#would he kill jyl to achieve his own ends

[crossdressingdeath]

On the JYL suddenly appearing at Nightless City, there was a theory I saw in passing about how maybe JGY brought her there? In the hopes that she would die (to help his ascent to power? and to hopefully make WWX go berserk?). I never really bought it (as wasn't JGY at the conference already??? when would he go back to Koi Tower to get JYL??) but something I thought I'd share.

Yeah, I’ve seen that. I don’t buy it either, if only because... that is a wild gamble for JGY to make? He’s assuming first that JYL will die, second that her death will make WWX go berserk, third that he won’t die if WWX goes berserk, and fourth that if everything else goes according to plan this will actively benefit him. There are way too many moving parts out of JGY’s control for him to take the risk. And yeah, also he was already at the conference. So it’s a theory, but I don’t think it’s what MXTX actually had in mind.

#mdzs #cql #jin guangyao #would he kill jyl to achieve his own ends? yes #would he do it in such an uncertain and risky way? i doubt it #anon #asks

[robininthelabyrinth]

Jin Zixuan knows what he wants, and that’s to be the next pretty but useless Madam Jiang. All that he has to is 1) pass his title of heir to his new brother, 2) convince JYL to fall back in love with him, 3) not embarrass himself. Three easy enough goals, right? -🙃

ao3

Untamed

Jin Zixuan was almost – almost – not surprised to open his eyes and find himself sixteen again.

Instead of, you know, dead.

Honestly, it just seemed like the perfect capstone of his life of happenstance: born an idiot, raised an idiot, continued to be an idiot, realized he was an idiot, remained an idiot but a better class thereof, and somehow despite all that managed to hit the jackpot of luck not only once but twice – the first in being born in the right womb, the second in convincing Jiang Yanli to give him a second chance despite the aforementioned unbroken streak of lifelong idiocy.

Possibly because of. She thought he was cute.

Anyway, as if to make him pay up for that amazing streak of luck, just when he’d finally achieved all the things he’d ever actually wanted – a wife that loved him and who he loved in return and a son to dote upon – he had, for the first time in his life, grown up and decided to not be a complete idiot…only to immediately die.

Being reborn seemed pretty much part and parcel with the whole stupid tragedy.

Not that he regretted inviting Wei Wuxian to come visit. That’d been the right thing to do, and Jiang Yanli had been so happy – it hadn't even been his fault; it had been Jin Zixun’s ambush that had ruined it all, really. Jin Zixuan wasn’t even entirely sure what it was that had actually killed him, whether it was a stray arrow or a misplaced sword or even the Ghost General gone berserk, but he was sure that if his stupid cousin hadn’t decided to attack, Wei Wuxian would have come and left in peace.

If he hadn’t rushed out by himself to try to fix things, to make sure the one thing he’d ever managed to do right by Jiang Yanli worked out well, then maybe he wouldn’t have ended up leaving her and Jin Ling behind.

Alone.

In Lanling City.

He shuddered even to think it.

Jin Zixuan knew that there were people who loved their sects – passionately, devotedly. Jiang Cheng had been one of them, defying death itself to resurrect the Jiang sect in his parents’ honor and reestablishing it as one of the Great Sects. And then there was Lan Xichen, the steadfast and honorable, who had sacrificed everything, even honor, to make sure his sect’s books survived what they had feared would be the end. And all this was to say nothing of Nie Mingjue, who had come to power painfully young and had played the game of politics that he so despised in order to stay the course, to avenge his father and keep his sect strong…

Jin Zixuan did not love his sect.

He did not love his city, he did not love his people. He had wondered if it was a failing in himself, but then looked at the rest of his family and realized it was just his blood running true. Lanling Jin had a soul of rot and a heart of stone, each one of them careless and indifferent in their own way – his father couldn’t give a damn about his sect except in the sense that it aided his personal power, his mother the authority it gave her whether through her husband or her son, his cousins the impunity they could derive from it…

Jin Zixuan had told Jiang Yanli about it when she agreed to marry him, worried that she'd change her mind when she learned the truth but even more worried that she'd wake up one day to find herself trapped and disappointed in him. But she was as ever the luckiest thing that had ever happened in his life: she’d said that she would be fine because she had him by her side, and he would be fine because he had her, and they would balance. He’d accepted that argument – and then, of course, he’d gone and died, like the idiot that he was.

And yet, somehow, he’d been reborn, granting him another chance to change his fate, and this time, this time, he wasn’t going to deceive himself.

After all, it seemed pretty clear from his last life that he was never going to not be an idiot, and that fate wasn’t too happy about him trying to stick his nose into politics or major events.

This time around, he wasn’t going to struggle against his destiny – Jin Zixuan was going to accept it.

He was going to be absolutely useless.

He sat up in his bed, observing that he was in the Cloud Recesses, and that his eye hurt; it must be not long after his fight with Wei Wuxian, which meant his engagement was broken. He’d have to win Jiang Yanli again – still, he’d somehow managed it last time around, so that wasn’t what he was worried about.

No, the main problem was definitely how he was going to manage the whole “be useless” part of his ambitions – and for that, he needed the advice of an expert.

“Nie-er-gongzi, can I ask you for some advice?” he asked.

Nie Huaisang blinked blearily at him. “Jin-gongzi? It’s the middle of the night.”

“It’s important,” Jin Zixuan said apologetically. “It’s something that only you can help me with.”

“…me?”

“Yes, you. I need to learn how to be a good-for-nothing.” Jin Zixuan thought about it. “Also, I need to get in contact with Meng Yao. He’s at the Unclean Realm now, right? Someone needs to inherit Lanling Jin, might as well be him.”

Nie Huaisang blinked owlishly at him.

“…okay.” He pulled open the door. “I think you’d better come inside.”

#mdzs #jin zixuan #nie huaisang #my fic #my fics

[no--envies]

I think it’s interesting how different JC and JYL’s attitudes toward WWX are, despite having experienced the same tense family situation.

JC did care for WWX, but could never accept him for who he was, without conditions. He wanted WWX to be less selfless and heroic, to stop being better than him at everything. He was bitter because WWX had a better relationship with his father than he did, even though it didn't mean JFM cared more for WWX, they just could connect better because they shared similar values, while JC was more similar to his mother. Despite this being an understandable source of frustration for JC, it was something that was beyond both JFM and WWX’s control. JC tried to convince WWX to abandon the Wen remnants not only because he was worried about him (though in his own way he did want to protect him), but because he couldn’t stand that WWX understood the Jiang Sect’s motto way better than he did. It was yet another reminder of his own inferiority.

On the other hand, JYL always accepted and loved WWX for who he was. When JZXun accused WWX of being arrogant and treated him as if he was a servant who had forgotten his place, JYL stood up for him and defended him - she said he was like a brother to her and that it wasn’t a small matter when other people humiliated him. When WWX killed her husband, she didn’t try to accuse him (even though it would have been understandable if she had), but instead she tried to talk to him, to reassure him in some way that she didn’t hate him. And in the end she even died to protect him.

JYL did what little she could to support WWX. In the end it wasn’t enough, but her intentions were sincere and she did more than JC, who had the power and position JYL lacked (as a woman and as someone who wasn’t a sect leader). This is because JYL understood WWX’s nature and loved him unconditionally. JC, on the other hand, could never do this. He was jealous because WWX was more talented than him and his achievements were greater, although WWX clearly did all of that to help JC rebuild the Jiang Sect, not for recognition.

To have a healthy relationship with WWX, JC would have needed to acknowledge that WWX was simply a better person and try to improve himself from there. But his pride prevented him from doing so. Having WWX on his side made him stronger than most other sect leaders, so it wasn’t even in his own interest that he abandoned WWX after he rescued the Wen remnants. Whether JC realized it or not, he wasn’t acting in a rational way with his sect as his priority, but he was driven by his own complicated feelings towards WWX. Showing more conviction when he tried to speak up for him (and actually explaining the extent of the debt both of them owed the Wen siblings) would have been enough to convince LXC and NMJ that WWX had good reasons for doing what he had done in the prison camp, that he hadn't behaved in that way because his demonic cultivation was corrupting him. And with LXC and NMJ on his side, it would have been much easier for JC to sway public opinion in WWX’s favor. Despite what JC said, it wasn’t impossible for him to stand up for WWX (and I think WWX knew it deep down).

I think part of JC’s issues were due to the fact that he was talented enough to think he could compete with WWX, but not enough to actually surpass him. If his talent had been like JYL’s, he wouldn’t even have thought about competing with WWX, who was so incredibly gifted. Besides, it wasn’t just a matter of talent and cultivation, even his personality and attitude couldn’t compare to WWX’s. WWX was even a better leader than him - more charismatic, more in control of situations - despite JC being the sect heir. Not even once did JC manage to outshine WWX, WWX was simply too much of a prodigy. All of this was incredibly frustrating for JC - despite everything he did, despite all his efforts, WWX was always a step ahead of him without even trying.

I think this was JC’s tragedy (not in the sense that he was a victim of events, but that it was something he couldn’t control and that contributed to his unhappiness). With time JC’s resentment only got worse, until it surpassed the affection he felt for WWX. In the end, it was the choices he made that ultimately caused their relationship to become broken beyond repair.

#mdzs #mdzs meta #jiang cheng #jiang yanli #wei wuxian

[ouyangzizhensdad]

As a mdzs/novel canon reader, how do you feel about the roles of Wen Ning and Wen Qing in mdzs vs cql?

I think one of the most important thing (for me) when thinking about how wn and wq are explored in cql is to remember the following two factors:

1. While the actress denied it, it seems that wq was indeed supposed to be a love interest for wwx in cql before fans made a fuss about it on social media: this is supported by the fact she was introduced as a main character in early talks of the series, the actress got the biggest $$ contract after xz and wyb, we got some leaked photos from set showing scenes that were filmed or were intended to be filmed but didn’t end up in the final cut of the series, and the simple reality that wq’s presence in the story was increased significantly (while her impact on the plot remained the same). Tbh that they chose to cast meng ziyi and introduced (and kept) a frankly bizarre (on a thematic and plot level) romance subplot between jc and her is proof enough for me that she was supposed to be a love interest for wwx (albeit a tragic one).  

2. CQL fundamentally modified the role of the Wens within the narrative by changing the whole subplot about modao, which then altered the role of wq and wn to a degree, and with which characters they interacted and when.

For me, these had an impact on the overall quality of the storytelling, particularly in regards to wq and her character (under the cut because I don’t know how to be brief).

WEN QING:

1. Even if she had been instructed by the director to play wq as close to possible to the way she was portrayed in the novel, I don’t think Meng Ziyi could have done it; for me, she doesn’t have the right presence, physicality, etc. to achieve a good performance of wq. Novel wq has such strong boss energy; she is high-ranking officer even if she is removed from the fighting, the best doctor, and someone who was in charge of the yiling supervision office, and she’s constantly snapping at people (I love novel!wq.........). Meng Ziyi just does not manage to embody that powerful energy--she has that female lead type of presence, and it just doesn’t mesh with who wq is.

Wen Ning nodded, somewhat embarrassed, “My sister. She’s really powerful.”

She was indeed powerful.

Wen Qing could be considered a famous cultivator of the QishanWen Sect. She wasn’t a daughter of the QishanWen Sect’s leader, Wen Ruohan, but instead the daughter of one of Wen Ruohan’s cousins. Although they were far cousins, Wen Ruohan had always had a close relationship to this cousin of his. On top of that, Wen Qing was exceptional in the liberal arts and studied medicine as well. She was a talent, and thus she was rather favored by Wen Ruohan. She often followed Wen Ruohan to the banquets of the QishanWen Sect, which was why Wei Wuxian found her face familiar. She was a beauty, after all. He had also heard from somewhere that she had an elder or younger brother. But, perhaps because he wasn’t as talented as Wen Qing, not many people talked about him.

2. In my opinion, making the wq a more active agent in the wen plot also takes away part of what defines her arc and character in the novel, and what she represents as a figure within the conflict. Let’s remember, we are only introduced to wq in the novel after Lotus Pier was burned down and jc lost his core--she is absent until then, and that is the point: she is not involved in the conflict. While morally upright, she is someone who passively benefits from the ills committed by her sect and who only takes calculated risks to help reduce the suffering committed to others. She becomes guilty by association despite never actively hurting others or helping wrh’s cause. It feels more organic and complex than the throne-room!threats we see in cql, and having her carry on missions for wrh.

Wen Qing cut him off, “What the Wen Sect does doesn’t represent what we do. We don’t need to be responsible for the Wen Sect’s wrongdoing. Wei Ying, there’s no need to look at me like that. There’s a beginning to all debts. I’m the office leader of Yiling, but I was ordered to take the position. I’m a medic, an apothecary, I’ve never killed anyone, much less touched the blood of the Jiang Sect.”

It was true. Nobody had heard of any lives lost by Wen Qing’s hands. There were always many cases that people wanted her to take over. It was because Wen Qing was one of the Wen Sect’s people whose way of doing things was actually normal. At times she could even put in a few good words for people in front of Wen Ruohan. Her reputation had always been good.

/////

Lan Xichen responded a moment later. “I have heard of Wen Qing’s name a few of times. I do not remember her having participated in any of the Sunshot Campaign’s crimes.” 

“But she’s never stopped them either, “ Nie Mingjue countered.

“Wen Qing was one of Wen RuoHan’s most trusted people, “ said Lan Xichen. “How could she have stopped them?” 

Nie Mingjue spoke coldly. “If she responded with only silence and not opposition when the Wen Sect was causing mayhem, it’s the same as indifference. She shouldn’t have been so disillusioned as to hope that she could be treated with respect when the Wen Sect was doing evil and be unwilling to suffer the consequences and pay the price when the Wen Sect was wiped out.” 

[...] One of the sect leaders spoke up, “What Nie-zongzhu said is quite right. Besides, Wen Qing is one of Wen RuoHan’s most trusted people. You’re telling me she never participated? Well I don’t buy it. Is there any Wen-gao without a single drop of blood on their hands? Maybe it’s just that we haven’t found out about it yet!”

3. Making wq interact with other characters before the qiongqi path incident also makes their motivations harder to understand. For instance, jc having feelings for wq makes his motivations and actions during the aftermath of the sunshot campaign more muddled, imo? In the novel, instead, jc’s unwillingness to help the wen remnants is used to showcase a foil between jc’s and wwx’s understandings of duty/responsibility:

“You burn this corpse right now and return to them all these leftovers of the Wen Sect. That’s the only way to make the subject die!” As Jiang Cheng spoke, he raised his sword again, preparing to attack.

Wei Wuxian clenched his wrist.

“Are you joking?! If we return Wen Qing and the others to them, they’d meet nothing but a dead end!”

“I doubt you’ll even return all of them. Why do you care what kind of end they meet? A dead end it is, then—what does it have to do with you?!”

Wei Wuxian finally lost his temper. “Jiang Cheng! What- What do you think you’re talking about?! Take it back—don’t make me give you a thrashing! Don’t forget. Who was the one that helped us burn Jiang-shushu’s and Yu-furen’s corpses? Who returned to us the ashes that are in Lotus Pier right now? And who took us in when we were chased after by Wen Chao?!”

Jiang Cheng, “I’m the one who fucking wants to give you a thrashing! Yes, they helped us before, but why in the world don’t you understand that right now any remnant of the Wen Sect is a target of criticism! No matter who they are, with a surname of Wen they have committed a most heinous crime! And those who protect the Wen are at risk of being condemned by everyone! All the people loathe the Wen-dogs so badly that the worse they die the better. Whoever protects them is against the entire world. Nobody would speak for them, and nobody would speak for you either!”

4. Adding more screen time for wq and more interactions with other characters prior to/during the sunshot campaign ends up adding nothing in terms of her arc or her impact on the plot. While wq is a secondary character in the novel, she is crucial to the plot: her skills and her agency shape so many crucial moments and events in mdzs. Take away pretty much any scene with wq in the novel, and the events of the novel have to change. However, when it comes to what has been added in cql to make her more prominent in the series, it does not feel like it brings anything of significance to the plot. In the end, what is the point of the hair comb moment? it never sways jc to help or feel really conflicted over not helping the wen remnants? it never changes anything about the way wq acts? jc doesn’t come to wq’s defense at jinlintai the way lwj does. At best, it just adds to jc’s manpain. In the end, what’s the point of having a cute moment between wq and jyl, except to reassure viewers that wq is a good person and cares for her brother (all things we known in the novel in spite of the absence of this scene). In the end, what is the point of spending screentime with wq looking for the yin iron in the cloud recesses, and wwx being suspicious of her, if anyway lwj and him stumble upon it by chance? If wq were the love interest, it would make more sense to just pad up her screen time in the series, and these moments would probably pay off more. But as it is, it just feels very aimless and even at times confusing. 

5. i 100% headcanon novel wq as a lesbian and the fact that they even suggest she might have feelings for jc is an attack on my gay rights ): 

WEN NING:

1. Gosh I love wn. I think his role in the novel is so important and i have too much to say to end up saying anything remotely coherent. I also have to say that I love the actor they chose. Of all the casting choices, I’d even say it is the best of the entire series in my opinion. He really captures the essence of wn and he looks so adorable. So cute. 

2. Overall, i think cql did not change too much in terms of his arc and characterisation (the shy but fiercely protective person, coming to terms with what he lost, finding wen yuan and reconnecting with his history, finding a path of his own instead of following his sister/wwx). However I do find that some of the interactions are more meaningful in the novel. For example, making wwx and wn’s first interaction happen in the cloud recesses takes away the importance of wwx standing up against wn’s own sect members on their own turf. The fact that wwx and wn see each other more in the CQL verse also undermines the weight of wn’s choice and how significant wwx’s actions and words were to him, since he was ready to go against his sect for someone he’d met once. Once!!!! It says so much about wn and what his life was like--and how much impact wwx’s acts of kindness and care could have. If I let myself I would just end up quoting back most of Poison - part 4.Okay, I will just quote this part:

Red seeped through Wen Qionglin’s face to even the bottom of his ears. There was no need for others to beckon him away; he fled self-consciously. Wei Wuxian chased after him, “Hey, don’t run! Uh… Qionglin-xiong right? Why are you running?”

Hearing his name called from behind him, Wen Qionglin finally stopped. Head hanging low, he turned around. It seemed as though shame rippled from his head to his toes as he stammered, “… I’m sorry.”

“Why are you telling me you’re sorry?”

“You… You recommended me… but I made you lose face…”

“How did it make me lose face? You haven’t really shot in front other people, have you? You were nervous?”

Wen Qionglin nodded. Wei Wuxian continued, “Have some confidence. Let me tell you the truth—you shoot better than everyone in your sect. Out of all of the disciples whom I’ve seen, no more than three people are better in archery than you.”

3. I do wish wn as the ghost general was scarier and more violent in cql, but they tamed all of the horror/violent/gory aspects of the novel so it was to be expected. I just love contrasts.............

#mdzs meta #asks #cql vs mdzs #wen qing #wen ning #Anonymous

[somepinkthing]

As someone whose first MDZS love was wei wuxian and who grew to love jiang cheng and jin guangyao after getting to know their characters, I guess I just have a hard time really seeing nie huaisang’s actions as “evil”. Especially not when put into context.

As far as I can tell, mo xuanyu was the only one who died within the plan and I’ve always been under the impression that while NHS might have provided the idea, MXY was more than happy to have his own revenge any way he could get it. And I’m not saying NHS doing that and putting the juniors in danger in yi city isn’t bad but. I mean, I came to terms with JC and WWX. Between the two of them, they must have over thousands of lives in collateral damage. And it just seems like people find that less “evil” because they did those things in a fit of emotion. But really, who cares? I’ll tell you what, I’d much rather be a pawn in a carefully crafted plan and have nothing happen to me than be ripped apart by corpses or tortured to death in a fit of emotion. I’m not saying WWX or JC are completely evil or that NHS’s choices were necessarily morally correct. I’m just saying that most of the characters partook in some major bloodshed. The only people that I can think of that didn’t ever participate or support any massacre would be LWJ, JZX, JYL, MianMian, and NHS. Knowing that, I guess I have a hard time seeing NHS as particularly sinister. In the end, good intentions can only erase so much. Nie huaisang’s intentions weren’t as good at WWX’s or as blatantly emotional as JC’s. His intentions were neutral and he never acted without a plan. But he also did less damage, hurt less people, got less killed. He let MXY make his own choice. He made sure the juniors had a rescue party planned out. And in the end? It panned out. Minimal damage, maximum impact. Morally pure? Probably not. But discounting careful planning, acting purely on emotion, flying into righteous rage, playing the hero, trying to do everything by yourself, putting others above you–these are all things that might have put NHS in the “hero” category BUT they are also what ultimately saw WWX killing thousands and JC torturing innocents in his basement.

And then there was JGY and XY, the actual "villains". At their worst, they represented the worst of intentions AND results. XY prides himself in his blatant cruelty. And as for JGY, which disaster within the last 15 years did he not at least contribute to? Who has he not hurt? Almost inherent in their characters is a fundamental disrespect for the lives and opinions of others and that’s where all the difference is. For all their intellect, they often act without thinking about the consequences to others and how that could reflect on them. I mean, once getting caught was no longer a concern, JGY literally tried to do away with every single cultivator he could get his hands on. NHS doesn't measure up to them by a long shot

Still, it's undeniable that NHS placed others in danger to achieve his goals. BUT also undeniable is that, in the end, NHS’s plan only saw MXY dead in the process. Those like JC and WWX never thought they’d put people in danger--they stubbornly jumped into the fray of things without much thought beforehand and managed to rack up thousands of lives in collateral. So which is better? Does it balance out? Do the ends justify the means? Do the means justify the end? Do the intentions justify the results? The question of whether good intentions are enough is one MDZS grapples with through many of their characters, NHS included.

I neither consider NHS a villain nor a hero. He’s not evil by any means nor is he purely good either. And while his actions may not have had the righteous backing WWX’s did, he also didn’t cause even a fraction of the damage our favorite chaotic boy did. He accomplished an altogether good ending but his means could be called into question. However, pretty much no one was hurt–a direct contrast to the effects that both the heroes and the villains in MDZS tend to have as both tend to leave widespread destruction. NHS is a neutral party in the truest sense. Idk if any of that makes much sense but there it is

#nie huaisang #mdzs #mo dao zu shi #wei wuxian #jiang cheng #gdc #the untamed #nhs #jin guangyao #jgy #mo dao su zhi #the grandmaster of demonic cultivation #grandmaster of demonic cultivation #mdzs meta #meta #founder of diabloism #xue yang

[robininthelabyrinth]

Jgy and jyl couple, where meng yao asked for nmj help for courting her in the middle of sunshot campain, could we see the political shenanigans involving jgs being his scummy self and newborn meng ling

World 2 - continuation of Four Worlds (JGY/JYL) - ao3 link

-

“So, uh,” Nie Mingjue said, uncertain and tripping over his tongue a way he never typically did. “What’s your plan?”

Meng Yao blinked at him.

“For courting Mistress Jiang,” Nie Mingjue clarified. “Unless you’ve already reached an agreement..?”

A bowl of soup every night and some pleasant conversation did not, in fact, make for an agreement to marriage, so Meng Yao shook his head.

“Right. So you have a plan, then.”

Meng Yao did not have a plan. Meng Yao did not have anything, nothing but his father’s blood, the weight of his promise to his mother, and his own clever mind; all he had was the sudden and overwhelming conviction that if he let Jiang Yanli go her own way without him that he would never again find a woman who would truly see him as her equal.

There was that girl, Qin Su, that he’d rescued – but that had been artifice, deliberate. He who had access to all of the reports of all the spies in the Sunshot Campaign, who sent out correspondence advising people on what roads were dangerous and which were safe, how could he not know that she would find danger in the route she had chosen? He had deliberately manufactured to rescue her as a means of winning her affection, his eyes all the while fixed on the prize of her surname, her family, which was one of the strongest subsidiary sects of Lanling Jin. They had influence he would need in winning back his name.

And while he had succeeded in his goal – once he had some status, she would fight her father to marry him, he was certain – he still thought he could detect the slightest hint of pity in her eyes. She was a girl in love, claiming that she didn’t care who he was or anything about his past, but how long would that last in the face of sober reality? In the face of struggle, of bitter adversity, of the opposition and scorn of all?

“…would you like help?” Nie Mingjue said, possibly correctly interpreting the blankness on Meng Yao’s face as absolute panic for the first time in the time they had known each other.

“Can you help?” Meng Yao inquired. It seemed unlikely.

“Well, I can write to my brother,” Nie Mingjue said, which sounded far more likely than the infamously frigid Chifeng-zun abruptly developing an expertise in wooing women. “And I’m on good terms with Mistress Jiang personally, so I might be able to provide some insight –”

“Wait,” Meng Yao said, fixing him with a stare. “What do you mean you’re on good terms with her personally?”

Nie Mingjue blinked at him. “Exactly what I said..? We first became acquainted as children, and while we were never close, we were always friendly.”

“But – you only allowed her to stay at our warcamp if she agreed to work! You said you’d kick her out if she wasn’t useful!”

“Naturally,” Nie Mingjue said. “Otherwise she might suspect I pitied her.”

Presumably, Meng Yao reflected, that statement made some amount of sense in Nie Mingjue’s head.

“What does she like, then?” he asked, deciding to focus on the practical. “Cooking, her brothers –”

Befriending people who are so far below her that they aren’t worthy of touching her shoe.

“She’s never had much talent at swordsmanship,” Nie Mingjue said at once, because of course that would be the first thing he would pay attention to. “Not her fault – she’s like Huaisang, born with a weak body, only worse, since it affected her breathing. Too much exertion and she’d turn blue…she used to chew licorice for it, when she was very young; if I recall correctly, she developed a taste for it.”

“Licorice? She likes licorice candy?”

Nie Mingjue nodded.

“She also always enjoyed reading. Poetry, classic texts or light, she wasn’t particular,” he said, brow furrowed in recollection. “She liked puzzles. Was always doing something with her hands – not embroidery, though, not unless she had to. But other things.”

Meng Yao nodded, his quick mind already flooded with ideas, thoughts…he was going to need to be clever about this.

Worse – he was going to need to be honest.

Jiang Yanli deserved it.

-

Meng Yao went to Langya with Nie Mingjue’s recommendation letter in his pocket and the memory of two hands in his, pressing together tightly, and a “yes” that rang in his ears so loudly that he almost didn’t hear the sneers and disdain of the people around him.

His father refused to see him, his peers mocked him, his supervisor stole his achievements and called his mother a whore –

“Yes,” Jiang Yanli whispered in his ear. “Yes, I’ll marry you.”

Meng Yao ignored them all.

He figured out soon enough that Lanling Jin was getting him nowhere, and that without some tremendous achievement, he wouldn’t get the name he had promised his mother he’d have, the one he was starting to doubt he even really wanted.

His supervisor told him he’d be better off dead in the battlefield, implied that he’d see it happen sooner rather than later. Meng Yao considered killing him.

“I would be proud to be your wife.”

Meng Yao did not kill him.

Nie Mingjue might’ve, chasing him out of the battlefield the way he did, eyes red with rage at Jin Guangshan’s insulting pretense – if nothing else, he should have given Nie Mingjue face by accepting the letter, especially given how many battles Nie Mingjue had won for him – but Meng Yao did not.

“I have an idea,” he told Nie Mingjue once he’d had a chance to calm the man down. “You’re going to hate it, so I’m not going to tell you what it is.”

“Be safe,” Nie Mingjue said at once. “Don’t do anything stupid and widow Mistress Jiang before you even marry her.”

Meng Yao smiled, and closed his ears to the sound of Jiang Yanli’s voice. He would need it more than ever, where he was going, but more importantly, if he wanted to succeed, he needed he needed to be the sort of person he was without her.

“I won’t.”

-

It was, Jin Guangyao thought with satisfaction, a perfect strategy.

He had brought down Wen Ruohan with his own hands, saved Nie Mingjue’s life – “What part of ‘I won’t do anything stupid’ means ‘I’m going to go spy in the Nightless City’, you imbecile?” “Sect Leader Nie is happy to see me, then?” “Of course I’m happy to see you! Now get over here and let me break your legs!” – and even swore brotherhood with him and with Lan Xichen.

With such a string of achievements to his name, strong connections to the other Great Sects, and even a personal title, there was no way Jin Guangshan would be able to resist the idea of bringing him into the Jin family to steal some of his reflected glory, even if it meant he’d finally have to give his bastard son the recognition and the name he’d so long refused to grant him.

Oh, his father had gotten his dig in there, calling him Jin Guangyao and situating him firmly outside the line of inheritance for the next generation where he properly belonged, but a name was a name. He was Lanling Jin, now and forever; his promise to his mother fulfilled at long last.

“We will have to find something for you to do, I suppose,” Jin Guangshan said when Jin Guangyao rose to his feet bearing a new name, as though he was trying to place a distant relative into some position as a servant, the minor irritations attendant to the life of a sect leader. “You were a deputy once, weren’t you? Doing all sorts of administrative things. You can arrange the hunt that we will hold to celebrate the end of the war, at Phoenix Mountain.”

“It would be my honor to serve you in this matter, father,” Jin Guangyao said demurely, and even managed to avoid rolling his eyes at the way Jin Guangshan pretended he didn’t know exactly whose deputy he had been, even after Nie Mingjue’s rather impassioned and too-public lecture on the subject back in Langya. “I am pleased to be able to contribute something before I leave the family.”

“Before – what?” Jin Guangshan turned a little purple in his rage, embarrassed in front of all the people who had come to view the naming ceremony and who had all started whispering all at once. His wife, who had been glaring death, suddenly looked far more interested in the proceedings. “Leave? What are you talking about?”

“I’m engaged to be married,” Jin Guangyao said apologetically. “I agreed to marry in – you understand, I didn’t have the Jin surname at the time.”

“You have it now. The girl can marry into our family, instead!”

Jin Guangyao’s smile widened. “I’m so pleased to have your blessing upon my marriage, Father,” he said, bowing his head. A father’s blessing was critical to a proper wedding, so he wanted it to be clear to the entire room that Jin Guangshan had agreed. It would make it more difficult for him to recant later. “But her family is small, her parents and much of her sect killed in the war, and she has only one brother – I promised her that I would marry in to ensure that her parents’ legacy lives on, even if only as the collateral branch.”

“It does you credit to respect your future bride in such a manner,” Madame Jin said before Jin Guangshan could speak. Jin Guangyao had counted on her leaping to his aid: she must think that it was in her best interest that the one bastard that Jin Guangshan had finally legitimatized be immediately rendered utterly ineligible for inheriting the Jin sect, and that nothing else mattered. Her open support now would make it more difficult for her to recant later, too, when she discovered that he was foiling her plans for her own son’s marriage. “Quite romantic, even. It warms my heart to see such faithful love.”

Jin Guangshan’s face went even more purple. To be criticized in public like that – only Madame Jin could accomplish such a feat.

Jin Guangyao saluted and bowed deeply to them both once again. “Father and Mother honor me too much. With your approval, I will arrange the Phoenix Mountain hunt as a proud member of the Jin clan and leave the family to marry into my beloved’s family on the first auspicious date thereafter.”

“Fine,” Jin Guangshan said, his lip twisting into a sneer. He couldn’t understand why anyone would want to be part of Lanling Jin and then leave it behind – he probably expected Jin Guangyao to stay and beg for scraps of attention, to run around doing anything he wished, to scheme for an inheritance he would always be denied. He might not have been wrong, in another life where that was Jin Guangyao’s only route to power – he’d always been ambitious, and often a little too optimistic with it. “Fine. You are, after all, my son, and to marry you will be a great honor for whichever family you choose. We’ll pay for your wedding, and even endower you as if you were a bride worthy of the family you marry into – it is the least that we can do, for the great honor that you have brought to Lanling Jin.”

At least his father remembered that he’d made a contribution, Jin Guangyao thought, and bowed again. It was an insult to call it a dowry, as if Jin Guangyao was a woman, instead of simply bestowing it on him outright as a gift, and even that pathetic gesture was only being made because his father knew they were in public, surrounded by the sect leaders of the cultivation world that he wanted to impress. And even then, even then, he had still tried to be clever, to say he would only make Jin Guangyao equal to the family he married into.

No doubt he expected that the only family that would take him when he was Meng Yao was some bunch of nobodies, and that the wedding would therefore be small, cheap, and uninteresting, just as he no doubt thought Jin Guangyao deserved.

He was doomed to disappointment.

“Congratulations, brother,” Jin Zixuan said, and maybe even meant it. “Who is your intended bride?”

Jin Guangyao savored the moment.

“Mistress Jiang, of Yunmeng Jiang,” he said, and watched Jin Guangshan’s face go pale, Madame Jin’s twist in abrupt rage, Jin Zixuan’s eyes go wide in sudden envy.

There were those that said the best revenge was living well, and they had something of a point, only they had left out a bit.

The best revenge was living well – and rubbing your enemies’ faces in it.

#mdzs #jin guangyao #nie mingjue #jiang yanli #jin guangshan #my fic #my fics #sorry you don't get meng ling #but you get politics? #Anonymous

[crossdressingdeath]

You are being a bit too hard on JYL. While she wasn't a perfect sister, she was also a victim to her parents dysfunctional relationship and she was only 2 years older than the boys. She was a poor cultivator and had a very weak constitution. She also had no political power despite her high birth. I'm pretty sure she never got any apologies for any of the slights against her character and on the pheonix mountain scene doesn't Jin Zixun storm off and then madam jin completely dismisses the situation as JYL being silly? Madam Jin loves JYL but I would say she doesn't respect her. JGS doesn't respect Madam Jin either so even if JYL went to her, nothing would be done. However JZXuan does invite WWX genuinely so I would say JYL was trying to improve WWX's situation as much as she could. As for not giving any financial support, she was completely dependent on JC and then the Jins, so I dont see how she could have helped there. Also I could totally see JC selling JYL to the Jins to appease JGS so she could be used as a political hostage against WWX.

Some points, in no particular order: First off, Madam Jin for sure respects JYL. Yeah, she dismisses JZXun insulting WWX (that’s important; he’s insulting WWX, a glorified servant, not JYL) because WWX is just a servant, but when JYL says that this isn’t a minor thing to her Madam Jin orders JZXun to apologise. To a servant. To appease JYL. That suggests the opposite of what you’re saying; it suggests that Madam Jin adores and respects JYL enough that she’ll force her family to lower themselves to the level of a man viewed by the Jins as a servant for her sake. And if she’s prepared to do that, maybe she could be convinced to do other things! Like... I don’t know, send servants to buy some food at market that can then be sent to Yiling? Or, alternately, JYL could ask the adoring husband who will give her anything she wants for money which she could then send to Yiling. And if she doesn’t trust anyone from Lanling (or Yunmeng; if she can ask JC to bring her to Yiling she can ask him to deliver some money) enough to think they could be persuaded to help her out with this, including the brother who she knows knows the Wens and WWX are innocent, then that raises a whole bunch of other questions about things like why the fuck she trusted anything the Jiangs and Jins said about WWX.

In fact, that’s kind of the issue here. Everything about her being dependant on JC and then the Jins raises an important question: if she, as she seems to, doesn’t doubt that JC and the Jins are being honest in their dealings with WWX... then why doesn’t she ask them to help him? Why doesn’t she even try? She goes to the Burial Mounds with JC and sees how badly things are going for WWX... and doesn’t feel the need to question whatever story JC gave her about what WWX was doing?

See, that’s the problem at the end of the day. It’s not about whether JYL could have done anything (although I’d say she could’ve done more than she did), it’s about whether or not she tried. Which... there’s no evidence she did. She brings WWX soup one time, but there’s no evidence that she tried to send him and his people actual supplies, or the means to acquire those supplies on their own. She convinces JZX to invite WWX to JL’s one month anniversary, but JZX is still assuming that WWX is the aggressor even though at least in CQL JYL knows for a fact he’s not and should have told him that. She shows up in her fucking wedding dress talking about her approaching marriage to the son of the man who’s in the process of ruining WWX’s life and there isn’t a single word that implies she’s at all unhappy with this situation; while I did say that JC could have forced her to marry JZX against her will there is no evidence that that was in fact the case and it looks more like he was just doing what she wanted him to. (Honestly the wedding dress thing in general is like... on the surface it’s a sweet gesture, and I’m sure that’s what she meant it as, but if you think about it her showing up in the dress WWX won’t be able to see her get married in to give him enough soup to keep a couple people fed for maybe a day when he’s got fifty starving civilians up that mountain and let him name the nephew he’s never going to get to meet and talk about her marriage into the family that’s currently running a massive smear campaign to get WWX killed and then leaving and as far as we see never trying to help him after that beyond wrangling him an invite to an event that clearly no one wants him at besides her is such a slap in the face whether that was intentional on her part or not that I’m surprised it doesn’t get talked about more.)

Look, JYL may be a woman in a patriarchal society and a weak cultivator, but it does not follow that she has no power. Or that no one respects her or is willing to apologise to her for slights against her, for that matter. She’s the sister of a sect leader. The wife of a sect heir. Even if she failed to actually achieve anything, the fact is that her lack of suspicion towards her family (by birth and marriage) and their actions in regards to WWX’s situation makes it pretty obvious to me that either she asked them to help or look further into the matter and didn’t feel the need to question why the only person willing to so much as make an attempt was her husband... or she didn’t ask at all. And the latter seems more likely, given how we see her react to conflict between her brothers; it’s “boys will be boys” and “they’re just teasing, they’re as bad as each other” all the way down, even when JC is threatening WWX with his literal worst fear or telling him that the children of servants will never amount to anything. JYL will defend WWX from outsiders, but the second he’s being targeted by JC she just decides everything’s fine. Maybe she really couldn’t have helped him! Maybe bringing him a bowl of soup and pretending everything was fine really was all she could do! But given there’s no mention either from her or from the narration itself that she so much as tried to do more... Well, it raises questions, and the fact that those questions are never brought up in this fandom means that I perhaps feel the need to be a little firmer on this point than I might be otherwise.

#mdzs #cql #lotus sister #this is definitely getting to the point where i need a separate tag for jyl huh #i still love her! but she wasn't exactly a FANTASTIC sister to wwx regardless of how much they loved each other #anon #asks

[crossdressingdeath]

I seriously think people need to stop being so hard on WWX for the whole core transfer thing. I agree that maybe WWX could have spoken to JC about it first, because even though he wasn’t in a great state of mind, he did calm down enough after WWX said that there was a way to restore his core, and he could have maybe mentioned his plan then. Whether JC wanted it or not, that'd be up to JC - so I do understand why some people have an issue with the consent side of it. However, I think the 1/8

extent of the reactions that some JC stans seem to have is pretty extreme. It's always a blatant, ‘WWX shouldn't have done that, it was a violation, he didn't get consent first,’ ect. and literally no empathy or understanding for his situation. Even if they can argue that WWX could have informed JC about what was going on first, you also need to consider the situation he was in. This was a teenage boy who had just had his whole home destroyed, the people who had raised him/he'd grown up with 2/8

killed; he had been blamed for the whole thing by both his brother and the woman who had abused him for most of his life, and YZY's dying wish was that he protect her son no matter what. Then, almost immediately after, his brother gets kidnapped, and is badly injured and has his core destroyed. WWX was in a terrible mindset by that point, was feeling heaps of misplaced guilt - and then JC wakes up and literally starts losing his mind. Of course I'm not complaining about this, JC had just 3/8

been tortured and had his life achievement taken away from him, of course he would be completely hysterical. But from WWX's side, watching this, of course he's completely freaking out. Just look at this scene. JC has literally completely given up by this point. WWX probably feels like he is about to lose his brother, and on top of that, YZY's words are probably replaying in his head. Then, when JC wakes up again, he is completely suicidal. He refuses to eat, he doesn't even want to move. 4/8

There's a moment when WWX asks JC, “Do you really want to die?" and I think that's the moment when he truly makes up his mind. Perhaps JC might have learnt to live with it in time, or perhaps WWX could have helped him cope with it, but that's not what we're talking about right now. We are talking about a teenaged boy who has been through horrible trauma, has been blamed for the destruction of his home, and is in a terrible place right now. 5/8

All he really has left at this point is JYL and JC, and he probably feels like he needs to protect them to make up for his 'mistakes' - and despite his best efforts, JC has been hurt, and is threatening to end his life. Even when you ignore all of that other stuff, just the amount of fear anyone - let alone a CHILD - would feel, watching someone they loved going through all of this. Of course he would want to do anything to make JC happy again. Overall, WWX was in a terrible place at the 6/8

time; he was in over his head, and he didn't know what else to DO to make the situation better. People who act like he was blatantly violating JC's consent, or whatever else they're saying, don't seem to take into account any of these extenuating circumstances, or the fact that this was a teenaged boy trying to handle a situation he should have never had to deal with in the only way he knew how to. I've seen so many people talk about how JC doesn't need to be grateful because he never 7/8

asked for this, but WWX never asked him to be grateful. He didn't even want JC to know - he only ever wanted him to be happy. And it's just frustrating how so many JC stans refuse to see any of the nuances in these events, or understand that there was just so much going on, and that any of their arguments against the core transfer don’t mean the exact same thing in that situation that they might, say, if the same thing had happened post-canon. 8/8

Yes. WWX was a teenager watching his brother die in front of him! JC refused to even speak to him! All WWX knew was that losing his golden core was killing JC, and giving up his own in return was the only thing he could think of that could possibly save him. It’s not a violation to give someone an organ when the alternative is letting them die; why should this be any different? WWX was raised in such a way that his reaction to a situation like this was... kind of inevitable, too. The Jiangs really did groom him to put them above himself in every respect, so of course his reaction to JC losing his golden core was to offer up his own! And JC did play a part in that grooming; he too very clearly believed WWX should always put himself second, and WWX took that to heart. Why is it such a surprise that WWX would give up such a huge part of himself to someone who always expected that from him without feeling the need to ask? JC had taught him that he expected that level of sacrifice from WWX. That’s a big part of why he was willing to give up his golden core, and it never seems to get brought up in these discussions, likely because it involves acknowledging that... yeah, JC was in fact abusive towards WWX and taught him to put JC ahead of himself in every respect.

And the whole “JC doesn’t need to be grateful because he didn’t ask for this” is like... sure, okay, but he should at least acknowledge what WWX gave up for him? He should recognize how much love and devotion such a huge sacrifice would have demanded? But he doesn’t. I really do get the sense that this was something he expected WWX to do. This was the required level of self-sacrifice. He doesn’t treat it as something incredible that very few people would have the will to do to themselves with such terrible odds no matter how much they loved the other person, he takes it as rightful payment for his family’s deaths. It’s not “Oh, how could you do such a huge thing”; it’s “It is right and just that you would sacrifice everything in payment for deaths that weren’t even your fault but also how dare you permanently outdo me and then not even spend the rest of your life as my servant”. So... yeah, the golden core transfer is a combination of WWX’s desperation on seeing his brother committing slow suicide right in front of him and JC himself teaching WWX that that level of sacrifice would be acceptable that led to WWX feeling that giving up his golden core would be something that JC would be okay with without even feeling the need to ask him (never mind that he didn’t have the ability to ask him because JC refused to speak to him.)

#mdzs #cql #grapehate #dis-core-se #anon #asks