#idk i'm just hugely fascinated by all of the characters motivations you know? whether or not they are bad or good i just find them

[trashlie]

Hi! I just want to bring up two details that I haven't seen anyone discuss from Ep182 and I would love to know what you think. I'm going to put the second detail in another ask because it's a spoiler from Ep197. Feel free to copy + paste it under the cut to this ask or answer it when it's publicly released.

1) Alyssa's interest when Minhyuk talked about his lunch squad. She met Nol, Dieter, and Soushi during their regular after school lunch dates! Originally, I thought that Nol reminded her of Shinae's genuine personality. But looking back at this Nol could've also reminded her of Minhyuk's easygoing personality or rather his popularity. Do you think this little bit of conversation had any affect on Alyssa's decision to befriend them? I guess I wonder if Alyssa values authenticity in people or if she simply wants friends for her own sake. 1/2

Hey Nonny! I looooove this question, thank you for bringing this up, because you are right, I have not seen it discussed, nor have I thought as deeply on it! Knowing that fandom has even drawn a lot of parallel between Nol and Minhyuk, you bring up a really interesting point to explore!

Part two of your ask is under the cut, so to anyone looking at this, there are spoilers for 197 following!

2) The fact that Minhyuk explained to Alyssa why he doesn't like his friends copying his homework. And then she went and did THAT! Shinae put so much effort into their project and got in trouble trying to get it back. Yet, Alyssa hadn't bothered to consult her or consider her feelings at all. Hell she even called the project "mine" and not "ours". I know her social skills are abysmal but she's just insensitive at this point. She didn't even apologize to Shinae for it and blamed her for the whole ordeal. It is so hard to root for Alyssa because I honestly don't know if she feels any remorse over how she treats others. 2/2

I thought that the flashback would help clear up Alyssa more for us, but it seems like we've just been more confused by her, right? I admit I try to remain optimistic, if only because I hope that there's more layers than I'd previously thought? And I do think we get that sense - just, you know, in a way that doesn't necessarily buy Alyssa any sympathy lol. I think there's a better understanding of some of her motives and reactions, but it still paints her in a very negative light.

I think something important to remember is that two opposite things can be very true. Alyssa can value both authenticity and also crave friendship for her own sake. I still think that's why she treated Shinae the way she did and seems to have developed a crush on her - because Shinae is just so authentic that it's hard to dislike her when you see that part of her, but it couldn't eclipse Alyssa's desire to be a part of something bigger, to have a group, which frankly is a very normalized notion of social life and something Alyssa didn't seem to have ever had before, right? So I think it's very possible - and likely - that Yeonggi could remind Shinae of his authenticity and Minhyuk in his easy-going likability, which frankly is a concept that really tickles me lol. Drawn to him because he possessed that easy nature of Minhyuk, the kind of person people just like because of his energy and that boyish charm, while lol ironically, reminding him of Shinae's earnest authenticity. I don't think it's by accident that young Shinae wore such bright, blinding smiles so similar to Yeonggi's, except that hers were real and true.

That said, yes, I've mused for a long time how much Alyssa actually liked their group, and as I've said, I know I'm often naively optimistic about her and I like to hope they were, even if for a short time, real friends to her, despite what we know, that once she became a trainee she seems to have stopped talking to them all. She also pointedly describes Yeonggi as a kid who you warm up to which.... lol. I mean, I guess Shinae, too, has essentially described him as someone who annoyed her until she warmed up to him, too, but Shinae isn't "dating" Nol, either. But with that in mind, yes, I think it's very possible that maybe the allure of being part of something, having a group of friends, being taken in by people was very alluring to her, even if she may not have had much in common with them. But I also can't help but feel that maybe there was something about how she perceived Nol that made her want to be a part of it, and maybe hope it could rub off on her, too. I don't think Alyssa accepted their friendship because they seemed popular as much as to be a part of something, to not be alone, but I guess we can also view it as when faced with a future that WOULD give her more popularity (legit fame) they were no longer necessary to her?

idk I waffle back and forth on her ALL the time and I think it's a matter of how two things can be true at the same time: that she does value these traits in people, but when faced with what she's coveted for so long, she's willing to let it go in order to obtain her goal? Or maybe she WANTED to hold on to both things and found out that she couldn't, and the one that required more attention was the one that better achieved her goal?

Much like Kousuke, though to a lesser degree, I think Alyssa is adequate at compartmentalization, and thus she confuses us and throws us off all the time. I think she does legitimately care about who she hurts, but I think she represses it deep down when it contrasts with her goals, and because of this compartmentalization, she has very Kousuke-like tendencies to try to control the narrative, to try to have the best of both worlds, to have her cake and eat it, too, but every time she attempts it, it blows up in her face, and when she's driven into a corner, she makes a choice that benefits her. Simply put, Alyssa has never learned to deal with the possibility that she cannot achieve all that she wants to and tries and tries until it blows up in her face.

Now that I've rambled a lot, I think this leads us nicely to your second point!

I think comparing that conversation to what played out with Alyssa and the assignment definitely just further cements their very different natures. Minhyuk is surrounded by people and he doesn't exactly have an alliance to any one group in particular. When his lunch squad wants to use him for his efforts, he doesn't want to spend his time with them. Alyssa cannot fathom this. I think part of it is because she's never HAD groups of friends and aches for it. To her, it sounds like a small price to pay to be surrounded by people I think it's a trade off for validation. The biggest difference, of course, is that Minhyuk is very confident, and because he doesn't have a necessary alliance to any one group of friends in particular, he's willing to cast off the ones who aren't truly his friends. If people stop seeing him for what he is because of his choice to remain friends with Shinae, then good riddance to them because they aren't truly his friends and don't truly like him, right? Alyssa lacks that confidence and spine. To her, that project was no big deal, easy work, they can always come up with something new and do even better, because in her mind, it's a fair trade off.

But you are right - that was Shiane's idea and Shinae also put in a lot of effort for it. She used her own meager allowance to print off those notes, she shadowed her dad's job even though she still had to go to school. And Alyssa doesn't acknowledge that. I think this is for two reasons: one, to her that effort is no big deal because she's pretty gifted and knows they can easily redo it and two, to her the trade off is worth it. The silly thing is, Alyssa doesn't think very far ahead. She thinks this is a one time transaction, that you give a little of your time and effort to someone and they'll do the same thing. But what would most likely happen is that girl would just continue to use Alyssa for help with school work, probably going as far as to get Alyssa to do more work for her, and in exchange, Alyssa would have only an empty, fake friendship that enriches nothing.

She just can't see or fathom that. To her, why would Minhyuk be bothered by having so many friends? Why would he want to get away from them? It's funny because isn't it very similar to Shinae and Alyssa regarding their families? Shinae cannot fathom what it's like to have both parents so deeply invested in your life and what you're doing and asking questions because she's got only one parent who is overworked and absorbed in his job + schooling + growing alcoholism. For her, how can parents being invested and indulging all of your whims be a bad thing? I think it's just a matter of the grass appearing greener on the other side. So when Minhyuk explains why he doesn't like people copying his homework, all Alyssa really gets out of it is "hey if you help people with their work, they will flock to you and be your friend" which lmao is exactly the OPPOSITE of what she should get out of it. But it's very similar to how Shinae visits Alyssa's house and thinks if this was her life, she'd never want to be in public school - because they each only see out of the other situation what they want. Shinae longs to not struggle, to have her needs met, and thinks that such a luxurious life would leave her wanting for nothing, with no issues to face. Alyssa longs to be a part of something bigger, to always be surrounded by friends, because surely if she was she wouldn't be filled with such loneliness and would learn to be comfortable in who she is, and therefore what's the harm of trading their project for friendship?

It's funny, that Alyssa is so afraid of bullying and ostracization, but she doesn't seem to have considered that not all friendship is genuine. She's willing to assimilate, to hide her true self, to accept fake friendship if it fills a lonely void, without considering how lonely that kind of "friendship" is. In her mind, being surrounded by people is the cure to what ails her, so she's never considered anything otherwise.

But yes, it's a selfish choice. She doesn't consider how Shinae would feel, or even ask if she'd like to give up their project. She just... goes and does it with the assumption that not only would Shinae understand, but that she might actually see the benefit, which is just... really rich of her. It's definitely a very selfish choice, motivated by what she gets out of it. Her current goal was a. to stay friends with Shinae while b. becoming popular, and she thought this was her how she could pull it off, until everything went awry when her plan blew up in her face. That said, I think she had every intention of telling Shinae about it except that her expectations were derailed. I don't think she ever thought about apologizing, though, because I don't think she thought it was a thing TO apologize for, and when she lost her opportunity to tell Shinae the truth, she blamed Shinae for making it into a bigger deal. And I guess, yeah, Shinae did make it into a bigger deal but... it wouldn't have happened if Alyssa had just never done that in the first place. From her perspective, Shinae did mess everything up, but there would have been nothing to mess up if she had not made that decision.

I want to reiterate that I do think Alyssa feels some kind of remorse, just because, I guess I'm dumb and hopeful lol, and I think she just compartmentalizes this? I like to hope that after blowing up on Shinae like this, Alyssa is probably feeling miserable, but too proud to go back on her word? Again, like Kousuke, when backed into a corner, Alyssa lashes out at everyone like a feral cat and she acts on her instinct of self-preservation and in that moment, the only way to save face was to throw Shinae under the bus. It's shitty and selfish and I just want to hope she regrets it and knows she's messed up badly, but that's just a hope at this point, I know. But I've definitely thought this of her arguments with Nol, too, that she responds like some feral, cornered cat when she can't continue to control the narrative and turns things on Nol (telling him he hasn't been the best boyfriend, lashing out on him for ruining her night at her agency party) where I THINK she probably feels some kind of regret later and just never acts on it. Alyssa knows when she hurts people and tries to deflect, so I think there's remorse buried deep deep under other complications she chooses to focus on instead?

That said, I can't blame anyone else who doesn't think this way! I think I continue to try to root for Alyssa because I WANT to see her change, but I still think it's going to require some kind of catalyst to get her there in the present. She has what she thought she wanted - an idol with adoring fans, fame that equates to popularity, and finds instead that she feels imprisoned. I think maybe it's there and she just hasn't reached the conclusion yet, and is continuing to lie to herself. Maybe she believes that the means will justify the ends and that in time she'll reach her true goal, but I think we all know that what she is receiving is a pale, watered down version of what she truly seeks. The only true friend Alyssa has is Meg, and Meg has her own life to live. Alyssa cannot expect people to fill a hollow void for her; that's something she has to learn to do through authentic means, and once, twice upon a time she had those opportunities and threw them all away.

And maybe that's what we're meant to learn about Alyssa - that she's so blinded by what she wants and craves that she's let herself get so deeply lost in it and her choices continue to haunt her. She could have had true friendship with Shinae, but was too blinded by popularity to hold on to it. She could have had true friendship with Nol and co, but she was too blinded by social prestige + her trainee life to expend the energy necessary to maintain that friendship. Her "relationship" with Nol exists only to serve their own individual needs not, and not out of any kind of true friendship anymore. Alyssa continues to trade ever true relationship for something that will never actually fulfil her, because she's still convinced that if she just reaches that goal it will be worth it, without coming to realize that she's wrong, that what she's been chasing is a hollow imitation of what she's thrown away over and over.

Please let me know more of what you think! I know I'm in a very small minority of those who try to see something more in Alyssa - or at least HOPE for her to finally acknowledge the way her choices affect others - so I don't expect anyone else to agree with those parts lol, that's more of something that I just always hope for, because it's what I want to see in her eventual development. I think I always wanted to believe that Yeonggi, Dieter, and Soushi meant something to Alyssa until she was faced with her trainee life, but you're right - perhaps it was always just the idea of belonging to a unit, rather than their friendship. Perhaps it was just Alyssa seeking comfort in finally feeling like she had a group, a squad, people who validated her rather than what they as her only friends in her very lonely life represented.

#I Love Yoo #ILY Brainrot #ILY Spoilers #ILY FP #Alyssa Cho #I genuinely love that people continue to send me asks about her even if they don't like her lol it's so fun to just talk about her #and her choices and motivations even if people don't like her choices #idk i'm just hugely fascinated by all of the characters motivations you know? whether or not they are bad or good i just find them #intriguing or something lol #i think there's a lot of likelihood that my hope and optimism is hugely unfounded lmao but i just put it out there JUST IN CASE #but look Nol never included Alyssa when he was talking about the friends who are important and special to him so it's highly likely that he #suspected a long time ago what you were getting at - that it was never about friendship as much as being a part of something #that he provided her that chance to experience what she'd always craved and it was just another attempt at karmic good deeds to him #maybe alyssa and nol never did have a true friendship like i'd hoped all along and she just relished in the concept of belonging rather #than the feeling of true friendship which. is pretty sad for her. #i hope she one day finally realizes she's just chasing something hollow and empty and will never fill that void if she keeps it up.

[kitsoa]

Meta reality anon: Well when it comes to Yozora we'll know better (or won't) in a couple of days. ;) Yeah something like that. I do think the merging and confusion between fiction and reality will be a major theme in the upcoming saga. After all it's been built up since COM in various ways: false memories vs real. Nobodies. Data and Dream worlds. Woldlines. Different realities w/different versions (video game Yozora and real Yozora). I do think MoM will toy w/this a lot. I think I'm pretty -

2 pretty focused on those dark beings MoM told Luxu about in Union X. He made them seem very different from what Sora and anyone else besides MoM has encountered so far. More intelligent. More scary. I'm wondering if MoM isn't the only mastermind in the shadows. Like those dark beings he mentioned are beyond anything even existing in the Realm of Darkness and they're pulling their own strings to keep this war cycle going. Shoot for all we know they messed w/reality first and MoM got in-

3  on it later on. There's a lot to unpack and a lot we don't know. But I do think those dark beings are going to be a huge deal: possibly the true final bosses of the saga (not that I think MoM will be a blameless saint unless some epic twist is made. He's definitely a shifty guy just for what he put Luxu and all the other Keyblade weilders through. Good intentions or not). They say there was darkness before light and all light must have a source. Maybe we'll learn about the first clash-

4 between light and dark, battling for supremacy as reality was taking shape. MoM could be a ancient being as well from around that time. As one reality fell to darkness. People learned to create new realities like storybook tales. Ansem said a heart like Sora's could breathe life into anything, from wind to a puppet. Maybe MoM also had a heart like that. One that could create whole realities even. The heart is the most powerful and mysterious thing in KH. Kingdom Hearts itself will make anyone-

5 a god who opens it successfully. Kingdom Hearts is a character all on it's own. It's the one that truly decides what is or can be real. It certainly seems far less inflexible them most Keyblade weilders are. W/this in mind Kingdom Hearts already has a very mysterious connection or interest in both Sora and MoM. Maybe KH is more active then we think? Everyone just sees it as this thing to attain or protect. But maybe it uses the Keyblades as its eyes to watch all these realities w/hearts 

6 I'm not sure if this whole kh universe is MoM's creation or if it's Kingdom Hearts. But I do think MoM is fascinated w/ideas of what's real or not on many different meta levels. I think to a degree Sora (and Yozora) is too. Sora's very first lines are questioning if what he knows is real. He also thought more deeply about the nature of nobodies and found out they are real. Not to mention, again, Ansem's insight that Sora empathy allows his heart to create hearts in others. What's real again?-

7 In KH Idk. Honestly the very idea of questioning reality to this extent is unthinkable. You'd almost feel detached like you were in a constant dream. Then to suddenly to yoinked to another Final World when you're existence was suppose to vanish. That's insane. Do you think the MoM's and Sora's actions are causing a ripple effect on KH? One that's warping fact and fiction. MoM and Sora were brought to a world: Fantasy based on Reality (FF13V's original tagline). What does KH consider not real?

In regards, to the dark beings mentioned in the flashback, I’ve basically said my piece in my analysis of the scene. I personally don’t think he’s talking about an actual force of darkness. I think he’s taking advantage of the double meaning in KH terminology to make us think there’s another force of evil out there. I think he’s actually just explaining his ‘sympathetic’ back story. The reason for the smoke and mirrors is because it’d be in dramatic character, point to the themes of fantasy as a coping mechanism, and the reality of it being the interpretation of real world evil would give away the twist. 

That’s my meta reality lens. If we limit our ideas here, then yeah, MoM could be talking about a new dark force in the lore. I just think we have all the lore pieces in terms of opposition laid out before us.

And having someone behind MoM is always a possibility but it’d be a little tired due to MoM’s reveal that he’s basically behind the entire first saga too. Motive is one thing but I personally am not a fan of last minute villains. MoM’s being established as a villain for years now and it’d be a little low to change that in the finale. 

Ultimately if you view the KH world as an entirely fictional beast, the subjects within it unaware, then you can essentially explain any plot holes and contrivance as a “meddling god” or author. I’ve always been one to try to understand the inner mechanisms of mythological physics which is why I’ve gravitated to this reading. Making real that which isn’t. I refer to my interpretation of the Replica situation to best describe the entire function of the kh world. 

Replicas are objects imbued with data. Cold hard facts and information. A heart is the force that sparks that data into life. Whether its a heart placed in the object or born from surrounding relationship, the heart is the sole requirement to be considered an existing person. And by nature of this very basic law the object miraculously becomes the intended person down to the blood pumping in their body. It’s not magic, it’s like… the actual physics. Because this is a reality that is subservient to the emotions and those emotions are born from the story told. The fantasy being presented. I go into this in my Worlds as Stories theory but it’s the reason why I see these grand entities like Kingdom Hearts as simply the embodiment of the entire fictional realm. 

I think the 4th wall is going to be broken soon. That Sora is going to discover his origins and have to grapple with his philosophies of existence being put to the test. This could very well change the entire fabric of the KH universe as a result. I mean you can't undo that knowledge once it happens. (i mean unless you forget which could happen). I’m the weird one saying that I don’t think Sora and Yozora are in the world of Verum Rex but in the real world. Because if Yozora dwells in a Fantasy based on Reality. Then Sora exists in a Reality based on Fantasy.

#kingdom hearts #meta catastrophe #meta reality theory #worlds as stories theory #kitasks #Anonymous