#joyce + hopper = willel twins + job

[chirpsythismorning]

What do you think about the possibility of El and Will not being exactly twins but half siblings? Maybe Lonnie was in the MK Ultra project for money and had an affair with Terry Ivis, so El was born. His sperm was affected, and Lonnie had another child with Joyce, who was born with repressed/hidden powers (I'm considering Jonathan was already born when Lonnie's balls were chernobyl'd). Then Lonnie took Will to the Lab a feel times for test, but they concluded he was born powerless, because he appeared to be a normal kid.

Upon coming across twelvegate, I did initially go down this rabbit hole! I made a shit-post about the possibility of Lonnie being both Will and El's dad, but more recently I've expanded on that evidence in an ask, discussing why I basically don't think that is the case anymore.

The main thing that makes me so confident about this, is that I'm certain Terry isn't El's 'mama'. Like pretty much 100% certain.

There are a few posts where I discuss this (here, here, here) so definitely check those out if you want a deep dive to better understand where I'm coming from with that claim.

To be fair, I did not subscribe to this up until recently. It was as if my brain blocked me from even merely considering the possibility that Terry isn’t El's mom because of how tragic her whole situation was. And so it felt almost insensitive to even speculate, I guess?

But as of now, after actually going back and watching her scenes for myself, as well as flashbacks featuring her that resurface in future seasons, I think that if anything Lonnie is a roadblock to the truth, in the same sense that Terry is. Because the evidence that Terry isn't El's mom is too alarming to ignore. Like, once you see it, it becomes very obvious they've always been trying to hint this to us, as subtly as possible, and they did it successfully bc it went over everyone's heads.

And so since Terry isn't El's mom, and there are certain details tying Terry to having some sort of connection to Brenner (ie Papa/Mama, Bonsai trees, Hopper's line about Terry's 'relationship' with Brenner), then it's very likely that, in the original timeline/universe or whatever we want to call it, Terry could have worked closely with the lab in some capacity, though ended up supporting Joyce’s claims over allegations about the lab and experimentation, ie. the article at the end of s1 including Joyce/Terry's testimonies. And so she was basically a confidant to them who went against the lab and was lobotomized for it and placed in a scenario that blocked out the truth very conveniently for them, while also essentially punishing her.

And when it comes to Lonnie... That is where it gets very complicated. Because I think it's likely that in the OG timeline, Lonnie was not the greatest guy. I think there was a lot of scary subtext surrounding him harming Will in s1 and it's possible that this dude has been given the role of their father in this timeline, which in the original timeline he is not. He's essentially Stranger Things' very own Biff.

This does make me very intrigued about what is going to be revealed in 'The First Shadow' play coming soon. We're said to get the backstory for not only Joyce and Hopper but also Lonnie and Bob (and Henry) apparently, so that is making for some interesting potential Back to the Future parallels from Marty’s parents’ 1955 timeline vs Willel’s parents’ 1959 timeline. Also the synopsis being young Joyce Maldonado and Jim Hopper dealing with the shadows of the past...

Arguably, it is crunch time. We're approaching the final season and this is a revelation that a lot of the audience are probably not going to be ready for, despite a lot of the hints in the details. I presume they wont have much time in s5 to rehash the mysteries of the past, beyond glossing it over, and so this was honestly a perfect way for them to go back and give context for what is to come in a really unique way that is canon, but without having to cram too much into s5 like they had to for s4.

I do think that Lonnie is very likely to return in s5. Though he referred to Hawkins at its most tame as a hell hole, so idk if he would be running back there during an apocalypse, seeing as everyone else seems to be trying to get out ASAP. It is possible though, and yet I just really don't think his arc is about this series long secret that he is both El and Will's father. If anything I think the revelation is much darker in relation to what truly happened to him and El, possibly in relation to the lab, as he could indeed have been an MKUltra volunteer like you said. It could also help to go read up on some of the cases/allegations put against MKUltra back in the day bc, though it is quite disturbing in parts, it could very well hold the answer to at least some secrets seeing as this is partially based on a real life program that did exist back in the day.

If Lonnie was their dad, I think he would have been a lot more prioritized in the overall story over the seasons, and yet they kind of introduced him in s1 with only a couple references to him in passing since then. If anything it's giving we do not want to give this character too much acknowledgement in the story.

I think a return for him would perhaps look like the storys way of revealing to us that he is not actually their father. Either via flashbacks to the og timeline or perhaps vecna visions at a point when we’re still assuming this is Will’s dad. I do think he very likely is connected to the darker secrets behind what really happened though, related to Will and El's original disappearances, leading up to them in the lab presumably.

I won't claim to understand the memory/time-loop nonsense, because I think that it could also have a lot to do with Will's powers related to time and therefore probability perhaps, which ties really well into the whole X-Men 134 reference. And yet, obviously, I feel like it's too much to try to be certain about which angle go at it, despite having a lot of the pieces to perhaps figure it out? Bc we can guess all day what Will's powers will look like, but we still don't really know for certain? And so going too far beyond that feels like too much guessing to me.

I will say that what makes me even more confident about this theory, even more than the Terry evidence, is just the heaps of evidence connecting Will and El from the very beginning, and how that also connects to Joyce and Hopper more often than not.

If you're open to looking at evidence related to the whole Joyce + Hopper = Willel twins + Jon ? gate (?), or even just how byler also fits into this, bc tbh a lot of the evidence connects, these are a few posts below that might peak your interest. And this isn’t even all of it.

This is the MAIN one so if you read any of them, read this (first and foremost)

Twelvegate Evidence going back to s1 and oh so many unanswered questions

Twelvegate Evidence going back to s1 + Willel Twins

Deer Imagery following The Hoppers/Byers Family

David Harbour cryptically changing his IG pfp to twins, multiple times before S4 dropped:

The fact that Star Wars' big plot twist was that Luke/Leia were twins... That the Duffers are twins... That Noah Schnapp is a twin... 'IT'S NOT YOUR FAULT (MIKE), THEY'RE IDENTICAL'...

El: Me? I'm twice as happy now *cut camera to estranged twin Will opening van door for him and El*

The Wright Bros

Parallels between El being confronted, with Will standing by frozen

"She missed her dad. We all do."

El and Will reuniting at Nina and the remaining timestamp is 12:00

"Mom!"

I will alway say that I am subject to be wrong. The only thing I'm very confident about now is that Terry isn't El's mom, and it just so happens that everything else sort of falls into place after that.

#byler #stranger things #twelvegate #willel twins #willel wondertwins #willel literal twins #joyce + hopper = willel twins + job #say it with me #lonnie is the biff of stranger things #hopper is the george mcfly #hopper starting the series on his couch with a focus on his pony tail bracelet and his wrist watch was a nod to will and el #along with the references to keys consistently connecting hopper and joyce being willel #its all connected #also if will is jesus #hopper is god? #i mean he is very much giving resurrection arc a lot... #also dont even get me started about how a lot of the side characters give off npc energy #constantly interrupting the characters before they're close to figuring shit out #it's weird #I do think that it's very likely Henry knows something about what the lab did not only to him but will and el #and perhaps he is not totally wrong for wanting justice bc the world is a disgusting place and he's giving will and el an out to join him #away from this horrible world #it really depends on how far they want to go and how dark #i do think that it could get very very dark #but the good news is that the really painful tragic events that are going to be unveiled #are going to make the happy ending that much more gratifying #like imagine having a whole fluff fic ending with a happy ending #like cool but honestly where is the build up and earning of that happy ending #you cant know joy unless you've known sorrow #shits gonna get real