#It's not just the fatui antis annoying me mildly with how they talk about this

[burning-bunni]

The harbinger order? is confusing me rant

*Discussion of Leaks, if you don't wanna see it that don't read this*

Okay so I'm sure some folks have seen the leaks that are saying Capitano is #1, Arlecchino is #4, #10 is empty for some reason, and Pierro isn't one of the number Harbingers, he's the director of them which feels like a bit of a weird choice if you ask me, but who knows

Now this makes sense in some parts and confuses me in others but I think mostly what people are trying to make of why the #10 seat is empty is confusing me most and I really don't see eye to eye with a lot of the conclusions people are coming to

Like, oh it's empty because the Traveler will be #10 that's why

But that makes no sense for a number of reasons from the fact that the traveler has beaten Signora who was #8 and while the Harbingers don't seem to be ranked purely based on strength from things that have been implied via voice lines and more, Signora doesn't run any major operation for the Fatui as far as we know like the Northland Bank, House of Heart, or holds any political position of power (once again from what we know)

She likely isn't based purely on strength, but also I bet that likely is a strong reason why she was ranked over someone like Pantalone, though again of course something may be revealed

But yeah if the Traveler could beat Signora with only 3 out of 7 elements, I doubt they'd be ranked under her and also Traveler's connections would be valuable so again #10 for the traveler makes no sense

"Oh there's some plot twist related to it" Yeah there could be, but in what way can we come to that conclusion now currently when there is not a single piece of evidence to prove as much? Plus what plot twist would it even be?

Like saying there will be a plot twist related to it this early when we have nothing to support that notion doesn't give charity and again that is so broad of a conclusion to come to that what would the plot twist even be? Like please elaborate more if you're gonna say that, why do you think that

"For whatever reason, #10 is empty" Honestly, gonna be honest here, if you ask me, I doubt #10 is just empty because no one has filled the role.

I feel like not only would the Fatui agents we've seen would remark on it like they remarked on #6 being empty for hundreds of years following the 3.3 quest, I feel like Scaramouche especially when he was shitting on Tartaglia would also mention that? Like haha look he brings down the Harbingers so much that he doesn't even fill the final slot, he's one below

So I doubt it's just like,, empty because there's been no body in that place before.

"We just don't know#10 yet, we haven't seen them" I doubt there's #10 currently if the order the leakers are talking about is in fact true for a number of reasons because

#1. it's the 11 Harbingers and Pierro does seem to be implied when people say that even if he's the director, like there are 11 (or I guess 9 now), its not the 11 harbingers and their director

#2. We all haven't forgotten the Harbinger Constellations image right? Which only has 11 constellations present and think what you may about what belongs to who, but the teardrop tragedy mask most likely belongs to Pierro given his namesake Pierrot and the teardrop present in his own mask like we see in the Lazzo trailer. While it is mixed with the Tragedy mask as it seems, that teardrop I genuinely would be surprised if it belongs to anyone else

Now, it could, Pierro's presence in this could be solely at the top of the image with that mask, but the thing is that the leakers seem to be emphasizing that we only will see the current harbingers we've seen and Pierro, we will only see those 11 and there isn't another member we will see coming from what Team China has said supposedly

So, yeah the case probably isn't there currently is a #10 and we just haven't met them

If I were to truly believe the leaks that are saying the order is actually this and not what we thought (which admittedly, I am hesitant to believe whole heartedly as it makes sense in certain areas but doesn't in others), then here are the conclusions I think could potentially be the reasons for what's going on with #10

Either, #10 is a retired rank hence why when Tartaglia joined he wasn't given the rank but rather #11, or #10 is in a similar position as Scaramouche with the 3.3 quest and #10 erased at the very least their association with the Fatui, as in erasing from the Irumsul whatever memories and perceptions were had related to their Harbingers title

To explain what I mean when I say retired rank, I want everyone to think of Signora's situation. There likely won't be another #8 or anyone moving up from the rank they currently are at to #8 I would guess due to what happened with Signora. Everyone below her keeps their current rank it doesn't move up like eliminating an option

Almost think like Jersey numbers that have been retired and now nobody can be that number. I think potentially whoever was #10 could have died somehow and out of respect no one ever took on #10 again not even when more candidates for a Harbinger came along

This would explain something like the lack of mentioning of #10 being that it could be a touchy topic, the Fatui avoid speaking of it since they don't wanna be perceived as saying something disrespectful of the late #10, additionally, why would the past death of a Harbinger necessarily be brought up especially in enemy areas like that's info that doesn't need to be discussed y'know?

And as for my other view of it, where #10 erased their existence within the Fatui, I think the only plausible time period for that to happen would be if it happened when Tartaglia had already become a Harbinger but it was before the Traveler started being active

Which could work, we don't know Childe's exact age we only know he's the youngest harbinger and he entered the Fatui initially at 14 (which since they say like "legends say hes been on the battle field since he was 14") I doubt he became a Harbinger at that age, but theoretically from 15-16 to about 2-3 depending years before his current age could be the range I think for when he became a Harbinger and after which #10 erased their association with the Fatui

And the reason I say that is because think of Scara's situation, everyone is already at their set ranks and just because everyone's perception of him was erased, doesn't change the actual events that happened which is why the traveler remembers them. The reason everyone doesn't move up a rank or wasn't appoint as a rank isn't because it was always that empty but because they only now think it was empty all along

Now this point could be where a plot twist happens like what was mentioned, depending on if we get revealed who #10 was and cite like "Oh Scara did the same that's the foreshadowing for how someone else in the Fatui erased and blah blah blah" but like you can't firmly say yet "Oh yeah the #10 reveal is gonna be a plot twist" or "there's gonna be totally a plot twist related to the #10 seat" like

Yeah there's potential for it, there are things set up to where we could come to the conclusion that its the same case for the #10 whether with Scara or Signora, but you can't really use any of that to for sure say there will be a plot twist related to it and things that could be foreshadowed isn't what a plot twist is either so like

I dunno I just don't like the idea of saying for certain when we only have leaks especially to go off of and literally nothing related to specifically the #10 seat in game, that there will be a plot twist related to it

Again, these are all leaks, there are things to support the idea, things could still change, there are things that contradict them a bit and will need further explanation in game to trust

We're just gonna have to see how it pans out in the end, I'm not gonna hop on board anyone's trains other than my own (tho I'm not even 100% confident in it) because I really do disagree with a lot of people's conclusions about this (not about believing the order, just about with #10 mostly and stuff)

#It's not just the fatui antis annoying me mildly with how they talk about this #ngl its mostly fatui fans trying to discuss this that are making me utterly roll my eyes #no hate for anyone really #ToT I feel so mean for saying all of this #I just get very particular about genshin lore and theories #Again I'm not even 100% confident in my own ideas about what's up #I just feel like certain things are no brainers yknow? #genshin #genshin impact #genshin impact lore #genshin lore #genshin theories #genshin leaks #spoilers #fatui harbingers #genshin harbingers #long post