#Tol-Sirion

[aureentuluva70]

I'm not sure if this has been talked about before, but I'm gonna talk about it regardless because it has completely blown my mind. I first discovered it on a reddit post, which you can read here.

In the book The History of the Hobbit, John Rateliff suggests that the Wilderlands of The Hobbit is actually the Beleriand of Tolkien's early mythology as it was written during the 1930's, only taking place ages after the War of the Jewels, since the later ages and maps of middleearth hadn't been created by Tolkien yet. Keep in mind that at this point in Tolkien's writings, the breaking of Thangorodrim was nowhere near as bad as it would later turn out to be. Beleriand never sank into the sea, but it was still drastically changed.

Here are two maps drawn by Tolkien during the 1930's, one of Beleriand and the other of the Wilderlands found in the Hobbit:

In terms of similarities, one of the first things I noticed(and one of the most obvious) was the river Sirion and the Great River of the Wilderlands. The name Sirion literally translates to 'Great River'.

In the middle of the path of said river is the Carrock, which is where the Eagles set Bilbo and Company down after saving them, and the way it is described in the Hobbit reminds me a lot of this illustration Tolkien made of Tol-Sirion:

"But cropping out of the ground, right in the path of the stream which looped itself about it, was a great rock, almost a hill of stone, like a last outpost of the distant mountains, or a huge piece cast miles into the plain by some giant among giants."

-The Hobbit, Queer Lodgings.

AND it is also uses very similar wording to how the Lay of Leithian describes Tol-Sirion(Tolkien was working on the Leithian around the same time he was writing The Hobbit):

'An isled hill there stood alone/ amid the valley, like a stone/rolled from the distant mountains vast/when giants in tumult hurtled past'

-Lay of Leithian.

There's also the mention of "a little cave, (a wholesome one with a pebbly floor) at the foot of the steps" which the person in the reddit post suggests could be the remains of the very same dungeon where Finrod, Beren, and their companions were imprisoned by Sauron after their disguises were stripped away. The same place where all but one of them were slowly devoured one by one. The same place where Finrod died.

Above it at the top of the Carrock would be where Finrod was buried, and the "Ford of huge flat stones [that] led to the grass-land beyond the stream" could be the remains of the broken bridge that was destroyed by Luthien: "the hill trembled; the citadel/crumbled and all its towers fell/the rocks yawned and the bridge broke/and Sirion spurned in sudden smoke."

The "two Mirkwoods" is also a big one. I always found it odd that there were two completely different forests sharing the same name, but at the time Tolkien wrote it, they weren't seperate at all, but the exact same forest, just changed and grown over thousands of years in between the events of the Silmarillion and The Hobbit. The same forest that Sauron fled to after the fall of Tol-in-Guarhoth. The same one Beleg found Gwindor in after his escape from Angband.

If they really were intended to be the same forest at the time Tolkien wrote it, it also answers the question I had earlier regarding this part in the Leithian when Sauron flees Tol-in-Guarhoth:

A new stronghold? We never hear anything about this in the Silmarillion, of Sauron building a new stronghold in Taur-nu-fuin, and it puzzled me when I first read it. But that's when I realized that this "new throne and darker stronghold" was talking about none other than the fortress of Dol Guldur itself, Sauron's stronghold within Mirkwood.

(Not lying, I was pretty proud of myself for figuring that one out)

Oh, and the Lonely Mountain? While it doesnt appear on the 1930's Beleriand map, it would likely be Maedhros's fortress of Himring itself, or at least the mountain it was built on top of, as Himring is located east of Taur-nu-fuin just about in the same place where Erebor is located. Just the thought of the Dwarves' home being within the very mountain that once had Maedhros's citadel atop it has my brain going wild. (Oh, and the fact that the arkenstone was found within the ancient hills of what was once Himring, fortress of the elf lord who threw himself into a fiery chasm with a silmaril? Coincidence? I think NOT)

There are plenty of other similar locations between the two maps, and judging by them both Eriador would be Hithlum/Aryador, with the Misty Mountains being the Mountains of Shadow. The Withered Heath would be the Anfauglith, the Eagle Eyrie would be the Crissaegrim, and the Iron Hills are what's left of Nogrod and Belegost. I've even heard that Mavwin/Morwen's house could be the roots of Rivendell.

Overall, it's so, so cool and it has my mind running wild. It really makes me see The Hobbit in a whole new light. We all talk about the amazing stories that came out of the Hobbit aka Lord of the Rings, but seeing where the stories of the Hobbit came from just adds a whole other level of depth to it all. This is why I love Tolkien's works so much. It's all so incredibly deep and rich and it just gets better and richer the deeper you go, and there's so much of it. It's one of those things that you just rarely get tired of, and even if you do, you're bound to come back to it later and I love it.

#Tolkien #Silmarillion #Hobbit #Lay of Leithian #Beleriand #Wilderlands #Lotr #Erebor #Taur-nu-fuin #Mirkwood #Lonely Mountain #Sirion #Finrod #Beren #Luthien #Maedhros #Sauron #Tol-Sirion #Tol-in-Guarhoth

[moredhel]

enjoy the silence

#my art #tolkien #silmarillion #art #fanart #elves #tolkien fanart #finrod #felagund #findarato #turgon #turukano #nolofinweans #arafinweans #Turgon son of Fingolfin left Nevrast where he dwelt #and sought out Finrod his friend upon the island of Tol Sirion #and they journeyed southward along the river #do you think they had a situationship

[anipologist]

There is not nearly enough said about Tolkien's ability to encompass volumes into very short sentences. Mostly because, yes the man was a master of lush descriptions and certainly he loves to wax long and poetically about stars and trees and far green fields under the wind...

But the skill with which he can pack an emotional punch into a couple of words...

Consider the following

"Then Fingolfin beheld (as it seemed to him) the utter ruin of the Noldor, and the defeat beyond redress of all their houses; and filled with wrath and despair he mounted upon Rochallor his great horse and rode forth alone, and none might restrain him. He passed over Dor-nu-Fauglith like a wind amid the dust, and all that beheld his onset fled in amaze, thinking that Oromë himself was come: for a great madness of rage was upon him, so that his eyes shone like the eyes of the Valar. Thus he came alone to Angband's gates, and he sounded his horn, and smote once more upon the brazen doors, and challenged Morgoth to come forth to single combat. "

And the final sentence "And Morgoth came."

All of that imagery of Fingolfin coming upon Morgoth like a Vala himself and throwing down his figurative gauntlet and then the fallen Vala coming forth with just a three word sentence.

Or the entirety of the Duel of Sauron and Finrod (that is renowned) all gorgeous imagery, the Lord of Wolves against the disguised king of Minas Tirith...

"Reeling and foundering, as ever more strong The chanting swelled, Felagund fought, And all the magic and might he brought Of Elvenesse into his words."

....

"The wolf howls. The ravens flee. The ice mutters in the mouths of the Sea. The captives sad in Angband mourn. Thunder rumbles, the fires burn"

And the final line "And Finrod fell before the throne."

The brevity and the switch from Felagund to just Finrod, from the dwarf-given title to his Telerin-originated father-name as he falls defenseless to the reminder of the kinslaying is devastating in its simplicity.

There is a time for lush descriptions and a time for brevity, a time for gorgeous, expensive imagery and allegory and a time for literary simplicity and Tolkien knew it...

#jrr tolkien #tolkien #lord of the rings #the silmarillion #lotr #finrod felagund #fingolfin #tolkien elves #silmarillion #dagor bragollach #Tol sirion #tol in gaurhoth #tolkien fandom #tolkien musing #tolkien meta #text post #literary #beren and luthien

[eilinelsghost]

Tol Sirion

I couldn't make any progress on the current writing WIP until I figured out some logistics for the island, so here's my best shot at a sketch of Tol Sirion with Minas Tirith looking out toward the north of the pass. (I did keep Tolkien's funky lil gnome-hat roofs because I love them.)

Even the great "house" of Finrod, Minas Tirith, as its name "Tower of Watch" signifies, on an island in Sirion, was primarily a fort intended to command the accesses into Beleriand from the North.

The Nature of Middle-earth, VI Dwellings in Middle-earth

#tol sirion #finrod #the silmarillion #sketches #frankie draws

[ettelenethelien]

Minas Tirith means "Tower of Guard", which seems like a pretty normal name for a fortress facing the enemy, and I'm not puzzled that there are two places called that in the legendarium.

What I am puzzled about is why no one in Gondor seems to find it ominous that their capital city is named the same as a fortress famously taken over by the enemy they're fighting (as explained in one of the world's best known tales).

#ofc a name doesn't mean anything #but 1) this is ME so maybe it does #2) it's still weird #// #my post #minas tirith #tol sirion #gondor #finrod #lay of leithian #Silmarillion #tolkien #lotr #lord of the rings

[a-world-of-whimsy-5]

Map/Layout of Tol-in-Gaurhoth under Sauron's command (click to see clearer image)

#tol-in-gaurhoth #tol sirion #fantasy maps #the silm #the silmarillion #the silm fanart #worldbuilding

[outofangband]

Basic Tol Sirion World Building

world building post for the Isle of Wolves!

World Building Masterlist

This was requested by an anon awhile ago, I’m so sorry for the delay

Please feel free to ask more!! General posts are hard because I didn’t have specific categories to cover so feel free to send categories or more questions!

Tol Sirion stood from the middle of the first century of the first age, for almost 400 years until 456 FA. Finrod first oversaw its building but Orodreth was left in charge and it was under his rule that the fortress lasted until Sauron

-Minas Tirith, unlike Nargothrond, is primarily a military operation rather than a creation of a realm where people can live and work and prosper. Minas Tirith means watch tower.

-Minas Tirith is constructed primarily from white limestone, mostly from deposits of the river Sirion, south of Tol Sirion. Slate, wood and clay were also used

-It is not a city, but rather watch tower with a collection of outer buildings, including an infirmary, a library of sorts, where information about the lands and its creatures and people were collected for sometime, an armory and forge and small houses. The watch tower itself has a number of personal rooms.

-There are also gardens and a small greenhouse, partly modeled after the one built at Barad Eithel which was warmed through hot springs. The greenhouse at Tol Sirion is mostly warmed through the sun and with steaming and misting practices originating from Alqualondë

-The library was a project of Finrod’s and at the time of its creation held very little text, because there was not room to bring many tomes, and written, works over. However, by the time it was invaded there was a modest collection of research. Not all of it would turn out to be completely accurate, but always done with sincerity, and with the help of truly preserving information. All of it was destroyed when the island was invaded.

-Food was primarily sourced from the river itself and from trade with Dorthonion, Hithlum, and Nargothrond. The island of Tol Sirion was probably both too small and its soil in ideal for large scale agricultural production though materials like leaves, roots, some fruit and meat were obtained locally. There were also some smaller gardens, mostly for medicinal herbs but some vegetables too.

-Fresh fish and vegetables, both grown and foraged, are common. During the Watchful peace, small scale agriculture projects are headed by some of the host. These were primarily west, in the shadow of the Ered Wethrin. Trout and river lampreys are delicacies

-Wild mushrooms are also eaten. Elves who have more contact with dwarven and human groups are more likely to eat mushrooms

-Materials for clothing, weapons and other supplies were also mostly acquired through trade however during the Watchful peace, mineral and ore deposits in the nearby mountains were quarried to gather metals and other resources

-The environment is far colder than Tirion, Alqualondë and the rest of Valinor and Orodreth and his host would suffer homesickness at times. The summers and spring are warm however and the island is draped in wild flowers and wild herbs, the scene mixing with the cool water

-The island is large enough that there are several small underground streams that cut through it. It’s from one of these that a well is sourced which provides Minas Tirith with water. It is from two of these wells that form the caverns that will become the pits of the Isle of Wolves. With the streams corrupted by Sauron’s force and repairs of the wells and foundations are no longer done so frequently, the water that drips down the walls where Finrod’s company are chained is poisoned and foul

Please feel free to ask more!

#the silmarillion #tol sirion #Finrod #orodreth #beleriand #musing and meta #tol in gaurhoth

[that-angry-noldo]

Eleven figures.

Tol-Sirion is empty. The silence is deafening. The silence is dead.

Dead, because you can't hear the singing of the birds, or the rustling of a mouse, or the creaking of a cricket. Dead, because you can't hear the ringing of shackles, the howls of werewolves, the laughter of orcs.

Dead, because the river has turned into a swamp, because the sky above your head is gray and cold.

It's dead because Tol-Sirion is a grave.

Beren walks uncertainly. It's his first time returning here.

Something in him screams that he doesn't need to.

But he would come, says a quiet voice. He always came, visiting your grandfather or his father or his father or his-

He would want me to come.

I want to come.

His body trembles, either from the cold or from memories.

Beren never allowed himself to think about it and feel fear. He can't - he has no right to be afraid.

They weren't afraid.

What a lie.

I have no right to be.

He never came here. All he had was a memory of a dead, torn body in his arms. All he had was the sound of his own scream. The sound of his own sobs.

You shouldn't have died.

But he died, and it's Beren's fault.

The shifted towers of the fortress ominously rise, forgotten by all. Forgotten by all, in this dark, cursed place.

The fortress is destroyed.

He remembers her grief. He remembers her strangled scream.

He remembers the sound that terrified everyone on the island. Inhuman. Unearthly.

He remembers how the walls fell, and how Luthien stood helplessly on her knees, and how her hands gently cupped her relative's face, and how tears flowed softly down her cheeks.

It should have been me.

At the site of the tomb, among the ruined walls, stand eleven skillfully carved statues.

Beren inhales sharply, but does not stop.

If Edrahil saw me, he would say I have no chance of defeating Morgoth in such mood.

Hilie would laugh and say that no one has tried and that I will be the first.

He would smile and put his hand on my shoulder.

For a second — just for a second — they were alive again, and they stood around him again, slowly discussing various plans, as if they were not going to die, as if they were not dying for a mortal.

Your people died for me. Your people are dying for my kin. I will be honored to repay you thus.

But they were dead, and only cold marble statues stood around Beren, and Edrahil's eyes were forever focused on the emptiness, Hilie's lips were forever tightly pursed, and King's hands were forever raised, as if he were entering the Song again.

Beren cries. This is wrong. Edrahil has to live and continue stabbing people with sarcasm. Hilie has to keep singing songs she loved so much. (Beren doesn't have to hear the crunch of her bones and a dull, wet scream every time he closes her eyes. He doesn't have to remember that she was the first every time he hears a wolf howl). Finrod has -

Finrod has to smile and tell him about - everything, about everything, about everything. He must turn away from him. He has to throw him over the threshold. He has to look at his people and say, "You're right, this is idiocy. Get that bastard out the door."

However, the crown always falls to the floor, and Finrod's steel gray eyes look straight at him, and he hands him the ring.

And Beren cries.

He had to be with them. He was to be among them. There were to be twelve, twelve statues.

"It should have been me" he sobs, falling to his knees. "It should have been me."

The white statue looks at him with cold stone eyes.

#beren 👏angst 👏 is 👏 underrated 👏 #my boy #my sweet prince #i'm sorry #it can be read as a sneak peek to he who sings #but i decided it can be it's own thing too #beren has to deal with survival guilt not once but twice #one when his father and hus companions died #two when he survived tol sirion #beren #luthien #finrod #beren angst #silmarillion #silm #tolkien #lotr #edrahil #tolkien fic

[ailinu]

fascinated by the implications of orodreth sending his wife and baby gil-galad to cirdan and the falas for safekeeping, whilst both he and finduilas end up in nargothrond. like i know this is a product of the changing editorial decisions that eventually assign gil-galad's parentage to orodreth but like. what's going on here man. why aren't you sending your daughter off for safekeeping, too? we could have avoided a good chunk of the whole turin thing.

#crucially i am back at work on my fin-galad fic and trying to wrangle the timelines #because like: if we assume that orodreth sends everyone in his family away from tol-sirion after dagor bragollach #then finduilas hits nargothrond and gil-galad hits the havens around f.a. 455 #but finduilas's stuff with turin doesn't go down until f.a. 495 #and gil-galad is high king of the noldor by f.a. 510 #which means we've got *tight* turnaround if we (i) want to make this happen #especially since real!gil-galad would have had that extra forty years to establish some of his leadership credentials #and fin-galad has a scant fifteen to recover from the turin thing. change her elf gender. and go get established.

[kameliabronx]

But Finarfin spoke softly, as was his wont, and sought to calm the Noldor, persuading them to pause and ponder ere deeds were done that could not be undone; and Orodreth, alone of his sons, spoke in like manner

Sauron, greatest and most terrible of the servants of Morgoth, who in the Sindarin tongue was named Gorthaur, came against Orodreth, the warden of the tower upon Tol Sirion

On that day all the pride and host of Nargothrond withered away; and Orodreth was slain in the forefront of the battle

#silmarillion #silm #orodreth #artaresto #tolkien #elves #nargothrond #tol sirion #noldor #arafinweans #silm moodboard #silmedit #moodboard

[squirrelwrangler]

Was telling my friend about how this week has been watching others play through the third Ace Attorney game and how one of the secondary pairings is almost insulting in how absolutely tailored to my tastes it is and now I was obligated to put it into a fusion Silm fic.

A brainstorm later and I have some more ridiculous angst involving Houseless fea and prisoners of Tol Sirion and some new characters to have roles in the Ghost Aegnor and Gorlim Buddy Cop drama that will strengthen that stretch of plot. And more angst for Consael, Aglar, and Faelineth. And an explanation for how she survived the Fall of Nargothrond and avoided capture unlike Faelindis or Finduilas. But most of all, I get an angsty nearly blind widower hellbent on tracking down Sauron for revenge even though he has no chance of doing anything against the weakened Maia with the ghost of his Noldo ranger lady love following him demanding a healthier coping method while herself refusing the call of Mandos.

#working on Silm fic #I love elf ghosts too much #is part of my glee the obvious rift on RoP? yes #but this also adds to Service to the Dead #and fleshes out the Tol Sirion ten #nice to have a dedicated OV for the other prisoners that helped B/L bury Finrod

[tenth-sentence]

Then Sauron made it into a watchtower for Morgoth, a stronghold of evil, and a menace; and the fair isle of Tol Sirion became accursed, and it was called Tol-in-Gaurhoth, the Isle of Werewolves.

"The Silmarillion" - J.R.R. Tolkien

#book quote #the silmarillion #jrr tolkien #watchtower #stronghold #menace #curse #island #fair isle #werewolves #sauron #morgoth #tol sirion #tol in gaurhoth #isle of werewolves

[pacificgasandelectric]

inventing a time machine just to go back and make tolkien write a second draft of the contest of finrod and sauron

#mine #WHY did he not get that far in the lay of leithian 2.0 new and improved version #i finally reached tol sirion in my readthru of the first lay which means i’m abt halfway thru #and i’ve just been thinking this whole time that this poem is like… not that good! #obviously it’s Bearable and it’s certainly Interesting but it’s also CLEARLY a first draft #we were Robbed of an Actually Good second draft version by jrrt working on Other Less Cool Stuff like [checks notes] The Lord Of The Rings #also while i was there i would yell at him abt the sexism too obvs but only AFTER i got my second draft of finrod & sauron. priorities #silm #jrrt #jrrtlb

[elevenelvenswords]

Sauron is named Melkor's greatest and most trusted servant, but why are we all ignoring Gothmog's accomplishments on Melkor's behalf??? Let's take a look at his most notable deeds:

-Killed Fëanor

-Killed Fingon

-Killed Ecthelion

-Captured Húrin

-Saved Melkor's ass during the whole Ungoliant incident

-Successfully led the assault upon Gondolin

Meanwhile Sauron captured Tol Sirion only to lose it to a girl and her dog.

Gothmog was literally 99% of Angband's power and he's NOT getting enough credit.

#gothmog #melkor #silmarillion #my man deserved a promotion!!

[eilinelsghost]

Song of Sirion

Fic by @welcomingdisaster; Art by @eilinelsghost For @tolkienrsb 2023

Fic Rating: T; Art Rating: G Warnings: No Archive Warnings Apply Relationships: Finduilas & Edrahil, Finrod & Edrahil Characters: Edrahil, Finduilas, Finrod, Gwindor Word count: 15k

Minas Tirith burns. Finrod's company rides to the rescue. When an orc attack forces his servant Edrahil and his niece Finduilas to break away from the group, they learn much of each other, and of the land. But Edrahil can feel his doom approach, and Finduilas struggles with the loss of her city. Coming home will not be easy.

More sparrows landed on the rocks. Edrahil let them catch his gaze, and tried to remember the rhyme. “What is seven for?” he asked. Finduilas thought a moment. He could see her lips move as she recited it, the words coming to him in her half-whisper. Five birds for silver, six birds for gold, seven little birdies for— “Doom untold,” she said. Edrahil shut his eyes. “Lovely.”

At long last, it's the day! Go read this wonderful piece by @welcomingdisaster! I had pretty much zero vision for where a story could go with these two when I put this art together (I just really wanted to draw them?) and Lena has taken that and written such an amazing story. It was such a delight to see this come together and I'm so excited that you all get to read it now too!

#trsb23 #finduilas #edrahil #tol sirion #finrod #gwindor #fic rec #my art #silmarillion fanfic #silmarillion art #frankie draws

[welcomingdisaster]

(lost tol sirion again and spent half an hour looking for it, convincing myself that it had somehow disappeared from the map while i was gone)

#lena speaks