#obviously that's not like. the sole basis of a lasting friendship. lol. like. there's plenty of white ppl who won't use her to excuse

[britneyshakespeare]

In my last personal post I told a story in the tags about a friend I've made in the past several months who used to be friends with a bunch of casually racist cishet white guys and whatnot. I mentioned how she sent me a message the other night about how she really feels like she trusts me and can be herself around me and how good that feels. But that post was about casual racism more than friendship so here's a positive post about friendship. God I just love meeting people and hanging out with them and doing cool things and introducing each other to cool new places. I love emotionally bonding through the gradual reveal of different layers of the self. I love having my set of interests, while they also have their own, but there's a good amount of thematic overlap and exchange and lending each other books and recommending movies and talking about them and stuff. I love when you haven't even known someone long but you can just feel a strong common sympathy there and like you're going to be friends for a long time. Like sometimes it comes out of nowhere when you really don't expect it and aren't looking for it but you're just speaking to someone you just met and shortly into it you're like "!!!!" inside your head because it's like. Wow. I could talk to this person forever. We could just shoot the shit on whatever topic and it would be a good time. Love that all so much.

#the tags i wrote about this friend didn't really show we were close for any other reason than me not being racist to her like the guys #she's just letting go of. but while that's certainly a reason we became closer (me sympathizing w her & finding their behavior disgusting) #obviously that's not like. the sole basis of a lasting friendship. lol. like. there's plenty of white ppl who won't use her to excuse #themselves when they want to be racist for an edgy joke. im not special im just Not Horrible for that. #even if it is new to her i always remind her that there's better out there than them and im not SO exceptional for treating her w respect. #which we all need to be reminded of sometimes if we have a history of toxic friendships/relationships but still. #we're actually bonded much more by our interests and worldviews. like. she LOVES philosophy and is somewhat into poetry #i on the other hand LOVE poetry and am somewhat into philosophy. #we have really interesting conversations and recommendations to each other. i like exchanging thoughts abt what we're reading or watching #we also like to go to secondhand stores and buy old books. and knickknacks and whatnot. #that's been a fun way to bond #and she's taken me to some open mic poetry events in her neighborhood that are AMAZING #i never read my stuff onstage since i was like 15 before her. and ive seen her grow as a performer as she's started doing it. #it's such a cool evolution. i love her. i love spending time w her she's such a cool friend. #tales from diana

[sundayschoolpodcast]

You might have already addressed this but I keep hearing about people being upset with what happened to Fiore and was wondering your opinions? I'm not exactly sure what's upset people? I think there's unanswered questions and we may see him and DeBlanc again. Seth and Evan hinted to as much in their AMA. There was an illusion to a homosexual relationship between Fiore and DeBlanc but it was never confirmed. They loved each other but I think it was very innocent. I think they were supposed to be

Second half of message: 

Seen as innocent, since they are angels. They didn’t seem to understand the way the world worked in a lot of aspects. Two angels sleeping together doesn’t mean that it has to be sexual. And if Fiore and Cassidy had sex that doesn’t make him or Cassidy gay. It’s an angel and a vampire who I’m sure the concept of sexuality and even gender didn’t play into it…. If I’m making any sense lol

Response (Rachel’s, aka @hermouthslipped ): Ahh yes. Haha well, I have a Fiore/DeBlanc blog, so I am almost certainly going to be biased in this regard. That said, I will put forth my best effort approach the question impartially. 

To begin, let me say that I understand why the episode would not strike you as particularly devastating. I think there was (and is) a very passionate sect of fans who invested themselves in this aspect of the story, but they (we) were giving spotlight to dialogue and actions which otherwise could be overlooked by the blanket statement “The angels are weird.” 

But Fiore and DeBlanc were written to be together romantically. You’re right, sexuality transcends whatever the two of them were before they came to Earth - Yusef spoke at length about the characters struggling now they were a part of the physical world, a world they did not understand at all. In terms of pain, this means they’ve never felt it before. In terms of sex, this translates to the scene with the vibrator Jesse finds in their things - looking inquiringly at DeBlanc, DeBlanc replies unabashedly with “It was our first time, we didn’t know what we’d need.” (Sundowner)

This quote reflects the two’s profound confusion over how the world works - and makes the most sense if DeBlanc means “It was our first time…having human sex.” It also reflects how completely oblivious they are to what is and is not considered strange to humans. This fits in with their behavior a lot throughout the season - DeBlanc and Fiore apparently thinking that the “cut him open with a chainsaw” plan would satisfy Cassidy, DeBlanc and Fiore never feeling the need to explain why Genesis apparently lives in a coffee can, DeBlanc and Fiore being absolutely scandalized by Jesse’s curiosity about where Genesis came from, etc., etc…If Fiore slept (as in sex) with Cassidy, then he was surely sleeping (as in sex) with DeBlanc. I would actually be extremely uncomfortable with the scenario if that weren’t the case…it would feel much more exploitive and almost predatory - if Cassidy officiated Fiore into a variety of sex he apparently had no knowledge or experience with before. As I read the scene, Cassidy slept with Fiore to provide the “friendship” Fiore was so obviously lost without, the friendship he got from DeBlanc…friendship which would more aptly be described as a romantic relationship. It helped Fiore, because he was so alone at the time. I don’t think Fiore would have gotten the heart-eyes music when he looked at Cassidy laughing at his joke if he had not already experienced that sort of intimacy with someone else who he identified as a “friend.” The sex with Cassidy was ultra-intimate in what (who) it reminded Fiore of, and so it could not be shown - whereas the sex with the prostitute could be played for laughs, as Fiore was clearly completely uninterested. 

But you’re right, they left it ambiguous. There was enough room for viewers to not consider Fiore as in a relationship with DeBlanc. And that is a lot of the reason so many people are upset. Dominic Cooper referred to DeBlanc as the “love of [Fiore’s] life.” But none of the actual show runners had the balls to admit frankly that that was the nature of the two’s relationship. They offered the idea of Fiore sleeping with Cassidy as consolation prize to us not hearing them admit verbatim that Fiore and DeBlanc were together. This decision pissed a lot of people off, myself included. 

Now, this might be out of left field, depending on how much you followed the angelship theories, but the other integral component of DeBlanc and Fiore’s relationship was (is) this: DeBlanc is not an angel - he is a demon. I was (am) more sure about that aspect of the show than I was (am) sure about the “being in a relationship” aspect. Yusef said as much in an interview. DeBlanc speaks over Fiore when Fiore seems about to disagree with DeBlanc about the two of them being “from heaven.” (He says “Both of us” before Fiore can contradict him…as we see with the conversation about the angel phone, Fiore is not good at shutting up when he needs to.) DeBlanc talks about having been to Hell before, Yusef says that DeBlanc “took this job” to get out of hell, and explains Fiore isn’t as afraid of Hell because “He’s from heaven.” DeBlanc also never touches the angel phone. (He doesn’t have “angel hands”)

Now, if they were changing the direction of the story, that would be one thing. But it does not seem as though they are. In this last episode, Fiore never said DeBlanc was an angel - even though he was given plenty of opportunities to. When Cassidy asks “So the Saint can kill angels, right?” Fiore responds with “He can kill anyone. He killed DeBlanc.” 

The writers could have just had Fiore say “Yes, he killed DeBlanc.”

Another hint is given when Jesse is talking to Fiore about Eugene: “You said once you’d get him out for me.” To which Fiore replies: “Well, that’s not going to work. Not anymore. Besides, I’m never going back there.” 

Fiore could have just said “Well that’s not going to work. I’m never going back there.” Replying in the way that he did implied that there are two reasons Fiore is not going to rescue Eugene - one reason is stated, Fiore refuses to return to Hell. But the other reason, the first reason, is not stated. I think it makes the most sense for it be referring to the fact that Fiore no longer has DeBlanc to help him navigate hell - which DeBlanc would be able to do, because DeBlanc is a demon.

A final hint is the fact Fiore referred to both himself and DeBlanc as the individuals who hired the Saint (”we hired him, his contract is with us, he’ll listen to me”)…this is rather strange, because it sure seems like DeBlanc was killed more or less immediately…long before he could be counted as “hiring” anyone. IF DeBlanc was a demon, this would make more sense - as it would imply that both an angel and a demon are needed to open a contract with the Saint. McTavish has said that the Saint has not just been promised the opportunity to be reunited with his family, he has been promised the opportunity to be reunited with his family in Heaven. Transferring the Saint from Hell to Heaven would be a transaction involving both sides. 

I bring up this aspect of the fan theory because it recasts the two of them in my mind - I do not consider them to both be angels, and that alone means that they are less innocent than they might seem. Fiore knows about sex and prostitution. And DeBlanc at least knows that vibrators are not a component of gay sex - something he apparently learned, as he felt compelled to provide an explanation to Jesse.  

Of course, the logical conclusion from 1) Fiore and DeBlanc being together + 2) DeBlanc being a demon while Fiore is an angel is this: Fiore and DeBlanc are the celestial beings who conjoined and created Genesis. I am okay with this not being true (I have a lot of evidence supporting and refuting this aspect of it), but it just seems astronomically improbable to present two separate, unrelated angel/demon relationships. Had this theory been confirmed, Fiore and DeBlanc - a gay couple, at least to viewers (because you’re right, gender isn’t really a thing in Heaven) - would have been seamlessly woven into the plot in a capacity which does not make their characters’ arc based solely on their sexuality - yet while still exploring the latent theme of “forbidden love” - without the forbidden love referring to gender. 

The comics were extraordinarily homophobic. Were this theory to be a reality, the TV show would be fixing the original story’s failings in a manner which is progressive, thematically rich, and brilliantly subtle.

As we stand with the show now, they have - depending on whether or not you believe Fiore and DeBlanc were in a relationship - either killed four gay characters (I’m counting the mascot suicide in the finale), or killed two gay characters, and two gay-ish characters (again, if you do not believe that DeBlanc and Fiore were ever actually together.) Now, IF Rogen and Goldberg’s reddit chat actually yields hope in terms of continuing the characters’ story, I can forgive them. But I am wary, it was disappointing to hear how they referred to the two of them in Talking Preacher (aside from Cooper.)  

Now, I suppose I (we) could just be seeing what I (we) want to see. I have picked over this show so much, and I know that when you are in so deep - your vision can become fogged. And so perhaps all of this will sound like a conspiracy theory to you - which I get and understand. All of this however is the basis for the intense betrayal angelship fans felt at the episode’s conclusion - and why so many of them (us) are afraid to hope that the story will ever be reopened.

I hope this clarifies the emotional reaction certain fans are having - again, I do understand that this is not an aspect of the show universally followed. If you want to hear our reasoning for why we consider the relationship having existed (or presently exists, depending on how optimistic you are) - Kathryn (@priscillajeanohare) and I devoted our third episode to exploring the three aspects of the angelship fan theory…it expands on more of what I presented above.

Apologies for the long, long, long post - and thank you so, so, SO much for writing in, and for listening - it means a ton when you guys talk to us, we absolutely love it. Cheers.

–R