#he just doesn't. he gets treated as a normal character and not canon fodder

[ren-c-leyn]

I'm going to use this WBW to continue asking - that's a really good start! How does it turn out with the dark elf?👀 Will he become her bodyguard? What would it mean politically? Are these dark elves different than usual, aka Ren's world touch?

@writingonesdreams

Sounds like a plan to me ^^

So yes, he does become her bodyguard. It's an interesting situation that all parties find themselves in as a result. I've been giving this particular part a lot of thought because this is something that has a lot of potential for chaos. My history-geek roomate has also been helping me with this part, so it does have some historical influences on top of my 'that sounds cool' approach.

So, here's your third readmore for the day, I hope you enjoy it :D

The dark elf body guard (I need to name all of these characters, I don't even think I've named the princess yet XD), is the youngest son of a member of the dark elf council. So, fairly important but not a critically important figure to them, which is why at the end of the war, when Acontinum won the dark elves let them keep him as a 'guest.' In truth, he and three other dark elf nobles are there as sort of political hostages to ensure that the dark elves keep true to their word, just as four minor nobles of Acontinum were sent there as 'guests'. Don't worry, they are all treated well on both sides, because if they weren't it'd spark another war.

But, having him as the princess's bodyguard sets several of the nobles on edge. She's the king's only child, she's beaten this elf in combat, they only just got out of a war, so everyone is freaking out because there might be an assassination which would start an internal battle of succession. And even if that doesn't come to pass, it puts a former enemy in a position to gain sensitive information.

She's not worried about it, because she has beaten him on the battlefield, and is actually the one who proposed the idea after talking with him during the first several months of his stay. The dark elf is cool with it for several reasons, not least of which because of his relatively low rank back home. At least here he gets to do something besides act as canon fodder for his house's battles. Since the dark elves do run on order of birth, he's the very last in line to gain his father's position and thus is the most over-looked of his siblings. So, having someone who both recognizes and values his skills is a plus.

It also creates a sort of image of unity between the two countries, with a princess picking a former enemy as he bodyguard. In some ways, it may make them more reluctant to openly act against her. In other ways, it could create a loophole to make it easier to get at her. That will mostly hinge on how the dark elf bodyguard chooses to play his guards.

As for the dark elves in general, they're a larger country that sits between the dragon empire and Acontinum and also shares a little of their southern boarder with the wood elves' territory (where the dark princess's assassinated lover is from.) Unlike many fantasy settings, they are surface dwellers. They have always been surface dwellers and have no problem with the sun. But, unlike many of my settings, the elves did not come from the same god, and some were not even born of Gods' meddling. So they all vary drastically in appearances and cultures.

They do have dark gray skin, but their hair runs a gray tone spectrum from stark white to deep black. Their eyes run a similar spectrum, but include varying shades of colors both normal and fantasy, like a super dark brown or a really pale purple are both normal for them.

Their lands, much like Acontinum, are cold and icy for much of the year and boarder the ocean. Unlike Acontinum, though, they massive mountain range doesn't cut them off from the south. So they are as versed with the open sea as they are with the frozen plains and the thick forests. Their country is mostly self-sufficient and even trade off some of their goods with Acontinum, the dragon empire, and the wood elves in exchange for other goods.

However, this great influence of varying cultures makes it where the dark elves are even further from being a monolith than the rest of their elven cousins. The different regions of their country have adopted different food staples, fashions, customs, and the like based on their influences and mixed with their own traditions. So it's a bit of a melting pot. The ones on the western side, for example, tend to be more warrior-like since they share the boarder with Acontinum. The ones in the north tend to be more sea-oriented since they boarder the ocean, and so on.

Their ruling system is a council made up of the heads of several families from each region. I don't have an exact number, yet, but I think each region gets multiple representatives and that these families have changed over the years as bloodlines ended, people got fed up with corruption, political workings put some families out of power, ect. Competition for these seats can become fierce and sometimes end in bloodshed. Different families are allied with each other and will vote on actions together, or work together to frustration the plans of political rivals. These heads of the families, and usually their spouses, live in the capital city while their eldest children or trusted stewards run things back home and keep them updated on what's going on there.

They typically prefer diplomacy to war, but will not shy away from war if it is called for. Though, I'm still working out what the clash between them and Acontinum was about.

And that's what I have on them so far. Thanks for stopping by, I hope you have a lovely day/evening.

#wbw #The Dark Princess of Acontinum

[eisforeidolon]

I know Dean is straight, but 2 things on the show stump me. 1: Crowley saying, "We've done extraordinary things to triplets." 2: Dean saying, "Live Skinemax?" in 12x11(did he mean simply watching?)" . I know an orgy doesn't change one's identification. But why do you think tptb presents such interpretive scenarios? Despite the rest of canon & Kripke's & Jensen's remarks–which I value–all the biDean posts have left me unmoored & I'd truly appreciate your 2 cents.

In terms of general “interpretivescenarios” as you call them, I think it's just old school shipteases.  By which I mean the showrunners basically doing theequivalent of turning to the fandom and saying, nudge nudge winkwink we know you're out there.  I think it’s foolhardy to try and imbue that with meaning since they’ve thrown them around like candy from the beginning.

Like all the times Sam and Dean havebeen mistaken for or paralleled with romantic couples.  Like all the jokes Balthazar made aboutCas being both Sam and Dean'sboyfriend.  Likeall Crowley's marriage/mistress jokes about him and Bobby and him andCas and him and Dean.  I could go on.

Slashfans used to know that was the best they were going to get, and theywere often grateful for little suggestive teases they could use asship fodder.  These days, when it's actually realistic to expect morediverse hookups on shows of all kinds, a lot of fans have turned acomplete 180 and now get angry at any tease that doesn't get followthrough.  To be fair, I think both fans and creators are strugglingto redefine how to maneuver the new territory where what used to be seen as a playful joke can now be taken (maybe even rightfully) as spiteful.  With this show inparticular having been on so long with older creators, I thinkthey're probably even slower to change to audience expectations thannormal.  For example, see what they thought would be a funny jokewith Cas' heaven that was scrapped when Jared pointed out peoplewould take it seriously.  

To getback to your specific examples, I don't claim to be an expert on dudeinteractions, but the impression I've gotten generally from moreguy-targeted media and various male friends is pretty much the pointyou already made about orgies.  I.e. at least some dudes seem toconsider it perfectly hetero so long as the dicks don't touch.  Withtriplets that would be easy enough, and I find this similarlyuncompelling as the example from the old!Dean episode where he checksfor the guy's birthmark under the blanket – not being bothered bythe nudity of others does not make you interested (nor are a walletyou could have stolen or a standard military tattoo quite asunarguable as a birthmark).  Likewise yeah, with Sam and Rowena, Isaw it as Dean talking about watching, since skinemax is a thing youwatch, so live skinemax = watching a live performance.  If watchingporn with dudes in makes you bisexual, well...  In short, I think TBTB throw this stuff in for fan titillation because they know they have a big fanbase which contains slash fans and it used to be it would cost them nothing to put in something the general audience would just dismiss as a joke.

Still,those are my interpretations - and that's exactlymy problem with bi!Dean meta.  Well, putting aside all the stuffwhere it gets weird about stereotypes and masculinity and gender,anyway.  Every single bit of it takes a throwaway joke, titillation,or utterly random moment and heavily interprets it with laser focusin one direction to a predetermined conclusion - and then treats thatinterpretation as canon fact.

It does so by ignoringother obvious interpretations of those moments.  It does so by ignoring all thetimes Dean has reiterated his sexuality in plain words – he doesn'tswing that way, he's looking for women, he doesn't play for yourteam.  It does so by ignoring Dean's on-screen explicitly sexual actions on theshow that have involved women and only women every single time for twelveyears.  Twelve years during which he's been normal, depressed,possessed, supernaturally influenced, condemned to death within ayear, a demon – and never once been overtly sexual with men. Ignoring that Dean is at this point nearing forty years old and very,very few people redefine their sexuality that late in life.  It does so by ignoringwhat Kripke and Jensen have said about the way the character has been conceived, written, and played all along.  

Idon't care if people have dumb headcanons.  I do care when they tryto insist said headcanons are actually canon, or they are entitled tothe writers changing the show to make them canon because the very existence of theirinterpretation makes it true in Entitlementlandia.  Especially when some of them are suchassholes about it.  

If youhad said to me before I came to tumblr, “I headcanon Dean as bi.”? I'd have shrugged and said sure, why not?  Then I read the meta andwatched the show again, and having actually examined it as a premise,I find it on the level of headcanoning that Sam wears purpleunderwear with dogs on every Thursday.  Sure, it's not completely 100% impossible,but there's really nothing in canon that substantiates it.  Althoughat least headcanons about Sam's underwear aren't contradicted by thebulk of the text and clear statements about intent from thewriters and the actor that plays him - which is not something you cansay for bi!Dean.

#askboxery #Dean has never been shown as anything but straight #Anonymous

[phoenix1966sbottom]

Hi Phoneix! Do you have any favorite fics discussing the more gloomy, realistic problems between Sam and Dean? Safiyabat's for example (just an example, it doesn't need to be something like that), but non-slash is fine with me. Preferably hurt Sam, and no fixing. Also, if you don't mind, I'm curious what's your idea on their dysfunctional relationship? Thank you! ( I understand this is a fic rec blog, please just ignore my question if you don't feel to answer :)

When I read your first sentence, I immediately thought of Safiyabat for their wincest and gen stories. I haven’t come across many that really focus on the dysfunctional nature of the family relationship as well as their stuff and stays close to canon (there are plenty of serial killer!AUs, etc., for example).

That being said, I have a couple of gloomy ones and ones that just focus on the broken, family dynamic. Hurt!Sam all the way. Heed the warnings where the stories are hosted as there are deathfics in this list, not to mention other disturbing content (also, John and/or Dean are not “good” guys in these stories):

Remember When…by darkroses on Ao3. Sam/Dean, Dean/John. Wincest. John is mysteriously back from the dead and Sam is happy about that until he walks in on his father and Dean. Sam is upset and jealous, so Dean reminds him of times in their past.Sam doesn’t want to think about those times. Dean thinks Sam is playing a game by shying away from him.

Don’t Let Me Know We’re Invisible by mimblexwimble on LiveJournal. Sam/Dean. Wincest. The sex is ambiguous. Sam just can’t cope with the hunting life.

Wild Men Who Caught and Sang the Sun by kroki-refur on adult-fanfiction.org. Sam/Dean. Wincest. Sam is Dean but Dean is not Sam.

What Doesn’t Kill Us by kroki-refur on LiveJournal. Sam/Dean, Sam/John. Wincest. Incest. Heed the warnings on this one! John and Dean use abusive methods to keep Sam in line. (this might be f-locked now)

Talk to Me by darkroses on Ao3. Sam/Dean. Wincest. John walked in on the unthinkable. He never wanted this to happen but he needed answers. He hoped this wasn’t true. He hoped there was another reason.

The Wolf At His Door by goandgetthegun on Ao3. Sam/Dean. Wincest.  Dean wants Sam in every way he shouldn’t, so when he gets an opportunity to have what he wants, he takes it.

The Virgin by darkroses on Ao3. Sam/John (non-con). Wincest. Sixteen year old Sam is on a hunt with his dad, brother, and Bobby. The thing is targeting virgins. John takes matters into his own hands to protect Sam.

And if I show you my dark side by ratherastory on LiveJournal. Sam/Dean. Wincest. Dean will never let Sam go, and Sam knows it. This changes nothing, but it changes everything.

These two are a/b/o by darkroses:

To Have Worth. Sam/Dean. Wincest AU. Dean claims Sam from a young age to be his omega. Sam wasn’t sure how he felt about that. His feelings changed with time. All he wanted was to be worth something. No matter what Sam offered, he could never have what he was searching for.

The Monster in the Shadows. Sam/John, Sam/Dean. Wincest AU. John comes to terms with how to treated Sam after he presented as an omega at the tender age of twelve. He only did what he thought he was right. He can never make up for what he did. He can never change what Sam thinks of him now.

And, finally, a gen one I really liked because it showed how Sam suffered for a decision Dean made (something the show, in my opinion, teases at but never fully resolves. e.g. Dean selling his soul and not really considering what hell he’s condemning his brother to in the process, allows an angel to possess him even though he knows Sam hated every moment of Meg and Lucifer). It goes AU after Dean knocks Sam unconscious and leaves him on the ground in 9X23.

How the Wild Things Start by foolscapper on Ao3. Gen. Sam-centric. "This is where it starts — the brightly lit ring, the screams, the glinting of knives, the baring of teeth. This, right here, is where it begins. Sam turns to Dean, Metatron just a hero’s walk away, and Dean slams his fist into the side of Sam’s face. It will bruise, but that’s not the point. Sam will not face Metatron’s blade and wrath, but that is not the point. The point is, Dean puts Sam’s hands on his chest, the action sickly sweet like perfume left on a tacky, bloated corpse — and then he walks away. He leaves Sam, dreaming black dreams on the ground, just outside of the impala. Baby does not protect him when one of Abaddon’s followers finds him. Baby does not scream for help or look for Dean when the demons drag Sam’s unconscious body away.When Dean leaves Metatron’s burnt-out husk, his bones screaming ecstasy from the kill, he finds Sam gone.“

As for my thoughts on dysfunctional wincest…I’ll put them below the cut so people can skip that if they want.

I started watching the show as it went on the air, so I have had 12 years to mull over all sorts of relationships, etc. Below are my thoughts on wincest in fanon. I am by no means saying it exists in canon or should exist in canon. These are simply my opinions. 

Wincest, to me, was there from the start. You’ve got the father (and one day I will sit down and write out my take on John) who raises his sons as soldiers (I know Sam described them as “warriors” in the pilot, but I suspect the word choice was intentional by the writers. There are rightfully all types of negative connotations to the phrase “child soldier”). Nevertheless, this is how they were raised.

The sons were never given the time or permission to form outside attachments with all the moving around John put the family through. They were taught at a young age to lie, and later to cheat and steal via credit card fraud and pool hustling at the very least (a reason the whitewashing of John’s character in these last few seasons irks me. “I raised you right” was John’s motto? Really? However, that is a discussion for another time)

Dean was given the heavy burden of raising his brother. John stripped him of his childhood and drilled into him to always “take care of Sammy” from a very young age. And that is where I see the seeds of wincest, with the older brother having proprietary feelings for his younger because John placed Sam (literally and figuratively) in Dean’s hands. And, at his end, John placed Sam’s life once more in Dean’s control by urging him to save or kill his younger brother while leaving Sam in the dark about what he knew.

John emphasized family first according to his rules and did not allow them to leave (except, of course, he was allowed to go off and not only father another son, but let that son have the life, including “normal” dad, Sam and Dean ached for). The price of leaving the family (and for college, not to run off to deal drugs, etc.)? Excommunication from the only family/support system Sam was allowed to have. Having made his sons so dependent on the family unit, I wonder if John secretly thought Sam would eventually cave and come crawling back to them (my speculation - nothing in the show overtlypointed to this).

For me, that sealed the deal that Sam and Dean were much like two people trapped on a deserted island, or like siblings trapped in an attic with a parent that was only sporadically present - ripe breeding ground for incestuous thoughts and feelings. No, I don’t for one second see it as a healthy relationship, because the boys were never allowed to know healthy.

Furthermore, Dean was always the controlling partner. I would say to the point of obsessiveness, which is understandable given the pressures that were placed on him by John. In the first season, we get to see Dean isolating Sam from the life he was building outside of the “family”. In “Skin”, he sort of mocks Sam for staying in touch with his friends, making him feel guilty that he is dishonest with them and agrees when Sam rather incredulously asks if he is supposed to just cut them out of his life. By the end of that episode, Sam is resigned to no longer really staying in touch. But Dean, like John, gets to live by different rules. We discover Dean did have a relationship with Cassie while Sam was away, going so far as to break that unspoken rule the family had about not revealing the hunting life to people they aren’t “saving”. That backfired on him, with her ending the relationship. When they meet up again in the first season, he promises to come back to her even though she doesn’t believe they have a chance. He never does return and even ignores Sam’s offer of staying there longer (Sam wanting Dean to have that life he himself had tried to fashion is once again echoed in the promise he extracts from Dean in Swan Song. Notice that when Dean returned from Purgatory [when he was thought dead], he harangued and punished Sam verbally and emotionally for trying for normal once again).

So, the show continued its slow reinforcement of the boys never having successful relationships outside of their tiny family. Sam “fails” at love when almost all his significant others die, and Dean “fails” at love when he is either rejected by them or he feels they are unsafe knowing him (in the latter, he makes one of his unilateral “I know what’s good for you even though this will take away some of your autonomy” decisions and has Lisa & Ben mindwiped. foolscapper did a dark fic au on how that choice played out in the end…ouch)

To me, there is so much fodder to play with in fanon for a twisted, unhealthy relationship with a dark, controlling Dean. Although I read very little written like that, it is my favorite wincest headcanon. This is not to say I don’t enjoy a romanticized version of wincest (because I do very much and it is usually my preferred reading), but, to me, the show enforces an unhealthy, push vs. pull relationship between the two that they will never completely resolve.

As an aside, I also find it almost humorous we all refer to them as “the boys” when they are men (if you take into account their age), as though we subconsciously acknowledge they have not grown up into adults in the conventional sense of the word and probably never will.

They truly are the lost boys doomed to never leave Neverland.

#Anonymous #dark!wincest #wincest #deathfic #fanfic rec #meta on wincest #my opinion #nothing more #a/b/o dynamics #omega!sam #alpha!dean #dark wincest