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#Anti Konoha's propaganda
whitelilynh · 6 months
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Just feel so stupid to realise, thanks to current real life events, that Naruto really talk-no-Jutsu-ed me FOR YEARS into Konoha's propaganda.
Like, what they did to Itachi and Sasuke was monstruos, what they did to Uchiha clan was a complete and unjustified crime.
Was Konoha justified to suspect the Uchiha after a Sharingan-manipulated Kyubi attacked them? Yes, ofc. Was it a justification for a full apartheid regime that lead to a genocide? Fuck NO!
Although Konoha didn't knew Obito was still alive, hence the possibilities, according to them, reduced to the Uchiha (and Kakashi, why nobody mentions Kakashi?), instead of the racist segregation they conduced they should have, Idk, do a freaking proper investigation?
Like, oh, a Sharingan user took advantage of the debilitation of the seal because of Kushina giving birth, it must had been an Uchiha. Well, how many Uchihas actually knew the seal was getting weaker during labor? How many of them knew *when* was Kushina going to give birth? And how many of them knew *where* btw? Reduce the list to those. Include Kakashi, if he knew.
And to those, investigate, survey, and all your shit.
But why to assume a whole freaking clan that lives in peace under the supposed protection of the village would want to destroy it?
And yet, Konoha is all prideful thinking they are better. They are no freaking better. They still saw the Kyubi and it's jinchuriki as nothing but a weapon, they didn't care at all about Naruto's well being and feelings, even though he was the son of the previous Hokage, even though he was actually made a Jinchuriki and became an orphan precisely to protect the freaking village (I'm looking at you Hiruzen, I hate you!).
And on top of that, freaking Konoha took advantage of a poor 13yo boy whose love for the village divided his consciousness, to f*cking force him to kill his entire clan for them, then threw him away and hunted him as a dog, criminalise and vilify him.
And never freaking cared about Sasuke, never explained a thing to him. They even tried to blame Sasuke for not blindly believing their propaganda.
Did Konoha ever realise *they* created Sasuke?
I know Naruto fell for Konoha's propaganda, and I know the whole village wasn't to blame, but the leaders. But somehow, Sasuke should have received a sort of repair, Idk, to tell the truth about his family at least, for the world to know. For the innocents to know, and to pay respect to the deceased clan.
But instead, Sasuke got guilt tripped into serving the masters that destroyed his whole people.
A masterfully done work of propaganda.
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Less Will of Fire and more will to respect human rights.
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enby-axels · 2 years
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if i was taking inspiration from a founding myth that manufactured a familial relationship between a settler-colonial monarchy and an indigenous people whose forced assimilation was justified by said myth, i would simply not reproduce and legitimize it in my story. rip to kishimoto but im just built different
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mixelation · 5 months
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does Minato get RPFd or is he like too much of a warcriminal. Do other countries run anti-minato propaganda and rumors? Is there vicious speculation of his sex life??? Do the tabloids report on little inane stuff like his coffer order? I sort of imagine Kushina gets a lot of stupid shit for being a foreigner and married to him :c
i think minato gets absolutely insane rpf BECAUSE he is a war criminal. like. they invented the flee on sight order for him, but also, he's, like, hot? he has a strong reputation as a charismatic leader. fire country fucking loves him, and you can either find that annoying and write a cartoon villain or you can write a romance protag. the fact that he's married is probably annoying for a lot of RPF writers, but it's also very easy to just ignore that Kushina exists.
this ninjacon is ~10ish years since the end of the war, so unless you were somewhere that was affected by him specifically, i think his international reputation has swayed more towards "powerful prettyboy." i'm imagining ninjacon as an international event so there's probably a lot of care put into their code of conduct to prevent people getting into fights bc someone wants dramatic romance protag minato while someone else his like THAT FIGHT CAUSED US TO EVACUATE MY WHOLE VILLAGE. so i think the rpf can go in either direction and sometimes, both directions at once
re: kushina. i think she definitely got shit growing up for being a foreigner (i forget if i this is canon or not). minato becoming hokage might have stirred up some xenophobic feelings too. but i think a lot of that died down within konoha with time because what are you going to do, insult the hokage's wife? plus kushina has her own brand of charisma. but yes she's probably the subject of a lot of mean speculation outside of konoha.
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comradefleur · 9 months
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as an avid snser there's a certain level of konoha propaganda that i can willingly put up with, and it is in the form of naruto's unfortunate state of perpetual bootlicking (that's my absolute babyboy but facts are facts)
so ive read plenty of fanfiction which adopt the shippuden ending that im against in actuality. it really is hard to find writers who are staunchly against the bullshit. i know they're out there and i sometimes find them but at the end of the day, i am okay with a good proportion of the canon fic writers if they can really sell the romance and the plot for me
but there's just one thing that will make me click out faster than ever and it's when sasuke is made to be embarrassed or ashamed of his past actions when he's back in konoha among his past teammates & peers. cause that's just not him
even in canon when he described his actions as "sins" he had to "attone" for he still moved through the world acting and knowing that he belonged there without any faltering
shame is just so...anti sasuke to me like its very out of character because even in his (truly backwards btw) denouncement of his quest for revolution he never spent any time really begging for forgiveness, experiencing self loathing or embarrassment or reflecting upon his past with shame even if he now disagreed with his mentality
he was kinda just like i did what i did and now i won't anymore. i really hate the fact that kishi adopted this ending but if he had to, he kinda did did it the right way for a self assured character like sasuke. i'll give him that
because the thing about sas is that he reflects total embodiment of whatever it is he's feeling. and i think that that's one of the coolest things he has going for him
but anyway, it's not like im gonna be out here berating these fic writers in their comments who do this in their works. that's really rude as fic is really about ppl indulging themselves but since this is my page and all i just wanted to talk about it a bit
anyway sasuke stans follow me, narusasu stans follow me too hehe :3
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adhdnojutsu · 6 months
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Identity wars & the Uchiha
I always wondered why Itachi haters hate him because he committed mass murder, but excuse Sasuke, Obito, and Madara, for doing/attempting the same. I finally managed to put my finger on why exactly this doesn't sit right with me, other than just being plain silly or using trauma or marginalisation as an excuse for just about anything. Look, I'm queer, doesn't mean I get to walk into a roomful of c*s folks and empty my clip.
Itachi weighs human life in absolute numbers. Anti-Itachi, pro-Uchiha fans weigh human life in identities.
To them, each marginalized life is worth a whole busload of non-marginalized lives. They forget that social justice is NOT revenge, ie marginalized people taking the whole cake and leaving the non-marginalized to starve, but to redistribute the cake so NO ONE goes hungry.
To them, anyone in Konoha other than the Uchiha are non-marginalized aka "the oppressor", so their lives carry not even half the weight of an Uchiha's.
Because clearly, when they defend Sasuke's planned mass murder, it's not just "Danzo and the elders", no, these people think "guilt by association" is the new social justice, so everyone "laughing" in Konoha, to use Sasuke's words from his unhinged rant, is guilty and deserving of retaliation, too. There are no "victims" or "innocents" in Konoha unless they have a ping pong bat on their shirts, it seems. Not even babies or elderly. They're all guilty of something only 3 living people are even aware of.
They don't realize they're justifying school shooters. Because yes, the boy was victimized by a handful of bullies and had every right to go after them, but what, pray tell, justifies shooting up the whole school? That's what Sasuke, Obito, and Madara are. Glorified mass shooters. They have righteous beef with an entity or handful of people, and they're happy to take everyone else down with them for sharing the enemy's zip code.
When lumping all Konoha residents/people everywhere in with "the oppressor", these people don't take into account:
-genuine ignorance of the administration's rotten tactics
-if aware, a lack of power to change anything
-repercussions of treason/desertion -rational thought, ie. not criminalizing someone for living in the only place they've ever known
-other forms of marginalisation existing within Konoha, as well as civilians and dissenters -cultural/propaganda impact, ie. drinking the kool
-aid not typically being an act of malice and thus not warranting a death sentence
-limited responsibility for elected leaders: you may not have voted for this leader, or your elected leader may not keep his promises
-various personal and societal struggles not leaving capacity to march for the marginalised; remember Konoha doesn't even pay decorated ninjas enough to have their sick children treated: Mukai Kohinata had to spy for an enemy village to pay his son's hospital bills, and Konoha sent Itachi to kill him for it
-Kage are not democratically elected, making people living under them even LESS responsible for their administration. The Kage administration is a dictatorship, making everyone living under a Kage oppressed and victims. This also adds not-so-voluntary pressure to the "voluntary" decision to serve as a ninja. Imagine saying no to a dictator with a huge standing army of brainwashed child soldiers.
-the public reaction to the genocide. If they hated Itachi that much for it, surely, they could have made good allies to the Uchiha if the latter had EVER bothered to share their concerns rather than simmer in silence!!
All they see is "Uchihas oppressed, so everyone else bad". So they don't mind that Sasuke or Madara or Obito kill a bunch of innocent and marginalized people along with "the oppressor". Collective punishment, guilt by association, all those things I thought we all agreed are ALWAYS bad, are suddenly excusable if committed in the name of justice (revenge) rather than power.
Itachi "looks bad" because he only killed oppressed people, under orders from the oppressor. Itachi haters don't even take into account that he did so in tears and hating his commander and only obeying because of the many INNOCENT lives he thought were at stake - many more than those 60 or so Uchihas. He didn't kill the clan "for the oppressor" (a government), he, from his POV, killed the clan for the people who didn't ask to live under this, or any government - after all, there is no opting out of "enabling injustice through citizenship" no matter where you go, so why fault anyone for existing where they do?
Is all of Konoha really "the oppressor" because of those 4 old people? Where could Konoha residents go in protest where they would not collaborate with some form of oppression, where is that utopia of innocence and justice? Fugaku sure wasn't gonna build it, since he would have to establish a new iron fist rule to keep people in line after *checks notes* kidnapping a leader who only ever showed them a loving face.
"Guilt by association" is not how to advocate for social justice. Not in the Narutoverse, not IRL. You just turn the aggressor-victim dynamic around, not eradicating oppression.
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opens-up-4-nobody · 1 year
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I kinda want an au to exist where some Uzushio clans survive and just kinda became nomads until they hear of the 9 tails being sealed into an Uzumaki baby.
They proceeded to kick down the gate and an old uzumaki woman who still has red hair and is double the 3rds age just strong arms him into letting them make Lil’ Uzushio. They take the “new” Uchiha spot so the Uchiha keep their old land.
Lil’ Uzushio is functionally a village in a village and Naruto grows up around people who love their little price. Kakashi is also dragged into little Uzushio. He cannot escape, they all know Kushina and Minato loved him like a son. Now he has no choice.
Downside, Naruto is raised fully Uzumaki. By his mother’s childhood friends and family.
He’s like Kushina… but so much worse. He’s a chakra monster with his father’s charisma and god dammit does he use it like a weapon
Good God, if the Uzushio ppl turned up at the gates of konoha, demanding to see the Jinchuriki, it would probably start a war. Danzo would not let that shit go, he would reignite the genocide. And like the only way to justify what the 3rd hokage did with naruto is to say that no clan should hold heavy influence over the Jinchuriki and even then what he did was so fucked. Also the villagers didn't trust kushina and she just like moved in from out of town and mostly grew up in konoha. They would never ever let a foreign power raise naruto, not even within the confines of the village. Konoha would be filled with anti-Uzushio propaganda, compounding the hatred toward lil bby uzumaki.
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nebuvoid · 1 year
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👋👋👋
heyyyyy so like is anyone awake and available for some brainstorming for my canon divergence sns fic rn lol. i got hit with plot bunnies late last night and have this bit
like yeah somehow it didnt occur to me until last night that they could meet by chance. even though ive had this slow cooking for weeks lol
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obviously its a draft its raw its not cooked yet. but anyway what do you think naruto would do here in the long run? would he insist they travel together? try to run from jiraiya and join sasuke?
what i can say for now is that by then sasuke is already at least 1-4 months into traveling with oc and oc acts as his positive adult presence so sasuke is a little less whatever-youd-call-his-state-of-mind-post-vote1.
im also thinking that oc knows enough from sasuke, and yknow from her own life experiences and her background, that she knows that konoha isnt nearly as pristine as it likes to depict itself. shes also a kekkei genkai haver so you know. and oc will try to convey that to naruto because she knows hes important to sasuke, which of course jiraiya wont like (shame such a hottie is spouting anti village propaganda etc)
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captnjacksparrow · 2 years
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When I say "Sasuke was right", I don’t wanna say "Sasuke should have killed everyone and burned Konoha with his Amaterasu." What I wanna say is "It was legitimate for Sasuke to hate Konoha’s gouvernement."
And it’s the same thing when I say "I’m an anti-Konoha", I don’t wanna say "Konoha’s habitants should have died". What I wanna say is "Konoha, and shinobi system in general are full of failures. This system should be changed"
So???
What's your point now???
Should I be a telepathic person to know what you think inside your mind is not what you say outloud???
Do one thing.
Paste all these lines in your blog description so that it's transparent for everyone as to what you mean vs what you say. Just like how I did in my blog description.
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What I wanna say is "It was legitimate for Sasuke to hate Konoha’s government."
But whatever you say is only half of Sasuke's Characterization though. Did you forget it conveniently or Did you cleverly bury it somewhere hoping that no one would read the Manga to find out the truth?
He hated Konoha. Agreed. I never denied it.
But he also verified his resolve to destroy Konoha over and over before he was about to actually going ahead with that plan.
I never saw Nagato verified his resolve.
I never saw Madara did it either despite he was the one who helped create it.
I never saw Obito did it as well, despite he wanted to become an Hokage of that said Village.
But only Sasuke.
He also came to term with his hateful feelings for Konoha, the moment he said this.
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This.
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And This.
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His only concern was to not let Itachi who fought for that place to be drenched with Darkness anymore. Which is in and of itself is a big proof that he didn't hate that place anymore.
But Somehow, you guys just bury this huuuge pumpkin inside your Salad and keep on saying, "This Salad doesn't have a trace of Pumpkin".
You are acting just like SS and NH peeps who take what's convenient for them and spin theories out of a Single Panel.
What I wanna say is "Konoha, and shinobi system in general are full of failures. This system should be changed"
And What do you propose on your Sasuke-kun's behalf to change the System??? I want to know your learned opinion.
Oh Wait!!! Never Mind.
I know what you'll say.
You'll bring some Utopian Idealistic Manifesto which says, "Everyone should stop being a Shinobi and go to school, learn STEM or Arts, wear spectacles and be happy".
Or you'll say, "Leave it to Sasuke-kun, he will take care of everything".
Or you might bring some copy pasted Communist Propaganda which is nothing but a fictional North Korea Version 2.0.
Sorry to say, Sasuke along with Naruto changed the system for the better. Hint : Read Chapter 648, Chapter 458, Chapter 700 in this particular order. Pick up the similarities and you'll notice the Change. 
When Sasuke said he wanted to become an Hokage, he never said anything about Revealing UCM or that Utopian Agenda you guys keep saying under the name of ‘Changing the System’ or that ‘Communist Propaganda’ your sect leader spouts often. Sasuke simply said, he wanted to keep the 5 villages together with pure Hatred and in Contrast, Naruto said he wanted to go with Understanding and Love.  
Meaning, they both wanted the same result (uniting 5 villages) but had different methods. 
My point is simple. Hate Konoha all you want. I don’t care. But why are you claiming that Sasuke still (after chapter 627) hated that place when in canon it’s totally opposite? Why are you saying that he didn’t change the system when in reality, he did already?  
Not Sorry, but I like and accept Sasuke as a Whole (from Chapter 3 to Chapter 700)... Not the bits and piece, bastardized version of Sasuke you guys use to project yourself. 
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maoam · 1 year
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politics anon again - im not interested in anything specific I just read a few antinaruto posts about it and I like ur analysis so was wondering ur take
Maybe I'll write something about it. I agree with anti-naruto takes on Tobirama and Konoha for example but I don't agree that Kishi wrote Naruto as a propaganda piece.
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revolutionarysasuke · 2 years
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the village elders have absolutely nothing to worry about. even when their lives have no inherent value and they just sit acting all high and mighty, the villagers would always protect them, even if it meant losing their lives.
the elders are the core problem, taking the most problematic decisions in the name of the "will of fire", and the rest of the village accepts it when the decision's face is the hokage. they hide in the hokage's shadow, and have assured protection when they do not deserve it.
in the entire series, only sasuke was able to understand the cause of everything wrong that happened in konoha and no one agreed upon that fact. instead, sasuke was said to have been blinded by the 'curse of hatred' when it was everyone else blindly protecting the hokage and the elders without thinking twice about the situation they created for people. 
and this is what the will of fire is. putting faith upon the untrustworthy leaders and their shadow without knowing their true intentions or even considering the shit they caused.
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Kishimoto’s framing
Kishimoto always tries to frame Konoha and its members in a sympathetic light no matter what. 
*Atrocities happen often. Tsunade towards Pain: “The great nations have suffered, too. I’ve had enough of your accusations!” Yeah, well maybe the three great nations of Stone, Sand and Leaf / Fire at least shouldn’t have used the Rain country as battleground. Konoha even started that war where you lost your younger brother and lover. In the end you came back to be Hokage, didn’t reform anything and only gave that shit response to Pain (Pain: “[...] You think you’re the only ones who matter.[...]”) Cry me a river.*
Example - The murder of Pain’s / Nagato’s parents
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Situation: A civilian family is cowering in a corner of their own home in fear of the Konoha ninjas who invaded their country and took over their city. Two Konoha ninjas just broke into their home looking for food to steal because they’re starving. *Looks like they didn’t bring enough provisions for a siege.* They plan to look around for more food after eating the canned food they found. 
The father apparently thinks that the best possible option is to get out and away from the ninjas before they are found. Nagato is scared, but his father tells him not to worry and try not to make any noise. They’re in the process of sneaking out when Nagato accidentally breaks a vase.
Pro Konoha/”Will of Fire” framing: Two Konoha ninjas are hungry. They haven’t eaten for three days. One of them even thinks it has been four days. That’s a further emphasis on how incredibly hungry they are. *Don’t you feel sorry for them?*
The family uses a perceived opportunity to get away from the Konoha ninjas. They sneak towards their door, but Nagato failed to be careful and broke a vase even though his father told him to try not to make any noise. *It’s Nagato’s fault that they got caught or maybe all three of them are at fault. Why couldn’t Nagato be more careful and follow his father’s guideline? Maybe they should have cut his hair appropriately. How can he see properly with the bangs in his eyes?*
Me: Am I supposed to feel sorry for the Konoha ninjas? Well, I don’t. They’re adult soldiers who commit war crimes. They got hungry in the process. Cry me a river.
Why did Kishimoto use that way to make the Konoha ninjas notice them? Why did he choose Nagato to screw up their escape and just after his father tells him to try not to do exactly what he ends up doing? Why did he give Nagato that nonsensical hairstyle? It makes it seem on the surface that being caught is their own fault. This looks like it’s the victims responsibility to react to the situation in a careful and wise way. It takes part of the negative focus away from the perpetrators by indirectly blaming the victims.
To be fair: The family is clearly shown as victims. They’re afraid and don’t want a confrontation. They were ready to abandon their house, their food and their belongings in order to get away from the Konoha ninjas. 
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Situation: The Konoha ninjas hear the noice and notice the family, which they immediately consider to be enemy ninjas. Probably because they’re being on edge since they’re on enemy territory that they just took over and also from all the recent and long-lasting fighting. They confront the family with drawn kunais (weapons) and question who they are. The father is desperate and charges at one of them barehanded. One of the ninjas falsely confirms out loud that they are enemies (ninja enemies) because the father charges at them. The father uses his right hand to grab the ninjas left wrist so that he doesn’t get stabbed by him. He stalls the ninja and tells his wife and son to flee. 
The mother tries to get her son to safety and protects him from being stabbed by the other ninja using her body as a shield. She tells him to run and dies. The father is enraged. *Can you blame him?* Then he’s murdered.
The Konoha ninjas realize that the survivor is a kid and that they aren’t ninjas. One of them panics about what to do about this and questions how this could have happened. They’re surprised that they mistook the civilian family for enemies.
Pro Konoha/”Will of Fire” framing: The Konoha ninjas are alerted to their presence because Nagato wasn’t careful. The family sneaked around. That’s even generally seen as suspicious. They don’t say that they’re civilians and they don't say anything at all towards the ninjas for the matter. The father charges at the Konoha ninjas first.
The ninjas misunderstood the situation. They thought that the family is a group of enemy ninjas. They're taken aback and disconcerted and one of them even panics apparently troubled. They had clearly no intention to kill civilians. It's terrible that it happened. How unfortunate. *Poor Nagato and those poor Konoha ninjas. They all now have to live with trauma.*
Me: *Who could possibly be there? Maybe the owners of the house? But no! They assume that all the civilians already fled their homes.* Why is the family drawn to look like they stand in the dark? Notice how the family is at the exact same spot when they sneak out and the light from presumably the kitchen illuminates them. The shadows of the ninjas shouldn’t be that big. The ninjas should be able to see them. They are clearly sparsely clothed, barehanded and don’t have a headband. The father only holds the ninja off. He doesn’t really attack them. 
The mother and son are clearly fleeing. The father even loudly tells them to. The other ninja immediatly goes after them right at Nagato. *How the hell am I supposed to believe that trained ninjas of all people don’t recognize that they’re civilians and one of them even a child?* The mother apparently doesn’t even defend herself. Her right upper arm looks like it’s hanging and she falls to the ground in the next panel. 
She clearly stands in the light, but falls down dead in darkness. How the mother is murdered is barely shown. There's her back and then she falls to the ground still with her back shown to us. The father is murdered off-panel after his face is shown in rage. What a way to obscure their murder at the hands of the Konoha ninja. Sure, the readers know it happened, but there’s a sense of detachment the way it's represented and as such we're to an extent disconnected from them and their experience.
All the while there are three panels dedicated to show the readers that the Konoha ninjas are surprised and one of them even troubled that they apparently murdered civilians of the village they just took over instead of enemy ninjas. The framing suggests to be sympathetic towards the perpetrators. Am I supposed to feel sorry for them that they now have to live with the knowledge that they murdered innocent civilians in their own home in front of their child? Well, I don't. Cry me a river.
To be fair: The Konoha ninjas are clearly shown as the ones in the wrong.
I left out a panel where Nagato is the sole focus. (He does nothing else than what he does in his last panel.)
Conclusion
The Konoha ninjas are shown to be the ones in the wrong, but the framing relieves them from some of the blame placing it instead on the victims or making it look like an unfortunate accident while also showing the Konoha ninjas in a light that apparently is supposed to get the readers to sympathize with them.
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aangopologist · 4 years
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Just read a dude saying Konoha isn't military dictatorship but "an extended family that emphasizes combat and loyalty" Damm, you all really up Uncle Sam's dick, huh
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The great thing about stanning Sasuke is that no one can accuse you of propping up an emo white boy. What they can accuse you of is propping up an emo Japanese boy who is a survivor of genocide and massacre of his entire clan who just discovered a conspiracy plan that pinned most of the blame onto his brainwashed brother and is pissed as fuck and we’re all there with him “DESTROY THE VILLAGE!!”
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sagemoderocklee · 6 years
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like tbh if you vehemently hate uchiha sasuke that means youre either a cop or a nark so i don’t trust you
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yugiohz · 3 years
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Ooooo what are your issues w fma I've heard nothing but praise
you only hear people praise arakawa cuz most people are lucky they don’t belong to an ethnic minority that gets persecuted lmao 😭
I vented a bit in this post back when I watched it but yeah basically how arakawa handled the ishvalan genocide wasn’t don’t well to put it mildly. fma’s strengths are its premise and characterization (which I love a lot), but the actual conflict is handled horribly if you ask me. as I say in my post there was NO need to twist history (massacre/oppression of indigenous peoples (ainu?) by the Japanese) into some sob story where the focus is on roy and co’s white guilt tears while the brown man seeking revenge is a terrorist for most of the series like 😐 luckily scar becomes a ‘good person’ in the end but it’s the same shit as sasuke, WHY did the genocide survivor have to change his ways 🧍🏻‍♀️
these mangaka barely stray away from anti-indigenous propaganda, it’s frustrating but not surprising there’s countless stories about poc becoming terrorists because some white meow meows killed their people enough 🗣🗣🗣
and all offense but I don’t like Roy at all and didn’t give a fuck about hughes’ death lmao they’re war criminals idk why ppl hype hughes up like that he’s just another white bootlicker 😭 no difference between them and the konoha elders/snk protagonists but most people only point at snk which tells me people won’t care if no one points it out 💀
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