#mk talks csi

[ilkkawhat]

9.16 Turn, Turn, Turn | 11.19 Unleashed

MK’s commentary because I just need to talk about it: I know the circumstances for Haley were different, and I think Nick has a big enough heart that he would have still reacted the way he did in Unleashed, but it’s just interesting to me, another sign of Nick’s growth in the series regarding his like, naivety and ignorance when it comes to certain things--and I say that with a huge amount of love to his character and watching how he grows out of “not getting it.”

He admits himself in Unleashed that the most he knows is LOL, LMAO, how to wink, for text, and in the way he describes old-school bullying as getting lunch money stolen or tripped in the hallway. He probably isn’t online a lot. But after Haley and seeing that downward spiral, seeing what happened to the victim in Unleashed, I think the magnitude hits him of what he didn’t quite understand the weight of before. He tells Haley to just blow it off as if it’s easy but...it’s not. It wouldn’t stop if she did that or not. We watch him even break at the end of Haley’s life, feeling that he could have done something to stop it and I bet he can’t help but think of it again in Unleashed and it’s why he pushes to make sure the people responsible are brought to justice. 

#csiedit #csi cbs #nick stokes #george eads #george eads thirst club #mk.op #mk.gifs #mk.edit #csi 9x16 #csi 11x19 #bullying cw #mk talks csi #i feel like i had to have thought about this before #or seen it addressed by somebody else but i'm blanking #and after giffing TTT yesterday I just happened to think about Unleashed today #also if tumblr would allow for 12 gif posts or if i had patience to merge gifs into rows #i have a side by side of nick's reaction to the reveal of the bullying

[bisexualstokes-archive]

@deltajackdalton and @dannilea got me thinking about nick, and his parents and siblings and how, sure, we assume that nick had a fairly pleasant childhood beyond the babysitter incident...but what if Nick sort of had, maybe not complete resentment, but just that tiny part of him that left his home, left Texas not only to get out of his family’s shadow--but away from that terrible memory?

he makes the announcement at a family dinner--and the entire family is shocked. sure, it’s natural for the stokes to branch out, but none of them ever left Texas. 

and it hits his dad particularly hard, his youngest son--who thinks he has something to prove to everyone when, unbeknownst to him, he’s already done so in dear old Cisco’s eyes--wants to leave him. leave the family. leave the state. the world has never seemed larger, never seemed more dangerous. he comes face to face with petty and hardcore criminals alike, acts as a judge, doing nothing to tip either side of the scale, ensure that everyone gets justice, and he had hoped that maybe Nick would follow suit...but he’s not, and he’s not disppointed, but he just wants to know...why?

and nick comes up with every excuse he can think of--because he doesn’t want to see his parents like this, looking at him like he’s telling them he’s going to go jump off of a cliff. he can’t tell them about the real reasons he’s leaving--maybe he even tries to make up a fake girlfriend to convince them--and an argument breaks out, the rage that nick has kept inside for years at this point is boiling to the surface, and he starts saying shit he doesn’t mean, and so does his dad

his mom tries to keep the peace but she gets caught in the crossfire--and fires back at both of them. 

nick leaves, driving the family pick-up truck that had been passed down to him, but not before mother comes to bid him goodbye (they both apologize to each other, for those words that they said, though they both know the wounds will still linger)

his dad doesn’t say a word, they exchange a firm handshake, nick looking into the fierce eyes of his father--but not faltering, not showing any weakness, because his dad is the best poker player he’s ever met and he knows that if he even blinks that his dad will know that nick is hiding something

and so nick goes to vegas, his parents still none the wiser as to the real reason nick left home, he calls, every once in a while but they can’t seem to talk like they used to. there’s still that tension in the air

and then, in may 2005, they get another call from vegas...but it’s not from nick...it’s about nick

#nick stokes #angst corner with danni and mk #(ft deltajackdalton since that's how this all started lol) #HOW LONG HAS IT BEEN?? #SINCE I'VE DONE A META LIKE THIS?! #too damn long tbh #mk talks csi #dannilea #deltajackdalton

[ilkkawhat]

My dearest angst buddy, it's been forever since we've talked so I'm sending my love and letting you know I've been fangirling over your gifs! The colors are so pretty and the images so sharp and everytime I see them I'm reminded of how much I love CSI and MacGyver. Your amazing. Love you, MK! 💜

🥺😭💜 thanks, that means a lot

#i know i keep shitting on myself but i do think my gifs have looked semi-decent lately

[ilkkawhat]

Did anyone else notice the acknowledgement to Nick’s past between the victim services advisor April Martin in the episode Death and the Maiden? How she told him to keep the other card just in case because she senses Nick’s own abuse and how hostile he is towards her for it?

oh nonny how I wish I could find the two page essay I had written to my friend back when this episode first aired, of how this episode was a perfect exploration without directly acknowledging Nick's past, of Nick's past. How he was so affected by this case but unlike 2x03 he didn't let it show--I think the 2x03 case we saw more of his emotions because it so closely paralleled his own experience that he even put himself in the damn flashback which is not something you see like, ever in that show (off topic but I hope the revival brings back those classic flashbacks)

I think April was yet another in what I feel like is a pretty sizeable pile of storylines that they probably wanted to explore a bit deeper--maybe even a full on relationship between the two of them--and hell now that I think about it, there was that bit in 12x03 where Nick had that back and forth with Doc Robbins' niece about baggage and stuff and you just know it was hinting at all of Nick's baggage--but I def think she had gotten some sort of feeling from him that made him stick out from all the other CSIs, which is why she was so willing to help and even came to him when she sensed that something wasn't right with Tommy--if any other CSI had gone into that office, would they have gotten the same treatment from her? Would they have stood up to her (fairly) cruel jabs towards the CSIs who in her eyes, treated death as a joke and victims as evidence? I feel like most others would just shrug her off but here we have Nick who's like "uhm yeah no, that's not how it is" and for once he's the one challenging that almost ignorance (similar to how his ignorance was at times, challenged, i.e a little murder) and while yeah he kinda storms off cause her words hurt him (bless his heart) and pissed him off she saw that, she saw that hostility that was obviously covering something deeper within him and extended that hand, extended her heart and I think if she reappeared in the show again, Nick would have returned the favor--maybe not full on divulging his past, maybe not directly seeking the service that she offers in the professional sense but maybe would have just...let her in a bit.

I rewatched those two scenes they had to answer this ask and another notable thing to me is that Brass was the one who led Nick to April--Brass, who has been there for all of the victimizations Nick's had to experience (and I mean...just look at Stalker. Look at how he cups his hand around Nick's neck, calming him down, comforting him with a soft smile and the assurance that "it's over") and so he obviously knows who April is, what she's capable of--and how Nick might not just need a professional consultation so to speak for a case, but a personal one too? And like yeah, he's not super reckless "i'm not afraid to die" post meat jekyll yet but I think Brass has known Nick long enough to see those cracks in him and idk man, I'm sure with just...Nick being Nick, with how he survived literally being thrown out of a window, all the gun point incidents, having been stalked, blown up, being buried alive--seeing Nick surviving all of that and still coming to the job that got him in those predicaments in the first place (well ok though, Stalker may have still happened if he wasn't a CSI since Nigel met him while installing his cable but oh god...what if the team was too late? how would that lack of personal connection to Nick affected their urgency to protect him??? What if that instance is what would pull Nick into the team? The possibilities of AUs are endless here folks)

but with all of that, there must be something else that happened to him to allow him to literally rise from a grave being like "yeah I'm fine." Something worse. Something that men in particular don't seem too eager to talk about.

Brass is a detective.

He's probably seen it all between his time in New Jersey and Vegas.

He probably saw something in Nick that he's seen before in other victims.

And not only that, he knows that like April, Nick has a big heart. A big bleeding heart even though Nick denied that April did, I think it's clear that Nick sure as hell has one and while he ends up kinda hardening up as time goes on--we still get flashes of it. we still see him admit to Doc in season 13, "sometimes this job really gets to me" and he tells Nick, "worry when it doesn't."

What if Brass felt that Nick was heading towards that direction? Season Ten Nick, while again, not as reckless as Indestructible Season Eleven Nick, was def carrying his head a little too high. Sure, he was stepping into more of a leadership role and therefore had to kinda hold back some his emotions, but seeing him work this case, seeing him say "I would have killed him too," seeing him take this case so seriously and probably in a big whole denial, "this isn't the same as what happened to me." there had to be something going on and that's why he gives him to April. To not just help the victim, but help himself before becomes too hard-boiled.

Before he stops being Nicky.

And going back to April and your original ask 😅 I could def see her being able to work with Nick a lot more than any of the "therapists" that Nick seems so against, just getting bits and pieces and running with them as much as she can. Maybe encouraging him to let her see more of the CSI side to things, and letting him see the work that she does. It wouldn't be easy, of course, I could see Nick walking away when she pushes too hard, just like Catherine did, but if he got backed too far into a corner or if she caught him on a really vulnerable night, I bet he'd crack like an oyster and just tell her everything and she would be able to help him in ways that nobody else could to that point--she could help that ghost of the nine year old boy who was too scared to do anything but sit in his room, in the dark, waiting for his mom to come home. Does she encourage him to finally tell his parents about it? Does she encourage him to tell more of the people close to him? Does she encourage him to sure, keep it to himself but to not blame himself for it? To show him that he can still trust the people he's "supposed" to trust, that the work isn't as dark and heavy as he sees it on a daily basis (which, hell, maybe they could have done the post grave danger burn out storyline george talked about wanting to do in an interview once where he couldn't' even look at spaghetti without seeing blood and bodies--god let this man just be the showrunner of his own show) and GOD! we could have just had it all. It could have been such a real, genuine relationship between two people on different sides of the same coin that tips the scales of justice--connecting over victims, and how they just want to help

#nick stokes #jim brass #april martin #mk talks csi #nick and brass #nick and april #lol just like kelly man i wanna explore this relationship more in fic #so i'm preemptively making that tag in case i ever write again #csi 10x06

[ilkkawhat]

1. What do you think is Nick’s greatest strength? 2. His weakness?

I've thought long and hard about this all day and I think to answer both, it's his empathy.

It's a strength in the way for the exact reason he points out to Grissom--you can't ignore the human element when it comes to the cases they work. It adds that extra layer of idk, not necessarily urgency but in some ways, yes. Would they have found Cassie alive in Gum Drops had Nick not been so personally driven because he was rescued so why couldn't this little girl, who's proven to be smart, to be a survivor, like him, why couldn't she live too? He gets more details talking to victims and suspects and witnesses like an emapthizing person would rather than some of the other CSIs. Look at the way he talked to Tommy in Death and the Maiden--which honestly I will forever think was the second installment in the exploration of Nick's childhood trauma trilogy with Overload, that ep, and Let's Make a Deal though they weren't like, as outright about it in DatM. Look at the way he talked to that one kid in I think a season two/three episode who had wet the bed--really any of the kids he talks to and helps, and helps him in return. The way he comforts his fellow CSIs (Sara in Empty Eyes always gets me, "she didn't have to die alone" because he damn near did back in that box and that's probably all he could think about), the way he's driven when one of them are in trouble, just...sort of the way he's kinda like, idk, the soul of the team?

Now that's not to say it's not a weakness--we watch him unravel and actually break down because he empathized too much with Haley in Turn, Turn, Turn and beats himself up cause he didn't do more for her. We watched him get close to Jason McCann only for the kid to turn on him and nearly kill him (and that's when another weakness of his shone through--his own explosions of anger) and saw him get to a point (before he knew the kid was involved, sure,) where he said: I'm not afraid to die, let's see if they are because he was just so wound up and had disregarded his own life (and really, I always felt like he already did ever since Warrick died, he grew more and more reckless which I think is another weakness of his) and it did land him in some hot water in a few season 4 episodes with warrick and sara (which built up to his "so what?" speech to grissom in 4x11) And I think that stubbornness he gets when people do prod him about his empathy, or when he feels that there is an injustice towards someone he kinda feels for (like that kid in compulsion and how he was super stubborn, and rightfully so, with how pushy Cavaliere was getting)

some other minor weaknesses would again, be that recklessness with his life esp in those later seasons where it seems like he thinks he's indestructible, his reluctance to get therapy, his reluctance to truly talk about his feelings, the occasional short fuse of his anger, his loyalty can cause a fault--oh and that's another part of the empathy, with how loyal he was to Ray and how they both fucked things up for themselves in season 11, his ignorance--which he does get better with as the series goes on

but also some more strengths of his: the loyalty esp when he was challenged by ecklie to try and throw grissom under the bus and did his best not to feed into it, his attention to detail and strong intuition, his endurance (I firmly believe nobody else would have survived grave danger), his charm--he seems to get along with pretty much everybody not to say he doesn't have a few people he has spats with, his courage in those situations which, a bit tragically, do make him a hardened individual who can get back up after getting shot at and who literally rose from a premature grave and I guess this bit lends into that empathy again, but just...his passion. the way that when he loves somebody, he is devoted (no matter what kind of love, platonic/romantic) and always seems like he will do whatever he can/needs to for those he loves

#nick stokes #mk talks csi #god i love him #lol do long answers like this count towards my 100 word count goal

[ilkkawhat]

Who do you think Nick misses most when he leaves and why? Or the people he’d miss most (and would he keep in contact with them)

Warrick - I mean, it's canon, he seems to visit Warrick's grave often although he does say that Warrick walks besides him every day, I think there's still gonna be that added layer that he'll have to drive extra longer to go visit that site although quite frankly I'm sure he'd still do it

Sara and Greg - Also canon, but Sara made it pretty clear that she'd go visit him often and it's only four hours away and I like to think they all still stay in contact on a very regular basis--I'm talking like weekly calls and many trips back and forth--maybe they even all meet halfway.

Grissom and Catherine - oh god esp catherine remember how he reacted when she told them all she was leaving!? the TEARS and of course he also got emotional when gris was leaving--he was getting so ready to cry when grissom told him "you're the best student I ever had, nick" and I honestly gotta wonder if having his work parents leave was just as hard for him as when he left his blood parents back in Texas. I know they had said somewhere that when Nick's gone in s14 he goes to a special training in Quantico with Catherine, and since he stays in contact with Sara I'm sure he stays in contact with Gris as well--and honestly it's a shame that we didn't have like, Nick driving Gris back to Vegas in Immortality--would have been great to have them kinda be awkward but also bond over Nick's new found entomology interest

Brass - I don't recall that we really got to see any reaction to Brass leaving at the end of season 14, but I bet Nick was kinda saddened that basically like, his uncle in a way wasn't the Captain to the crew and while they did have some of that tension in 14x02, otherwise, they seemed to have a really caring relationship with Brass calling him "Nicky" affectionately very often and with how he cradled the back of Nick's head in 2x19 and calmed him down with the most gentle smile I've ever seen Brass give and it's a detail that I feel goes unnoticed a lot, how Brass was literally digging him up in 5x24 and was right next to Sara and Warrick when they were gonna open the box--and was one of the first in line to check on Nick after the explosion. But even with all of that...I don't think Brass is the type to like, "keep in touch" with people that often and so anything contact would probably just be happenstance

The Lab Rats - Can't forget his fellow assclowns and other lab techs like Archie and Mandy and Bobby and everyone else who I'm sure was still floating around. I do like to think maybe he swings by the lab to check in--I'm sure he, Greg, Hodges and Henry all have a group chat going or something lol

Finn - You can tell he really struggles with leaving in the end of season 15 knowing that he wouldn't be there while she was in the hospital and I don't think he was trying to use it as an excuse to stay in the slightest. Similar to visiting Warrick's grave, I'm sure he goes to the hospital as much as he can to check in on her

(so really, tbh, I feel like Nick never actually leaves Vegas as much as it seems like because lbr he'd be visiting at least once a month)

DB and Morgan - I feel like I'm still not as well acquainted with the later seasons and am still getting a good grasp on his relationship with the later members of the team, but it's obvious he respected and admired them and I do like to think he kept in touch with them, too.

#nick stokes #mk talks csi #writing this made me think of that one meta I did where I broke down why I love Nick's relationships with like. everyone #and this is basically the cliffnotes lol #(that post was on the deleted blog RIP me)

[ilkkawhat]

Does the show ever say why Nick left TX? Like the actual reason?

I don’t think it was ever explicitly said in the show that I can remember at least, but there’s two key lines that I feel pair well with the reason he leaves in his character bio (as described in the csi: ultimate book) which is: he couldn’t shine in the shadow of his parents, no matter how impressive his achievements, so Nick decided to join the Las Vegas Department of Police.

in season one, evaluation day, he tells grissom: You know why I took this job? Honestly? I wanted to pack heat, walk under the yellow tape, be the man ... but mostly, because I want you to think I'm a good CSI.

I feel like he puts emphasis on the you, which lends to my own personal headcanon that perhaps he, similar to sara, saw grissom at some sort of guest lecture and heard/saw how renowned he was in the CSI world, and paired with wanting to prove that he’s more than just another Stokes Kid that was probably stigmatized to be like, good in the eyes of the Dallas PD, he wanted to move somewhere else, somewhere exciting to become his own person

and then in season seven, leaving las vegas, he tells grissom: I told my folks when I went to college I'd be back, you know? Go to work at the D.A.'s office with my dad. You can kinda see how that turned out.

which, well, also according to that bio, he did work in the Dallas PD and then was a level one in the Dallas Crime Lab before Vegas but I think he was just generalizing his experience to prove the point that he claimed that he’d be back with his parents and never ever leave, letting them all get engulfed in that fantasy that perhaps their final baby bird (because that bio also states he’s the youngest of seven) will stay with them in the nest--but he couldn’t. he needed to fly out, spread those wings and see the world.

and what better place to start than one of the most exciting cities?

#mk.op #nick stokes #csi meta #is this even a meta #it's not even that long #mk talks csi

[ilkkawhat]

What do you think Nick thinks about humanity?

so I think the answer changes as the series goes on.

I do think for the most part, Nick is an optimist at heart and wants to see the best in people. I said before in another post how I feel like he's a pretty personable guy, can easily get along with pretty much anybody and that's not to say of course, he doesn't have a few people he just can't like or even actively despises

and I feel like he has firm beliefs into how the world should work. Kids should not have their innocence ruined (that bit in 1x07 where he punches the doorframe saying "this kid should be out playing pop warner" came to mind), that they should be disciplined to keep from doing terrible things (his and warrick's convo at the end of fannysmackin'), his ignorance towards some of the more...out there things that he sees in vegas (the first time he and catherine are in lady heather's dungeon) but I do think that part evolves, we see him kinda challenging a suspect who was being ignorant about the whole rubber suit thing in season 15 and he seemed to really enjoy evelyn in season 8 in a real endearing way despite her literal tin foil hat--and also sage, who tells him his third eye is wide open and he has a crazy feminine energy...I feel like s1-4 nick would have written her off, "yeah right lady" but grave danger was a huge turning point in his character

and speaking of GD, I do think he likes to see the good in people as much as he can to the point where he even tried to rationalize walter gordon's actions that he kidnapped and buried nick alive to prove a point about what happened to his daughter, who he cared about more than anything in the world

but I think as he keeps working, the faith he has in humanity falters. we see just how much it hurts him when he gets too attached to an innocent teenager who loses her life due to circumstances set in motion long before she was even born--something that he beats himself up over thinking he could have stopped it, and shows how bad his job can. he becomes a bit harder, we don't see as much of that soft empathy/compassion in those later seasons. we see a guy who's not afraid to intimidate suspects. talk back to the guy shoving a shotgun in his face and even dare to raise his voice at him. the cases with kids still affects him--that moment in s13 when he tells doc "sometimes this really gets to me" and doc says "worry when it doesn't" does tell me that Nick will not easily get over that stuff, no matter how hardened he becomes, it's just that the optimistic softness we see in those earlier seasons just ends up buried under layers of trauma.

but, I think the biggest example to show the change on his view of humanity, based on what has happened to him and what he has seen in the span of the 15 years we see him as a CSI, is the difference between Overload and Let's Make a Deal:

Overload: "It's what makes a person, I guess" when Catherine apologizes, hearing about the horrors that happened to him and his explanation about why he's working so hard on this case

Let's Make a Deal: "His life was ruined a long time ago," when relating to a fellow victim who was able to do what Nick couldn't--murder his abuser which Nick does state in early season one that he "didn't know" if he'd be able to go through with a murder

it's tragic and a little horrifying, and yet, Nick still endures and still survives and still does his best to bring justice to those who suffer the absolute worst of humanity

#nick stokes #mk talks csi

[ilkkawhat]

Does Nick ever forgive Kelly or Walter?

I think he never even considered putting blame on Kelly, esp given that he even told her, "you didn't do anything to me"--though yeah, sure, I bet in the moment that he heard why this happened he'd just kinda be upset but I don't think he'd necessarily hold it against her, more so her father, and honestly, I think on one level he tries to like, rationalize as we see him even tell kelly "I guess it's just cause he loves you so much" which always makes me feel like he's trying not to dwell on it too much, trying not to point fingers because he already feels like it was his fault for being stupid and letting his guard down (which is a line that got cut from the final episode according to the draft script I have, but gives me so much validation that Nick has those thoughts too), I'm sure he watched his father explode when they heard about it all too, and I think the trauma was just so much that he's just trying to move past it (or rather, in his case, repress it cause lmao he just seems to repress everything instead of actually dealing with it, although I guess it says something that he tried to talk to kelly, just like he tried to pay his respects for clark at his funeral and I always felt like he did those things to kinda put it in his head that "ok, this is it, it's over" but oh man it's definitely not)

but I do think he doesn't necessarily forgive walter in the slightest outside of that rationalization that the man was suffering at his daughter's injustice (which, honestly, I would have loved to see the show go in a far different direction with kelly and give her more of a redemption, not just make her the criminal that she was framed to be--this could have been a good foundation for the whole corruption storyline cause I mean hell, there was the one semi-deleted scene in GD where McKeen was already trying to put Nick down by telling Ecklie to get his guys ready for a funeral instead of paying the ransom BUT ANYWAY they could have like, idk, had Nick and Kelly sort of heal together? Learn from each other?) and esp given the things he did to nick, the words that he spoke to him which seem to bother nick more than anything--watching him re-listen to the tape in daddy's little girl is literally the only part i like in that episode for that reason, because it just shows how much it got under nick's skin (and because when he's flashing back, we see the more like, subtle horrors of it all...the claustrophobia and the whimpering) and nick's seen some pretty terrible shit done to people--has had pretty terrible shit done to him but this just...this was a whole new level of bad and I don't think he could ever forgive someone for that but at the same time, I think he's also conflicted cause he never even actually saw the man (well, consciously)

(and on that topic, you should check out this amazing fic called "where the sky begins" which has nick talking to a bunch of dead people that impacted his life and oh my god, the walter stuff is just great)

#nick stokes #mk talks csi #sorry i like to see you suffer nick #nick and kelly #nick vs walter

[ilkkawhat]

Do you think Nick knows he’s cute and plays people (especially suspects) with his smile or do you think he’s a humble butter soft aw shucks boi and why?

I think for the most part he's humble about it--he's a very modest guy, I feel like while he does take a lot of pride in "being the man" as he even states that he wanted in evaluation day, when it comes to those moments about promotions, save for his adorable "WHOO!" when he got promoted to level 3--he's very like, reserved and chill about it (though I'm sure internally doing somersaults lol) and so I like to think he's the same way about his looks too. He knows he's attractive--he does lead on that one chick in the end of season six "I got a Tom Cruise thing going on" and obviously isn't afraid to flex his muscles when asked and isn't insecure enough to like, be modest about taking his shirt off in both let the seller beware and rashomama (and even walked around the lab in rashomama until he got a new shirt presumably from his locker)

and so I think he will ham it up when he feels it can be useful/just for the hell of it like when he made that tom cruise call, but for the most part is one of those guys that just smile and say "thank you ma'am" when told he's cute

#nick stokes #mk talks csi

[ilkkawhat]

Nick being the youngest in a big family makes sense for why he always has to prove himself. Hard to feel seen with so many siblings. That makes his sad past even more sad.

aww yeah! and re: his sad past, oh yeah, esp if you get to thinking about why nick may have needed a babysitter that one night. where were all of his other siblings? what was the age gap, were one of them home when it happened and just completely unaware? were all of them otherwise at friends' house or sports practice or away for school etc? (or was there some emergency cause i mean...it was last minute) the possibilities are endless and no matter what, 100% tragic

#nick stokes #the babysitter thing #mk talks csi

[ilkkawhat]

What do you think Nick thinks about love and relationships?

First and foremost, I think Nick is a bit of a hopeless romantic--not perhaps necessarily in the “love at first sight” because with relationships, he likes that slow burn which I’ll get to in a bit--but he does believe in love, believes he’ll find it someday, wants to love and be loved in return. He’s very traditional and perhaps has some closeted views at first--esp given his comments in the early seasons like in the lady heather episode with the bdsm stuff, and his romanticism showing through in rashomama, but I do think he opens more and more to different facets that he’s been uneducated on or had previous judgements of, as well as putting a lot of value in not just romantic relationships but platonic ones too, feeling that the team is his family to the point where he’s torn on moving to san diego for a great promotion because he doesn’t want to leave them

he’s loyal, almost to a fault (thinking how he blindly followed ray to LA and got into trouble because of it, how he followed up with kristy the morning after they did it, etc) and it’s interesting cause I feel like while he’s a very personable guy, and seems to show a lot of care and interest in people...he doesn’t let people in all that easy. he needs to be woo’d (though I’m sure he feels like as the man, he needs to do the wooing lol and be the gentleman his parents raised him to be), wants to get to know his partner, needs that trust to be nurtured before anything serious happens and I don’t think he’s the type to do a one night stand (again, bringing up kristy, bless his heart he called her and went to her house the next morning). When he’s in a relationship he’s in it for the long haul but I do think his partner would need to be patient with him in allowing him to open up fully to them--the true testament would be how they react to him when he’s having a bad day at work, waking up from nightmares, etc. He of course, represses and brushes things off but it’s always simmering beneath the surface and I think would catch his partner off guard until he puts down his wall entirely. 

#nick stokes #mk talks csi #i feel like this isn't as long as my usual nick thoughts but idk that's all i got? #nonny #mk talks #(tonight's just kinda falling apart sorry)

[ilkkawhat]

What do you think is Nick’s purpose as a character and what he brings to the CSI team? And why does he mesh with Greg so well?

Bear in mind I’m like, 1005% biased since Nick is my fav but I really do think he brings so much to the team, I’d argue based on his empathy and perseverance through some of the worst traumas, he’s basically the soul of the team, and an important one at that. 

And I guess this bit also goes to that first part, of what his purpose is as a character, but part of being that soul I think also includes sort of being a conduit for the viewer? Cause think of it, season 1 starts with him and Warrick in front of the case board, bright eyed and bushy tailed and we watch as Nick grows and matures throughout the series, rising up with promotions but also falling with a few failures (the whole LA arc in season 11) and while his screen time is cut pretty short in the later seasons, when he leaves at the end of season 15...the show was cancelled--and I’m not saying it’s necessarily related to George leaving in the slightest, cause I mean, he left early on in season 14 and still came back and the show didn’t kick the bucket but just in the way that the final episode of season 15, which would have been the series finale if they didn’t do Immortality, sort of acts as a bookend--Nick in front of that same case board, and also that amazing montage that no other character who left ever really got accompanied by the best thematic song you could associate with Nick Stokes, “I Lived,” AND given that Nick actually has the highest episode count of any of the characters...I really do feel like he was meant to kind of be our gateway, that we’re meant to sort of grow along with him and while he of course doesn’t show up in every episode, and while of course, there are the various leads over the years that take the forefront, there’s just something about Nick that’s always so...idk...comforting? He doesn’t take any shit, he has a lot of faults, he gets in trouble but also gets to have fun. He always has a more optimistic attitude and still smiles even fifteen years into the show, still shows cracks under a hardened exterior (looking at you, Let’s Make a Deal), and seems to get along with basically everybody on the show. Even Ecklie, who he hated at first, becomes “Conrad.” Becomes a friend. 

And so I think that’s part of why he meshes so well with Greg, too, he just has this natural connection with people (which I’ve always thought to be interesting cause I feel that even though he’s very personable...he’s not super trusting of people, but I guess that can be a thing) and I’ve always felt that Greg kinda brings out a bit of that youthful recklessness in Nick. The spontaneity. While sure, Nick goofs around a bit in season one, when he’s on a case and needs results, he has a tight leash that Greg encourages him to loosen up a little. Their chemistry really thrives a bit on their similarities to each other (in the way that they both seem to get along with most people) but also their differences (Nick’s a bit more uptight while Greg’s looser, and I feel like that starts to shift as the series goes on--that scene in rubbery homicide in the A/V lab? Felt like it was a reversal of s1 Nick/Greg to me) and I think Nick just sees a lot of potential in Greg that many didn’t seem to hold right away, given that they share a lot of scenes together in season one, that we’re led to believe Nick hangs around DNA very often (as we see him doing in season four while Grissom’s doing some quick rounds) and I know that also probably relates to George campaigning to get Eric more scenes, too (I believe Eric talks about it in the season 15 bonus feature on Nick’s exit) and he cares very deeply for Greg, even with how “annoyed” he gets at the personal space invasions and Greg’s goofing off, but I think Nick secretly thinks it’s endearing (and I mean. He invades Greg’s personal space too lmao) 

#nick stokes #nick x greg #nonny #mk talks #mk talks csi #mk.op

[ilkkawhat]

Nigel embodied similar traits to Nick’s dark side, so that’s funny you pointed it out too. His need for acceptance but distaste for humanity and what people are capable of doing to each other is reflected in Nick’s overactive emotions on the job, and the way he follows Grissom and even Warrick around like a puppy. He knows if he wasn’t attractive he would have suffered the same fate as Nigel and I hc that’s why he freaked out so much about Greg’s newsletter. Reminded him of himself

oh absolutely!!! It’s something I kinda want to hammer in during this post-stalker fic I’m writing, how nigel is basically that dark side of nick--and I have another ask about that with a longer answer lol

but yeah with the newsletter thing I think it was that he didn’t like the attention, hell he even tells greg that himself, “I don’t need the extra attention” which can we talk about that, how he says “extra attention” indicating that he probably already gets enough attention--which maybe whatever he did to get that letter of commendation was such a big deal that it did garner him a lot of attention already, even before public affairs made the letter (cause he also says that he didn’t have anything to do with that, it wasn’t an actual interview it seems, and those personal tidbits about making models is perhaps something he tried to use to connect with a victim or their family or something and of course he would get a letter of commendation for being, well, nick, because he is just that great of a guy) -- and more than that, maybe he was just upset that it was attention from the wrong people. attention from his friends who made fun of him for it (though I do think Greg didn’t do it in any sort of mean spirited jest, I think he was legit proud of Nick and wanted to share it with everyone) instead of getting attention from the people like Grissom who he seeks validation from.

I would argue that Nick is a little bit insecure about his looks (see season six’s post-trauma hair crisis) but I do get what you mean about him not being as attractive and how that probably saved him from becoming another Nigel, and also I think his saving grace is that while yeah, sure, Nick doesn’t necessarily despite humanity to the point where Nigel does and looks down on them like “ants” (which LOVED that bit of unintentional foreshadowing, honestly this whole episode parallels grave danger so nicely) but because Nick can still function ya know, as a normal human being who conforms to societal norms (though he does break his jock stereotype that I feel they make you think he is at first when really he’s a big ol’ softie and a nerd, too) but like you said, he has that strong need for acceptance which I 100% agree with cause he’s always sought it, always sought to be his own person away from the shadow of his family and if we really wanna get angsty, wants to prove to himself that he is worth it after a lifetime of wondering, why him, why his life was ruined when he was just a kid, and what kind of person that made him. Is he a person people can trust, even if he can’t trust them himself--and he does still seem to place a lot of trust in people very close to him, even if it takes a while to build (like kristy, she had to basically woo nick over half a season before he slept with her lol) so he can only hope he can be seen as trustworthy too, just as you would trust a cable guy to install your cable and not do anything freaky in the process like infiltrate your attic and your whole life too. Is he a person who can get the job done, be a CSI that Gil Grissom--one of the best, if not, the best CSI in Nick’s eyes--will think is good, will think that Nick can sort of become once he leaves (cause lbr Nick does kinda become a bit like Grissom later on, with the bugs and the more like, laid back non-paperwork dealing but still harworking in the field attitude, his little quirks that people don’t get like his love of birds and his general idk giddyness he almost seems to have later on like he really stops giving a shit and while he does turn it off when he needs to he still goofs around though never as much as he did with warrick, and even superfically...he grows a beard like grissom lmao) JUST LIKE NIGEL WANTED TO BECOME NICK!? 

#nick stokes #csi 2x19 #WHOOOOOOOO it's been a while since i've talked about csi like this #i said it yesterday i think with another ask where i just kind of went off on a rant #and honestly i know my rants are probably not even that long #but I'VE MISSED THIS SO MUCH #i saw these messages early on at work and honestly couldn't wait to get home to answer them #even spent my car ride trying to think of my responses #though i ended up thinking about work (boo) and other bad thoughts instead BUT HEY #i'm home now #not going to work tomorrow #and get to do what i love #mk talks csi #nonny #mk talks

[ilkkawhat]

Frat brother and mailbox baseball you say?? Please elaborate. Now it makes complete sense Greg goes for a man like that, oddly his cup of tea. Nick is more wild and free than I thought hehe

Yeah so the mailbox baseball was brought up (and actually played) by Nick in season 9′s Woulda, Coulda, Shoulda where he talks about being a bored teenager feeling a little destructive, and over the course of the series he does talk a few times about his college days--citing Pleding Mr. Johnson for the frat detail, he makes mention about a threeway (in season one? two? def one of the earlier seasons, he was with Sara and they were in white lab coats that’s all I remember) that kind of get retcons for a joke in season 11 (but maybe Nick was just being coy lmao), and also in season 11 makes mention of waking up on a lawn with a box of corn flakes on his head. I feel like there was more that I just can’t think of right now lol

lol I know I just went on a tangent in the last ask about how Nick’s a bit uptight but I wonder if that’s just cause he’s overcompensating for being so reckless in his youth. But we do still see a bit of that wild recklessness in canon too, his bets with Warrick, Appendicitement, playing mailbox baseball with Hodges, his glee when he gets to do fun lab experiments, his almost danger lust as he constantly involves himself in chases and shootouts even though yes, of course, season 3 Nick was hounding Sara for the same thing but I think Nick just sort of stops giving a fuck after being buried alive cause holy hell he should be dead by now so might as well just say “fuck it” and do whatever he wants

#nick stokes #nonny #mk talks #mk talks csi

[ilkkawhat]

I guess we’ll never know though. I think in an interview Tarintino said he knew the network would never go for his original take, which was the Grissom getting rescued story and it probably would have been more gorey. The writers or William/Marg I think said that Nick’s character was the only one who fit that type of submissive role and they wanted to get sympathy for his character/felt only he could get sympathy as a character from the audience in this role. Some tidbits for you today lol.

hmm that’s very interesting! I gotta say I really like, cannot see that episode without Nick in that coffin, like I feel like this situation was so unique to him but I do feel like I would have sympathized with basically anybody in that case lol. 

it’s interesting they used “submissive” to describe him, too and honestly kinda shows just how much that changed for Nick--post GD he def started lashing out more, lot more angry than scared when put in peril (think of his reaction to Who Are You vs Sheltered, though even in Stalker he was starting to show a bit of that recklessness, or how in Targets of Obsession he just straight up got pissed at being trapped and recorded)

#mk talks csi #nonny #mk talks