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lady-plantagenet · 3 years

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What hasn’t already been said: The Spanish Princess 2

Episode 3: GOOD Grief! (we finally have a good episode on our hands)

To all those of you keen enough to have come back for another segment of ‘what hasn’t already been said: TSP’, as opposed to have just been scrolling when you see this - welcome back! (Scrollers you too <3)

Drawing of Thomas More’s Son AKA who Margaret Pole at this point wants to be the step baby momma of ;).

To anyone who’s seeing this for the first time: what this is a list of observations, jokes, reactions and criticism which occur to me upon a rewatch. I wait every week until Saturday to do this so that I have had my fill of scrolling through the tag and aggregating what has already been said. I tried doing a whole spoof (here where I gave up 10% in) but tbh a) I don’t know the history well enough b) it’s more time consuming than I thought and c) this series is just not as funny or as crazy as TWQ, so it’s untenable. Having said that: This is not a hatepost. I’m not hatewatching this series and nitpicking on purpose but expressing my honest views and trying to find the good in it as well as the bad.

Without further ado...

First Scenes:

LMAO the way Wolsey suggests they break their alliance with Spain is freaking hilarious because the actor delivers the lines as if he were a high school girl making a personal attack by suggesting the prom change its theme to 70s disco to the chagrin of the peppy up-and-coming rival.

Also @ Henry VIII looking like the peppy up-and-comer’s bff and shy stan with that pencil bite and small smirk when Catherine loses her cool against Wolsey.

I’m sorry... who is Henry married to again?

Also what is Margaret Pole doing at the council meeting?? I’m not saying I don’t like it.

Margaret Pole warning against certain repetitive thinking creating madness :(((

Attempted Naked Twister:

Oh Catherine, what is with you and all the other STARZ protagonists and that weird politcky bedroom talk? Who actually finds this sexy?

‘Catherine you are unnatural’ ooof that line delivery was somehow haunting.

Was the whole ‘I can’t be rushed you are off-putting with your overpowering’ a callback to Arthur and Catherine? Apparently there’s another writer for this episode so I won’t put all subtly past them.

Scotland:

‘Shitey men’ asdkjashd

Look I’m tired of all this ‘my children won’t be safe’ line getting repeated. Look mate, murder of royal infants and children was not exactly a common occurence, even in cases of deposition. The Princes in the Tower are an exception to this but a very infamous case for that reason. Child murder was extremely taboo. In situations like this with an infant kid, no one is going to bother murdering the babies and taking their thrones, the lords will just vie for power and make themselves de facto rulers and oust the queen. It’s not a question of safety but a question of holding power. Stop giving all women characters perma mummy brains.

Maggie being all caring:

‘Barnaby’ *scoffs* ‘Such an English name’ - OH MAN 0_0 is Catherine mocking them for trying to adapt ? Like I know it’s meant to show her envy for Lina, but it’s coming out all messed up.

Our girl Maggie’s smile screams I’m beating your ass in chess.

Anyhow this is the least histrionic we’ve seen Catherine so far.

Chaplain vs Catherine:

I’m interested how Catherine will feel at Stafford’s execution given that I have noticed this show build up to a friendship between them.

Why is everyone laughing at the whole ‘will you delight us with new schemes’ line was not that funny?

LMAO at Thomas Boleyn’s attempted brown-nosing.

You know what? Ruairi is a decent actor. When he says ‘so you admit it? you lost the child because you tried to be a man?” the actor conveys Henry’s troubled mind, lowkey scare towards Catherine and bewilderment all in one. The way his eyes do not move but just widen emotionlessly also gives this sense that he is being manipulated (which I guess they are going for with Wolsey). Then the whole choir music in the background.. I don’t know.. I’m liking this, it’s creating a vibe of a king of haunted and increasingly paranoid Henry. I’m sure they are going for that, so good.

Ursula Pole and Mama:

Maggie Pole say ‘riches don’t keep you safe’ with tears in her eyes :’(. Please tell me how this is not her thinking on her parents and granddad Warwick and what befell them ;’(.

I find Ursula refreshing actually, don’t get those types of heroines often. But they are making her similar to a gold-digger, an exhalted marriage was first and foremost considered a thing of honour. Noblepeople wouldn’t speak in such mercenary terms regarding their marriages.

Post Mary Defiance:

I love the ‘horse’ nickname from Brandon n’awwww

Also just realised what made TWQ so atmospheric - that wierd ‘oooo’ sound effect in the background when a character was being paranoid or worrying. They are using it during Henry’s ‘How is it that I have no sons?’ and it is just... so effective.

Catherine calling them ordinary children... she just keeps striking me as more and more classist. Like ok, I know every royal was... but still, I thought she was meant to see Lina as a friend and equal despite her race and status. To add the race element, this kind of rubs me the wrong way.

Also it is so clear by the end when Catherine states how the king is upset with her, she expects Maggie to ask her about it.. but she doesn’t lmao.

Back to Scotland until Sexy boy fencing:

I love me this soft boi. Angus <3 <3

I like how they address that some men don’t really like killing and that violence isn’t inherent in a man’s nature.

Oh man, are we supposed to look at Lina’s house and deplore the impoverished conditions? It would go for at least 3,000,000 pounds in today’s property market?

Is Catherine being particularly classist again with ‘Why u not becoming a butcher Wolsey, ey?’.

Though I will admit the ‘but giving meat to the poor is also good’ was one of her only smart comebacks.

Just realised, Catherine’s pink dress pretty as it is, looks straight out of the 1570s... why?

Montage and After:

You guys are right, there is this weird longing between Henry and Wolsey lmao. It is actually insane.

So basically Catherine is officially depressed

OOOFF we have Stafford as regent instead of Catherine. (edit: I suppose it’s cause they go to France which they didn’t historically? Also if Stafford is at home then what is his son later doing in France, why would he be there without his father. This show didn’t think this through)

Meg Singing:

An impassionate speech is not too anachronistic. But despite the title of this post (what hasn’t been said) I will reiterate that 16th century and Medieval people’s problem wasn’t that they were ashamed of their grief and didn’t cry. In fact, crying was somewhat more socially acceptable then than it even is now! Even manly men like Arthur were written as crying in literature such as Malory’s Morte d’Arthur. Obviously you couldn’t go overboard, but in truth crying was indeed often too performative rather than hidden too much behind doors.

Pole and More UWUWU in France and after:

I LIKE THIS INTELLECTUAL FLIRTING

It’s nice to see a depiction of romantic feelings between mature and level-headed subjects.

God Mary Tudor is so beautiful in this scene jesus. and the music when she was being presented was also very beautiful.

Maggie Pole getting given ‘a modest income’ yeah... she was one of the wealthiest peers of her day.

Also Maggie’s lady cousin not lady aunt Frost!

‘shaking of the sheets’ lmaoooo

William Compton cracks the hell out of me. I love this guy. He is just so creepy and twisted yet super keen and friendly. ahaha He looks like a riot, I hope we see him more. lmao tiles.

Also this palace feels very anachronistic almost 18th century-ish.

I like the Louis and Mary sequence, it’s nice seeing him trying to make her feel less scared, but OMFG when he lay on that chair.. for one second I thought they were trying to kill him off already.

Scotland: ‘Love is an open doooooorrrrr’ + Last Scene:

I ship Meg and Douglas ahhhh this soft boi x strong woman match is everything Henry and Catherine could have been.

I wonder... why is Lina speaking in Spanish more than Catherine. hmmm Are they trying to foreshadow Lina’s eventual return home and how Catherine become a true englishwoman?

Conclusion:

7.5/10

I cannot in all fairness believe it. This was actually decent. I’ve given up on historical accuracy long ago so by this point I’m focusing more on how it stands as as drama. I mean, TWQ was also a flop when it came to grasping the complex issues of that era but why do I feel compelled to rewatch it every year? Because it had atmosphere when it came to acting, music, certain aesthetics (though the costumes let me down often). It felt adequately gothic and dark, yet bright and jewel-lish when it had to be, sometimes both at the same time. Some one-liners were also memorable etc...

So far TSP 2 did not have any of this. Everything felt way too off and anachronistic. But not even consistently anachronistic. The music was also often very meh (though I just noted the absence of the spanish stringy theme that kept playing in season 1 - I guess I understand why), the dialogue very clichéd (‘alright lads let’s throw in the words: king, crown, power, fight, battle + other buzzwords and we have ourselves Shakespeare’) and so on... but I saw a change in this episode and I couldn’t initially point out what it was.

Upon rewatch, I identified some of the improvements (noted above) but above all: The producer was different! Boy does it show. Unfortunately, I think she is only for this one episode which really sucks. Come back! There is more chemistry between the couples, less predictable interactions, pervy Compton, cinnamonroll Douglas, better music, more scenic shots (e.g Douglas and Margaret in church) e.t.c. I hope it will match the rest of the STARZ productions in getting better towards the end.

Look it’s no masterpiece. But I’ll give credit where it’s due because at least this time it didn’t leave me feeling wanting and unsatisfied (if that makes sense).

#the spanish princess #the spanish princess 2 #lady plantagenet's series reviews #catherine of aragon #henry viii #mary tudor queen of france #margaret tudor #charles brandon #margaret pole

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eldritchsurveys · 4 years

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954.

5k Survey LII

2651. Do you think that most people have the qualities you look for in friends/intimate relationships or do you feel alienated? >> I don’t know. I always feel alienated, but it’s difficult to pinpoint exact reasons for that. Most of the time I default to assuming that it’s me that doesn’t have the qualities required for friendships. 2652. Are you very critical: of others? of yourself? >> I can be exceedingly critical of myself; less so of others, but I can be critical of them too. I’d prefer not to be critical of anyone, but the nature of my inner monologue isn’t exactly under my control all the time. 2653. Is there such a thing as expecting too much? >> I’d imagine so. 2654. Would you rather take an hour lunch break or skip lunch and get out of work early? >> --- 2655. Do you believe that happiness is equal to fakeness? shallowness?joy? something good that happens? an attitude you have inside no matter what happens? >> It’s weird to me that happiness is the only emotion that people seem to have all these varying ideas about. I don’t think it’s any more remarkable or interesting than any other emotion, but this is the one that gets all the attention. I think it’s also because happiness got conflated with all these other lofty ideas like “inner peace” and “equanimity”, which doesn’t really make any sense to me.

2656. Can you control your emotions? have you ever tried? >> Of course I can’t control my emotions; my nervous system is responsible for my emotional response to things. My actions in response to and my thoughts about my emotions are much more conscious functions, so that’s what I focus on learning to control. 2657. Imagine you are 34 weeks pregnant. You are healthy and you didn't have any major problems in your pregnancy. Would you consider flying from the UK to Germany, which takes one hour, whithout a bad feeling that something could go wrong or the baby decides to come out earlier? >> You lost me at “imagine you are pregnant”. 2658. How long do you think it would take you to jog a mile? >> A long time, because I’d actually spend most of it walking. Fuck jogging. 2659. Word assciation: twilight: Vampires. >:3 garden: of Eden. warm: Sun. stars: Moon. crash: 1996 movie directed by David Cronenberg that I’m lowkey obsessed with. mold: Cheese. gold: Favourite colour. green: Meadow. lush: That soap store that smells way too strongly even from 10 feet away from the entrance. 2660. Picture a triangle: Quick! What color is it? Picture a square. Quick! What color is it? Picture a circle. Quick! What color is it? Why do you think you saw these shapes as these colors? >> *stares blankly* 2661. What things are endless? >> I don’t know what things are endless. I don’t think we can truly measure that, although we can come up with some fairly logical theories. 2662. Are you ever subtle? >> I mean, I guess. 2663. Because we don't know when we will die, we get to think of life as an inexhaustible well. Yet everything happens a certain number of times, and a very small number, really. How many more times will you remember a certain afternoon of your childhood...some afternoon that's so deeply a part of your being that you can't conceive of your life without it? How many more times will you watch the full moon rise? How can you fully appreciate these moments, every moment, when it all seems limitless? ~Paul Bowles, except from The Sheltering Sky >> I imagine that’s not a question I’m supposed to have a ready answer to. It’s just something to think about, I guess. 2664. Do you never have an ordinary day? >> Most of my days are ordinary. For me, that is. 2665. Do you embrace every single thing you've never known? >> I don’t know what this means. 2666. Has anyone ever mistaken you for a satanist? >> Probably. It’s easy for people to see someone in all black and a metal band t-shirt and automatically assume a great number of things about them. 2667. Can stress sometimes be good? >> Yep. 2668. Write something random, just whatever flows out of your head without thinking. Forget punctuation just try to type as fast as you think: >> No. 2669. Are you a musical snob? How about a film snob? >> I’m not a snob, period. 2670. When you were in school did you learn to think or repeat? >> Meh. 2671. Do you have everything you need to be happy? If not, what is missing? >> All I need to be happy is a nervous system and brain that can create and process an emotional response that I can then interpret as “happiness”. 2672. Would you take a very casualy dropped 'maybe I should just kill myself' as a warning ssign? >> You know, it’s pretty hard to say, these days. Casual suicide jokes have become a bit more commonplace than they were in previous generations. I’ve said “I’m going to jump off the balcony” in response to just... being slightly overwhelmed by noise. Although I should probably stop saying shit like that, to be fair. There’s got to be less dramatic and potentially disturbing ways to express myself. 2673. What does the word 'ironic' mean? Can you give an exaple of an ironic situation? >> May I introduce you to a website called dictionary.com-- 2674. What did you see today that was beautiful in an ordinary way? >> I don’t know. 2675. Have you ever been on the edge of the night? >> I don’t know what that means, so I can’t say. 2676. Do you feel oppressed in some way? >> Not, like, at this moment. 2677. Who do you think shot JFK? Who do you think shot Martin Luthar King? Why do you think they got shot? >> I assume the people that were named as the killers are the killers, because I have no real reason to assume otherwise. I think they got shot because they stood for something that the shooters didn’t, and the shooters decided to take drastic measures to prevent the social change they felt threatened by. 2679. Are you aware that although only about 14 percent of the american total population is black, that about 70 percent of the people in jail in america are black? Why do you think that is? What conclusion can you draw based on this? >> Yes, I’m aware of that. As a Black person, it’s hard to avoid learning that fact at some point. As far as why I think that is, I know why it is. The conclusion that I draw is that racial profiling is a thing and our communities have always been targets for systemic oppression by some form or another. 2678. Do you think that the culture you live in is completely open to all ideas and forms of expression? >> The country I live in is definitely not completely open to all ideas and forms of expression, and that manifests itself in a variety of ways. 2680. What do you think of the character (muppet) on sesame street that has aids and should this kind of a theme be explored in children's television? >> Of course that theme should be explored in children’s television. 2681. Are you dyslexic? >> No. 2682, Can you construct a bong out of: household objects? an apple? your cat? >> I’ve participated in some stoner engineering in my time, lol. Don’t know about the cat, though. 2683. Starwars, star trek or star gate? >> Stargate! <3 2684. Windows or mac? >> Windows is what I use, for better or worse. 2685. Do you start conversations or wait for other people to start them? >> Either? 2686. How many phallac symbols can you think of? >> I’m sure I could think of a lot of phallic symbols if I put my mind to it, but I’d rather not at this moment. 2687. Would you but tickets to see the top ten american idols sing live? >> No. 2688. A bird may love a fish...but where would they live? >> I don’t see why they have to live together at all. 2689. Are you a hologram or a misfit? >> What? 2690. How are you oriented sexually? Do you agree with the people who say that everyone is bi-sexual even if they don't want to admit it? >> I’m oriented against outworld sex. I don’t agree with the people who say that everyone is bisexual, because that’s one hell of a way to invalidate the experiences of millions of people. 2691. If you are the only human on the planet of the apes do you have sex with an ape? >> --- 2692. If you aare making out with a sex someone and you reach down and find they have a fish tail instead of legs do you still fool around with them? >> *sigh* 2693. Does superman wear kryptonite condoms? >> --- 2694. Do you know exactly where you are? Do you know the meaning of it all? Do you know the distance to the sun? Do you know the echo that is love? >> The longer this survey goes, the more esoteric the questions get... 2694. Do you believe you are: extraordinary? Blessed? Cursed? Won? >> Wait, that last one makes no sense... 2695. What are you doing this weekend? >> I assume the same thing I do most weekends -- go grocery shopping on Saturday, maybe go to the park meetup Saturday afternoon if it’s happening, and do laundry on Sunday. I’m not sure what we’re doing Monday, which is part of the weekend this time because of Labor Day. 2696. Do you believe that black people should get money to make up for their previous enslavement? Do you believe that all oppressed people should get money to make up for their oppression? >> I think reparations are probably a drop-in-the-bucket type of solution; I’d rather see actual change being made in the way this country is run and the way we are treated in society rather than just be given a lump sum of money as some kind of “apology”. That’s such a capitalistic kind of apology, too, lmao. Here’s some money, take it and don’t complain. Meanwhile, we’re still gonna literally gun you all down in the streets with impunity :) 2697. What's a quagmire? >> I’m not Google. 2698. Is philosophy a science or can everyone have their own philosophy? >> Er, philosophy isn’t a science, period. Go ahead and try to apply the scientific method to a work of philosophy. 2699. Are you a big fish in a small pond? >> I’m not a fish. 2700. Would you like to read an entire novel written in stream of consiousness form? >> Probably not.

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