#ned stark critical

[fromtheboundlesssea]

Listening to AGOT and another thought—more like a grievance.

I hate that Ned didn’t send Arya back to Winterfell after the Trident incident. She was not necessary for his cover and it was likely that a bigger issue could have arisen later (although it didn’t).

I also hate that the first person to use Sansa as a pawn for their own personal gain was her own father.

#asoiaf #a game of thrones #sansa stark #ned stark critical #boundless reads

[viiisenyas]

So, I’m just going back over highlights to get some things straight. This 14 year old boy was DRUNK when he asked to join the Night’s Watch. Not only that, Benjen had the perfect opportunity to tell him exactly what had become of the Wall and who was being accepted there, but for whatever reason chose not to tell him at any given moment prior to arriving there?

And then there’s Ned’s POV. “There will be no place for him at court.”

Hey, Ned… have you ever heard of squiring? Bastards are fully capable of becoming knights, and Barristan Selmy is literally the Lord Commander of the KG. You could just ask.

Jon had options.

#until it's confirmed in plain text i do not subscribe to r+l=j #so let's just get that straight #look I know plot demanded him to go to the Wall but that whole ass arc could have went to BENJEN #what a waste of potential #when all the adults fail your blorbo #hhhhhh #jon snow #ned stark critical #a game of thrones #asoiaf #this was sitting in my drafts for over a year oops

[hchollym]

Percy Weasley & Sansa Stark Parallels

This post is going to be more for me than anything else, because I doubt many people are interested in this very specific topic, but I couldn't resist.

Percy & Sansa are two of my favorite characters in literature, and the more I started to think about it, the more I realized how much they have in common. I know that sounds strange, and don't get me wrong, there are some key differences (Sansa was definitely more of an innocent victim - the poor girl was only 11 years old), but they do actually have a lot of similarities as well!

I'm going to link some posts/metas about Percy, just in case someone wants to see extra support for my claims, because I feel like Sansa is a little bit more obvious/self-explanatory in canon.

Basics

They are both tall redheads (which doesn't mean anything, but it is a fun coincidence). 🙂

They are both unfairly hated by fandom because of the POV trap (Harry & Arya).

Personality

They are both feminine (see this post about Percy).

They both love reading, and neither of them are very athletic.

They were both naïve and trusted the wrong people because they didn't know any better. Unfortunately, they were both raised by their fathers to trust in something that wasn't trustworthy (the Ministry of Magic - see this post about Percy - & the idea that most men/knights are honorable).

They are both romantic in nature (Percy writing love letters & Sansa reading love stories). Interestingly enough, both of them are the first siblings in their families to be given a storyline that involves a romantic relationship/betrothal & yet both of their oldest brothers end up getting married first (which is not a bad thing; it's just an observation).

Family/Background

They were both the "perfect" child who had high expectations placed on them from a young age ("Sansa was a lady at three, always so courteous and eager to please."), yet they were also ignored the most because they were "easy" compared to their siblings (see this post on Percy's relationship with his mother).

This is why their acts of "rebellion" (Percy disowning his family & Sansa going to Cersei) were so unexpected. They were always so well-behaved until they finally felt pushed over the edge:

“What do we want to be prefects for?” said George, looking revolted at the very idea. “It’d take all the fun out of life.”  Ginny giggled.  “You want to set a better example for your sister!” snapped Mrs. Weasley.  “Ginny’s got other brothers to set her an example, Mother,” said Percy loftily. 

suddenly changing to:

“He went completely berserk. He said — well, he said loads of terrible stuff... And he packed his bags the same night and left. He’s living here in London now.”

&

"It was for love," Sansa said in a rush. "Father wouldn't even give me leave to say farewell." She was the good girl, the obedient girl, but she had felt as wicked as Arya that morning, sneaking away from Septa Mordane, defying her lord father..."

They were both usually the odd one out with their siblings, who all had a closer bond with each other than with Percy/Sansa. Their siblings also looked down on their interests because they couldn't relate to them:

“We’re trying to standardize cauldron thickness. Some of these foreign imports are just a shade too thin — leakages have been increasing at a rate of almost three percent a year —” “That’ll change the world, that report will,” said Ron. “Front page of the Daily Prophet, I expect, cauldron leaks.” Percy went slightly pink.

&

Sansa would have sighed and shed a tear for true love, but Arya just thought it was stupid. 

They were also the target of their siblings' pranks/mischief:

“I shudder to think what the state of my in-tray would be if I was away from work for five days.” “Yeah, someone might slip dragon dung in it again, eh, Perce?” said Fred. “That was a sample of fertilizer from Norway!” said Percy, going very red in the face. “It was nothing personal!” “It was,” Fred whispered to Harry as they got up from the table. “We sent it.”

&

"Arya started it," Sansa said quickly, anxious to have the first word. "She called me a liar and threw an orange at me and spoiled my dress, the ivory silk, the one Queen Cersei gave me when I was betrothed to Prince Joffrey."

They were both resented by their younger sibling(s), who each happen to be about 2 years younger than them (Fred and George & Arya):

"...we never had trouble like this from Bill or Charlie or Percy —” “Perfect Percy,” muttered Fred.

&

Sansa had the grace to blush. She blushed prettily. She did everything prettily, Arya thought with dull resentment.

Ironically enough, their parents usually let those siblings get away with a lot more than Percy or Sansa would have been allowed to get away with (see this post on Molly & Arthur's lack of discipline with the twins):

None of which stopped Arya, of course. One day she came back grinning her horsey grin, her hair all tangled and her clothes covered in mud, clutching a raggedy bunch of purple and green flowers for Father. Sansa kept hoping he would tell Arya to behave herself and act like the highborn lady she was supposed to be, but he never did, he only hugged her and thanked her for the flowers. That just made her worse.

Circumstances/Storylines

Their fathers failed them (though not on purpose) when they needed them most (Arthur yelled at Percy and accused him of spying instead of calmly helping Percy see that he was being used & Ned refused to explain why Sansa's betrothal was being called off). This directly led to their acts of rebellion.

As a result, they were both taken advantage of by people in power (Fudge & Cersei) and separated from their family. Initially, this is what they both thought they wanted (Percy chose to leave & Sansa wanted to remain in King's Landing with Joffrey instead of returning home), but they both ended up regretting it (after losing their innocence and naivety) and wanting their family back.

They were both young, and yet they were judged for not knowing something that even the adults didn't know (Percy didn't notice that his boss, Barty Sr., who he barely knew, was under the Imperious Curse, while Dumbledore failed to notice that his old friend was actually a Death Eater using a Polyjuice potion & Sansa thought that she could trust Cersei while Ned believed that he could trust Cersei enough to warn her to leave town without her retaliating against him).

While they were separated/alone, their mothers were really the only ones doing anything to try and get them back (Molly visited Percy & Catelyn freed Jaime).

They both had to play their part in politics under a corrupt government. They both originally wanted to be a part of that system (eventually becoming the Minister of Magic & eventually becoming the queen). They ended up realizing that the people in charge were not as noble and well-intentioned as they thought.

They learned to be more careful about who they trusted, and they adapted to survive (Percy in a Ministry controlled by Voldemort & Sansa with the threat of Cersei, Jeffrey, and Littlefinger).

They both lost a brother. 😭

He and Ron had both grabbed Hermione and pulled her to the floor, but Percy lay across Fred’s body, shielding it from further harm.

&

Robb had died at a wedding feast as well. It was Robb she wept for. 

They both reconnected/made amends with the sibling(s) that initially resented them (Sansa and Arya will meet again and work things out in the books - fight me):

“I was a fool!” Percy roared, so loudly that Lupin nearly dropped his photograph. “I was an idiot, I was a pompous prat, I was a— a— ” “Ministry-loving, family-disowning, power-hungry moron.” said Fred. Percy swallowed. “Yes, I was!” “Well, you can’t say fairer that that,” said Fred, holding out his hand to Percy.

In Conclusion

I just found it interesting that two of my favorite characters - who seem very different - have so much in common. I'm sure that says something about me! 🤣😊

#percy weasley #sansa stark #percy & sansa #percy weasley defense squad #sansa stark defence squad #character parallels #hp #asoiaf #weasley family critical #anti arthur weasley #ned stark critical #those tags are just to be safe #my thoughts #my opinion #my headcanons

[elegantwoes]

An unfriendly reminder that book Jon Snow looks like this (picture on the left) in AGOT when Ned practically exiles him to the Wall and only that (picture on the right) when he gets stabbed repeatedly and left to die in ADWD.

#asoiaf #jon snow #like using age appropiate actor really puts in perspective how fucking young Jon is #he's a fucking baby in agot #and ned does that to him #ned stark critical

[brydeswhale]

The reason that Sansa initially views the North as cold, grey, and desolate, is more to do with how her father’s trauma has influenced her entire life and her home.

We know, thanks to other Northern houses and people, that this isn’t exactly normal for Northerners any more than it is for anyone else. Especially when we’re confronted with more flamboyant houses like the Manderlys.

Ned’s failure to create a thriving arts and cultural scene has less to do with some kind of inherent lack of artistic and natural spirit and more to do with the fact that Westeros doesn’t have therapists and his failure to take personal responsibility for his own healing.

#asoiaf #sansa stark #eddard stark critical #ned stark critical

[asharaxofstarfall]

you are all so funny when you act like renly and cat are awful human beings for not wanting to raise other peoples babies. they didn't sign up for that!!

#and renly was fourteen too 😭😭 #like sorry #but that's not their problem #asoiaf #a song of ice and fire #renly baratheon #cat stark #catelyn tully #catelyn stark #ned stark critical #anti robert baratheon

[rosalinesurvived]

"Margaery is too shrewd to be caught so easily," said Lady Merryweather. "Her women are her castle walls. They sleep with her, dress her, pray with her, read with her, sew with her. When she is not hawking or riding she is playing come-into-my-castle with little Alysanne Bulwer. Whenever men are about, her septa will be with her, or her cousins.

Besides, Margaery never slept alone. Even with Ser Loras dying, there were swords about her night and day.

See, what annoys me about Ned is that throughout the entirety of AFFC we are constantly told how betrothed-to-the-King, daughter-of-a-high-lord Margaery is surrounded by people, which stops her from being in danger. This seems to be a normal thing too, everyone important in asoiaf is tailed by others.

And Sansa in AGOT? Just her septa. You're telling me that the daughter of the Warden of the North and Hand of the King, the girl betrothed to the future King is just left alone around people like Sandor Clegane? And mind you, Ned is the person who hates King's Landing, who lost most of his family. Why don't his daughters have any swordsmen around them, any other highborn Northern ladies??

#asoiaf #shitpost #sansa stark #margaery tyrell #ned stark critical #a song of ice and fire #look i understand for grrm's sake that he wanted sansa alone for some of her interactions #but was it seriously so hard to work in some others?? #i mean even at winterfell WINTERFELL the seat of the north all sansa had were jeyne and beth #and i love jeyne and beth!! i love my babies so so much but #medieval society didnt seem to be like that #asoiaf royal society isnt like that

[aemontargaryen-bloodraven]

This fandom talks a lot about Jon feeling gratitude for what Ned did for him, but what about the other side of him having been in the camp condoning his siblings' murder for the throne he won for Robert, continuing to speak in the highest of words to his sons about him as King, according to Jon's first encounter with Robert.

#Jon Snow #Canonjonsnow #ASOIAF #Ned Stark Critical

[ariamariastark1]

Can we talk about how Catelyn being a bad mother to all of her kids and not just Arya is a thing and how some of the bad things that happened were avoidable?

If she didn’t project her trauma into Sansa and Arya, their relationship would have been normal siblings and not one of Bully and Victim, delaying the first book, and if she treated Jon better, Rob would have kept his marriage agreement and wouldn’t marry the mother of his bastard!

On this note, can we also talk about how Ned Stark was a neglectful parent?

#asoiaf #arya stark #catelyn stark #jon snow #sansa stark #rob stark #bran stark #ned stark critical

[fromtheseventhhell]

I ignore about 95% of the conversations surrounding Arya having killed people because, outside of Arya stans, people refuse to include the context of the very violent circumstances she experiences + her trauma which influences her actions. She wasn't destined to be a killer and her being forced on the run, having to survive during a war (at times on her own), having to witness countless people being tortured and murdered, being enslaved as a prisoner of war, having to witness the deaths of her family, etc. are all hugely important factors. Not to mention the times when her life is literally on the line and she has to make tough decisions to ensure her survival. The only time her trauma is acknowledged is when people are using it to prove she's "too far gone", otherwise it's essays on how she hasn't suffered that much. It's so boring how people ignore well-developed characters just to reduce them to one or two aspects of their story. And this treatment is only for certain characters; let someone mention Sansa being part of the plot to poison Sweetrobin and all of a sudden, people can understand being forced to make questionable decisions under difficult circumstances.

#arya stark #asoiaf #fandom nonsense #I'm just so uninterested in the same boring repetitive conversations where people debate fanon characterizations...boring! yawning! sloppy! #Sorry?? I guess that she hasn't had the benefit of being in a castle the whole story with relative safety #but people trying to demonize a child who has one of the most harrowing and violent journeys for the decisions she's been forced to make #is ridiculous cause why are you more worried about how Arya reacted then to the actual situation she's in?? #If they're feeling especially faux-progressive they'll pretend to care about Daeron and cry about how innocent he was #but of course this never leads to criticism of Ned or Westerosi society...nope just calling Arya a psychopath and nothing else #At this point it's just jealousy because they know their fave never would've survived what she did and not only did she survive #but she showed off incredible skills and intelligence + has only learned and grown more + constantly gets her importance reinforced #yeah I'd be mad if she wasn't my fave either 🤭 #the disconnect between Arya antis and George is so funny cause they twist themselves in knots over how /evil/ she is and then there's #George calling her a character everyone will love ooooh shouldn't have picked one of the author's faves to hate on 🤷🏾‍♀️

[woorweid]

i will always feel frustrated about the ways ned and cat failed to fully show arya she was loved. she is failing femininity at winterfell and it really feels like no one but jon was stepping in and telling her that she’s ok.. that shes loved.. that there’s a kind of person she can be. and what she wants (to run and jump and fight and to not be failing all the time) is actually not so crazy???? starks live in the north, they know the lady mormonts at bear isle! and hell, other noble families seemed to have figured out raising gnc girls (brienne, asha, many others), including ned’s own sister!!! also.. cat literally grew up the way arya is needing so badly to live and cat can’t even figure out that it’s ok! that maybe someone can tell septa mordane to lay off! the feeling of rejection and inadequacy that arya carries her entire life is NOT bc of sansa, a litral child, it’s bc her parents can’t get their act together to show up for her fast enough. and it hurts her so much, she feels so bad, so guilty, so scared. jesus h christ…

#arya stark #asoiaf #she’s so important… #the starks #ned critical #lol #fry thinks

[elegantwoes]

In the pale dawn light, the young knight looked as though he were sleeping. He had not been handsome, but death had smoothed his rough-hewn features and the silent sisters had dressed him in his best velvet tunic, with a high collar to cover the ruin the lance had made of his throat. Eddard Stark looked at his face, and wondered if it had been for his sake that the boy had died. Slain by a Lannister bannerman before Ned could speak to him; could that be mere happenstance? He supposed he would never know

Perhaps I am conspiratorial by nature but I believe that Hugh was killed by command. Clegane may be a bloodthirsty and violent individual but I don't see him acting out without getting a sanction from his boss. This was under the order of someone else. I can feel it in my bones. Or maybe that is my vitamin D deficiency talking

The squires smiled nervously until the king turned on them. “You. Yes, both of you. You heard the Hand. The king is too fat for his armor. Go find Ser Aron Santagar. Tell him I need the breastplate stretcher. Now! What are you waiting for?” ... Always, though, the graver thoughts crept in. He could not help taking note of the two squires: handsome boys, fair and well made. One was Sansa’s age, with long golden curls; the other perhaps fifteen, sandy-haired, with a wisp of a mustache and the emerald-green eyes of the queen.

Look. Yet another adult who bullies children. Is it any wonder why Bob died thanks to Lancel? That is what happens when you relentlessly bully a young kid. It will bite you in the ass.

“The woman tried to forbid me to fight in the melee. She’s sulking in the castle now, damn her. Your sister would never have shamed me like that.” “You never knew Lyanna as I did, Robert,” Ned told him. “You saw her beauty, but not the iron underneath. She would have told you that you have no business in the melee.”

Now I can't help but imagine a world where Lyanna and Robert did marry. I know a certain type of fans (*coughs* dudebro asoiaf fans *coughs*) act like Robert would have treated Lyanna differently, but no. Robert would have turned any woman he was married to into a Cersei. Perhaps not to the extent that they would start an incestuous relationship with their brother and pass of their illegitimate children as legitimate (that is a Cersei thing lol) but Robert would have pushed any woman to the brink where they consider killing him so they are free from him and enjoy widowhood. And personally I would have cheered them on just like I cheered Cersei for killing him.

Ned turned back. Robert took up his horn again, filled it with beer from a barrel in the corner, and thrust it at Ned. “Drink,” he said brusquely. “I’ve no thirst—” “Drink. Your king commands it.”

This scene reminds me of another instance:

Sansa lifted the cup to her lips and took a sip. The wine was cloyingly sweet, but very strong. "You can do better than that," Cersei said. "Drain the cup, Sansa. Your queen commands you."

Like father like daughter (ﾉ◕ヮ◕)ﾉ*:･ﾟ✧

“Let me tell you a secret, Ned. More than once, I have dreamed of giving up the crown. Take ship for the Free Cities with my horse and my hammer, spend my time warring and whoring, that’s what I was made for. The sellsword king, how the singers would love me. You know what stops me? The thought of Joffrey on the throne, with Cersei standing behind him whispering in his ear. My son. How could I have made a son like that, Ned?” “He’s only a boy,” Ned said awkwardly. He had small liking for Prince Joffrey, but he could hear the pain in Robert’s voice. “Have you forgotten how wild you were at his age?”

If you don't like him so much, Ned. Then why in the fuck is he still betrothed to your daughter??!! (* ￣︿￣)

This was the boy he had grown up with, he thought; this was the Robert Baratheon he’d known and loved. If he could prove that the Lannisters were behind the attack on Bran, prove that they had murdered Jon Arryn, this man would listen. Then Cersei would fall, and the Kingslayer with her, and if Lord Tywin dared to rouse the west, Robert would smash him as he had smashed Rhaegar Targaryen on the Trident. He could see it all so clearly.

I have nothing to say to this. I am that speechless. However, I will make on note though. The naivety of thirty five year old Ned is less crtiqued in this fandom than the naivety of eleven/twelve year old Sansa. Let that sink in for a moment.

Littlefinger overheard. “If you know who’s going to win the second match, speak up now before Lord Renly plucks me clean,” he called to her. Ned smiled. “A pity the Imp is not here with us,” Lord Renly said. “I should have won twice as much.”

Ned Stark is hearing all of this and yet never does it occur to him that Littlefinger has duped him with how he lost his dagger. Think Ned, just think. I beg of you. I am on my knees.

But Sansa had the right of it after all. A few moments later Ser Loras Tyrell walked back onto the field in a simple linen doublet and said to Sandor Clegane, “I owe you my life. The day is yours, ser.”

Look Cujo did one good deed. I suppose he should get credit for it. He gets a quarter of a brownie point from me.

That night at the feast, Eddard Stark was more hopeful than he had been in a great while. Robert was in high good humor, the Lannisters were nowhere to be seen, and even his daughters were behaving. Jory brought Arya down to join them, and Sansa spoke to her sister pleasantly. “The tournament was magnificent,” she sighed. “You should have come. How was your dancing?” “I’m sore all over,” Arya reported happily, proudly displaying a huge purple bruise on her leg. “You must be a terrible dancer,” Sansa said doubtfully

Arya and Sansa are finally get along after several weeks of tension. How cute.

Ned ran his fingers through his hair. Any decent master-at-arms could give Arya the rudiments of slash-and-parry without this nonsense of blindfolds, cartwheels, and hopping about on one leg, but he knew his youngest daughter well enough to know there was no arguing with that stubborn jut of jaw. “As you wish,” he said. Surely she would grow tired of this soon. “Try to be careful.”

So let me get this straight. You see your daughter finally learning something that she actually enjoys and what do you do? Consider putting an end to it. What is wrong with you Ned?

He took out the dagger and studied it. Littlefinger’s blade, won by Tyrion Lannister in a tourney wager, sent to slay Bran in his sleep. Why would the dwarf want Bran dead? Why would anyone want Bran dead?

You literally overheard a conversation that disproves this, but okay continue believing this lie, Ned. (╬▔皿▔)╯

He was at the door when Ned called, “Varys,” The eunuch turned back. “How did Jon Arryn die?” “I wondered when you would get around to that.” “Tell me.” “The tears of Lys, they call it. A rare and costly thing, clear and sweet as water, and it leaves no trace. I begged Lord Arryn to use a taster, in this very room I begged him, but he would not hear of it. Only one who was less than a man would even think of such a thing, he told me.” ...... Ned had to know the rest. Ned felt half-poisoned himself. “The squire,” he said. “Ser Hugh.” Wheels within wheels within wheels. Ned’s head was pounding. “Why? Why now? Jon Arryn had been Hand for fourteen years. What was he doing that they had to kill him?” “Asking questions,” Varys said, slipping out the door.

So far I have reread ASOIAF as a whole a couple of times, however, despite knowing this book series for ten years now I still don't know the point of Vary misdirecting Ned from who the true killer is. Do perhaps any of you know, dear readers? Please share your thoughts.

Next chapter the King of Incels; Tyrion

#asoiaf reread project #agot reread #Ned Stark critical #anti Robert Baratheon #I just really fucking hate his ass

[brydeswhale]

Ned and Arya Stans are just not used to anyone criticizing their faves, so it kind of traumatized them when people are like, “Yeah, not my fave.” Actual critique makes them go into a full meltdown, sadly.

#ned stark critical #Arya stark critical #anti arya stark #anti ned stark

[bibiundtinaundzombies]

asoiaf characters with a canonical breeding kink:

-ned stark (thinks about having more kids with his wife during a meeting like three times)

-catelyn stark (fantasizes about getting pregnant literally mid-boning, still wants more of her husband’s kids after he fucking dies)

-alyssa targaryen (girleen tells her husband she was “made for this” while slowly dying of childbed fever and tells him she’ll give him “an army of sons”)

-jahaerys and alysanne (they have fourteen kids. look me in the eyes and tell me they don’t have a breeding kink. and don’t you “but medieval society” me. it’s a breeding kink if i say it’s a breeding kink.)

#ned stark #eddard stark #catelyn stark #catelyn tully #alyssa targaryen #alysanne targaryen #good queen alysanne #jahaerys targaryen #ned x catelyn #ned x cat #alyssa x baelon #jahaerys x alysanne #i will not accept criticism #nor will i apologize #‘tis the truth and nothing but the truth

[lagosbratzdoll]

I feel like I've said this before but I am not a fan of Rhaegar but the way antis talk about him in this fandom is so frustrating. It makes it so difficult to have a nuanced discussion about the man and his failings.

#half of the reason you people don't like him are things you've made up in your heads #the other half are taken out of context and twisted to vilify him #this is a complaint i make regularly but you can just dislike a character #you don't have to make up reasons. #so much of Rhaegar criticism is just nonsense #and it's so annoying #i'll be having a conversation with someone and they'll bring up something he never did and it's like please let's keep the hate #grounded in the text #it actually burns me that i am writing this cause i don't even like the man #but the antis are so annoying. #it's the same problem i have with ned stark criticism #it devolves into ned abused sansa rubbish more often than not #like where did he do that? #please show it to me #ned is many things but an abusive father is not one of them #need everyone to bffr #it is enough

[aemontargaryen-bloodraven]

Fanon: Ned Stark is the protector of the series.

Canon: Ned Stark dies as a common brigand tied up and is executed as a traitor to the realm in the first book.

#ned stark critical #fandom nonsense