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talkfantasytome · 3 years

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I would like to know an opinion from you, who is a reader and writer, without favoritism using more the logic and facts of the book.

What are the chances of G+A, E+A and E+L happening in ACOTAR and why do you think so?

By logic I think G+A has an 85% chance of happening, for several factors pointed out in the books and in interviews. E+L I have doubts because it depends on what will happen in the next book and E+A for me is dead

Hi there!

Interesting question! And a tough one to ask me to answer as a writer and a reader, but also just to use logic and facts. I'll do my best, but admittedly, on some points in may appear as more of an opinion as a writer, or my own interpretation being a writer and understanding how things can be done.

However, I did really love including that focus in my answer! I did try to keep out favoritism and stick to logic. Admittedly, when asking specifically about all three ships, I'm now including all in one post and I'm sure one will appear favored, so I apologize for that. However, I did stick to facts of the book and facts about SJM - since you asked about my thoughts as a reader and writer, I felt I had to bring in certain things we know about SJM, in particular her style and the stuff she's likely to do.

This is a very big question you're asking, though. So, a fair warning, this post is very long. I have provided the word count below so people will have fair warning. There is also a TL;DR section at the bottom (before the post divider above my disclaimers) with a paragraph on each pair, for those interested in my opinions but don't wish to go deep into facts and thoughts.

I only ask that if anyone is looking to discuss this with me further, for any reason, that you do read the full post first before coming back to me with questions or concerns. :)

WC: 8,821

If you're interested, please keep reading for the ramblings of a mad woman...

The first thing I want to talk about is:

Foreshadowing.

Foreshadowing is the technique of hinting at future events in a story using subtle parallels, usually to generate more suspense or engage the reader’s curiosity. (Grammarly)

Writers, publishers, and readers all f*ing love foreshadowing. Even if you're a fan of big surprises and plot twists, foreshadowing is such an amazing and wonderful thing to see. I think it's because, even as a reader, even if you want something to completely throw you off guard, when you go back and see the foreshadowing later on, you respect it. And it makes you appreciate that author's craft. And true readers - as well as writers, of course - love to do that. As a reader, I loooove when an author does something that foreshadows something to happen in two or three books. As a writer, I strive to be like that.

But an important note to make about foreshadowing - it's typically about using "subtle parallels", once that could generate suspense or engage our curiosity. That's just something to keep in mind throughout this piece.

If you don't take the time to think about foreshadowing, and to understand its importance to writers and readers alike, then you're not going to be able to think critically about questions like this. And you're going to write a lot off as just something to make the readers happy or something a little pretty or fun.

And you'll also forget how crucial foreshadowing is. It is important, but it's hard to do, and it's not going to be done on something minor. You're not going to foreshadow what someone is going to make for dinner that night - not unless the choice of meal, or that meal itself, will end up being a vital plot point.

Similarly, you're not going to foreshadow things like, say, future possible relationships just to make that relationship an "oh, look, they're just platonic friends with minimal importance in that relationship". No. If you're foreshadowing something that will become just a friendship, it's going to be a massive, live-or-die, most important, life-altering friendship. It's going to be a friendship that changes the course of the characters lives.

So, having given that small lesson, I'd also challenge all readers of this post to read everything I've said with foreshadowing in mind as well. In some places I bring it up and mention it more, but I feel like foreshadowing is the most important literary device in questions like this. So as you read, see if there are other parts I bring up that are also foreshadowing, but I didn't say were foreshadowing. I think you might be surprised at how much it is laced through everything, just as it is extremely predominant in these books.

With that in mind, I'm ready to move on to the main questions:

E\ain & Azriel

Quickly, for this section, basically my entire focus is on why I don't believe these two will share a book, which - based on SJM's explanation of the second set of three ACOTAR books - means they're not endgame. If you're interested in an argument more about why these two aren't endgame based more on what's in the books about the characters, how they interact, etc. and doesn't focus on which books we'll get, you can see a very long post here that I made on that. On top of that, you did ask me this question "as a reader and writer", and I found that in answering "as a writer", it lended more toward talking about which book we'll get a bit more than which endgame relationships we'll get (even though they're basically synonymous lol).

I think they have an incredibly small chance of being endgame, personally. I hate making blatant, all out, 100% positive statements without the facts to back it up, and right now, we don't have that. Because we don't yet know who Az will be paired up with for his book. We do know he'll be getting something, as SJM has said she's excited to write his journey, and that is too big a statement for it to be a side journey.

So, we know Az will get a book. And we know that SJM is planning two more full novels for the series. There will be at least one novella, I believe, potentially two, but I'm not considering those. Based on what we've seen from Az, as a writer (as you requested 😉), I cannot see him being a novella story. Especially not after Sarah has talked about how excited she is for his journey.

The other reason I believe he'll be a full novel - the novels are for those who are hitting true rock bottom. Look at Feyre in ACOMAF, and look at Nesta in ACOSF. The main character for the novels will hit rock bottom, to then go through their character arc.

And Az is hitting it now. You can see it coming. He's moved on from pining for one female to pining for another, and while yes, he could technically get E\ain, there's a reason they're not together, and I firmly believe it goes beyond Lucien.

Lucien is the excuse. I know you asked about these from the perspective of a reader and writer, but just quickly - as someone who also is PHENOMENAL at preferring the emotionally unavailable, I know exactly what's going on with Az.

I'm not exaggerating here, for the record. I'm 29 and have never had a boyfriend because I CANNOT like the right guys. If you actually show interest in me, or are someone who could, I will not like you. I also won't like you if you're married or in a relationship, no, that's a turn off, but if you're emotionally unavailable in a way that means we will never be together - that's my jam.

Sound familiar? 👀

So, yeah, I know Az. And I know what he's doing with E\ain. Unlike me, he might go for something physical - that kiss attempt - but even in that he was thinking it would only be that one time. Because he knows she's not emotionally available. And NOT because of Lucien. Lucien, as I said, is the excuse. He's the "reason they can't be together" in Az's mind. He's "the obstacle to my happiness". But he really isn't.

E\ain said herself, in ACOFAS, she doesn't want a male. And we have reason to believe she wants to become human again. She isn't actually happy as a Fae, and she doesn't want to be with a Fae. And, friendly reminder, Az is Fae. 👀

So, Elain is emotionally unavailable. She may be physically available to Az, but I do not believe she is emotionally available to him - or any Fae - at the moment. I'll get more to that in the Lucien section, too.

Despite the lack of development around this information in ACOSF, and the fact that we can't know this for certain since we've never seen her POV or the POV of someone who truly knows E\ain - no, I don't believe either sisters truly do - this did not change in a year. I know E\ain's own personal turmoil and issues won't get solved on the side, off-page. Despite her lack of development so far, I do agree with those that ship E\ain and Az on one thing - she IS a main character. Or, at least, she will be. Hands down, 100%, of course. She's an Archeron. Sarah has said she'll have a book. It's all a fact.

So no way in hell did E\ain's emotional journey happen off-page. E\ain's journey is not solely going to be her training, or finding her value in Prythian in terms of what she'll do during the day and how she can help against a villainous threat. There will be an emotional journey. It's called a character arc. One of the character development resources I have bookmarked includes this diagram:

Source

This is a standard character arc. And while it may appear that it can all be stuff that happens to the character, which it can, take a look at the end point: character is forever changed.

That, in and of itself, implies that this arc goes beyond what is happening to the character, and expresses how all of those things happening are also working the character internally. More importantly, no one wants to read a book about a character who has no emotional journey, only a physical one. As a reader, I can attest to this. As a writer, I understand this and...am working on it in my own writing. 👀

Lastly, we KNOW SJM likes a good emotional arc. Feyre - hit rock bottom. Nesta - hit rock bottom. Bryce (CC) - hit rock bottom, and lived there for two years. Aelin (ToG) - she hit rock bottom on some levels, in different ways, multiple times. That girl went through some serious emotional shit, on top of all the stuff happening to her and around her.

My point - E\ain's book will include an emotional journey. And even if she's not at a full, devastating rock bottom, it will be something close to it. I have thoughts on what could cause it, what her bottom could be, but that's not for this post.

So, both E\ain and Azriel will have a book. And some believe it will be together. Allow me to explain why I believe all that I just said, as a writer, tells me it won't be:

Their journeys are too big for one book.

That's it. That's the main kicker. And it sounds stupid to some, I'm sure. So allow me to explain.

Azriel is so close to rock bottom, he's passed Bikini Bottom. He's taken the wrong bus home, and he's passed the final stop before he gets to Rock Bottom. And he's gonna be there until someone else comes along and blows up his hand glove to help him fly out of there. (If you don't get the reference, you're probably too young to be reading ACOTAR. 👀)

He's on his second girl he's pining after who is emotionally unavailable. A girl he doesn't actually want, but is just an idolized representation of what he wants. (This post, the Share Life with Me section explains my thoughts on that.) He's also struggling with a ton of other things. I won't list them all, cause this post as become a beast, but we know he's dealing with a lot.

In fact, that Az isn't able to sleep is a big sign of where he's at emotionally. I mean, he's an active male. And he's got a lot on his plate. He's busy, he trains, he is definitely physically tired regularly. But he can't sleep, because he has so much shit going on in his mind. All the stuff he's struggling with, not to mention his own feelings of inadequacy. You cannot convince me Az is not close to rock bottom.

E\ain, on the other hand, is nowhere near it. If she was, we would have been given an inkling. In ACOFAS, we got some Cassian chapters, clearly meant to help prepare us for ACOSF, and give us all some Nessian angst because we were all shipping them by then. BUT. More importantly than that, we got a little snippet into Nesta's mind too, when she got home after Solstice. It's the only time, other than Wings and Embers, where we got Nesta's POV before ACOSF. Both of which were meant to tell us a lot about her. Wings and Embers offered a lot of character development, and a look into something that happened to help explain a bit better Nesta and Cassian later in ACOMAF. (Also, I'm convinced Sarah just loves them and writing them, so couldn't help herself in writing that scene. lol)

The ACOFAS piece, on the other hand, was specifically designed to tell us where the hell Nesta is at emotionally. ACOFAS offers a bridge between ACOWAR and ACOSF. It gives us answers to tell us what's going on in their lives, so we don't show up a year later and are like "so, what's all this?" And the biggest answers it gave us was about Nesta, because the end of ACOWAR did not give us enough to tell us that's where she'd be at a year later.

So ACOFAS came in to tell us where everyone's at, and those Nesta POV pages gave us a look into Nesta, to see her without the lens of another person's perspective. And what did we see? Nesta, drowning at rock bottom.

As a writer, that is how I read the purpose of all that happened in ACOFAS, and why we got that snippet, as well as the purpose fo the Wings and Embers little chapter.

We have gotten nothing like that on E\ain. We have crumbs in ACOFAS that tell us she's not happy as a Fae and doesn't want to remain as such. And then in ACOSF we get a few quick looks at her through others' eyes, none of which tell us much. Maybe some minor foreshadowing, but nothing to tell us what is actually happening with her.

And then, basically the last thing we are given about E\ain in ACOSF is a comparative vignette on E\ain and Nesta in black for Solstice - which, yes, has a huge purpose. Everyone who says it doesn't is, I'm sorry, very wrong.

As a writer, I feel I can confirm, you would not include such a comparative vignette like that for no reason. I may not be published, and I do love a good description, but look at the way it's worded - it's not just about the physical descriptions, but the feeling you get in seeing those two women in black. What black does to them. If it meant nothing, no editor would keep it in. So much can be read in those words that I'm sure SJM and her editors expect us to think they mean something more. For them to then have no purpose, mean nothing, it would actually be incredibly misleading writing in a way authors don't do in their books. Yes, in interviews they may say thins to mislead readers. Yes, they may try to make their foreshadowing super subtle and hard to catch. But they're not going to blatantly, obviously foreshadow the opposite of what will happen. They're not going to spend a few paragraphs describing a character in a way that implies the Night Court drains the life from her, and then end with her finding her true home in the Night Court with a person that embodies night. Because those two things don't align.

But I digress.

The point is, that's very little with E\ain. If you read the scenes very carefully, yes, you'll pick up on certain pieces that I do think will be used later. But none of it tells us E\ain is close to rock bottom. If anything, it tells us E\ain is trying to pretend or prove she's not going to hit rock bottom - which, admittedly, a bit of a death sentence for you E\ain longer-term.

What I'm getting at here is that Az is ready for his story, E\ain is not.

Now, one good argument against this would be - well, only one person will likely be at rock bottom. You, yourself, Kasey, said that E\ain and Az's journeys are too big to be one book. Clearly you're assuming both will hit rock bottom. But, if E\ain doesn't, then their stories aren't too big.

Fair point, except this:

We know E\ain is getting a book.

A book that will be hers the way ACOSF was Nesta's. Obviously, I hope the next two books will provide more development for the love interest than my bby Cassian got. That being said, the books will have a protagonist, and a love interest who is also the silver medal protagonist for that book. Both will have journeys, absolutely, and their journeys will align.

And E\ain Archeron will NOT be the "love interest" in the book she's in. In fact, that's a HUGE argument people make against gwynriel. That these books are about the Archeron sisters, so the next book must be E\ain's. Their argument is that these stories are all about the Archeron sisters.

Okay, first of all, that's wrong. We know it's wrong, because we know there are two more books, and there's one more sister. So you cannot say that it's solely about the Archeron sisters.

However, they're right in one regard - the Archeron sisters are f*ing important. On so many levels. And while, at the moment, E\ain only has enough development to maybe be a love interest in the next book, she WILL NOT be that. E\ain will be the main protagonist. E\ain will be the Nesta, and her love interest will be the Cassian. You cannot convince me otherwise. Not with E\ain's Seeing powers, being Cauldron-born, and the journey/conflict Sarah has started setting up for her. It's not enough for its own book yet, but she's laid the groundwork to allow a build in the next book or novella, so that when we get E\ain's we'll have a better idea where she's starting from.

To say the next book is an E\ain/Azriel book means you are expecting Az's story to take second place, and that's not happening.

Az has had a POV chapter - yes, it was an exclusive, so not everyone could see it. But, if you wanted to, you can no problem. So, we have an idea of where Az is at - both in terms of actions we saw and what's going on in his mind.

We've seen that, and we know he's hitting rock bottom. Which means his love interest likely will not hit rock bottom. She will have a journey of her own, for sure. Some form of character arc that helps her be who she needs to be for Az, and for the plot of the book. So, even without Sarah telling us how excited she is to write Az's journey, we've been given enough to know that in Az's book, he'll likely have the gold medal protagonist slot.

More so than that, we have not seen E\ain's point of view at all. And while we haven't seen any character's point of view who is a possible love interest for Az, we do know that, at least for the main character, SJM seems to like to give us that first, while also testing the waters a bit.

Again, ACOFAS, a couple Cassian POV chapters plus the Nesta section of that one chapter. We actually got a smaller POV for the main protagonist, interestingly enough, but it made sense with the novella considering she was not spending time with everyone else. But we still got the snippet. However, that's just one book. So we need to go to a different series to talk more about SJM's preferences.

Let's think about Throne of Glass. Written entirely different - entirely third person, and every book was technical multi-POV. However, book 1 was heavily Celaena. We had minimal Dorian and Chaol POV sections until book 2. Similarly, in book 3 we got a very small amount of Rowan POV and Aedion POV, but then in book 4 they came in and shared a lot more page time. Why? Because, I believe, when she can SJM does like to test the waters a bit, try it out. Learn the voice without it being so crucial and central whenever possible. I could be wrong, but I don't think it's a coincidence that we saw that. That she gave us sneak peeks into the minds of people who, in later books, we'd see more fully. She would build to them being a main POV.

Of course, Manon and Elide were exceptions. And maybe Lorcan? I honestly can't remember if we got a Lorcan POV snippet in QoS, or if we just started to get Lorcan in EoS right away.

However, Manon and Elide were different. We couldn't just get a teaser snippet of Manon's POV in book 2. That would have spoiled a lot and had no place for flow. Same with Elide. Those two women came in and from day one as characters in the series they were too important, and too separate from others, to be a smaller POV in their first book.

So, to me, as a writer, SJM has shown a bit of a trend in giving us the POV of characters before the become true main characters with their own POV. I believe we will see E\ain's POV before she is the main character of her book. Which we haven't yet seen. So I can't believe her book is next.

Which, considering all the things I've said that explain why Az's book is, is another reason why I don't believe they'll be one book and are endgame.

E\ain and Lucien

Now, we know Lucien has his own story, journey. SJM has confirmed we will see him heal and grow.

Of course, if I'm right about how Az and E\ain won't be in a book together, and Az is the next book, then it sort of confirms that the sixth will be E\ain-Lucien. But I'll go into a couple other reasons why I believe there will be an E\lain-Lucien book.

First of all, let's ask the question - if I'm wrong, and the next book is E\ain-Az, then who's the sixth book about?

Some people say it's Lucien and Vassa - because we know we're going to get a deeper look into Lucien's journey. And, I would agree, if we have it confirmed that book 6 is Lucien's and E\ain has had her book, then yes...I suppose Vassa is the only option.

However, as a reader and writer, I can not see that happening. For one, I definitely got Vassa/Jurian vibes in ACOSF. I mean - banter. We know how SJM feels about the banter. Plus, they're both mortal, and Sarah doesn't really like to have endgame ships that can't actually be together their full lives. And I agree with what some others have said that I don't see her doing with Lucien what she did with Lorcan. She's used that already, and while Sarah can get repetitive with certain things, she likes to repeat herself in ways that can feel different.

So, as a reader who has learned a bit about SJM's general style, what she enjoys, etc., going beyond "signs" in the book, I can't see her doing Vassa and Lucien as endgame.

Beyond SJM's style and everything, though - we also have to remember what mates are in ACOTAR. They are different than Throne of Glass, just as the Fae in ACOTAR are different. These are not the same exact being types - Sarah adjusted them.

So, what do we know about mates - all from ACOWAR, ch. 24:

The male feels the bond stronger - "there will always be a...tug. For the females, it is usually easier to ignore, but the males...It can drive them mad."

Bonds are allowed to be rejected - "It has been illegal in our territory for a long, long time for males to [kill whoever their mate chooses to be with. Same with the other courts]. On the continent, there are territories that would believe the females literally belong to their mate."

Rejecting the bond is not a magical rejection - "It is their burden to fight through, but some believe they are entitled to the female. Even after the bond is rejected, they see her as belonging to them."

These are all such incredibly important points, especially when considering Lucien's future.

He feels the bond stronger - but Elain still feels it. There will always be a tug. She's just better at ignoring it, because as a female, it's easier. But he feels it, badly. I do believe Lucien is strong enough to not be driven mad, but that's how powerfully he is feeling it. We should remember that. Because if that's the case, do you really expect him to find comfort with another woman?

Bonds are allowed to be rejected...in Prythian. That's a MASSIVE caveat. This isn't like an "oh, you can undo this". No, in Prythian, their laws allow females to make a choice on who they will be with, mating bond or no. But other territories don't always allow that. Which helps lead into the next point even more:

Rejecting the bond is not a magical, official process that will release the male from the bond, in any sense. Now, the quote I pulled, Rhys is explicitly speaking about those who feel entitled to their female mate. HOWEVER, what it signifies is that, when a female rejects the bond, it is not some magical process that will suddenly lessen the tug or anything. And it sure as hell doesn't dissolve the mating bond. That bond is there, for life, and nothing can destroy it.

Sorry, but I'm going to trust Amren's understanding over everyone else's, considering she is literally thousands and thousands of years old.

So, even if E\ain rejects the bond. Which, like, if she wants to do that, go for it. I'm not saying she has to accept it, it's her life, her choice. However, that's not going to suddenly change anything for Lucien. A lot of people seem to think once she rejects it, Lucien will be more free. But no, that's not the case.

He will be just as bonded as he always was. Just as desirous for her. And, my guess, he'll be waiting to see if she'll ever change her mind, because we have no reason to believe the females can't do that.

Because of this, we can conclude Lucien is still entirely focused on E\ain, especially since she hasn't yet rejected the bond. So no, I can't believe Lucien and Vassa will be a thing. Based on the text, it sounds like it would take years - decades or centuries, even - for a male to be able to ignore the tug to his mate enough to enter into a meaningful relationship with someone else. And we don't have that kind of time in these books.

Taking out Vassa as an option, Lucien is left with E\ain. The same way E\ain is left with Lucien as I've now explained why I don't believe the next book is E\ain-Az. It's not exactly the best reason, and I'm sure Elucien shippers would hate it, but by process of elimination considering who we know we're getting journeys for, and what seems to make the most sense, E\ain and Lucien end up together.

However, I also think there's more to it than that.

As I've mentioned, I believe a piece of E\ain's journey is likely going to be her struggle with being Fae. She's not happy as a Fae, she wants her old life back. And I don't judge her for it - she had no choice in the matter, and that f*ing sucks. I do believe there will be more to her journey as well, but I believe that's going to be a big pice of her emotional arc.

Lucien has become, to E\ain, the main representation of everything she doesn't want - poor bby boi. Similar to how Nesta struggled with the idea of having an actual mate because it's such a Fae thing, and in claiming Cassian as hers she would be letting go of a final piece of her humanity, I think E\ain is also projecting a lot onto the mating bond. It's become the representation to her that she is no longer human, and is the reason she lost the things/people she loved. It's not - Grayson may have said that, but I think we all know he would have dumped her for being Fae regardless of if she had a mate or not.

So, if E\ain's arc is going to be about accepting herself as a Fae, then it makes perfect sense that Lucien would be an incredibly important piece of that story. Because, to be able to accept herself as she now is, she will have to stop blaming him and projecting her hatred of being Fae onto him. Az has no part in that journey, that arc. He, at best, could make her feel something good that might be nice for a little while. But she will not learn to love herself, to accept being Fae, by sleeping with Az.

Now, I'm sorry to say, nonnie, but that doesn't mean E\ain and Lucien are definitely endgame. Because SJM could do something where E\ain still chooses to reject the bond at the end of the journey.

That being said, I find it highly unlikely that will happen. Considering SJM said that each book will be about a "couple". It's not just "love interests". It'll be about a couple, meaning each book's couple will end up together - or, at least, most likely they will. Plus, we know that SJM enjoys her happily ever afters.

I do agree that the fact that Rhys mentioned females being able to reject the bond is a possible form of foreshadowing. HOWEVER - I actually find it very unlikely it would be about E\ain.

Why?

Because he and Feyre were talking about E\ain. SJM prefers her crumbs to be a bit more subtle than that - except maybe everything to do with Nesta and Cassian, but to be fair, neither of them are subtle either. XD

It would be such blatant foreshadowing for a conversation about E\ain's mating bond to lead to a new piece of information that females are allowed to reject the bond, to be a segment foreshadowing E\ain rejecting that specific bond.

Remember, foreshadowing is subtle hints to tell us what will happen in the future/later in the story. So, I do believe that conversation is more likely hinting at other possible mating bonds that have had rejections in the past.

I don't really believe that E\ain will reject the bond.

However, even if she does, my belief is that it would be early on in the book, maybe while she's still really in whatever dark space she'll be in. And then, for other reasons, or maybe just because she herself feels a bit more free, she ends up spending time with Lucien, and then throughout the book falls in love and at the end decides to accept the bond. Because I do believe a rejection is reversible, seeing as the bond can't be broken.

As a writer, that last scenario is actually what I would probably go for. However, this is SJM's world, and it's up to her what the different laws about everything is. I just believe a rejection is reversible because so far everything we're told about a mating bond rejection is that it's basically just a woman saying no. It doesn't magically affect the bond.

There are my thoughts on E\ain and Lucien, separating them from Az as much as I could, to explain why I believe they're likely going to be in a book together.

Admittedly, I don't have as many thoughts on them as endgame, because I will say that I haven't seen a lot of foreshadowing in the books yet to confirm that. Which is why I, again, focused more on why it makes sense that they would share a book.

Az and Gwyn

Disclaimer: I will also be referencing E\ain here. I did this on purpose, and kept certain arguments out of the E\ain-Az section because, when I talk about those two, I like to talk first and foremost about reasons why I think they're not right together or won't be in a book together without bringing in Gwyn. I believe there are a ton of signs that have nothing to do with Gwyn, and don't need her for comparison, to provide that case. Plus, I do think that if you bring Gwyn into the argument that goes against E\ain and Az, some then just say I'm biased toward Gwynriel and my reading his clouded by that.

You said, nonnie, by logic, you are about 85% certain Gwynriel are endgame. That's a decent percentage. However, I'll admit, I think I'm higher, probably closer to being between 95%-99%. Like I said, I can't be 100%. But, I'm great at deductive logical reasoning. And, if you've read the rest of this post, I believe I've already deduced that Az and Gwyn would been a book together, because like how E\ain has one other option besides Az, I think Az only has one other option besides E\ain.

He's had almost no interaction with Emerie, definitely nothing stated or seen. And we know Mor isn't an option because she and Az will never be together, since she can't be emotionally involved with men.

So, logically, I may have already convinced you that Az's book will be with Gwyn, which means they're endgame. Yes, like I said, SJM could do something where the female rejects the bond, and I could see that being an ending to the fifth book more than the sixth - but, since they're also mean to be stand alone books, to an extent, SJM is gonna want her happily ever after in all three of them. Also, more than that, I don't see SJM putting Az in a mating bond relationship where he gets rejected - he needs literally the exact opposite. A rejected bond would not put Az on the journey toward healing. It would give him a drill and he'd tunnel far beyond rock bottom to a place he'll never come back from. So, to me, no matter who it is that ends up being with Az in his book, I believe they are definitely endgame.

However, let me give a few more reasons why I think they're endgame:

1. Not a Crack Ship

Firstly, I just want to remind everyone that Gwynriel isn't a crack ship. If I'm getting technical about it, I could just say it's because they're actually in the same world - same books, even - so it's plausible because they literally know each other and can know each other. The term crack ship initially came about to talk about ships that go across fandoms. Azriel and Legolas, for example, would be a crack ship, because they are in different universes and literally could never, ever end up together.

However, more than that, I wrote a long post about why they're not a crack ship here.

In that post, I discuss the bonus POV chapter, the structure of that chapter, and what all of it most likely means, from the mind of a writer. A quick recap:

The chapter is a comparison. It is half and half Azriel's focus on E\ain and Gwyn. Beyond that, you also get a moment between Az and each girl, and then a moment between Az and another who knows what's happening (Rhys knowing about him almost kissing E\ain, Clotho knowing about him giving Gwyn the necklace) - and that those conversations provide us reflections in Az's mind that are TELLING.

Basically, the two sections mirror each other. The only reason to write a chapter like this, in this way, is to provide a comparison. The only reason to provide a comparison, UNLESS we're actually getting confirmed endgame information (i.e. say it was a true love triangle, and Az was speaking with each girl separately to tell them his decision), would be to show us that these two females have something worth comparing. In this case, it's likely their relationship with Az, in particular their effects on him and his thoughts about them, and how it all makes him feel.

We see Az get shy about his hands around E\ain, but not Gwyn. We see his shadows skitter back from E\ain's breath, but they leap out and dance with Gwyn's. We see Az think of E\ain only in the physical sense - he wants to have sex with her, but that's all we see - vs. we see Az picture Gwyn's smile at opening the gift, and he tucks it away in his heart.

These are specific comparisons, mirrors. And I didn't bring up too many details on what happened in that post, because that post wasn't meant to go into which one is endgame. But here, I can bring those up, and express that in the mirroring chapter sections, in the comparison we were given, I believe the signs point to Gwynriel.

2. Foreshadowing

I spent a lot of time talking about foreshadowing at the beginning of this post, for a reason. And while it was relevant in the other two sections, I was saving a lot for this one because this relationship has received an insane amount of foreshadowing in the shortest amount of time.

And, a vast majority of it was definitely in the bonus POV chapter. If you have not read the chapter yet, I do encourage you to look for it. It's not difficult to find it online, but make sure you get one that has both the E\ain and Gwyn section, because without the Gwyn section you don't get much of the foreshadowing.

The bonus chapter, as I mentioned, really did provide a comparison of E\ain and Gwyn. And yes, you come out of it knowing Az wants to have sex with E\ain, and he's not thinking that about Gwyn. It seems damning, except for a very important factor:

Sex isn't all Az wants.

He wants a relationship like his brothers have. That means more than sex. And yet, all we see from Az with E\ain is physical thoughts about her, or later on an argument that she should have been given to him, since her sisters were given to his brothers. Bad argument, horribly misogynistic, and none of his other points had anything to do with his actual feelings for her. She has just become a representation of what he wants, and it's blinding him.

You do see some foreshadowing in the E\ain section, much of which I do believe is hinting that they are not endgame. The biggest one is when she breaths sharply and his shadows "skitter back". That's a subtle hint that tells us his shadows reaction to E\ain.

Others might argue that it was one time, but we have seen his shadows retreat around E\ain before. We just didn't fully understand how bad it was. However, the other truth is, we can't be sure back then it was "bad". Because SJM did it with Mor too, even when Az and Mor were, I believe, endgame in her mind. It's possible SJM had remained undecided on E\ain and Az until ACOFAS, maybe even ACOSF. For all we know, SJM got Gwyn and Az on a page together, and it was like Nessian all over again. And this chapter is meant to represent that and show us how certain things that we clearly didn't always interpret to be bad (and maybe she even hadn't and just got lucky with) are, in fact, a bad sign.

My point, let's not think too hard on Az's shadows in ACOMAF and ACOWAR, because we know that these books didn't start getting planned until they were working on ACOWAR, maybe even already promoting it and done writing (?). And authors can change their minds. We writers try to stay as consistent as possible, but sometimes you just don't know every single thing that's going to happen, and new information is going to come in, and you just have to make sure it doesn't actually conflict with what you've already provided.

In this case, the idea of Az's shadows knowing who is right for him, and skittering back from those who aren't, would actually be consistent and fitting, and SJM likely needed us to understand that Az's shadows retreating aren't good.

But how did we learn that?

Well, beyond the use of "skittered back", which definitely has a more negative connotation, we get more when we see Gwyn later in the chapter.

Azriel ends up in the training ring, and there Gwyn is. Surprise! Cause his shadows didn't warn him, so now he's stuck and has to at least greet her.

While talking, at one point Gwyn's breath exhales visibly, and you get a description of Azriel's shadows "darting out to dance with it before twirling back" to Az.

That's a very new interaction with shadows, one we've never seen before. We've already seen the shadows retreating with Mor, who we know is wrong for Az but whom he pined after. Now we see them retreating again - skittering back, even - with E\ain. Another one he is pining after, though pining might be a strong word here.

We clearly know that the two reactions mean two different things. By my own logic, I would already assume that we're being told E\ain, like Mor, is not endgame for Az. And that Gwyn, who receives such a different interaction, is. However, if you're not sold, there's another part of the conversation that I believe is an important clue.

Gwyn asks Az about his being called a "Shadowsinger", if it means he sings. This, obviously, amuses Az, but his explanation is:

"I am a shadowsinger--it's not a title that someone just made."

I AM a shadowsinger. It's who Az is. It's a part of him. For Az to accept himself fully, he has to accept this about himself as well. I'm not saying he hasn't, it's just a general notion.

The shadows aren't bad, they are a part of Az, of who he is. E\ain and Mor aren't chasing nasty shadows away to let us see Az better. They're scaring away a crucial piece of who Az is, so that they'll never fully know him. You can't know and truly see Az without his shadows.

Basically, E\ain and Mor both have Az hiding a part of who he is, but around Gwyn he is himself fully, his shadows on full view. And he's comfortable - he's not worrying about it during the chapter. No, instead, he finds "something restless settling in him. Even his shadows had calmed."

These hints, in all honesty, don't feel super subtle. I'm not going to lie. However, they clearly must be a bit subtle, since not everyone is catching them or reading them the same way.

And that's fine. We all read things differently, interpret them differently. However, as a writer, and one who has read basically all of SJM's books, I do feel like I have a really good idea of her style and how to interpret what she does. It doesn't mean she can't or won't surprise me in the future, but in this, I do think my interpretation is right. Because I understand the importance of a comparison.

I believe she used the comparison as a form of foreshadowing. In fact, I believe she's done it a few times with comparisons, and that the bonus POV chapter was just the longest, most continuous comparison for foreshadowing we've seen.

3a. Banter!

I can't not bring this up. But it should be quick.

SJM has stated, out right, one of the endgame signs for her, or a sign that a couple should maybe be considered to be endgame, is banter. That is incredibly important to her. Yes, she likes wings and tattoos - but that's just what you need for the main male. But ALL her couples have some form of banter, and they're all different to suit them.

Aelin just drives Rowan nuts with innuendos and outright statements and little negliges. Manon and Dorian have that taunting type of banter going. Rhys and Feyre have a super flirty style. Nesta and Cassian just egg each other on and use sharp words that would make most people cry, but instead just makes them both hard. Even Aedion and Lysandra had their own style of banter. We didn't see as much spoken banter but, I'm sorry, Lysandra using her different animal forms to bother Aedion as they made their way to Terrasen, or her tackling him when in ghost leopard form, those are just a more physical style of banter and you cannot convince me otherwise.

It's a thing. E\ain and Az don't have banter. Sure, they talk to each other...sort of...once a year. But they don't banter.

Gwyn and Az have more of a banter-type relationship. We haven't seen too much of it yet, but just the taunting each other about the obstacle course - Az being all "no prize cause you won't do it" and Gwyn needing to prove him wrong - is a form of banter. Again, it may not be spoken, but if you broaden the concept, it is banter - a competitive banter.

3b. Relationship Trait

Similarly, all of her endgame ships have at least some trait that makes each relationship unique. It's often aligned to the banter, but it's there.

Again, with Feyre and Rhys they're just stupid flirty in an obvious way, except they do it mind to mind. Cassian and Nesta are more unique, again, in how they somehow manage to build each other up while sounding like they're tearing each other down. 👀 Elide and Lorcan have the "we're the last thing you'd expect" thing going for them - considering the insane height difference, and yet Lorcan is definitely more afraid of Elide.

Basically, there's something there that makes them unique. But, with Az and E\ain, there really isn't much other than "aw, the two prettiest got together". But that's not a trait for a relationship, just as being pretty is not exactly a personality trait - it's something that might affect your personality traits, for sure. But a person's face doesn't automatically mean any type of personality trait. But nothing would really set them apart, give them a unique aspect to their relationship and how they connect to each other.

Gwyn and Az, on the other hand, would be that ridiculously competitive couple. They'd likely connect and relate to each other through games and competitions. They'd probably use dares and challenges to push the other to be better, to go outside of their comfort zone, etc. I mean, I'm about 95% certain that the first time Gwyn flies with Az - assuming it's in a lighthearted scenario and Gwyn has had a certain amount of healing already - Az will literally be like, "You scared, Berdara?" and that's how he'll get her in the air, cause Mother-forbid she give in to that.

4. Nicknames

So, this isn't one that SJM has mentioned, but as a reader and writer I couldn't help but notice she does this for alllll her biggest ships. And typically, it's a slightly more taunting nickname, at least at first.

Rhys - Feyre darling. It's a term of endearment now, but it started out with a teasing tone.

Cassian - Nes. Yes, I'm also upset we lost sweetheart, but I think I know why - after ACOFAS SJM wrote Crescent City, and decided to give Hunt "sweetheart" for Bryce, and she doesn't like to repeat nicknames. But he also has "Nes", which also is more taunting, especially as she tells him not to call her that.

Hunt - Sweetheart. As mentioned earlier. And this most definitely started out in a taunting manner.

Aelin - Buzzard. Obvs, Aelin plays with the boys on this one. Rowan's nickname for Aelin has always been a term of endearment and soft, but "Buzzard" started off in a bit more of a taunt. It's also soft, but considering it's a reference to his hawk form and how he fusses, there's a taunting tone to it.

It's a big trend in her books that's definitely noticed, but I haven't seen it discussed as much.

And this is, to me, one of the clinchers. It is, arguably, a form of foreshadowing, but it deserved its own section.

Gwyn threw Azriel a withering stare as she strode past him. "See you tomorrow, Shadowsinger," she tossed over a shoulder.

This is really huge. He may be a shadowsinger, but people don't call him this.

At least, for ht most part. I can't remember if others ever call him just "Shadowsinger". If any do, it was definitely disgruntled Illyrians or something of that ilk, and it was meant derogatorily. Which means Gwyn is actually reclaiming that name for him, and even though it's used in a taunting way, Azriel knows it's not in a judgmental way. It's just an "I now know this is you" way.

In fact, by using that name in the way she does, it's a form of acceptance of who he is. And a reminder. Remember, he told her "I AM a shadowsinger - it's not a title..."

And here Gwyn is, turning it into a title, likely a direct reference to that conversation. And reminding him, this is who you are. I see that, I know that, and I am not afraid. I mean, she is taunting him, not to anger him or make him feel small. It's a taunt to say "Game on, I'm in, you won this round but I'll prevail" sort of thing. (Remember, competitive.)

As a writer, seeing Gwyn call Az a nickname, having noticed this trend in SJM's works, feels like a huge sign that they are endgame. Thinking about the meaning behind her using that term as the nickname does the same, because in doing so she's telling him the thing he's always wanted to hear from others - "I am not afraid".

Summary

Well, there you have it, nonnie. My own logic and facts - maybe not literally presented as perfect screenshots always, but I was doing a lot of writing - to explain my own personal opinion.

This is my own opinion, and I will not state that this is 100% a fact of what will happen, as only SJM knows what's to come completely. However, I did appreciate the question, because as someone who loves writing and does do a lot of writing, I do feel like I sometimes see things a bit differently, or look at them with a different eye - at least after the first read through.

That being said, there are other people on here that provide absolutely amazing analyses of stuff like this. Many better than mine, and far more succinct. Though, this was a big question to ask me to hit all three ships at once. lol

TL;DR

E\ain and Az are essentially both too big of characters to share a book, as they will both have big, emotional journeys to go on. The only way to get them both in a book is if one doesn't hit rock bottom, but we know Az is going to do just that and is on his way there. That would mean E\ain would be the one to not hit rock bottom, which would also mean she's not the main protagonist of the story, because that would be Az. That's not happening, E\ain will be the main protagonist of her book. But, as a writer, that rock bottom trend is obvious, and you can't have two people at their true rock bottoms as the main protagonists, because they'll never be able to pull themselves up. The love interest will have their own journey, but they'll also be the ones that are guiding the main protagonist out of the dark, as Cassian did with Nesta.

E\ain and Lucien are, kind of, logically deduced to have a book together. However, if I'm right that E\ain's journey will include her needing to accept now being Fae, and that she has been using Lucien and their mating bond as a representation of all things Fae that have ruined her life, then it would make perfect sense that Lucien would be the one to help her along her journey to acceptance. Because she will need to first stop putting it all on him.

Gwyn and Az have a lot of foreshadowing, and the main one I focused on was her shadows. It's not a new argument, but it is important to remember that comparisons can be used a multitude of ways and done differently. It's not always a blatantly obvious "well, girl a is like this and girl b is like this". It can be done throughout a whole chapter, in how you structure it. It can be done in a vignette. But what's important is to recognize the comparisons, and then analyze for foreshadowing, cause those are often a spot you'll find a wealth of it laying around. And the Az POV bonus chapter was just that - a chapter structured in a specific way to mirror the two sections and provide a comparison of the two females, and use it as a form of foreshadowing. They also hit a few important SJM endgame bingo spaces. In particular the banter, the fact that they have a trait unique to their relationship - even now, when they're just starting to be friends - and also Gwyn's nickname for him that has started out as a form of teasing, as all of the main character relationships have had in SJM's novels.

As always, these are my opinions. I have based them on my own experience in writing, as well as on my own interpretations of what I've read in ACOTAR and other SJM books to help me understand her as an author. I promise to respect your own opinions, all I ask is that you also respect mine. I have tagged this carefully, because I know not everyone wants to see this content, but if you do, please I just ask that you're respectful about it. And to read the full thing before coming back to me about it.

Many of these opinions are shared by other tumblr users, absolutely. As are the interpretations and analyses. So most likely they won't all seem new, but this is my own work. I typed it up entirely on my own over the last six or so hours - while procrastinating stuff I actually really need to do.... - without referencing others posts. If anything feels similar, I apologize for that, it's likely because you and I share the same opinions and interpretations.

#acotar #acotar thoughts #acotar theory #ask box #antielriel #anti elriel #gwynriel #elucien #gwyn #azriel #lucien #elain archeron

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