bi-ship

[bi-ship]

Lumity - you're glad you finally got canon healthy wlw couple in a kids’ show and became obsessed with it. Also you like highschool romance trope and probably is taken.

Lunter - you think Lumity and Huntlow were written bad. "Highschool romance" is never your otp. You prefer classic (in any way). You're probably on aro spec or believe in soulmates. You and your crush always tease each other. You're good at keeping secrets.

Huntlow - you enjoy Amity's redemtion arc and Willow's development. And Hunter is your favourite chatacter. You probably don't have a partner, but very much want to.

wow, i feel very called out, especially with the arospec & intimacy aspects of the lunter reading!

What you favourite toh ship says about you

No judgement, just my opinion based on how shippers act and how I would feel if I were them. Pls let me know if I have forgotten something!

Lumity - you're glad you finaly got canon healthy wlw couple in a kid show and became obsessed with it. Also you like highschool romance trope and probably is taken.

Boschlow - you miss s1 Lumity potential and hate the way it was done in s2. Also you want Boscha to be your gf.

Boschamity - you miss s1 Amity and hate the way she was was done in s2. You believe deep inside Boscha is a good person, who has the same trauma as Amity and she could become better too if there was anyone for her. It's very likely that you're a bitch and used to have bitch friends who left you for some reason, but I can't judge you for it, cause I ship it too.

Willuz - you think Amity's arc was rushed. You feel bad for Willow, cause she was "separated" from Luz and Amity in s2 and think she became an ooc in s2 and miss Willow from s1.

Lunter - you think Lumity and Huntlow were written bad. "Highschool romance" is never your otp. You prefer classic (in any way). You're probably on aro spec or believe in soulmates. You and your crush always tease each other. You're good at keeping secrets.

Goldric - it started as a joke, but you don't think it's a joke anymore. When Huntlow appeared you realized you went too far to change anything. Also you just want to have more mlm couples in media.

Huntmira - it started as a respond to goldric shippers, but then you realized it actually has a great potential and their dynamic would be amazing.

Gunter - I haven't seen you, but I really hope you just want all good things for both of them and also think Gus is criminally overlooked.

Raeda - you're bigger than ship wars. Love between teens is overrated and love between adults is underrated. You love suffering and wanna be both Raine and Eda.

Gustholomule - you think it's extremely unfair that Gus doesn't have a partner.

Skasha - you love Boscha and want all the best for her, but you're fine with her being an antagonist and Amity being happy with Luz.

Skamity - for some reason you dislike Lumity, but want Amity to be a good guy and want her to be in healthy and equal relationship with someone who's like Luz. You probably don't really like Amity, but still want good things for her.

Odalador - you want Blight family to be actually good, happy and health family and I can't blame you for it. Also you wanna know more about Alador, Darius and Odalia's friendship in the past. You also think deep inside Odalia isn't as bad or at least want her to have at least some good traits.

Dalador - you really hate Odalia and want Alador and kids to be happy, but not with her. You also think Odalia was a third wheel in their friendship and, again, you hate her in all possible ways

Odarius - Im not sure if you're exist, but if you do, you just find them both hot and want them to fuck. If you also ship them with Alador as a poly ship, then you want them not only to fuck, but also to have some romantic stuff together. But if you're a straight girl, then you're probably just wanna Odalia in this ship.

Daraine - you think Darius as bi and you probably ship Daraeda too. Also you think Darius is underrated.

Amillow - Willow is your favourite character and you hate the way she doesn’t get enought screen time. You also think Amity's redemtion arc was rushed. You probably also had a close friend, who left you and you still miss them and wanna bring them back even tho they hurted you. You also probably still believe in aroace lesbian Willow.

Veenter - you don't exist, but you wanna rewrite toh cuz you see too much of wasted potential in it. Also you have a lot of headcanons about Vee and want her to have an actual role.

Huntlow - you enjoy Amity's redemtion arc and Willow's development. And Hunter is your favourite chatacter. You probably don't have a partner, but very want to.

Guslow - you believe that friends are always more important than a partner. You truly believe in friends-to-lovers and probably don't really believe in m/f friendship.

Amiter - you really love Wittebane and Blight lores and hate how they were revealed. Also you love forbidden love trope.

Veesha - you want everyone to have a partner. You probably also used to ship Tom x Janna and just love "Mysterious demon x a Human who like mystery and demons" trope and want Masha to be inckuded in a Hexsquad. Also you wanna know more about Masha and adore Moringmark's comics.

Veelow - you don't like Huntlow and think Willow should get a gf instead. You also can see this fragile simality between Willow and Vee, but can't explain it.

Bris - you love Bria and wish she ever appeared again

Brisha - you love both Boscha and Bria and think antagonists are more interesting than protagonists

#lumity #lunter #huntlow #i find the mention of amiter + potentially guslow/gunter a bit 🤨 if they’re not all platonic but anyway

[bi-ship]

Notice how gustholomule parallels lumity, a sibling-coded ship. Has a really sibling-coded moment (the scene where gus and matt slap each other). Also, in the finale Matt stands next to Gus's dad. And people STILL ship them smh theyre so obviously siblings.... (/j)

Exactly!

We've talked about how Luz and Amity are sibling coded here, and the fact that Gus and Matt paralell them is almost too hard to ignore. I mean, just look at these screenshots:

I mean, this is an undeniable sibling dynamic that they've set up. Sibling 👏 engery 👏

You can't convince me that Matt doesn't see Perry as a dad.. i mean..

Look at them! Father-son energy for real.

#PERFECT #SCREAMING #‘sibling-coding’ in this fandom is when two characters have a banter once or twice #the perry porter point making the camila/adoptions argument look ridiculous has me dead i’m crying omg #lumity #gustholomule #shipcourse #shipping discourse

[bi-ship]

Okay but, even though I dislike TTT for making the characters sit on their asses for months for no reason [like seriously, Im not sure why they're wasting time building a door without titan blood. Luz and Hunter both know a door will not work without titan blood.] It's the most entertaining episode of the season for me. When I first watched this episode I wasn't bored like i was with the other two episodes.

It's not just because of the Lunter bonding and Lunter hints - it's that they wrote the episode in such a way where it looks like Hunter is homewrecking Luz's and Amity's relationship. If you were to insert yourself into Amity's POV it looks like Hunter has a thing for Luz. And that is soooo funny to me.

like seriously,

Luz and Amity have been clinging to each other since they came to the human realm. The only time she isnt with Luz is when Luz is at school and this specific day TTT takes place on. This is one of the rare moments Amity isn't with Luz and she's going to be busy for many hours trying to figure out the mystery behind the rebus.

Amity inspires the others to venture into the human realm with her so they can figure out the mystery behind the rebus. Everyone is ready to go into town but Hunter needs to change his outfit because Amity thinks its cringe. So Hunter is like, okay, ill change and catch the next bus into town.

And then he never shows up

So it's like, hmmm, I wonder where Hunter could be on a day Amity isn't clinging to Luz and is going to be in town for many hours...

AND THEN - the next time anyone else sees him, he comes through the door with Luz lying about where they've been and what they've been doing. It's an obvious lie but no one questions it.

At the faire Amity tells everyone - including Hunter - that she wants to surprise Luz with the rebus after the carriage ride. However, after the "Wittebane Backstory" carriage ride is over Hunter and Luz completely disappear. Amity literally takes her eyes off of them for a moment and they vanish.

Then Gus says THIS as a response to Amity's worry: "Calm down. They probably just went to buy some more cars."

His dialogue here never fails to make me laugh because it sounds like Gus is covering for his bro 😭 and it's even funnier when you realize Gus just retold Hunters lie lksjdsldf

Anyways, right after Gus tells her to calm down, Amity notices the rebus is missing... She knows Luz wouldnt take it because she literally does not know it exists. HUNTER knows about the rebus though - AND he knows Amity wanted to surprise Luz with it. So its like... Why would he take it when he knows she wanted to surprise her girlfriend with it? He must have put two and two together during the carriage ride and knew the rebus was actually going to lead to titan blood [they were unsure if it was going to lead to titan blood initially].

But... that doesn't explain why he would take it... everyone was going to go get the titan blood together right after the ride. Perhaps... Hunter wanted to impress Luz by taking all the credit for uncovering the mystery behind the rebus even though he never showed up when they were looking for information about the rebus in town... That's so strange... why would he do that?

...You dont think he has a thing for Luz do you?

Let me remind you that no one else besides Luz and Hunter think Belos is still alive. Hunter didnt want anyone else to know because he doesnt want to scare them. So Hunter and Luz just VANISHING into thin air is very sus. And then the missing rebus makes their sudden disappearance even more sus because Hunter knows Amity wanted to surprise Luz with it. Also, nobody knows why Hunter stole the rebus from Amity - they NEVER get the answer to this mystery. Hunter - nor Luz - never tell them why he stole it. He never tells them he stole it because he thought Belos was alive. So, it is perfectly logical for them to assume Luz and Hunter DIDNT know Belos was alive UNTIL he intercepted them at the graveyard.

It's so fucking funny to me. It makes it extra funny because they wrote such juicy drama UNINTENTIONALLY. This is the perfect storm for Amity to know about Hunter knowing Luzs secret before she did. It also the perfect set-up for confrontation between Hunter and Amity.

#homewrecker hunter #SCREAM LMAO #this is a FTF hate post 🙅❌‼️🗣️ #lunter #lumity

[bi-ship]

You asked me to write about Lunter's parallels with Evelyn.

Let's start with just similar moments that could be noticed.

1. (photo 1,2)A parallel with Luz and Hunter running away from Belos, holding hands, and in the same series a picture with the same Caleb and Evelyn running away from Philip

2. According to 3 and 4 pictures, everything is basically clear. It's funny that this picture is literally on their background

3. 5, 6, 7 - Evelyn introduces Caleb to his palisman, luring him and Luz, who literally also introduced Hunter to the Flop. In both cases, apparently, this was the first step for Caleb/Hunter to throw Philip/Belos

4. 7-8 - Evelyn/Luz attack Philip/Belos with Light magic after he attacked Caleb/Hunter

5. Interestingly, Evelyn wears a raincoat in all the pictures, just like Luz in the episode where she and Hunter met, although she had practically not used it before

6. In a sense, both Luz and Evelyn are people (witches) who came from another world and discovered wild magic for Hunter/Caleb, helped them look at the world with different eyes, changed their worldview and even "took" them from Philip/Belos. Literally throughout the HM, Luz helps Hunter escape from Belos, opening his eyes to his personality, while on the walls in the same episode the story of Evelyn, who also runs away from Philip along with Caleb, is told.

#lunter

[bi-ship]

So what's your opinion on Huntlow? Love it, hate it? I'd love to hear a full on analysis from you.

It's show time.

SO! In order to dissect this, I'm going to ALSO be comparing it to Lunter. I'm not personally a Lunter shipper but I do think it is MUCH better than Huntlow. But first let's just go over the characters involved, starting with Willow:

Her debut in I Was A Teenage Abomination depicts her as sweet, meek, self-conscious, and protective. In this episode, we learn from Amity that she tends to go by:

Due to her supposed lack in magical expertise, she's seen as weak and not even a whole witch. But thing is, she DOESN'T lack magic. She's introduced as being this "weak, shy, bullied girl who struggles greatly with magic" and then just 30 seconds later:

It's immediately established that she's not actually "half-a-witch" and that her bullies are bullying her for no real reason other than pettiness. (Yes, Willow being skilled in plant magic is kind of a secret at the start of the series but come Wing it Like Witches, Boscha is just trying to keep Willow down, not because she finds it amusing to mock her lack of magical skill but to "put her back in her place")

While it is definitely true that Willow got called this pretty much all throughout her childhood considering;

The reason I'm bringing all this stuff up is because the "half-a-witch" is the first thing that seems to have drawn Willow to Hunter(she grabbed him from the sky for his flying skills but wanted to show him what the team is really like after hearing the half-a-witch remark from him)

The two manage to kind of bond over a shared trauma. But something feels REALLY forced about Hunter being called "half-a-witch".

Hunter, ever since he crawled out of the ground, has been surrounded by adults.

Hence why any time someone of the EC DOES insult him, it's in regards to his age.

they...aren't really creative.... It's either "brat" or "golden brat" from Kikimora.

Now I'm sure someone may be thinking "well, the scouts are pretty goofy, they might call Hunter 'half-a-witch'". To which I say; just because the scouts are older, does not mean that they would EVER have the balls to tease the Emperor's right hand man.

Why am I tearing apart this "half-a-witch" thing? Because it's one of the biggest bonding moments these two have, like it's some sort of "red string of fate" BS.

Willow has a whole arc of growth and moving past the nickname that shamefully held her down and she got all this confidence and yet in the end, when For The Future comes along, turns out-! All that confidence and growth and moving past the pain that that nickname gave her and she just lets herself succumb to all the stress that had apparently been building up(she sure as hell seemed perfectly fine in Thanks to Them). Then just has this meltdown in which HUNTER has to comfort HER!!! Right after he JUST LOST HIS BEST FRIEND!! For GOD'S SAKES GIRL!! Why in the HELL did you think showing him a picture of his DEAD friend would cheer him up after he had JUST been killed, like, TWO HOURS ago??!!!! MAKE IT MAKE SENSE!!!

Generally I think Hunter and Willow are best as friends. I like the idea of Hunter, Willow, and Gus just being a chaotic trio.

The relationship is; rushed.

I KNOW the show was cut short. But they could have introduced him as a minor reoccurring antagonist in season 1, with the charm of Separate Tides GG. Then in the mid-season 1 finale, have THAT be Hunting Palismen. Having Hunter introduced sooner in the show rectifies the issues that some people have had with his character arc as a whole like; being the writer's punching bag, and being thrust into a romantic relationship less then a day after his therapy animal/best friend is killed by his abusive uncle.

In fact it's actually kinda gross that they did that. Something really doesn't sit right with me that they wanted a "splash zone" for when Belos got splat by the Collector and Hunter was going to be covered in "belos chunks".

Then they go back and decide that they want to do the "love conquers all" trope?(the thing being 'conquered' in question being trauma) Seems like the writers just didn't know how to write a former cult member going through the internal struggles that come with deprogramming and unlearning all the harmful teachings he was taught growing up and figured they'd go with:

"suffering = 'redemption'"

even though Hunter doesn't NEED any MORE suffering, he's been suffering all his life.

And that's where Luz comes in:

She's one of the first people to actually be nice to him, despite them being on opposing sides.

I know LOTS of people point to their first interaction with the mask off as being "sibling-like"

Yeah, as a certified lil shit little sister with a stern stick-up-the-ass older brother; I see it, I'm not blind, it's there.

Does this dynamic stick? Somewhat.

But see, Luz and Hunter have the flexibility to be silly and comedic in calm moments and serious during tense moments. And conveniently, it's those serious moments where that supposed "sibling energy" completely disappears and has the room to be interpreted as something OTHER than "lil sis Luz" and "big bro hunter"

The comedic aspect of their relationship having the "#siblings" label over it all the time is an obnoxious result of the show having found family be a core aspect of its genre. Despite the fact that there's also romance all over the series, once a character duo has the label of "siblings" on them, it is then considered incestuous to ship them.

In the serious scenes between Hunter and Luz, the two protect each other and view each other as equals.

And if Any Sport In A Storm is "the Huntlow Episode" then Thanks To Them is definitely "The Lunter Episode".

(Looks like I'll have to continue this in a part 2)

#huntlow #huntlow critical #argument archive

[bi-ship]

it's funny that the voltron fandom was brought up cause arguably the ship conflict is the same in both cases klghkgsdjkdldhj just with the gay/straight aspect swapped lmao:

the ship that was always set up subtly and makes the most logical sense is swapped out for the surface-level one that would ideally appeal to mainstream watchers (i.e. those not in fandom spaces who just follow along with whatever the written script says)

I feel like I’m gonna regret making this post but I’m gonna do it anyway cause I’ve been in enough fandoms to know the toxic hole TOH fandom is about to go down….

You do not need to fight or argue with anyone, if they ship Luz with Hunter or any other characters besides Amity. Shipping is just supposed to be for funzies not a life or death situation.

A lot of people are multishippers, who probably ship Lumity too. And even if they don’t ship them, that doesn’t mean they’re homophobic. (Unless of course they say that they don’t like the ship just because it’s gay.)

Please everyone don’t make The Owl House fandom be like the Voltron fandom or the My Hero Academia fandom. If you see a ship that you don’t like, just let the person have their fun and move on. There is absolutely no reason to fight with anyone over 2D children. 

Lumity Shippers 🤝 Luz x Hunter shippers

Not fighting over their ship cause we all want Luz to be happy and loved

#lunter #lumity #voltron

[bi-ship]

Why do you not like lumity?. Explain. Give me evidence that it's bad. I want to know.

I recently reread my first lumity analysis and I realize I may not have been all that clear in my wording so I'm willing to give this a second go around. And just so ya know, you don't HAVE to dislike it because I, a random internet stranger, happens to dislike it. Enjoy what you enjoy.(though I will judge huntlow shippers /j)

ANYWAY-!

Let's start with the characters that compose the relationship:

Luz Noceda; a bi 14 y/o human afro-latina girl with ADHD, relentlessly bullied at her home in the human realm, and has a hyperfixation with The Good Witch Azura and arguably by extension-witchcraft in general.

She's fun-loving, kind, smart, and adorable. Occasionally troublesome but that's just part of being a Disney kids cartoon protagonist, as they need to learn lessons. And, of course wants everybody to get along. Due to her obsession with the Good Witch Azura, she applies it to her own life and makes it her goal to turn enemies into friends.

Amity Blight: A gay 14 y/o witch white girl bully.

btw, she became a bully of her own volition, her parents didn't tell her to bully Willow. Boscha and Skara were her lackeys. So this:

is a blatant lie made by the writers in the vain effort to try and make Amity seem not as guilty. Better to be a bystander than an active abuser after all, right?(/s) Lumity just doesn't make sense when you have Willow right. there.

Willow and Luz are both victims of bullying

So why pair up Luz with a (former) bully? Especially since Amity and Willow didn't officially reconcile on-screen. In Understanding Willow, after they leave her mind, Willow just tells her that it's "a start". Then Escaping Expulsion happens and

"Luz, Willow, and Gus are my friends-"

Since when??!!

Amity has only ever bonded with Luz.

Yet she's only gotten as far as just being on speaking terms with Willow and by extension, Gus.

So, come Labyrinth Runners, it feels weird and off that Willow and Amity are just suddenly alright with each other. And even then, the B-Plot of that episode was those two sorta kinda "working things out"(except not really). Really it was just about getting Amity to quit being so overprotective and underestimating Willow, nothing to do with their ACTUAL baggage that NEEDS unpacking. And Gus is basically nonexistent...poor Gus.

This all does NOT put Luz in the best light. It's one thing to develop a crush a former bully but to start dating that person before they've actually reconciled with the people she claims to be friends with, then Luz is just not a good friend. It makes her look inconsiderate, or at the very least, ignorant. Even though Willow's feelings had only ever been brought up ONCE and they had to go into her MIND to do so. I do believe that Gus and Willow listen to each other, but I don't think Luz listens to their feelings.

I know someone is gonna bring up Hooty's Moving Hassle and claim that "well willow didn't listen to Luz". I'm aware, except-

Willow and Gus's feelings about Luz dating Amity are basically never brought up, because if they were, I have zero doubt that Willow would be worried Amity might hurt her.

I STILL am unsure how S1 Gus would've felt about it because, despite ALSO having been bullied, I don't think he was bullied by Amity directly. However, taking Labyrinth Runners into account, knowing that him and Willow have been friends since they were little, I don't think he'd approve of another one of his friends dating someone who hurt his closest friend.

The reason I'm going on such a rant about the bullying is because Willow is the elephant in the room that just NEVER gets addressed. Understanding Willow was just the set up, NOT the pay off.

Also the "romantic" chemistry between Luz and Amity is just not there. They blush a lot at each other and that's it. That's not how you write romantic chemistry or give characters chemistry in ANY way. Yes, the dance at Grom was pretty good but that's the only example where the two actually have something.

Now THIS however:

THIS is chemistry true god damn love

I'M SORRY! I HAD TO SQUEEZE IN THE INUKAG SOMEWHERE!!!

#lumity #lumity critical #argument archive

[bi-ship]

I know this show presents Luz's and Amity's love of The Good Witch Azura series and how they see each other as the characters in the book as a good thing... But all I see is the perfect storm lol.

Cuz you got these two kids who use The Good Witch Azura books as a form of escapism from the stresses of their lives. They're way too young to know what healthy romantic relationships look like so they're going to base romantic expectations off of a childrens book. And because they see themselves as Azura and Hecate, they're going to base certain expectations from each other around these fictional characters. And since these characters are in a romantic relationship, they're going to project their relationship onto Azuras and Hecates relationship. They're going to expect their relationship to be Exactly Like Theirs.

The show tries really hard to convince me their relationship is cute and healthy, but when you factor in Luz's tendency to lie to Amity and keep secrets from her ONTOP OF Amity's insecurity with their relationship that's never properly addressed outside of Eclipse Lake and this need to be an awesome girlfriend [which means she never voices her frustrations with Luz whenever she does something that upsets her] it's like...

... You really expect me to believe this relationship actually lasted more than a year?? LOL.

#lumity #lumity critical

[bi-ship]

Okay so, I found something interesting as I was re-watching Sense and Insensitivity. Here's a link to a clip.

King: "Luzura's tears fell on the frozen prince bringing him back to life."

 👀 👀 👀

Luz is literally dressed like Azura now... and she'll most likely still wear that outfit until she defeats Belos... I also find it interesting that Luz's thing for princes is brought up outside of Season 1 episode 2. Because people think that episode is a deconstruction of romantic expectations... but... it' keeps being brought up...

Also do i like, really need to explain how this is the writers telling us what's going to happen... luz and King are literally in a writers room... I mean i dont think he'll die again, but there's gonna be a romantic moment between Luzura and a prince... please just watch the clip lol.

#lunter

[bi-ship]

Okay, NOW everything is out of my system... probably:

Amity: "But no more hiding, okay?" (Thank to Them, towards the end of the episode)

Oh, Amity... this is the third time you've been through this with Luz.... she's going to do it again by not telling you Hunter knew her secret way before you, her literal girlfriend, did. Luz will not tell her unless she's put into a situation so out of control that she has to tell her. Most of the time these situations are of her own creation.

But yeah... she's going to do it again because she has yet to receive a reaction so negative it forces her to change her mindset... Amity is still way too nice about this problem lol.

If I was Amity i wouldn't tolerate Luz's nonsense anymore. I mean, if you've told your significant other many times that you'll help them if they just tell you what's bothering them and they still choose to keep secrets from you, wouldn't you feel a certain type of way?

From her POV it makes no sense why Luz would trust Hunter over her. This kid was her enemy not too long ago... and you know, Luz and Amity are literal girlfriends. Isn't that just weird? What is it about Hunter that makes him more trustworthy?

Again, I want to bring attention back to the bathroom scene with Hunter and Luz in Thanks to Them. Throughout the series, whenever Luz has an intense emotional upset, she doesn't tell anyone about it even if they ask. She'll be vague, make something up, and/or tell them not to worry about it.

She does this with her mom even though Camila is a supportive and loving parent, she does this to Eda even though Eda established herself as a guardian who can give her great advice in the second episode of the series. I don't have any specific examples for Gus and Willow besides Thanks to Them - but yeah, she never tells them even though they are her best friends who will always have her back.

This is something that permeates all of her relationships - besides hers and Hunter's. For some reason she doesn't try blocking him out by being vague, making something up, and/or telling him not to worry when he asks her how she feels after the events of Hollow Mind.

Which is insane lol

And it's because Hunter knew her secret and chose to keep it to himself - he never ratted her out and he doesn't hate her for her mistake. That's why she trusts him so much.

Like... oh my god... Luz trusts someone who was her enemy more than her girlfriend who made it clear numerous times that she'll listen to and help Luz with her problems... or her best friends who will always have her back no matter what...

They are so crazy for this.

#lumity #lumity critical

[bi-ship]

Everyday this show brings my consciousness to a new level of insanity...

See, see the thing you have to ask yourself when looking at stories from a structural standpoint is : WHY certain things need to happen.

For example: WHY does Hunter need to be the one to know Luz helped Belos.

Here's the thing about Luz: She is not open with anyone - not even Eda or her own mother - about her emotional issues UNLESS the situation she creates from her emotional distress blows up in her face.

When Eda asked what she was getting out of helping Kikimora in Follies at the Coven Day Parade - she dodged the question by telling her she's a sucker for romantic reunions. When Eda asked her to spill what was bothering her in Reaching Out, Luz tells her something vague - she completely leaves out the part about today being the anniversary of her dads death.

I already talked about how she won't let herself be emotionally vulnerable with Amity...

So it's just like... so crazy to me that they'd do this... You have to ask yourself what the payoff is.

Because Hunter knowing Luz helped Belos was never going to cause conflict between them. Hunter was not upset when he found out the truth (he even emphasized with her in Clouds Over The Horizon) and he never ratted her out to rest of the group. It was always going to be Philip who'd do that to her. It's also just not in character for Hunter to behave like that at this point in the story.

So you're like Hmmm...

Hmm okay so where is this going then?

And then you're like OH-

OH

Hunter knowing about Belos is supposed to be the catalyst for You Know What to break up. I already talk about their relationship here and how they're stuck in a cycle. Hunter knowing Luz's secret is supposed to break it. I don't see how this wouldn't be the final nail in the coffin for them.

I just can't see Amity tolerating Luz's behavior after she kept quiet for so long AND supposedly confided in Hunter - and only Hunter. Like... how would you feel about that? That once AGAIN your girlfriend doesn't trust you despite making it clear many times that you LOVE her and WANT to help her. From Amity's POV it doesn't make sense why Luz trusts Hunter over her. It's definitely going to open a doorway to her insecurities surrounding inadequacy.

Even if Luz is honest with Amity - I just don't see how Amity can trust her once she finds out the truth. Luz has lied to her face in the past. So I honestly can't see this ending happily for them.

#lunter #lumity #lumity critical

[bi-ship]

YES, THANK YOU!! believe me, i love lumity with all my heart but this is one criticism that often bothers me because people just simply don't notice, or at least acknowledge, the issue and i thought i was the only one who did. especially since people are always putting them on a pedestal when it comes to a perfect example of healthy relationships that they can compare relationships they don't perceive as healthy to lumity as a "gotcha" ─ primarily thinking of catradora here.

Amity and Luz don't really have alot of episodes dedicated to them being a couple. But during these episodes we can see some glaring flaws:

Luz keeps secrets from her and is incapable of being honest with Amity until the situation she [Luz] created gets so out of control she has to be honest with her.

Now, Luz isn't doing this maliciously - she's doing this because she doesn't want to worry Amity. But the problem is is that Amity has insecurities surrounding being inadequate - Eclipse Lake being the most obvious example. That whole episode was dedicated to setting up their communication problem that persists throughout their relationship.

Amity was frustrated because Luz was giving her a code she couldn't decipher. This frustration opened a doorway to her insecurities surrounding inadequacy - this is why Hunter was able to manipulate her so easily.

But before i get ahead of myself let's go in episode order:

Knock, Knock, Knockin' on Hooty's door: They don't start dating until the end of the episode, so there's nothing for me to say here.

Eclipse Lake:... I think it's a really interesting choice to have the first episode dedicated to their relationship establish their miscommunication problem that continues after this episode.

Folly's at the Coven Day Parade: Luz is keeping what happened with her mother in Yesterdays Lie a secret from Amity. This demonstrates that Luz doesn't feel comfortable enough with Amity to be vulnerable with her. Even though moments earlier she was talking sweetly to Amity

... It's like... Luz is comfortable showing displays of affection with Amity, but doesn't feel comfortable being emotionally vulnerable with her. Basically, Luz is giving Amity mixed signals. This bothered Amity so badly she sought out Willow for advice. And whatever advice she gave her pushed her to seek out Luz. Which by they way, if Amity didn't talk to Willow, Luz would have been killed by Terra.

Their talk on the bridge showcases the main problem with this relationship: Amity wants to help Luz, but she can't do it if she doesn't know what's going on. Luz doesn't want to tell Amity what's wrong because she doesn't want to worry her.

I wasn't sure how to squeeze this in earlier but we need to note something: Luz put herself in a dangerous situation, which was entirely of her own creation, because she wanted to distract herself from her emotional issues.

Reaching out: Again, Amity asks Luz if she's okay, knowing that today is a special day for Luz (but she doesn't know why it's special). Luz, again, dodges the question and tells her not to worry about it - it's not even worth talking about - she really just wants to help her out. Even though Amity doesn't actually NEED her help. She's only helping her so that she doesn't have to think about what day it is - the anniversary of her father's death.

Luz doesn't tell Amity that she triggered the alarm on the abomitron. Luz in fact, just straight up lies to her face then takes her back to the ring to fight - to distract herself from her thoughts. Then Alador shows up and exposes Luz's lie.

By the way: Amity's been picking up on her emotional state throughout the episode, and everytime she asks Luz if she's okay, Luz tells her not to worry about it. Again, this shows us that while she's comfortable with giving Amity gestures of affection and sweet-talk she ISN'T comfortable being emotionally vulnerable with her. And you can tell Amity's hurt by this. So much so that she doesn't even want to run away from her father with Luz.

I also need to point out that this day was supposed to be a special day for Amity. She wanted to bring home the Bonesborough Brawl champion belt before she's forced to join a coven. She wanted to bring home this belt as a way to connect to her father - since he has won the same belt in his youth. But because of Luz's inability to be open with Amity she made a bunch of mistakes that ruined this special day for her. AND AGAIN, Luz isn't able to be vulnerable with Amity unless a situation she created get's to a point where it blows up in her face.

Luz says to Amity that "When you told me about the problem with your dad - I don't know. Maybe I was jealous or just needed a distraction. I was dumb. I'm sorry."

Despite Luz telling her all that, Amity still wants to help her pick flowers and do whatever rituals she does on the anniversary of her fathers death.

But can you imagine hearing your partner basically say they only wanted to help you with something you consider really special as a way to distract themselves from their emotional issues. Because for some reason they're too scared to be vulnerable with you? I would have ended it all lol.

Anyways, instead of getting mad, Amity is really gentle with Luz's emotional state - she even helps Luz make a little ritual for her father at the end of the episode... However, this is still a really big problem - Again, for the 4593845th time, Luz can't be emotionally vulnerable with her unless a situation she [Luz] created blows up in her face - like it did in this episode and in FATCDP.

Thanks to Them: I mean... do I really need to specify at this point? Do I need to explain how Luz keeping secrets from Amity is in character for her? And how Luz is able to display gestures of affection but cannot be emotionally vulnerable unless a situation get's so bad she has to tell her?

Okay but I just want to point out how damning this one is - because this is the longest Luz has kept secrets from her. Amity, at this point in the story has proven to Luz that she is willing to listen to her and help her. But Luz STILL doesn't want to talk to her about her emotional issues.

And I think this particular incident will be "a nail in the coffin" for them because of one key difference: Hunter knew about Luz helping Belos. From Amity's perspective it looks like she trusts Hunter more than her. There's no way this wouldn't trigger her insecurities surrounding inadequacy. Of course Amity doesn't know the circumstances in Hollow Mind --- how Luz didn't tell him her secret willingly. But because of Luz's track record of keeping secrets and lying to her face - she's going to have a hard time believing anything she says. There's no way this is going to end happily.

I just don't see how it can because this cycle is just going to repeat itself - the cycle where Amity demonstrates for the 454509th time that she's willing to help Luz if she just tells her what's going on and Luz demonstrates for the 454509th time that she's not comfortable being emotionally vulnerable with her.

#lumity #lumity critical #argument archive

[bi-ship]

Not to be mean or anything... but when I see people compare Luz to Caleb and think Evelyn and Caleb are supposed to be about Lumity I tab out immediately.

The parallels between Caleb and Luz don't work; and Lumity isn't Caleb+Evelyn because

Hunter is a clone of Caleb and is the only Grimwalker who looks the most like him. Hunter and the GG's are tied to Caleb whether or not they like it or are even aware of it. Their lives and deaths have always been determined by what Philip believes his brother should have been - a fellow witch-hunter who would never abandon him for the evil he wants to destroy.

2. Caleb is an orphan. The only remaining family member is his brother Philip. Before Hunter knew the truth of his origins he was raised to believe that his entire family was wiped out by wild magic. And that it was his "uncle" who saved him and is his only remaining family. This mirrors Caleb and Philip as orphans who were the only ones left of their family after tragedy befell them. Though the caretaker role has been reversed.

3. Caleb's entire deal is that he's fundamentally a good person who eventually forsakes his "oppressor" mindset. We can even see this quality present in all the GG's including Hunter. Every single one of them came to the realization that what they were doing was messed up and changed themselves. And that they'll always try to put a stop to Philip's plans. But yeah, the "unlearning of an oppressor mindset" doesn't work with Luz for reasons that are so obvious I'm not going to waste time writing them out.

4. Amity did not "entice Luz away" with magic and Luz did not run away to a new world because of Amity. Luz ran away to TBI specifically because she followed Owlbert through the door. And she didn't stay there for Amity. She stayed there only because she wanted to learn magic and live out some kind of grand destiny in a fantasy world. AGAIN, Luz did not run away to TBI because she wanted to start a more peaceful life with her lover - she "ran away" because she wanted to learn magic and live out some kind of grand destiny in a fantasy world. She never planned on staying on TBI for the rest of her life despite dating someone from TBI. And I honestly don't see this show ending in a situation where Camilla and Luz are going to spend the rest of their lives on TBI. The most likely outcome is that they're going to find a way to go back and forth between worlds.

Also I want to point out that unlike Philip's and Caleb's relationship, Camilla's and Luz's relationship isn't hinted at being unhealthy and eventually abusive. This is important to note because Caleb most likely "abandoned" Philip because he came to realize their relationship was poisonous. Luz didn't INTENTIONALLY "abandon" Camilla like Caleb did with Philip. Camilla is not a toxic influence over Luz's life that Luz wanted to get away from. This is why Luz "running away" and Caleb running away doesn't - the motivations are completely different.

5. Amity does not have meaningful history with the main villain like Luz, Hunter, Evelyn and Caleb do.

6. Luz lured Hunter away from Philip. I mean this literally and from a character arc standpoint. Here, let me just copy and paste what I wrote in my pinned post:

" Okay so let me explain why this drives me crazy as someone who loves storytelling. Because this parallel doesn't start when Hunter is running away with Luz in Hollow Mind and stop in the season finale. It goes deeper than that - to a character arc level - and it goes all the way back to Hunting Palismen. This episode is the start of Hunters positive change arc and "betrayal." The person to spearhead his positive change arc and "betrayal" is our favorite WILD WITCH Luz. Completely unbeknownst to Hunter, the moment he lets Luz go he is taking a stand against Belos. And he's following Calebs footsteps by choosing a wild witch over Philip. That is so romantic it's crazy to me"

Romantic undertones aside - do you know how important this is? That both Hunter and Caleb were lured away by someone who represents something they've been taught to fear? Caleb was taught that magic was evil so any practitioners of magic were agents of the devil who needed to be killed. Hunter was taught that wild magic was dangerous and that anyone who didn't want to seal their magic were criminals that needed to be killed. Do i need to say any more than that? This is also why "Amity enticed Luz with magic" doesn't work because Luz was never afraid of magic.

7. Luz introduced Flapjack to Hunter like Evelyn did with Caleb. It's unclear whether or not Flapjack was hers or she carved him for Caleb. I'm more inclined to believe the later because of how Flapjack is a cardinal - a.k.a a creature that is not a native species on TBI. Either way, the point is: without Evelyn showing him that magic isn't evil, Caleb would have never wanted Flapjack. Just like how Hunter would have never wanted Flapjack if Luz didn't show him "wild" magic wasn't dangerous.

8. Evelyn is a Clawthorn and Amity is not. Luz isn't a Clawthorn either but she's heavily associated with this family. And this family has alot of ties to the plot of TOH. Amity doesn't hold the same weight in the story like the Clawthorns do.

9. Luz is a "witch from another world".

People tend to forget what wild witches are and how magic works in universe. Wild witches are witches/demons who refuse to limit themselves to one of the nine main forms of magic.

Magic operates in two ways: either the spellcaster writes a spell in glyphs to perform it or the bile sack, which produces all the glyphs, combines them for the caster. For the former, if you know all the glyphs then you have access to all the same spells someone with a bile sack would have. However, unlike a person with a bile sack, you need to spend some time writing out combinations to figure out how to get the spell you want. This is why this parallel still works despite Luz not being an "actual" witch. Because, even without a bile sack, she still has excess to all forms of magic, just like any wild witch with a bile sack would have.

I need to point out Luz not being an "actual" witch is irrelevant. The point is that Evelyn and Luz represent something Caleb and Hunter were indoctrinated to fear. Evelyn representing magic and Luz representing WILD magic. Through Luz and Evelyn, Caleb and Hunter came to realize the thing they feared wasn't actually dangerous. And because of Luz and Evelyn, Hunter and Caleb were "lured away" from Philip so they could try and live more peaceful and fulfilling lives.

It just doesn't work with any other combo of characters besides Luz and Hunter.

#lunter #argument archive

[bi-ship]

you forgot to add how their color palettes compliment each other (yellow & purple)! i remember someone on this side of tumblr posting a screenshot of them from hollow mind with the image colors inverted but i can't for the life of myself find it now...

Okay, so this is a revision of that huge asf Lunter post i made before FTF aired:

Here's how the Luz/Caleb parallels don't work: here

So, for this one I'm going to point out all the... totally Sibling symbolism... between the two of them and specific details that tie them to Caleb/Evelyn.

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Okay so before I even begin...I just want to show you these images of Hunter's early designs:

Hunters early designs:

God... I really need to know whats in the TOH bible... He may have been conceptualized as a friend of Luzs before he became her enemy...

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Witches Before Wizards: Luz crushing on the prince character. First of all, you do know Nevareth didn't have to be a prince right? He could have literally been any other archetype. Also, Hunter is nearly identical to him character design wise, because:

He's older than her.

2. The angsty, warrior teen prince archetype

3. Has a compelling and tragic backstory.

4. Is on a quest of vengeance with Luz [after the events of Thanks to Them].

5. Had an animal sidekick.

6. Very similar shoulder armor Hunter has when he's in his GG uniform. There's no reason for him to wear gold shoulder armor so similar to the only other prince character in the show. it's also on the same shoulder Hunter wears his on.

7. Their hair length is the same and the hair on the top of their heads is slicked back [after Thanks to Them].

8. Nevareth and Hunter now have the same eye color.

9. I thought Nevareth's anime sword was just a anime reference, but we can see Hunter was initially conceptualized as a sword wielder

The curvy sword he used to have was repurposed into the dagger Philip uses to kill Caleb. You can also see this dagger in Hunters room in ASIAS and HP. And the character in the stain glass window is Hunter because they have the same profile:

10. This one is self explanatory.

I also want to show you the way their first appearances are contrasted... cuz I think it's neat

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The hints that will forever haunt me in Sense and Insensitivity:

"Luzura's tears fell on the frozen prince bringing him back to life."

So, I just wanted to highlight the dialouge here:

King: Luzura's tears fell on the frozen prince bringing him back to life? It feels a little unrealistic.

Luz: I see what you're saying, but in your version Ruler just destroys everything. I think a little romantic tension can help the scene.

2. Luz's drawing of herself kissing a prince that looks like Hunters early design in a story she wrote about her self-insert character. This is very suspicious because this episode actually does spoil some plot points that happen later in the series. The example i used in the first point foreshadowed Hunter dying and coming back to life. Im also going to include King's dialogue while this kiss is in the foreground, so you can see why this scene drives me fucking crazy

3. Look I know Huntlows are gonna chug their copium and pretend like this kiss is supposed to be between Hunter and Willow. But if they actually payed attention to this episode they'd realize that the story the lizard man is holding is about Luz's self-insert character. Here's what her self-insert character looks like BTW:

As you can clearly see, her self insert has POINTY EARS, not round ones! So this kiss is obviously supposed to be Luz and Hunter and not Willow and Hunter lol.

We ALSO know Luz has a thing for princes as this was presented in Witches Before Wizards [kind of suspicious its being brought up again... in an episode that foreshadows other events that have come to pass in the series]. So this is... obviously supposed to be Luz and not Willow.

This kiss is extra sus when you remember this card is in the episode:

This isn't Luz - it's Amity. In this episode, Luz and King are writing a story about their self-inserts. So the Prince and this girl on the heartbreak card are stand-ins for Hunter and Amity... because they are her Love Interests... Again, this episode spoils some plot points that happen later in the series... so you can see why this is something Im going to be wondering about for years to come. Why is Amity on a heartbreak card?

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"The First Day"

"And maybe [I'll] meet a hot yet vulnerable upperclassmen."

Look... this show is filled with shit that makes no sense to me in hindsight. I dont know if this dialogue was hinting at Hunter appearing at school at some point, but Im taking this line for the Lunter shippers since Hunter's the only kid in the main cast thats older than Luz. He's the only one who qualifies to be an upperclassman.

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Hunting Palismen:

Okay so before I even get to the fakeout kiss moment I want to tell you this is what Hunter looks like when he teleports back to the ship...

People say this is just him being confident... but idk man this looks more firty than confident. He also says "Hiiiiiii" in a sus manner... Later in the episode he talks to Luz in a way that sounds confident and weirdly flirty... and he never sounds like this again... I cant upload more clips and I dont really want to make separate posts just for those clips... but like, just go and watch these parts of the episode to see what i mean.

Fake Out Kiss moment:

This...

Is literally a callback to this (proof of concept video)

Despite this biphobic fanbases insistence Luz is a lesbian and think the story would somehow be "better" if she was one... she is not and she will never be one. Cry about it. Luz is also into boys - and she's into boys like Hunter - the angsty warrior princes who are older than her. So you can see why I think people who headcanon them as siblings are weird as fuck. Especially after they see this obvious fake-out kiss moment. Like seriously, people who draw them as siblings are fucking weirdos - this is something ill never EVER change my mind on lmao.

Moving on....

2. Flapjack connects Luz and Hunter the same way he connects Evelyn and Caleb:

Without Evelyn, Caleb would have never received Flapjack. If Evelyn never showed him how magic wasn't this evil and dangerous thing that should be feared and destroyed, Flapjack would have never been created. We still dont know WHO carved Flapjack. What Dana said in her post series Livestream was just her HEADCANON. This is something we'll never know most likely. As i doubt TOH is going to get a spin-off. But the point is... without Evelyn, Caleb would have never received Flapjack.

Hunter was taught to fear wild magic because it's dangerous. Wild magic is the reason why his family was wiped out. Luz's and Hunter's meeting in Hunting Palismen was integral for Hunter's growth. If Luz didn't show him wild magic wasn't dangerous, Hunter would have shunned Flapjack. Without Luz, Hunter would have never received his greatest source of emotional support. Without Flapjack, Hunter would not have gone back to save Willow and Gus from Darius. Hunter only went back to save them because he knew Willow's and Gus' palismen would get killed by Belos.

Flapjack is also the physical representation of Caleb and Evelyns love... So, now do you see why Luz giving Flapjack to Hunter is inherently a romantic gesture? Like lol...

3. Hunter could have taken the palismen from Luz

Hunter can teleport... he could have literally teleported to Luz as she was flying away on Kikimora's dragon and restrained her with ease if he really wanted to... like he did literally at the beginning of the episode. He could have also sent scouts to retrieve the palismen at the school. BUT HE DIDNT.

Hunter willingly disobeys the man who gave him everything knowing full well his physical safety could be put at risk. In Hunting Palismen and ASIAS it is implied Belos gave him his cheek scar. In the past, Hunter did something that required him to "earn" a second chance from Belos. Whatever this was we dont know - but Hunter's cheek scar is most likely something Belos gave him to teach him a "lesson".

Again, Hunter is choosing to disobey Belos - his abuser - for Luz even though he barely knows her, she's a wild witch, she's the protégé of a notorious wild witch AND he has the power to take those palismen away from her. Like... this is a big fucking deal lol. ESPECIALLY when you remember Caleb "betrayed" Philip for a witch. A witch - a.k.a a person that was considered evil and dangerous during Philips time period. Wild Witches are considered evil and dangerous in Hunter's time...

Hunter has been raised to believe wild magic wiped out his family, so him helping out a wild witch knowing his abuser could physically harm him for failing to bring him any palismen is FUCKING HUGE. This is why its weird to me when people call Hunter selfish... like the kid literally let Luz go and didnt bother to send any scouts to the school to get the palsimen... it didnt benefit him at all to show Luz this kindness.

4. Hunter tells Luz his name after she expresses disappointment in him and he protects her from Kikimora. Again, he doesnt have to protect Luz but he does... cuz hes not completely devoid of humanity.

It really is funny... like people dont realize Luz needed to be written out of ASIAS and Eclipse Lake because Hunter would have folded like an envelope the moment Luz expresses disappointment in him.

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Any Sport In a Storm:

When looking for a first and last name to call himself by, Flapjack coins in the name "Caleb". Which Hunter uses for his first name. Again, Luz is forced into a b-plot because if she was there, Hunter would have joined her side right then and there LOL.

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Hollow Mind:

We have the Grimwalker that looks the most like Caleb running away from Philip with a witch from another world... Both at the end of the episode and during the episode. You might be thinking, " but that monster wasn't Philip"... but... it doesnt matter because that is what Philip's monster form looks like...

2.) The jacket Luz wears in Hollow Mind has a big ol' "E" on it. It's a jacket that belongs to Eda... a Clawthorn... Evelyn also begins with an "E"... Golly, I wonder what the significance of an "E" on Luz's jacket could possibly mean in an episode that directly parallels Luz and Hunter with Caleb and Evelyn... It really is a mystery! [If you cant tell im being sarcastic]

Here's a picture of Luzs jacket:

Another thing... Look at whats going on here in this scene...

^ This portrait is in the the background of the above scene just so you know. And the scene with Luz, Hunter and "Philip" looks nearly identical to this painting...

3. This is the episode where we get these portraits, which by the way were not shown in this order during the episode. Someone on reddit put these images in this order. Again, TOH was made for nerds who like to look for the hidden details and find out how they fit together (me, im the nerd this show was made for.):

... The first portrait in the second row is a memory of Caleb choosing to go with Evelyn over Philip... shown to us in an episode where Hunter - the Grimwalker who looks the most like Caleb - runs away from Philip with a witch from another world... Like Hunter literally turns around to look at Philip as he's running away with Luz just like Caleb turns around to look at Philip when Evelyn is leading him away. Haunting, absolutely haunting.

4. I just want to say: in the painting where Caleb and Philip meet Evelyn for the first time, Caleb looks around Hunter's age - I'm basing this on how young Philip looks here and that he's holding the mask Caleb carved for him. Actually,, Here's the updated Hollow Mind portraits posted on TWT so you can see what Im talking about:

[link]

So, while the play in TTT and the book in Yesterday's Lie implied they met Evelyn as adults it actually looks like they met her when they were teenagers.

OH WAIT, I need to point out that they did these parallels WHILE LUZ IS DATING AMITY. This episode comes after Knock Knock Knockin on Hootys door, the episode where they officially start dating.

5. Another connection Hunter has with Caleb is that he's also a witch-hunter... His name is a short-hand for witch-hunter... Belos has been training him to be a witch-hunter because he expects every clone of his brother to be a witch-hunter... because you know... Caleb WAS a witch-hunter before he "betrayed" Philip...

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Kings Tide:

This is the first instance where we get Philip calling Hunter "Caleb".

2. Both Caleb and Hunter run away to another world with an expecting witch. Philip crosses worlds to track down both pairs.

Luz counts as an "expecting" witch because she is waiting for her palisman to hatch... Evelyn was pregnant when Caleb chose to "run away" with her

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Thanks to Them:

Okay where do I begin with this one... Let me say this again, pretty much confirm Hunter/Luz = Caleb/Evelyn AND they confirm these parallels WHILE LUZ IS STILL DATING AMITY.

First of all, they didnt need to give Hunter Calebs hairstyle. It's the same length but Hunter's is more unkept. They could have done that trope where the possessed characters hair returns to normal after they're unpossessed. Like... WHY did Hunter need to have a change in eye color and hair color if it wasnt going to go anywhere?

2. They did not need to make Luz look like Evelyn. Like... why does Evelyn have brown hair lol.

3. The framing on the carriage ride is really... interesting. First of all, they make Hunter sit next to Luz and not Willow as Masha is telling everyone The Tale of The Brothers Wittebane... a story where Caleb and Philip meet a witch from another world.... as Hunter is dressed as a human character and Luz is dressed as a witch character... and we know from Hollow Mind that Calebs and Evelyns relationship was a romantic one...

Oh right, and they only frame Luz's and Hunter's reactions to hearing Masha say how the brothers met a witch from another world name Evelyn... And Luz is the only character in the cast who fits the whole "witch from another world" theme

This is exactly how this scene happens btw

AND THEN Luzs and Hunters reactions are framed again while Masha says that maybe Philip is still chasing his brother, caught in a cycle of horror and strife...

Also in the storyboard version of this scene only Hunter and Luz have a negative facial expression.

Oh right and Flapjack is in this play... Evelyn is presenting Caleb with Flapjack, which neatly ties in with Hunting Palismen where Luz introduces Flapjack to Hunter

4. Philip calls Luz Evelyn before he tries killing Flapjack right in front of her. Then moments later, when Philip leaves Hunters body, he calls him Caleb AGAIN.

5. So, this isn't a parallel but I still want to talk about it: When Hunter asks Luz how she feels after what happened in Hollow Mind, she gives him a straight answer and even tears up in front of him. This is a big deal because when Luz has been prompted by other people, including her own girlfriend, about how she feels after a great emotional upset, she'll be vague, make something up, or tell them not to worry about it. Which is very fucking strange given what happens in FTF - where Luzs and Hunters bond is completely discarded even though TTT focuses on their relationship. Like Hunter literally asks her to help him fight Philip and he died and came back right before her eyes... but they treat each other more like strangers in FTF. Also in FTF Luz is the only one to ask Hunter if hes okay after Willow shows him the picture of Flapjack. Luz asking Hunter if hes okay comes a little to late in the episode to feel natural, but its still so fucking funny how LUZ asks Hunter if he's okay and not Willow... Like Willow deadass shows hunter a picture of his dead friend and for some reason HUNTER has to be the one to apologize to Willow when she gets upset over Hunter not responding the way she expected him to... Like my god... Anyways here are some links examining how Luz tends to keep her real feelings bottled up with other people vs Hunter.

(more in detail here. and here, aaaaand here. one more)

6. Hunter has his most vulnerable moment with Luz and not the girl he's crushing on. This writing choice makes no sense given what happens in FTF, where they focus on Hunter's relationship with Willow... but they dont actually canonize Huntlow. You... kind of have to make one character confess to the other in order for a relationship to start. Very, very strange to me... Yes even if its m/f you have to have a confession because... that's romance 101, buddy.

Again, FTF makes no sense with the context of Thanks to Them. In Thanks to Them, they focus on Luzs and Hunters relationship and bring Caleb and Evelyn to the forefront. So you think FTF and WAD are going to focus more on Hunters and Luzs relationship because theyve been established as Caleb/Evelyn.... they do not. All of Luzs scenes with Hunter could have gone to Willow in TTT considering what happens in FTF and WAD.

Like seriously, why didnt they make Huntlow canon is TTT and give all of Luzs scenes to Willow? Fanservice thats why, lol.

7. While I don't know every single detail about Hecate (the goddess) i do notice some similarities between her and Hunter. I also want to point out that the wolves on the shirt are Luz, the Hexside gang, Vee and Camila.

... People do not fucking get that this shirt didn't need to look like this... but they went out of their way to make it pretty clear this is supposed to be Luz, Camila, Vee and the Hexside gang.

The wolf with red eyes is obviously Hunter, the one behind it is Luz, the biggest one on the bottom left-hand side is Camila, the brown one is Vee, the blue one is Gus, the magenta one is Amity, and the greenish one is Willow.

But isn't it suspicious that the wolf representing Luz is right behind the one that represents Hunter...

Also just so you know, Luz's school team is called "Wolves". AND this scene at school comes BEFORE Hunter shows Gus his wolf shirt:

As of WAD this choice to color-code the wolves on Hunters shirt AND to put the wolf that's obviously Luz behind Hunter AND to call Luz's school team Wolves is going to haunt me for the rest of my life :)

8. Hunter has the same death pose as Caleb:

9. Philip : "Caleb, you would stab me in the back?"

Luz : "You did it to him first."

... Please just look at the painting of dead Caleb...

10. Flapjack only let Hunter and Luz use him. And he flies to Luz when he's mortally wounded.

11. They also made sure Luz was the one to express the most worry over Hunter drowning and not the girl he's crushing on. Luz was about to jump into the water to get Hunter if Camila wasn't faster on the response. I also need to point out Luz was the ONLY ONE who couldnt fight Hunter. She was the only one holding back. Im not counting Vee in the same group as Luz because while she didn't throw anything at him her magic absorption abilities could have damaged him. Hunter is a GRIMWALKER, Vee's attempt to such the magic out of him could have had negative consequences on him.

Sooooo.... again... Why did Thanks to Them focus on Luz's and Hunter's bond if they were going to pretend like it didnt exist in FTF and focus on Willows and Hunter's dynamic instead? So fucking weird.

The fact that they dont even show us Evelyn is very suspicious. I still do not understand why her appearance is kept in the dark. She couldnt even appear as a "ghost" in FTF. "They didn't have time" BULLSHIT - they had time, they just wasted it on FUCKING BOSCHA and school shit that exists specifically for Huntlow bait. They had the time but focused on the wrong shit because they didnt have the spine to show us Evelyns face.

Also i want to point out that Caleb's ghost is him when he was a teenager. Caleb died when he was a grown ass man and he didnt have a pony tail when he died. So like... Why does his "ghost" look like that?

12.) Evelyn was a Clawthorn

The way she is depicted in the play in TTT is heavily inspired by Eda. Her name is very similar to Eda's actual name: Edalyn (who is an actual Clawthorn by blood btw)

Luz is not a Clawthorn, but he is heavily associated with the Clawthorns - she is Eda's protégé. Also Luz does count as a witch even if she is not an "actual witch". God damn, do I really need to explain how Luz doesn't need a bile sac to be considered a witch? Im sure the people who are reading this have paid enough attention to TOH to realize Luz is considered a wild witch since she practices wild magic. She is also the ONLY CHARACTER who shares the whole "witch from another world" theme with Evelyn.

I also want to point out Hunter and Luz's costumes again: Luz is dressed as a witch while Hunter is cosplaying as a human... A witch and a human... gee that sounds familiar dont it?

I also want to point out that Willow's costume takes design cues from both of Evelyns INNACURATE and STEREOTYPICAL appearances. She has Evelyns devil tale from Jacobs book [Yesterdays Lie. Theres a picture of this depiction in the point that comes after this one] and she has the striped green tights from her depiction in Thanks to Them.

I also want to point out another thing that makes Evelyn a Clawthorn: the vial of titan blood has an owl head on it - which is another symbol that associates her with Eda. Also all the Clawthorns we've seen in the show have bird themed palismen

13.) Flapjack belonged to Caleb and not Evelyn: Flapjack was searching the house for the rebus... because that was Caleb's house... he knew Caleb hid it somewhere under the floorboards, but couldnt remember its exact location. Flapjack was with Caleb enough for people to record him of him in a "history" book:

there he is sitting on Calebs shoulder

14.) Oh right, So another obvious detail that connects Hunter to Caleb is that during the carriage ride, a piece of animation from Hollow Mind plays with Masha voicing over it. This piece of animation is the part where Belos flicks Hunters hair before he tries killing him. Masha address Hunter as Caleb during this voice over... like i have no fucking idea how yall could have missed that detail lmao.

#lunter #argument archive

[bi-ship]

I mean, to put it as simply as I possibly can - if they wanted to go the whole siblings route they... would have done it. Because of how detail-oriented this show is, the writers clearly have the capability to weave that kind of symbolism into the story...

...But they didn't.

I already talked about how detail-oriented TOH is here. And I also talk about how the Luz/Caleb parallels don't work here

So, for this one I'm going to point out all the... totally Sibling symbolism... between the two of them and specific details that tie them to Caleb/Evelyn.

Witches Before Wizards: Luz crushing on the prince character. First of all, you do know Nevareth didn't have to be a prince right? Also, Hunter, at this point in the story (Thanks to Them) is nearly identical to him, character design wise, because:

He's older than her.

2. The angsty, warrior teen prince archetype

3. Has a compelling backstory.

4. Is on a quest of vengeance with Luz,

5. Had an animal sidekick.

6. Very similar shoulder armor Hunter has when he's in his GG uniform. There's no reason for him to wear gold shoulder armor so similar to the only other prince character in the show. it's also on the same shoulder Hunter wears his on

7. Their hair length is the same and the hair on the top of their heads is slicked back

8. Missing eye. Okay so this one is a theory of mine. I think Flapjacks eye wound is foreshadowing Hunter losing his left eye - since he inherited Flapjacks eye color, he might "inherit" his eye wound. Hunter still has to give Belos a beatdown, so it's possible he's going to lose his eye in the Final Confrontation.

9. Edit: 11/20/2022: I can't fucking believe I forgot to mention this but Nevareth and Hunter now have the same eye color.

Now you might be thinking "Oh, that episode was a deconstruction of romantic expectations." and I'll say...

No.

Because first of all, this entire episode was a deconstruction of The Chosen One story archetype - which is what TOH is in it's entirety. Secondly I'm literally just pointing out Luz's taste in boys, because they keep bringing up she likes princes after this episode. They even gave her a fake-out kiss moment with Hunter in Hunting Palisman. They didn't have to do that you know... just like they never had to tie Luz and Hunter to the Caleb/Evelyn story.

Sense and Insensitivity:

"Luzura's tears fell on the frozen prince bringing him back to life."

So, I just wanted to highlight the dialouge here:

King: Luzura's tears fell on the frozen prince bringing him back to life? It feels a little unrealistic.

Luz: I see what you're saying, but in your version Ruler just destroys everything. I think a little romantic tension can help the scene.

I highlighted that part in Luz's dialogue because that's... literally what Emperor Belos tried to do - and what he's going BACK to do. While i don't think Hunter will have another near death experience - I do think Luz will. Because of the foreshadowing on the stairs in Thanks to Them:

But yeah... how can I not help but think there's gonna be some kind of romantic scene between Luz and Hunter during their Final Confrontation with Belos based on Luz's dialogue... Because the parts with Luz and King feel like the writers are dropping story spoilers.

Like... Luz is literally writing a story with "Romance, magic, and heartbreak with shimmer tears" based on her self-insert character.

Also... WHO is the girl supposed to be on the heartbreak card... that's not Luzura because Luz pulls out her self-insert character literally seconds after - and she just looks like Luz in a witches outfit. So...

2. Luz drawing of herself kissing a prince that looks like Beta Hunter in a story she wrote about her self-insert character.

Edit 10/27/2022: I forgot to point out how King's dialogue in the picture above is extremely suspicious

(/looks suspiciously at the the writing board in Sense and Insensitivity because the word "prince" comes up 4 times)

Edit on 11/14/2022: I forgot to mention Luz's line in the episode, "The First Day"

"And maybe [I'll] meet a hot yet vulnerable upperclassmen."

Amity IS NOT Luz's upperclassman, since she tells Luz exactly what she needs to do to get into her class in "Adventures in The Elements".

Hunting Palismen:

Fake Out Kiss moment:

This...

Is literally a callback to this (proof of concept video)

I mean... do I really need to explain that this isn't a sibling thing? Luz is into boys like Hunter - the angsty warrior princes who are older than her - that... is enough of an explanation for why this isn't something you do for characters who are always meant to be siblings.

Moving on....

3. Hunter is... i don't really know how to describe this - but he's associated with princess tropes. In this episode he's "the sleeping princess needing to be woken up by a kiss" and " the princess stuck in a tower guarded by an evil sorcerer"... And Luz frees him from the evil sorcerer in Hollow Mind... as if she's like his knight in shining armor...

Must i really go in depth about why these concepts are romantic... to you, the viewer who watches a Disney cartoon?

Here's his tower:

4. Thanks to Them makes a connection back to this episode by putting Flapjack in the play... an incredibly specific detail that didn't need to be here because the painting in Hollow Mind doesn't show him. The collage of paintings is further down so you can see what i'm talking about with your own two eyes.

This means Evelyn carved Flapjack for him.

The point is though, without Evelyn, Caleb would have never received Flapjack. Just like how without Luz, Hunter would have never received Flapjack.

I want to go more into this detail: This play and the vial of titans blood confirms for me that Flapjack was not hers and her palismen was an owl.

Because if you look at the vial of Titans blood in Thanks to Them, you can see it has an owl head for a plug.

And the way she is depicted in the play is heavily inspired by Eda. Her name is very similar to Eda's actual name: Edalyn (who is an actual Clawthorn by blood btw), So, for me, this is the proof I need to say her palisman was an owl, just like Eda's. And that she definitely carved Flapjack for Caleb because Clawthorns are famous for being Palismen carvers. She looks very similar to Eda so that it's undeniably clear to viewers that Evelyn was a Clawthorn:

Another reason why Flapjack is Caleb's and not Evelyns: Flapjack was searching the house for the rebus... because that was Caleb's house... he knew Caleb hid it somewhere under the floorboards. Also, Flapjack is based on an animal that's not a native species of TBI...

ANYWAYS... Now do you see why Luz giving Flapjack to Hunter is inherently a romantic gesture?

Any Sport In a Storm:

When looking for a first and last name to call himself by, Flapjack coins in the name "Caleb". Which Hunter uses for his first name.

Hollow Mind:

We have the Grimwalker that looks the most like Caleb running away from Philip with a witch from another world... Both at the end of the episode and during the episode. You might be thinking, " that monster wasn't Philip"... but... that is what he looks like as a monster...

This is the episode where we get these portraits, which by the way were not shown in this order during the episode. Someone on reddit put these images in this order. Again, TOH was made for nerds who like to look for the hidden details and find out how they fit together (me, im the nerd this show was made for.):

... The first portrait in the second row is a memory of Caleb running away from Philip with a witch from another world... shown to us in an episode where Hunter runs away from Philip with a witch from another world... Hunter by the way, is the only Grimwalker who meets a witch from another world...

I just want to say: in the painting where Caleb and Philip meet Evelyn for the first time, Caleb looks around Hunter's age - I'm basing this on how young Philip looks here and that he's holding the mask Caleb carved for him. So, while the play implied they met as adults it actually looks like they met as teens.

Also take note of the fact that Evelyn is pregnant in that painting.

OH WAIT, I need to point out that they did these parallels WHILE LUZ IS DATING AMITY. This episode comes after Knock Knock Knockin on Hootys door, the episode where they officially start dating.

[I wasn't sure where to put this point... but another connection Hunter has with Caleb is that he's also a witch-hunter... His name is a short-hand for witch-hunter... Belos has been training him to be a witch-hunter without his knowledge because he expects every clone of his brother to be a witch-hunter... because you know... Caleb WAS a witch-hunter before his "betrayal"...]

Kings Tide:

This is the first instance where we get Philip calling Hunter "Caleb".

2. Both Caleb and Hunter run away to another world with an expecting witch. Philip crosses worlds to hunt both pairs down.

Luz counts as an "expecting" witch because she is waiting for her palisman to hatch... MUST I say anything more about this one? Like... why are they doing this when Luz is dating Amity? Isn't it suspicious as fuck?

Thanks to Them:

Okay where do I begin with this one... Let me say this again, they're doing these parallels WHILE LUZ IS STILL DATING AMITY.

First of all, they didnt need to give Hunter Calebs hairstyle. It's the same length but Hunter's is more unkept. They could have done that trope where the possessed characters hair returns to normal after they're unpossessed.

2. They did not need to make Luz look like Evelyn

3. Philip calls Luz Evelyn before he tries killing Flapjack right in front of her. Then moments later, when Philip leaves Hunters body, he calls him Caleb AGAIN.

4. So, this isn't a parallel but I still want to talk about it: When Hunter asks Luz how she feels after what happened in Hollow Mind, she gives him a straight answer and even tears up in front of him. This is a big deal because when Luz has been prompted by other people, including her own girlfriend, about how she feels after a great emotional upset, she'll be vague, make something up, or tell them not to worry about it.

(more in detail here. and here, aaaaand here. one more)

5. Hunter has his most vulnerable moment with Luz and not the girl he's crushing on.

6. While I don't know every single detail about Hecate (the goddess) i do notice some similarities between her and Hunter. I also want to point out that the wolves on the shirt are Luz, the Hexside gang, Vee and Camila.

... People do not fucking get that this shirt didn't need to look like this... but they went out of their way to make it pretty clear this is supposed to be Luz, Camila, Vee and the Hexside gang.

The wolf with red eyes is obviously Hunter, the one behind it is Luz, the biggest one on the bottom left-hand side is Camila, the brown one is Vee, the blue one is Gus, the magenta one is Amity, and the greenish one is Willow.

But isn't it suspicious that the wolf representing Luz is right behind the one that represents Hunter...

7. Hunter has the same death pose as Caleb:

8. Philip : "Caleb, you would stab me in the back?"

Luz : "You did it to him first."

... Please just look at the painting of dead Caleb...

9. Flapjack only let Hunter and Luz use him. And he flies to Luz when he's badly injured.

10. They also made sure Luz was the one to express the most worry over Hunter drowning and not the girl he's crushing on. Luz was about to jump into the water to get Hunter if Camila wasn't faster on the response.

Sooooo.... do you see why none of this shit looks unintentional to me? Especially in a show like TOH, which pays attention to the details - and even goes out of it's way to add story details in the background - even though MOST people watching this show aren't going to notice them or even LOOK for them?

NOBODY thinks that's worth noting? Really? All the OTHER details matter, but not the ones that tie Hunter and Luz to Caleb and Evelyn?

OK.

I wasn't sure where to put this point but: Luz and Hunter have parallel storylines where they go through a deconstruction of the chosen one archetype. Luz believed she arrived on TBI to fulfill some kind of grand destiny while Hunter believed the Titan had big plans for him... While Hunter's isn't as indepth as Luz's, because he's not the protagonist, it's still there.

Again, it's not like Luz and Hunter are minor characters: Luz is the protagonist and Hunter is a major character (and former secondary antagonist) who has deep history with the MAIN VILLAIN. They parallel past lovers whose actions are the only reason this story exists in the first place...

But I'm sure this isn't intentional... i'm sure this isn't working up to some payoff down the line... I'm sure they put all this effort in for nothing LMAO.

#lunter #argument archive

[bi-ship]

Look my guys... there is no fucking force in this universe that will ever EEEEVER be able to convince me there wasn't a plan for a Lunter endgame. Like you CANNOT look me in the eyes and tell me the Heartbreak card with Amity on it and King's "Skip to the finale, because it is quite a payoff" playing over a literal Lunter Kiss wasn't foreshadowing. When literally everything else that was presented in SAI came true later.

"Oh, well, those hints were subversions of expectations" How the FUCK were they subversions when they're literally part of an episode that spoils future events. Like how is anyone supposed to know that these specific details were subversions of expectations but the others were not. That's because they weren't fucking subversions they were FORESHADOWING lmao.

This show clearly wanted more than 3 seasons [from a studio that usually cancels it's shows right after it's first season btw]... but here's the thing: I honestly dont think they would have done a good job if they got more seasons.

Hunter needed to be introduced in season 1 and not season 2. Antagonistic character's like Hunter need alot of time dedicated to them to make their redemption arcs work - this is even more important if you plan on pairing this character off with the protagonist. The reason why he isn't in season 1 [beyond just those two cameos], despite the show making references to him in WBW and SAI is because they had to deal with two major things in this season:

Lilith's redemption arc and Amity's redemption arc. Hunter isn't excluded because of some weird shipping reason - they wanted to focus on these two character's first and then move onto him. Which again, was a mistake and it was a mistake that came about as a result of thinking they were going to get alot of seasons.

#lunter

[bi-ship]

mannnn what really gets me about the "family" scene in TTT is how hunter clearly wants to impress luz. he wants her to respect him and to think he's cool, and not only can we see that in all the ways that luz basically refuses to do so (and how that comprises most of their banter), but also in other moments where hunter is in a vulnerable state around luz. like hollow mind for example, where after hunter hears the truth about his nature as a grimwalker, this is how he steps out:

he's completely closed off to luz: he even steps out with his fucking eyes closed, turning his back to her as soon as he's able to. like he can't even bear the fact that she's able to look at him while he's in this state.

and this happens in TTT too: when hunter brings luz to the old house to "fight off belos", he's clearly shaken and inestable and luz first tries to address it by suggesting them to wait for the group, but he insists and then ends up voicing how he hates feeling this scared, this vulnerable around luz. and this is where she takes another approach and offers the masks.

and it's just soooo cute how hard luz is thinking about this, trying to come up with anything that will make hunter feel better, and her cute expression when she sees the masks 😭 and ofc hunter's reaction is perfect too:

like this is beyond thoughtful for her to recognize this as one of hunter's insecurities and earnestly do something to make it better. and i love the subtext of the masks being representations of luz's found family from the boiling isles... aside from the moment NOT happening in the noceda household to begin with. because hunter's not a noceda babyyyyyyy and also how hunter DOESN'T get the king mask because king is luz's brother and hunter is NOT luz's brother this is amazing thank you verrrry much

what makes this moment even better is that when luz verbalizes what's clear for us now, that hunter is part of the group, that hunter is someone worth taking care of and he is loved and considered family by luz, he's still wearing the mask luz gave him.

which means he's able to fully allow himself to feel and express the emotional impact of this moment because, thanks to luz's gesture, his emotional boundaries are completely met and respected by luz. like holy FUCK they love each other SO much 😭😭😭😭

#lunter