingers everything is burning. I totally see him smirking while saying:
"You where right angel, nothing lasts for ever"
Aziraphale at some point finds out about this and goes down to earth first time in months, and he is mad.
When they meet Crowley blames Aziraphale for the bookshop burning down and every other bad thing Crowley had done so far, "because if you hadn't left i wouldn't have done it". That makes Aziraphale go from mad to pissed. Everything escalates from there and now things between them are even worse. They are both very angry and blame the other for everything.
Perhaps, perhaps not things get violent or/and other people get involved
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am i the only one that doesn’t have hope anymore? like at all? i don’t trust the duffers anymore and i feel like us(the bylers) created all this byler thing in our heads and we just looked too much into the details in the show :(
i dont blame you for not having hope bc volume 2 for byler definitely was a disappointment and i understand not wanting to look between the lines of the monologue and get hopes up only to be disappointed again but DO NOT think we just made all this up!! if byler doesnt happen i genuinely think that it was their plan originally and then they trashed it.
its not like theres two or three potential hints towards it. there are dozens and dozens of clues and subtext from the dialogue and actions of the characters but also the cinematography, the lighting, the score and tracks they use, the parallels to other couples on the show, the placement of their characters, and probably so much more we havent even noticed yet. we did not make anything up.
after volume 2 i wasnt that sad or mad because more than anything i was just VERY confused. because none of mike wheelers actions make sense unless hes deeply struggling with internalized homophobia. there will be genuine plotholes in the whole show if they stick with mlvn til the end.
lets look at mikes actions alone. can you answer ANY of these questions with an answer thats NOT related to his sexuality?
why did mike not let el touch her when they were kissing at the beginning of s3?
why did he say “its not my fault you dont like girls” if thats not projecting?
why did he say he loves her out loud to everyone else but then pretend he didnt know what she was talking about when she brought it up again?
why did he look so confused when el kissed him and said she loves him and why did he keep his eyes open and didnt kiss her back at all?
why didnt mike have any indication of even having a gf in his room besides the letter we saw him read, while el had a whole shrine and a “book of letters” from him? why did, instead, mike have wills drawings up all over the basement and has a while binder for them that we saw in s1. book of drawings.
WHY on earth wouldnt mike hug his best friend who he hasnt seen in months at the airport? its not because he knows wills feelings, the duffers and finn and the script itself have confirmed hes oblivious to his sexuality and feelings for him.
why did mike look so nervous to ask will about the painting? if it was just because their friendship was kinda dying i think he would have said it as if he was bored or didnt care but instead he looked like he cared a little too much and was trying to hide it. this is right after reading el’s letter that said that will might be painting for a girl.
why did mike barely even look at el as they were walking out of the airport and why did he wear something very different for mike as if he’s portraying someone he’s not?
why would mike emphasize so much “WE’RE FRIENDS!!! we’re friends!” will didnt mean it in a romantic context but mike took it that way.
why was mike kinda an asshole to el and didnt comfort her after the bullies at the rink? “she didnt look fine?” what the hell.
WHY COULDNT MIKE SAY OR WRITE THAT HE LOVES EL!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHAT IS THE POINT OF THAT SCENE IF HE ACTUALLY GENUINELY DOES LOVE HER??? why didnt he say it right then if he did?
why was that “i feel like i lost you” scene so god damn flirty? he’s never looked at el the way he looked at him here.
why did he nod when will told him that its scary to open up to people especially if they dont like the truth? why did finn say that this “psyches him out”?
why did mike say “its not fate, its not destiny, its just simple dumb luck” about first meeting el and then claim to her that the moment he say her in the woods was love at first sight? we know that this is a blatant lie and will should know this too.
why did mike look at will like THAT during the painting scene!!!??? (i will admit tho this could be finn wolfhard just wanting his character to be gay so he plays him gay but they could have used shots of him not looking at his lips but they kept them in.)
WHY DID WILL HAVE TO PUSH MIKE TO CONTINUE TALKING TO EL!!!!!???? HE WASNT GONNA SAY HE LOVES HER BUT WILL PUSHED HIM INTO IT!!!!!!!!
and thats just his actions alone!!! now lets look into the more technical film choices theyve made when it comes to mike wheeler. again, can you answer any of these questions with an answer thats not related to him having internalized homophobia?
why did they make it clear that max and lucas at day of the dead were having a date (“im spending romantic time with my girlfriend”) and then choose to place mike and will together but not with them, as if mike and will were on a date too.
why did they film mike and el’s break up in s3 so playfully and humorous with bright lighting, lots of colors, an audience, max and el laughing, and fun music after vs mike and will’s fight which was very dark and blue, pouring rain, harsh shadows, and played an emotional original score track?
WHY the eye witness parallel?
why would they frame mike in a closet in s3 during that awkward unreciprocated kiss? this is the biggest thing by far for me that makes me think he’s gay for sure.
why did they frame mike reading el’s letter so that theres a literal fucking one way sign pointing to an open closet?
why did bouncy upbeat music play when he and el reunited at the airport? they could have made it emotional but they made it light and playful as if its more friendly than romantic.
WHY DID THEY PLAY A TRACK CALLED “IN THE CLOSET” WHEN MIKE STARTS SPEAKING!!!!!!!!!!!! NOT WILL!!! this is also right after he said “we’re firends we’re friends!!” no its not just because el is in a literal closet here, the track starts during mike and wills fight.
why did they play a track that is EXTREMELY similar to the track eulogy during mike and el’s fight, a track thats only played when someone dies.
(emotional, tender music). why. its only used in romantic contexts. we see it used with byler, lumax, jopper, and once with mlvn when theyre at the pizza place.
why did they frame will out of focus in the middle of mike and el when they reunited!!? at first i thought this was just to emphasize will’s pov but now im thinking it might be more symbolic of will getting in between mike and eleven. he himself isnt doing that at all though, quite the opposite actually- he keeps giving mike relationship advice and hes the reason mike told el he loves her, so it must be in reference to how will is disrupting mike and els relationship because of mikes feelings for him.
why did they keep will in the frame when mike said he loved her? the only other time we had a similar one on one emotional monologue delivery to someone was in s2 when joyce, jonathan, and mike were trying to reach will and mike told him asking him to be friends was the best thing hes ever done. that was shot as if there were no one else in the room it was very centered around just will and mike, whereas this monologue shows will in the same frame as mike as well as will and jonathans reactions to what hes saying.
and lastly, WHY did they frame every couple so dramatically paired off together in the final shot while el was all alone. joyce and hopper, mike and will, and jonanathan and nancy. theyve done this in the past but this was the first time they made it excruciatingly obvious.
damn i wasnt gonna list out every thing i know when i first started answering this but thats what i ended up doing. anyways, again, i understand giving up considering how disappointing volume 2 was, but absolutely no way was it all in our heads. look at all that.
i still have hope just for the sheer fact that not only mike wheeler as a character, but all their film choices surrounding mike wheeler make no fucking sense unless hes gay and DEEP in the closet.
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