#i tend to handwave it by remembering most of this lore comes from in game books written by fictional people who are capable of being wrong

[felassan]

Hello, I know you're a really good loremaster, one of the best, so what's the most fitting class if I wanted to roleplay a character as a Chantry Priest? I wanted to import my character from another RPG where they were a healer priest of a monastery but can't make them a Mage in DA because it seems like the nature of metaphysics of the universe conflicts with their character So is a templar-spec nomad in light robed gear or a Rogue like Leliana/Seb more fitting for a Priest? Which is closer? ty!

Hi Nonnie, awsh thanku, that’s v kind of you to say. :) here’s some thoughts for your consideration. cut for length.

in terms of the frames of how classes and class-tropes are in some other similar (fantasy, sword n sorcery, etc) settings, spirit healer mages in DA remind me of classical clerics and the white mage archtype. here’s (spoilers for Tevinter Nights and Blue Wraith at link) a recent post about what we know about how healing magic works in the DA setting, just in case it’s of any interest/use to you.

in terms of mundane healing and non-magical medicine references in the DA settings, the lore has references to “healers”, “surgeons”, “medics”, and “physicians”. there are also midwives, apothecaries, herbalists and alchemists, although it’s unclear if one has to be a mage to brew a straight-up potion-potion. here’s what the DA wiki has to say about medicine/healing arts in Thedas, both magical and mundane. you might be particularly interested in the following:

the only access to any sort of proper care that common people would have is through the Chantry, or one of the Circles of Magi. The visitation of a Circle-approved mage practitioner must be arranged through a Templar. The local chantry provides care for the sick, and members of the clergy may travel to troubled areas in order to provide free relief in the name of charity.

as it pertains to having Chantry clergypeople healing and providing medical care to the sick.

the templars strike me as paladin-esque. what they really do as an Order isn’t really the same, but the basal archtype is there. they are essentially this’s setting’s holy warriors, the crusaders. bear in mind that if you make your character a templar or someone who has the abilities of a templar, they are essentially taking on an addiction to the substance lyrium, which becomes a serious problem for people in the latter stages/grips of the addiction. lyrium withdrawal is unpleasant and comes with significant cravings. over time, users lose their memories and their minds, become paranoid and obsessive, exhibiting dementia-like symptoms, etc. templars in the Order are sworn to protect the world from the dangers of magic, but their primary duties on average usually boil down to acting as jailers to the mages kept in Circles, hunting down escapees, and ‘bringing in’ mages who came into their power outside of the Circle, although there are ofc other duties like guarding Chantries or being the bodyguards of the Divine. mentioning this stuff because it would naturally have an impact on how you play your character. perhaps not the Templar Order stuff if you make someone with templar abilities who isn’t in the Order (see below), but the lyrium stuff definitely. note it is possible to wean off and stop taking lyrium, Cullen can do this according to PC choices in DAI.

there are examples of non-heavy templar armor in the games, like Templar Armor - Light Issue (a medium chestpiece). DAI presents us with red templar enemies who are archers/marksmen. from what I remember they still wear heavy, or at least medium/heavy-looking, armor. they’re deformed by red lyrium so it’s not really a helpful thing to note, but the red templar enemy faction in DAI’s stealth units, Shadows, still look like they’re wearing heavy or heavy-looking armor.

Light Armor tends to be for mages, but not exclusively. when we meet Leliana in DAO, she’s in Chantry robes, which iirc DAO defines as clothing technically (DAO has both LA and clothing as item categories). she wears these when she assists the Warden with the skirmish with soldiers in the Lothering Tavern. (I doubt she didn’t switch to other, more protective gear for the duration of the Fifth Blight though, regardless of player choice here). in the Magi Origin, there’s Lily, a Chanty initiate. she’s a temporary companion/party member and does some fighting. she’s also wearing the robes and the game classes her as a rogue. incidentally she can be equipped with a dagger and a mace.

the actual priesthood of the Chantry is made up entirely of women. men are only allowed to become true priests in the Imperial Chantry, which is the Chantry of Tevinter. in the southern Chantry, the only rank men are allowed to have is Brother. the best example of a Chantry Brother we’ve had as you say is Sebastian. Brother Burkel also springs to mind as a non-companion example. (he doesn’t fight but if you YouTube him you can see how he sounds and what he talks like when he’s speaking to the PC) men are allowed to occupy associated/adjacent roles like chanters and scholars. of particular note here is how the Chantry’s male acolytes, basically an ‘invisible army’, tend to tend to the less spiritual side of things; they keep the Chantry in good repair, fed and see to the physical well-being of their Andrastian charges (tying to the above excerpt about local Chantries and so on caring for the sick, although do note I can easily see female Chantrypeople doing that role too even if they are ‘priestesses’). the exception to this outside of Tevinter would be in post-DAI worldstates where Leliana was made Divine; she opens the priesthood to all genders and races. sth to bear in mind if your imported character is a male and you’re set on the whole priest aspect as opposed to a lower-ranked Brother.

on balance if you wanted to RP as a Chantry clergyperson (bear in mind “Chantry clergyperson” is my phrasing for the ease of this answer and not necessarily a label from the lore) I think the Rogue class angle would be more fitting. there are examples of Chantry clergypeople who are Rogues and fought as such in the lore (Leliana, Sebastian), and I can’t recall examples of templars in light armor or robed gear. A Chantry clergyperson more closely matches the role of a healer priest in a monastery; we can see from the lore there are mundane healing skills/professions and there’s a definite precedent for Chantry clergypeople to be caring for and tending to the sick. You could play the most skilled mundane healer Chantry clergyperson from a particular Chantry - perhaps even a formally trained physician who gave themselves to a life of service in the Chantry - and/or to capture the travelling angle, your character could be one of those clergypeople who travels to troubled areas in order to provide free healing and relief. if you wanted I think you could have them don a more protective form of equipment or a more protective version of Chantry robes for safety when travelling, or if they’re particularly combat-inclined, like Leliana in her mission in DA2, or Leliana’s Sacred Ashes trailer armor, or Lily’s Heroes of Dragon Age appearance.

I feel like if you went for the templar angle it sounds like you’d be leaning away from the heart of your character, which seems to be a healer monk/travelling priest/traveling healer-type deal. templars are sth different. you would also have to explain how a nomad person gained the powers and abilities of a templar, since that’s usually the purview of templars only, and usually requires templar training from the Order, and always the imbibing of lyrium. Alistair was a trainee who left before starting lyrium. him teaching the abilities to Warrior PCs or Warrior PCs reading how to be a templar in a book in DAO, Templar Hawke and Cassandra’s spec being the Templar spec in DAI are more like story/gameplay segregation. Cass is a Seeker of Truth, in truth, for instance, not a templar. it’s a bit more realistic and less handwaved in DAI for the PC at least - Way of the Templar is the sidequest through which the DAI PC gains the spec, and specifies that if you construct a lyrium philter (for the imbibing of lyrium) and “study the methods of the templars” (which = doing a lot of related reading) you can learn the secrets of the spec from someone who knows it or knows about it. on the subject of not being part of the Order, the character Ser is interesting because he knows the physical aspects of being a templar but makes it clear he’s not part of the Order. the abilities of a templar might not necessarily be what you’re looking for either - they’re about dispelling and nullifying magic, inhibiting spellcasting, not healing. usually these abilities are employed to fell demons, abominations and be turned against mages. also bear in mind the templar spec has so far been the purview of the Warrior class. imo a rogue like Leliana or Seb would be closer to what you’re describing, out of the 2 options in your ask.

hope this helps you decide or at least gives you some food for thought :)

@simonjadis has some great input below in the notes: if you’re open to making your character a Tevinter citizen, note that men (if applicable) have access to all levels of rank in the Imperial Chantry, and mages can be part of the clergy (if you decided that in the end being a mage was acceptable in this setting for your char). following on from the mage angle, although not a priest or part of the clergy, you could make a loyalist, faithful Andrastian spirit healer mage. Wynne in DAO is our best example of someone in this position so far.

#dragon age #bioware #mj replies #anonymous #video games #simonjadis

[whatisthisnonsense]

Okay you know what I am gonna talk shit in a proper well-thought-out manner because I’m salty and stressed and I may as well channel it into something fun like yelling about anime in an over the top display of angery as befitting this cesspool of a social media platform. This being said I’m gonna do it under a read-more ‘cause most of ya’ll ain’t got time for no negative nonsense and some of you genuinely enjoy Tri, and you know what, I respect you, you’re valid.

Okay so to explain how much I want to throw Bandai into a dumpster, we first need to go back and explain Adventure and the fiasco that was 02.

Digimon Adventure came out in 1999 (March 6th in japan and August 14th in the states, which coincidentally means this show came out exactly on my sixth birthday!) and lasted for about a year, with 54 episodes. The plot was simple; seven punkass grade schoolers turned out to have been chosen by fate to defend the Digital World, an alternate plane of reality created by various forms of digital information (the wee baby internet of the era, for example), mostly to kind of justify Bandai’s V-Pet (Tamogatchis but they’re gross and can FIGHT) and sell toys. So like, Transformers but with more human characters and kickass monsters and sometimes a lesson about the Power Of Friendship. Later, they find out they were chosen because they saw their neighborhood get wrecked by two monsters and Inexplicably Forgot This, as well as the fact there’s actually a missing member of their group (which less than surprisingly turned out to be the leader character’s little sister, who had already been seen in a prior episode and had also been involved in that early monster attack). It was hokey, the english dub generally bordered on that of a proto-abridged series if not aggressively sanitizing things (turning sake into green chili sauce, for example) and it was just good dumb fun and in the end everyone was crying anyway because dammit, while it was dumb fun you still cared about these characters and loved how they grew up. And then came 02.

Hoo boy. Digimon 02 came out in 2000 (April 2nd in japan and August 19th in the states) and lasted for another year or so. While sometimes listed as a second season, in truth it was a sequel series and it had...some interesting ideas, lets say. And I mean that sincerely! They did have some good ideas! But it was pretty clear from the lack of direction and the constant roller coaster of serious and stupid that it was being a sequel for the sake of being a sequel. For example, a whole new super secret crest turned up out of nowhere, which brings up a lot of questions in the lore but is mostly used to prove Ken isn’t irredeemable because he’s a Chosen Child ,as well as the questions about how this Crest is still present and useable and then literally gets no use. No Ultimate Form Wormmon for you, folks, NORMAL digivolution is out! I think I and @yunisverse have made our opinion on how to use that crest better clear while we’re being salty over Wizardmon, ha People have said that it’s big draw was that it had a heavier focus on character development and...yes and no? On the one hand, Ken and Cody’s arcs were genuinely enjoyable, Kindness shenanigans aside, as was occasionally exploring TK and Kari’s trauma, something often brushed over in the original series. On the other hand, more or less the whole of Adventure centered AROUND character growth where in 02 it’s...sporadic. Sometimes even random. However the main two reasons everyone was mad at 02 were these;

The original digidestined that were not Kari or TK got shunted onto the backburner, usually using excuses as they had given up their crest powers sometime between Our War Game and the present (despite that A) this is otherwise disregarding the fact they were supposedly not able to enter the digital world again until 02 and B) the power is literally inside them as part of their core, not something the digiworld actually gave to them, and while it could be diminished it could never actually be removed) or that it was the New Kids turn, often with wildly out of character personality developments. (Looking at you, Sora’s new docileness and Mimi’s lack of involvement in most of the plot period.)

The epilogue, which not only gave everyone really weird future jobs (why is Matt an astronaut?!) but also seemed pretty much out to be as aggressively Happily Ever After without actually stopping to think about any implications or actual lead-ups.

02 usually gets a pass from riding on the Adventure coattails, but everyone still tended to be at least disappointed in what had occurred. Also, more serious takes on Digimon, such as Tamers and some of the games, had been growing in popularity.

Thus Bandai, in it’s infinite wisdom, decided to cash back in on Nostalgia by focusing on the Adventure kids, making them closer to 02 so they’re older and they can therefore do more serious mature takes like Tamers, while also trying to rectify how they would even begin to come around to their epilogue jobs. They do this by killing the 02 cast in the first two minutes.

Welcome to Tri folks! Okay, so the 02 cast isn’t actually dead, but we don’t know where they are for six movies. Six movies!! The most we know for a few years is Ken, for some reason, has reverted to evil! And he has Imperialdramon, which implies Davis is brainwashed too!

He is basically doing this most of the series (which was initially going to be a mini-series before becoming a series of movies which then proceed to often be cut up into episodes, which that alone should tell you the problems BEHIND the scenes much less on screen) and we find out what he is (not actually Ken but an evil Gennai clone which is also out of nowhere) and what he’s doing (apparently bringing Yggdrasil, long time lore big bad of various digimon continuities and also god, into the Adventure storyline) not by efforts of the kids. Oh no. They’re too busy playing with their new friend Mei!

God I wish I was joking. The original squad literally shows no concern for where the 02 gang is until halfway through, and it’s a handwave at best and quickly moved on from. Hell, they barely react to “Ken” and CHEER on defeating Imperialdramon! More gravitas was given to having to kill the plot coupon of the day, Meicoonmon, than someone they actually know and should be upset about. Also making Tai NOT want to rush into a fight (what?), Turns Out Homeostatis Is Also Evil Or At Least Amoral (why), a reveal one of the backstory five original digidestined went mad with grief (no), and also I guess for some reason the kids and digimon were separated again given their reactions despite 02′s ending? That’s. That’s not even keeping your own continuity. Why are you like this. Also connecting to the epilogue just seem to be on a whim (not metaphor, Matt decides to be an astronaut on a whim), the general lack of gravitas in most moments followed by moments of SEVERE gravitas (which is the 02 problem but Worse), and bad jokes. I don’t mean Good Bad Jokes like Adventure, just really not funny jokes. And the real bitch of the matter? It had a few things that should’ve made it AWESOME! Like listen, I miss these idiot kids a lot, and the concept of a virus forcing a reboot on the digiworld and thus having to explore, finally, the digimon as characters and what they would be like without the kids? That’s cool! The idea of undoing all the Perma Digideaths (like WIZARDMON goddammit, and in this own show friggin’ Leomon again) with said reboot and thus having a pretty legitimate reason to allow it? Also cool! Worldbuilding about the previous five digidestined? Neat! And lets be real, you all cried at the cast version of Butter-Fly. You know you did. But the thing is they didn’t DO anything with most of this, or did it in a sloppy way. Example; the virus was basically a means to an end for waking up Yggdrasil (I’m not calling him King Drasil, that’s stupid), right? Why? When the Adventure-verse, often to it’s own detriment, is actively tied to the Milleniumon mythos, you could just pull in that eldritch horror and finally have Ryo make sense everywhere not japan. Or heck, the Dark Ocean! Remember the Dark Ocean? Where literally cthulu is and also Daemon now? Apparently neither do the script writers since that would’ve been a golden opportunity.  Of course, this would be asking for continuity, which Tri has issues with within its own narrative. Remember when I said the reboot should’ve undone all permadeaths? Yeah, Wizardmon still shows up as a ghost later to lead Kari out of trouble. No lines or anything, just pops up facing away from the audience and leads her out, and then vanishes, despite the fact that according to the rules they made up for the reboot, he should be a cute little Mokumon in Primary Village at the moment who remembers nothing. Also it kind of low-key has the vibe that growing up is terrible and results in having to make awful decisions? Which I’m not sure is what they meant to do, but it does pretty much have that end result. And that sucks! Even Tamers didn’t do that! Growing up is HARD, sure, but there are GOOD things about it too, and being Adventure one would think that would be the main focus! Nope. I just. This should have been good and when it was announced I was super excited and now I’m pretty much exasperated by its mere existence. And now we’re getting a sequel after ANOTHER timeskip.

Bandai if this is how you give us a nostalgia feels trip, do us a favor and let Adventure die. You’re just making the sugary memories of childhood have a bitter aftertaste. Or, if you must, just do a proper reboot. Tie up things that actually WERE wrong with the original series and do some clean ups but otherwise leave it untouched. We all know you’re trying to capture the magic twice, guys, you’re not even trying to hide it now. TL;DR, The only parts I like about Tri are Butter-Fly (cast version) and the fact Tai and Matt are gayer than ever

#Digimon Adventure #Digimon 02 #Digimon tri #I'm about to get REAL salty so like #If you like Tri don't look you're still valid #I just do not and want to express why since I've been mulling it over since that ask