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[toyahinterviews]

BBC THREE COUNTIES RADIO WITH BABS MICHEL 24.6.2023

BABS: Have you thought about going to see Milton Keynes International Festival? If you haven't, I'm going to give you the best reason that you need to go. I have to be still, my 11 year old self, because the first time I saw this absolute queen on Top Of The Pops it just blew my mind. She was singing “It’s A Mystery”. It was 1981, I think,  it was miss Toyah Willcox! Welcome to the show, Toyah! TOYAH: Thank you so much. It was 1981. I remember it well, I think it was March or February     BABS: When I was watching the television, but just couldn't get over your whole look, your image, your voice, the power in it. It was like nothing else and it was just liberating for a little 10 year old girl watching. "I want to be her. If I can be anything can I be her, please?" What was it like for you? TOYAH: It was fabulous for me. Going back to 1981 it was unheard of for a female to have brightly coloured hair. It was unheard of to have that absolutely independent image. So when I appeared on the scene on Tops Of The Pops, it had an a groundbreaking effect. Overnight I suddenly was the biggest name in Europe. I just didn't expect it. It changed my life forever   That one appearance on Top Of The Pops meant I couldn't pop down to the newsagents anymore. When I was being driven down High Streets doing radio tours, every window on the High Streets all over the UK had a poster of me, which was extraordinary BABS: Oh, my goodness. I mean the fact that you have sustained for all of this time, Toyah, being at the top of your game. If people don't realise I want to just play them a little bit of the Isle of Wight Festival last weekend. Just have a listen to this at home Plays of clip of Toyah and Robert performing “Rebel Yell” 18.6.2023. Watch it HERE

BABS: Oh, miss Toyah! You have them in the palm of your hand! (Toyah laughs) I watched it and I was just like oh, my God! How is she still so brilliant at this?! 

TOYAH: (laughs) I just loved the Isle of Wight. It was extraordinary. It was really one of the highlights of the year but we're going to have a highlight at Milton Keynes on the 28th of July. We're going to make sure in that beautiful The Stables Spiegeltent that we deliver exactly the same performance for that audience BABS: I think if people haven't seen you, they've got to come. It's very reasonably priced, £38 mark, which for festivals really good value, especially because you're going to be there. And I've got to ask is Robert playing as well, your husband? TOYAH: This is a "Toyah and Robert Show" BABS: Aaah! OK. If people have not seen you and Robert doing “Sunday Lunch” ... it's the best thing ever. Can I say my boyfriend particularly likes you in the gold leaf thing (below) (they both laugh) That was one of his highlights. I want to know how hard that was to do? Toyah  has basically covered her top part in just gold leaf. How it's staying on ... I don't even know! TOYAH: I'm very good with gold leaf. I do a lot of crafting and I do quite a bit of artwork where I use gold leaf so it's not that hard to keep on. A bit of olive oil and gold leaf does the trick (they both laugh) BABS: Some of the comments on your “Sunday Lunch” channel are just the best. Some of the men comment on there how lucky they think Robert is … They're amazing those comments and you look amazing! Absolutely amazing! TOYAH: You're very kind. I turned 65 this year BABS: No! TOYAH: I’m just starting to feel ... hmm ... it’s showing now BABS: (laughs) What?! TOYAH: I made the most of lockdown and did these really wacky films while I could (laughs) “Sunday Lunch” has really taken off globally. It’s huge and it's had on YouTube alone over 77 million hits. I think totaling up with Facebook and Tik Tok it goes up to 111 million. It's a very large identity now. We've always presented fun. The idea is that every year is the best year of your life   Robert and I, as a team, really want to do is say that life is a journey and it's a very positive journey. Every year we have is an honour and we try to make it the best year of our lives. My husband is 77, we've both got aches and pains, but we're loving what we do. We love music and we just don't see why we should be any different to who and what we were in the punk movement (they both laugh)  

BABS: That's what I love about it. It's so unapologetically fabulous. It's in your face. It's sexy. It's funny. Just the two of you together. Here's the most brilliant straight man to you, isn’t he? TOYAH: He's stunning. He's a very clever straight man because he steals the scene every time. His little face when I get up to things (Babs is cracking up laughing) I think he's one of the cutest human beings in the world   Sometimes he's just looking at me disapprovingly, which just makes him even more lovable. Other times he's afraid or he's laughing his head off. He just cannot stop being the cutest man in the world 

BABS: Oh, this makes me so happy! You're saying you're giving it the bird (the middle finger) to what people think you should be like, at whatever age. You're saying actually, no, this is who we are. We're going to do this for as long as we can and we do not care. And the numbers don't lie, do they? Because you've really connected with people TOYAH: I think a lot of people just wanted to see this. I know so many people of my age personally. We don't feel our age and we're not ready to just stop because of our age. So we're challenging the perception of age   If anyone doesn't know who my husband Robert Fripp is he was the guitarist on David Bowie's “Heroes”. He's worked with Brian Eno. He's one of the world's top guitarists. He's produced Peter Gabriel. He worked with Blondie, Talking Heads. He's just worked with everyone in the world and is hugely respected   What we're doing on the "Toyah and Robert Show" is bringing classic, timeless rock into the auditorium. The whole idea is that this is classic rock - the way Beethoven, Mozart, Chekhov did. They're all classics, they don't age, they remain in their space eternally. Tthis is what this show is about BABS: There's a little bit of noise about what is this show going be like? Fripp and Willcox. It’s going to have a kind of meatiness about it. When I watched you on the Isle of Wight clip I just went yeah, 100% I'm going to Milton Keynes to watch that! Absolutely! TOYAH: (laughs) It's a rock show. We call it a "Rock Party". The whole idea is we really want people to feel free to dance, to join in or just listen. We want the audience to identify with the energy and the music that we're presenting. I's a large band. It's three guitarists, including Robert and each guitarist is a world class guitarist so it is a rock show BABS: Wow! What's not to love? You've got all of that and then you've got you. What other songs are you going to be covering? You’re going to obviously do some of your own songs?   

TOYAH: Yes. We can obviously cherry-pick because there is 50 years of brilliant rock and roll out there. We take people on a journey. We start with quite light-hearted songs like “Thunder In The Mountains”, which is a Toyah song. We do “Echo Beach”, which I put back in the charts in 1985 at n:o 21. We do Blondie, but we also do Black Sabbath and Metallica, Led Zeppelin, Marc Almond   So we really mix it up. What we've found is the way we placed the songs - the audience go crazy because we go from “It's A Mystery” into Black Sabbath. It's the most beautiful juxtaposition. It works and the audience just get it   BABS: I think it's going to be an amazing show. I must ask, just in general, when you're not doing all of this and you're not doing “Sunday Lunch”- are you still acting and presenting and just in other stuff? Because you're great at that too TOYAH: It's been very busy. Ironically, literally two months before the beginning of lockdown I had three movies coming out, which then came out during lockdown. I won best supporting actress for “The Ghost Of Borley Rectory”   In “Give Them Wings” I got the Richard Harris Award for Best Supporting Actress. So it's been very busy. And yes, both Robert and I are presenting. We're in the very beginning of pre-production of our own TV series

BABS: Brilliant! Will it be based on “Sunday Lunch” and will the gold be making an appearance? (laughs) TOYAH: No, it's all about music and the UK BABS: Oh, OK. Is that coming out later in the year, hopefully? TOYAH: Oh, gosh no, it won’t be made in time. This is for next year BABS: OK. It's just been an absolute joy to speak to you. I love “Sunday Lunch”. I've loved you since I was 10 years old TOYAH: Awww BABS: And now the fact that you're going to be on my doorstep next month is just brilliant. I can not wait, Toyah! Thank you so much for your time TOYAH: Thank you and have a wonderful few weeks in between then and now BABS: Thank you, Toyah! TOYAH: Bye!

LISTEN to the interview HERE

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[toyahinterviews]

TOYAH AND ROBERT ON BBC BREAKFAST WITH SALLY NUGENT AND JON KAY 21.6.2023

JON KAY: At exactly eight o'clock the gates will open at Glastonbury for the first campers to go in. It's looking dry and sunny for most of the weekend, and that is good news for everyone who's pitching a tent SALLY NUGENT: But maybe disappointing for people who like to go and enjoy the mud ... Some people who are definitely going to be there ... The singer Toyah Willcox and her guitarist husband Robert Fripp, who will be performing together on Sunday. They're here with us now, before you face the mud and the tents. Good morning! TOYAH: Good morning! ROBERT: Hi! TOYAH: This is the first time either of us have played Glastonbury.  So excited JON: I'm not sure the dress code is going to work (they all laugh) TOYAH: We always dress like this. Even with our show, the Toyah and Robert Rock Party SALLY: We love it! TOYAH: We’re  pretty dressed up. So it's going to be quite an experience JON: Well, that's brilliant, isn't it? You got to be who you are. That's what Glastonbury is all about TOYAH: I will be in six inch heels. Thigh boots, head to toe in glitter. And if we've got to go through the mud, we've got to go through the mud SALLY: I love that. Isn't it brilliant that you haven't played Glastonbury before and now here you are with all these years of experience. You can bring that to the stage      

TOYAH: I think we have over 100 years of experience between us (To Robert) You don't mind me saying you're 77?

ROBERT: Not at all!

TOYAH: I'm 65 so it's about time we play Glastonbury and we're really proud about it. We've done huge festivals around the world. My husband opened for the Rolling Stones at Hyde Park  -

ROBERT: In July 1969

TOYAH: I've done massive festivals across Europe and in the UK, but never Glastonbury

JON: I can feel the excitement. Robert, what is it about Glastonbury that is so exciting for you?

ROBERT: Well, I realised after the Isle Of Wight Festival on Sunday, which was a blast -

TOYAH: It was amazing

ROBERT: - that I was probably the only person on the site that actually played festivals in the 60s. I was probably the oldest person on the site anyway. In 1967, when I turned professional, we all knew that music could change the world. The the free festivals were a primary vehicle for - today you might say - social transformation    

The point is, by getting together with music, a lot of people in these events had such a power. We knew the world could spin backwards and the future you could reach back and grab us

TOYAH:

Everyone you've been talking to, who are waiting at the gates - they want joy, they want music, they want to make friends. And what's so special about Glastonbury it's a groundbreaking festival. Its future forward looking to the whole ecology arguments and how we can change the world. It's a great success. Glastonbury speaks for itself

SALLY: Isn't that interesting? I love what you said there, Robert. It's like the future coming back and picking you up. Showing you forwards

ROBERT: Yes!

SALLY: You have vast experience of festivals. How have you seen them change?

ROBERT: To begin with they were all free. Primarily run by volunteers, including the Hells Angels. Today, the spirit is there but the organisation is much more professional. And if you're getting several tonnes of equipment on the stage, and turning up to an event with hundreds of thousands of people it's very good that the organisation is professional

TOYAH: Isle Of Wight (below) was just unbelievable. It was fabulous! E veryone talks about the toilets at festivals -

SALLY: Yes, we have already mentioned them ourselves this morning, haven’t we, Jon? TOYAH: The people who organise them mostly volunteers. They're absolutely fabulous. The actual audience themselves are a joy to be in front of. So this is a privilege for us  

JON: That word joy. You've used the word joy a lot and how we all have this need for joy, especially after the last few years. You spread so much joy during the pandemic with your videos, your social media TOYAH: "Robert and Robert's Sunday Lunch", which were touring in October. Coming back to Manchester, to the Lowry. We realised during lockdown that classic rock changes people's lives and it gives people the chance to visit really good memories. For me it would be David Bowie “Life On Mars, which I first heard when I was 12. Every time I hear that song I'm taken back there   And very much the concept of what we are doing, as a very large band, is taking people back to classic rock but also introducing new generations, who have just come from the dance tent, to Led Zeppelin. We're introducing them to Black Sabbath. We're even introducing them to classic Blondie and Robert has work with Debbie Harry and Blondie. So that's the whole concept of what we're doing SALLY: What's quite interesting now for teenagers and young people, they are more aware of classic music because of the new forms of social media like Tik Tok. All the older stuff is coming through again, isn't it? TOYAH: It is and (there's) another beautiful thing about festivals. We played one on Friday, where I was watching a father with his son on his shoulders. The years between them seemed enormous. But at that moment in time, as this father held his little boy on his shoulders, you can see that in 20 years time they will talk about that moment. The bonding, it's so special JON: We heard from Boney M on Monday how their music is reaching a new generation of fans through Tik Tok TOYAH: We easily look out at five year olds and 85 year old audience, all having a good time JON: Looking at the crowds go through the gates at Glastonbury this morning it was really striking that the age range was enormous TOYAH: And let's face it, we should live every year of our lives as if it's the best year of our lives. Age should not be something that we judge. As you say the gates that Glastonbury shows that's really true SALLY: Couldn't agree more. I think the pair of you are the living breathing example of that, aren't you? It just doesn't matter, does it? TOYAH: No, we're still pretty anarchic (Jon laughs) SALLY: Is it your attitude or is it the music? Is it the performance? What is it? TOYAH: It’s the music ROBERT: It's my wife's energy. There is something about her classic repertoire. It’s s not old. It's alive, it’s in the moment. It’s immediate.  Nothing ages with the classic repertoire JON: Not going there camping there though, are you? TOYAH: No! (they all laughs) JON: You weren’t temped? ROBERT: No TOYAH: Never done it! JON: Never camped?! TOYAH: No, we drive overnight to avoid being in the tent  (Jon laughs) SALLY: I love that! JON: (whispers) There are a few caravans out the back as well TOYAH: Thank goodness! JON: Lovely to meet you! Thank you so much for coming in and enjoy it! You’re going to! TOYAH: We will SALLY: What a moment! TOYAH: Yeah! WATCH the interview HERE

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[toyahinterviews]

TOYAH AND ROBERT ON BBC RADIO MANCHESTER WITH MIKE SWEENEY 31.5.2023

MIKE: Toyah Willcox and Robert Fripp, one show business' most recognisable couples. They've had some massive hit records. Toyah on her own and Robert Fripp as a member of King Crimson. During lockdown their brilliant "Sunday Lunch" YouTube videos were incredible   They got such a reaction to those videos that they're coming to The Lowry (in Salford, 9.10.2023) to celebrate both of their careers. To find out more, I sat down with Toyah and Robert earlier this week TOYAH: Well, when the dreaded lockdown started we just didn't know what was going on - like everyone else. We're live musicians and performing is our oxygen. Our audience is quite simply our family. We put this jive video out on a sunday lunch (time), about the 9th of April and we got 100,000 replies within five minutes from around the world. New Zealand, Bali, Manila, Hong Kong. It was all from people who were alone We decided that we would just continue posting these "Sunday Lunch" videos, which was very absurd. We don't take ourselves seriously. It grew and grew and grew. We had 111 million visitors to Toyah YouTube channel. And we now feel we want to take this out into a live environment, touring. Myself and Robert Fripp and we just want to share the love now MIKE: Robert, I think we're a similar age. I started in bands in the 60s and you've come through that with King Crimson and then onwards through these decades. We're here now, it's 2023. When you look at your start in rock and roll and where you are now - it just fascinates me what a journey that's been. How do you view it? ROBERT: Well, I view myself strapping on and rocking these rock classics with my wonderful little wife. Very much like the last time I strapped on and rocked out with the League Of Gentlemen in 1965. In between I seem to have been sidetracked into writing music and playing with good musicians this strange material, which has been accepted by some but rejected by most people in the mainstream     So I might as well go back to what I began doing, which is playing great rock songs with my chums. In this case, my bestest is chum in the world, little Willcox TOYAH: I'd like to abbreviate that answer, if I may (Robert and Mike snigger) My husband has ended up working with David Bowie. One of the main guitarists on “Scary Monsters”, on “Heroes”. He's worked with Blondie. He's actually worked with them all and they're all legendary musicians ROBERT: Yeah, but none of them played “Enter Sandman” or “Paranoid” (Toyah laughs) Or “I Want To Be Free”. I mean c’mon!      

MIKE: You will have different musical directions. How do you decide - so it’s a proper team effort - what the actual songs are going to be?

TOYAH: They have to suit who we are. Without a shadow of a doubt we've got to do these versions absolutely brilliantly. We are doing “Enter Sandman” and we are doing “Paranoid” and they have to be Toyah and Robert doing them. So we sit down and I usually start off with a list of songs that I love. I love classic rock. Then Robert listens to it. He says “I  really love that!” And we both develop a passion for the same song and then we work out how we're going to do it. So the tour that we're doing, the Toyah and Robert "Rock Party/Sunday Lunch" tour is a celebration of how incredible heritage rock is and it is breathtaking. We're going to be covering people from David Bowie, because of Robert’s history with David Bowie ...      We're doing my hits as well. But we're also dipping our toes in with Marc Almond “Tainted Love”, Blondie. Many, many other artists that were playing the songs of ROBERT: Metallica's “Enter Sandman” is not one that I would normally expect me to play but this popped up on the "Sunday Lunch", which is actually our highest ever viewing figures. The riffs in the in Metallica are phenomenal so rock out with that MIKE: How are you preparing for that transition from being on YouTube as a couple to being on stage as a couple? TOYAH: Well, we've done five secret gigs already and three of them had to call in extra security. It turned into an absolute riot. The audience got very, very excited. It is a transition. So we're very much going out there with a large band. It's a show band. It's got eight musicians - ROBERT: Yeah, we have two keyboard players, who sing and a wonderful electronic drummer. Two guitarists - TOYAH: Three guitarists - ROBERT: Well, that's when you add me. And if everyone sings and it's been suggested by me that I don't join in the backing vocals on this one - there can be seven people singing and me cheering them on TOYAH: So what we've developed is a very big rock show, which honours - totally by accident - 50% of the songwriters are American, 50% of English. So it's a complete celebration of this kind of heritage rock and we're calling it a "Rock Party". It is absolutely inevitable that Robert's and my humour is going to come on to that stage, but the humour isn't the carrying force. The carrying force is the shared love of music So when we're on the road in October, we're going to use the imagery of "Sunday Lunch" as part of the projection screen production so that the posters are going to keep flashing up. What we've learned is that the posters are what people identify with     Now, if anyone's listening ,who's never seen what we do on social media - there's always a very big colourful poster in the background saying something like "Fripp's Ma Bitch" or "Bollocks". These posters are going to be up on the big screen as we're performing so we're bringing in the visuals of "Sunday Lunch" via media while doing an incredibly live rock show ROBERT: So the question is how to honour the spirit of "Sunday Lunch"? Well, the quick answer is we're going to have fun and we're going to rock out with nothing solemn here whatsoever. We are aiming to give people a good time    

MIKE: Final question to the two of you. I get where you're at, Robert. My wife's my best mate, I adore the woman but she's not in the music business. I often wonder how we’d get on if she was a really successful broadcaster, which is what I do now         You two - you've got to have egos to get to where you are. You really care for one another. That always came over, funnily enough, in the kitchen videos - your affection for one another. But how do you balance that? Robert wants this or Toyah wants this TOYAH: (they both laugh) We typically fight! ROBERT: That's an easy one, Mike. You learn to say “yes, dear” MIKE: Well, there we are. Can I just say it's wonderful talking to the two of you. I remember getting an Island (record company) sampler. I think it might’ve been “You Can All Join In”   - ROBERT: (It was) “Nice Enough To Eat” MIKE: It had “Court Of The Crimson King” on - ROBERT: No, it has “Schizoid Man ” - MIKE: It did! (Toyah cackles) That's when I first discovered you. And then Toyah I've met because of radio various times since the middle of the 80s. It's brilliant talking to the two of you. A great rock and roll city, when you come to Manchester. I hope you realise that TOYAH: We do. Respect   MIKE: You take care, both of you. Robert, thanks for being with us. Toyah, thanks for being with us TOYAH: Pleasure. Thank you, Mike ROBERT: Bless you, Mike Listen to the interview HERE

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[toyahinterviews]

TOYAH ON GET SET FOR SUMMER, BBC1 WITH PETER POWELL, JULY 1982

PETER: Toyah, come and join us down here if you can TOYAH: Hello! I like your microphone! PETER: Do you want to hold this? Just sit down here. Take a seat. Folks, it’s “Pop A Question”. Thank you for the 1000s of cards on Toyah’s behalf that came in to this part of the programme. And it's when we put you under the thumb TOYAH: Put to the test PETER: Yes, we got to find out all about you TOYAH: Oh no! (Peter laughs) PETER: Steven has written in from Norfolk TOYAH: (the kids next to her are restless) Be quiet there! PETER: You keep them in order (Toyah laughs) Steven says “Dear Toyah, I'd like to know where you get all your energy from?” Here she is huffing and puffing! (Toyah pretends to collapse, the audience laughs) and “how do you keep yourself so fit?” 

TOYAH: It takes takes a lot of sort of determination to get up very early or go out very late at night and do lots of running PETER: You go to a gym, don't you? TOYAH: Oh, yeah, I do lots of gymnastics. I'm sort of like  very supple PETER: And every time you do a tour you go and have a workout for three weeks to get yourself  - TOYAH: Oh, yeah. Really have to PETER: Good for you. It's important we want to keep fit I think. Robert from London wrote “my question to Toyah is, which is more important to you - acting or singing careers? Or are they both equally important?" Thank you for the question TOYAH: (Puts on a phoney 50’s American accent) Well sincerely folks, they're both very important. I mean, they really are important to me. I love doing both of them. I only believe you should do what you love doing. You shouldn't be forced into doing something you don't want to do 

PETER: Alison here (points to girl next to him) has a question for you, don’t you? Let’s take the mike over here ALISON: What was it like making “The Blue Marigold”? (above) TOYAH: I made it well over a year ago, and actually made it when “It’s A Mystery” first hit the charts. So I was very sort of happy and very up but it was a challenge because I had to age considerably. I sort of had to like - don’t laugh at me (laughs) wear these great big wigs, which is always a challenge to wear a wig sometimes because it feels like a hat PETER: (Touches Toyah’s hair) This is real, isn't it? TOYAH: This is, yeah! People think this is a wig. I know it looks like one PETER: Another question here I'd like to ask. This is Alison from Somersert. “I would like to ask Toyah if she wore outrageous clothes and had funny hair do’s when she was at school?” A lot of people wrote in about this question 

TOYAH: Well, I don't want to get into trouble but basically yes. I started cutting my hair before I started wearing sort of weird clothing. I mean, teachers don't like it. I don’t think they ever will. But I think it's always very nice if you can sort of look normal for school and then come home from school and you can actually actually buy sprays to colour your hair that can wash off. And I advise kids to do that more than anything, but I was pretty outrageous at school PETER: Your look is very hyper important to your image, isn't it? 

TOYAH: It's not done totally for image. It's done because that's actually how I like to look PETER: Can we do a close-up on Toyah’s eyes? They’ve changed haven’t they? Why did they change? TOYAH: Well, the new album is called “The Changeling” and the changeling means when the elfin folk snatch a human being away from society and put a fairy there. Now, I'm not saying I'm a fairy (the audience laughs) I thought the only way to sort of portray that word is to have black eyes (pretends to hit herself) Bang! PETER: Another question from Callum in Glasgow. “What inspires most of your songs, Toyah?” TOYAH: Well, (with) the new album it's been mainly dreams. I have terrible nightmares and what I do is I wake up and I write everything down. And also I've been abroad a lot in the last year. I wrote a lot of songs while I was in Hamburg and places like that, which are very inspiring PETER: That's good. Toyah, thanks for answering the questions TOYAH: Pleasure

PETER: Do you want the rest of the cards that were sent to us? TOYAH: Yeah! PETER: You can look at them and find out what people really want to know about you TOYAH: Yes, thank you!   Watch the interview here HERE  

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[toyahinterviews]

TOYAH ON HARTY BBC1 8.3.1983

TOYAH: (accidentally knocks off Russell’s notes of the table when she sits down) Sorry! (laughs) RUSSELL HARTY: That’s the notes down then. Not only are the audience carried away - my notes are carried away as well TOYAH: Sorry about that RUSSELL: You’ve had to train very hard in this play called “Trafford Tanzi”? (below, Toyah as Tanzi) TOYAH: We only had two weeks of rehearsing. So that gave us natural adrenaline to get the show ready for the public in time - RUSSELL: But I mean physically you had to train quite hard? TOYAH: Yes, I did a lot of judo.  A lot of traditional wrestling, a lot of weightlifting (shows her biceps, laughs) Which I'm stuck with now RUSSELL: For the rest of your life (A clip of “Trafford Tanzi” plays) There you are wrestling with - TOYAH: Ah! Neil McCaul. He played my husband. He was wonderful! I mean he could fight with his mouth whereas I fought with my fists 

RUSSELL:  Was this (Toyah’s pulling and throwing Neil) your husband until the end of the show? TOYAH: No, not at all- RUSSELL: But the way you’re behaving I’m not all surprised at all  TOYAH: But he was brilliant - 

RUSSELL: It's a story of what? A battered baby? TOYAH: It's about a battered baby brought up in the north with the traditions of being a woman. The fact that women are taught to take the step behind and not want to work, only want to get married and have babies. Within the play Tanzi gets married to a husband that's unfaithful to her    So to prove herself, her pride and everything, she takes up wrestling and in a heated argument with her husband says “right, I'll take you on!”. And she takes him on. It's a 20 minute fight and she ends up KO’ing him (knocking him out) RUSSELL: You’ve now landed with these rock hard things for the rest of your life (touches Toyah’s arm) If you let them go they’ll … (the audience and Toyah laugh) ... the flab will fall down and you'll have very big fat hands won’t you? TOYAH: Well, I found what’s very healthy is I do 50 press ups a morning and if I've still got it in me I’ll do 60 before I go to bed RUSSELL: Were you ever fat? TOYAH: Very! When I was a kid I was incredibly fat RUSSELL: What did you look like? Describe yourself TOYAH: I looked like an ape (the audience laughs) RUSSELL: Did you? TOYAH: A real ape. I had very long black hair that was very, very bushy. I looked like a cavewoman. And (puts on a lisp) I talked like this, I had an exceptionally bad lisp and I walked with a wobble and I was like everybody's failure. So I had a lot to fight at RUSSELL: (talks with a lisp) I think your lisp came in quite useful (the audience laughs) through a programme called “Kick Up The 80s”. Did you see that? TOYAH: I deliberately avoided it because I like Tracey Ullman. I thought if I saw it I’ll kill her! RUSSELL: I hope we have a little piece of this because in that programme there is Tracey Ullman actually imitating your lisp (Toyah laughs)

(A clip of “Kick Up The 80s” plays) RUSSELL: That’s Miriam Margolyes and Tracy Ullman doing Toyah Willcox 

TOYAH: It’s very good actually!

RUSSELL: Are you flattered or annoyed by that? TOYAH: I'm told by my father I should be flattered but in the early days, I just was genuinely insecure about it RUSSELL: And cheesed off a bit? TOYAH: But I'm not that insecure now I don’t think RUSSELL: Is there's a core of steel inside this tough lady? TOYAH: I hope not! RUSSELL: This tough exterior? (the audience laughs) TOYAH: (flirtingly) Not at the moment (giggles) RUSSELL: I mean of resolution and of ambition and the energy? TOYAH: I’m still ambitious. I'll always be ambitious. There’s so many people I want to work with. I'm very lucky with who I've worked with up to now. I've got ambitions to work with people like Spielberg. He might let me be the monster in his next movie RUSSELL: (Makes monster noises) Well, if he doesn't, you can KO him and throw him over. Now, you're going to sing us a song. A song that you've written? TOYAH: Yes, it's our latest single. It's called “The Vow” and I wrote it with my lead guitarist Joel - RUSSELL: What is its subject? TOYAH: Its subject matter is we all know our mistakes, but we never know how to correct them. And love can be so close to the destructiveness and I think within what the world is going through now and 2000 years ago, Jesus was supposed to have come down and told us, you know "get your act together" and we haven't. And “the Vow” is saying I love you I love you, but I could hurt to protect you, which is the contradiction RUSSELL: OK, “The Vow”, Toyah Willcox

Watch the interview  HERE  

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[toyahinterviews]

LIFE AND TIMES WITH VANESSA FELTZ BBC1, 2000

VANESSA (voiceover) : From punk rocker to Shakespearean actress, distinctive sounding singer to religious programmes presenter Toyah Willcox has had a surprisingly varied career. Toyah was born in 1958 into a middle class family in Birmingham and  had a difficult start in life TOYAH: When the midwife delivered me, apparently the first thing my mother said “is everything there?” and the midwife said “yes ... but” because the right side had developed and the left hadn't so it was just overdeveloped. I had longer legs, longer arms. Clawed feet So everything was turning in like that (twists her arms) and a twisted spine, but relatively easy to deal with. I apparently went into plaster for six weeks. That was to set the spine and the legs. And then when all that came off, it hadn't worked. So it started 10 years of physiotherapy which my mother was taught to give me VANESSA: It's quite amazing to hear somebody describe themselves as non-perfect. I think most people don't even have to grapple with the concept of whether they're perfect or not. They just are 

TOYAH: I wasn't aware of it until I went to school and then I became known as Hopalong. Because of the gate how I walked and also because my speech impediment was very, very bad then. I could hardly speak at all. And apparently my tongue used to hang out of my mouth, which was comical. So people were very, very cruel and it was only when I was with other children that I was aware of my imperfections. Otherwise, I was quite happy (laughs) VANESSA: What you are as a little kid, who, as you say, is not quite perfect and of course you were, as I suppose could have only been expected, quite badly bullied at school 

TOYAH: I was badly bullied, but I was an incredible tomboy. I've always loathed being a girl. My fight against gender started very early. So at school I was incredibly boisterous. I was the one who was always breaking bones, always smashing my teeth I can remember, at the age of five, climbing a climbing frame in pouring rain, mud below me and tight rope walking this climbing frame. I came off it, smashed my nose, smashed my teeth and then started to play with the blood. I really was a very weird kid. And I think even though people bullied me they were slightly wary of me VANESSA (voiceover) Even at a tender age Toyah was starting to rebel against society's views of what the future held for her as a woman TOYAH: I was brought up in a time when women had expectations about their future forced upon them. And I loathe every angle of those expectations. Marriage, children. If you're lucky you could be a secretary, or you may go to university and be a doctor, but you would retire and have children and you would settle down and you'd run the house. I'd rather be dead than have any of those things 

VANESSA (voiceover) 1970: Toyah’s mother was taken into hospital with a serious illness TOYAH: It was my 12th birthday. I got out of bed and no one could find her. She she wasn't in the house, which was completely unusual because she always drove me to school - otherwise I wouldn't go. And she always made us breakfast. She’d disappeared. Couldn't find her VANESSA (voiceover) Toyah’s mother feared that she was dying and didn't want the children to see her in such pain TOYAH: I got a phone call at the school. The headmistress called me into the office to tell me that my mother was possibly going to die. She'd been found hiding under my brother's bed where her bladder had burst because of a gallstone. Imagine the pain! So I wasn't allowed to visit her even though I was told that she was dying. And within the month or two months she was away I changed. I changed radically 

By the time my mother got back she was unrecognisable. She'd probably gone down to about six and a half stone. Clothes were just hanging off and I walked in the house and dad came out of the kitchen and said “there's someone here to see you”. And Mum walked out and I really really wanted to hug her and I didn’t and that was the end of our relationship for a long time VANESSA: Have you hugged her since? (Toyah shakes her head) Why not? 

TOYAH: Umm … Not a hugging family. There's big barriers. (Toyah’s visibly upset) But we know we love each other. (Above, Toyah with her dad Beric and brother Kim) VANESSA: So at this point punk arrives on the scene. For you it must have been a gift from heaven because it must have been all you were looking for in some kind of rebellious expression TOYAH: It was fantastic because the first time in the world I realised that wasn't alone. I went to a club, I went to “Bogarts” - this was in Birmingham and I heard that the Sex Pistols were playing. I thought never heard of them but I'll go anyway and I walked into this club and there were 300 people in this club that all looked like me VANESSA: How did you look at the time? TOYAH: I had black hair but I had green and yellow at the front and the back was all yellow. So I was very punky and I was dressing in bustbin liners and I had a little kind of Andy Pandy (a 1950's children's TV series) suit which I dyed black and I was wearing that and up until this point I'd be laughed at in the street, buses wouldn't stop for me and taxes wouldn't take me home

VANESSA: Explain the appeal of something which is so, on the face of it, unattractive and repellent TOYAH: I disagree! VANESSA: Unappealing! TOYAH: I just I thought I looked really beautiful VANESSA: Oh, you thought you looked gorgeous? TOYAH: Yeah, I thought it was the best way I could look. And up until that point I'd always wanted to look different because I felt different. My expression of punk was I wanted to show how I was feeling internally - that I didn't feel part of the norm. I didn't feel part of everyday life. So I wanted to express it. And this gave me a licence to do it and I did it with a vengeance and I felt extraordinarily beautiful What I liked about this was it made the kind of gender statements that I have been desperate to make all the time. And that was I am not a woman. I am not a man. I am a person and it works 

VANESSA: It's around this time in your teens that you become involved with the Old Rep Theatre and do you start thinking "I want to be an actress" yet? Have you sort of always had that thought? TOYAH: I knew I wanted to act and sing the first time I saw "The Sound Of Music" with Julie Andrews running up that hill in that opening sequence. When I started the Birmingham Rep Theatre School I was 14. I started going Friday evenings for my dancing lessons. Saturday morning for drama I knew exactly what I wanted by then and I wouldn't be swayed. Even a visit to the careers officer when I was 15 - I sat down in the office and she said “what do you want to be?” and I said “I'm going to be an actress and I'm going to be a singer.” And she said “yes, of course” and then put some leaflets about nursing in front of me. I just left the room and I said “just remember my name because one day everyone will know it” VANESSA (voiceover) 1975: Toyah left school with one O-level and started full time at drama school and she soon got a job as a dresser to actress Sylvia Syms TOYAH: I loved it.  I'm very good at being subservient in a perverse sort of way. As soon as I walked into Sylvia Sym’s dressing room on the Monday - she was on tour, she arrived at the Alexandra Theatre in Birmingham and I walked in and I said “is there anything I can do for you, Miss Syms?” and she said “oh, I was starving!” So I went off and got her a sandwich and I said “when do you like your cup of tea? And how do you like it?” 

So she always had a cup of tea at the beginning of the show, in the middle of the show and then at the end, and it was absolutely fine because I had the privilege of standing in the wings watching her work, which taught me more than any theatre school could ever teach me. I loved dressing. I dressed Simon Williams, Sylvia Syms, the whole of Dad’s Army, which was a difficult experience because I was madly in love with Ian Lavender, who would not wear clothes when I was in his dressing room. So that was my first experience of lust VANESSA: There must have been something remarkable about you. I mean obviously there is because you were a dresser and suddenly you're kind of discovered. Somebody sees you and realises that you're not just going to be a dresser. You're going to be an actress 

TOYAH: I was paying my way through drama school by dressing and also doing extra work. My very first day’s extra work at Pebble Mill BBC I made £12. And it was on a retro play about a 1950s rock band with Kate Nelligan starring in and all I had to do was sit at the cafe table watching the band. But little did I realise that everyone was watching me. And I was getting all the close ups in the scene even though I didn't have to talk So the next day I get a call at the theatre school from a director who'd heard about me and wanted to meet me. He was called Nick Bicât and he was trying to cast a young girl in a play. The story was this young girl wanted to appear on Top Of The Pops so badly she breaks into the studio. So Nick came to the drama school to see me and that was it. I got the part, a lead in play ("Glitter", above) VANESSA: Just like that TOYAH: Just like that VANESSA: I know the drama school kept saying “no, audition all the others” -

TOYAH: Yeah, they refused to tell Nick who I was. And they refused to let him see me singly because I wasn't the best student. And so Nick came. He knew who I was immediately. He said I just stood out in the crowd and I went down to London and auditioned but he just knew I'd got the part A clip of “Glitter” plays TOYAH: A wonderful irony from this was that when it showed on telly three months later, Kate Nelligan was watching it, not knowing who I was and that I'd been an extra that day in her play. And she said to Maximilian Schell, who was directing at the National Theatre - “that girl has to be in our play” So I was called down to the National Theatre and joined the company. I was the youngest member of the National Theatre Company in 1976 VANESSA (voiceover) Offers of work flowed thick and fast for Toyah. Derek Jarman cast her in the role of “Mad”, a pyromaniac in his punk film “Jubilee”. And in sharp contrast, she worked opposite Katharine Hepburn in the film “The Corn Is Green” 

1979 was the year that Toyah played the part of “Monkey” in the film “Quadrophenia”, and on television the part of “Sal” (in "Quatermass") TOYAH: When I got “Quatermass” I was finishing off “Quadrophenia”, so I was night shooting “Quadrophenia” and day shooting “Quartermass”. So I actually got pneumonia halfway through that. Sir John Mills was in it and I was playing this kind of tribal love child who was wanting to go to another planet in a spaceship

VANESSA (voiceover) Despite her success as an actress what Toyah really wanted was to be famous for her music. She formed a band but the rock and roll lifestyle took its toll on her health TOYAH: I formed the band and I realised that if I wasn't sexually attractive to the audience, I wasn't going to be doing the band any favours VANESSA: Through your teens you did balloon and get quite potch TOYAH: Yeah. When I was 20 I was a good three stone heavier than I am now. Purely I think because I was lonely, therefore rather than doing what normal people do at night I was eating VANESSA: Was it an effort to to lose weight ultimately? TOYAH: I started taking diet pills but I've taken them recreationally. You could buy them in the bags and just you know, pop them away. And it would mean I'd go on average three days without eating, have a meal, three days about eating, have a meal

Why I'm still alive I think is a miracle. Because I was taking about five of these really strong amphetamines a day and not sleeping. Drinking an awful lot of alcohol to try and come down from it. And I went from being about 11 and a half stone - and I'm only five foot tall - to being seven stone I was just a person of extremes and I do have an addictive nature. I like my habits. I like extremes. I like danger. I'm a real adrenaline junkie. So the whole attraction of popping amphetamine and frightening living daylights out of people because I’d do the most stupid things like climb roofs, climb cranes, steal cars. (It was a) really mad time in my life VANESSA (voiceover) 1981 was the year that propelled Toyah to stardom with her first hit “It's A Mystery”. Finally her childhood dream became a reality TOYAH: It was heaven. The day before, just lounging in the bath at midday, and the phone rang and it was the record company saying “you're on Top Of The Pops tomorrow” and I said “how?! Why?!” And they said “It's A Mystery" has gone straight into the Top 40” I was like “nooo!” (pulls a face) because I hated “It’s A Mystery” 

I thought it was the worst song I've ever recorded. And they said “no, it's true.” And when I turned up, at BBC Wood Lane … oh, I was just so excited! I can't tell you how wonderful it was. And in retrospect, it was probably the most boring day of my life. You just sit around in the dressing room all day and then do your song I was bullied about everything … Everyone ridiculed me for saying I wanted to sing. Here ... I had the flag and I was putting it on top of Everest for the first time. It was fantastic! (Below, performing "It's A Mystery" on Top Of The Pops 19.2.1981) 

VANESSA (voiceover) In 1983 things went from strength to strength for Toyah. Her music career was booming and her fame began to escalate TOYAH: “It’s A Mystery” moved me into the league which was commercial success and being an international name. And not being able to drive down any road without seeing posters with my face on in every shop window VANESSA (voiceover) Just when she thought it couldn't get any better she was offered a part alongside Sir Laurence Olivier in a TV drama (Below, "The Ebony Tower", Toyah with co-stars Laurence Olivier, Roger Rees and Greta Scacchi) TOYAH: I wasn't in awe of working with Laurence Olivier because I'd worked with Katharine Hepburn so many years earlier, and I knew what to expect. That generation of actors has an etiquette that you must keep to. You either call them Sir or Madam or Lord Olivier. And with Lord Olivier ... we just sat and talked hour upon hour about when he formed the National Theatre, when he worked with Marilyn Monroe, when he met Joan Plowright, when he married Vivian Lee 

We got on incredibly well and as for working with him, the hardest thing was that he and Katharine Hepburn worked at a different pace. Modern style of acting is much more natural, it's much more quicker, it's much more throwaway. So you had to just bear in mind that you're making those two generations meet. But it was a really fabulous film to work on. We were treated like stars VANESSA (voiceover while a clip from “The Ebony Tower” plays) Toyah had to strip off completely during some of the scenes TOYAH: As I was maturing, I wanted to be a sexier person. So part of me really wanted to do those naked scenes, yet the rest of me was aware that I was kind of kneeling, therefore my breasts weren’t going to be seen from the best point of view and my thighs weren't going to look good So it was worrying and I starved myself two months to do those scenes. But once you're actually doing it and your director has actually kindly stripped off to be naked with you, there is a kind of enjoyment about it 

VANESSA (voiceover) In 1985 at a charity lunch Princess Michael of Kent introduced Toyah to rock guitarist Robert Fripp from the band King Crimson (below with Toyah) TOYAH: He approached me to do a charity album with him. So I moved down to his studio in his house near Bournemouth and worked with him and within a week he proposed! VANESSA: What made you say yes to him so very quickly? TOYAH: He is the most extraordinary human being I've ever known. He's kind, spiritual, super intelligent and does not manipulate you in any way through fear or intellectualism. He straight down the line. He's truthful, to the point of hurting but you can't help but admire someone like that. And I knew as soon as I met him that this was someone that I could take that journey with where you grow, where everything is an event. I thought this will make a really good marriage VANESSA (voiceover) And on “This Is Your Life” Toyah’s husband made his feelings for her extremely clear after hearing “Freedom”, the track they wrote together (Clip of “This Is Your Life” plays: MICHAEL PARKINSON: Robert, that music really did come from the heart ROBERT: (tearfully) I fell in love with my little wife when she sang that and I haven’t fallen out of love with her since)

VANESSA: They look like tears are the most acute love. I've never seen anything like it! (Toyah laughs) He's just sobbing at the sheer vista of you being there, isn’t he? TOYAH: He's extraordinary. He really really loves me. At the same time he’ll go go off on tour for a year and he will phone me up in tears every day telling me how much he loves me. He's an extraordinary pot of juxtapositions. He really loves me, but we see very little of each other 

VANESSA: I was just going to ask you about that because this is a dynamic that fascinates everybody whoever holds fort about the subject of your marriage. Why does he have to be away so much? TOYAH: He’ll never be at home! He'll never do it VANESSA: What's he doing all the time? Why is he always away and why don't you just go with him? And why aren't you together more? What’s it all about? (Toyah laughs) TOYAH: I refuse to be a rock and roll wife. My career has always been my priority. And it's the same with him. We're nomadic, basically. We are both nomadic and the distance between us actually holds us together VANESSA: You don’t want to be separate! You want to be together! TOYAH: You do in the beginning, and I think then children come and children hold that mesh together. But we we didn't have that in the equation of our relationship VANESSA: It's not an accident that there are no children. You took the decision to be sterilised and it's what you wanted to do and yet having done it, you immediately felt, you say, robbed of your femininity 

TOYAH: Yeah. Very, very odd feeling. Knowing I didn't want children, knowing I didn't want to accidentally get pregnant and go through all those decisions of whether you keep it or lose it. And there was another factor - because I don't have a full socket in the hip on the right side that can dislocate. I have to be very, very careful with dislocation So pregnancy would have meant that I'd have to spend the last three months of the pregnancy kind of in a chair or lying down. So I got sterilised. There's no problem in me making that decision, but when I woke up after the sterilisation I thought “what have I done? I've I've actually played with God's decision of who and what I am”. I felt very strange about it. Now I don't at all, but for the first year of being sterilised, I felt weird VANESSA: So no part of you now thinks, oh gosh, I wish I’d just left it to chance or happenstance? 

TOYAH: (Shakes her head) I really am very, very firm in knowing that I don't want children. Obviously now I'm 42 ... I mean, I suppose I could, but I've never had those feelings or that calling never VANESSA (voiceover) In 1991 Toyah started presenting television programmes. (Back at the interview) This is yet another unexpected incarnation. By this time you've been so many people and done so many things. Classical Shakespearian actress, you've been an absolute top selling singer and suddenly you’re a TV presenter.  Did you ever dream of doing something like that? TOYAH: No! Never dreamed of doing Panto either! (Vanessa laughs) What happened was I was in Los Angeles visiting Robert who was working on an album and a phone call came from England. And it was my agent and she said, “Oh, you really don't want to do this. But there's this programme that's asked you to present it” and I said, “well, actually yes, I do!”

Because I'd never done it and I wanted the experience and it was the Midlands version of “01-For London”. It was called “First Night” and I spent a year doing that. It taught me how to present, taught me how to interview. taught me how to write as a journalist, and I haven't looked back since then VANESSA (voiceover) For the next 10 years Toyah went on to present a rich variety of television and radio programmes. (Back at the interview) Nobody can say you're not a grafter, you're extremely hard working and always have been TOYAH: I love my work. I live for my work, and nothing can substitute my work. I'm very, very honest about that and my friends understand that and my husband understands that in a way that he's the same. I only get any sense of calm or satisfaction when I'm working If I'm not working, I'm almost a manic depressive. I'm just not worth knowing. But now I'm slowly moving back towards being a film actress and TV actress with doing “Barmy Aunt Boomerang”, which is a BBC children's programme (Below with Richard Madden) VANESSA: By the way my children say congratulations on your Australian accent - it’s magnificent 

TOYAH: (in a thick Aussie accent) Oh, bless them sweetheart. I think that's just so kind, dear little Sheilas (Back to normal accent) I do “Aunt Boomerang”, which I based on Barry Humphries (who plays "Dame Edna Everage") (they both laugh) I just finished the feature film “Most Fertile Man In Ireland”

VANESSA: Tell me about that TOYAH: I was working in Malaysia, got a phone call - could I do a day's filming in Dublin? So I got the next plane to Dublin. Shot all my scenes in one day and a miniscule role but the pivotal role in the whole story. I play a fertility doctor who cannot have children in Northern Ireland who finds a man that is so fertile he can make sterile women pregnant. It’s a comedy (they both laugh) And there you have it. A day's filming and I'm in, really, one of the best films that will be out next year VANESSA: What do you think the future holds? How would you like it to pan out? TOYAH: How I’d like it is very different probably what it holds. I would still like to sing but it's got to be on my terms. I can't handle huge fame like that ever again. I love my independence. I love being able to walk into a supermarket and browse but I want to be a film actress, a TV actress and I want to sing and I want to write books but I know I will not be sitting at home being idle VANESSA: I have a feeling all those things will happen and more. I would not be surprised if you were suddenly an astronaut. I really wouldn't! (Toyah laughs) Toyah Willcox, thank you very much indeed TOYAH: Thank you 

You can watch the programme HERE

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[toyahinterviews]

PARKINSON, BBC1, OCTOBER 1981

MICHAEL PARKINSON: First, a young woman whose vocal style could not be more different from that we just heard. Her style is theatrical, some might say bizarre. Her commercial appeal has given her three hit records this year. As an actress she's appeared on stage, screen and television. She was nominated as the Best Newcomer in Films at the Evening Standard Awards in 1980 for her performance as "Miranda" in "The Tempest"   But this is the style that gets her into the Top 10 (The video for "Thunder In The Mountains" plays) Ladies and gentlemen, Toyah Willcox! You’ve changed your hairstyle since then TOYAH: Oh yes, I'll take my wig off. It’s my real hair now MICHAEL: That's a new one, is it? TOYAH: It's not new at all. I've had this since I was about 15 years old, seven years MICHAEL: When did you first start experimenting with your appearance?

TOYAH: Well, really it started when I was probably about 11 where I suddenly decided I wasn't going to wear any other colour for the rest of my life except black. And that's because I was just going through depression from growing up. I didn't like being told to wear uniforms at school and things like that    So I used to sneak into school in my uniform - with my report card - because I was one of the naughty girls and I used to have to have a report card to say that I turned up and then I used to get changed into all black and I used walk around like a nun (they all laugh) A friend of mine, who is a hairdresser, said “I'll do your hair for free, but you've got to let me do to it whatever I want to do”. And I said, oh, okay. The first experiment he did was he shaved the back of my head and it didn't go down well at all with my mother MICHAEL: I bet it didn’t!

TOYAH: Not at all! I had a great pointed fringe and I've got naturally black hair, which I don't like at all so I decided to dye it pink. And my mother almost killed me that day MICHAEL: What was the effect that you had on the populace though - apart from your mum and dad  -  when you walked down the street with with a bald patch and all that? TOYAH: It was frightening. The bald patch came at a time when I was at drama school. I used to have to catch the bus to school every morning and I'd stand there all innocently smiling, being a nice person at the bus stop but I just happen to look like a freak. So the bus drivers - you’d put your hand out and you just saw them waving goodbye. They’d just go "goodbye" … and they’d be another finger involved ... DAVE ALLEN (guest on the show): Do you find people have made up their mind about you before because of your appearance? TOYAH: They could see me from miles away DAVE: Even now – do you feel people . . . ? TOYAH: They expect me to be instantly aggressive. They expect ignorance and perversity and so on. Like bleugh . . . just (for me) to be really horrible

MICHAEL: But what was the reason though? Why you decide to adopt this  - TOYAH: Quite simply I don't like the natural colour of my hair. I think mentally I'm a brightly coloured person. So I thought if you're going to dye your hair why the hell dye it blonde or something? Why not be honest about it and dye it your favourite colour MICHAEL: You said that you were trouble at school - you went to a private school, to a Church of England School? TOYAH: Yes MICHAEL: You came from a very respectable middle class background - TOYAH: I am respectable I’ll have you know! (they all laugh) MICHAEL: She’s not aggressive, is she? (jokingly, they all laugh) Your parents were quite well off, weren’t they?

TOYAH: Oh yes. It was a typical middle class family (Toyah with her dad Beirc, below). I had really a very strict upbringing. I wasn't allowed out on my own until I was about 10 years old. I wasn't allowed to talk to the kids in the street because they had Birmingham accents and at that time I was talking like (puts on a posh accent) “Mommy, could have some sweeties, please?” I was just incredibly naive. It was my first experiences in the outside world that made me realise how protected I was I was genuinely quite shocked that each time I went on a bus with my school boater on (the school uniform hat) the girls from the other schools wanted to hit me. They were so aggressive towards me because they thought oh, she talks posh, parents have got money and they really disliked me for it. And that disturbed me greatly. When I first discovered sort of the class system, I just wanted to get out of that school

DAVE: Was there a conscious effort to join the other people? TOYAH: I didn't want to be judged by my parents property or by the colour of the uniform I wore. I wanted to be judged because I was me MICHAEL: It seems that you must have been an outsider not only outside school, but inside school? TOYAH: I was definitely an outsider. I had an incredibly bad lisp. I used to stutter, and I wasn't clever with words whatsoever. I was also very fat. The school bullies, who would come up to me, and they were quick with words, and I sort of just would stand there and go I want to get them back and I used to get so frustrated I just used to burst out crying   And one day, after spending many years treading school every day, because I used to get bumped a lot and pushed around, I thought I just can't take this anymore. I'm going to jump out of a window or I'm going to kill someone. So I walked into the classroom to two particular girls jeering at me. And I sort of (puts her first up) yeah, come on then ... and I just snapped and picked up the chair and wolloped her DAVE: And you were fat at the time? So there was a lot of weight behind it? (they all laugh) 

TOYAH: Yeah! But the sad thing was I had to do it that way. I couldn't do it with words. I disagree with that kind of violence greatly. But ever since that day, I was never picked on again. And I was the girl that everyone came to to sort other people out DAVE: I think that actually happens. I think where you're put to a point where all you can do is go forward - TOYAH: I was so frightened DAVE: People tend to leave you alone because you're breaking the rules. I remember getting chased by three kids and I thought what am I doing? I saw a big stick on the ground so I picked it up and I ran back towards them and they scattered because what was I doing?

MICHAEL: You’re the hardman. How did you in fact get into the business? Was that an ambition when you were at school? 

TOYAH: Oh, it was an ambition. It started at a very early age, at about nine years. I was a dreadful liar at school. I was so bored the whole time. I just used to tell lies such as sorry I'm late, my mother got eaten by a shark (they all laugh) I used to get people buying presents because they thought I was leaving school the next week to go make a movie. And it kept the whole of this nine to five syndrome exciting because I hate that kind of timetable, that schedule   I like to be totally unpredictable. I wanted to act and sing, I wanted to do both. But the greatest thing I wanted to do was sing. The reason I wanted to do that is because I was such a nervous child that I couldn't even sing in a choir. It meant so much to me that my voice would go and I'd shake and everything. I was quite a pathetic kid really. I went to drama school every weekend from the age of 14 upwards and when I left school with my one O Level, I went to drama school full time I was so well known in Birmingham because I looked like a freak. I mean to me I didn't look like a freak. To me I was just a nice colourful person, but so everyone in Birmingham I was either a prostitute, a mass murderer, or a complete hippie. It was just unbelievable. But my first break came when a director called called Nick Bicât was trying to find someone to cast in play 

It was a half hour play for the BBC and he wanted a newcomer who could sing and he couldn't find anyone in London apparently so he came up to Birmingham and was asking around "do you know any sort of young girl that stands out in a crowd?" (Dave laughs, Toyah pokes her tongue at him) And the wardrobe department at the BBC, who knew me because I used to do extra work there to help get a bit of money for drama school, suggested me and the director came to see me and I got the job MICHAEL: And then of course you got the into the National Theatre very early on. How did you fit into the National Theatre looking like  -

TOYAH: I’ve got to say it was wonderful. I don't like the building very much because it looks the same. It's all corridors and I used to keep getting lost. You'd run off stage for a quick change and find you're on the wrong floor. And you go which floor am I on and you could never find out until you found someone and said "excuse me, could you tell me where I am?" And you'd get a witty answer like "you're in the National Theatre" (they all laugh) You'd always be late for your cues on stage   I was the youngest in the company. The loudest in the company. I think in the National Theatre, you're supposed to be a woman. You're supposed to have etiquette and to be silent until you're spoken to. But I instead was running around screaming at the top of my voice and being very vulgar because I am quite a vulgar person when I’m happy. My dressing room, I shared it with six other girls   You used to look out into this well, all the dressing rooms aren't sort of surrounded and you could look up to the wardrobe department and scream for your dresser or you could look across to the next dressing room and watch the men get undressed. They used to do the same with us

Next door to us was Sir John Gielgud. And one day I was very late, the clocks went back and I forgot about it and I was late for the performance. I opened my window and shouted “where's my (bleep) dresser??!” I was really panicking and I was going “come down here for God's sake and help me!” And I got this phone call and I picked up the phone and there’s this very very posh voice on the other end and he said “excuse me, miss Willcox - did you know this is the National Theatre?” I went “of course I know it’s the National Theatre!” and I was looking across to see if one of the men were phoning me And he said, “well, this isn't a zoo. So could you stop acting like an animal please, Miss Willcox. You're in the National Theatre”. I was about to swear down the phone. I was going oh come off it! Who is this? And there's no men on the phone in the dressing rooms opposite and I suddenly realised it was Sir John and I went as white as a sheet and I thought my God, what am I going to do and I just went I'm very sorry and I put the phone down and I never shouted again in the National after that day 

DAVE: The ghost of Sir John hovering - TOYAH: Yeah! He's the sort of person you instantly respect MICHAEL: What about the things that run side by side in your life? The actress - you work in the National, you’ve done Shakespeare, you shoot  movies and that sort of thing and then the pop star. Is there a conflict in your life about the two? TOYAH: The only conflict is there's not enough time in the day to everything and I've got to do both. I'm trying to prove desperately that to act you don't have to look stereotype. I can look like this and still be an actress. Because I just plunk a wig on my head to hide the hair and everything. I love acting and I love singing but the only conflict is there’s just not enough time MICHAEL: I must confess, to be honest, as the father of young people playing your music . . . I am sort of baffled by its appeal - if I were to be frank … Do you have a purpose, like Dave said, as an entertainer, whose purpose is to entertain and to perhaps instruct people. Do you have that same purpose in your performance?

TOYAH: Oh, yeah. My purpose isn't so much political. There's so many problems in this world and kids are always being reminded that when you leave school there's going to be no work, or you're going to get mugged in the streets or something. I want kids to come along to my concerts and to forget all that. I want them to enjoy themselves. Because no matter how much unemployment (there is) etc etc you can still enjoy life. Life is very valuable    I try to put that respect, that self-respect across to my audience that don't go around beating up black people and things like that. That's not what living is about. Living is about just being very happy and coping and being with each other and helping each other with your own problems. I know what you're getting at. You think the lyrics are very diverse MICHAEL: I think they're quite aggressive, some of them … and despairing TOYAH: I don't sit down to write and think oh, I'm gonna write about this today. I sit down with pen and paper and write the first thing that comes into my head. I find that me being aggressive and abusive to myself on stage gets the tensions out of the kids, and they sit and watch me do that to myself - what they they feel like doing half the time - and it sort of allows them to relax

MICHAEL: Isn't there always a problem of course with this unfortunate group of kids that you say you want to relate to … When they look at you onstage famous, wealthy. Do they disassociate themselves from you because you've got what they -

TOYAH: Oh God - they don't dissociate themselves at all. Number one, I do not put a barrier between me and the audience. Those audiences are - sounds a bit patronising - but they're my brothers and sisters, and I go in among them and I sort of touch them and they touch me, and that communication is so valuable. I'm nothing special. I'm flesh and blood like them. I have the same problems like them. I may be famous, but it doesn't mean you have the money. I just want to communicate with these kids. Get them to forget about all the horrible things MICHAEL: Do you think as you get older that the rebellious streak will soften? TOYAH: Oh God! I hope not! MICHAEL: You will be middle-aged with with a mortgage? TOYAH: Put it this way: I suddenly became famous this year and I've aged 20 years this year and it shows because the workload is much heavier. I don't think I will conform any more than I have. I've only conformed to sell more records really so I can keep the band going and that to me it's not too bad a sellout because that means I've got money to make albums, which I can be diverse on. If I ever have children it will be when I'm in my 30s I suppose … but I really would pity them because I get bored of things so quickly (they all laugh) MICHAEL and DAVE talk over each other

MICHAEL: Don’t change the hair on your head. Not for the moment anyway. Toyah Willcox, thank you very much indeed

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[toyahinterviews]

BBC RADIO SCOTLAND THE AFTERNOON SHOW 7.9.2022

NICOLA: First up this afternoon I am delighted to be joined by a musician and actor who has been shaking up counterculture and the pop charts for over 40 years. Toyah Willcox made waves in films like “Quadrophenia” and Derek Jarman's “Jubilee”.  

She blazed the trail on Top Of The Pops with hits like “It’s A Mystery”. And that's not to mention her TV stints in “Casualty”, “Kavanagh QC” and “Teletubbies” and that is not the half of it What I'm saying is Toyah was already amazing. But then in lockdown - did you see her? She and her husband, who is the King Crimson genius and collaborator Robert Fripp, made our Sundays. They did these YouTube renditions of classics from Radiohead, AC/DC Metallica - the list goes on And she and Robert Fripp also performed Grace Jones’, “Slave To The Rhythm”, which Toyah is now releasing as a single. She has got quite a history with the song and she's here to tell us all about it. Welcome back to the afternoon show, Toyah! TOYAH: Thank you so much. It's so wonderful to join you on this rather remarkable day, where so much is going on in the world!

NICOLA: There is a lot going on indeed. Toyah, you're having a new single out. What a song it is. And what fascinates me about “Slave To The Rhythm”, Toyah, is the life of this song and your involvement with it. Take us back to before the time it came to Grace Jones?

TOYAH: Well, there was a quite a history with it before Grace Jones. It was written by my long term writing partner, Simon Darlow (above (left) with Robert Fripp and Toyah) and I was the demo singer when this song was presented to Frankie Goes To Hollywood and they decided it wasn't for them But (the producer) Trevor Horn then picked the song up, he rearranged it, got more writers in alongside Simon and then produced it for Grace Jones and we all know the classic, brilliant version that Grace Jones did So about two months ago, Simon Darlow said to me "don't you  think it's about time you release your own version?" I was very nervous about it, because you cannot mend what isn't broken. Grace Jones’ version is absolutely perfect. And my husband Robert Fripp plays on it. It's myself, Simon Darlow - that's the three of us on it We have one of the original writers on it, Bruce Woolley, playing theremin and it's just a beautiful version. Our version is slightly reflective and gentle. That's all I can say about it in comparison to Grace Jones’ version, but it's very beautiful and the audience dance like crazy to it NICOLA: Oh, I'm not surprised. We are going to play it shortly. I'm fascinated by the fact that you inhabited this song for the first time decades ago. What are your memories of your connection to it at that point? It's got haunting quality that song as well, I think

TOYAH: I know and I actually can not remember singing that demo because 35 years ago I was writing constantly and making demos constantly. That was the nature of the business. We always had to submit new songs to the record labels   And I have very little memory other than when I first heard Grace Jones’ version I thought it was one of the most magnificent things I'd ever heard, as with every single she ever released. So when Simon Darlow mentioned to me “you do know you were the original singer on this track?” My reaction was “oh, was I?!” (Nicola laughs)   But you know, we do a lot as artists. The audience gets to see the cherry on top of the cake. That's when we walk on stage, we're all dolled up and we share our music with these wonderful people. But to get to that point, so much more goes on. And to be honest, I have virtually no memory of doing that demo (Nicola laughs) NICOLA: But you've brought it back to life and we are delighted about that. Simon Darlow, who co-wrote the original and is involved in this version of it also produced your most recent album, which was last year's “Posh Pop”. And that featured, Toyah, another long time collaborator under a pseudonym. Tell us about Bobby Willcox?

TOYAH: OK, I'm married to Robert Fripp (above with Toyah) of King Crimson and he's a very reluctant superstar. Everyone I know who has superstar credentials really want to be invisible and anonymous. And believe me I know a lot and my husband is one of them And when he played on this album, he didn't want to be known as Robert Fripp on “Posh Pop”. He wanted to be known as Bobby Willcox, which is his alias when he books into hotels around the world. So everyone now knows his name at every hotel he books into. He's he's changed his mind in recent months because next year, we're touring Sunday Lunch - NICOLA: Oh wow! TOYAH: And we're going out as Toyah and Robert. So he's very, very happy now to be known as Robert Fripp because he's entering the world of classic rock, whereas he's probably better known for prog rock and working with Bowie. So he's changed his mind and on “Posh Pop 2”, which we start recording in a couple of months, he will be known as Robert Fripp NICOLA: Ah, he’s stepping into the limelight under his own name. I think we last spoke around about the 2019 reworking of your album “In The Court Of The Crimson Queen”, which echoed the similar King Crimson title. Were you and Robert Fripp creative sparring partners from the off? Was there always a spark there?

TOYAH: It's very good question, Nicola. I'd say it's always been a point of creative friction because my husband works historically in a world where timing is absolute. And what I mean by that is if you're in a band and you're playing a time signature where there's 18 beats to a bar, you cannot have fluidity in that timing   I come from punk where everything is about fluidity and tightening. And if I want to shift a vocal across a bar, I will. So we've only really met creatively as successfully as we have in recent times with Sunday Lunch.   The lockdown allowed us to kind of grow together creatively. And thus, we are now probably huge influences in YouTube. We have over 111 million visits to our site. This could only have happened if we were locked in a house together and we were for two and a half years NICOLA: A lot of us were locked in a house together but none of us had the costumery, the musical ingenuity, the playlist. How did you decide on the songs that you wanted to cover? It was a great surprise every single week

TOYAH: I know. In the beginning it was just me choosing the material. I must say now Robert is so excited every week he comes to me with ideas. And initially I posted a 28 second clip of me teaching Robert to dance and it went viral within five minutes.   And that was April of the first lockdown. And what we learned very, very quickly from that was the responses we were getting were from people who were alone, who had no one, access to no one in this terrifying time And we decided that we would keep posting every Sunday lunch. And eventually we evolved into classic rock and this is because we learned something out about the world and the history of classic rock is that it's timeless. Classic rock is a universal language. It crosses every generation   Old people and you know - what is old? It's just a number but people in their 80s, 70s, 60s right down to those who are in their early teens love classic rock and we found a way of communicating with a broader span of generations through the use of classic rock songs NICOLA: I love the fact that you're both embrace classic rock. Your most recent album was called “Posh Pop” and there's another on the way - TOYAH: Yes  

NICOLA: In saying that do you think that at the heart of all this punk as an ethos, as a rebellion, with its lack of boundaries still drives your art in some way? TOYAH: Well, yeah, absolutely. I think rebellion is in my DNA. I was brought up that way. There's nothing I can do about it. I see the world through different glasses to everyone else. It's extraordinary. However when I tried to just fit in with everyone else I managed to just hit some kind of note that is rebellious. And believe me, I'm not trying! It’s me (Nicola laughs). So I've learned to accept it NICOLA: Oh, wow. You're gonna record “Posh Pop Two”  - I hope you're going to come to Scotland soon with your Sunday Lunches - TOYAH: I am! I'm coming on the Billy Idol tour. We play  the Glasgow Hydro on the 21st of October NICOLA: Oh, fantastic! Well, listen, (I’ll be) down the front for that. It's really, really lovely to speak to you. Thank you so much for coming on Toyah, and thank you for making those Sundays, for what felt like an eternal time, so much brighter. It was so important to people as well. And by the way - the costumes as well - that's a whole other conversation (they both laugh) For now though, absolute pleasure. Let us go back to this new single. Imagine Toyah recording the demo of this! And here she is, released this week, “Slave To The Rhythm”

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[toyahinterviews]

BBC RADIO 2 BREAKFAST SHOW WITH GARY DAVIES 16.8.2022

GARY: What can I say that my guest this morning? She’s released more than 20 albums, she's written books, appeared in more than 40 stage productions Over 10 movies, presented and starred in so many TV shows it's impossible to name them all. Toured the world and best of all she's an 80s icon and she's with me right now on Zoom from home - Toyah Willcox. Good morning! TOYAH: Gary. It's so lovely to see you. My goodness, you are a silver fox! GARY: (laughs) And you're still a blonde bombshell I'm pleased to see. How are you doing? TOYAH: I'm really really good. It's been a fantastic year - being able to play live. See my fans again, release new music. It's been very special GARY: So you come from Small Heath in Birmingham (NB It’s King’s Heath). How proud were you when the Commonwealth Games came to Brum?

TOYAH: I am super proud of Birmingham. The Commonwealth Games was effortlessly perfect. Everyone just did so well. Birmingham as a city did brilliantly and I find Birmingham very exciting in this millennium  I was making a movie in Birmingham on a little back street about 2007 called “Battleship Earth” (she means “Invasion Planet Earth”) and we were suddenly approached by Steven Spielberg, who was shooting a test sequence for one of his movies on this street And I found out that even Spielberg loves Birmingham, and the thought that the Eurovision Song Contest could come from Birmingham next year! We've got to  champion this! GARY: I think that would be an amazing idea. And listen, you're an outrageous and an adventurous person. What if you represented us in the Eurovision Song Contest? TOYAH: Oh, that's just too scary - GARY: C’mon! TOYAH: You know, Sam, this year, I mean, my goodness! What a superstar!

GARY: And like you’re not? You’re not exactly shy and retiring are you, Toyah?     TOYAH: I'm not shy and retiring and I certainly could give a good match to Norway's usual entries, especially when it comes to costumes, etc etc. I would do it if I was asked. I think this is a competition for young, new, undiscovered brilliant talent. But I would do it GARY: There's no rules. I think we should put you in the fray. Talk to me about your crazy lunch sessions on YouTube - TOYAH: Sunday Lunch GARY: It’s good to see you're not calming down TOYAH: It's good to see me dressed as well this morning (they both laugh) It started with a 28 second clip I posted in the first three weeks of lockdown two years ago of me teaching my husband Robert Fripp to dance   

He can't tell his left foot from his right foot and we got 100,000 responses within five minutes of me posting this on YouTube from people, who were alone in lockdown and saying that we had given them something to smile about and how much they love that clip   And for the last two and a half years we've continued to do it. We now have 110 million hits worldwide. We've even been approached about a movie being made about it     -  GARY: Seriously?!   TOYAH: Yeah, and we're taking it on the road in October 2023. It's actually become absolutely epic in our life GARY: It’s brilliant! I mean your husband, Robert Fripp, his facial expressions - they are mind blowing, just the way he looks. And you. I mean, you should be ashamed of yourself at that age! (jokingly, laughs) TOYAH: I'm 64 and proud of it GARY: You look fantastic!

TOYAH: Well, thank you. And as you know, Gary, we remain rockers. Age is just a number. And I love the fact that my husband, who is 76, behaves just as badly as me. He is an absolute rock god, he should be an actor            He's so brilliant and this is why he's on my single “Slave To The Rhythm” because he's a great guitarist. The world knows this. He's played with Bowie, Talking Heads, Blondie. He's even played with The Damned And of course he has his band King Crimson, but we now have our band, The Posh Pop Three and our first album in August went to number one in about 36 charts. In the main charts, it went to 22. And this has really launched us and it led to me playing the Isle of Wight for the first time ever in my career in June GARY: I want to talk about that. But I also want to play your new single. It's a cover of Grace Jones’ “Slave To The Rhythm”. I'll play it now and we'll chat about it afterwards, OK? TOYAH: Thank you! GARY: Can I introduce it in the style of Grace Jones? TOYAH: I'd like to hear that

GARY: (does the voice over like in the beginning of the Grace Jones version) Ladies and gentlemen, Miss Toyah Willcox (Plays “Slave To The Rhythm”) GARY: Toyah together with Robert Fripp, “Slave To The Rhythm”. That is Toyah’s brand new single and she's with us live on the show this morning. That is so good TOYAH: Thank you. We wanted something different to the iconic version that Grace Jones did. And we have had Trevor Horn’s blessing. Trevor Horn produced it and my long term writing partner Simon Darlow, who produced this new single … he was kind of the original writer on “Slave To The Rhythm” and I was the demo singer. So this song has one hell of a history and a story not only in my life, but in Grace Jones' life as well GARY: Are you a big fan of Grace Jones? Have you met her? TOYAH: Oh, gosh. Talk about about originality! GARY: Did she inspire you? 

TOYAH: Well, actually my career started almost 10 years before Grace’s career (they both laugh) But what I will say is everything she's done is absolute perfection. Perfection in artistic terms and originality and my goodness, she's amazing on stage GARY: She is, isn't she? So tell me about the new album. When's it coming out? 

TOYAH: Well, we have done a reimagining of “In The Court Of The Crimson Queen” (above) with Robert Fripp on it, and this single will be on it. Pre-orders (are open) now, (it will be released) 10th of February, but I've got a lot going on before then - I'm touring with Billy Idol and so much more - GARY: I know! You're so busy! So you've got a tour with Billy Idol in October, which is gonna be brilliant. And then you're off on your Anthem 40 + 1 Tour TOYAH: Yes, that was supposed to be obviously last year and “Anthem” is my big multi-gold album from 1981 which I'm touring right through September, October into November. And luckily Billy Idol’s arena tour fits perfectly with the “Anthem” tour. So I'm touring two shows at once GARY: You’re a workaholic, aren’t you? TOYAH: Well, I'm very, very grateful to see that audience again (laughs) GARY: Tell me about the Isle Of Wight  Festival? So you played it for the first time this year. How was it? TOYAH: It was absolutely extraordinary because I played the big tent and as I stood in the wings waiting I thought a few thousand people will come in, but the crowds just came and came and they were just ramming that tent     

And I think we had about 12,000 people crammed into that tent and people who couldn't get in. And I have a 45 year career with 28 albums to fit into a set. That's a lot to do - and 15 hit singles. So I cherry-picked right from the punk moments through to the present day. We even did “Slave To The Rhythm” and it was magnificent GARY: I've got a few messages coming in here. Trish says good morning, Toyah. I've been a huge fan all my years. I still love your “Anthem” album. Loved you at The Rebellion - TOYAH: Rebellion was amazing! On the promenade at Blackpool GARY: Richard in Tamworth says please tell Toyah my 13 year old son Fraser saw her on Saturday night and she now has a new fan. He loved her and said her ending was awesome TOYAH: Well, I would like to send my love to that brilliant audience. They were out there in 37 degree heat. 10,000 people absolutely loving the music. Thank you Tamworth GARY: Amazing. I've got to ask you about the movie “Give Them Wings”, which is coming out. And it's based on an incredible true story, isn't it? 

TOYAH: This is the story of Paul Hodgson, who when he was very young, he contracted meningitis and became paraplegic. His mother was called Alice and she looked after him til she had a stroke. Then Paul looked after her and he was lost in the system. He didn't get any help. So this is a true story It's released now, we finished it just a month before lockdown. I've been nominated by the best critics award for the Richard Harris Festival as the surprise actress of the season for my role as “Alice” (Toyah with the director Sean Cronin (on the right) and Bill Fellows who plays Norman Hodgson, below) It’s a phenomenal story

GARY: You a play his mother? TOYAH: Yes, I play his mother and believe it or not as sad and as crazy as this story is - because he is a Darlington football fan and he used to go to the football in his wheelchair and he would chant obscenities at the opposition     He even used to get beaten up and he'd still be shouting obscenities at the opposition. Paul Hodgson is still with us. He's a brilliant, brilliant script writer. And he's just the most amazing man and he will sit in his wheelchair and tell you like it is GARY: Still shouting obscenities! Love it! TOYAH: He tells people the truth! GARY: Trevor  in Eastborne says I was lucky to see Toyah at the Isle of Wight. She was amazing! Gave a great performance. James in Northern Ireland: Toyah played at the Let's Rock Festival here and her and her band were fantastic, Toyah rocked and she jumped about just like she's a teenager … I’ve just had a text saying - is it true? You're on The Archers this week?! TOYAH: Yes! (they both laugh)

GARY: How was that?! TOYAH: It was fabulous! We recorded it at The Archers studio in Birmingham. I was on with the icon called Pat. I was there with all the characters, loving every moment of it and I can't tell you the storyline but it's  so funny GARY: Listen, I can't tell you what a pleasure it has been to have you on the show this morning. I love the fact that you grow old disgracefully. Long may it continue. Her new single “Slave To The Rhythm” is out now and you can get tickets for Anthem 40 +1 Tour and you can catch her on The Archers! Thank you, Toyah! TOYAH: Thank you, Gary! Thank you, everybody!

#toyah #toyah willcox #toyahwil #toyah interview #toyahinterview #toyahbbc #toyah bbc #toyah radio #toyahradio #toyah 2022 #toyah2022

[toyahinterviews]

TOYAH ON BBC RADIO SCOTLAND WITH BILLY SLOAN 30.10.2021

BILLY: Toyah Willcox has made her career as a successful singer and actress, and one of her first big breaks on the big screen was when she appeared alongside Phil Daniels and Sting in the film “Quadrophenia”. So was she a fan of the 1973 album first, before being cast as “Monkey” and the movie version of Pete Townshend’s mod rock opera? TOYAH: I was a fan of The Who. I've always been a fan of The Who. I didn't know “Quadrophenia” until I received the script from the production team. And then of course this opened up The Who for me even more, and the extraordinary writing abilities and talents of Pete Townshend. So I've always been attracted to Roger Daltrey’s voice, to the power, to the mod movement and the sheer the finesse of what The Who created has always been very attractive to me.   Unfortunately, my career started at a time in punk where punk was opposed to what The Who created, but the energy of “My Generation”  and all those songs was pure punk. And suddenly I found myself in “Quadrophenia” as an actress, and I was having to hide the fact that I was a punk rocker. But I always respected and love The Who because they were the original punks. BILLY: How did you actually get the part?

TOYAH: Franc Roddam, the director, asked me to get John Lydon – Johnny Rotten of the Sex Pistols through a screen test for the part of “Jimmy”. So I went along to John Lydon’s flat and ran through the scenes and he was absolutely astonishing. Firstly, he was a gentleman, he was an absolute treat to be with. There was none of that kind of persona of Johnny Rotten. He worked incredibly hard. He knew his lines. Then he and I went to Shepperton Studios where we shot our screen tests. I was playing “Steph”, he was playing “Jimmy”.   Then I didn't hear another thing and I was making a movie with Katharine Hepburn at Lee Electrics in Wembley and the production office and “Quadrophenia” was next door. So I walked around the outside of the building and saw Franc Roddam in his office and I banged on the window, and I said “Frank, give me a part because I did this favour for you. Give me a part”. John Lydon by the way didn't get the role of “Jimmy” because no one would insure the film if he was in it because of his reputation in the Sex Pistols.   But I knew that Franc Roddam hadn't cast the role of “Monkey” and he called me in and Phil Daniels was in the office at the time with him and Franc said if I could perform the party scene with Phil Daniels, he'd consider me for “Monkey”. We did the scene there and then and I got the job. BILLY: What kind of person was "Monkey"?

TOYAH: “Monkey” for me was the girl with the golden heart that didn't make good. “Monkey” was a drug dealer because she worked in a chemist and she was just slowly taking all the pills and selling them to her friends. And she wanted to be loved and she wanted to be the number one girl but of course she wasn't, “Steph” was the number one fantasy girl for every male in the film. And we all know who this character “Monkey” is. She's the one that is that girl in the gang, but it's the one with the golden heart. BILLY: And there's a real ensemble cast because Leslie Ash (as "Steph"), as you mentioned earlier, there's also Sting as the “Ace Face.” The cast also included people like a very young Ray Winston, Michael Elphick, who was "Jimmy's" father, Kate Williams, who was "Jimmy's" mother, Timothy Spall. And of course, Phil Daniels. And it's not hard to almost imagine anybody else playing “Jimmy Cooper” other than Phil, isn't it? TOYAH: Oh, Phil Daniels was absolutely perfect for the role. It's the most ultimate character I think he's ever created. He was so astonishing and breathtaking. And even today, as acting has evolved into a more naturalistic form, Phil Daniels was ahead of game. Its perfection and that's why the film is still as powerful as it is today.  

And looking back with hindsight now, I think Phil deserved more accolades. He deserved more nominations. But the film wasn't critically well received at the time of its release. And then the audience took it in their hearts and the audience, a generation after generation, the audience has returned to “Quadrophenia”, making it an absolute classic of its time. BILLY: The story of “Quadrophenia” is set in London and Brighton in 1964. And you had to be so accurate, recreating that time period in terms of the clothes and the haircuts and the locations and the scooters. How was that done? 

TOYAH: Franc Roddam was a documentary maker before making “Quadrophenia”, an award winning documentary maker and he wanted “Quadrophenia” to feel like a documentary. So he encouraged us to go out and socialise with people who had lived through the mod movement and still had the lifestyle within their lives. So we were going out at weekends and partying with people who've been mods, with people who have been rockers, and they did not hold back on the culture. They really immersed us in it.   Also, we were in dance studios in Covent Garden for three hours a day learning the dance movements, which we enjoyed so much, because as I’ve discovered with all great musicians around the world, Sting - great musician, great songwriter - can not tell his left foot from his right foot. Boy, did we have so much fun with that! This beautiful "Adonis" who we spent so much time with couldn’t dance, and we were just drawing focus to it all the time. Wonderful, wonderful man.     Other things that we did, we had to learn to ride scooters, we had to learn how to repair scooters, how it is to fall off a scooter. We needed to know all of this. We needed to know the dangers that surrounded us as well as the joys that surrounded us. And we immersed ourselves in this for about three months before principal shooting started.  

The incredible thing about the principal first stage shoot - we were shooting the riot scenes first and talk about a baptism of fire. We were in Brighton with 5000 extras shooting riot scenes (below) for 20 hour days. And that really bonded us as actors, because we had to protect each other, look out for each other, find food, find water, find toilets. I mean it was extraordinary. And then we made the rest of the movie, by which time we were a family. And we've remained family. We are one of the closest knit teams I have ever known in the whole of my career. And we remain that way. 

BILLY: One of the other real pivotal scenes in the movie is the dancehall scene where Jimmy is trying to impress “Steph” and he jumps up onto the balcony and then leaps off into the crowd. That must have been an incredible scene to be involved in. Was it? TOYAH: Yeah, I think we shot those in Southall, North London somewhere. It was really wonderful to do and Phil Daniels was completely committed to doing that jump. I mean it must have hurt like hell. I think the first jump he did was into boxes. I don't think there was a stunt person involved. I'm absolutely sure Phil Daniels did the jump in the dance hall sequence himself. It was incredibly good fun because we got to show off our dance prowess.   I was dancing mainly with the actor Phil Davies, who I just absolutely adore. It was lovely because within that sequence, all the characters were able to develop and signal to the audience who and what we were by the style of their dancing, which you don't normally get the chance to do in films and the mod dances were just gloriously precise. So all of us got a chance to shine in that sequence. BILLY: During the production of the movie there was some sad news when we learned that Keith Moon had passed away. What impact did that have on both the actors and the film production?

TOYAH: All of the actors were looking forward to meeting Keith Moon. All of us we just couldn't wait. This man was a legend. He was a bad boy, a great drummer. He had attitude. He was everything all of us wanted to be. But the week before we started principal photography, he died.   So when I first met The Who and I was in a room with The Who, with the producers, with the rest of the cast for the first time - it was literally the day after Keith Moon died. And the decision was made that the film was going to continue. They did think about discontinuing the film. And thank goodness it was kind of made in his honour and in his memory. But we were all brokenhearted that we were never going to get to meet this legend. And I think he would have been on site every day enjoying all of us and we'd have been enjoying him. And it was a huge loss. That potential was a massive, massive loss.

BILLY: You spoke earlier about the lasting affection for “Quadrophenia”. 42 years on - what do you think the legacy is of both the movie and the album? TOYAH: I think the movie is an astonishing film and an astonishing achievement made with no compromise, with great heart. And I think young people who feel diswoned by society will always find themselves and  their story in that movie. And that's incredibly important, especially at a time like this where young people have lost a year of their lives. I think the legacy of the music is great music never goes away.   Heritage music and music that was there first, that broke the mould first, that inspired many generations of musicians to come, is the music that will remain constant and “Quadrophenia” will remain constant. It's one of those albums along with my husband's album “In The Court Of The Crimson King”, with Sting’s and The Police albums - they're constant so “Quadrophenia” is up there with the greats. BILLY: We're asking everybody who takes part in the programme to choose their favourite Who track and naturally you have gone for a song from “Quadrophenia”. Which one is it and why?

TOYAH: My favourite Who song is “Rain On Me” because of the actual passion. It's about a young soul facing the future, just wanting their own place in the world. There's anger in it. There's hope, there's determination and it's an absolutely beautiful composition musically. And that is the song that I would choose.

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BBC RADIO DEVON WITH RICHARD GREEN 20.4.2019

RICHARD GREEN: Let's have a chat now with a wonderful lady who's got some brand new music coming out. She's been doing the business for many years, probably more years than she cares to remember! Hi, Toyah! TOYAH: (on the phone) Hello! I think I've been doing it for more years than your audience have been born for! RICHARD: Well, I don't know so much about that but listen – you've got a brand new album - TOYAH: Yes! RICHARD: Perhaps you can clarify this for us. It's called “In The Court Of The Crimson Queen” but it's partly new and partly re-working of old. Can you just explain for us? TOYAH: OK. It's not that old, the songs began their lives around 2007 and only the fans that come to see my shows knew these songs. And then on my 60th birthday last year, which was May the 18th, they downloaded everything to number one in the charts. At that time I was an unsigned artist and politically to get radio play and presence you have to be on a label   So a label called Demon Records said "we have to release this because there's an audience who desperately want it". So the first song of the album, “Sensational”, did start its life around 2009. It became the theme for Weight Watchers so it was on telly all the time The other songs have all been used in movies and the entire album has been used in a London stage musical called “Crime And Punishment”, four years ago. Now we've written five brand new songs. The last to be finished in January was “Dance In The Hurricane”, which is the opening track. So this album has walked back into success -   

RICHARD: Wow! That's nice though, isn't it?

TOYAH: Yeah and the fans have made it a huge success already. Two weeks ago in the pre-order chart, which is what happens now and it gives you a sense if something will chart – I went number one across the board in all the rock charts  

RICHARD: Are where are you, Toyah, on that one? I'm just going to pin you down - are you a sort of tactile vinyl person? I suspect you probably are -

TOYAH: Well, it's a very satisfying thing to have back. I had success last year with a release called “Desire” and that just sold out. When the vinyl arrived through the post in my home I thought “oh, this is a really nice feeling!” I feel like an artist again – I've got vinyl!

RICHARD: And of course it feels from the audience's point of view like they own something. If you stream stuff nowadays you don't connect with it the same way ...

TOYAH: I feel the same about books. I like to have a book in my hands so yes, you're right. It's a product and you own it

RICHARD: So tell us then what's going to happen with this album. You said the audience have got it up to number one in the pre-order chart, which is absolutely fantastic. What sort of welled up in your inner spirit when you realised you were going to be number one? That you're going to get good traction on this album?

TOYAH : Yeah ... (struggles to find words) It's taken a while to sink in. Because I play all through the year, I do four shows a week and I have done for the last twenty years and my shows sell out. I'm used to having an audience but to suddenly know there's going to be this presence ... I'm still coming to terms with it because it's going to very different how it was 42 years ago ...

The world has changed considerably and I'm learning every day about what a download chart is, what downloads are, how people can write and respond and comment online. It's still a huge learning curve for me. I feel as if I'm coming to the tip of the tidal wave and learning to surf it

So it's a very exciting time. The whole of my year has live shows booked so we're going to be performing these songs. I'm even being booked into next year so it's going to have a long life  

RICHARD: It certainly is. Shall we hear one of the songs from it? The opening single is “Sensational” - which is a good title for a song, isn't it? (laughs)

TOYAH: It's a song of empowerment. It a song that tells people with no confidence that they are miraculous, they are sensational

“Sensational” plays

RICHARD: You've been singing songs of empowerment that have a sort of oomph to them, for ages ... haven't you, really?

TOYAH: My songs are anthems. My songs are written for the stadiums where you want a lot of people singing with you - RICHARD: And how does it go when that happens? I've seen you at the festivals when you do some of the big songs from the past and they'll be singing them back at you -     

TOYAH: Yes! (laughs)

RICHARD: That must be an awesome feeling?

TOYAH: It's amazing! “I Want To Be Free” is always the fun one because they always sing along to everything I do but somehow “I Want To Be Free” has an anarchy to it still , so they not only sing along – they shout it along!

And it's fabulous because I want to remind people of our rebellion because I'm the punk generation. We're the generation that forgot to grow old and still have that element of bravado in us. So when I do “I Want To Be Free” I seem to ignite a passion in people and it becomes quite militant -

RICHARD: It's good that that happens but what about “It's A Mystery” and “Brave New World” ...

TOYAH: Well, they're romantic. People sing along to those because there is a romantic connotation in them but there's definitely rebellion in “I Want To Be Free”. Another one that always takes me by surprise, and I have a similar effect with the song “Sensational”, is the song “Good Morning Universe” because that is a song of inclusion and we open the set with that. The whole audience is dancing and singing it back

RICHARD: It's always good to open with a belter that they know, isn't it?

TOYAH: Yeah and one thing that makes me really laugh is they're doing the harmonies and it's lovely because (Richard laughs) it really helps out! You think “oh, thank you! You're doing the harmonies, it sounds even better!”

RICHARD: I know you're doing a Let's Rock (festival) but towards the end of the year you're doing a tour more focused on this album

TOYAH: Yeah. We're playing all through the year and we're going to be doing a lot of the “In The Court Of The Crimson Queen” songs. But end of the year, October and into November we're doing the "Crimson Queen" gigs, which will be Birmingham, The Mill, The Brook in Southampton, Bristol

But we are doing dates throughout the year right up until that point where we're playing the new songs in so I feel the whole year is actually dedicated to the new album

RICHARD: I know sometimes you do more intimate concerts as well, where you're a bit more slimmed down, dare I say?  

TOYAH: Yes, it's called “Up Close And Personal”. I do a lot of those

RICHARD: So how do the new songs fit into that? Bearing in mind this is a album with an electric band?

TOYAH: You've got to bear in mind I've got 42 to years of  -

RICHARD: Experience! Yeah! (laughs)

TOYAH: - writing to play. That's about 28 albums. So the acoustic evening starts in the punk movement and works right through to the present day. We play songs that work really well with three voices and two guitars. The show is a huge success, it sells out around the world

The new songs actually work very well. When you're playing acoustically it allows you to work with the harmonics, they just stand out better. It's a very satisfying thing to do. We did a small court room in Otley last Saturday and we had a stage invasion (Richard laughs) It was absolutely hysterical! The three of us on stage in this tiny venue and we had a stage invasion. It has the same energy and the same intention as the band shows

RICHARD: Lovely to talk to you, Toyah!

TOYAH: Thank you so much, Richard!

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[toyahinterviews]

TOYAH ON BBC RADIO LONDON WITH JO GOOD 23.1.2018

JO: Toyah Willcox is an award winning British rock legend with over 20 albums and 13 UK Top 40 singles. She has starred in over 40 stage productions and 10 feature films, including Derek Jarman's controversial film "Jubilee".   When it originally opened I believe Vivienne Westwood sent an open letter (NB It was an “open T-shirt”, below) to Jarman describing it as the "most boring and therefore disgusting film that I've been put through". Well, to a punk that's music to their ears.      

It's now being adapted for the stage. This time Toyah is playing the role of Queen Elizabeth the 1st and I'm so pleased to say she joins us on the afternoon show. Toyah, welcome. TOYAH: Thank you. The last time I was here, I remember I sang "I Want To Be Free" live to you     . . .

JO: It went out on a loop. I think we played it at the Christmas Special, the Easter Special, it went out again and again, thank you for that.

TOYAH: I just hope I was on tune and ....

JO: The thing about your voice … it doesn't age, actually, which is very interesting considering the amount of work you've done because it hasn't ever had a chance to rest, has it?

TOYAH: I've looked after it. I only sing four times a week. I could not do one of those tours where you are working for seven shows a week because I use so much range. I have a very large five octave range and I don't believe in doing the show if I can't hit my top notes. 

So I'm very protective and I turned 60 this year, and my voice is getting better and better. Really, I had my fame at a time when I was learning on my feet, but now I feel I am a singer and I'm getting there so I really want to look after it. It means so much to me.

JO: I'm proud of you, because I'm 63, and I think we are such a lucky generation - TOYAH: I totally agree JO: Because you've got great hair. I think that as long as you've got good hair and energy and you came bouncing in here, and we're both the same height and I said we look like bookends and I quite like at 63 being little. You said you'd like to be a foot taller? TOYAH: Yeah. I don't like being small, because it does affect how people speak to you. They speak down to you, not nastily but it's kind of . . . “well, she's small, we'll look down on her”. I have a real problem with it because mentally I feel I'm six foot tall, and then I have to keep reminding myself I'm barely five foot. I have a lisp and I hobble, so … I have to keep stopping to think that I am not Tina Turner. I'm not a supermodel. I'm short. I'd rather be a foot taller . . . JO: No, I think you're as Len Goodman called me “a pocket rocket” and you certainly are  - TOYAH: Len likes that phrase. I think he's called me that, he's not exclusive with it, obviously!

JO: I watched “Jubilee” on YouTube this morning, there are some clips, because I never saw it the first time around so I'm really looking forward to coming to see it at the theatre. I think this is an extraordinary opportunity for all of us to see it. I never saw it at the movies.   My goodness! You were always cutting edge. I remember when I last saw you I said I've been reading (Sir Laurence) Olivier's autobiography and when he was at the National he said "this young girl is hanging out of the tower (Toyah giggles) doing a vocal limber" and he said “who the hell is that?” and "they said “it's Toyah” and I went “who's Toyah?”" There you were at the National Theatre when no one like you - no punk worked at the National - TOYAH: 1976. I would absolutely rock the building because I was fresh from Birmingham. I had no idea of etiquette and behaviour. I was a wild animal, and I was so exhilarated and full of life because I was in this amazing environment so I would just shout out of the windows for wardrobe. I'd shout to wigs. Singing and running around, just feeling so lucky to be there.  

And I can remember on one occasion, the rest of my dressing room - there were six of us in the dressing room - we found some wheelchairs in the corridor, so we were racing them backwards around the corridors. I bumped into Sir John Gielgud, and he said (does a posh voice) “Toyah! This is the National Theatre, not the zoo and you are not a monkey”. It was a joy. I think people liked me and loathed me in equal measure . . .

JO: You took away the preciousness of the National. No one like you, no one like Toyah, no punk actress had ever gone into the National Theatre. It was all the Lords and the “luvvies” - and I hate that word, and then you turn up there.   You'd come from playing “Mad” in “Jubilee”, and she's the most extraordinary character. As I said I was watching it this morning – you with this sort of ginger, wonderful fuzzy head. Was that your own hair? 

TOYAH: Yeah     JO: I mean, shaven head which we'd never seen. Living in some kind of squat. Did you film “Jubilee” in London? TOYAH: Yes, it was all based from Derek Jarman's apartment in Butler's Wharf by Tower Bridge - JO: Before it was the groovy place it is now -     TOYAH: It was completely rundown and slightly bombed out, there was a brewery next door so there was a gorgeous smell of hops every day. There was an artistic community living in this warehouse. You had Andrew Logan, Sandra Rhodes, Derek Jarman, it was electric.   

And Derek particularly loved the punk movement and “Jubilee” in a way stood outside the punk movement because you can't make a movie and call it punk. It's a contradiction in terms, it's exploitation and Derek very quickly became aware of that when Vivienne Westwood, Malcolm McLaren, Siouxsie Sue – they all said they would have nothing to do with the film because it was exploiting the movement, and they were correct.   But Derek was an artist. Derek was a collage maker and at that time his style was about layering image and sound and story on top of each other to make a very rich experience. “Jubilee” was shot very much (on a) handheld (camera). It looked anarchic. He allowed us, the performers, to be anarchic. It had a great cast. The original cast was Ian Charleson, Richard O'Brien. Brian Eno did the music. It was a royalty of performers but also a royalty of punk artists as well, who agreed to do it - JO: And rumour has it that you were mates with Ian Charleson and that's how you met Jarman?     TOYAH: At the National Theatre     - JO: And then Jarman wanted you for the role of “Mad” but didn’t have a budget and said, “I don't know if I can afford you” and then said to all of the actors, “I won't have a fee. I'll pay you lot instead”. Is that true?

TOYAH: Yes. What happened Ian Charleson was making “Chariots Of Fire”, and he was at the National at the same time as me. He said “I want to take you to meet someone, I think you're made for each other” and it was Derek Jarman. Ian and I had tea with Derek and Derek handed me the script. At that time it was called “Down With The Queen”, something like that. He said “pick a part”.   So it's a story about an all female gang who raped and murdered men at a time of anarchy in the UK, slightly set in the future.  I went through the script, I knew that the punk icon Jordan had the lead in it, she played “Amyl" ("Nitrate”) and the next biggest role was “Mad”, the pyromaniac.   So I picked that role and Derek didn't even audition me, he probably trusted that because I was at the National Theatre I could act. And then a week later he phoned me and said he's had a cut in the budget and he’s had to cut characters and "Mad" had gone. He instinctively sensed that he broke me.     Everything - my dreams were relying on this film and I was a broken woman with that news. Three weeks later he found me - because back then you didn't have mobiles, didn't have email - and he found me, got in touch with me and he said “I could tell I had ruined your life in the moment I told you that. So I'm not going to be paid, my fee will pay for you to come back into the film.”  

And it was an extraordinary experience making the film because it was so hand to mouth. There were days where he couldn't pay for us to have sandwiches. He'd be in tears and he'd say, “I don't know what to do, I can not feed you”.  We said “don’t worry, we will  support ourselves, we want to be here.” And it was very much a production of everyone. Even outsiders like Andrew Logan coming in and throwing impromptu parties for us. Everyone wanted this film made. So we made it as an ensemble and we made it possible.   But Derek was very much the pivotal linchpin that kept it all running, and there were days when we didn't know if we were allowed to film on the streets so we ran out, and we just filmed and waited to be arrested. And then we ran back to base. It was beautiful, loving anarchy

JO: And do you think he’d be pleased to know it's now brought to the stage? TOYAH: Yes, he would, because Chris Goode, the director and writer of this particular version - he is passionate about the film. When the Manchester Royal Exchange invited him to put on stage anything he wanted to he chose “Jubilee” because of what it meant to him. He has bought it up to date, it's now present day, but it still very much hangs on to the story of the 1977 original.   But because we are leaps and bounds ahead within sexual politics and within politics general but we're still the same messed up world - we refer very much to gender politics, gender, sexual fluidity, gender fluidity and also today's politics that here we are again with the Tory government and the NHS is suffering, the young are having to go into debt to be students, that transgender people are still being beaten in the streets.   It's very much addressing all of that today within the original story of “Jubilee”. It's very clever, clever, it's very provocative. And another thing that Chris Goode has done - which I think is it stroke of genius - is the cast are all, in real life, political protestors. Thet're all actors but they're activists, which gives the play an incredible bravado and confidence.  

These very brilliant performers are not scared to strip off, they're not scared to offend the audience, and they live for real. Like we as punks - we lived as punks. These guys live as activists, and that has brought Derek’s “Jubilee” into the modern day with a younger generation of performers.

JO: How interesting as you say, and totally topical. And if you look back - I've read what you've said in interviews about your own youth. You said gender was never a big concern to you. You were very boyish, you were gender neutral? TOYAH: I chose to be a person, not an agenda and I used the term third gender. Well, now we have many, many genders. I still be prefer to be referred to as a person - JO: And you say and I agree with you - we're the same generation - all of that thrusting through the barriers that you certainly did and I suppose I did in my own tiny way - it was available to us. These kids now have taken the route that I never took, which is they're all qualified, they're all at university, they all have degrees ... and 50% are out of work. That is really worrying, isn't it? So we've taken a step forward and then 10 back.         

TOYAH: What concerns me is 40 years ago, when I was a punk rocker, everything was an opportunity, and I feel genuinely concerned that there's very little opportunity yet there is opportunity. With IT the way it is, with the technology the way it is . . .  If you have the right education and good ideas, there must be a way into the workplace.   I heard Billy Bragg say something utterly astonishing and it blew the top of my head off. About four years ago, he was writing for an anniversary of the “Titanic”, he wrote the most beautiful song about people that worked on the “Titanic" and he said he was the first member of his family that was not born to work in factories.   What frightens me today is within media young people are very much born to shop and to spend money, and to become ill. And what I mean by that is by entering into obesity. That really frightens me because they are being encouraged to be poor. If we don't address this  - what was phenomenal about punk was individual identity and punk opened up and pushed out the boundaries that if you had an idea that idea had a place, and it could move you forward in the world.   And I think young people need help to identify with that individuality as being part of what puts them in the workplace, their ideas have a footing there. So it does worry me incredibly that the young people today are in a completely different world to the world I came into.  

JO: Neither you or I have children and I often think it has enabled us to bounce around from job to job     - TOYAH: A lot of freedom, yeah     - JO: And it has given us a huge amount of freedom, hasn't it? I have God kids and nieces and nephews and all the rest of it and you watch them and you just think every generation thinks they're the luckiest but I truly believe we were and are -

TOYAH: Yes, I agree. We were very very lucky -    

JO: It was all out there for us  - TOYAH: It was all out there and we're still lucky  -

JO: I think punk was a voice that was listened to. It went across to the States and everything. Now ... what is there? What rebellions are there?     TOYAH: Let's just jump back to 77’ – I mean punk started really around 74’ but 77’ was the Jubilee year, we had the 1960’s, which was a huge social revolution, especially for women. It was the introduction of the pill, free love. You had amazing bands like The Rolling Stones, The Beatles, then we had amazing artists like Bowie, who was just so creative. I mean what incredible role models we had.    

Now we live in a broader world where there isso much choice, and there's so many little niches. It's quite hard to find your inspiration, because you need to find a niche to find the inspiration within it. We were very lucky. I still think the luck is there.

I just think we actually need a bit of a revolution, hopefully a bloodless one that will rebalance everything. I have no respect for people who are multibillionaires, because they're doing it because they're not paying taxes, and their parents help them be where they are, it's so unfair. We need to find a way that everyone has the opportunities we had where class, nepotism and education didn't hold others away from being successful. We all deserve success, we all should be working in the workplace. JO: I'm going to go home and see this, it's at the Lyric (Hammersmith). What a perfect theatre for it to go. Did you open it in Manchester?  

TOYAH: At The Royal Exchange Theatre     -

JO: Oh, I love that! I haven't been to the new one. I remember the old one -

TOYAH: It's mind blowing  . . .  

JO: Is it? How was it received? Who is your audience? (Is it the) Toyah audience?   

TOYAH: Well, critically it was received - it took us all by surprise. It's a huge critical success. The audience to begin with were middle aged and middle class, and we lost about 40% in the interval. But then slowly we've found the audience that can stomach the violence, stomach the nudity, stomach the sex.

It is about an all girl gang who rape and murder men but it's also abut transgender politics at the same time. It really is an eye opener. And by Act Two people are shouting approval, they agree with the politics, and they're up on their feet, crying ... it's beautiful  -

JO: And apparently you were fangirled outside?  

TOYAH: Yeah! (laughs) I've been papped as well! It's been quite a morning!

JO: Of course you will (get papped)! She's going to leave here under a blanket! Toyah, thank you so much for coming in . . .

TOYAH: Pleasure, thank you, Jo.

(Toyah and Jo at the BBC London studios)

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TOYAH ON BBC RADIO 4 WITH COLIN PATERSON 6.11.2017

TOYAH: It's the most defensive script I've ever read. It's political. It's sexual. It's rude. It's abusive and it's shocking. COLIN: Toyah Willcox on the first ever stage adaptation of "Jubilee" 40 years after the late director Derek Jarman's film TOYAH: It is the first ever punk rock movie to be made. We shot it in a bombed out part of London, near Tower Bridge, which is now the most expensive real estate area in the world. So the whole kind of weirdness of what we have today in comparison to back then is actually addressed in the play. COLIN: In the original film Toyah played "Mad", a pyromaniac in a murderous girl gang. For the stage version at Manchester's Royal Exchange Theatre she has swapped roles, playing Elizabeth the 1st who time travels to see what has become of her country. The script has been updated and will be changed every day to reflect what's in the news. TOYAH: It's a very sexually political version of "Jubilee". There's seven murders, very graphic murders within the play. And I think about five full on sex scenes. I think we constantly need to be reminded that life isn't always about comfort and shopping. I think it's one of the cleverest things I've ever been in.

COLIN: However, during the final week of rehearsals, it was decided to cut the section of the original script where "Amyl Nitrate" explains her manifesto for life, and describes the Moors murderer and Myra Hindley as a "hero" and a "true artist" for realising her dreams. The speech was in the play until late on ... what changed?

TOYAH: There's been discussion all along, group discussions, about whether that line should stay in. I think Derek Jarman put it in 40 years ago into the original film because of the shock factor and punks in the beginning did do things to shock. But as punk had its maturity and it developed ... for me punk took on a social responsibility and gave voice to those that were marginalised.   And I think today it undermines the whole play if in the opening scene there is homage to Myra Hindley. We all agreed as a group, who are performing in Manchester, that it was beyond disrespectful. I couldn't bear to even hear Myra Hindley's name. We did not want people going out of the theatre, not hearing the message of the brilliant politics within the play, because of this one line COLIN: You've had a remarkable career. There was the early 1980's, all the Top 10 singles and the Smash Hits awards. You did fims starring with Katharine Hepburn and Sir Laurence Olivier. Still, maybe, the work heard by the most people ... is the Teletubbies? TOYAH: Isn't that ironic? I put the top and the end voice on, it was a favour to a friend. The only time I needed security on the streets was during the arrival of Teletubbies. It was extraordinary! COLIN: It was just two lines you did? One at the start and one at the end? TOYAH: Yes, I wasn't even seen - it was just my voice. "The sun is setting in the sky. Teletubbies say goodbye."

COLIN: What would the punks in 1977 have made of you doing Teletubbies? TOYAH: I think they'd have loved it because I think Teletubbies was brilliantly surreal 

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TOYAH ON BBC RADIO MANCHESTER WITH MIKE SWEENEY 1.9.2021

MIKE: The first time I interviewed you was in 1981. You're still performing, still writing, still recording. And it always fascinates me when people have got that longevity. Where does that energy come from and that commitment? TOYAH: I've got the best job in the world. It's as simple as that. To be in front of an audience. To affect people in a really positive way, with music or acting. It's absolutely wonderful. And I suppose part of me I'm still ambitious because I'm hoping to be discovered. MIKE: Yes, where I've watched you - you and Robert Fripp. For those who don't know - Robert was in  King Crimson. He and Toyah have been doing these lockdown concerts from their kitchen - TOYAH: Sunday lunches. Yeah. MIKE: Tell me how that came about? Because that's like watching a kid perform and that’s what you look like

TOYAH: Yeah, well, it's all from our kitchen. In May of last year, I wanted him to move more. So I started to teach him to dance and we posted a 29 second clip of him jiving really badly, but beautifully at the same time. He was just so cute. And within five minutes we had 100,000 replies from around the world as far as New Zealand, as far as Hong Kong, Bali. And we kept posting, and these messages were coming back, just saying thank you, we've cheered them up. By January of this year we had 40 million viewers, and it escalated in a really wonderful way.     And it taught us so much about what a world audience is. And it's not about us showing off as rock stars or saying "look at our cars, look at our swimming pool". It was us saying that we behave badly in our kitchens as well. And it was cheering people up and then I got the record deal in lockdown. Started writing “Posh Pop” with my co-writer Simon Darlow. Robert agreed to come on it.     And we found that we were hugely influenced by knowing this world audience and what they needed. And it wasn't that they were needy people, they just needed to be seen and to be recognised and for us to say "we're in it with you".

MIKE: I've got to be careful how I phrase this. I am old school and I’d like to think I’ve got good manners. But you look amazing in the videos. You look very young, very lively. And to a certain extent and I’m sure this is a by-product - you became a role model or a yardstick for women of a certain age to still look really really youthfull and energetic. Are you aware of that?

TOYAH:  Well, I'm 63 and I do look after myself and image is important. It’s not all vanity, it's just I want to look how I feel inside. Talking to you, I can tell you're exactly the same, the energy will never change. You are who you are. You were a punk rocker, you're still a punk rocker. I was a punk rocker, and I still have that energy. I adore performing and I'm not ready to stop.   And I found in lockdown the silence of the industry, as painful as it was, because I knew that there were people out there who were struggling, but that silence allowed me to write music and I wasn't going to let that go. I had to do it. I was driven to do it. MIKE: What was the musical moment in time for young Toyah, where you thought "I want to be in the rock’n’roll industry"? TOYAH: It was three albums. Roxy Music “For Your Pleasure.” Marc Bolan “Electric Warrior” and David Bowie’s “Ziggy Stardust”. When I heard those three albums I knew that in my head the rebel I was but wasn't allowed to express externally, I knew I could do it. If they could do it, I knew that I could be the person I was in my head.

MIKE: How important was that punk era for opening the door for people like you? People like Chrissie Hynde? So many … Poly Styrene - TOYAH: Definitely Poly because Polly and I weren't your typical physical types. So up until that point you have beautiful performers. You had Lulu, you had Cher, you had Olivia Newton-John, who was just physical perfection and punk opened the doors for people like me. I'm barely five foot tall. I was three stone heavier back then. You had the gorgeous and beautiful Poly Styrene, who was just a poet. He was a female poet who wrote beautiful music as well. It opened the doors for us, and I'm so grateful. MIKE: Where do your songwriting inspirations come from? Because you get older . . . yes, you can write about - well, I could write about girls and cars  . . .  I'm 73 - it was a long time ago. So you’ve got to write about the now but you've got to write about the now without it being "I’m so weary" . . . Where do you get the inspiration from?

TOYAH: I’m 63, and my inspiration just comes from - both of us have lived a lot of life. And we have a lot of wisdom. And I've seen in people as they grow older, I saw in my parents, that they needed to be relevant. So I'm writing songs about how relevant everyone is. That we are never not needed. We are needed somewhere and people need to know that.   I think that was one of the incredible messages about lockdown, that we all were part of a community and I'm now calling that a world community, that everyone of us was still relevant, even though we were locked in a room in the middle of nowhere, and told we couldn't touch anyone.   So that brought out in me incredible messages like how privileged we were before lockdown. To be able to hold those that we love, whether they were young or old, about to pass from this world, or about to come into this world. Touch was so unique and it was a privilege. So I kind of wrote about all of that.

MIKE: I’ve asked every performer - whether it's musicians like you, whether it's actors, backstage staff, roadies, everybody. How do you manage when your life is around interacting with people in a live environment and in a studio environment, in an art environment and that stopped overnight. Psychologically - what was like for you? And Robert? TOYAH: The first three weeks was tough because I was about to go on the road with Hazel O'Connor in big venues,a  completely sold out tour. And we kept moving it and moving it and moving it hoping that we'd be able to do it by the following September.  It's now happening in June of next year. We are honouring every ticket sold. I had three movies coming out, two of which I've won Best Supporting Actress awards globally in film festivals, so it was going to be a halcyon year. But these films are still coming out.   Then the reality of the stage riggers, the lighting men, the sound crew, the tour bus drivers, the caterers, who were losing everything and had no government support . . . made me stop thinking about myself and just go right, we need to project something here that says that we're all in the same boat. I just started making the Toyah YouTube channel, and it had a very positive effect on people. Probably because of my chest (they both snigger) but also because they were very wacky wild things . . .

MIKE: Did you notice that I didn't make any reference to that whatsoever. Trying to keep my job . . . TOYAH: I love it that at 63 what I've done that with my body! I have to say I love it. And part of it is, why should age matter? It shouldn't matter. It's the spark within us that counts. MIKE: So when’s the tour going to start again? TOYAH: I've been on tour for the last five weeks because we've been able - MIKE: What’s it like? TOYAH: The first time I walked on stage was Liverpool. I could have cried. I could have just knelt down to kiss that stage, and the audience is just so there with you. More than ever before because they want this, more than ever before. MIKE: And the future? So where are we going to go from here? The record’s coming out, obviously . . .

TOYAH: Yeah, well, its midweek chart place is number five and that's midweek. So we're very very excited. I'm touring it for another year and a half, then hopefully I get into the studio and write the next album. It's very very busy because we're all buffering so many gigs from last year into this space of time while we can . . . MIKE: I’m more into you now than when I first met you 40 years ago. It’s been an absolute pleasure talking to you. Toyah, you take care of yourself. TOYAH: It’s good to see you! Don’t leave it 40 years again, alright?

Mike and Toyah at the BBC Radio Manchester studios 

You can listen to the interview here  HERE

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TOYAH ON BBC RADIO DEVON WITH RICHARD GREEN 18.9.2021

RICHARD: It's the BBC in the South West. Toyah's alongside me, brand new album out. It's your lockdown album that you did with Robert, of course. So tell us a bit about it? TOYAH: "Posh Pop" was made during lockdown. We started the main writing January of this year. My co-writer Simon Darlow and I wrote the whole album and recorded it and then we got Robert in. So we gave Robert the chord charts, half an hour every week, he'd come in to the studio, improvise over the tracks.      Now of course . . . Robert Fripp - 40th great guitarist in the world. He doesn't need very much prep time, and he only likes to do one take. So his role was very very quick and then we fed him which is the priority, he always wants to be fed. And I have to say that I think we are a magical three when it comes to creativity.   The sound on "Posh Pop" it’s very definitely Toyah but it's awfully unique at the same time, and it's just become a vast critical hit. It was number one across the board last week, but 22 in the main album charts. I don't have a Spotify audience yet, my audience like to buy LP’s, CD’s and have that physical product in their hand. So this is still 40 years on a massive learning curve for me.

RICHARD: Yeah, what about you? Do you still like to own a physical product,  if you've got something that you enjoy listening to? I mean I do. I'm always buying CD's, I feel like a bit of an old boy in that respect. What about youself? TOYAH: I think I would prefer physical product but I'm on the road the whole time. So last week I was on a ship, doing concerts for four days. Then I had to travel to a TV studio and then travel here. So having physical product for me, just with the job I do, is very, very hard. That said, I've still got absolutely every LP I've ever owned in the last 42 years. Well, actually -  I’m 63 so in the last 60 years. I've got everything I owned as a child as well. Do I get to look at it? No. RICHARD: You don't want to give it away. I heard somebody on Twitter the other day say “I got rid of my vinyl and I took it to the dump” and I thought no! Don't do that! Give it to a charity shop or something if you're going to get rid of it - TOYAH: I mean in this day and age - and I think lockdown has proved it - everything has value. Don't put it in the dump, keep it. RICHARD: I saw over lockedown - not only were you obviously with Robert and doing your album and so on and so forth. You were very active on things like Instagram and the socials keeping your fans, and yourself enthused I guess?

TOYAH: Yes, I started Toyah YouTube channel in lockdown because I had the time to. And again, it's this thing, the irony of lockdown. You took these very creative artists, me and my husband, and put us in a house with nothing to do, and we were going absolutely stir crazy, and it gave me an opportunity to develop this community. And we did it by posting very simple little videos.

 The first one was 28 seconds long, and it was me and Robert jiving and it went viral in five minutes. Then we realised there's an audience out there that were getting a lot of pleasure from what we were doing. And eventually I think January this year, when we did Metallica's “Enter Sandman”, we had 40 million views or 40 million passed through Toyah YouTube, and it's now kind of a second career for me RICHARD: It is amazing. So just tell us a little bit about performing again? Because I've heard it on good authority that when Let’s Rock Liverpool happened - I’m not certain whether you were at Liverpool - but Tony Hadley was full of nerves, so was Kim Wilde and Glen Gregory thought he was going to forget some of the words to a Heaven 17 song and all that sort of thing. So how are you now? Are you completely back into it or are you still with a frisson of nerves?

TOYAH: I’ve been performing concerts since the end of May, because I've been doing hotels, which are a controlled environment, and small venues which again are a controlled environment. And ironically, if we ever have a problem again with Covid it’s the smaller venues that can survive because we can prove testing. It’s huge events where it's difficult to control.   So I didn't have stage nerves. What was immensely emotional for me, and I could have kissed the stage, was that we could all be together again. And what Toyah YouTube has taught me is that we remained a community. The Let’s Rock is a community, and it's very much a family atmosphere. So for me - my problem was not being overcome with emotion. This event being able to be a family again, and to be a cultural community, which we were all terrified was lost forever. RICHARD: And we are a family, aren't we? Because we've known each other for years coming to the Let’s Rock event. I'm going to play something from the new album in a moment so have a little ponder in your mind as to what we ought to be playing. Whenever you go on stage, you always look stunning. Can you describe your ensemble for the radio audience that are listening now?

TOYAH: It's a very grand looking outfit. It's actually a prom dress covered completely in gold sequins that I found in a second hand shop. People cannot believe what I find. I'm an absolute treasure seeker. So this is a second hand prom dress. Only ever worn once probably. I snapped it up and it's become my signature dress. It's phenomenal. RICHARD: It will look great when you're out on stage here at Exeter. So the new album. I've heard some of the tracks actually on the radio and as you rightly say - essentially Toyah but Robert’s there as well. You can hear Robert’s touches on it as well. What should we play? TOYAH: I would love you to play “Space Dance”, because it's very very happy, very very up. The most popular tracks are  . . . “Rhythm In My House” is the runaway track on the internet. “Space Dance” I love doing live and “Summer of Love”. RICHARD: And when you say you love doing it live, what's going beyond this afternoon. Beyond performing at Exeter? What what are your plans? Have you've got a big tour planned now? 

TOYAH: I'm on tour now until the end of 2023. And that's because we've lost last year. So I play London in two weeks, and I have the Posh Pop band, we're promoting “Posh Pop” right up until June next year. Then Hazel O'Connor and I are touring together right throughout June, and then I'm touring “Anthem” which is being rereleased next year, which is my platinum 1981 album. Then after that, the touring continues and I’ve got to write a new album so it's busy. RICHARD: Yeah, I don't know when you're going find time to do that in between all those gigs but it's lovely to catch up with you again. It's great to see you out and enjoying yourself and enjoying “Posh Pop” as well. TOYAH: Yeah, thank you very much and lovely to see you. 

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