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familyagrestefanblog · 1 year

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About recent takes of Félix’ father vs Gabriel, Félix’ guilt in “Emotion” & How the amok- child abuse of Adrien works (part 0.1 lol)

Just to make this clear right from the get-go (although is sad that such disclaimers need to be made again): No, this is not written as a Félix Defense Post, this is me writing out my analysis’ and other thoughts regarding way too much out-of-context stuff from “Emotion” and the one big confirmation of Félix’ indeed BEING an abuse victim from leaks which I will only incorrperate as vague concept since tbh I dont remember details and I’m not seeking it out for this.

Aright? Let’s go!

Where is all this stuff about Félix’ father coming from? Are those from even more leaks? From what I have seen in leaks of Félix saying something about the parenting he received I too got my confirmation that Félix’ father was abusive, but where is this coming from that Colt Fathom was alot WORSE than Gabriel?

In my opinion, that directly contradicts Félix’ attitude in “Emotion”. Who knows what exactly happened before that episode, though at the very least Félix most likely knows now that Adrien is Chat Noir and thats what made such a massive difference in him:

Also there was this out-of-nowhere second carmoflaged Black Cat-like ring Félix used as amok object that looked exactly like Adrien’s, although we see later that Adrien is still wearing his? That element of the episode was ridiculously out of context, but Félix’ knowing now that Adrien is Chat Noir makes its existence and the episode overall make alot more sense in my opinion.

Its basically the only way I can properly explain anything Félix-related that happened in “Emotion”, down to his behavior when he mentioned Chat Noir towards Ladybug:

Or the way Argos straight up refused to try and take Ladybug’s Miraculous away from her by his own force. He only asked/ threatened her to surrender her earrings to him but he never went further than that. In fact, her calmly stating that she would never give him her Miraculous was what set Félix over the edge in frustration, because he knew thats IT now. Taking it from her forcefully would mean she would speak up against him when he brings Adrien back (to get the Black Cat miraculous and because Félix WANTS him by his side on good terms), but he cant snap the girl behind the mask away either or else Adrien would see him as nothing but a villain if Félix only has her earrings but SHE is gone.

If Ladybug doesnt surrender her Miraculous and remains there to ensure with her words that Adrien too should give Félix his miraculous, where at that point Félix has the chance of explaining his plan to his cousin that noone is gone for real and he just wants to create a better world for them- which in Félix’ mind lead to a scenario in which he’s not the bad guy. Look, the boy knows he, Adrien and Kagami belong to a race of enslaved magical beings and are at the mercy of tyrannical abusers (Dude, what a sentence!). I’m not expecting rationality from Félix Fathom at this point. He was still 100% the bad guy in this, but I get it.

Also Fuck u Gloob, how dare YOU leave me without actual context for this shit?? xD)

But even without that... explanation-theory of mine, in episode 18 all I can see is Félix acting on SO MUCH god damn guilt towards Adrien and trying to free him from Gabriel. He literally states he tried to succeed in this episode for ADRIEN:

Then regarding Colt Fathom’s parenting again: when Félix confronts Gabriel about how Gabriel uses them, his family, he does not treat his uncle as a lesser monster than the one Félix (may have? Idk?) known as a father:

Félix went to the upmost extreme methods to get rid of Gabriel in this episode. He sees his uncle as nothing short of a tyrannical monster that needs to get taken out with a literal SNAP so Gabriel has no opportunity to stop him and be remade with a reality changing wish.

But most importantly, when Félix called Gabriel out he named ADRIEN first:

This was NOT Félix only doing it for himself and those are also not the actions and words of a person who views Gabriel as LESS of a dangerous tyrant bc of his own father. No matter how bad Colt Fathom was, Félix is not underestimating his uncle as the madman that he is. At least not ANYMORE!

Not in a single second of “Emotion” do I get the impression that Félix has NOT finally understood in what horrible position Adrien is caught in in Gabriel’s grasp (more on this regard for the Diamond Ball in an upcoming post I’ll link HERE). Which, yes, Félix too partly caused through the s4 finale. This is most likely why he goes to such insane lenghts to try to save Adrien.

Félix feels fucking GUILTY now in hindsight for having sold the one amok ring of his cousin he already had safe and sound in his possession back to Gabriel, along with 15 more miraculous’ to make him even MORE dangerous:

Which btw, GOOD!!! He should!

Anyway. While I dont understand where these takes about how much worse Colt Fathom was to Félix than Gabriel to Adrien come from, that claim does seems to be very accurate though to Félix’ point of view of Adrien’s abuse BEFORE season 5. Hence why he was being so god damn awful to his cousin and SOLD HIM TO HIS ABUSER!

The way I see it right now, Colt Fathom was abusive on Gabriel Agreste’s level but he did it in ways more open and “obvious”.

Gabriel is an extremely abusive father, but the worst thing about him has always been that he abuses Adrien in a way for which people cannot easily get him for it. Sure, there has always been ALOT to worry about under the circumstances after Emilie “died” but Gabriel Agreste has always made sure whatever he does to his son he remains untouchable enough from a normal legal perspective.

I’m not sure if child protection services could ever have actually helped Adrien even if they tried, because while Gabriel has been stretching all lines of possible slack problematic parents are being given - because the child cant nor SHOULD immediately be taken away from their parent if not truly necessary - Gabriel has never made.. that ONE slip-up too much and too out-of-line that could set Adrien free from him.

And in my opinion, thats what the show is going for because thats what Félix realized at some point prior to episode 18 about Gabriel’s treatment of Adrien and Adrien’s own behavior towards his father, for which Félix gave him massive shit for just last season:

Félix made a full-blown 180 regarding Adrien, thats the only way I can explain it.

Its GUILT. Guilt and the desperate attempt to save his cousin from the horrible consequences Félix had a HUGE part in unleashing and to be able to somehow manage to somewhat save the strong and basically brother-like bond he and Adrien once had as cousins.

And I dont care what anyone says, its by far the one bond Adrien has with anyone besides Plagg in which he’s literally 100% his authentic self and not any degree of Adrien Agreste™ or Chat Noir™. Seriously, if you wanna see Adrien behaving like nothing but a normal boy, watch him interact with his cousin who’s basically his BROTHER.

And it doesnt even matter how much of a damn dick Félix became, in any interaction these two had in the show you could easily SEE how close these two were/are from Adrien’s behavior. Which btw, makes Félix actions before s5 alot worse, but thats the point. This is WHY he goes as far as he does in “Emotion”. Because they once HAD such an incredibly close bond as Adrien’s “naively trusting” behavior towards him always claimed.

The bond which FÉLIX comitted to burn into the ground in s3-s4:

Guilt I can only explain in the same only way I can possibly explain Félix throwing Adrien under the bus as awfully as he did til s5, and in particular the s4 finale:

I can only explain it if Félix all his life had received the other - but in this case pretty much equal - side of the spectrum of abusive parenthood and Adrien’s abuse simply looked so different and way more ”subtle” and “acceptable by society’s standarts” from what Félix’ knew as highly abusive (when he finally gained freedom through getting his ring, probably at his father’s funeral hence why Adrien wasnt allowed to be there. It’s where Félix has told he’s a Sentihuman) that he didnt recognize it as such and therefore ended up hardcore victim-blaming his cousin because he has it “so much better” under Gabriel’s fist but “still cant take initiative like Félix does”.

Félix at the end of “Strike Back” in my opinion truly thought that even though his uncle is a delusional, tyrannical man, Adrien would be the ONLY person safe ENOUGH with him and from him (I know this sounds like a hypocritical cop-out, but Félix is literally in the ONE family position as Adrien’s close and only cousin, who’s also the only other child in their families but always also lived far away enough to not be around to wittness most of Adrien’s and Gabriel’s father-son dynamic behind closed doors [especially in the last, and most crucial year], that I simply have to say that.. this is so god. damn. realistic. This is a way too realistic variation of how the once close children in abusive families end up as bitter rivals throwing each other under the bus within their own absive family system.)

Félix thought that Adrien is as per usual the ONE exception for Gabriel in EVERYTHING, so giving Papa Agreste the control object and 15 more miraculous’ he can fry his brain away with simply... wouldnt have meant endangering Adrien’s entire life in Félix’ eyes.

Which WE know is the WRONG damn reading of the situation!

But for Félix Adrien was his uncle’s one weakness “out of fatherly love” Félix most likely never knew himself, because Gabriel put/s ALOT of effort into keeping his son in the dark (”overprotectiveness”) which lead Félix to even blantantly using Adrien against GABRIEL bc he knew that threatening to tell Adrien would be the most effective way to make his uncle instantly stop denying that he’s Shadowmoth:

(Also, notice how in the upper picture when Gabriel is denying that he’s Shadowmoth, Flairmidable is shot from the ONE - the ONE - possible angle from where his character model looks similar to Chat Noir.

With whatever tons of context we are apparently missing from prior to “Emotion” regarding this entire Agreste, Graham de Vanily/ Fathom and Tsurugi mess, this visual forshadowing in “Strike Back” is in SOME WAY apparently about to become relevant now. Most likely through Nathalie but eyyyyyy, its not like we have any kind of DAMN context! <3 :D)

I already long assumed Félix’ awful but NEW behavior towards Adrien since his father’s funeral to be the result of Félix despising Adrien bc Gabriel burdened his nephew with the knowledge of being Sentihuman in the worst way and at the worst time possible while “overprotecting” Adrien. But now with “Emotion” it seemed I read it mostly right.

The way I see it, Félix did the one thing unnervingly not even uncommon in abusive families: He couldnt recognize his cousin’s extreme abuse because he was too blinded by his own that looked different, while simultaneously comparing Gabriel’s life-long treatment of him and Adrien.

And since Gabriel has probably always treated him unfairly and “worse” than Adrien in Félix’ eyes (which was probably primarily more arrogant indifference from Gabriel’s side while treating Adrien as a golden boy) Félix then most likely thought that HE was the one truly in danger of Gabriel because he isnt Adrien, when Gabriel in actuality probably wouldnt have paid his nephew alot of mind at all and would have had included him automatically in the new reality for Adrien’s sake if - ironically - Félix’ hadnt involved himself and made himself a thorn in Gabriel’s side by now out of (UNDERSTANDABLE) fear and paranoia.

So yeah, still: Fuck Gabriel.

But back to Félix’ possible abuse from his father and how that blinded him to Adrien’s:

(No, I’m not forgetting Amelie and EMILIE, this is just getting WAY too much for this one post. The three mother figures of this family (Emilie, Amelie and Nathalie) are the crucial puzzle pieces in the Agreste’s & Graham de Vanily’s narrative. I’m gonna tackle that in posts dedicated to them specifically)

If Félix for example was more physically abused with open disdain from Colt Fathom than emotionally manipulated, used and gaslit out of “love”, then he would have a hard time at first (especially if he’s UNWILLING to see it) to understand or even just recognize to certain degree all the red flags of that what Gabriel is doing to Adrien resultes/d in emotional scars so bad that Adrien was/is pretty much suicidal at times and spend most of the show stuck in his mental and emotional escapism as Chat Noir (Still, I’m also pretty sure Félix SHOULD have been the ONE person who SHOULD have recognized the resemblance between Adrien Agreste and Chat Noir, the same way Félix was able to recognize Gabriel as Shadowmoth. But ironically, for that he was too blinded by his victim-blaming of Shadowmoths SON)

And if Félix only has ONE amok object and that means whoever wore it (his father) has 100% control over him, then he could (have) significantly underestimate(d) how BAD the emotional toll on Adrien would have been all his life when he always had TWO objects and that - I must assume - resulted in two 50/50 control holds over him:

(Disclaimer at this point: The show is very consistently exploring 3 unique ways for Adrien, Félix and Kagami in how the same peacock amok control resulted in very individual abuse situations for each of them. The amok abuse is not inconsistend or poorly explained, it was never meant to be a 1 for 3 explaination the same way you cant generalize ONE case of parental abuse for ALL existing abused kids. The show is treating this as legit child abuse the way it should. And yes, I will elaborate on all of that in ALOT more detail in future.)

Meaning only Adrien’s action and emotional compliance can be controlled but not his emotions themselves, which I see no reason to not be the default for Sentihuman who only have one object. Meaning for example, that if Colt Fathom didnt wanted Félix to care about any kind of bond with another person his age but his cousin, then Félix simply would have never felt the desire to have friends and therefore also never learnt how to handle the emotional pain of not getting to have them as Adrien was “allowed to”. Adrien didnt get to have friends either, but I suppose unless you wear BOTH his rings no order about forbidding him to have friends would have stopped him from still feeling the longing to have them anyway.

So Adrien’s sounds “better enough” on surface level - which is all Félix would have seen - but its actually massively fucked up bc the clash between Adrien’s natural emotions and the actions his body and mind are forced to obey would quickly beat a young childs mind into misery and helpless fawning on their own expense just to mentally survive that constant invasion of their mind by TWO sources they cant explain to themselves.

Adrien may have been “allowed” to still have emotions but his living conditions would have quickly turned that into emotional agony because Adrien would still be forced to burry everything deep inside that clashes with his parents orders, or whenever he thinks that his behavior or voiced desires would lead to him being shut down again. Its a malicious circle that pretty much accurately represents the normal cycle of emotional oppression within “regular” emotional child abuse.

Not that being 100% controlled physically and emotionally bc of having just ONE amok is in any way “better” (Holy shit, nah!, and I’ll get to Félix’ and Kagami’s abuse in their own posts), but I cant imagine having TWO the way Adrien does as anything short of mental and emotional oppression & exhaution at best - since Adrien ever since infanthood would always have to FEEL the pain of his orders directly going against something that would make him happy/ one of his basic needs and yet he has to submit to it anyway - or basically torment at worst.

Cause can you imagine if Gabriel’s and Nathalie’s contradicting orders in “Protection” would CLASH in the same moment?? GOSH!!!

This pretty much emotionally ripped Adrien back and forth between the two wearers of his amok rings the ENTIRE TIME ever since BIRTH, which would perfectly explain why Adrien is so emotionally repressed, resilient to impossible levels and instandly tends/tended to remain in denial and fawn or submit as copying mechanism. That would have been the only way he could have mentally survived TWO PEOPLE controlling him at once against his own emotions ever since he was a BABY.

I’d say its a reality check on THIS caliber that made Félix pull a 180 regarding his attitude towards Adrien - again, most likely through Nathalie (who I think would be the most logical person for Adrien now to choose to tell his secret Identity to if he needs help in managing to keep his secret save from his father) and SHE would get Félix involved because he’s aware of Gabriel, has the peacock miraculous and KNOWS what pain Sentihumans go through. But honestly, anything in this direction is guessing into pitch darkness lol.

I have so, SO much more to say on how the control of Sentihumans works but especially Adrien’s unique case of him having TWO objects. I’ve been analysing the Agreste houshold in this regard since around the beginning of s4, but that definitely deserves its own massive post(s) the same way Kagami’s abuse via amok ring (which she got to wear ever since AFTER her debut episode “Riposte”) deserves it own post seperated from Félix’ and this one here.

This is getting SO interesting, I’m LIVING for this scale of fucked up story telling! I just wished we would get it in the right chronological order so I can look at it with all the NEEDED context, Gloob, come ON!

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gale-gentlepenguin · 1 year

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I refuse to call any human sentimonster a Sentihuman or Sentibeing. Not because I dont respect them as people. But it robs me of the ability to call anyone interested in Adrien, Kagami and/or Felix a monster f***er.

#ml s*** post #miraculous ladybug #sentimonsters #i will fight on this hill

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nothingtherefornow · 3 months

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(I am just curious)

Which Holders are (in your opinion) "Major Characters" of Miraculous Team (i.e. these Holders that weren't given Miraculous "just because")?

I always saw Rena Rouge, Carapace, Viperion, Ryuko, Bunnix and now Vesperia as the major characters of the Miraculous Team, for different reasons, even if for now Nino and Alya are walking on thin ice because of their lack of faith and trust in Marinette and their disreguard of Adrien's opinion, and I still think it wasn't cool for Kagami to reveal Marinette's identity as Ladybug to Felix even if she felt that it was necessary for Felix to trust Marinette and Ladybug for help.

Rena Rouge and Carapace where the first temporary heroes to be chosen, and as much as theiy are left to be desired as reliable friends, I can't deny that they both proved themselves as heroes. Alya still managed to bring a considerable help to Marinette when she needed it during season 4, and Nino stood up to an akuma by himself only with Chat Noir's weapon to gain enough for Ladybug, and later in season 4 I think he did a great job with the Resistance if we are to exclude his plan during Illusion, I think those are notable feats to mention about Nino, but even though he was a great help as a civilian, his inability to keep a secret and the blind faith he had in Lila does not make him suitable to be a permanent miraculous hero. If Alya can learn from her mistakes with Lila I guess I can accept her as a major member of the miraculous team but she remain the same and repeat the same mistakes, I don't think she's worthy either.

Kagami and Luka really became major characters in Miraculous, and I think Ryuko and Viperion became a crucial part of the miraculous team, even more than ena Rouge and Carapace dare I say.

Luka provides a form of psychological support to Marinette and Adrien, and now knows the secret identities of the two concerned. And it is thanks to him that the events of Ephemeral could be rectified. And after having undergone training with su-Han, Luka must have gain an even more important place among the miraculous team, because if something were to happen to Laybug or should Marinette renounce her gardianship, Luka is the only one who I think could replace her.

About Kagami, as a sentihuman and one who is really involved in the lore because her mother is/was Gabriel's ally, and after Kagami became close to Felix as well as becoming aware or her sentibeing nature, I think she gained a more important role in the story, and this could make her one of the major miraculous wielder. At this point the trio Adrigaminette became very popular, and Kagami is also aware of Ladybug's identity, which in my opinion may have given her the same importance as Rena Rouge on the miraculous team.

Alix's role as a miraculous wielder was kinda predetermined from the moment hier future self as Bunnix was revealed. As the wielderof a miraculous allowing time travel, her importance in the team no longer needs to be proven. Even if I didn't really appreciate the dark look that Alix gave Marinette during the Ladybug episode when Lila falsely accused the girl of theft, but at least when Nathaniel believed that Marinette had played a trick on him to make fun of him, Alix knew that it wasn't Marinette's type and that Nathaniel had probably misinterpreted the situation, and during the rest of the episode she was of great help to the heroes. Then she accomplished her mission brilliantly during Evolution, and was absent when Lila was spouting bullshit about Marinette during Revelation and Confrontation, so for now I can't yet judge if she's a good friend to Marinette, and by extension if she's truly truly one of Ladybug's most reliable allies, but I like to think that for the moment this is the case.

Zoé could be a major member of the team, because she's the only one who defended Marinette when she needed it, and she bravely stood up to an akumatized Chloé during Queen Banana and thus proved her courage. But she's also Chloé's half sister, who is/was one of Miraculous antagonist, and she's now the wielder of the Bee miraculous, who was on the same spot as the Turtle, Fox, Butterfly and Peacock miraculous in the previous miraculous box for whom Master Fu was the gardian. She could be put in the background during season 6, or she could on the contrary gain a more important role within the miracle team, that's remain to be see.

As for others miraculous wielders that I could see becoming major members to the miraculous team if they prove themselves reliable enough, I would pick Max, Mylene and Rose. In the Robostus episode, if it wasn't for Max, Ladybug and Chat Noir would have lost their miraculous, and his help was his help and that of Markov were essential during starTrain. Mylene actively advocates for just causes that are close to her heart, and she did extremely well during her first use of the mouse miraculous. I would think the same thing about Ivan if we had seen him prove his worth rather than being chosen in Penalteam a bit by default by Ladybug in the same way as Traquemoiselle, Caprikid and coq Courage. And Rose was able to resist Guilttrip's power on her own, that's an impressive feat in my opinion, yet but I don't think she'll be that of a major member in the miraculous team though. As for Kim, He still has a lot to do to prove himself truly worthy, even if he's got potential, but I don't think he's that major for the miraculous team either, even if the monkey miraculous is pretty powerfull too.

But these characters have unfortunately proven that between Marinette's words and those of someone like Lila, it's not Marinette they will listen to, and for me Ladybug deserves better than allies who never listen to her alter ego civil

in season 5, Zoé, Alya, Kagami, Luka were the only other miraculous wielders to intervene and get the mostt attention from this arc contraru to the other wielders

For now I still don't think that Marinette's classmates are all worthy of being permanent wielders, and I'm saddened that Ldybug thinks that they are perfect for the job when she can't even fully rely on them as Marinette But then I can also theorize that Marinette entrusted her "friends" with miraculous permanently more likellly out of necessity so that no one can steal all the miraculous at the same time like Felix once did.

#ask #miraculous ladybug #my thoughts about the Miraculous team #ml season 6 speculation

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princess-of-the-corner · 1 year

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I've seen the leaks and I agree with Zeto, it's a horror movie:

Adrien will not be in the final battle

Adrien will not know that Marinette is Ladybug

Adrien will not know that Natalie was Mayura and the reason that she got sick was because she was using the broken Peacock Miraculous

Adrien will not know that Gabriel was Monarch and that he wanted the Miraculouses to make a wish to revive Emilie

Adrien will not know that he is a Sentihuman and that his father multiple times stole his free will because of it

Adrien will not know that his mother died because she used the broken Peacock Miraculous to creat him

Marinette will not know that Adrien is Chat Noir

Marinette will let Felix get away with what everything he did and keep the Peacock Miraculous

Marinette will let Natalie get away with what everything she did

Marinette will let Tomoe get away with what everything she did

Marinette will let Monarch get away with what everything he did, granting his death wish of lie to Adrien and letting people build a statue in honor of the "hero" he was

Felix will not tell Adrien that he is a sentihuman, that his father was Monarch and the reason he betrayed the heroes

Kagami will not tell Adrien that he is a sentihuman, that his father was Monarch and was working with her mother

Andre will abandon Chloe and adopt Zoé, taking no responsibility for his role in what his daughter has become

Lila will get away with what everything she did

Gabriel will stole both the Black Cat and Ladybug Miraculous from Marinette and make the wish

YEAH GOOD POINT

#ml leaks

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felixfathom · 1 year

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felix should have been the only canonical sentihuman in the show. not because of anything having to do with adrien and kagami i just think he should have something unique for him going on

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my-lady-noir · 11 months

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I dont know, I don't think I like this sentihuman plot going on for adrien, felix and kagami...

Like, I know that all the imagery and symbolism points to it but I just refuse to believe it and I'm really hoping it's just one of those "theories so widely accepted that they're considered cannon"

It doesn't seem like something that was meant to happen?? like, the show was meant to be modern-day but with superheros and a villain not with the added fantasy element of miraculously created children

it just doesn't seem like something we signed up for in the earlier seasons. and I'm just really disappointed because I love the characters but I'm starting to hate the plot. I guess it just really depends how they play out this part of the plot in the next season

#ml #miraculous ladybug

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temporalbystander · 1 year

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Okay so uptoolateart is amazing and makes amazing posts and I've spent the last hour skimming through a bunch of them. First of all, if Transmission is supposed to be Alya's redemption as a hero, where Exaltation was hers as a person, I may really need to watch it. But that's not the important part, I know I'm amazed at that too agreed Alya salt not being the most important part of a post of mine?

No the important part was an offhand comment about Determination where they noted that Kagami saying look in a mirror was funny because Kagami was Japanese for mirror. Now my Japanese is based solely off of anime so I thought Kagami would be more similar to fire god. Where Ka means fire and Gami is used interchangeably with kami, which means god. But okay. It's mirror. I'm sure I need no further explanation to tell all of you why that is currently making me freak out!

Kagami, the girl forced to be perfect in every way her mother demands, who is most definitely a sentimonster made by her mother for those demands, is named mirror... Excuse my French (heh) but could this bitch be any more of a crazy psycho?!!!

In fact let's hit google real quick shall we?

Felix comes from the Latin word meaning Lucky or fortunate. Which any fan of Harry Potter should have already known but it's good to be sure.

Adrien? Well also from Latin it could mean son of Adria or Hadria which are rivers in Italy. Go for Greek though? And it means rich. Gee. I wonder if that might have been Gabriel's preferred choice. *Rolls eyes*

I know in a fictional show that all names reflect some character traits, Dupain is french for bread for crying out loud! But when said show also includes children who have been made for a specific purpose? Kind of goes to show that Amelie might be the better parent out of this lot since she considers being able to have a child at all extremely lucky.

In fact, following this trend, let's see who the most likely candidate in the Bourgeois family is hmm?

Now Bourgeois is french for... The middle class... Seriously? How in the hell has not been used against her yet? Anyway, moving on.

Chloe means young green shoot in french but in Greek means blooming or fertility so... Probably not her since I don't see Audrey being that obvious. Or maybe she just named her daughter after the range of handbags.

Next is Zoe. Which comes from Greek and means life, light of life or brave. Since the brave part seems to be more her character? I'll say that it's not her either.

Which leaves us with Andre in some theories. Now you look into his name and it means either man or warrior which... While fitting if he were to be a senti and Audrey named him? Also kind of shows how unimportant he is when you consider his full name is just man of the middle class. Which is also fitting character wise and makes me think that it was originally his surname and not Audrey's.

You know just out of curiosity I looked up Audrey as well and... Her name can either be translated as noble strength or ancient power. Neither of which particularly seem to fit. I mean I guess if you twist it and squint a bit you could get power of the nobles? Which would kind of fit her above everyone else character.

So I guess that means we only have three sentihumans running about.

#ooc #outsideofcausality #mun ramblings #miraculous ladybug #senti theory #name meanings

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familyagrestefanblog · 1 year

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There is this ongoing thing with Adrien drawing back from kissing Marinette all the time, which at this point in "Collution" doesnt make sense anymore as him just 'backing out'. "Emotion" too brought this up already as legitimate issue Adrinette is going through that after the ending of "Adoration" every single time Adrinette tried to kiss, Adrien stopped it and even ran away.

This is a great opportunity for me to FINALLY talk about this massive subtext plot that started for real with the end of "Adoration" but up til now I didn't know from which angle I should approach an analysis post about it. This kissing detail being back and visually more elaborated on is EXACTLY what I needed!

In "Collusion" we see that Adrien's facial expression looks like as if an older order put in him is lighting up for a second preventing him from kissing her:

I mean, the shot composition is even purposfully leading your eyes towards Adrien's head with the background wall for example. It's clear who you're supposed to focus on the most.

"Emotion" already implied it through dialog but "Collusion" now pretty much proves that the one time on-screen we saw Adrien draw back from Marinette in "Emotion" wasn't merely caused by the damn phone (although this isnt the first time something weird happens with Adrien's phone this season) or an order somehow given in real time as one would assume, every single time after "Adoration" where Adrinette tried to kiss, Adrien seems to be stopped by an order Gabriel gave him after Gabriel turned Adrien into a puppet in the end scene and Marinette was so worried about if Adrien might be in danger in his home, but tried to remain hopeful:

This is something I figured for a while now. That we were supposed to feel exactly what Marinette is feeling here. She has no idea if Gabriel is doing something to Adrien and if its bad. She is the the outside person, she doesnt know whats happening in that house and she can't help Adrien once he's in it alone with his father. All she can do is hoping that there is another explaination.

Though that turns out to be wishful-thinking, because "Emotion" in fact has already told us that Gabriel did something to Adrien on this evening in "Adoration" after Adrien was forced back inside and Gabriel kept on and on twisting and using the ring while creeping backwards where WE know exactly that Adrien has just returned inside. They would have met in the foyer.

There is nothing far-fetched about a conversation having taken place once Marinette was gone and in my opinion it feels more like wishful denial to say that Gabriel 100% totally did not go to talk to his son. I mean, Adrinette was straight up about to have their first kiss right in Gabriel's view and that right after the events of "Protection", the episode right before "Adoration":

Re-enforcing to Adrien through harsher means to not be in a relationship with Marinette seems like a fitting punishment order Gabriel would pull after "Adoration's" horror show ending.

Give me a logical reason for why that wouldnt have been a realistic thing to happen? A reason that please isnt rooted in the logic of "we didnt see it when we followed Marinette's pov and therefore nothing happened". Cause I sure followed Marinette's pov and she ended this episode very alarmed and concerned.

Alarmed and concerned for a very good reason. The entirety of "Emotion" then goes on and on and ON about asking WHY Adrien is acting so weird and WHY he hasn't told Marinette about the Diamond Ball:

This question is a central theme all through the entire episode, and in the end the truth about Adrien's silence gets revealed.

Marinette herself has no idea and everyone else in this episode is also just giving their best guess of what makes the most sense for them. But that doesn't mean anybody actually got this right. And we know that because in the end Adrien outright SAYS that he didnt mention it because his father ORDERED him not to:

And then Adrien's and Gabriel's father son talk elaborates on that further from Gabriel's perspective:

I don't know what to tell you, it's right THERE. Adrien did not tell Marinette because Gabriel forbit it. It was an order Adrien couldnt go up against because it explicitly stated that Adrien is not allowed to tell Marinette specifically about the Diamond Ball. And as we saw in "Emotion" this order manifested in Adrien panicking around Marinette and lying in a way that at least somewhat still contained the truth:

I really find it upsetting when people victim-blame Adrien for not rebelling and "being brave" the way Félix and Kagami do (or even worse, compare him to Marinette who isnt a Sentihuman at all) because unlike them Adrien is not wearing his own amok AND is unfortunate enough to have both his parental figures wear them, so of course there are alot of direct interactions.

But if that one moment in "Collusin", where Adrien talks back at his father, indeed showcased Nathalie giving Adrien the means to really fight back for a moment by having laid her ring hand on Adrien's so one of his amoks would for the first time touch his skin and making it possible to nullify Gabriel's order depending on how passionately Adrien is against it, then this was a first taste of what Adrien would be like if he were given full control over himself:

Nathalie did that on purpose to protect Adrien from Gabriel and enable him to choose his own happiness as Emilie wished, which is what we saw moments before:

Adrien in "Emotion" and "Pretention" was not a 'coward', that is such disgusting victim-blaming against a person who is literally mind-controlled by their parent without even knowing it for their entire life. It's like giving Kagami shit for giving her amok back to her mother when Tomoe demands it, as if Kagami KNOWS that her ring holds her entire mental and physical autonomy. These poor children have it horrible enough being literally almost enslaved to their parents demands from the day they were born for some sort of sick purpose. Cool that Marinette doesn't have that problem at all and Félix doesn't have it anymore so THEY are able to do whatever they want, but they have no business being held as the golden standard.

This is about Kagami and Adrien who are still being taken advantage of and lied to ever since birth from the people who are supposed to love and protect them. Yes, they act weird and nerve-wreckingly sometimes and in ways that apparently dissappoints you because - of course - if you were a Sentihuman half enslaved and kept in the dark by your parent you would just choose to not have those problems, no biggie, but unfortunately Adrien and Kagami arent you.

They're weird and frustrated. Weird, frustrated, exhausted and abused little half-slaves, left in the dark and still minors so they cant escape anyway.

These things matter.

DETAILS matter.

Details like between the ending of "Adoration" and "Emotion" the episode has Marinette tell us that there was a time skip we didnt see in which Adrien has been acting very weird:

New and suspicious extremes MATTER.

Gabriel crossed a massive line by turning Adrien into a literal puppet at the end of "Adoration" seemingly for the first time from a further distance, since this seems to be the first time THIS happened in Adrien's head:

The fact alone that this was the instance where Gabriel crossed such a fundamental line is already a give-away that whatever is about to follow from Gabriel as Adrien's father from this moment onwards will be on an even more extreme layer of abusive. Which we know to be true from all the episodes afterwards.

But even if you wanna ignore all that, Marinette is then increasingly more worried about Adrien's safety in his home and everything regarding his father and has to truly face for the first time her underlying fear of "what if Gabriel isnt just a bad father?" and "What if Adrien is even being hurt in some way?" although she tried to approach it from deflecting angles until Gabriel talked to her in "Pretention".

But more and more Marinette is learning in what hellhole Adrien has been living in for all his life.

Because, you know, that is the case with highly abusive parents and its something one very likely has to face when one enteres a relationship. This is perfectly realistic, just the abuse method is fantasy. Something the show is not yet letting any of the children besides Félix know yet.

But we KNOW that Adrien is a Sentihuman at his abusive father's mercy and "Emotion" tells us that Marinette's concern at the end of "Adoration" was correct. Gabriel DID do something to Adrien but we, just like Marinette, couldnt fully see it because the biggest portion of the abuse happened behind closed doors as most abuse does. And Marinette, just like us, was left wondering what just happened to Adrien when she saw something disturbing happen to him which may stand in connection to his father.

And she, just like us, asks herself if he's even safe living with this man (no he isnt) when THIS is what happend to Adrien just being near his home and father:

And just like Marinette WE were supposed to find Adrien's silence after this concerning. Marinette read this correctly but she doesnt know yet how to properly interpret all of Adrien's types of silence and the family contexts surrounding it.

Adrien didnt tell Marinette about the Diamond Ball because Gabriel silenced his son, something that Adrien himself wouldnt properly recognize as such and only blames himself for as a failure on his part.

Who cares what the other characters' guesses are for why he didnt say anything? The only two people who truly know why Adrien didnt tell her are Adrien and Gabriel themselves because that's the abusive parent and his abused child. And that's the truth Marinette should be after. Not the one she prefers to be true and she is finally making good progress on that front.

And we can take the silencing in "Emotion" even further, because that wasn't the only time skip + silencing situation we had.

Just like in between "Adoration" and "Emotion", there is yet another significant time skip very cleverly handled - and almost hidden - between "Emotion" and "Pretention". We know that there is a time skip because once again Adrinette tells us:

Honestly, no doubt they will go back to these important time skips in season 6 or 7, there is so much important Marinette development for her love-related anxiety alone deliberately skipped before and after "Emotion" because of what it was entangled with. Not to mention everything else!

Optional rant ahead, I need to get this out of my system for a second: "Emotion" still barely makes sense and dont get me started on Félix! When do you think he fell in love with and stalked Kagami besides in the time skip? He wasnt in love with her before he found out at the diamond ball that she's like him, he probably barely made anything of her when he thought her to be a "normal human". Kagami and Marinette were not part of Felix' plan, Kagami he only just found out is a sentihuman too and therefore deserving of concideration for him, and Marinette wasnt even supposed to be there!

I swear, "Emotion" and the time skips before and afterwards are driving me crazy. I have to make a seperate post for the Felix and Amilie stuff alone and Adrien too was just plain weird in that episode with no proper explaination besides for the little amout that was required to make this work for Marinette's outsider perspective who doesnt know what's going on inside those families anyway. Félix apparently was gone for WEEKS and apparently both Adrien and Kagami knew that because they werent surprised hearing that and neither Gabriel nor Tomoe seemed to care that Amilie went off on Gabriel about it in infront of their children.

Félix was gone for weeks. Adrien knew it. And then we see Adrien immediately recognizing Félix as peacock miraculous holder even despite the magic; not being too surprised seeing Felix there transformed and AT ALL when he should be missing and is willing to go to him in a friendly enough and trusting manner despite that being weird too with no context! Félix is a completely new person who suddenly is aware that Adrien has always been a victim caught in a hellhole with Gabriel and what the fuck was that fake miraculous ring from Adrien Felix had?

Screw you, something happened there in this time skip before "Emotion" and we only got to see the tip of the ice berg! And screw this show for barely giving context for anything in "Emotion" yet because we are stuck with Marinette as main character and Adrien didnt wanted to involve her in his family shit because why would he?

*GROAN* I'm turning grey because of this damn show...

ANYWAY

What "Pretention" does very cleverly is picking up the same character goals established at the end of "Emotion" prior and starting this episode with it. But that doesnt mean at all that this is the next day. NOTHING about what Adrinette tells us about how Gabriel now breathes down their necks makes sense if this is merely the next day:

It's at the very least a couple of days and that's being VERY generous. I'm personally putting it at one week. That would mean Gabriel is being increasingly more of an ass for one school week where Adrinette has to get more and more creative (and Adrien ending up knowing when his father is busy) and at the beginning of the second Marinette has had it. One week is also a perfectly reasonable timeframe for the kids to put off talking to Gabriel and Tomoe while its also a realistic point in time where you would draw the line and motivate yourself again to finally do it.

Kagami's dialogue is the factor that very cleverly tricks the audience into thinking it can just be the next day since Kagami is "oh so much braver than Adrien who doesnt dare to talk to his father", which the episode then subverts by showing that Kagami rightfully fears her mother too and shouldnt be concidered less for it because Tomoe is an abusive hardass too who Kagami needs to be protected from as (her) child and Sentihuman who doesnt know she is one & the end of "Emotion" literally showed us Adrien talking to his father right after he told Marinette that he would try to convince him to have a heart-to-heart with her to clear up whatever he has against her:

Adrien did NOT fail to talk to his father after he said he would because we saw him do it right away. What he did "fail" to do though was mentioning towards the girls that he already talked with his father and tell them what Gabriel said - though that's understandable, Gabriel is being an irrational fuck; blaming the fiasco on Marinette when it's realistically on Félix - and to convince his father to talk to Marinette. But even for this Adrien's on-screen talk with Gabriel has the explaination for:

Did you pick up on the pattern too? That as well was an explicit order from Gabriel with the ring.

Adrien in "Pretention" didnt 'manage' to talk to his father again about him and Marinette so they can have a heart-to-heart because prior to that Gabriel forbit Adrien through an order to ever mention Marinette towards him again (and that means, since Adrinette didnt talk to Gabriel yet, Kagami in turn put off talking to her mother too)

So of course Adrien couldnt do it, which is why he went along with the only option he subconciously felt like he had left. Bringing Marinette to his father so SHE can talk to him by his side, forcing his father into a corner. Adrien unknowingly loopholed himself and out of Gabriel's order that's literally silencing him.

Details, time skips and circumstances matter.

So to bring this back to the failed Adrinette kissing in "Collution":

I'm pretty sure that from the ending of "Adoration" onwards we are now going to see a further and further escalation of ways for Gabriel to enforce his power over Adrien. Regularly just as his father (which is already bad enough) and also the ways in which Gabriel can hurt Adrien through the amok ring

- but in ways he can for now at least somewhat still hide from Nathalie, though no doubt this is going to end BADLY where even Nathalie cant help Adrien anymore as it was already established that Gabriel can absolutely do that and still cross so many more lines-

and in "Emotion" that already included silencing Adrien from letting Marinette know about the Diamond Ball and then not letting him talk about Marinette to him at all (for which I'm quite sure Nathalie touching Adrien with the amok ring in "Collution" helped Adrien break through that barrier because that WAS the first time he really talked ABOUT Marinette towards Gabriel since "Emotion" that isnt just him mentioning her name in logical situations or vaguely talking around the relationship topic like in "Pretention").

But I'm also betting that Gabriel odered Adrien to not kiss Marinette after he puppeteered Adrien back into the mansion in "Adoration" or some other variation of an official grand gesture that Adrien is in a relationship with her. Something that... yeah, DID indeed stop after "Protection", didn't it? (Ooh. That explains why the date was made such a big deal for Adrien's story through the parallels to Gabriel's and Emilie's date in the past in "Evolution"; that was the last time Adrien was able to do something like that...)

But poor Adrien of course does not know the true reason for why he's still hesitating to kiss Marinette even now in "Collusion". He must be so relieved that Marinette is reading it as him needing more time with her too to get comfortable enough to kiss. It's so rough watching all these episodes and seeing Adrien beat himself up and think so low of himself when he's literally being abused through mind-control. All I want is for Adrien to finally have his rings on his hand like Félix and Kagami get to. I just want my boy to be free :'(

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