#why are all of my long posts about sao lao yan

[hunxi-after-hours]

Any thoughts on the similarities and differences between hualian and yanshen??

(kicks down the door) DO I HAVE THOUGHTS OR WHAT

so it's funny you ask this, anon, because when I was reading 《千秋》 and Going Through It, I distinctly remember trying to explain it to people and at one point saying "the main ship of 《千秋》 is like TGCF if the central ship of TGCF was Xie Lian/Bai Wuxiang"

which, having now finished the book, isn't actually that accurate, but I think it gets at the Two Main Things that come to mind when I compare and contrast TGCF/QQ: 1) Xie Lian and Shen Qiao parallels, and 2) the arc of enemies/symbolic opposites/narrative foils-to-lovers

I think there's a lot to unpack between TGCF and QQ on levels of character, theme, and relationship, which all orbit around/interact with the material of the central ship, so grab some tea, this is going to get roundabout:

first, let's talk character similarities w/o relationships in the picture:

Shen Qiao 🤝 Xie Lian:

too good for this world, too pure

has gone through literal hell and back

refuses to give up morals even under the threat of intense suffering/death

ridiculously pretty

unrepentant sword nerd

always assumes the best of people

Yan Wushi 🤝 Hua Cheng:

will roast anything that moves

ambiguously evil (or at least, perceived as evil by other characters in the narrative)

can and will wipe the floor with anyone in the room

does not especially care for anyone beyond their immediate circle of close loved one(s)

so we can see a lot of superficial similarities between hualian and yanshen (it's the dynamic of ghost king/demonic cultivator x pure-hearted Daoist), but truth be told, I think the similarities between Shen Qiao and Xie Lian does most of that work, rather than anything inherent about the hualian vs. yanshen relationship

because Hua Cheng and Yan Wushi have starkly different character arcs, which then reflects upon the general relationship arcs in their respective stories

in TGCF, the only thing keeping hualian apart are the secrets they hold about themselves. seriously, by the end of book one (book!! one!! of!! five!!) the two of them move into Puqi Shrine together and live in peak domesticity until the plot comes rudely knocking on the door. the only reasons why hualian don't get together immediately are because 1) the plot Continues to Happen, and 2) they met each other like, yesterday, they're still getting around to actually knowing each other

the slow burn of TGCF primarily comes from the flashback reveals about hualian's past--for Xie Lian, his greatest secret and greatest shame is how close he came to becoming a Calamity, which is why when Hua Cheng tells Xie Lian that he was there, that he had been at his side, that he supported and loved Xie Lian unconditionally through the darkest days of his immortal life, Xie Lian is amazed and moved to tears

for Hua Cheng, his greatest secret and greatest shame is the true depths of his obsessive love, overcoming a certain amount of internalized shame and of course, the mortifying ordeal of having exactly how much you care be known by the object of your affections

but like, once they talk it out on both sides, they are in full battle couple mode from pretty much mid-book three onwards

MEANWHILE WITH YANSHEN. god. meanwhile with yanshen, there are no secrets to be revealed between them; their relationship does not hinge on the revelation of truths but rather the slow accumulation of shared experiences. in direct contrast to hualian, who are functionally together for most of the book, yanshen don't get together until the literal fanwai because Meng Xishi makes them earn it

oh my god she makes them work so hard for it

Yan Wushi is quite upfront with his attraction to Shen Qiao from the early chapters, but that’s all it is, really--Shen Qiao is drop-dead gorgeous, Yan Wushi is human, and there isn’t really any emotional or romantic content in their relationship beyond that. Shen Qiao, however, is definitively uninterested in Yan Wushi’s cursory advances (and the advances of literally everyone else in the jianghu sdlfkjs;flakdj), and brushes them off with long-suffering tolerance

in direct contrast to hualian, whose primary obstacle to their relationship is their knowledge (or ignorance) of each other’s past (which is, again, fairly easy to overcome because it’s no more and no less than the mortifying ordeal of being known), the primary obstacle to yanshen’s relationship is yanshen themselves

exhibit A, of course, being The Betrayal, but also the separate journeys yanshen take to realizing and accepting the fact that yes, they would in fact be interested in a relationship with the other, and yes, it takes these two chuckleheads the whole damn book to figure this out (I say, with great fondness; I wouldn’t have them any other way)

if Hua Cheng’s character arc is coming to accept himself for who he is (I’m thinking of this phenomenal meta in particular) and how much he loves (and that his love is both valuable and good), then Yan Wushi’s character arc revolves around realizing that Shen Qiao (and what Shen Qiao represents) is not only worthy of respect and admiration, but specifically worthy of his love and devotion (one of these days I’ll get over the story of the goddamn stone but not today)

meanwhile, Shen Qiao’s character arc... is about a lot of things besides yanshen, but specifically Shen Qiao’s character arc in context of their relationship goes through:

he saved my life so I owe him mine. it’s not personal though

he sold me out. that kinda felt personal?

I saved his life so we’re now even, I swear it’s not personal

we keep saving each other’s lives, and also helping each other out. it might be getting personal?

oh my god it’s personal, I actually care about him now, please don’t die you dumbass

Shen Qiao is such a fascinating character because if you don’t take the time to  excavate his interiority, he seems simple, boring, one-dimensionally good, but once you go looking, the fabric of his person is actually built of an incredibly complex weave of guilt and grief, sacrifice and selfhood, determination and resolve

and a good amount of it has to do with his developing relationship with Yan Wushi. for the vast majority of the book, Shen Qiao keeps Yan Wushi firmly at arm’s length, and his interactions with Yan Wushi are never anything beyond necessary, polite, and professional (as he can make it)

this of course, gets sorely tested due to (waves vaguely) All the Shit That Goes Down in the plot, and also Yan Wushi In General, but all the way up until... heck, up until Shen Qiao takes back sect leadership of Xuandu Shan, Shen Qiao sees Yan Wushi as nothing more than like... a coworker. a weirdly close colleague. someone he’s fought with, multiple times, a fellow traveller of the same way somehow, and it’s not until Shen Qiao hears of Yan Wushi’s challenge to Hu Lu Gu, which isn’t on Shen Qiao’s behalf but neither is it not on Shen Qiao’s behalf that something slides into place and Shen Qiao goes oh. oh?

...him, really?

and like... there’s all the domesticity of the days before the final duel, Shen Qiao slowly allowing himself to admit that actually, he does care, and in fact cares very deeply, which culminates in his realization on the peak, cradling Yan Wushi’s cooling body

because here’s the thing: as long as their relationship is professional, is impersonal, then Shen Qiao doesn’t have to acknowledge how deeply Yan Wushi’s betrayal hurt him. when people try to offer him sympathy, or condolences, or mockery disguised as sympathy or condolences about Yan Wushi’s betrayal, Shen Qiao shrugs it off and explains that Yan Wushi is just like that, it wasn’t personal, but at the same time, as long as Shen Qiao denies this, he will never have closure. he cannot forgive Yan Wushi for this betrayal until they both acknowledge that actually, it’s been personal from the beginning. Yan Wushi gets there before Shen Qiao does, but Shen Qiao figures it out, eventually

I’ve written in the past about the yanshen relationship, and how it isn’t so much a relationship of knowing as it is one of choosing. Yan Wushi chooses Shen Qiao to love and cherish; Shen Qiao chooses to forgive Yan Wushi, to allow their relationship to move forward. again, in stark contrast to hualian, the main obstacle in the yanshen relationship is their own individual character arcs, which eventually lead them to a place where they can realize the potential of their shared relationship arc

I also think it’s worthwhile to point out that Hua Cheng isn’t... he’s not evil at all. his morals are at all times taizi-dianxia-oriented, which is quite compatible with Xie Lian’s general goodness and Xie Lian’s laidback attitude about morality in general (Xie Lian may be a pure force of kindness and goodness, but he recognizes his own exceptionalism and does not expect the same of anyone else). meanwhile Yan Wushi isn’t... he’s not like, the mindless, destructive evil that Bai Wuxiang embodies in TGCF, but doing good and accumulating merit isn’t particularly high on his priority list. Xie Lian and Hua Cheng almost never argue, and especially never come to blows over their disagreements in moral frameworks. Arguing and coming to blows over disagreements in moral frameworks, however, lies at the heart of the yanshen relationship. Yan Wushi and Shen Qiao are constantly challenging each other and each other’s beliefs, taking turns to verbally roast or physically drag the other as the opportunity arises (fine, it’s mostly Yan Wushi doing the roasting/dragging but Shen Qiao gets a few good ones in there)

sldkjfslkdjf this is getting extremely long again, tl;dr hualian / yanshen parallels exist primarily on the levels of Xie Lian / Shen Qiao parallels, but the differences between Hua Cheng and Yan Wushi is where the hualian / yanshen parallels begin to diverge

#hunxi thinks about TGCF #hunxi thinks about QQ #千秋 backlog #why are all of my long posts about sao lao yan

[hunxi-after-hours]

Ok going off that Yan Wushi ask and the Betrayal™️ I gotta ask your opinion. When I read the buildup to that, Yan Wushi showed up and is truly surprised Shen Qiao is happy to see him, even eats from a bowl of food that he finds disgusting for Shen Qiao. And then betrays him - and to me that almost read as Yan Wushi was starting to realize he liked Shen Qiao and flipped out and so betrayed him to reject those feelings? Though it seemed like he had already set up the meet with Sang Jingxing so I’m probably reading too much into things. Doesn’t change how awful an act it was but could kind of color the motivation of why he did it, so it’s less that he got tired of him and more that he was lashing out.

I mean, let's look at the scene:

sldkfsldkjf when did I start doing close-reading of 《千秋》 passages rip

晏无师抚上他的脸颊，禁不住轻轻���息：“阿峤，你怎么总这么轻易就相信别人？” / Caressing his cheek, Yan Wushi couldn't resist sighing, "A-Qiao, why do you always trust people so easily?"

沈峤蹙眉：“我以为我们是朋友。” / Shen Qiao furrowed his brows. "I thought we were friends."

晏无师微微一笑：“这该怪你自己，你若不是说出朋友的话，我兴许还要晚一些才会对你动手。本座何许人也，哪里需要一个武功都恢复不了，有门派归不得，人人耻笑的落魄之人来做朋友？” / Yan Wushi smiled slightly. "You can only blame yourself for that. If you hadn't said 'friend,' I might have moved against you later. What kind of person am I, to need someone who cannot recover their martial skill, who cannot return to their martial sect, who is mocked by all and abandoned by the world, to be his friend?"

沈峤不说话了。/ Shen Qiao no longer spoke.

so in the fanwai, it's made clear that Yan Wushi traded Shen Qiao for his former sword not because of any fondness for the sword, but precisely for its rhetorical value in breaking Shen Qiao: look at you, you're worth no more than a sword I don't even care to use. Yan Wushi came to Bailong Temple deliberately looking for Shen Qiao in order to betray him, but if we take him at face value, he wasn't completely resolved to do so until Shen Qiao made the mistake of calling him his friend

and you know, I think there are multiple valid interpretations here. all of this is still 100% compatible with Yan Wushi's project of breaking Shen Qiao--all of the friendliness, the companionship, just preparing Yan Wushi to drive the knife deeper into Shen Qiao's back. 众叛亲离 is the chengyu that comes to mind--betrayed by the masses, abandoned by those closest to you; Yan Wushi might be one of the last people Shen Qiao has left in the jianghu right now (though "has" is questionable), so he deliberately and cruelly weaponizes Shen Qiao's trust in a brutal lesson

or, alternatively, Yan Wushi came with the intent to kidnap Shen Qiao and betray him, but Shen Qiao's speech earlier about being friends shook him so fundamentally that he felt the need to call it out. I do think it's worthwhile that Yan Wushi specifically targets 'friendship' in his lines--this 'friendship' is the accelerant in Yan Wushi's betrayal, this 'friendship' is precisely what Yan Wushi is rejecting, thoroughly and definitively. because friendship is trust, and trust is a knife in the hands of someone you turn your back on, and while Shen Qiao believes that there are people in the world you can willingly hand that knife to, Yan Wushi believes that there are none. this goes all the way back to their fundamental disagreement, the scientific experiment of Shen Qiao, the most foundational theme of this novel

so is there a version of the story where Yan Wushi was so alarmed at the very possibility that he could have a friend, not a disciple, a friend, not a grudging ally, an actual friend that he promptly stabbed potential friend in the back? yes. absolutely. I 100% buy Yan Wushi being enough of a disaster in denial to do that

is there another version of the story where Yan Wushi remained completely unmoved by Shen Qiao's trust and overtures of friendship? yes, absolutely. I 100% buy Yan Wushi being enough of a cold-blooded, cold-hearted character to do that (that's what his character arc is for, and ho buddy it’s coming for him with a five-sided vengeance)

whichever version you prefer is up to you! once again, I love how tantalizingly opaque Meng Xishi made Yan Wushi, so I'm having a grand time bouncing between interpretations as the mood moves me

#千秋 backlog #yan wushi #why are all of my long posts about sao lao yan #hunxi thinks about QQ