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the-musical-cc · 3 years

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What's wrong with the Twilight Princess manga? (Genuinely curious because I often hear it's good)

No, I mean, it's good! What I've read isn't really terrible (And take in account that because they aren't selling it here just yet, I've only read what I've been able to find online.) This is most likely about me putting something in the tags about how most fans ignore it, referring specifically to Link's backstory, but like...Bruh I'm biased, don't pay mind to my rambles XD

...

*rambles anyway.

I mean, it IS good. I like it enough that I want to buy the whole thing once it's completed, available in my country (In english because the spanish names are a fucking joke) and have enough money that I don't regret buying like 12 tomes that are like 120 pesos each. It brought some ideas that are gold, such as Luda and Shad coming with Link in the adventure for a short time, Midna helping Link beat the Gorons in sumo (Though it does sacrifice one of the most hilarious parts of lore of the game.) and the questionability of Hyrule's attitude towards anything that isn't 'Pure' or 'Bright'. I just disagree with a lot of the choices made in it.

Link's backstory. I had thought it to be a matter of personal taste at first, where I saw him as someone who maybe came from outside but grew in Ordon and was just getting stupidly offended over differing opinions, but as it turns out I just didn't remember why I'd had that idea for years now. Ilia mentions having been kids together with Link, and hilarious as the thought that she's referring to one year prior to events in the game is, it most likely means he's been there for years. Honestly? My impression is they wanted Link to not have too deep a tie to Ordon for whatever reason, and I Hate That. I'm certain I'm not the only one to say 'That's bullshit' and just go with something else there, which is why I say most of us ignore it anyway.

They highkey stole an arc from Hyrule Warrior Legends. Though tbf they also put a very blatant 'Empire Strikes back' moment in there and as much as it annoyed me... it was pretty cool. Still, this is the one game where Shadow Link had no business to be and they put it in there for an entire fucking arc.

Twilight Princess' cast is fucking HUGE why on Hylia's green earth are you putting OCs in there??? It's not even like they're filling a role no one else could have had! They've done it before in their previous Zelda works, and other manga adaptations have as well, but I like most of them because they had something to bring to the table (Even if it was romantic drama, in Ganthy's case.) here it's little to nothing they can contribute with that couldn't have been done by putting an already existing character there. It may be my theatre brain speaking but it bothers me when you have a huge cast and do NOTHING with it and instead bring out another character out of NOWHERE to get things done. Just use what's already there, damn you!

Zelda and Midna's backstory. Hear me out... I love it... but it doesn't work. I've spoken before about how much it annoyed me when the narrative had Zelda and Link respectively blame themselves for the invasion (Even though the guy invading is RIGHT THERE???!?!) for having 'Touched' the dark and made it so it could invade their world, and that's part of it. The other is: Having Zelda sacrifice for Midna not because it was the right thing to do, not because it's the one thing she can do for her people, for the Twili, for Link and Midna herself, and instead making it 'You're my childhood inter-dimensional pen pal, I just realized, welp, time to die.' kind of cheapens the impact it had on Midna in the game and what it says about Zelda as a character (We barely get anything on her in the game, but what we do get is powerful.) It's beautiful, but it misses the point completely.

Also Midna just randomly showing up in Link's dreams in her true form is stupid. YEAH, I SAID IT! I get it they're probably thinking 'Well, what's the point in building up anticipation? You know this is what she looks like already.' but one of the reasons the ship is so heart-wrenchingly good is Link knew her inside and out despite her warped shape. In the end, it didn't matter what she looked like so long as it was her. Link fell in love with her gremlin ass transformation AND THAT IS PERFECT OK??? Imagine like if on 'Beauty and the Beast' Belle just randomly kept meeting the prince in dreams, like they're waving a carrot in front of her to get things done with so she can smooch that freaky Habsburg mug. It's fucking awkward! (And it sort of cheapens their actual chemistry, it feels a lot like 'Oh, he has to see she's hot or it wouldn't be believable that he fell in love.' Get outta here with that.)

Shad.

OK, fine, I'll elaborate. Shad has a dialogue in-game about following up on his dad's life work, it is also implied that he's passed away. What does the manga do? Ignore all that and make it so Shad's dad is a 'Serious' investigator who disapproves of his son's interests. 'Shut up dad! It's not a phase dad! You go clean your room, dad!'. Why? No reason. It's not even interesting!

Shad is the friendliest fucking guy ever, rambling to Link about his hyperfixation on first meeting. Calls him 'Old sport' and stuff like that, seemingly befriends him immediately. What'd the manga decide to do with him? They're RIVALSSSS, and snarky to one another because Shad may or may not have a little crush on Ilia. UGH.

Look, you can't be a real Resistance if the members can't even look after themselves, so making Shad kind of a loser (Because he's a nerd. Hahah. Get it? Nerds are losers.) really took the piss out of the Resistance, tbh. Might have been the point, though, seeing how they needed to make space for their OCs in the final battle at Hyrule Castle... and, look, I've said this before but if you need to make a character look horribly bad for no other purpose than making another look more competent, you're not half as good a writer as you think you are. Link didn't need Shad to look pathetic to look more heoric, that's just sad.

Also take one look at that guy and tell me he doesn't drink his respecting women juice every damn morning and sometimes for dinner... well, in the manga, he's apparently kind of a leecher.

Srsly how is he friends with Ashei if he's kind of a leecher, she'd break his fingers.

There's probably more but I really don't want to come off like I'm trying to discourage people from reading it because I'm not! Like I said, it's a good manga! It has some pretty neat battle sequences, it makes Hyrule feel MASSIVE, it has some pretty horrifying moments that make the stakes feel more real, it takes things that are a certain way in the game for the sake of the mechanics and tries to make them more organic (In the specific case of Ilia's memory, it succeeds.) and Akira Himekawa never fails to make Zelda and every female character look gorgeous. It's just not great in terms of being an adaptation, but that's not necessarily a terrible thing, it just depends on taste. Still, specifically where Link's backstory concerns... I think most fans just ignore it because, really, it doesn't make sense.

#twilight princess #cc rant #cc wtf #look I am capable of liking something and yet realizing 'Yeah this doesn't work I'll ignore it'#and Link's manga backstory... is one of those things #also his broody characterization gets on my nerves but that's taste srry srry #you know which manga I DO hate? The Skyward Sword prequel one #nahhh jk jk #I just get annoyed at fans that just blindly accept it and get pissy if someone wants to do their own thing

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linkspooky · 4 years

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Ten Favorite Female Characters

I was tagged by @midnight-in-town, so now I have to show them how much I love my favorite women.

Name your favorite female characters from 10 different Fandoms and tag 10/or the amount you wish people

Tagging: @hamliet @amonmahboi @inumaqi @thyandrawrites @kaibutsushidousha @harostar.. yeah, I don’t know ten people.

Enoshima Junko

“Hope is harmony. A just heart, moving toward the light. That is all. Despair is hope's polar opposite. It is messy and confusing. It swallows up love, hatred, and everything else.”

Junko wishes she was a psychopath. She’s spent her entire life pretending to be a crazy psychopath, because living that life is just so much more interesting than the one she’s stuck in. Enoshima Junko is just too smart for the world, and everything is too easy for her, and rather than try to dumb herself down a little bit she’s decided to knock everything else down. She’s a girl kicking down sandcastles because building them out of sand all alone is no longer doing it for her.

Junko’s interesting because of the weird logic and loops she runs her brain into. There’s a complex character behind the whole “I exist only to spread despair” thing. She’s perfectly capable of forming emotional attachments to people, and genuinely caring. But the people she likes are generally far worse off than the ones she doesn’t care about.

Junko wants so badly to, just not be human. She does the most inhuman things possible to prove that she’s not human. What really made me love her is the lengths she’s willing to go, to the point in Dangan Ronpa Zero where she basically took a screw to her own brain and started acting like a normal girl only when all of her memories were removed.

Junkos relationship with Matsuda shows two conflicting sides of her character. How much she's humanized by her love of him, and also how much she wants to completely destroy that part of herself. It's like she physically can't be a normal girl. Or rather she doesn’t want to be to such extremes she’ll break everything and then herself.

And if she can’t be normal than Junko decided that self destruction is her next best bet. There’s just nothing that will satisfy Junko, and it’s interesting to watch someone that empty decide the world is going to end, or she’s going to end herself and she doesn’t really care which.

Ajimu Najimi

“Call to me with affection, Anshin’in-san. Well, I don’t really care what manga characters call me.”

Hey, I put Junko on this list twice. Both Ajimu and Junko live in a world that is too easy for them, and therefore they have no reason to get emotionally invested in others or try to attach themselves to anything. Which is why it’s fun to see Ajimu attempt the same thing as Junko to kill herself in style and eventually get saved from herself.

Medaka Box is such a meaningful manga to me because they take the weirdest characters and no matter how deranged they are they find the parts of them that are relatable and go, well guess what you’re human too. Ajimu literally calls herself a non-human and she’s just as human as all the rest in the end.

The best part is it’s not her good points that make her human, it’s all her flaws. It’s easy to feel like the world isn’t real, that nothing in the world is worth living for, to feel no emotional attachment. Those are all human emotions. Not because they’re good and shining, but because they’re petty and terrible. Ajimu is this brilliant character, but she’s also kind of just a petty little girl using a ‘fiction is reality’ lens to cope. She’s not that special actually, she’s just suicidal, and kind of awful in general. It’s nice to see that human side behind the mastermind character.

Azula

“My own mother thought I was a monster. She was right of course but it still hurts.”

Azula is someone thoroughly dehumanized by everyone even the “good” members of her family (Uncle Iroh, Zuko, her Mother). I like how Azula in some part seems to be aware that both her brother, and mother seem to kind of consider her the “bad sibling” and she just decides to embrace it. Like it’s... not emotionally healthy in any way and it’s terribly tragic but there’s something about characters who actively make the decision to be a monster that gets me.

There’s something about Azula’s writing that makes me uncomfortable, and it makes me sad that Zuko like... continually associates her with his father’s abuse, and demonizes her like she wasn’t also a kid going through the exact same situation, but Azula getting increasingly unstable is at least an appropriate response to that.

Even if her brother, her mother, or her father won’t see her as her own person and they all see her as an extension of her father’s abuse on her, Azula is just so determined to be her own person even if it means burning the world, or herself A common theme I guess, but a lot of these characters have narratives about not being allowed to be their own person or shown any kind of humanity or normalcy.

Morrigan

“Well, well, well what do we have here?”

Morrigan is mean, and nasty, and grumpy and bitchy and witchy. She’s allowed to be unlikable, because Morrigan never bends to anyone. Her survival, and freedom will become first before anything else.

It feels like Morrigan is the main character in her own story, and you just happen to be a part of it for a short while. You may even be an important character to her, she may be attached, but ultimately you’ll never be more than support to her.

Morrigan is such an ambitious an singular entity that her character development is letting you be a part of her life and not the other way around. She'll always survive on her own. Morrigan is irrevocably shaped by her environemnt, and yet she craves freedom in that too because she doesn’t want to be bound by her past or shaped by her mother. So much of herself is dedicated to being better than the environment that she was raised in that she defeats her mother not by killing her, or freeing herself, but rather by being a better mother than her.

Raven / Rachel Roth

“Azarath, Metrion, Zinthos...”

Raven is fun, because a bunch of monks thought the best way to teach her to handle her emotions was to never allow her to feel any emotion ever. So, Raven is eternally running on a zero. She’s terrified even a small amount of happiness will end the world. She’s not allowed to be her own person, neither her bastard father, nor the monks treat her like one.

Raven is so gentle, and selfless, and emotionally perceptive and sensitive to others needs but she can’t ever display almost any of these good traits because she’s internalized the idea that she’s such a bad person. She always believes all the time that she exists to hurt others and that makes it so difficult for her to connect to others.

Which is why her true friends bond with the Teen Titans is so meaningful, because Rachel found a family in spite of all of that. She has friends who think she’s a good person unconditionally despite the fact that Raven continually tells herself she isn’t. There are people in the world willing to navigate the maze of walls that Raven has built around herself, and that her environment forced her to build and closed up, and she’s so happy to have them.

Midna

“Some call our realm a world of shadows, but that makes it sound so unpleasant... The twilight there holds a serene beauty... You have seen it yourself as the sun sets on this world. Bathed in that light, all the people were pure and gentle...”

Midna just steals the show. Her story now. The game’s not called Legend of Zelda anymore now it’s Legend of Midna. Not only is she the most important character in the game she appears in, but she’s also in character someone so selfish she’ll always prioritize herself over everyone else. However, only because she feels that she can’t exist as anything other than the princess of the twilight and has to prioritize her survival for the sake of her people. Midna even says so at the start of the game, she can’t be kind because she wasn’t spoiled like princess Zelda in the bountiful kingdom of the light.

Midna is so selfish and yet doesn’t really have her own wants and needs as a person outside of the role she has to play for her people, which is why she’s so terribly lost without it and just because this terrible selfish little gremlin. Link and Zelda affect Midna so much because they humanize her. They both sacrifice themselves to save Midna the person and she doesn’t get why. She doesn’t get why two people would help someone who has been so unkind to them and who has failed them this much so far.

That act of selflessness moves her, and also freaks her out. She even says she didn’t want to be saved by either of them. Which is what makes her redemption in the second half of the game so interesting, because Midna really improves herself so she can become someone worth their kindness. She doesn’t want the selflessness of people like Zelda and Link to go to waste, and because of that begins to care about things outside of her kingdom and her role as princess

Vriska Serket

“After all of this is over. Do you want to go on a d8?”

Unfortunately one of my top 3 favorite characters of all time comes from a really terrible source material. Vriska is everything I like in a character. She's a mess. She's really hard to swallow. She's a character that's not meant to be liked.

Nobody really likes Vriska and it's all her fault for being such a horrible person, nobody wants her damage. Which is so interesting because usually main characters get forgiven over and over again. Everyone leaves and if they don't Vriska will burn those bridges herself. No character better embodies what it's like to be stuck in a self harming cycle

Authors are always so obsessed with making characters look good or showing what a good person they are few characters are allowed to be just plain unlikely in ugly ways. It’s what lets Vriskas genuine desire to be better actually seem like a struggle.

Kocho Shinobu

“Are you angry? Yes, I’m angry Tanjiro. I’ve always been angry.”

Shinobu is just all pleasantries on the surface, but so full of negative emotions in ways women aren't allowed to be. I love the medicine / poison dynamic to her character and how it rots her to the core. Too much medicine is a poison, while poison can be a medicine when applied to the right situation.

Shinobu is, two faced. She’s beautiful and kind, and full of ugly emotions and empty. She nurses people back from the dead, she sees no point in living herself and purposefully throws herself into a suicide in her plan against Doma. There’s just such a destructive dance between extremes for her because Shinobu is such a unique individual, trying to deal with all of these emotions she just can’t deal with. She can’t be noble, or better than her trauma, she just pretends to be a good person while she slowly rots away inside.

Shinobu can put on smiles all day -

But she can't be like her sister. She can't love people like her sister can. Maybe she could once but all that's left now is anger. Bitter, unpleasant, and completely in denial of it and still masquerading as a good person. The most beautiful kind of poison of all.

She’s not her sister, but she’s also not really her own person. She doesn’t know who Shinobu is, doesn’t know who Kocho Shinobu lives for. She just doesn’t imagine herself living past her revenge, and even though she’s surrounded by love she’s just so cracked it all pours out of her and absolutely nothing could be worth prolonging her life after everything she’s lost.

Toga Himiko

“What exactly is a normal life? I also live a normal life, you know.”

Himiko Toga is a girl who lives entirely on her own terms. Which is just so rare for a female character, you know? It’s so genuinely subversive to know that Himiko was once a nice girl, who always smiled, always put other people’s feelings first, and that sort of ‘good girl’ behavior drove her completely insane.

Toga deciding to be true to herself is an act of rebellion against the world.

For Himiko everything is flipped. What others regard as psycho behavior is her normal. She doesn’t let other people define her story as a tragedy, and even murders the one person who tries to control her story. In a story where female characters constantly downplay their own importance to support the male characters Himiko is the only character important enough to be the center of her own story. Himiko’s story is so subversive as well, both of how society treats her, and how the story treats characters like her.

Himiko is such an excellent yandere, all yanderes wish they were himiko. She comes off as this batshit stabby girl, but then you find out that shes actually emotionally perceptive. She first comes off selfish, bratty, and self-centered but she turns into one of the most sensitive characters in the manga. She eschews the ideals of being a good girl that was forced down her throat, but that doesn’t mean she’s not empathic, or that she’s not capable of goodness. She’s good to twice. She’s good to the people who accept her.

Himiko no matter what will always be a deviant. Always be an outsider. Instead of trying to make room for her her parents forced her to lie and wear a mask until her identity became completely shattered. I like Toga because under the knife wielding psycho she's a normal girl. Then under that normal girl there’s also a knife wielding psycho ready to fight back, and both of them are the real her.

Ihei Hairu

“I saw the reaper, he was very beautiful.”

Every character from the garden is just fundamentally broken. Hairu and Rize are interesting foils, because if you think of about it a loveless childhood turned them both into ruthless killers. It’s just they decided to live for different things, Rize lived rejecting love and Hairu lived chasing after love. However, fundamentally they are the same. They are children starved for any kind of love or nurturing. Hairu is so desperate she devotes her entire life to the first person who acknowledged her. However, the same sort of desperation to live, that tragic need to make the most out of the few short years they have exists in all garden children.

Hairu wants so badly to be a person, but she’s not a person. She’s half ghoul.

There's just something about a girl who was never meant to be born and never meant to live, still trying. There's a dark side to her character, she's violent and inhuman exactly like the environment she was raised in but she was also still a child at heart seeking love.

Which is why though her narrative is a thoroughly unhappy one, it does make me happy that there was someone who loved her in the form of Koori Ui. There is someone who wanted her to live longer. Her life was short, but she did live, and it’s that struggle to connect to others that made her truly alive.

#hairu ihei #ajimu najimi #enoshima junko #toga himiko #kocho shinobu #midna #rachel roth #raven #azula #vriska serket #morrigan #morrigan dragon age #meme #spooky speaks

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ganymedesclock · 5 years

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there's a post somewhere about how ganondorf's death is often presented almost as a holy death, deeply dignified and with appropriate silence. i think the term the person used was like a kind of anti-martyrdom, like. "a holy death, but not of something good". i'm not sure if i'm using the terminology entirely correctly, but that's something that's always hit me. like. i don't think that comes from just the general seriousness of the plot, but also that there's a quiet acknowledgement that fate

itself was against him - and the inherent tragedy of that. like. they're So Close to digging just a little further and questioning that concept of fate + supposedly inherent character weakness in the first place. this is present in oot - zelda acknowledges him as pitiful, someone who couldn't control the triforce. and in tp, zelda seems to do something like a quiet prayer. this aspect of zelda herself isn't present in wind waker (iirc), but is embodied by the king, who directly compares himself.

That’s a concept that a friend of mine talks about a lot ( @betterbemeta ) in almost those exact words but I asked her and she said she wasn’t sure of the specific post, just that she didn’t get it from someone else.

But, yeah, I feel like... there’s this interesting sort of counter-narrative within the Zelda series, I think? There’s the main narrative, which is the Legend and the Cycle and that it is Correct to perpetuate the Cycle and live out the roles people are given.

But there’s also a lot of counterpoints, of things making it clear that the Cycle is hurting people, that you will not be rewarded or kept safe for perpetuating it- and in Wind Waker this is very interesting, because, a lot of the evidence points to Ganon’s stance- “Your gods abandoned you!” being correct.

Hyrule was destroyed. Most of its people were killed. Two young people who were active servants of the god at the time were murdered and nothing protected them. Ganon comes across as someone who’d know- because he’s acting as the Divine Opponent, here.

And there’s this scene, late in Wind Waker, where he reads Tetra’s dreams with his power.

This scene sticks with me, because it’s Ganon doing something unnecessary. He’s got no reason to treat Tetra hospitably at this point. He’s got no reason to tuck her into a bed, which he does, or acknowledge that she’s a child, or wonder who she is besides Zelda.

And, yet, we have this. unexpectedly introspective soft scene, and while it’s followed by the puppet Ganon fight, the things he says there don’t seem just like villainous trash talk, but, nearly a plea for these kids to realize how messed up their situation is. They’re allegedly agents of the gods who are being chewed up by their Fates, used and cast aside, and while he has an agenda in not wanting this to happen (as their given Fate is to be parties in his execution) there’s a bleak humor Wind Waker Ganon has about the situation that, to me, has never actually been contradicted within the Zelda games. Words to the contrary ring hollow. In practice, we watch Hyrule desolated, we watch its executioners throw him on vulnerable populations (in Twilight Princess, the Sages know enough of the modern Twili to recognize Midna in her cursed form- so they had to have known the people they were leaving at the mercy of a wounded, panicked Ganon who was nonetheless fully capable of killing a person with his bare hands at that point).

In Breath of the Wild, which doesn’t even depict Ganon as a person who can argue his point (though the sequel may shed new light on that), he still nonetheless seems correct about the nature of the cycle; Zelda is unabashedly a survivor of child abuse who was forced to pray in sacred springs starting at age seven.

BotW is basically the series’ most detailed thesis yet that the Cycle broke Link and Zelda and tore pieces from them they’re not getting back. Both of them lost a century. Zelda’s passions and interests were sublimated to force her into a passive role. People they knew and were close to died. Link’s habitual silence is depicted as a product of the anxiety that the hero role pressed on him, and he was also a human shield just to guarantee that of the Champions, Zelda at least could make it, that left him critically injured.

The only real coherent defense raised by the Cycle- which is meta-wise, “justified” by Skyward Sword, which establishes it as an unholy curse- is “this is the only way to save Hyrule” which is never challenged or argued or defended. It’s merely accepted. And we keep watching young, vulnerable kids following the paths laid out by their predecessors and being torn apart by these events.

Link and Zelda don’t look like people who are protected by benevolent gods that shine over them. Repeatedly, the deities of the Zelda setting are depicted as not especially loving. In A Link To The Past, the Triforce itself says it doesn’t care about good or evil, merely that Link has proven his worth and should now make a wish. Other characters in the setting describe it as fickle or a troublemaker. In Skyward Sword, Zelda, regaining Hylia’s memories and thus the clearest potential insight into how Hylia was thinking and feeling, states that Hylia obtained a mortal incarnation basically as bait for Link, who would be driven by compassion to protect his friend, and thus get functionally conned into acting as Hylia’s champion.

I think this is why fanworks that put the chosen three on the same side make sense, because, in this way, Ganon is more a contemporary to the heroes than the King of Hyrule, who, no matter how often he dies, never really has that sense of being a martyred hero who’s lost fragments of himself. Daphnes was able to choose his own death, and the death of his kingdom, on his own terms using the Wind Waker and then the Triforce; Rhoam controls the narrative at the beginning of BotW.

Ganon?

Just from what we know about BotW’s sequel (which is not much at all) Ganon is having a bad time. In a way, his fate seems to combine elements of Link and Zelda’s- he was confined for a long time in a death match with another force (Zelda), and he was heavily and brutally injured and may have lost consciousness (Link) only to awaken in an unfamiliar future where he’s been all but forgotten (both of them).

And part of this is the need that the games seem to have, to have everything be Ganon’s fault, but to never acknowledge or explore the relationships Ganon actually, has with the various entities he ostensibly commands. I love Wind Waker, but, as friends of mine have pointed out- there’s only flimsy excuses at best for Ganon to put the various boss monsters in the environments they’re found in. They’re themed to their environments so that they seem fitting elements, rather than something foreign placed there that’s disrupted an extant order.

It leads to this sense of Ganon more as a pariah than as a true Source Of Evil. Because he’s blamed for everything, including things that don’t actually seem to further any of his stated objectives and in fact, might even work against something he is stated to want (e.g. the withering of the Deku Sprouts in Wind Waker, which are stated to be a potential way to drain the Great Sea and leave the Land Below accessible once again- the big thing Ganon wants- but they’re stated to fail because of Ganon’s magic; or him outright saying he wants the sun to shine on Hyrule when earlier in the game Daphnes accuses him of cursing the entire sea into a state of darkness because he wants everything to be dark)

Ganon’s not blameless and harmless- like. he absolutely did shit and is rarely sorry for it or sorry but not enough to stop- but, it definitely feels like his role as Hyrule’s Enemy is a degree outside of his control, much as the Hero or Princess roles are out of Link and Zelda’s. This is a game series about people being forced into roles that cause them to suffer, and then the end takeaway is I guess It Was Worth It because the Bad Man Died.

It’s this situation where the narrative tells us we are dealing with a demon man who hates everything and the only holiness or justice can come from his death, and then at the same time we’re shown a guy who is a power-hungry jerk with a large list of offscreen and frankly mystifying crimes that don’t seem to add up with anything he seems to want or value or even his sense of humor. And it ends up leaving the whole Cycle... feeling rather bleak.

#Legend of Zelda #Ganondorf #Link #Zelda #like it's this Weird Thing of I guess the cycle has to be ultimately vindicated #so we can keep making more games #but also look at all this lovely drama of how the cycle is awful and hurts everyone #but don't feel bad for Ganon who has seen this murder wheel go around multiple times in his life #faelapis #long post

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nautilusopus · 5 years

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sorry this is a lot but I enjoy your opinions. G, P, U, W, X, Z

G - Have you ever had an OTP? If so, do you remember your first one? Who was in it?

Nah. I’m aggressively boring and uninvested in general in most romances so I usually just go with whatever’s canon and call it a day.

The closest thing I got to ever shipping in the past was being mildly surprised that people saw Link and Zelda as an item in Twilight Princess because they don’t really talk much in that game (they have maybe two conversations? Three if we count any presumed dialogue they might’ve had during the last boss battle when they’re on a horse together). I wouldn’t say I’m actually invested in it one way or another though. Link didn’t really have much of a personality until Wind Waker came along.

P - Invent a random AU for any fandom (we always need more ideas).

FFXV AU where Noctis asks literally any questions at all about anything and interacts with the plot as an active participant in it instead of a copypasted emotional beat from FFX and thus doesn’t die at the end due to lazy writer caveat. (spoilers i guess)

I am so so so so tempted to write this and the urge has been growing stronger over the last few weeks. I imagine fans of XV wouldn’t be too thrilled I’m writing fanfic specifically because I hate everything about XV, but y’all keep circulating posts about how writing fanfic to fix canon is totally valid!!! so I fully expect everyone to walk the walk after talking the talk.

On another note, AU where Cloud never actually makes it to Midgar after Zack gets filled with lead, thus never meeting Tifa at and least screwing his head on semi-straight, and just wanders around in the wilderness as a weird amnesiac murderhobo in a perpetual fugue state. Hijinks ensue I guess.

Shit, I should write that.

And now I have 48 fics queued. Look at what you’ve done. Are you proud of yourself?

U - Three favorite characters from three different fandoms, and why they’re your favorites.

alright let’s get the obvious one out of the way

Cloud because I used to fucking despise him and over time he really grew on me after I was exposed to his genuinely moving character arc and narrative that actively trampled every expectation I had about what it would be. Dumb asshole that unabashedly loves his friends, which is something that you rarely if ever see in other protagonists of his mould which is why it infurates me as much as it does when people (Square or the fanbase, it’s annoying either way) try to downplay it. That was one of the things that made him unique and compelling in the first place and you’re actively discarding it? Fuck you.

It’s genuinely refreshing to see someone try as hard as they can and fail catastrophically in every possible respect, and then that’s just the result and he has to come terms with that pain as something shaping who he was instead of just learning a lesson and then getting over it. There are a lot of matter-of-fact moments like that with regards to loss and pain in VII but Cloud’s arc actually took one of said moments and made it extremely cathartic.

I have a lot of fukken feelings about Cloud, man. That character analysis essay is officially four years old and the ETA on it is “whenever I guess”.

Azula from ATLA. I mean, I adore basically everyone in that series so I don’t even know which one I’d call my favourite, but I do think I ought to highlight Azula since a lot of who she is kinda gets overlooked. She’s like a family-friendly Eva character.

It’s genuinely fascinating to watch her break down, and on a second rewatch you can sort of tell which beats fell into place where. Ironically, she considers Zuko the “favoured child”, and part of the reasons she utterly despises/loves/despises him as much as she does is because she tries to earn his approval in her own weird, sociopathic way. Then, when he inevitably bails, he not only rejects her, he goes and shacks up with even more people that consciously chose to love him, and for all her talent, after all her hard work, all she has is Ozai, who’s probably never loved anything in his life. The unfairness of it all.

The breakdown she has at the end isn’t even anything new, really. It’s just the first time other people get to see it.

Speaking of Eva, Shinji. DISCLAIMER: YES SHINJI MASTURBATED TO COMPLETION OVER ASUKA’S COMATOSE BODY IN A BLATANT DISPLAY OF NOT ONLY HIS GENERAL DISLIKE AND FEAR OF WOMEN BUT IN AN EXPRESSION OF HIS REFUSAL TO PROJECT AFFECTION ONTO PEOPLE BECAUSE PEOPLE CAN REJECT HIM, PREFERRING TO SEE ASUKA AS A PERSON-SHAPED OBJECT INSTEAD. THERE I HAVE ACKNOWLEDGED THE PROBLEMATIQUE ™ BIT NOW. CAN I LIKE THIS CHARACTER YET?

Shinji and Cloud have a lot of the same character arc, as I’ve mentioned probably more than a few times because I repeat myself a lot. Where Cloud is a more optimistic take on defining oneself on one’s own terms and as a result accepting that they can be someone worthy of love, Shinji’s side of that concept is waaaaaaaaaaay more cynical, in that Shinji kind of… doesn’t learn to do that in the end. Refuses to, in fact, to the point where it gets everyone killed. Also Kaworu is Zack if Zack actually had character development and if C//la/ck was actually canon. Where Cloud overcomes his fear of rejection by learning he is deserving of existence on his own merits, otherwise why would he have people that care about him in the first place, Shinji is crippled by it and spends most of the series screaming at anything that remotely resembles responsibility. For a guy that repeatedly tells himself “I mustn’t run away” his reaction to everything is almost exclusively to run away.

Now, I’m not necessarily implying that if things had gone worse, Cloud might have masturbated to completion over Tifa’s comatose body, but like… I’m just saying.

(Though Aeris and Tifa were admittedly a lot more stable than poor Asuka or Rei ever were, as low of a bar as that may be.)

In case it wasn’t obvious, I clearly have a Type. And that type is a maladjusted child soldier screaming VALIDATE MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE from the top of the lightpole they climbed up to avoid their feelings, and they all deserve a good hug and a firm shove down a flight of stairs or two, in either order.

W - A trope which you are virtually certain to hate in any fandom.

Love triangles. If I wanted to see a bunch of assholes do a bunch of petty bickering fueled by hormones and poor communication and pitting two people against one another for extremely asinine reasons, I’d lurk outside a high school.

X - A trope which you are almost certain to love in any fandom.

Apart from the aforementioned Type ™ I have, people getting overwhelmed by gestures of basic human decency and the implications of that.

Z - Just ramble about something fan-related, go go go! (Prompts optional but encouraged.)

God they did poor Luna so dirty. You could have replaced her with another fucking crystal or something and it would affect the plot about as much. Man, didn’t the selling point for FF used to be its rich, inventive storytelling?

Come the fuck on, Square, you had female characters figured out in fucking 1992. This isn’t hard.

#asks #neon genesis evangelion #forfdorfsorf #avatar #goddddd i need to write a vii eva crossover already #the number i does not count it is a crossover only in spirit #tofuthebold

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juushika · 7 years

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travel to first city > get out of habit of playing Zelda in sleep-deprived travel and recovery days > stall out > pick game back up same day we started playing Dark Souls III again and wow the games do not mesh > oh well > travel to other city again, can’t play Dark Souls while here > tl;dr finally beat The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time

My liveblog from ~50% to the end: game events, Navi as mechanic, time travel???, so much metadata, Gerudo are the very best, cyclical narrative are fascinating and I wish I wanted to play the other games, etc.; it is very long!

me: hello dark Link is in this one 1) this is the 1.5 things i was not really spoiled for (in context of Ocarina) 2) oh my god i have so much fanart of this scene what a well-done sequence! really subtle and eerie effects/use of reflection and clever combat and like not skillful combat at all “don’t lock on, try and sort of flail until you get around him then stab his butt wildly” but pretty and the fade-out is really effective! so much really good subtextual-to-the-point-of-not-existing narrative; fights with shadow selves are best trope?? i looked at that art again and! it v good! i remember finding this dynamic compelling even before familiar with canon in any way! but it’s not explored, just, “you could explore this yourself, if you want”

me: where is Link keep iron boots when not wear that they don’t effect his weight just curious

Missy: don’t ask they magic also it really amuses me that your biggest connection to OoT is “i have sexy pics of Link and dark Link”

me: what is the logic of traveling BACK to kid Link??? (there is no logic, i know, i know) “you picked up the sword and were too young for it so we incubated you until ready” implies that Kingdom Hearts-esque he grew up in the jar, time passed but he wasn’t there for it but then no! and he can go back! and i get it would be awful to put collectables/shortcuts and then be like ARBITRARY UNPREDICTABLE CUT-OFF POINT being able to pop back is polite; and having offered that, tying it into plot is clever but ……..how???? it work?

[future Juu: Spirit Temple is best dungeon b/c it makes the time travel mechanic part of the core gameplay, aka the dungeons; but the time travel still fails to make sense, here or there or in the ending. maybe I read too much into chrysalis imagery b/c of my KH background? but the original wording, “we put you in sacred realm until you growed up,” just conflicts hugely with everything else time travel does in this game]

Missy: in the room with the rolly boulders HEY HEY HEY HEY HEY HEY GODDAMIT NAVI I GET WE NEED TO AVOID THE BOULDERS YOU DON’T HAVE TO YELL ABOUT THEM NONSTOP hey navi. you don’t like getting squished. i don’t like getting squished. HOW ABOUT YOU STOP SAYING HEY SO I DON’T JUST SQUISH YOU.

me: i am so 50/50 on why everyone found Navi so annoying i have this strong “it not her fault” feel “it the limit of her programing”

Missy: normally she fine but sometimes HEY HEY HEY HEY

me: some of [the boy’s] retro game adventures in the time before waypoints are… interesting like it’s super immersive which is great more active exploration, less “mindlessly follow waypoint” but they forget that in the samey-textured-fucking-identical-rooms you just … can’t pathfind naturally i come away with this really strong sense of “oh that’s why we handhold” when actually! we could handhold less now that we can have unrecycled textures/assets and rooms that aren’t just boxes! but you still spend the whole time (in retro games) wishing for a waypoint or a fucking HUD or anything in the world that tells you how go where [examples of retro games that fit this matrix: the original Thief series, the original Deus Ex] and i feel like Navi is that “in such a sprawling and potentially non-linear game, player needs an aid” Missy: esp when HEY WHERE DO I GO? HEY HEY LISTEN sorta useful me: yeah she's good for "how to begin next dungeon" stuff but for stuff like "what do these magic seeds do" "chickens????" she useless and then she breaks out the advice for "DID YOU KNOW BOULDER MAKE THE SQUISH" thanks navi, i had guessed

Missy: hehe yahh

me: there’s actually--and, let us still preserve my overall ehhhhhhhhh opinion of Undertale, but--there’s a great sort of hat-tip to that trope when helper NPC interrupts you while doing a puzzle so that you are forced to “fail” it (need to push three buttons; NPC: “I’ll help you with timing!!”; reminder re: timing forces you to fail timing lol) god aren’t vidya games cool they’re like 50% experience/feelings/narrative and 50% mechanics/game design it’s so interesting!!! i have feelings!!!!

me: Bongo Bongo actually fav boss so far WITH savestates without, probably hell but with, save stating becomes another mechanic, another move to time, like saving after stunning second hand so i can make sure eye of truth + counter eye + dmg, and then reset to save state if i miss one of those steps which happens a lot pacing great with savestates, very tense without, probably just ragey

Missy: yes and yes

[future Juu: this became a consistent theme. I started using save states to avoid the constant walking back each time I returned to the game, but they universally made combat feel more strategic and dependent on my actions, and less flaily and dependent on ehhh controls]

me: hello yes the Gerudo are extremely interesting is very Amazons

Missy: yes except Ganondork

me: like in any single-sex society, even those created by feminists (Joanna Russ, Nicola Griffith) i want more interrogation of sex=gender, how gender binary works when part of the binary is super unrepresented, characters forgoing binary entirely, etc. esp. interesting here b/c they 1) do have very rare males 2) have contact with non-Gerudo men, so they’re exposed to a gender binary, but how does that impact their culture “occasionally a man and then he becomes king of everything” is super icky for obvious reasons but i wonder what the on-the-ground view of that is, like, they have their own leadership roles, 100 years is a long time to be periodically self-sustaining, does the average citizen even care is it a figurehead monarchy “they just wear the pretty crown and look important; meanwhile, we rule ourselves” system fucked up every cycle that Ganandorf shows up to be ~evil~

me: obviously they do enough breeding outside their race to sustain it, but their culture is actually pretty self-contained/even xenophobic, so how does culture sharing work, how does race work???? Gerudo have distinct skin tone, but are breeding with whiter people presumably a lot, what does mixed race look like??? or b/c ~magic~ is that not a thing, are the daughters all just Gerudo wiki says we unno if they have contact with bio fathers, is there any cultural sharing??? what does Gerudo family unit look like; j/k it’s a “a lesbian and her extended lesbian family”

Missy: Keep in mind Historically speaking *every* Gerudo male in known history is Ganondork Following every game And every timeline So the king of everything may not be so much icky political as Gerudo + triforce of power = Ganon king of Gerudo/evil = harbinger of end of world and Hyrule reset

me: so, Dark Souls-like, we’re sort of stuck in a timeline/event loop, looking at same sort of events in different times/iterations (maybe it’s a reverse Jesus, like, they had this prophecy indefinitely but it didn’t effect daily life, but when it’s realized via Ganon we begin a sort of cycle of the game series) Missy: Most interesting bits there are the Twilight Princess stuff Where the n64 Link is a shade waiting for end of world to pass on his knowledge before disappearing Because yeah--Ganon loop seems like public Gerudo knowledge But Link loop is less talked about. The hero of time is just the legend

me: i’m sort of mad that aesthetic/the plot is just hero’s journey/here have the same narrative 2023842 times makes me not want to play others while iterated narrative is such a great trope and does make me want to care

Missy: Zelda future is open world The narrative is apparently partially taking back seat So the future lore from Twilight Princess would be tasty for you (esp. since Hyrule is bigger and more history has been written) But then the open world of BotW is a different allure. You write your own story etc

me: but open world just so ……………tired the dumb shit one can do in BotW is interesting, i just i like, you know, a narrative or sense of purpose

me: i finish Ocarina i have questions so Zelda sends him back to original time, everyone happy in future, life beautiful, sages together & everyone seems to know what’s occurred or at least that evil gone now child Link shows up at temple, Navi is like bye bitch, child Link goes to see child Zelda does he tell her to not fuck up > Ganondorf doesn’t come to power in new alternate timeline???? b/c either she’s like, hey, i know you want to be an adult now, but time to be a child and live through the reign of terror until future you saves shit, OR they’re alternate timelining it and everything sages etc did won’t really exist, so why so long an epilogue focused on them either way the time travel still doesn’t make sense since all the sword does is pop Link in chrysalis until old enough to use it??????/ Missy: Ocarina -> timeline split the adult saved timeline is the one that leads to Wind Waker, i think tl;dr Link saves world and then goes poof oops

me: “Regardless, Ocarina of Time has always been one of the centerpoint games in the chronology, with the events at the end of the game, where Zelda sends Link back to his youth, splitting the timeline.” (source) okay okay that’s a thing

Missy: yeah so Twilight Princess is the other branch

me: Zelda: still fucking things up sorta gj Zelda she is the center of everything isn’t she, i guess, like, thus the title

Missy: yes she is Ganon-Link-Zelda triforce

me: “When the official timeline was revealed in Hyrule Historia, the placement of Ocarina of Time in the series was revealed to be of even greater value, as the events of the game actually split the series’s timeline into three branches.” (ibid.)

Missy: oh yeah third branch we fucked up branch as in you lose to Ganondork and then.. snes game?

me: god i love iterated narratives it really is a pity i don’t care about the worldbuilding (except lesbians obvs.) and also characters and also aesthetic and also hero’s journey and also gameplay “Link is sent back to his childhood, leaving this branch without a Hero, as told in the prologue to The Wind Waker. Ganondorf eventually overcomes the Sages’ seal and attempts to take over Hyrule, but with no Hero to face the evil,” GJ ZELDA JEEZE like tbf, Link telling Zelda > child timeline is also Link’s fault and Link failing to defeat Ganon > grimdark timeline is also him so he is central, triforce, etcetc but Zelda is actually interesting and Link is mostly fridge horror so, shrug that said, it some good fridge horror i propose alternate timeline for another fanfic i never gon’ write child Link almost warns Zelda, goes, wait, what about timeline shit, nvm, decides to just wait it out seven years of increasing darkness watching bad shit pile up actually seeing it from the ground instead of in summary, it worse than he thought, “i done fucked up”

Missy: do a triforce swap Ganon comes out with wisdom Zelda has power Link still courage

me: Ganon wisdom = grimest dark b/c he would be smart enough to succeed wisdom is power really, it’s more effective longterm than brute force then Hyrule rip

#Juu metadata #conversations with Missy #Juu plays #The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time #too many to tag #but uh:#Undertale #The Legend of Zelda #Dark Souls #Juu watches other people play #Thief #Deus Ex #Juu reads

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