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yeoni-k-art · 6 years

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Why Credence wasn’t admitted into Ilvermorny...maybe

It’s probably already too late for this, but spoilers...obviously.

I was watching a couple of Harry Potter fan theories, and came across the following comment-question that peaked my curiosity and got me thinking.

TammyLouise7921 month ago HUGE UNANSWERED QUESTION YOU MISSED!! Why the hell wasn't Credence collected to go to Illvermorny?!?! Dumbledore went to go get Tom Riddle and Hermione had a representative come and tell her. You don't just get a letter to tell you to show up at hogwarts. There's clearly a process for entering these individuals coming from non-magical homes into the wizarding world. Leaves the question why didn't anyone come for Credence?!? Does MACUSA have weird policies around muggle-born wizards/un-registered magical babies because it's hinted Crendences mother was possibly a witch. So WTF. I can see that MACUSA would have hang ups about muggle borns because of their statute of secrecy stuff but it seems incredibly irresponsible and directly against that statute to not keep tabs on all magical kids regardless of parentage. THIS TO ME IS A HUGE HOLE NO ONE SEEMS TO TALK ABOUT!!! PLEASE MAKE A VIDEO.

Very interesting question. Here's my take on the matter.

The comment about MACUSA vs his blood status could possibly be a reason, and for the reason given - to keep witches and wizards hidden. Newt even says they have “backwards laws about relations with muggles”.

There could be a few other reasons for Credence not being admitted into Ilvermorny, however, and those are the ones I want to talk about here. Let’s get started.

So, first of all, we don't know all that much about Ilvermorny, which means that I'll be drawing comparisons with what we do know - Hogwarts. I’m sure there will be differences between the two schools, but seeing as the desire to keep the existence of magic a secret is a common factor here, I think it’s safe to assume there would be some common ground between the two schools too.

According to Pottermore, the admittance of students to Hogwarts is done via an enchanted quill and book combination known as The Quill of Acceptance and The Book of Admittance, which was set up by the four founders of Hogwarts. (source)

(This is what Hagrid was referencing in his remark about Harry having had "his name down ever since he was born"). This article also goes on to inform us that Neville Longbottom very nearly never got his admittance to Hogwarts at all due to the delay in confirmation of his magical aptitude - he was already 8 years old when his name was finally written down.

Yet another thing is that not all 11 year old witches and wizards in the UK are chosen to attend Hogwarts. Dumbledore even says in the article that "it saves the staff tedious explanations to parents who are furious that their children have not been selected for Hogwarts" - meaning some kids born into a magical family, who do possess magical abilities, do not get accepted into Hogwarts. Hogwarts is claimed to be “The best school of witchcraft and wizardry”, it never says it is the only one, and with the introduction of Beauxbatons and Durmstrang in the fourth Harry Potter book, we know it certainly isn’t. As for it being the only school in the UK: witches and wizards not being admitted to Hogwarts actually implies that there is at least one other school. How do these children rejected from Hogwarts learn magic otherwise? Do they have to be home-schooled? What about those subject their parents are unable to teach them? I’m pretty sure they wouldn’t be kicked to the curb like “Sorry kid. The magical quill-book combo didn’t write your name down so you can’t learn magic. Like ever. Have a great life now~”. And what about those children into muggle homes? One word: obscurials. The article also says that the book in particular is extremely picky about the names it allows the quill to write into it, and because of this Hogwarts has never admitted a student who does not possess magical abilities. Keep this in mind for a point I will get to a little bit later on.

It's entirely plausible therefore that Ilvermorny would have a way of identifying potential students just like Hogwarts does. Isolt wanted to create a place young witches and wizards could learn magic freely - like the Hogwarts she so wished she could have attended, but I think it would be rather cruel to allow just anyone into this school. Imagine being surrounded by all this mystery and wonder but not being able to partake in it because you are born with no magical abilities. In fact, Isolt’s own daughter eventually cut off the magical world for this very reason (Source). Also, MACUSA would certainly keep tight reigns on the school and its students, and it has been a fair amount of time since Isolt's time at Ilvermorny, so it’s plausible that admittance policies had changed if they had been lax before.

Back to my earlier point about Hogwarts never having admitted a student who does not possess magical abilities. Credence could very possibly fit into the description of someone not being admitted into a magic school. We are not sure how old he was when he was adopted (correct me if I'm wrong), but if he was still very young, living under the strict oppression of Mary Lou Barebone would certainly have a huge negative impact on his magical capabilities. He was cruelly and continuously punished for something he had no control over, and as a result started to internalize what made him different - his magic.

As everyone knows, this is how an Obscurus is formed. It seems almost like an unstated fact now, that Albus Dumbledore's sister -Ariana- was an Obscurial. (source) If this is true, she was already 6 years old before she started repressing her magic. Children born with no magical abilities are known to show signs of magic at first which are like a sort of aftereffect or echo of their parents’ magic, but this eventually wears off. This gives Credence plenty of leeway to be misread as a squib for years under the abuse of his foster mother – especially if he started showing signs of magic at a young age, which he would start repressing due to the abuse he was subjected to.

The people around the Dumblesdores actually thought Ariana was a squib because she never attended Hogwarts (source) her absence from the school acting as further proof that not everyone born with magical abilities is admitted into Hogwarts, and also serving to provide the possibility of her reluctance and later on, inability, to produce consistent and stable magic being misread as her having no magical abilities at all.

This is what happens with Credence. Even Grindelwald himself doesn’t pick up on the fact that Credence actually does have very dangerous magical abilities. In Fantastic Beasts, Graves even tells Credence that he “can smell squib" on him...coincidence? Maybe. Regardless, the point here is that Credence was still able to keep his real magical ability hidden from the greatest dark wizard of that time - while he was literally right under Grindelwald's nose - over and over and over again. The relationship they share serves as proof that they had DEFINITELY been meeting regularly, and for a while. Skills right there.

Another possible reason for him not being admitted into Ilvermorny: He never gets the letter sent to him. We’re not all too sure how admittance to Ilvermorny works for those who are Muggle-born or half-blood. Coming from an all magical family, it’s plausible no one would have come to fetch Credence because his mother and father would have grown up aware of the magical world. There would be no need, because Credence would already have known about it.

In the case of Credence having one muggle parent (there is absolutely no reason for him to NOT be a Pure Blood Wizard by the way - especially because of how against relationships between Witches/Wizards and Muggles/NoMajs the MACUSA is!!!) MACUSA would definitely be keeping an eye on him; especially being aware that Credence was adopted (it wouldn’t make sense for MACUSA not to know this because of their secrecy policies).

**Side note: It’s recently been revealed that Credence seems to be related to the Le Strange family, but could he also be related to Isolt, and therefore to Salazar Slytherin too? Isolt, as we know is a descendant of Salazar Slytherin. She is also a descendant of a powerful witch called Morrigan, whose Animagus form is known to have been a crow. (Source) In a clip from the new Fantastic Beasts trailer, we see the Le Strange family tree, which informs us that Credence is a descendant of this lineage. However, under the head of the Le Strange family tree, Corvus (which means Raven by the way) Le Strange - in a little bubble of its own, we see an animal; specifically, a bird. Could this be a reference to a connection to the witch Morrigan? Could this mean that the Le Strange family are descendants of Morrigan? Whose family is married into the Slytherin lineage? This would mean Bellatrix, the Blacks, the Malfoys, the Le Stranges, and therefore Credence are all related (by extension - some more distantly than others) to Lord Voldemort!** But I digress.

However, a child born to two wizard parents, who is orphaned but shows no magical abilities would not be a reason for any concern for the MACUSA. We also need to keep in mind that Tina was demoted because she attacked Mary-Lou Barebone. How and why did Tina get to be involved with Mary-Lou?

In Harry Potter, Dumbledore goes to deliver Tom Riddle’s letter only because he has already been admitted into Hogwarts. The same is true for Hermione Granger. As stated before, students admitted to Hogwarts are actually selected, which makes them special. It therefore makes sense that someone would physically go out to deliver their letters to the selected students who are from mixed or non-magical homes.

Who’s to say this didn’t also happen with Credence? If he was orphaned as a young child, it wouldn’t matter what his blood status is - someone would still need to go out and deliver his letter to him. The children born into these circumstances (having no connections to the magical world) receive a visit from a witch/wizard whose job it is to fill them in.

Mary Lou Barebone is Credence’s adoptive mother and as such she would be the person any message-bearer from Ilvermorny would have to first meet with in order to be able to meet with Credence. This makes it possible that Credence’s acceptance letter, if he did have one, never even reached him.

Dumbledore first meets with the person running the orphanage when he was delivering the letter to Tom Riddle, and then he meets with Tom. Remember, the people around Tom Riddle in the orphanage were unaware of the existence of magic. They just knew that strange things happened when he was around. Mary Lou Barebone, however is fully aware of it. How? Why? Was she aware of it before being most likely deservedly attacked by Tina?

I think she would have no trouble in recognizing magic at all, and she also seems to be the kind of person who would keep a visit about an admittance to a magic school a secret from Credence, and I can definitely see her destroying his letter as well. It would furthermore only serve to fuel her hatred for him, and give her reason to single him out like she does in the Fantastic Beasts movie.

“Ah-huh! But what about the Dursleys being hounded when they tried to prevent Harry from getting his letter?!” I hear you cry. Well, honestly, this thought has occurred to me too, and I think I know what the difference is.

The Dursleys were plagued for trying to hide Harry's letter when he was accepted into Hogwarts, I think, for one simple reason. Dumbledore had an invested interest in Harry. Yes, it is Hagrid who is hounding the Dursleys for preventing Harry from getting his letter, but remember it is Dumbledore who sent Hagrid to fetch Harry in the first place.

He is there to personally drop Harry off on the doorstep of the Dursleys when Harry was a baby and even left a hand-written note for them to read, he has sent at least one other communication to the Dursleys after they had taken Harry in - presumably more (The ”Remember my last” howler Petunia receives in the books implying this), and had a personal connection to Harry's parents through the order of the Phoenix. He even goes so far as ensuring Harry will be kept safe until he comes of age (which is why he has to stay with the Dursleys), and guides Harry (at least some of the time...okay so it’s more like he sort of vaguely suggests it) in what he needs to do or learn to defeat Voldemort. Dumbledore is also personally connected to Neville Longbottom’s parents through the Order of the Phoenix, but he doesn’t do any of this for their son even though Neville could literally have been the Chosen One. This is because Harry is special, an exception. Credence, unlike Harry, doesn’t seem to have anyone like this for him.

So far, we have no reason to think Dumbledore (or anyone else for that matter) would even know about Credence because his birth and childhood have been unmarked by anything out of the ordinary - as far as we are currently aware (such as surviving the killing curse), and being born to a witch/wizard means that at best he is a potential wizard – at worst; a squib. So no one really has any reason to pay any extra attention to him…at least prior to his identity as the Obscurial being revealed.

Grindelwald being interested in an Obscurus would certainly get Dumbledore's attention (even more so if Ariana really was an Obscurial herself) and would bring Credence onto Dumbledore’s radar. Up until the events of the first movie, we have no reason to think that Dumbledore is even aware of Credence’s existence at all. This will most likely change since both characters have been cast in the second movie.

The sad fate that meets Credence (or does it?) could also very well be a part of what drives Dumbledore to get involved in Harry's safe-keeping – preventing what happened with Credence from happening again with Harry.

This seems to create a plot hole: The Dursleys literally mistreat Harry for years but he doesn’t develop an Obscurus. Why? The key difference between Credence’s case and Harry’s case I think, was stated by Ben of The Super Carlin Brothers in their video about why Harry isn’t an Obscurial. “Check it out if you haven’t already.” (source)

My next possibility for Credence not being admitted into Ilvermorny is that Credence himself could be just as likely to decide against going to Ilvermorny; especially because he is a mistreated, impressionable maybe-11 year old at the time who is living with a magic-hating fanatic. It’s possible, with the constant indoctrination from his adoptive mother, that his own abilities could have scared and/or even embarrassed him or felt like a failing, fault or short-coming he has. This would make sense for and give him even more reason to repress his magic – especially since he gets beaten every time he produces anything remotely magical.

The Credence we are introduced to in the movies is much older, and very bitter-hurt-angry. He would have had time to come to realise what type of person Mary Lou Barebone truly is, and freed himself of her conditioning, and this would have been helped along by Grindelwald - he is all for putting Muggles in their rightful place...The Greater Good, and all that.

It is also possible that Credence could hold Mary Lou responsible for him being unable to perform magic, and he could even resent her for it. Add to this the fact that Grindelwald has been visiting Credence in secret which gives him plenty of time to manipulate Credence, and that Credence also secretly longs to be part of the magical world. (source)

He also seems to be able to control or dictate tasks to his Obscurus - at least for short amounts of time (the attacks on senator Shaw, and Mary Lou Barebone), which means he’s obviously found a way to co-exist with it, even if only temporarily. This co-existence is very likely to be part of the reason for his extremely rare long life. I don’t think he’s actually fully aware of how he is able to do this, if he is even aware of it at all - at least by the end of the first movie, because he literally asks for help. Things look to be different in the trailer for the second movie though. (source)

If he is able to control the obscurus, it wouldn’t have been accomplished through magic in the traditional sense since MACUSA do not get involved with Credence (we all know how hung-up they are on the secrecy thing - they would definitely have got involved with a magic kid harbouring an Obscurus being raised by a NoMaj who is not a biological parent), which leads me to believe they were not aware of his magical ability. Graves’ comment about smelling the squib on Credence and being unable to detect the boy’s abilities even though he’d spent who-knows how long together with him, also serves to reinforce this idea of Credence learning to use an unknown of type of magic to coexist with his obscurus, to me.

Obscurus-Obscurial co-habitations are still largely a mystery and there is potentially a ton that is not yet understood about the phenomenon because it is quite simply not yet known. It’s therefore possible that there is no way for Magical ministries to keep tabs on “Obscurus magic”.

After all, leaving a ticking time-bomb that threatens to reveal everything you’re working so hard to keep hidden, unsupervised and primed to go off at any moment seems more than just a tad negligent.

TL;DR: 1. Credence was simply not selected to attend Ilvermorny. 2. Credence was misread as being a squib - something he is certainly misread as being later on in his life, and was therefore not selected to attend Ilvermorny. 3. Credence was selected to attend Ilvermorny, but never received his letter. 4. Credence received his letter, but chose not to attend Ilvermorny.

What do you think? I'd love to know.

#harry potter theory #credence #ilvermorny #mine #harry potter #credence in magic school is a very interesting idea for me #fan theory #credence barebone #jk rowlings wizarding world #fantastic beasts #and where to find them #magic schools #wizard school #why was credence not admitted to ilvermorny #is credence related to lord voldemort?#family tree #le strange #isolt sayre

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obaewankenope · 7 years

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So I've been back into Harry Potter (because flamethrower) and FBaWtFT (because you) for a while and I've been thinking: Why did Harry not turn into an obscurus? He was certainly punished for magic by the Dursleys.

Oh my. This is. Nonnie. You speak of me and @deadcatwithaflamethrower in the same ask as motivation for the return of your HP related interests… I need to lie down for a minute.

Okay. I’m back. I’m okay.

So. Harry. Obscurus. Why didn’t he become the thing?

Very good question. Like holy crap, excellent question really.

Ariana and Credence are both, as far as we can tell with the former, Obscurials. They both have in common one thing Harry… well, I’d say he doesn’t but thinking about it, no he still sorta has that in common with them.

Physical violence caused Ariana to stop using magic and become unstable later in life.

Physical violence resulted in Credence internalising his magic to the point where it burst out on a rage spree and ended badly.

Harry, at a glance, doesn’t really have that sort of thing in his life. The main focus in the first book especially is all on the emotional and psychological abuse he receives from the Dursleys for being a ‘freak’. Whilst Vernon and Petunia don’t exactly beat him black and blue (though I do recall the frying pan incident and hair grabbing thing), he does still suffer from physical violence in the form of Dudley and his friends.

Of course, considering it, in HP1, Harry’s thought process about the revelation of his being a wizard is very difficult to parse. Initially he denies it, rejects it and cannot fathom how it could be true because:

Hagrid looked at Harry with warmth and respect blazing in his eyes, but Harry, instead of feeling pleased and proud, felt quite sure there had been a horrible mistake. A wizard? Him? How could he possibly be? He’d spent his life being clouted by Dudley and bullied by Aunt Petunia and Uncle Vernon; if he was really a wizard, why hadn’t they been turned into warty toads every time they’d tried to look him in his cupboard? If he’d once defeated the greatest sorcerer in the world, how come Dudley had always been able to kick him around like a football?

Harry Potter and the Philosophers Stone, p.62, 2014 edition

Now, you could potentially argue that Harry is stronger emotionally and psychologically than either Credence or Ariana. Or even go route of ‘different times, different reactions’ and such. But the end result still sorta ends the same:

All three suffered physical abuse and are taught in some ways to think negatively of themselves for their magical ability.

Harry differs from Credence and Ariana only because he’s exposed to the magical world and taught at 11 (not 18 or 20 or whatever age Credence was in FBaWtFT) that he isn’t a freak and shouldn’t be ashamed of his magic.

[Of course, the whole second year and OOOOOOHHH PARSELTONGUE! HE’S EEEEEVVVIIILLLLL! thing is conveniently glossed over as never having any impact on him and really? Nah. Only the positive reinforcement from Ron and Hermione are able to act as any sort of counter-weight to the collective scorn and fear of the magical world he’s come to rely on for identity-formation so heavily]

But you ask a very interesting question because there are plenty of reasons why Harry probably could have been an Obscurus, especially since he’s raised in an abusive home with no support system or positive reinforcement. He’s damn near the poster-child for ‘how not to treat a child’ and the fact that he’s somehow not permanently negatively impacted by this upbringing is… worryingly ignorant of JK.

[The lack of faith in authority figures, trust issues with adults in general, is probably one of the only accurate things JK included about growing up abused in any way; because why trust any adult when not one ever saved you from being hurt in the first place?]

I can’t rewrite HP to make it more accurate in its portrayal of the damage constant psychological and emotional abuse from authority figures (especially guardians) has on a child, but the way Harry develops in HP is… less accurate and reliable than I’d ever prefer. It creates a misunderstanding on the damage these types of abuse can, and do, have on developing minds.

FBaWtFT and the Deathly Hallows both further misunderstanding, implying that only physical abuse can produce an Obscurial while inadvertently ignoring the very real effect psychological and emotional abuse has. It’s an oversight of JK but not one I’m particularly surprised by.

Of course, while we’re at it, Harry isn’t the only character that we know had a bad childhood and didn’t become an Obscurial; Severus Snape fits this narrative too. Perhaps moreso depending. As far as we know, his childhood was both unhappy and potentially violent with psychological and emotional abuse included.

This, however, is something @deadcatwithaflamethrower is more equipped to discuss since she’s writing frickin’ epics about Severus at the moment (of which I greatly appreciate, belief me).

But, ultimately, it seems that it’s a combination of factors that induces someone to become an Obscurus, something that is dependent on abuse, trauma, and lack of support. There’s also personality factors and mental stability aspects to it, and while I’m aware Harry is our way of seeing the magical world and therefore is a ‘special snowflake’, I do find it annoying that there are so few negative impacts of abuse and trauma discussed in the series by JK. She had a perfect narrative tool to examine the effects any type of abuse can have on a person, what constant, repeated trauma can do, and all the attendant factors and effects. Yet… she didn’t. She was willingly selective and, if I’m remembering correctly, has stated that she doesn’t believe Harry was abused as a child.

I’m sure you can imagine what my response to that sort of statement is.

#Anonymous #Kat answers #People talk to me!!!#thank you so much nonnie #HP #FBaWtFT #meta #my meta #wank for ts #this was really interesting to consider #i imagine DC will have other thoughts to add to it

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