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nicklloydnow · 24 days

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“This campaign against Rowling is as dangerous as it is absurd. The brutal stabbing of Salman Rushdie last summer is a forceful reminder of what can happen when writers are demonized. And in Rowling’s case, the characterization of her as a transphobe doesn’t square with her actual views.

So why would anyone accuse her of transphobia? Surely, Rowling must have played some part, you might think.

The answer is straightforward: Because she has asserted the right to spaces for biological women only, such as domestic abuse shelters and sex-segregated prisons. Because she has insisted that when it comes to determining a person’s legal gender status, self-declared gender identity is insufficient. Because she has expressed skepticism about phrases like “people who menstruate” in reference to biological women. Because she has defended herself and, far more important, supported others, including detransitioners and feminist scholars, who have come under attack from trans activists. And because she followed on Twitter and praised some of the work of Magdalen Berns, a lesbian feminist who had made incendiary comments about transgender people.

You might disagree — perhaps strongly — with Rowling’s views and actions here. You may believe that the prevalence of violence against transgender people means that airing any views contrary to those of vocal trans activists will aggravate animus toward a vulnerable population.

But nothing Rowling has said qualifies as transphobic. She is not disputing the existence of gender dysphoria. She has never voiced opposition to allowing people to transition under evidence-based therapeutic and medical care. She is not denying transgender people equal pay or housing. There is no evidence that she is putting trans people “in danger,” as has been claimed, nor is she denying their right to exist.

Take it from one of her former critics. E.J. Rosetta, a journalist who once denounced Rowling for her supposed transphobia, was commissioned last year to write an article called “20 Transphobic J.K. Rowling Quotes We’re Done With.” After 12 weeks of reporting and reading, Rosetta wrote, “I’ve not found a single truly transphobic message.” On Twitter she declared, “You’re burning the wrong witch.”

(…)

Phelps-Roper has taken the time to rethink her biases. She is now the host of “The Witch Trials of J.K. Rowling.” The podcast, based on nine hours of her interviews with Rowling — the first time Rowling has spoken at length about her advocacy — explores why Rowling has been subjected to such wide-ranging vitriol despite a body of work that embraces the virtues of being an outsider, the power of empathy toward one’s enemies and the primacy of loyalty toward one’s friends.

The podcast, which also includes interviews with critics of Rowling, delves into why Rowling has used her platform to challenge certain claims of so-called gender ideology — such as the idea that transgender women should be treated as indistinguishable from biological women in virtually every legal and social context. Why, both her fans and her fiercest critics have asked, would she bother to take such a stand, knowing that attacks would ensue?

“The pushback is often, ‘You are wealthy. You can afford security. You haven’t been silenced.’ All true. But I think that misses the point. The attempt to intimidate and silence me is meant to serve as a warning to other women” with similar views who may also wish to speak out, Rowling says in the podcast.

“And I say that because I have seen it used that way,” Rowling continues. She says other women have told her they’ve been warned: “Look at what happened to J.K. Rowling. Watch yourself.”

(…)

Phelps-Roper told me that Rowling’s outspokenness is precisely in the service of this kind of cause. “A lot of people think that Rowling is using her privilege to attack a vulnerable group,” she said. “But she sees herself as standing up for the rights of a vulnerable group.”

Rowling, Phelps-Roper added, views speaking out as a responsibility and an obligation: “She’s looking around and realizing that other people are self-censoring because they cannot afford to speak up. But she felt she had to be honest and stand up against a movement that she saw as using authoritarian tactics.”

As Rowling herself notes on the podcast, she’s written books where “from the very first page, bullying and authoritarian behavior is held to be one of the worst of human ills.” Those who accuse Rowling of punching down against her critics ignore the fact that she is sticking up for those who have silenced themselves to avoid the job loss, public vilification and threats to physical safety that other critics of recent gender orthodoxies have suffered.

(…)

In the words of Fiennes: “J.K. Rowling has written these great books about empowerment, about young children finding themselves as human beings. It’s about how you become a better, stronger, more morally centered human being,” he said. “The verbal abuse directed at her is disgusting. It’s appalling.”

Despite media coverage that can be embarrassingly credulous when it comes to the charges against Rowling, a small number of influential journalists have also begun speaking out in her defense. Here in America, Caitlin Flanagan of The Atlantic tweeted last year, “Eventually, she will be proven right, and the high cost she’s paid for sticking to her beliefs will be seen as the choice of a principled person.

(…)

Because what Rowling actually says matters. In 2016, when accepting the PEN/Allen Foundation award for literary service, Rowling referred to her support for feminism — and for the rights of transgender people. As she put it, “My critics are at liberty to claim that I’m trying to convert children to satanism, and I’m free to explain that I’m exploring human nature and morality or to say, ‘You’re an idiot,’ depending on which side of the bed I got out of that day.”

Rowling could have just stayed in bed. She could have taken refuge in her wealth and fandom. In her “Harry Potter” universe, heroes are marked by courage and compassion. Her best characters learn to stand up to bullies and expose false accusations. And that even when it seems the world is set against you, you have to stand firm in your core beliefs in what’s right.

Defending those who have been scorned isn’t easy, especially for young people. It’s scary to stand up to bullies, as any “Harry Potter” reader knows. Let the grown-ups in the room lead the way. If more people stood up for J.K. Rowling, they would not only be doing right by her; they’d also be standing up for human rights, specifically women’s rights, gay rights and, yes, transgender rights. They’d also be standing up for the truth.”

“But I do like the phrase, implying as it does a refusal to bow down to the establishment. Although we had a Labour government from 1974, it’s fair to say that the establishment of the 1970s was a fusty right-wing thing, sexist and racist and snobbish. But funnily enough, it’s still sexist and snobbish, in that women and the working-class are expected to obey (transvestite) men and the liberal elite respectively; it’s not racist in the old vulgar way but in a modish, middle-class way, dealing in the poverty of low expectations, seen best in that hilarious Labour election promise that only Jeremy Corbyn ‘can be trusted to unlock the talent of black, Asian and minority ethnic people’ when the Tory cabinet already featured more black, Asian and minority ethnic people than a Labour one ever had. Oh, and racism is also judging people on the colour of their skin as opposed to the content of their character – as Martin Luther King preferred – which is inherent in every diversity and inclusion drive, every taking of the knee, every ‘black-out’ theatre performance. When people of colour refuse to lose their agency by identifying as underdogs and waiting for whitey to save them (some to the point of becoming Conservative politicians), they may be called ‘coconuts’ and all sorts of nasty names – but in a caring, anti-racist way.

(…)

Punk wasn’t ever left-wing – it was anti-establishment, so whatever the establishment is for, punk was against it. The anti-Lydon lot will always bring up The Clash as an example of a left-wing punk band, but this was more a difference of class origin than of politics proper; Joe Strummer was a lovely fellow, but he was also an upper-middle public schoolboy and thereby prone to a bit of P’n’P (poncing and posing) with his R’n’R. Of the other big punk bands, The Damned were about as political as The Munch Bunch, The Stranglers had a soft spot for the crazed Japanese militarist Yukio Mishima and The Jam were young patriots who pined for ‘the great empire’ and spat loathing at avuncular James Callaghan (‘The truth is you’ve lost, Uncle Jimmy!’). Unlike the cosy 1960s scene, they barely spoke to each other; that was the whole point of punk, to be different. But the rewriting of punk history by anxious middle-class lefties happened almost from the start; by the 1980s, punk was being recalled as a reaction against Thatcher’s Britain, despite it all kicking off three years before she became prime minister. Indeed, with her desire to destroy anything which seemed weak and outdated, there’s a case for saying that Mrs T was the most punk politician thus far. This was echoed in Sex Pistol Steve Jones’s autobiography Lonely Boy – surprisingly good – in which he understandably writes that he went into showbiz to make money as much as music, and that when he finally scraped enough royalties together to buy himself a second-hand car, Vivienne Westwood accused him of ‘selling out’. This would be the Vivienne Westwood who took an honour from the monarchy and was a shameless tax avoider. Hypocrite, heal thyself.

Punk was, as Westwood and McLaren so flagrantly demonstrated, always marbled with corruption, as indeed is every place where art meets showbiz; it gives it its piquancy. But punk is like a religion to some pathetic purists now. There was a long-running argument on a social media forum a few weeks ago about whether Anarchy In The UK was a call to real anarchic communal living. (No, that would be for the filthy hippies.) Others said (correctly) that it was simply a call to smash the status quo – and the status quo is now woke.

Punk can be traced back to historical anti-establishment art from the political cartoons of the 18th century, through Beyond The Fringe to Monty Python, all mocking the monarchy, judges, police and politicians. It couldn’t have started anywhere but England; someone said that Brexit was an amalgamation of South Downs Tories and snarling inner-city punks. It was only natural that the great charismatic loner contrarians of 20th century pop, Lydon and Morrissey, were in favour; If you’re independent and rebellious, you certainly weren’t going to be a remainer.

Predictably, the vast majority of those who identify as punks these days come across as extremely wet blankets who get their knickers in a twist over weird things; think of the hissy-fit Rage Against the Machine had over people who wouldn’t wear masks at their gigs and the American ‘punks’ who beat up ‘fascists’ who aren’t fascists in the least unless one uses the word in the manner of Rik in The Young Ones. Then we have the weirdest cause of all, trans. whereby privileged white men can whack on some rouge and call themselves women – the war for the soul of punk is being fought on this front, too.

(…)

When I started out as a musician, I thought that punks were anti-establishment; then when my first album was released, I passed through the scene and realised it’s full of Stasi boneheads who love the boot when they’re the ones wearing it. Punks pretend to be rebellious musicians but act more like bureaucrats and propagandists who contribute nothing to music except a pathological hatred of women and the highest form of wokery I’ve ever personally encountered. Speaking your mind publicly is what making music is all about; freedom of speech and our hard-won rights as women – especially in male dominated music industry – is something that should be protected at all costs no matter what -ism we’re living under. But when the establishment and corporations support you, you are the establishment. So, for me being a Terf is about as punk as it gets.

I was there; I may not have liked the music much, but I lived the ribald and riotous experience that was punk – and I know a short-haired hippie when I see one. As I wrote in Welcome To The Woke Trials: ‘Woke is the revenge of the dullard on the wit, the curtain-twitcher on the headline-maker, the wallflower on the whirling dancer’ – add to that ‘the establishment stooge who believes himself righteous on the outlaw’. So, punk’s not dead – this time, she’s a Terf.”

#terf #punk #anti establishment #john lydon #johnny rotten #brexit #joe strummer #the clash #britain #margaret thatcher #julie burchill #woke #jk rowling #harry potter #free speech #antiauthoritarian

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ratchet-serperior · 1 year

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I have some Thoughts. Yes this is related to current drama, no I will not give more context on what or why. I also wholly intend for this to stay to myself, so no tags today for all of my zero followers.

I don't use Twitter. This little hellsite and another, redder hellsite are the only social media platforms I use. I do not care about drama. In fact, I hate getting involved in drama. So, more often than not, I just ignore it until it goes away.

I used to be fully on board with the idea of socially ostracizing someone if they did something fucked up. Find out that JonTron is racist, yeah let's boycott his videos. Find out that JK Rowling is... JK Rowling... Yeah, we shouldn't accept that kind of behaviour. But, the more I see these things happening, the more I see calls to cancel someone (or more likely, see posts saying that someone has already been cancelled), the less I believe in the idea, for one simple reason.

The Twitter mobs are usually just wrong.

This has long been known about social media, but there's not a lot of room for nuance. On Twitter, you have only a certain number of characters to use. On other platforms, you see a post and can take it in isolation, not able to or simply not needing to understand the context surrounding them. This becomes a problem when a large group of people rush to cancel someone for doing a Bad Thing. Hell, all I know about the JonTron thing is that he said a racist thing at some point. I don't know what he said, in what context, or if he ever said anything like it again. But, for me several years ago, it was all I needed to instantly decide that he was a terrible person and I should hate him and all that he does.

Then, as more people I follow got cancelled, I was less and less involved in the effort. When the drama surrounding ProJared came out some years ago, I was on board at first, then kinda just stopped caring. Then, he came back after the flames had died down a bit, and explained what was going on. Some accusations were outright lies, and others were misunderstandings or exaggerations made through the social game of telephone online. Overall, maybe he did fuck up, but in a completely human, understandable way.

Another that I remember vividly was ZeRo. He had these accusations of sexting underage girls which essentially pushed him away from social media entirely. He even came out and admitted it, right? So cancelling him worked! Well, no. A long while later, he came back to YouTube and admitted that, after the mobs got to him, he decided to admit to it, and then kill himself. He thought it would be easier that way on everyone involved, because he knew that not only was he being cancelled, but everyone associated with him was feeling the backlash. He thought that if he took the fall, those around him would be spared from the negative association.

And, I mean... Can we talk about how massively fucked up that is? Even if the accusations were true (which they weren't), can we recognize that driving someone to suicide for that is a massively deranged thing to do? I can't imagine being in that situation. Because yeah, I've fucked up before. I've even had some major fuck ups that would have probably gotten me cancelled, if I were in any sort of public sphere. I know it, I learned from it, and I can move on from it.

So yeah, forgive me if I don't care about the latest youtuber drama, celebrity drama, whatever. Forgive me for not immediately raising pitchforks and torches to burn down their homes for supposedly doing a bad thing. And don't get me wrong here- BAD THINGS ARE STILL BAD. And they should be punished. But the mob justice of the internet and social media on these people is far too extreme, and in my experience, is usually wrong anyway.

#suicide mention #content warning suicide

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amazingphilza · 3 years

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twitchcon :: cc!multiple x reader

fluff , platonic , gender neutral ! some mcyt headcanons if you were to attend twitchcon w them

cc’s included in order: tommyinnit , tubbo , ranboo , wilbur soot , philza , technoblade

cw: kinda lengthy for the minors (i think), not as much for the hags LMAO /hj

tommyinnit

this man is so excited to be at his first twitchcon & being able to hang out with all his best friends makes it a hundred times better

when he isn’t at a panel or doing meet & greets, he’s dragging you everywhere to see the whole convention center (clingyinnit)

he is just so at awe despite this not being his first convention to attend

you’d be surprised he gets tired pretty quickly & stops over to the partner lounge

you both rest for a bit against a wall in a pretty packed hallway despite it being an exclusive area to twitch partners

every time a famous streamer walks by he will yell it out and record it then vlog your reaction, even if they’re surrounded with bodyguards & trying to get to another place quickly

he’d zoom in his camera to their face at a horrible angle and be like

“oh my god it is THE ninja. ninja famous fortnite player, HELLO.”

but he gets completely ignored

then the camera pans out to you, still really zoomed in that the capture is blurry

“ninjainnit?”

“EH?”

tommy is so confused, forgetting the bit ninja did on his twitter where he renamed himself ‘ninjainnit’ for a split second

okay tommy isn’t that athletic but he will chase you and the rest of your group down a hallway if he had to

he’d probably find a toy gun from the artist alley/seller booths and shoot you and wilbur with it

but if tommy stumbles across any of the dream team, it’s about to be minecraft manhunt but irl

and he will def play his stream music while walking or smth when he’s bored (or trying to jump dream & sapnap)

** DO DO DO DO MANHUNT MUSIC **

oh my god,, now thinking about it he’s probably the one to open like random doors of empty rooms and steal stuff while you film him

like he will take a random empty glass, a bunch of pens, a freebie t-shirt, everything he sees he takes with him and you’re just panic

“tommy we’re literally not supposed to be here, and i’m stuck here filming you. it’s surely a felony in action”

“well, it’s their fault for leaving the doors open! plus this is great content. who’s the dirty crime boy now, HM?”

you’d tell wilbur about this and he’d scold tommy and threaten him with the same pen tommy stole

tommy probably would also drag you some weird event happening outside twitchcon along with tubbo and ranboo

“pokimane is giving out free pizza to everyone if we go to this one restaurant down the street!”

“we are literally gonna get bombarded. have you forgot you’re like three of twitch’s top streamers? i’d rather pay for all of our meals than try getting free pizza from pokimane against all her other fans”

“DEAL! let’s go to five guys then!”

you unfortunately end up paying for all 3 of their meals and picking on their food instead of buying your own

even with all of them making way more money than you, they still happen to be cheapskates

OR tommy will end up getting a burrito from a taco truck, immediately making a mess of himself, then proceed to complain how messy the food is to eat despite knowing what he was getting himself into before even ordering

“shit my clothes are all ruined now!”

“well that’s your fault you got a burrito, as if it’s your first time having one”

“i mean the food is good, i’m not complaining about that but i don’t think it’s that good that it’s worth costing my red and white shirt, im just saying”

tubbo

same with tommy, he is so excited

i don’t know why but i imagine him overpacking his suitcase and you making fun of him for it

anyway tubbo has his irl backpack on and streaming EVERYTHING

probably spends a lot of time at a bunch of different booths, checking out all the pointless gadgets he could buy for his stream

you’re the one to stop him from doing so

“TUBBO IT’S LITERALLY OVER TEN THOUSAND DOLLARS, STOP. DONT GET IT.”

“WHY NOT?? IT WILL BE COOL FOR MY STREAM AND I WILL USE IT EVERYDAY”

“okay theoretically speaking, how the hell are you going to even bring it home? which—let me remind you—is across the country for you and not to mention the giant ocean separating america and the uk”

“free ship-pang!!!”

“i hate to break it to you tubbo but there is no way you can get free shipping on a FIVE FOOT PC. it’s nearly as tall as you! what are you even gonna do on it, hack the government???”

the arguments are all lighthearted but eventually you give in and let him splurge over a thousand dollars in different devices he claimed he “needed”

i could honestly see him visiting the beaches in san diego and going for a swim or even renting out a boat to use for a bit :D

also he’d bring benson along with him and taking a bunch of scenic photos with it in them

i have a feeling he’s the type to schedule a spontaneous meet & greet because he was bored & gets in trouble for causing a mob in a certain part of the convention

he’s like “oh god, i did not expect this many of the bois to show up AHAHAH oops”

tubbo would def pull a lilypichu and bring his melodica or ukulele and play themes while following random people/cosplayers

at the end of the day, you’d find his bag just stuffed with crap he either got for free or bought in the convention

“how did you get all that stuff? i was with you all day??? and it’s only the first day of the convention, hello?? it looks like you’ve been collecting as if twitchcon has went on for a week already!”

“HA i have my ways, do not underestimate my powers”

lani would probably tag along for the vacation honestly

like whenever someone comes up to her giving her gifts/asking for pics, you and tubbo would tease her about how famous she is

and i dunno but something about tubbo just gives me this amusement park energy and going to legoland and spending the whole day there since it’s near by and because he can

ranboo

he is like a beacon in a sea of people, that’s it .

i honestly just see him causing as much chaos as the other two

ranboo would probably like take someone’s camera whether if they’re streaming or if it’s for the vlog, hold it up high, and point the camera directly above someone’s face

it did not matter how tall you were and if you had platform shoes on, ranboo was a skyscraper next to you

“HAHAH this is how i see you from this height, this is funny”

then he shows you the vid of the recording of him getting like an aerial view of your face

like you see your nose and all your pores and just overall a bad angle to be captured in

“OH GOD RANBOO DELETE THAT, ITS HORRIFIC”

i dunno why but i feel like he’d jump scare every person that was cosplaying as his minecraft character from behind for some reason

“BOO!”

“ranboo i’m not even remotely dressed as your skin—”

“don’t worry i’m practicing it’s fineee”

“you’re like the height of 2 people combined, i think you will be fine as is. you even intimidated the security at the front”

i feel like if he had his own panel he’d like pull up some undertale song in the middle of it and scare all the people in the crowd

“lore but in real life”

probably would get some matching keepsake with you from artist alley/the booths!

i could imagine like a cute keychain or smth :D

i feel like he’s the type to like randomly volunteer as a participant for those mini events in a booth thinking it would be funny but regrets it the moment he’s on stage

after introductions the presenter is like “okay ranboo, you will be given a random meme prompt above your head you won’t be able to see until after and you will have to make a random face to compliment it!”

and you can just tell by his facial expression he’s just thinking

oh god what have i gotten myself into

what is this game? who came up with this idea?

you’d laugh at him the whole time, even after he’s off the stage and finished with that small fiasco

“that was horrible. never again.”

“AHAHAH IT LOOKED SO AWKWARD YOU DID GREAT”

“I CROSSED MY EYES AND PUFFED MY CHEEKS BECAUSE I COULDNT THINK OF ANY OTHER FACIAL EXPRESSION. THE PROMPT ENDING UP BEING ‘WHEN TWITTER CANCELS YOU FOR USING PLASTIC STRAWS.’ AND WHEN I SAW WHAT IT WAS—LITERALLY WHAT KIND OF GAME–”

“I GOT PICTURES AND EVERYTHING ITS PERFECT AHAHAHAH”

wilbur soot

honestly with wilbur it’s slightly more chill

he already experienced twitchcon before so he’s just glad to see his friends again after so long

insists that you explore the convention yourself rather than sticking with him the whole time but you do anyway!

wilbur would probably have like a mini concert and gets you front row seats with the rest of the group

but that doesn’t mean before it that you’re not helping him set up

“y/n please– my amp is so heavy, i can carry it”

“don’t worry! i’m strong” :D

and musically talented or not, he will probably bring you and the rest of his friends up to stage to just vibe and sing a bunch of random acoustic songs

it’s not like some big concert hall stage,, i imagine more like a casual thing w a slightly higher platform from the ground yk?

after spending a long day at the convention he’d also bring everyone across the city to la jolla or smth !

you’d all probably have dinner there and chill, watching the pretty sunset

“this place is really pretty but oh my god im gonna lose my breath hiking up this stupid hill, please slow down”

and wilbur is like ??? because he’s completely fine with his long legs and everything

“just walk faster”

“no, you walk slower”

AHAHAH and for context traversing through la jolla by walking around the town is a bit hard since it’s basically on a bunch of hills (walking up from the beach to a restaurant actually is actually sm work, trust me ive been there)

wilbur honestly doesn’t spend that much time in the actual convention center, he’s probably sightseeing a bit of san diego with you instead

but i could imagine him staying at the tabletop games area playing dnd or smth

“c’mon y/n, come join!”

“uhh i’m not sure, i’m not the best at roleplay and...”

“it’s fine don’t worry!”

he’d pull you in with him and end up enjoying yourself even if it was your first time

and if you’re of age, you’d be wilbur’s +1 at the twitch partner party and make sure mans doesn’t too drunk

if it’s not too late in the night, you two would chill at the beach after the party

it’s just a nice, calming moment after all the loud music mixed with hundreds of conversations at the party

also something about like taking polaroids pictures with wilbur just seems to go hand in hand for me

i’m not sure why but you will be taking lots of pics with wilbur for sure (not necessarily you both in the photo, but of sceneries as well while you’re together!)

philza

literally a dad on vacation with his children, it doesn’t matter how old you are

need sunscreen? surprisingly has it

want a snack? probably has a small granola bar somewhere in his bag

but same with wilbur, he’s more chill like this isn’t his first time at twitchcon

omg he’d def bring you to the artist alley and just buy a bunch of fanart and stuff tho

“oh wow look phil, someone made a giant poster of the dream smp and shit!”

“holy shit that’s so good what the fuck!”

and he’s like rushing to that artist’s stall to buy a poster or print

idk why but phil seems like the person to know where he’s going all over the convention center

he probably had a copy of the directory map but yk

you just have trouble reading it bc all the signs seem to be misleading to you

nothing really crazy screams out to me of what phil would do at twitchcon besides like go to a few events, spend a bunch of time w his friends, etc

HOWEVER i could see him wasting a lot of his time at the gaming area and testing new games that are currently on the works of being developed

like “woah y/n, this vr game is sick, you should try it out!”

ngl i feel like phil would plan a visit to disneyland for everyone, like he gets the tickets and everything but once you’re at the park it’s free reign, y’all go everywhere with not much of a plan

the minors would try to cheap out phil and pay less than the others even though everyone else fully paid phil back and everything LMAO

ok but if he’s feeling nice, phil will buy everyone cotton candy/pretzels :D

and if you’re not hungry, he’d at least get you a mickey balloon

HE WILL HAVE MATCHING MICKEY EARS WITH MUMZA YES .

ALSO STAYING FOR THE FIREWORKS THOUGH OMG

just in general, best idea phil had for taking everyone to disneyland :D

technoblade

surprisingly techno is really calm despite this being like one of his first conventions

but when he finally settles in and gets comfortable, he’s showing the same energy

if you’re playfully yelling, he will yell back

however there’s still those awkward moments that are unavoidable

idk why but something about him makes me think that if you feel tired and want to go back to your hotel room, he’d go with you just to make sure you get there safe

he probably also needs a break from being around everyone else for a moment too LMAO

i could also see him searching far and wide in the artist alley for fanart of himself AHAHAH

walking around with him in the convention consists of someone yelling “BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD” every 5 minutes but you don’t really mind

something about him makes me think he’ll be forced into playing minecraft twitch rivals along with the rest of sbi or smth

and he’s like “oh god, i’m going to be on stage? and people will see my face while i play minecraft?”

“i’m sure it will be fun!”

“i mean i like being competitive and feeding my ego, but i’m not that desperate.. well”

do i imagine techno getting easily tired of being surrounded by a bunch of people and just going back to his hotel room with phil and watching some anime with him? yes

and will you watch even if you have no idea what’s going on? also yes

i feel like after a while of you guys hanging out in techno’s room, the rest of the gang will just slowly join you guys

like eventually everyone is there; you, techno, phil, wilbur, niki, tommy, tubbo, ranboo, etc

and techno is like “wha– where did you guys come from?” because his room is basically packed

and niki could be like “oh we can go if you want!”

then techno just insists that she’s fine “but who let the child get in?” clearly implying tommy’s presence

“OI!!”

eventually techno gives in with the company and someone gets a bunch of board games to play from the front desk

lots of yelling and laughing for sure

when it becomes late at night, techno is like half conscious, you’re on your phone, wilbur is staring out the window & enjoying the night view, tommy is passed out on the couch from tiredness, tubbo & ranboo is still wide awake quietly talking, and phil & niki are helping clean up the giant mess

eventually everyone brings themselves to go back to their own room except tommy who won’t budge

you give techno a look and he immediately understands what you were thinking

he rushes to the bathroom to fill up two cups with ice cold water and handed one to you

“on three?”

“okay.. one”

“two”

“three!”

then both of you pour the water on the poor child’s face

he jolts awake and saying a string of curses

“what the fuck techno? y/n too?”

“get out” is the only think techno says that before tommy rushes out with his stuff and you leave right after

a/n: i honestly can’t wait until conventions open up again though,, phil and ranboo were talking about vidcon earlier and omg.

also i kinda want to take in tommy requests but i’m not sure??? it would be both cc! and c! x gn!reader for sure tho. i love writing him to bits but who knows, maybe i’ll only stick to my ideas,, or not. send in a tommy x reader request, might do it, might not, but he’s my fav cc if you can’t tell so! :D (i dunno if i will keep it strictly platonic, but unrequited crushes and stuff are fun to write hehe,,)

edit: let’s hope i fixed all the grammar mistakes LMAO we love writing late at night :) /s /hj

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shihalyfie · 3 years

Text

Shiramine Nokia, and her role in Cyber Sleuth’s narrative

This one’s on request! Cyber Sleuth is quite the interesting game and a rather landmark entry in the franchise, mainly for being a love letter to the franchise and its long history itself, and for being the franchise’s very first work exclusively aimed at adults, meaning that it can explore different topics that wouldn’t normally be Sunday morning timeslot material, while also being a little more willing to assume that the people playing this are familiar with a lot of older parts of the franchise (not that it’s advisable to have complete lockout, but the game benefits greatly by not needing to assume lockout by default).

One of the ways Cyber Sleuth exhibits its “franchise love letter” status is by starting off the game all the way back at the franchise’s roots, before Digimon Adventure changed the game and everyone’s perception of Digimon and Digimon partnership, when the V-Pet lore was intertwined with Digimon as elements of hard sci-fi. As the game proceeds, the atmosphere slowly starts to resemble the more fantasy-like version of the franchise established by Digimon Adventure and its follower entries -- and that change is represented in none other than Nokia herself.

Before we begin: As anyone who follows my meta work has probably noticed, I generally prefer to have my analyses use tons of references and screenshots so that it’s easy to follow and the evidence is concrete, but Cyber Sleuth is a game, and it’s much harder to get those things without replaying the entire game, so I hope this won’t be too hard to follow despite being mostly text.

Nokia’s background and personality

If we want to apply the producer’s statements on Twitter, Nokia is 17 years old at the time of Cyber Sleuth, and has a backstory of having originally been a shy, bullied child who broke out of her shell thanks to the influence of her cousin (who, of all people, happens to be none other than Date Makiko). The flashback we get with Nokia in chapter 18, however, portrays her as just a fairly cheerful, go-getter child, but (although we only get to see her hair) she’s not quite as “flashy” or in-your-face as the description entails.

A possible hypothesis for rationalizing this all together comes from a what we learn about the process of memory wiping in Cyber Sleuth chapter 14: even if memories are extracted from the person, there’s some kind of residual memory left behind (the producer’s above statement also states that the same thing had even happened to Suedou). In Hacker’s Memory chapter 16, Arata confesses to Ryuji that the first Under Zero incident and Jude's loss to the Knightmon had re-triggered his trauma from having lost Yuugo years prior -- “not the memory, but the feeling.” So in other words, there was some feeling of loss that came after the loss of Yuugo that impacted those involved -- and it’s very possible that this deeply impacted and traumatized Nokia as well.

Assuming we’re still following this line of thought (since, again, this background point wasn’t actually in the game proper), Nokia eventually decided to break out of her shell thanks to Makiko’s influence, and become eccentric and assertive, and thus, the game begins.

While we’re here, I also want to point out that Nokia is also voiced by Han Megumi, possibly the Digimon franchise’s most notorious “promoted fangirl” who freaked out after getting to meet her childhood characters’ voice actors while cast as Airu in the Xros Wars crossover and ended up casted in a handful of major Digimon roles thereafter as a result. Which is not to say that her voice performance wasn’t also absolutely perfect for the bright and aggressive Nokia, but, you know...considering the below analysis, food for thought.

Nokia as a representative of “the conventional franchise”

Cyber Sleuth opens on a world where Digimon are largely seen as hacker programs, and even the hackers themselves only see them as non-sentient programs; there are ones like Chitose who treat them with empathy, but his attitude seems to be kindness towards them in a way not entirely unlike a family would treat a Roomba. Although he doesn’t admit to it at first, Arata himself also comes from this “world” of hackers, and we later learn that Yuuko herself is as well (via her “Yuugo” persona), meaning that, other than the playable protagonist, Nokia is the only “outside-context” person -- a completely ordinary civilian who’s gotten dragged into all of this.

Much like, say, the protagonists of Digimon Adventure.

With this background behind her, once she’s thrown into the world of hackers, she immediately has a “fateful encounter” with Agumon and Gabumon, instantly recognizable as two of the franchise’s most prominent Digimon (and complete with their Adventure voice actors, too). And I do especially bring up Adventure specifically, because while Nokia’s position in the game does end up taking in certain elements that roughly came around that era and possibly slightly predated it (mostly Digimon World and V-Tamer), Agumon and Gabumon weren’t particular mascots of the franchise until Adventure basically blew everything to pieces.

Right off the bat, Nokia does not have a single shred of doubt that Agumon and Gabumon are living beings and should be treated as such (again, much like the protagonists of Digimon Adventure; even Taichi in his “is this a game?” mode never doubted this). And they open up their meeting with this conversation:

Agumon: Umm, who are you? Nokia: It... It can talk?! It's so... so... so adoooooorable! M-M-M-M-My name's Nokia. What're your names? Agumon: Me? My name is Agumon! Gabumon: I... I'm Gabumon. Nokia: Agumon and Gabumon? Hee hee! What weird names! Gabumon: Hey, they're not weird! Agumon: You're the one with the weird name! Nokia: As if! My name's not weird! Hee hee!

And on top of that, Agumon refers to Nokia as having a “familiar” scent. Remember this for later.

Nokia’s second encounter with Agumon and Gabumon in Cyber Sleuth chapter 3 involves her properly partnering herself with Agumon and Gabumon, and learning about the existence of the “Digital World”. Note that, for all intents and purposes, EDEN had been treated like the functional equivalent of the Digital World in this narrative up until this point -- cyberspace with hackers, coming from the network, it’s basically a “digital world” from top to bottom, and yet here Agumon and Gabumon are introducing the concept of a more fantasy-esque incarnation of a digital world. (And, in fact, despite EDEN being right there, many long-time Digimon fans playing this game often complained about how little you get to see the “Digital World” in this game, because of how associated that term is with something more fantasy-like.) So, again: here we have Nokia, who’s forming a partnership with Agumon and Gabumon as equals instead of recruiting them as hacker tools (even the protagonist wasn’t immune to this method), and being indirectly responsible for introducing the more fantasy-like concept of the Digital World that the modern franchise is currently associated with.

Nokia embarks on the conventional shounen anime character arc of starting off cowardly, but eventually learning to have her own inner strength, with her Digimon evolving in accordance to her emotions. And, eventually, in Cyber Sleuth chapter 8, she decides to form her own hacker team, called the “Rebels”. She ostensibly bases it off the old creed of Jude, having heard that they were a team that never caused trouble for others, but we later learn via Arata turning out to have been its former leader, and the even later portrayal in Hacker’s Memory of its spiritual successor Hudie, that this is an extremely rose-colored image of them -- Jude (and Hudie) was not a well-intentioned team by any means, but rather a sort of mercenary group meant to enforce the “freedom” of EDEN, often taking on shady jobs and “punishing” entities they considered to be causing chaos. But in this case, Nokia forms her team under the idea of legitimately fighting for justice and good will -- again, much like a Digimon Adventure protagonist.

In case the metaphor weren’t clear enough, Nokia decides that the members of her group will not be called “hackers”, but “Tamers” -- the same lingo used by the franchise to refer to a human who partners alongside a Digimon to help them get stronger -- and that she wants to promote the idea of humans and Digimon working in tandem (complete with emotional bonding exercises). For this, everyone looks at her weird, and yet her methodology, initially naive as it seems, keeps working, because Nokia’s natural charisma starts bringing people from different places together and making quite the formidable team. Everyone is perplexed by this, but perhaps it’s only natural, because Nokia has just independently invented the modern concept of Digimon partnership in a world where it did not exist. And this is eventually solidified by the Under Zero invasion in Cyber Sleuth chapter 10, in which Omegamon is finally formed (from sheer guts on her part).

Omegamon is yet another symbol of the modern franchise, but it’s important to remember that he hasn’t always been so; even his appearance in V-Tamer was as more of a tactical piece than any kind of game-breaker, but the impact of Our War Game! has led him to constantly make a resurgence in major franchise roles (maybe a little too much these days). However, on top of Nokia basically embodying the modern franchise itself by doing this, Nokia and Arata’s positions are an obvious reference to Our War Game! in particular, being Omegamon and Diablomon Tamers -- but they’re not seen directly fighting each other. In fact, Arata’s partner only ever reaches Diablomon when he’s at the highest point of his morality, so the reference is more ideological; Nokia represents the more idealistic and heroic side of Digimon, whereas Arata represents the more dirty-playing and cynical hard sci-fi side of it (remember that Diablomon himself was rather detached from the fantasy conflict of Adventure, being a mysterious entity that sprouted out of nowhere on the Internet and wreaked havoc). Moreover, Nokia’s usage of Omegamon embodies a theme that’s central to both Our War Game! and Cyber Sleuth itself as a whole -- while most people associate Omegamon with Taichi and Yamato these days, the original method of formation back in Our War Game! came from “bringing people from different places together”. Nokia managed to bring together a formidable army in a place where everyone else in the hacker world was trying to promote a dog-eat-dog philosophy, and the sense of cooperation is arguably making her stronger than anyone else.

(I should also point out that Nokia’s name is, obviously, a reference to the Finnish telephone communications company, and this has a lot of relevance to the game’s theme of connection, along with her phone Digivice...and, also, the method used to bring everyone’s powers together in Our War Game!’s spiritual successor, Diablomon Strikes Back. Feels a bit too on-the-nose here.)

In the second half of the game, when the world starts falling apart due to the Digital World portal opening, Nokia becomes one of most important people holding everything together as Arata goes off the deep end and Yuuko starts fixating on her own personal problems and revenge -- because she’s the one most in tune with treating Digimon as the living beings they are, she’s most active in advocating for them and helping them bond with humans, and and she’s the one making the chaos be a little less chaotic. The second half is basically the more fantasy-esque version of Digimon leaking into the sci-fi, with the sidequests progressively resembling your average Digimon anime monster-of-the-week episode, and holding that all together is Nokia, who becomes a vital figure in maintaining that fellowship by being in tune with the modern franchise’s philosophy.

Through all of this, Nokia ends up taking a role rather similar to a Digimon protagonist, which is highlighted very strongly in Cyber Sleuth chapter 18 when she ends up literally becoming the player character while the main protagonist is out of commission. During that time, Yuuko and Nokia learn the truth of what happened during the EDEN incident eight years prior -- and we also learn that the five children involved had an extremely conventional “first meeting in the Digital World” experience that could have been pulled right out of the first episode of a Digimon anime, with them having a lovely adventure meeting new creatures. And at the center of that “first contact” was none other than Nokia, Agumon, and Gabumon themselves:

Agumon: Um... who are you? Nokia: Ahem! I am Nokia! And just who are you? Agumon: Me? My name is Agumon! Gabumon: I... I'm Gabumon. Nokia: Agumon and Gabumon? Hee hee! What weird names! Gabumon: Hey, they're not weird! Agumon: You're the one with the weird name! Nokia: As if! My name's not weird! Hee hee!

Nokia, Agumon, and Gabumon’s meeting at the beginning of the game had been an (accidental) reenactment of their first meeting in the Digital World eight years prior -- and, in the flashback, Nokia invites them to go on an “adventure” with them. So in other words, Nokia getting involved in the hacker conflict at the beginning of the game was, unknown to all of them, her attempting to restore that beauty and idealism of the Digimon Adventure-esque philosophy and fun in a world where the Eaters had torn it away and EDEN had turned into a haven of cynicism and hacker battle royale.

In the end, the game’s conflict is only resolved by bringing everyone together; Arata has to be retrieved from the deep end, and Yuuko has to settle her deep-seated personal grievances. Everyone makes a promise to return together, in the sense of making things right and repairing the connections between them that had been cut in that incident. The final battle (momentarily) causes the playable protagonist to literally fall apart, and the one reaching out to them and sending her message to them at the end of the game is none other than Nokia herself -- again, in the absence of the game’s protagonist, Nokia is the one with the closest role, because in the face of the new world going forward, she was the one who contributed most to restoring its idealism.

Ultimately, all of this is especially because Cyber Sleuth works under one of the most terrifying imaginable premises for a fan of a kids’ franchise: “we made an entry for this, but for adults.” Many of us can testify that this kind of premise can go very well, or very badly -- the latter especially in the case of things that decide “taking the opportunity to do things that you can’t do on a Sunday morning kids’ timeslot” means “going out of your way to put edgy violence and sexy things and cynicism just because you can”, or, in other words, looking down condescendingly on its kids’ franchise roots with malice and deciding that something for adults means “more suffering” and not “issues that require more life experience to understand”. The reason the game ended up getting as much acclaim among longtime Digimon fans as it did was that despite being the franchise’s first venture into this territory, it did end up setting itself up as something that took that opportunity to do something new and unique that would have never made it into any of the prior entries (holy hell the doll quest) and yet never gave up on the idealism and themes of connection that make up the franchise at its core, and paid respect to everything that had contributed to all of that while it was at it.

And at the center of that is Shiramine Nokia, who is effectively the spirit of Digimon Adventure, condensed into a single character.

#digimon #digimon story cyber sleuth #shiramine nokia #nokia shiramine #shihameta

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soul-dwelling · 3 years

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Have you heard something about Ohkubo being racist? I saw some twitter links, which due to personal reasons I cant check for myself, but otherwise couldnt find anything on.

Shared September 18, 2021

I've sat on this question for a long time, and yet my answer will still be incomplete. As I am white, I want to be aware of the white privilege I have, and I anticipate I am going to give a response that fails to address certain topics and concerns--and is just going to be flat-out wrong in a lot of parts. I anticipate I will get things wrong below, I don't like that, but I want to be open to reading more and figuring out what I'm getting wrong so I can fix what I get wrong. And I want to learn from any responses I receive--so I encourage any responses, and I will read and consider them.

At the time when I received this question, I was not aware of any Twitter links regarding accusations of Ohkubo being racist. Despite being a huge fan of Soul Eater, this was something I was unaware of, and I was purposefully ignoring--because I was ignoring any discourse around Fire Force, not around Ohkubo or Soul Eater in general. While I have followed what Soul Eater stuff is out there, I have purposefully avoided a lot of Fire Force content since the anime was announced--including muting any Fire Force stuff on Twitter. While I do not regret avoiding Fire Force stuff (there is only so much annoyance I can take from that franchise), I do regret overlooking this discussion around racism in Ohkubo’s works, I regret that, and I apologize for overlooking it right now--and in the past.

Because I have overlooked racist elements in Ohkubo’s prior works, including in Soul Eater, including on this very blog. I don’t think apologizing is enough, and I am determining what steps I can take to handle this better--and that starts with acknowledging the racist elements in his works. I think some have unfortunate implications that need to be debated.

For example, one Twitter remark I read asked why the South American meister had to be Enrique instead of a human. (And, I anticipate, how that leads to its own set of unfortunate implications, associating being from South America to being a monkey, regardless Tezca, his visual conceit, and his powers being derived from, not South American cultures only or exactly, but from Aztec and indigenous Mexican cultures.) I don’t think adding Enrique as a meister is bad, when the joke works; I think adding Enrique, and not more South American human characters, is a problem, and when your one South American meister is a non-human animal, when no other meister in the series, especially of a Death Scythe, has been a non-human animal, this is going to stick out and be offensive. I have seen and written stories with animals as meisters to weapon partners; it is a great idea, having Enrique be that character is great, but it is a missed opportunity that erases a spot where a person of South American could have been. Having Tezca as one such South American person helps, but again, this is a missed opportunity.

As an aside, this also opens up unfortunate implications to having Black Star being mistaken by Liz as a monkey, given headcanon I’ve seen from fans about Black Star’s identity with regard to Japanese ethnicities and the fact that Black Star does have dark skin.

And another set of Twitter remarks focused on the stylized designs to the band playing at the DWMA Anniversary Party (and here). Regardless whether stylization was used on white characters in that scene, the stylization on the Black characters who were performing in the band is drawing upon a history of racist images (the lips on drummer and cellist) and is racist. I’ll get to this later, but I agree with this remark that it’s bizarre that Ohkubo did this despite what he has done well with inclusiveness amongst his cast. And like I’ll also say later, it’s like me sitting here thinking “How could he do so well at writing a girl lead like Maka in an action series, then fail so badly writing Tamaki in his follow-up series?” My pathetic answer is that no creator is perfect, they make mistakes--and it becomes infuriating when they screw up so badly and don’t seem to learn from that screw-up, don’t show regret, don’t fix what they broke, and don’t improve. I’ve ranted enough here on this blog that I don’t think Ohkubo has grown with his audience: I think he keeps making the same immature mistakes (immature in terms of his craft, immature as well in terms of his humor).

And since I did bring up the monkey remarks about Enrique and Black Star, there are the major sets of discourse around racism in Ohkubo’s works, that being Maka referring to Sid, who is Black, as a gorilla (not to mention “thuggish”), and Shinra in Fire Force referring to Charon, who has dark skin, as a gorilla.

Regardless the excuses made (“racism in Japan is not the same as racism elsewhere”--which, no, fuck that, people globally including in Japan know the racist associations made where being Black or brown is associated by racists with non-human primates), I don’t get why no one, from Ohkubo to his editors to distributors to audiences including me, do not say more about this racist detail.

And I don’t get why no editor or localization staff bothered to change it. I have not sat through the Fire Force dub, but I hope someone working at localization changed the line. (It’s one thing to change a subtitled line and avoid something offensive at the cost of accuracy in translation, including accurately translating content even when it’s awful, or else you’re just covering up for the awfulness in the original work. But it’s another thing to not revise the line for dubbing, when you should have more flexibility in that kind of adaptation.)

(And that’s not getting into casting white actors as Black characters in the Soul Eater dub, but I hope I can address that another time with more depth should Soul Eater ever get a continuation or a re-dub...which, given how enough of the original dub cast have fucked over their careers and revealed their abusiveness and toxic bullshit in their personal lives, either a new anime or a new dub sounds good right about now.)

The responses to this criticism have been to rightly point out that Ohkubo does include numerous varied portrayals of Black characters (also here and here and here), drawing upon Black identities from the United States and Africa, especially for characters like Kilik and Ogun. But, me personally, pointing out what is done well does not negate what is done badly. (And yes, just because I think Maka Albarn is a great representation of a girl character in shonen doesn’t negate how Ohkubo fucked up with Chapter 113 and all of Tamaki in Fire Force).

As a creator, you’re supposed to fix what you did wrong, you don’t distract from what you did wrong by doing something else well later. You fix the character in front of you, not only make new characters and let that distract the audience from what you did wrong. You fix Sid (which, for me, means some potential adjustments to character design and not calling him a freaking gorilla); you don’t distract by creating Kilik and Ogun. You fix Tamaki (give her more to do, don’t make every joke around fanservice, stop fucking sexualizing a 17-year-old); you don’t distract by pointing to Maka or Maki. That’d be like me excusing something I did wrong in one set of responsibilities by asking you to look at something good I did: that doesn’t fix what I did wrong by mistake. Asking people to “leave the medium” is not helping: this is a debate, you get to watch something, you get to decide for yourself whether you think something is racist or misread, I’m not up for gatekeeping people to block them from either criticizing something or enjoying something.

And while your enjoyment of something can reflect on your values (if you keep liking jokes calling Sid a gorilla, what does that say about you?), I said “can,” not “does,” it is by context and debate (you can enjoy slasher movies without being a serial killer, etc).

I wish I had something more meaningful to say, and I don’t like that I don’t. I want to be a better ally, but just being aware that there are racist elements to this series, and just stating awareness, is not sufficient for me. It’s one reason why my focus is on uplifting fan content that does far better at handling inclusiveness and representation in this series. But my focus has been on representations of gender in the series--and that is my fault for not doing more to focus on representations of race and ethnicity, and I wish my apology would be enough, and it’s not, so I’m trying to figure out what I can do that is better. I will read feedback to do better.

#soul eater #atsushi ohkubo #fire force #sid barett #kilik rung #enrique

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nightswithkookmin · 3 years

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So every member has been posting on weverse or Twitter lately, they've been coming on vlive. But Jk has done none of this. Do you see his social media absence as a silent rebellion against BH for them trying to hide Jikook or do you think he's probably just staying away for like mental health reasons or something.

Run that by me one more time???

Are you asking for my opinion on why JK might be absent from social media or are you asking me to choose between those two opinions as explanation as to why Jungkook might be absent from social media???

Is it for his mental health or relationship??? Lol. You are juxtaposing two extremely opposite theories so one sounds more appealing and plausible to highlight the other as outlandish and ridiculous. But that's a fallacy ma'am. Nice try though.

Also, the part about BigHit hiding Jikook...

I object. You is leading the witness sir/ma'am.

It's a little bit silly and presumptuous to assume whenever a member is absent from social media that the only possible reason I could possibly think of is that they are rebelling against their company.

Sometimes it's just a case of volition and personal interests. Sometimes you just don't wanna be social on social media. Sometimes you have work, family, chores, practice. Sometimes you've outgrown the space or lost track of why you wanted to be apart of an online community in the first place. Sometimes it's the toxicity and wanting to take a break from it for your mental health. Literally a plethora of reasons all of which could be valid depending on the context.

I try to give my theories context by sharing as much of my thought process as possible. It's asinine to strip those contexts away and present me with a skinned theory devoid of context.

About his mental health-

Let's try it this way...

Your first Ask: is there ever a moment I wonder if Jikook are just platonic brothers or something along those lines.

Yes. When they are not together romantically. I look at them and go huh... that's a very platonic hug, or interaction. I still uWu over their interactions though.

Cute. Next.

Is he rebelling against BigHit....

Why would he?? What's the context?

Do you think BigHit is making changes JK and the others might not be happy with in the company? Do you think the company or the members are interfering in his self autonomy and determination within the group or suppressing him in anyway in regards to what he says, what he does or who he does it with?

If so then him rebelling in that way would make sense to me because he wouldn't be the first idol to have used that tactic. A lot of idols do these and worse to assert themselves against their company.

If there's no such underling subtext then him rebelling makes no fucking sense to me.

Is he staying away for his mental health

Again, do you think he's been exposed to severe amounts of toxicity and hate online beyond what all the members experience on a daily such that he would need a break from the internet to rejuvenate like we saw around 2019? If so then taking a break for his mental health would make a lot of sense too.

But for someone who keeps reiterating how important connecting with his fans is to him, you gotta wonder how he strikes a balance between his mental health needs, his emotional needs and his professional deeds.

This is the last he was seen on Weverse.

Relatively recent I'd say. So when you say he's absent from social media which timeframes do you mean? They were all pretty much off the grid until recent times post PTD not just him. Are they all dealing with mental health issues or are they all rebelling against their company or something?

You have all these tiktok trends and memes he's been referring to here and there and incorporating into their freestyle dance- seems to me he's active online alright. Just not in the way we are used to them being 'active' online. He is fulfilling that need to connect with his fans just not in a way you'd expect. I can say same for Jimin.

Just gonna have to observe things for a while to form a definitive opinion. If you know what I mean.

BigHit hiding Jikook

Sigh. Sounds like shade when you put it like that honestly and so I didn't want to touch it but also I don't think anyone in Bangtan has had an out in the open romantic relationship with anyone yet💀

Show me RMs partner or Suga's girlfriend.

BTS are hiding their relationships gay or straight. If you can see it from that angle then I think the idea of Jikook hiding their relationship or Bighit aiding them or asking them to privatize their relationship isn't so outlandish and ridiculous like you make it seem. BTS are allowed to date, they are just not allowed to make those relationships public💀

If Jikook were heterosexuals and in different bands I think a lot of people would have entertained the thought. Hell people are convinced they are each dating female idols and keeping it a secret. People are convinced JK is dating Mijoo and keeping that a secret but him dating a boy in the same band and keeping it a secret is kapushkalava😌

Theories of RM married and raising a kid abounds in this fandom and people entertain the idea. However, because Jikook are in the same band and play out certain interactions in front of the cameras the thought that they may be hiding sounds funny in y'alls ears? Jokers💀

Most idols hide their relationships and are required by their companies to keep that out of the public eye. Jikook are idols ergo they are required to hide and are hiding their relationships be it with themselves or with others.

And yes BigHit does aid them in doing so when they issue statements about that "this relationship rumor is false" or when the members evade questions about their relationships in a way to insinuate they are single and not in relationships.

How Jikook feel about being required by the company to keep their relationships to themselves or their peers taking it upon themselves to enforce those company policies of private relationships is up for debate and speculation.

BTS wrote a whole ass song dissing the company and calling them out for having a no dating policy yet expecting them to write love songs and yet somehow we think it's ridiculous that Jikook who are part of BTS would rebel against their company from time to time over certain mandates? Lmho.

Edit:

This ask was sent in a few days before JK's recent VLive. I started answering it and let it go to draft because I felt it was pointless to answer it. Especially since a lot of my thoughts on this were regurgitative, abstract, and based on my own subjective opinion and assumptions about the boys. I feel I keep repeating myself and repeating the same things I've been saying over and over with these kinds of shady trolling asks. Sigh.

However, due to recent events that gives more credit to my thoughts and feelings on the matter, I'll attempt to answer it again.

In JK's VLive he said he noticed it's been a while he interacted with Fans which is why he jumped on the Live to see Army- if we take his word for it and at face value then he said nothing about his mental health ergo it can't be because of that😌

Tae equally said in his VLive he noticed the others coming on VLive and so he thought he would come too.

Now, don't you think they wouldn't have come so spontaneously if they were dealing with mental health issues or trying to take care of their mental health???

There was a time Tae was constantly online interacting with Fans and I think I was one of the few people out here who speculated he was lonely and wasn't dating anyone at the time- which he confirmed in Soop by the way when he told JK he being online constantly was because he was lonely.

Do you think he staying off Social media in recent times is because of his mental or that he doesn't feel as lonely anymore??

I stay off line sometimes for my mental health, sometimes too it's because I feel there are people and things in my life I've neglected and need to spend time with and pay equal attention to them.

Sometimes it's because there's death in the family or studies, or work or a film I need to catch up on...

As to the relationship between campanies and artists- in case you can't pick up on the subtle cues some of the members leave- Suga captures it so well in his Weverse magazine interview.

We made you, as long as you follow our instructions you will be good. Idols are expected to be subservient and sycophantic. As Suga points out it's a thing in the industry and it's destroying the industry.

As to whether or not you think BTS are fully and totally exempt from this harsh reality because BigHit is different is up to you frankly. As to whether or not you think this type of attitude from companies can create friction and tensions between them and the bands is equally up to you.

As to whether you think certain members in BTS are more obsequious than others, more rebellious than others is equally up to you.

In what ways they rebel is up to you too.

That's part A.

Part B. Lol

I answered the first part of this Ask based on the assumption you were being shady. But just in case you were not then here is an alternative response.

Like I said, JK is not the only member who's been absent from SNS in recent times. They all were at one point.

It's interesting how they will promise to come on Vlive whenever they have some to sell us and only recently started showing up on Vlive consistently when Permission to Dance received such mixed reactions from the audience.

It seems their disconnect from their fanbase and its subsequent consequences is becoming much more apparent to them...

For Jungkook, I think the members discussed his rebellious phase at the beginning of the year when they talked about him not posting for the members's birthday, how they expect his post for Hobi to be a start of something new and Jimin even said he was gonna cut his head off if he didn't post for his birthday- I don't think in all the times he didn't post for the members it's because he was grappling with mental health issues. It's just a post. It doesn't take more than a minute to wish your bandmate a happy birthday on their birthdays.

Especially not when he was posting relatively regularly on SNS but would go radio silent on their birthdays... Forget mental health that's antisocial and we saw how the members felt about that from the VLive.

Also, I think it would be insensitive for the members to expect Jungkook to post on their birthdays or for Jimin to hold him to such high expectations when they know very well that he deals with mental health problems or was dealing with mental health issues in those periods he didn't post for them- whoever says Jungkook didn't post for the members because he was dealing with mental health issues is a fraud. Yea I said it. If I ever spewed that nonsense out here then I'm a fraud too chilee💀

His other forms of silent rebelliousness has been in passive aggressive backhanded remarks aimed at the company and at times certain members. In my opinion of course. He won't do what he won't do and if he has to do it he will do it huffing and puffing and later chat shit about it during pillow talks at night with his boyfriend.

So I don't know what it is he might zeffbe rebelling against now. Like I said, being asked to tone down does not mean he can't Jikook. They are Jikooking. It's just on the low low.

And when you say he is reacting to BigHit hiding Jikook, you have to take into account if Jungkook himself wants to keep things hidden and private. Why would he rebel against something if it's what he wants too?? Know what I mean?

This is why I was talking about context. Jungkook of 2018 and 2019 is not the same Jungkook now. He's pretty much the same person, has the same values but he is learning and growing and that is equally important in the way he sees the world around him.

For instance, he wasn't one to think much about the future when he made certain choices and this is something I've talked about a lot in my blogs. Carpedium, make hay while the sun shines etc used to be his values but now he places a lot of emphasis on thinking about the future, being considerate and about how his actions could impact his future.

Those two mindsets produce totally different actions. One is likely to do very childish things, one is not. One is likely to be reckless, not very ambitious, and less serious, while one is likely to be thoughtful, calculative, intentional and less impulsive. He talks a lot about growing up fast but now it seems to me he's catching up with the times.

This is not to say he is a different person but more so he is becoming. He is learning and unlearning. He is not there yet but he is getting there.

If he wants to sit with Jimin, Vlive with Jimin, post on his birthday and not the others, if he wants to stand in a line up next to him but he can't then definitely he's gonna react strongly to that. But as it stands he is not doing any of that in my opinion- not that I'm aware of. Dude is living his best life out here.

I think I've said this, he is happy with where they are at now. If he is not we will know. That's when they ghetto jumps out of him. Don't know if I'm making sense chilee. Lol.

On the part of the company, I can only speculate to the effect that they are looking for various means to optimize and leverage the bands high demand. That they are trying to monetize their platforms and so restricting access to the boys is part of their mid pandemic marketing strategy- something I have been saying from day dot since the pandemic hit.

Like Suga says, monetization is a huge problem in Kpop and the Pandemic has only exacerbated it.

Showing up on Vlive gives us free access to the boys. As often as we would like to see them through that medium it doesn't pay their bills- doesn't pay much especially if they earn money in Won or whatever currency Naver uses.

YouTube is great. However it comes with restrictions and challenges especially with censorship- videos can be demonetized easily and willy nilly, You have to comply with Coppa and YT guidelines. There's CPM- whixh I don't know if it's high for BTS...

Then there's that whole breaching into Korea/China market agenda going on with them etc

Bighit is a business. BTS is not a nonprofit organization. I think the members can understand that much should the company explain to them why they all- not just Jikook- need to limit access to them.

Bighit made them and holds a contract over their heads. There's a certain amount of control they have over them yet a certain level of autonomy they reserve within such a transaction or business relationship.

Take Tae's appearance in Peakboy's MV for example. It's indication BTS does have a ree will to embark on such out of company adventures. There's Hwarang and features and all these side hustles they do...

Yet in the same breath they were at one point prohibited from taking photos with fans on the streets and stuff like that- I guess I should say allegedly.

If they want to VLive they will- as to whether or not they can VLive outside schedule is another thing all together.

As spontaneous as their VLives can be, a lot of them are scheduled too. So it's interesting how they all went MIA for a noticeable minute without the company officially scheduling these 'compulsory' Fan interactions via Vlive or even YT.

Let's not pretend they don't post sometimes on behalf of certain members. Let's not pretend that that doesn't happen💀

Jungkook showed up on YT grumpy and passive aggressive talking about that he didn't know he was supposed to do a VLive, he wasn't prepared, his hair was messy, he didn't know how to operate things- sigh.

Then he nagged us to death about the arts and crafts thingy... but in his recent live he said singing is all he can do so he sang and thrust his hips away- we can't be mad at that.

So if your question is whether I think there's something up with BTS and how they are interacting with fans or not interacting with fans my answer is yes. I mean that much is obvious...

Money is the root of all evil blink blink. Lol.

Do I think there's something up with Jikook and BigHit my answer is yes still- my theory?? Well I'm still observing things and hoarding information. Can't put out half baked theories you know?

I'm a professional ship delulu theorist and I take my delusions seriously😐

I can say this though, I think BigHit has a lot to lose now that they are a publicly traded company. They have investors and stockholders they hold themselves accountable to- how the fear of a scandal or the stigma of a queer relationship plays into all that is yet to be seen.

They are trying to mitigate that risk through strategic marketing and business models- separating BigHit under Hybe is one, their partnership with Dispatch has always been one. There's just so much they are doing we don't know and can only assume or infer.

If their recent interviews and line of questioning has taught me anything, it's that they are all well aware of our theories on BTS and speculations on their sexuality and if Taemin's manager can ask him or was asked if he was dating Kai to his face then others can equally speculate, wonder and ask BigHit directly if Jikook being the sticky ones in the group are dating fueled by all the fandom theories out there.

Rumour says Jikook is gay and are dating eachother. How Bighit feels about this, how BTS feel about it, how Jikook feel about it open for discussion.

There are those who just want to nip all such rumours in the bud and those who want to lean into it and and profit off of it because negative attention is still attention.

Which brings me to your question about Jikook, because I see you sent that Ask in twice, they sure as hell are goofy and dorky. Jungkook admitted that much in his interview.

They are the ones to troll the lives out of us and feed into our delusions of them. It's why most people dismiss them as messing with fans and playful and fanservicey.

So I find it interesting that the members calling them a couple because of their outfits isn't being taken as goofy, dorky, fanservicey but as a reason to further invalidate their relationship.

If you can't take whatever Jikook says and does seriously then you certainly can't take whatever anyone says and does concerning them seriously either.

I will answer the rest of it under the Ask you sent in. This post is getting longer already.

I hope this helps.

GOLDY

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tobi-smp · 3 years

Text

Context: [Link]

@maryqueenofmurder said: ok this is so totally nitpicking and probably incredibly irritating to see buuuuuut… “here’s the truth that a lot of dream apologists don’t like acknowledging: it’s Both true that no one deserves to be tortured And that dream’s actions lead him to the position that he’s in now.”

Actually, a lot of us acknowledge it. Being put in prison is a direct response, pretty much, to the things he’s done. But so many people use ‘karma’ and 'it’s his fault he’s in prison’ to excuse/justify the abuse he was/is put through. it leaves a kind of sour taste in my mouth to see it now because it’s usually followed with the sentiments mentioned above.

dream “apologists” are very, very, very rarely people who think what dream did was okay/excusable. Maybe a few see it from a slightly more justifiable perspective. but most of us are aware that dream has caused harm, and that he did bad things. I don’t know how many dream apologists you’ve heard from, but most of us are aware of the fact that he’s brought a good deal of what’s happening to him down on his own head.

I personally think that even if Quackity was furious over what Dream did to Tommy, he’s still doing something very wrong. And what I’m about to say is going to sound even more irritating than the previous rant but, Practice what you preach. It’s both true that Quackity didn’t deserve a lot of things he got/will get but they’re also the inevitable fallout of his actions.

And if Dream apologists paint Quackity as the villain? It’s because they’re seeing/writing from Dream’s perspective. I’m not saying Quackity is some one-dimensional villain. I’m saying he’s definitely an antagonist in Dream’s perspective. It’s just that us Dream Apologists don’t talk about his motivations because they’re irrelevant to the story we’re telling. Plenty of other stories/takes are written like that. And if he is OOC or does things that don’t match his motivations in canon? it’s just a h/c i guess. or he has motivations you just don’t know them. [End Transcription]

So before anything else, I’m gonna have to ask that if you send me a response this long that you don’t put it in the replies. I’ve never had to ask that before but I’ve also never had to choose Not to include screenshots of what I’m responding to for length before. moreover, it’s much harder for me to know when you’ve finished your point if you’re sending 6 replies in a row as opposed to one reblog (for instance, several more replies came after I’d initially seen that you’d responded). if you’re trying to engage in a direct conversation with me that can’t fit in a couple of replies then just reblog or make your own post and @ me in it, anything but this would be better fadsjkljlkfds.

secondly, you’re right ! this wasn’t an appropriate response to the conversation in question and I’m not certain why you sent it to me.

The first post that I wrote was about how ridiculous I found it that people dance around, ignore, or straight up deny that dream designed and commissioned the prison as it is to hold tommy, and how that fact leads into the prison arc (and the thematic significance of that for both characters and the arc in general).

an anon fixated on a line from those posts wherein I point out the fact that the disc war finale was dream’s downfall stemming from his own actions. the anon disagreed, insisting that what’s happening now is only down to quackity’s desire for the revival book and not anything that dream has done. I got annoyed (because I’ve seen this argument in many forms often used to reduce quackity and his motivations down), so I decided to expand on how dream’s actions lead him to this point and influenced quackity’s actions towards him.

that’s the context of the post that you’re responding to, and you almost acknowledge it too. you point out the fact that I Explicitly stated that Nobody Deserves To Be Tortured, and yet you act as if I’ve excused everything that quackity has done by pointing out the reasons that lead him to take those actions. “practice what you preach” you say, while you insist that dream apologists don’t Excuse his actions while in the same breath making the assumption that I Don’t think quackity deserves comeuppance for his actions based solely on the fact that I insisted that he’s a complex character with motivations driven by revenge for him and his friends.

I think if dream fights back against quackity and sam, if he kills them even, when he inevitably escapes then that’ll be in his right to do so. I also think that las nevadas is going to blow up in his face some day, that the people he manipulated into joining him are probably going to play a part in that, that technoblade and phil are probably going to become a problem very shortly, etc etc etc.

my post was not about how quackity is going to eventually face the consequences of his actions (or how he already very much so has), it was about how dream is Already doing that. I Explicitly condemned quackity’s actions Twice, so why do I have to go in more detail now to appease you? why did you react to a criticism of dream’s actions by demanding that I criticize a different character too When I’d Already Done So?

and while I Am bothered by quackity being misrepresented in fanworks, what that post was in response to is the Overwhelming mischaracterization of quackity in the fandom’s consciousness as a whole. not just for Fun but in serious discourse, meta, and character analysis. he is Chronically stripped of his nuance All The Time. which is what gives value to pointing that nuance out. again, you tell me to “practice what you preach” and yet you’re telling me that I should just suck it up when I character I like is misrepresented while you actively identify with and push for the label of a character apologist.

finally, while it’s easier to use shorthand to refer to a general collection of ideas (and people with similar ideas) within a specific space, that shorthand becomes insufficient when you try to apply hard definitions to it. “us dream apologists wouldn’t do that,” no You haven’t done that. there are plenty of people who self identify with the label who Do excuse his actions, who Do vilify other characters and infantilize his character. they’re straight up common, especially on twitter and youtube. but those things (apparently) don’t reflect You or the people that you associate with.

which is fine, but the problem comes in when we drop nuance. I’ve attributed an action to a group that you don’t agree with, therefore this is read as an attack on you and your standing in that group. which just isn’t true. “dream apologists” are not a monolith, they’re people. and while there are trends that can be observed those trends are going to look different depending on what angle you look at them, and individual people are going to Still Be individual people with unique experiences and opinions.

“dream apologist” is not an identity, it’s not a set of beliefs. it’s a vague group of people that enjoy the character dream from the hit minecraft roleplay “dream smp” who are defensive of his character in one way or another. different people are going to have different associations with that term depending on the different people they meet because those people are going to believe and do different things. making assumptions about the people that you’re talking to based on labels Without a solid definition is not conductive to productive conversation.

you don’t have to defend yourself if I criticize behavior that you don’t do, and you Certainly don’t have defend the honor of a subsection of a subsection of a subsection of minecraft youtuber fans.

#discourse #long post #this is a bit messy but what are you gonna do

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caustic-light · 2 years

Note

Got it, no worries. There’s no need to address that topic specifically since I actually feel the same about other things.

I don’t know how to deal with having such fringe and widely despised opinions as being pro-youth rights, radical inclusionist, a proshipper, etc etc. Knowing that so many random strangers hate my guts because they misconstrue my positions & think I want harm to come to people is… really hard to deal with, mentally.

Idk who or what to turn to. I feel very isolated because I don’t want to compromise my values and befriend folks I disagree with (the only way would be to lie to them about my beliefs or not mention them, which I don’t vibe with). When you add all this up, it means the amount of people I’d feel comfortable interacting with incredibly tiny.

As my views got more “extreme”, I grew uncomfortable interacting with previous friends and acquaintances (for context, I’m an ex-anti), and stopped doing so. My social world is so small, and IRL interaction feels impossible, because obviously people aren’t going to just list their views like they might do online, and realizing that someone I’d started to befriend would hate my guts if they knew what I think about certain topics is enough to stop me trying to meet anyone new. Not to mention the risk of callouts online and social consequences in meatspace.

I realize all this sounds pretty unhinged, probably? Like I probably have some kind of trauma regarding all this but I dunno how to deal with it. I’ve been struggling with this for a very long time and simply don’t know where to reach out for help at this point. Thanks for taking the time to read this. I understand if you don’t have many answers for me, I don’t expect you to solve my problems or anything, but I thought you or your followers might have dealt with similar feelings and I wonder how you might cope with it. Thanks again.

Ok, so I’ll give a tldr in advance and it’s that my advice is to instead of trying to find communities, you should look for individual people who may not agree with all of your opinions but are generally chill as people. That is something that is kinda rare to come by wherever you go on the interwebz but they do exist and I promise you, you will feel so much more comfortable if you have like a handful of accumulated friends who are not poisoned by discourse and callout culture.

Longer answer (I promise I swear to make this as concise as possible but it probably won’t be, I’m very sorry in advance):

I know that feeling al too well. Without going into too much detail, I have experienced being in a community and developing views that the community would fucking hate if you voiced them. And what I noticed is that if you do voice them in an open way, even just an exploratory version of them, yeah you get shit for it, but you also find other people who are more afraid of voicing them openly and who may contact you privately about it. However, that is advice that only works if you can: 1. say things and have a level of reach in the space you’re in where people see you as a somewhat significant person and 2. if you’re able to overcome the fear of speaking about it. That is not easy and especially when you feel alienated, it gets a lot harder, so I’ll try to also give advice under the assumption that this won’t work.

I understand the feeling of not wanting to befriend people while lying to them. For me the most important part of that is to realize that not everyone is twitter discourse brained, even if it seems like it a lot of times. A lot of people are more open than you may give them credit for. That is mostly in private, though. I’ve been surprised especially at how many people who don’t really engage with discourse are receptive to my more radical ideas if I frame them right. It helps to set up a foundation of where you’re coming from, so views you have aren’t seen out of context. Start at the bottom and work your way up. In the process screen people for how they react. I have talked to people about child abuse prevention that actually works and have gotten “you sure think a lot about sex with children” as an answer and known that that person is not gonna be open, but at the same time I have said some very radical shit (like calling out the way anti zoo mentalities in furry are full of shit to a person who is very uncomfortable with zoophilia as a concept) and gotten a surprising amount of acceptance simply bc some people are just chill. Some people hear something controversial and instead of jumping to the attack, they keep listening. A lot of people are tired of the way discourse is turned into a life or death fight everywhere it occurs. You’re not alone there.

It takes time to find people who are genuinely cool. It takes time to find people who are genuinely open. Because despite there being a surprising amount of them, especially in the beginning it’s hard to find them. It’s hard to figure out what kind of mentalities and behavior to look for and how to differentiate between genuine red flags and things that look like red flags due to discourse induced hyper vigilance. If you do have trauma from your time as an anti, this is even harder, but I promise you it’s not impossible to learn.

At the same time, though, spaces can be genuinely cool, too. Usually it’s the smaller ones with more of a community feel. But you don’t really find them by just looking for spaces, you find them by finding people who can direct you towards them.

Personally in a lot of the friendships I have I have reached some equilibrium between “well I can’t just drop xyz oppinion and not expect some kind of off reaction” and “it doesn’t feel like lying to keep some stuff to myself because I’m not hiding anything, I’m just not seeking out an argument.”

One of my most important online friends has some opinions that violently clash with mine and we both kinda know it, but also have a mutual agreement not to discourse about some topics bc there’s nothing really to gain from that. Discourse makes them uncomfortable and some topics make them uncomfortable so they don’t go there and I respect that, and they respect that I have views that would make them uncomfortable but don’t go there bc they know me as a person and that I have my reasons for the way I think and am not gonna hurt anyone with it, even if they don’t get it. That can happen. I have another friend who doesn’t know a lot of my more controversial oppinions but knows a lot of my views that naturally lead to them and they also don’t do a lot of discourse, usually just watching me go off about a topic I am passionate about and being like “yeah, I don’t have anything to add, but yeah”, or “idk if I agree with that but I don’t have anything to add” at worst. Another friend I have who knows like 95% of my most baddest views and the other 5% are not an omission but things I just never really say all that often bc the topic rarely comes up in that way. They’re also very into discourse and have strong opinions that sometimes clash with mine in significant ways but we’re still friends and know where the other person comes from and that we’re not bad people for opinions the other disagree with.

Relationships like this happen and the more you learn to find them, the more you will realize that people are better than they look in big groups on the internet. But you also gotta know when to keep distance. I believe that every person has types of people who are good for them to be close to and people who are bad for them to be close to, even outside of a political context, just by the way different characters and even lives can interact. And learning what kind of people are good for you to be around is a skill. You have to experiment and learn how you do relationships. People you really like can be bad for you and you have to learn that, too. That sometimes it’s better to keep someone at an arms length despite really hitting it off. This applies to discourse as well. It’s a very fundamental part of how to build relationships in your life, but discourse adds another layer to it. Though I have found that personally people who are unnecessarily aggressive about discourse also don’t mesh with me as people to where I can let them get close without hurting myself in the process.

Irl it’s similar but also different. Generally it’s more difficult and scary to screen people irl and test out where they stand. You have to wait for opportunities a lot more, you have to spend more time on it. You have to deal with the fact that irl people know your real identity and are in your real life. But at the same time people irl act a lot more like people. They’re a lot less discourse poisoned. What you gotta keep in mind is that, yes they’re real and know your real identity and are in the meatspace with you, but all of that also goes the other way round. The needless aggression that permeates online spaces is partially a result of people not recognizing people they argue with as real people the same way. A person talking to your face irl will be constantly aware that everything they do and say affects a real person. And they will be aware that you are a human being, no matter what your views sound like to them if you present them in a text box on a screen. So it’s a trade off. I think it’s good for the personal wellbeing to talk to people irl to get a reality check on how far removed from the average person and the real world a lot of these discourses are. (Which is both a good and a bad thing by itself, but knowing specifically where irl people usually stand is definitely good to keep in mind.)

And also how much more lenient people are in irl, and how much more okay with disagreements. Especially if they know you as a person first. Somebody who has been your friend for years in real life will not react to an opinion they find objectionable the same way as someone who knows you fleetingly, be that online, or offline. But again… the stakes are higher, so you have to go really slow about it. And really try to read the other person and see how they respond when you screen them. Unfortunately your life situation plays a lot into your ability to find cool people and ads a big luck component to it. I have been very lucky in my life by having good people around me, but I recognize that not everyone has been born into a life that in that particular regard has been as good as mine. BUT. Idk if you’re an adult, but if you’re not I can tell you that once you leave school and gain more agency over your own life, more of a choice of who to associate with it becomes significantly easier and significantly more in your own control to chose who to associate with. And the more self reliant you become, the more that increases.

Lastly… It’s difficult to talk about some of these things in a format that is both anonymous and semi public. And idk if you know who I am, who I used to be on here, or on twitter, or still am elsewhere. Idk if you came here because you know who I am, or if you just found my tumblr and thought I seemed nice enough to not tear your head off. But if you dm me we can talk more in depth and I can possibly point you to some people and/or spaces to get an easier start. And in case it’s not clear, I promise that you can be as open as you want, I have heard some really wild stuff in my life and unless you’re gonna drop in my dm’s like “I murdered a person in the pale moonlight and I wanna do it again” I can tell you with certainty that you don’t have to worry about anything being too much for me. That is not hyperbole btw, that is actually what it would take to be the wildest stuff someone ever told me.

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annaraebananawriter · 3 years

Text

Hands

First off...HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO THE SQUID!!!

I honestly had no idea it was his birthday until last night from twitter. I was in the middle of writing this scene, in fact, and realized ‘Hey, you know what? I could probably get this done in time for it!’. Now here we are.

Secondly...This is a scene from one of my WIP’s. It will probably take place somewhere in the middle chapters, but I saw that it was a fairly out of context scene to show that it wouldn’t really matter if I showed it now as a teaser or later.

Obviously, I chose the latter.

That said, this is set to change a bit as the WIP develops, but it’ll be nice to see what you all think of it. Hope you enjoy!

Fandom: Undertale, but specifically UTMV

Pairings: Implied Errorink, or Pre-Errorink

Characters: Error (Who belongs to CQ) and Ink (Who belongs to Comyet)

Warnings: Nothing really. Although, again, it is a scene from a wip, which means that it is not in it’s final form. Let me know!

Word Count: 2488

~oOo~

His phone buzzed on the floor beside him. Ink paused in the middle of trying to balance a pencil on his finger, which was probably a losing battle, but since when has that ever stopped him before? That’s right, never. And it never would. Setting the pencil aside, he checked his phone and read the short message.

mommy-bear

Are you coming home for supper? It’s past 5.

Ink jumped, looking outside to see that, indeed, the sun was lower in the sky and time had in fact passed. They must’ve gotten lost in the throughs of their homework, or the casual avoidance of it, for one of them. Error seems to have made some sort of headway into the work from Mx. Alex. Good for him. He’ll be able to hand it in on Monday without it bugging him in the back of his mind while he ignores that bugging and just doddles instead of doing his work like he should until the next thing he knows it’s almost midnight on Sunday and he still hasn’t gotten it done.

But honestly, who would do that? Certainty not Ink.

Error had also noticed his jump and was looking at him now. “What is it?”

“Just a text from my mom.” He answered, gathering up his things. A glance to his study buddy showed Error blinking and setting down his pencil as well in order to listen. “She was just wondering where I was. It’s after five, y’know? I said I’d be back then.”

“Oh.” Error fell silent after that.

Once his things were all accounted for (he did lose his eraser for a minute there and partially freaked out about it, which was kind of silly as he had plenty more than just this one white one, others that were far more colourful, but he didn’t have to worry for long—Error had silently placed it on the bed for him to grab, making Ink smile in gratitude), Ink walked to the bedroom door and got to the top of the stairs before he realized another pair of footsteps were following him.

Man, Error really needed to take him up on the suggestion of bells. He was too silent on his feet, just too much like a ghost for his liking. Not that he didn’t like ghosts. He just didn’t like people being silent when their walking. It made him paranoid.

Ink turned around. “You know I can just walk myself back, right? I literally live right next door.” He held up one finger. “That’s the house right beside yours.”

Error scowled, just like he always did when Ink pointed things out like that. It was also a reason why he was determined to point things like that out as often as he did, which was rather often. “Don’t be stupid. Of course I know that.”

“Then why are you following me?”

“What if I wasn’t? What if I just decided to get some food? To do that, I’d need to go to the kitchen, which is also downstairs.” He gestured to the passageway to said downstairs. “Those are the only stairs to get there.”

Ink smirked, “You have a box on the top shelf of your closet where you keep all the chocolate you bought, stole, or stole from Fell.” This statement was rewarded with a light blush of embarrassment from Error, who looked around as if to make sure his brothers didn’t overhear.

Ink was sure that they already knew though.

He also suspected that they put chocolate in the box too, as Error was sometimes surprised that there was some there when he had said he had eaten it all.

“I didn’t even say I was getting chocolate! I might be getting something else.”

“You don’t snack on anything but chocolate.” Error’s scowl deepened. “You also sort of admitted to following me” He couldn’t help but laugh when the blush on Error’s skull deepened in realization and his taller friend looked away from him. It was always interesting to see just how much it took to get to this shade of blue, with the yellow freckle-like dots just barely seen overtop. The sight made Ink want to draw it.

He wanted to draw it so badly.

Laughter dying down, Ink tilted his head and smiled at Error. “If you wanted to walk with me, you could’ve just asked.”

For some reason, Error glanced back at him and quickly looked away again, blush deepening again, the yellow becoming brighter. He also started to glitch a little bit, which would normally spark a tiny bit of worry, but he could see that the other wasn’t in any danger, so he had no reason to worry. If the glitches got worse, then he could worry.

That was…pretty much the saying for being friends with him.

‘If the glitches got worse, then you could worry.’

Error burrowed down, like he usually would if he had his scarf on. It was, presumably, back in his room. Weird. The glitch he knew never went anywhere without his scarf; at school, at home, at the café, at the park, walking, sitting, it was always on. Well, it probably came off at home. Here he was with his family, a safe, happy environment away from the judging eyes of school and the city. He could be himself here. That’s an assumption, at least, hopefully the right one. Ink didn’t know the relationship between skeleton and scarf and never asked, never would talk about it until, or if, Error brought it up. He wanted to respect his privacy, after all.

But now that he thought about it, the scarf had been coming off around him lately. It had started off small. It started with it being up to his mouth, almost as if a way to hide or be smaller than he was. That was how it was for a while. Then one morning, it was down just a bit, just under his mouth. And as the days passed and the two talked more and became friends, the scarf would be lower and lower. Down to the chin in Math. Under the chin the next day. Around his neck a week later in English class.

It was almost like earning his trust. He had earned Error’s trust, which meant that he got to see the skeleton behind the scarf. The true, unshielded one.

It was…kind of nice, to be honest.

Ink blinked, coming back to himself and realizing that Error had mumbled something.

“Sorry, what?”

Error looked back at him and sighed a little before speaking up just enough so that Ink could hear. “I said, can I…walk with you?” His arms went in front of him. Ink guessed that it was a temporary shield in place of the scarf.

He was prepared to be rejected and just walk back to his room.

Well, Ink couldn’t have that, now could he?

“Of course!” The smile on his face widened and he started down the stairs with lighter steps. It was always nice when friends offered to walk you home or something of the sort. The walk was less lonely, even if you never spoke a word.

It’s just how it was.

They talked in the small time it took to get from Error’s house to Ink’s. Well, that wasn’t really true. Ink did most of the talking, which ended up being mostly complaints about homework and school and also talk about his works in progresses. Error just listened quietly, humming or nodding in certain spots. He would like to think that Ink could talk about nothing at all and Error would listen. It just seemed to be the way he was.

Their friendship was a good one. Maybe there were a few unbalances here and there, but overall, it was good and healthy and, most importantly, mutual. It benefited both of them in different ways. Ink had someone who would listen without interrupting, who cared about his interest and how he felt, even though he didn’t have a soul and relied on substitutes. Error had someone who didn’t pressure him into a conversation, who gave him and respected his personal space and asked before touching his things and body. It was like a missing piece just fell into place, so perfect, it felt like it hadn’t been missing at all.

That said, there were some hurdles.

Like how Ink was soulless. There was always that thought, loud or quiet, one that questioned whether the love he felt towards his friends and family was real. Or if he was just deluding himself and everyone around him into thinking that they were. This thought had always been there, since before Dream and Blue, before Error, before anyone he was with now—what if it was all fake?

It was kind of silly. The substitutes he took acted as a soul. It supplied him his soul magic, the working parts of his body and the emotion spectrum. He may not feel things as intensely as others and may be lacking a feeling in a certain way, but that didn’t mean they weren’t real. They’re substitutes for a reason, after all.

…Ah! They’ve arrived at his house.

Ink blinked, stopping on the first step and turning back to Error. “So…” he said, finding himself unable to think of what else to say. He shifted awkwardly and cleared his throat. “I’ll see you next Friday?” He tried to think back on what else was going on in school. “We have some sort of project to do or test to study for, right?”

Error nodded. “Yeah, I think so.” He fell silent too, but didn’t leave like Ink had expected. He lingered, clearly thinking about something with the way his arms slightly glitched around. He didn’t say anything, though.

“Anything else?” Ink asked, trying to prompt him.

The blush, which had died down as they walked over here, brightened again. “Um…yeah, actually.” Error straightened and fiddled with his sleeve. “Do you remember the lesson we had…I think it was a month ago? In Health?”

Ink rocked on his heels as he thought. It was times like these that he cursed his memory. A month ago…a month ago…he didn’t really remember a lot of the lessons from a month ago. But the ones that he did… “Do you mean the one about the different types of intimacy? I only recall that it was about intimacy, nothing specific.”

“Yeah…yeah, that’s the one.”

“Okay…why is it important?” Curious. Error rarely asked him if he could remember a lesson from as long as a month ago. He knew how bad Ink’s memory was, so why did he ask? And why now, of all times?

“I, uh…w-well…” Error stuttered. Error didn’t normally stutter. It was only when he glitched really badly and was on the verge of crashing that he stuttered, or lagged, as he liked to call it. Normally, though, he spoke fine, if quiet and almost echoey.

Speaking of glitches…the ones on his arms had quickened up a little. Not enough to be too worrying yet, but definitely something to watch over.

Frowning, Ink was just about to bring that to attention when Error spoke again, voice clearer. “Just…can you…raise your hand?” He slowly brought up a hand with the inside facing Ink, like he was to high-five someone. “Like this?”

Ink eyed him suspiciously.

One of the first things he had learned about Error was that the other had haphephobia. He couldn’t stand people touching him, as it usually caused a flurry of glitches in the touched spot, and sometimes it was so bad that the minute someone touched him, he crashed. Those days were few, but they have happened. Ink had been lucky that it hasn’t happened since meeting Error. But this fact he had taken in and committed to memory, determined to not trigger his friend like that.

He would hate himself, if he did.

But now Error was asking him to raise his hand? For what? He couldn’t see them high-fiving. It would be too painful for Error and frankly a bit of a reach for Ink (he hated being short like that). And because it would be painful, he couldn’t see why he had to raise his hand.

But he was curious.

Curiosity usually made his answers for him.

Just as slowly as Error did, Ink raised his hand, mirroring the one in front of him.

Error inhaled and…

Ink’s mind froze.

He could barely focus on Error stepping closer as excitement and happiness began to take over. The urge to squeal was overwhelming, but he reigned himself in as he knew that wouldn’t help Error at all. It would probably just make him run away and never come near Ink again. And he didn’t want that. So, he forced himself to stay still and stay quiet, eyes focused on the hand that started to come closer and closer to his.

He could see the black bones begin to glitch a ton and felt a spark of worry—despite what might just happen, he didn’t want Error to hurt himself. He would never want him to—he should speak up now. He should tell Error to stop and calm down.

They didn’t have to do it like this.

They didn’t even have to touch at all!

They didn’t…have to…

It was…warm.

Fuzzy.

The hands contrasted starkly and they would be stunning in a painting. The white of Inks and the black of Errors. They were different, but they looked so well together.

This…This had to be a dream.

But it wasn’t. There was a light touch to his bones, just enough to know that the hand against his was, in fact, against his and trembling ever so slightly and actually existed in the world and not just his imagination. Somehow, this made it even more surreal. He knew it was real…but he just couldn’t believe it.

If this was a dream, he didn’t want to wake up.

Despite his promise to stay still, Ink shakily inhaled.

And just like that, the spell was broken.

Error retracted his hand and walked away quickly. Ink was slow to realize what was happening and so by the time his hand was up and the name of his tongue, his friend was already gone. He stood there with his arm outstretched, gazing at the house next door blankly.

He slowly looked down at his hand.

It still tingled.

Gently wrapping his other hand around it, not daring to actually touch, he brought the hands closer to his chest, right over where his soul would be.

It felt like something should be beating wildly in there.

It felt like some new emotion had been lodged in his substitutes.

And somehow, it felt like that contact, the light touch of hands, was far more intimate than a kiss had ever and would ever be.

#my writing #my fanfiction #oneshot #teaser #errorink #implied errorink #pre-errorink #error sans #ink sans #utmv #fluff #happy birthday ink!

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cfiesler · 4 years

Text

thoughts on AO3 from a content moderation researcher

A few days ago I tweeted some thoughts about current conversations around content moderation and racism on AO3. I thought I’d reproduce here:

OK I'm going to weigh in on the tagging/content moderation conversation happening right now regarding Archive of Our Own. To be clear, this is me as a content moderation researcher who has also studied the design of AO3, NOT me as a member of the OTW legal committee.

To clarify the issue for folks: Racism is a problem in fandom. In addition to other philosophical and structural things regarding OTW, there have been suggestions for adding required content warnings or other mechanisms to deal with racism in stories posted to the archive.

Here's a description of the content warning system from a paper I published about the design of AO3, in which I used this as an example of designing to mitigate the value tension of inclusivity versus safety:

“Knowing that this tension would exist, and wanting to protect users from being triggered or stumbling across content they did not want to see, AO3 added required warnings for stories. These include graphic violence, major character death, rape, and underage sex. These warnings were chosen based on conventions at the time, what fan fiction writers already tended to warn for when posting stories elsewhere. Warnings are not only required, but are part of a visual display that shows up in search results. One early concern was that requiring these warnings might necessitate spoilers—for example, telling the reader ahead of time that there was a major character death. Therefore, AO3 added an additional warning tag: ‘Choose not to use archive warnings.’ Seeing this tag in search results essentially means ‘read at your own risk.’ Most interviewees found this to be a solution that did a good job at taking into account different kinds of needs."

The idea is certain kinds of objectionable content is allowed to be there as long as it's properly labeled. Content will not be removed for having X, but it can be removed for not being tagged properly for having X. This allows users to not have to see content labeled with X.

My students and I have studied content moderation systems in a number of contexts, including on Reddit and Discord, and I actually think that this system is kind of elegant and other platforms can learn from it. That said, it relies on strong social norms to work.

One of the big problems with content moderation is that not everyone has the same definition of what constitutes a rule violation. Like... folks on a feminist hashtag almost certainly have a different definition of what constitutes "harassment" than on the gg hashtag.

A few years ago we analyzed harassment policies on a bunch of different platforms and usually it's just like "don't harass people" but okay what does that mean? I guarantee you there are people on twitter who think rape threats aren't harassment.

So a nice thing about communities moderating themselves--like on subreddits--is that they can create their own rules and have a shared understanding of what they mean (here’s a paper about rules on Reddit). So you can have a rule about harassment and within your community know what that means.

I've talked for a long time about the strong social norms in fandom and how this has allowed in particular for really effective self regulation around copyright. In fact I wrote about this really recently based on interviews conducted in 2014. HOWEVER -

Generally, I think social norms are not as strong in fandom as they used to be, in part because it's just gotten bigger and there are more people and also some generational differences and we're more spread out. (My PhD advisee) Brianna & I wrote about this for TWC.

So the point here is that without those very strong shared norms, definitions differ - across sub-fandoms, across platforms, across people. Whether that thing we're defining is commercialism, harassment, or racism.

This isn't to say that there *shouldn't* be a required content warning for racism in fics, but I think it's important to be aware how wrought enforcement will be because no matter how it is defined, a subset of fandom will not agree with that definition.

That said, design decisions like this are statements. When AO3 chose the required warnings, it was a statement about what types of content it is important to protect the community from. I would personally support a values-based decision that racism falls into that category.

Design also *influences* values. An example of this was AO3's decision to include the "inspired by" tag which directly signaled (through design) that remixing fics without explicit permission was okay. Another quote from the paper:

“Similarly, Naomi described a policy decision of AO3 that was a deliberate attempt to influence a value. Prior work understanding fandom norms towards re-use of content has shown something of a disconnect, with different standards for different types of work [15,16]. Surprisingly, although fan authors themselves are building on others’ work, some don’t want people to remix their remixes. In Naomi’s original blog post, there is some argument between fans about what AO3 should do about this, with suggestions for providing a mechanism for fan writers to give permission for remixing. Naomi described their ultimate design, and feels that in the time that has followed the creation of AO3, the values of the community have actually shifted to be more accepting of this practice:

‘We had baked in right from the beginning that you could post a work to the archive that was a remix, or sequel, or translation, or a podfic or whatever, based on another work, another fannish work. As long as you gave credit, you didn’t need permission. In fact, we built a system into the archive where it notifies [the original author]. That was because we were coming from a philosophy where what we’re doing is fair use. It’s legal. We are making transformative work. We don’t need permission from the original copyright holder. That’s why fanfic is legitimate. But what’s sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander… So, I think that’s an example, actually, where archive and OTW almost got a little bit ahead of the curve, got a little bit ahead of the broader community’s internal values. That was a deliberate concerted decision on our part.’”

A design change to AO3 that forces consideration of whether there is racism in a story you're posting could have an impact on the overall values of the community by signaling that this consideration is necessary AND that you should be thinking of a community definition of racism.

Also important: content moderation has the potential to be abused. And I know that this happens in fandom, even around something as innocuous as copyright, since I've heard stories of harassment-based DMCA takedown campaigns.

There's a LOT of tension in fandom around public shaming as a norm enforcement mechanism, and I would want to see this feature used as a "gentle reminder" and not a way to drum people out of fandom. (See more about that in this paper.)

That said, I think these reminders are needed. There will be a LOT of "uh I didn't know that was racist" and that requires some education. Which is important but also an additional burden on volunteer moderators who may be grappling with this themselves.

This is more a thread of cautions than solutions, unfortunately. Because before there can be solutions, we need: (1) an answer to a very hard question, which is "what is racism in fanfiction/fandom?" and this answer needs to come from a diverse group of stakeholders, and (2) a solution for enforcement/moderation that both makes sure that folks directly impacted by racism are involved AND that we're not asking for burdensome labor from already marginalized groups.

All of this comes down to: Content moderation is HARD for so many reasons, both on huge platforms and in communities. AO3 is kind of a unique case with its own problems but I am optimistic about solutions because so many people care about the values in fandom.

I’m still thinking about this and welcome others’ thoughts!

#archive of our own #ao3 #OTW #fanfiction #fandom #acafandom #content moderation

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greenbergsays · 3 years

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So, you're the closest thing I have to a "friend"* in fandom, and you seem to know your fandom history and have a level take on a lot of things, so I hoped I could bother you for your opinion on something. This is a long and kind of heavy/complicated question so if you don't have the mental space for it, please feel free to disregard it entirely.

So, I absolutely adore an anime (My Hero Academia), and I really want to write for it, but I personally headcanon my favorite character (Shoto Todoroki) as having DID. I've written a lot of personal snippets for myself about it and done lots of research because it sort of became a new special interest for me, and I really want to start writing proper fics and sharing them again. However, my problem is sort of twofold.

I don't want to insult people who actually live with DID by writing a character that is inaccurate, and I know research will only get me so far. I understand that stories don't have to be perfectly realistic in fanfiction contexts (eg, the difference between posting Master of the Universe vs Fifty Shades of Grey) but I don't want to cause more harm to an already marginalized community, even if unintentionally.

The other issue is that the fandom is kind of known for being incredibly toxic in some circles, especially on platforms like tiktok and twitter. I worry that even if I openly say I want criticism on my stories so I CAN do better, I'll just get flooded with hate comments about it not being canon, or arguing about basic shit like how I portray my characters vs how they perceive them from the show, rather than getting any actual feedback that could help.

I really love this fandom, and I really want to get back in to writing. It was one of the few things that gave me joy before my entire life turned upside down, and I want to get back to doing things that make me happy. But I've had so many bad experiences with harassing comments that I'm not sure how to move forward with wanting to continue, much less when I want to touch such a delicate topic.

*I use this term incredibly loosely, I just follow you and appreciate your content and you were the first person to pop in my mind when someone said ask a friend about it, I sincerely apologize if that upsets or offends you in any way

So here’s the thing, right.

I did once read a fic where Bucky Barnes had DID because of his lifelong trauma. I thought it was a well-thought-out fic, unique and memorable, and I don’t feel like it was toxic or harmful in its portrayal, but I also don’t have DID.

I don’t know how someone living with it experiences that fic or the one you would write.

I would recommend a sensitivity reader rather than declaring open season in the comments. I would recommend getting one before you even start the fic, actually, because you don’t know whether or not the idea/plot itself will be harmful to them as a whole and you don’t want to go through that much work only to figure out you have to scrap it all.

The other thing I will say is that you’ll have to prepare yourself for the harassing comments. I hate them, I don’t agree with them, I will do everything in my power to fight them and teach better etiquette, but this is the internet and people are NOTORIOUSLY ASSHOLES on the internet.

Even with a sensitivity reader that okays a story, people are gonna try to come at you that don’t experience the issues or even know someone who does, bc they like to be Performatively Woke In Public for the kudos or whatever.

So you really gotta weigh whether or not you wanna rock that boat or if you just want to share your story with a privileged few. It might be easier that way.

I hope this helps? Even a little bit?

And good luck!

EDIT: Actually, I thought about this as soon as I hit post, so lemme add

If your story ideas are about the DID experience itself, I wouldn’t recommend writing that. Having a story with a certain type of character with a completely separate plot is inclusive and I encourage that, but when it comes to stories that are “experiences with x” exclusively, it’s one of those “own voices” things.

Allow queer people to write queer experiences, black people to write black experiences, etc. But absolutely include these kinds of characters in your fantasy/sci-fi story where that isn’t the plot itself.

#neurodivergence #sensitivity readers #dissociative identity disorder #fandom etiquette #nani asks #greenberg replies

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keelywolfe · 4 years

Text

FIC: Pet the Kitty (spicyhoney standalone)

Summary: Edge does not resent that his cat is utterly shameless when it comes to Stretch. (He just wishes he could do the same)

Notes: Totally based on a twitter prompt. Link to the prompt available on AO3.

Tags: Spicyhoney, Lemon Goodness, Rough Sex, Yearning, Jealous of a Damn Cat

~~*~~

Read it on AO3

Read it here!

~~*~~

“aww, who’s a pretty girl, yes, she is, pretty pretty baby.”

It was almost offensive, really.

Doomfanger was a lovely cat, of that there was no question. Long, silky fur that was blissful to stroke, (and that clung stubbornly to every surface when shed, particularly Edge’s trousers), her wide eyes strikingly blue against the wheaten shade of her coat and the dark mask of fur on her face. Beautiful, yes, and aware of it; she craftily used her enticing appearance to lull unsuspecting guests into a false sense of security. Despite Edge’s warnings, so many of them were reeled in for that first stroke and then went for a second. That was when she struck, sinking her needle-sharp teeth and claws into any hand that fell for her trap.

It happened often enough that Edge kept a small first aid kit in the front room and anyone who complained as antiseptic was dabbed on their bleeding wounds was firmly reminded that they’d been warned. Do not touch the cat.

But for some reason, that rule never seemed to apply to Stretch. Even before they added the vulgar title of ‘fuck buddies’ to their relationship, Fanger seemed to set her personal morals aside for Stretch (and Edge did not think at how similar that was to her owner). She seemed to sense when he was at the door and came running, already chirping her baby-cry meow as she wound her way between his feet, nearly tripping him before he was even properly inside.

It was mortifying, Edge decided, watching with his arms crossed over his chest as his cat flopped to her side and exposed her vulnerable belly for Stretch to rub. No, it was shameful, and he did not resent that when he petted her belly, more often than not he’d be hastily jerking his hand away from a sudden application of sharp teeth.

He didn’t say a word, though, not a single one, and Edge was very sure that whatever expression was on his face, it didn’t warrant the calculating expression that fell across Stretch’s when he glanced up and caught sight of him. It certainly didn’t deserve that infuriating smirk as Stretch stood, dusting any clinging fur from his bony fingers as Doomfanger loudly voiced her displeasure at the cruel abandonment.

“aww, what’s the matter, sweetheart?” Stretch crooned. He sauntered over and the cocky roll of his hips was nearly as infuriating as the way it drew the gaze, implying a certain level of skill in a very specific context. “do you need pets, too?”

“You—” Fucker never made it out of his mouth, smothered beneath a harsh kiss as he was suddenly caged in Stretch’s arms. Just as well, it was better to have the reality of it than the word. Stretch was stronger than he looked, easily able to lift Edge off his feet, urging him silently to wrap his legs around those inviting hips to carry him off towards the bedroom.

They didn’t quite make it, mouths jarring apart as Stretch briefly stumbled, his sweatshirt gone askew where Edge gripped it. The temptation to sink his teeth into Stretch’s exposed collarbone was too much to resist and had him stumbling again, cursing loudly as he turned to push Edge against the wall with enough force to knock his breath from him.

“you little shit, wanna play like that?” Breathed hotly against his skull.

He didn’t, couldn’t say, yes, fuck yes, have me, take me, make me. He could only tip his head back against the wall, snarling wordlessly at the ceiling as his clothes were seized with magic and torn away, leaving him bare to the bones, his cunt forming between his roughly spread femurs. His clothes were certainly taking a beating these past few weeks since they’d begun this, sometimes ripped to little more than rags, and he didn’t care. Not so long as he could be here, his wrists roughly pinned to the wall by strong, slim fingers, another arm under his knee, hitching him up higher as Stretch struggled to wriggle down his shorts, his cock pushing urgently against Edge’s already humiliatingly dripping pussy.

They both groaned in unison as he shoved inside, filling Edge with one hard, deep thrust. It was almost too much, the girthy stretch of it almost painful with no prep and Stretch didn’t pause, already moving, his pelvis pistoning against Edge’s as he drove in with a brutal rhythm.

“Fuck!” Edge grunted. Barely, he could feel the burn of friction on his bones where he was jostling against the wall. Hard to pay attention to that when the angle of Stretch’s cock inside him was perfect, hammering in exactly where he needed it and sending his vision into stars. The wet glicking sound of it was loud, obscene, pulsing with metronome precision.

“yeah, that’s the idea, baby,” Stretch gasped out. The undercurrent of laughter in his voice was familiar and unwelcome, and Edge wrenched a hand free, scrabbling for a grip around Stretch’s neck to cling viciously. Needle sharp fingers dug into his cervical vertebra and Stretch yelped and only fucked him harder, returning his viciousness in kind, stretching him brutally past his limits.

“Oh, fuck, oh, fuck, I—” Edge whined, his voice shorting out into a desperate cry.

“don’t you fucking come,” Stretch grunted, “don’t you dare, not yet.”

He nearly disobeyed immediately, even as Stretch suddenly withdrew, unceremoniously releasing Edge so that he slid down the wall, staggering to his feet and nearly collapsed directly to the floor. He didn’t have the chance to even catch his balance, spun abruptly around and a foot clad in an untied sneaker kicked his legs apart, Stretch crowding him back into the wall, both hands on his pelvis angling his hips as he pushed roughly back in.

“Yes, yes, fuck!” Edge wailed, his voice breaking and hoarse, his sharpened fingertips gouging into the wall as Stretch drew back to only the tip and slammed back in, again, again, oh, fuck, again.

A slim hand fumbled down between his legs, two fingers vicious on either side of his clit, stroking with painful intensity and his threatening orgasm abruptly swarmed over him, dimming his vision on a blinding rush of pure, sweet bliss that left him trembling and weak. He sagged, held up only by Stretch’s hands and weight holding him against the wall, sliding in his own sweat disgustingly damp beneath his bones.

Stretch never paused, hands shifting to Edge's pelvis and his fingers digging into the iliac crests as he kept fucked into him with a brutal drive. He panted out against the back of Edge's skull, “that’s one. now let’s see what you can do for me.”

By the time Edge properly came back to his senses, lying in his sweat-and-cum sticky sheets, the light coming in through the bedroom blinds was tinged with twilight. Next to the bed, Stretch was pulling on his stained clothes, his hands still a little fuck-clumsy, quivering yet with little aftershocks.

“Leaving so soon?” Edge managed to keep it light, a teasing question that didn’t reveal any of his inner turmoil.

“yeah, i gotta, promised blue i’d be home for dinner,” Stretch yawned. He gave the back of his clothed pelvis a crude, vigorous scratching. “gonna have to shortcut right to the shower and hose off as it is, don’t think spunk is the aroma du jour for a lasagna…oh, hey, there, beautiful.”

As Edge watched, Stretch crouched down to where the cat was winding through his legs and gently stroked a hand down Doomfanger’s arched back. Gentleness that he never showed Edge, not that he asked for it or even wanted it. He scritched lightly under Fanger’s chin and the rusty sound of her purr filled the small room, as did her mrrp of disappointment when Stretch stopped.

“see you this weekend?” Almost a careless afterthought, as if Stretch didn’t mind very much if he did or not.

“Maybe Sunday, I’m busy Saturday.” Busy doing nothing but pretending he wasn’t desperate for more of this, so much more.

“sounds good, text me. laterz.” With a casual wave over one shoulder, Stretch shambled out of the room, shoelaces trailing, and Fanger’s last protesting mewl following him out as he closed the door behind him.

Doomfanger leapt lightly on the bed, her tail curled around her feet as she sat just out of reach.

“What?” Edge asked her defiantly.

Her meow was as accusing as the glare in her pale blue eyes.

“It’s not like that,” he told his cat, “we’re not in a real relationship.”

Her tail twitched, once, twice, like a snake. “What can I possibly do? If he wanted to stay, he’d ask. Obviously, he doesn’t, what do you want me to do, beg?”

Doomfanger blinked slowly, her ears flicked, and Edge sighed. “I know.” Softer, a confession only for feline hearing. “I know. I wish he would stay, too.”

That seemed to be all she had to say about the situation. Doomfanger stood and walked fastidiously across the soiled sheets, settling back down against his ribcage. Her purr was loud enough to rattle bone and Edge rubbed her ears, touching silky fur that Stretch’s fingers had only just stroked with such gentleness. It seemed he saved his kindness for only one pussy in the household and Edge did not yearn for a softer touch against his own. He didn’t and he’d keep telling himself that until he believed it.

Edge lay there in the growing darkness and pet Doomfanger for a very long time, and tried not to think, tried and failed, because his cat really liked his fuck buddy, his friend, his…he didn’t know, and couldn’t risk asking. All he knew was that Doomfanger really liked Stretch and Edge was very much afraid that he liked him, too, and all he could do was lie here and pretend he wasn’t jealous of his own blasted cat.

He drifted off to a rumbling purr at his side and the memory of soft words, who’s a pretty girl, yes, she is, pretty pretty baby, words that weren’t for him, not in the slightest.

But he could still pretend.

-fin

#spicyhoney #papcest #keelywolfe #underfell #underswap #underfell papyrus #underswap papyrus #lemon goodness

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bluecoloreddreams · 4 years

Text

(Disclaimer: this contains spoilers for the Fruits Basket and Fruits Basket: Another manga, as well as taking into consideration tidbits from Takaya’s twitter.)

So, okay, first of all we have to address the YMMV aspect: Some people don’t like this ship. As long as they’re respectful, I have no beef with that. I’m well aware that some people cannot/choose not to make the distinction between “real life” and “fiction”— I have the luxury of this choice, so some of the “problematic” ships/character aspects within Furuba don’t bother me (for the most part). It’s fiction, and I’m aware of this.

Again, some people cannot/do not make this distinction, and that’s none of my business because that’s their personal life. I’m aware that people dislike aspects of Akigure, and that’s fine.

Personally? I’ve been reading Furuba since like, basically the dawn of time. I was reading scans on, like, MSN groups. I remember a friend at church (of all places) telling me about the Akito reveal because I was behind on updates. It’s literally engrained upon my shipping heart at this point.

(Headcanons ahoy! Like literally, this is all headcanon/my perspective on the series as a whole. YMMV/YKINMK/Dead Dove, the whole works, if you know you know

YES I wrote it like it’s an actual research paper because I have No Chill At All, please forgive me. It’s long and pretty rambling.)

Addressing the first elephant in the room: Given my limited interactions with the fandom, my impression of Akigure from a generalized fan POV is that it’s pretty divisive. Every episode she comes up there are “I hate this kid” comments and I cry

Akito is a favorite of mine, and it’s impossible for anime-only’s to make a deep, informed call on her character. On the other hand, a lot of manga-readers dislike her too.

So, why am I talking about whether or not people like Akito as a character?

I’m of the opinion that it impacts people’s ability to view her character arc as one that deserves a happy ending. That she doesn’t deserve to have love, happiness, or forgiveness, all of which are given to her when she and Shigure finally end up together on equal footing. (Do I think the way it’s rushed in the original Furuba ending? Yeah, but hey. Sensei had like a huge ensemble cast to wrap ends on. Now there’s Furubana to look to and it’s just chef’s kiss.)

There’s a mental aspect in this, involving the dichotomy between “reality” and “fiction”.

There is absolutely zero argument that are a lot of things that Akito does that uh, listen, if it was IRL she’d be in jail! Jail for terror baby! Jail for life!

Fortunately, Fruits Basket is a work of fiction. These characters aren’t real, they’re idealized brushstrokes of human nature created to move a plot and a message along.

That’s why Akito and Shigure work as a couple and as characters:

They’re both incredibly deep characters that get passed off as one-dimensional by a lot of people (and the original anime, woof). Some of it is again, because anime-only fans just don’t have the whole story, since Akito’s arc is one that builds gradually until it hits a point where all hell breaks loose, which we are a ways away from.

So what’s the message that their relationship and characters are supposed to pass on?

Well, it breaks down into two categories: world building and thematic arcs. The latter is more important and what I’ll be focusing on, while the former is just a little spice that I, personally enjoy, and won’t really talk about in depth. (It’s that the magical realism in Furuba sets up the idea of soulmates, it’s just…. Something I enjoy and it’s really heacanony, so I can’t really justify spending more words on it!)

When discussing Fruits Baskets in any capacity, I feel like we must first keep in mind the thematic “lessons” of the series:

There is an inherent loneliness in living as a human being, since loss, grief, and hurt are indelible parts of the human experience, and learning to cope with these feelings in a compassionate manner is a life-long lesson

People react differently to the loneliness of existence, and their reactions are based upon their personalities, their upbringings, and their own choices

Everyone is capable of change and learning, if they choose to do so, however:

Personal agency is taught, but in the vacuum of positive reinforcement, the ability of a person to choose to be compassionate is stifled or outright inaccessible

Therefore, if you are not taught to deal with your grief and existence outside of others, your ability to connect may become warped, manipulative, or abusive, and this is not the fault of the child but instead the parental figure

Eventually, you will be aware of your actions, and then it is your burden to choose—some people do not take this choice (the head maid, Ren, Kyo’s bio dad, Rin’s parents, Sawa’s mother in Furubana)

Abuse has long lasting effects on the psyche and can be physical, emotional, and/or mental in nature and must be dealt with in order to grow as a person

“Dealt with” does not mean that it goes away, but that it is acknowledged and given a positive outlet (Yuki’s garden, Aaya’s shop, Rin’s art, Momiji’s violin playing)

Forgiveness is not linear

Forgiving yourself is a long and arduous process, and happens independent of other people’s forgiveness

This is really brought to the forefront in Fruits Basket: Another, when Shiki talks about how his mother interacts with the rest of the Sohma family. It’s shown she’s done what she can to make amends, but recognizes that while she can individually hold relationships with certain family members, as a whole, it's best if she allows them to be away from her.

This is a whole tangent on its own, but there’s a certain blanket of casual forgiveness given to Akito by the entirety of the shown Zodiac in Furubana, in that they trust that she’s raised a kind and thoughtful son and allow him the grace of his own family.

Again, in Takaya’s tweets post-series that acknowledges that Akito’s friends with Uo-chan, despite her relationship with Kureno (and it shows a depth of awareness on Kureno’s part that he stays away

People flourish in environments where love and positive reinforcement is given freely, even when people are in the wrong

This doesn’t mean that no one is ever scolded: see Komaki and Kakeru, Kisa and Hiro, Hatori chews out Shigure all the time, but never ceases being his confidant

So okay, that’s A Lot. But every single character in Furuba follows these themes in their own manner, because the series is about healing and learning how to heal from abuse, neglect, and isolation. Someone’s gonna have to be doing it. Point blank, the end, to tell a story there must be conflict, and boy howdy, there’s a lot of conflict in Furuba. Every personal thematic arc in the series ends up tying into a romantic one, because Furuba is a romcom drama.

There’s a loop that goes “personal betterment”->”crush”/”friendship”->”conflict”->”personal growth”/”relationship growth” in the series for every character. That’s the bread and butter of Furuba.

But anyway. To the question:

I love them because they work, they’re both their own people with their own narrative focuses, motivations, conflicts, and flaws. Both Shigure and Akito are believable in their own right in the context of Furuba, and I think Takaya did wonderfully in crafting a story where their personalities mesh well and give each other reasons to better themselves.

To talk about them together, you have to talk about them separately.

I’m gonna start with Shigure because, truthfully?

I just want to lament about how often he’s simply passed off as either comic relief or absolute trash. He’s so underestimated!

“He’s a joke of a grown man… He is reliable and I trust him.” (Another, v. 3)

He’s incredibly intelligent when it comes to interpersonal relationships, which is why he’s able to do what he does. He’s also incredibly kind—no one made him take in Yuki or Kyo or Tohru. He could have just went “ah, I’d prefer not to” and moved on. But he didn’t, made up some bullshit so Haru would feel like taking in Yuki was a transaction, and let me just tell you, I am the same age as Shigure and if you gave ME three teenagers to be the guardian of?! It would be a full on disaster.

He’s actually incredibly trustworthy (if he wants to be), insightful, and a genuinely good guardian despite his jokes and wisecracking.

He forced Kyo to go back to school, knowing full well it would be good for him. He lets a whole host of children run rampant through his home. Kids who actually enjoy his presence. He’s shown as having a good familial relationship with Rin (who tries to warp that for her own means), Kisa, Haru, and Momiji. His advice to Tohru is genuine, insightful, and ridiculously helpful.

Shigure is good with people. He gets up at the crack of dawn to drive Shiki to see Sawa in Furubana. He’s who Mutsuki and Hajime immediately go “holy shit you need to do something about this” to when they find out Shiki’s getting nasty notes about Akito. He’s who Shiki goes to when Sawa fell down the stairs as a child. As much as Shiki and the others make fun of Shigure, he’s obviously someone who’s trustworthy. And that’s not some new development, he’s always been trustworthy in regards to those he loves. No one asked him to show up to Tohru’s teacher conference, he volunteered. Like this dude loves people, he’s the dog spirit after all, and rightly so.

Does he have his own motivations? Of course! But so does everyone else in Furuba. He’s a complex character, man!

He laughs and jokes a lot because he’s projecting this image of a laid back, doofus. When you think about who he’s friends with, the whole middling goofball act makes a lot of sense. Just like some of Ayame’s over the top behavior is a defense mechanism, I believe that Shigure casts himself as a generally unappealing man to keep himself safe from advances when he was in school, but also to temper the wildly unequal personalities of his other two friends. He’s the sort of person who would just go “eh, whatever makes it easy”, and that’s just how he is.

He doesn’t mean the creepy school girl thing, it’s a bit and I think the only people who don’t realize he’s running a bit are Yuki, Kyo, and Tohru who are absolutely too stupid to realize he’s playing them for reactions. He thinks it’s funny.

Anyway:

When the older Zodiac had the dream of Shigure, Shigure is the only one who made the active choice to seek out that feeling. His soul was touched, and he decided that he wanted that and only that. This doesn’t necessarily mean he went full Jacob from Breaking Dawn, but it does mean he acknowledged there was a bond, and he wanted it.

When you get into the technicalities of the curse, it’s mentioned that their Zodiac spirits influence how they interact with Akito, and that going against her can cause physical and emotional pain. Yuki cries when meeting her, and it’s mentioned that that’s just the normal reaction for the Zodiacs.

It’s hard to say how much of their early interactions are influenced by the curse, but it’s obvious that Shigure has genuine fondness for her. She wasn’t always absolutely broken, as shown in Yuki’s backstory, and was a precocious child, one who sought affection openly.

Shigure has an indulgent personality, and is shown to love being adored. Guess who loves him! Akito! Guess who wants lots and lots of affection! Akito!

Their personalities are very well matched as they get older: They’re both intelligent and coy. They both have fairly sharp tongues when needed, and have no qualms about doing whatever it takes to get what they want.

Shigure wants Akito to be independent from the curse. He’s made it clear to her he doesn’t want to be her father, he doesn’t want to be her friend, he wants to be her lover. Those are boundaries that Akito’s never been given before, and his frankness with her and his jealousy with Kureno is something she agonizes over, simply because she’s never been given any sort of serious interpersonal boundaries, or repercussions for her actions. He’s always kept himself separate from her, because of those boundaries, even when they were children.

That’s important. It opens the door to the idea that her actions have consequences, and is a persistent nagging in the back of her mind.

“Even though you hadn’t realized it, I was waiting for that day.” (ch 101)

For the bulk of the series, the only person who sees Akito as a person separate from the curse, and sees a future where she can grow is Akito. He has an extraordinary amount of patience for her, and forgives her for a lot.

There are only two incidents that Shigure cannot forgive: Her sleeping with Kureno, and at the very end of the series, I’m of the full opinion that if Akito had pushed Tohru off the cliff, Shigure would have been done with her. Look at that expression, that is the look of someone who is toeing the line of throwing away all his hopes and dreams. If she really had pushed Tohru, I just...... The series would have taken a much darker tone.

OKAY that’s enough about our favorite terrible author! (Okay, an aside, Shigure, please share your work ethic, you goof off so much but you’ve published so many things…how…)

ONTO AKITO!

“I’ve finally realized… she hated her own shallowness all this time, from the very start.” // “It’s frightening because you have no choices.” (ch 121)

A lot of people dislike Akito because she, for the bulk of the manga, is violent, manipulative and just downright unpleasant. And that’s fine, but it’s not the point of her arc or the themes of the manga. (It is, however, the point of Rin’s: you don’t have to forgive everyone.)

She’s not the only violent person in the series. If we as readers can forgive Uo-chan and Kyoko, or even Hana-chan for her moment of violence, why can we not extend the same grace to Akito?

Violence is often shown as a knee-jerk reaction to fear and sadness: Kyoko, Uo, Hana, Kyo, Rin, and Akito all react violently to negative situations and feelings. Even Kisa reacts violently when she’s at her worst, biting both Haru and Tohru when she’s in her tiger form, which is shown to actually cause pain like a real tiger would. (It’s played for laughs, but has anyone been bitten for realsies by a house cat? That hurts! How much more would a house-cat sized tiger hurt!!!)

Out of all of them, Hanajima and Kisa are the only characters to show immediate remorse, because they have what the others don’t: A positive support system. Once positive role models and support systems are in place, all of the others begin to learn how to react differently and ease out of the knee-jerk reactions that were ingrained in them.

It’s made explicit in the manga that you have to be taught how to react positively, you have to learn and choose to be good, to be friendly, to love yourself outside of others’ perceptions of yourself. Look at Yuki’s arc. Look at Uo-chan’s. Kyoko’s.

Yuki sums it up nicely in the last chapter of the manga, where he tells Tohru that she taught the Zodiac how to become human. She allows them to grow into people who can make the choice to be loving, compassionate individuals.

Just because Akito doesn’t interact positively with Tohru for the bulk of the manga, it doesn’t make it any less true:

Akito is kept in a juvenile state of being: No one teaches her to suck it up, that the world exists outside of herself, that other people are people and not things. In fact, she’s actively encouraged to act the way she does. She’s incredibly broken, between the maids of the Sohma estate just… allowing her to do whatever the fuck she wants and her absolutely jacked up relationship with Ren and Akira. She has no moral compass at all. No one bothers to teach her that her actions have serious consequences.

She knows, in a roundabout way that hey, these people don’t like me. There’s a serious mental dissonance between what she latently knows—these are all people with no connection to her other than the bond of the curse. This is why Tohru is able to break through to her at the climax of the manga:

She knows she’s wrong, but no one has ever told her she’s wrong but understood why she’s doing it. Akito just didn’t have the words to explain herself. What do children do when they cannot communicate? They lash out. Kids will bite, scratch, yell, kick, fall to the floor and have screaming tantrums out of frustration. Eventually, most kids learn that there are other ways to express frustration, and move along. (Not all, though, but most.)

Akito was taught that this is acceptable, allowable, and is her right as god. She is actively broken and kept that way through the neglect of the Sohma family maids, Ren’s abuse, and how Akira framed her role in the Zodiac.

I can go on and on and on and on why the way Akito was treated for her role in the Zodiac by her parents and the rest of the Sohma estate was just awful. I hate it, it’s terrible, she never had a chance to learn and grow and be the genuinely thoughtful woman we know she grows into.

She doesn’t force her path of forgiveness onto others and is fully cognizant of what she did, the repercussions of her actions, and lives her entire life after the curse breaks trying to right what she did wrong.

“Even if she gets hurt, she says she deserves it. She tells me not to let it bother me, but… I’ve always, always loved her so much.” (Another, ch. 13)

Tohru opens the door for Akito. She extends her hand, offers her friendship despite having seen the absolute worst of Akito. She tells Akito that everyone is lonely, everyone wants bonds, and acknowledges Akito’s worst fears, that Akito herself is selfish and dirty for wanting something assured and unending because she, Tohru, herself is dirty and selfish. Tohru knows what Akito has done, knows she’s injured some of her beloved friends, had plans to lock up Kyo, hurt Hatori.

Tohru still forgives her. One of Tohru’s striking traits in the manga is that she is suffering, every day, she struggles with the grief of losing her mother and the fear of being alone in the world. Through nothing but her own empathy and realization that loneliness is universal, she’s able to forgive people. She forgives Akito and cares for her, and through Tohru, Akito is introduced to the realization that she’s been wrong and that maybe, she shouldn’t be forgiven.

Shigure also forgives her, and this is the crux of their ship.

To me, that itself is wildly important.

They’ve always circled around each other, and Shigure has always been waiting for Akito to be able to come to him again, in full control of her life and choices. He wants Akito the woman, not Akito the god.

He’s been waiting for the day Akito can meet him as an equal. Akito wants it too, and has wanted him to turn and see her for a very very long time. But she’s been terrified, the entire time, that when he does see her as herself, Shigure won’t like what he sees, and will leave. She’s aware of what she’s done post-curse, she’s aware of the impacts it will have on the former Zodiac members, and she’s aware that once the “bonds” of god and the animals is gone, there may not be anyone left for her.

Neither of them are under any illusions at the end of the series: Akito knows she has to atone for what she did, Shigure knows she has to learn to grow into a person who can function alone. They both know that there are people who are against them changing the oppressive structure of the Sohma family.

Neither of them care. There are things that they want, together, and it’s enough. There’s a whole new world for them to explore and learn about. And in Furubana, this is shown to be a lifelong effort on their parts:

“She said after meeting me, she learned so many things for the first time. She smiled happily as she said it.” (Another, #13)

To close, I’d like to take a moment to talk about the curse and Shigure, and how he set things in motion.

Without Shigure, the curse would have devolved on its own, yes, but the circumstances would not have allowed for the freedom the Zodiac had at the end of the manga. It would not have ended with Akito being able to learn and live freely. Allowing Tohru into the Sohma family cracked open a door to compassion and kindness none of them had ever experienced before, because the Sohma family seems to exist in a vacuum of stability and love.

It wasn’t that Shigure knew instantly that Tohru was kind and loving and thoughtful, if anything, his read on her was “completely normal, albeit strange, teenage girl who obviously has a rough life”. But she was normal, she was from outside the Sohmas, and he knew that was enough. No one in the family was stepping up to change the status quo and how stifling and abusive it was, so he did it himself.

He did it because he loved Akito.

Not because he felt bad for himself, or Hatori, or any of the others, but merely because he loved her to the point of manipulation. It backfired in his face, because he got a big ol’ dose of “loving and respecting” juice from Tohru, but he still got the end he wanted.

What I mean to say is best summarized in chapter 123:

“It would be nice to live in a kind world, without any troubles, without any fear, without hurting anybody, without ever being hurt, only doing the right thing. I wish I could reach this kind world by the shortest path possible. … “That’s wrong”, or “that’s stupid”: If it’s someone else’s life it’s so easy to make such irresponsible comments. ...It would be great, but it doesn’t exist. … Little by little, walking one step at a time, is all you can do.”

We get to experience the roughest part of the path with Akito and Shigure, we got to watch them be terrible people who were lonely and in want of love struggle and learn how to get up and move on.

They tease each other, Shigure is thoughtful of the distinction between “the person Akito was raised to be” and “the person who Akito is”. He’s seen her at her messiest, and she’s seen him at his most jealous. They still chose each other, despite the hurt they caused each other, and others. They make up for it, reflect, and live a life that demonstrates that they have learned. They have friends who are thoughtful and loving and would not hesitate to drop everything and help them, lend an ear when they’re frustrated, help them not to make the same mistakes.

And then we get to see them be wonderful, kind, thoughtful, loving parents in Furubana.

We got to see their adorable, kind, compassionate child be friends with the children of the people Akito hurt, because everyone in the former Zodiac’s family collectively decided “never again, no”.

Their child adores them. Shiki in Furubana #13 radiates love for Akito and Shigure the same way Mutsuki and Hajime do.

They are genuinely good parents, even when they tease Shiki, and I think that is testament for how good they are for each other and how much they’ve changed as adults.

I think that’s enough of a reason to ship them, don’t you?

#Mitkun writes stuff #fruits basket manga spoilers #fruits basket another #fruits basket spoilers #akigure #fruits basket akito #fruits basket shigure

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shihalyfie · 3 years

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The differences between Takato and Haru

(This meta was requested by @digitalgate02, who also assisted me with a large portion of it. Thank you for your help!)

Takato and Haru often beg a lot of comparisons because of the fact they go so against the usual “brash hero” archetype common to not only Digimon but also shounen franchises in general, being significantly more mild-mannered (on a language level, they’re also the only Digimon protagonists to date who use the more polite boku first-person pronoun instead of the more assertive ore). Haru himself even points out in Appmon’s very first episode that this kind of personality would normally be more suited towards a side character than a protagonist!

Because of that, Haru is often considered to be a spiritual rehashing of Takato, and many have tried to make close parallels between the two, but while the desire to make comparison is naturally understandable, the truth is that beyond surface temperament, the two characters actually have very little in common. In fact, both Tamers and Appmon take rather different approaches to their definitions of a “conventional hero”, and that results in both Takato and Haru having very different roles in the plot.

In many cases, the role of a protagonist in a narrative has a deep relationship with what kind of narrative it is in the first place, and especially what kinds of themes it wants to present. For instance, in the case of 02, you could argue that the story is more “about” Ken than it is about Daisuke, since both major arcs in the story are about his fall and reformation, but when you consider the major themes present in 02′s narrative about purpose in life and pragmatism, Daisuke’s way of life and overall attitude are vital elements in relation to them, and it’s why he ends up being the “protagonist” (or, more accurately, the character at the forefront of the story) despite Ken’s heavier connection to it.

Tamers and Appmon have a number of similarities in storytelling, mainly that they’re both “hard sci-fi” stories in comparison to other entries that have stronger fantasy elements, and do have a certain amount of crossover in terms of dealing with AI-related topics. However, the actual “nature” of each work ultimately turns out to be different, and thus impacts how each of their protagonists is presented.

I heavily dislike calling Tamers a “deconstruction” of the monster collecting genre or of Digimon Adventure, mainly because of how much that term has been exploited to stereotype works in a genre as being things they’re not, or less nuanced than they actually are (as one Twitter user aptly put it: “a deconstruction is when I like something in a genre I disrespect”). I absolutely do not care for the idea of claiming that Adventure or 02 were somehow less nuanced or “deep” than Tamers just because they were more idealistic or more subtle about it, because they sure as hell had a lot of deeper things hidden between the lines if you bother to look out for them, and I also don’t like the implication that Tamers exists to criticize Adventure for supposedly being too naive. It is true, however, that Tamers re-examines a lot of Adventure (and 02)’s concepts in a different context; while Tamers isn’t as strong of a theme narrative, and it’s much more difficult to say there's an overarching message that encompass most or all of the series as much, it does indulge in a lot of thought experiments and smaller subplots that wouldn’t be possible in Adventure, and Takato thus has an important position in facilitating those kinds of thought experiments. The overall franchise metaphors of “growing” (evolving) alongside your Digimon (or, at least, something different from you) and the symbolism associated with it are still more than present, so the Tamers way of showcasing it is in mainly presenting the question of how that kind of goal would even be achievable in the first place when things aren’t as clear-cut.

In particular, Takato serves to address how someone who doesn’t fulfill the typical protagonist mold would cope with situations that somewhat resemble those in Adventure, what would happen when a Digimon partner is fundamentally different from oneself, and how one would still be able to grow alongside such an existence. Thus, his own character arc is more relevant to his own personal growth in accordance with interacting with Guilmon and what he gets out of his journey. This is especially because one thing particularly unique to Tamers is how it portrays Digimon as significantly more feral and different in mentality to humans, which means that he had a much higher personal hurdle to begin with, and thus his personal story and what he gets out of it becomes of significantly more importance.

Appmon, on the other hand, very much is an overarching theme narrative and isn’t exactly subtle about it, with one of its biggest questions being about what’s important in a world that’s getting increasingly controlled and regulated by modern technology that’s getting more and more intelligent. Haru is thus the embodiment of Appmon’s answer to that question: “to choose to be kind” -- and the less-than-subtle invocation of the word “protagonist” ends up having a very different meaning invoked in its final episode.

At the very least, on top of both being rather unconventional protagonists, both Tamers and Appmon do start with Takato and Haru both expressing a desire to be more like one who could go on some kind of adventure (Takato’s version isn’t as verbal, but his way of enthusiastically putting on goggles as proof that he’s a Tamer in Tamers episode 2 carries heavy implications of wanting to emulate the heroes he saw on TV).

However, this is where we get our first difference: Takato proudly claims his newfound status as the series protagonist, whereas Haru is unsure and self-conscious about it -- Haru himself is the one who initially considers himself not cut out for the role despite Yuujin personally believing he does and Gatchmon trying to urge him into it. And, in fact, this is actually the difference that kicks off where their paths entirely diverge.

Takato is often said to be unconventional for a protagonist, but when you really think about it, it’s not like Taichi or Daisuke were exactly models of typical protagonist tropes; while you could call them “hot-blooded”, in the end, Taichi’s standout traits have more to do with natural charisma and sometimes even being too chill, and Daisuke, for all he seems assertive, is actually extremely deferential. So why is Takato still such a standout in comparison?

Well, when you look at the detailed profiles of all twelve of the main Adventure and 02 cast, you might notice something: all of them are naturally selfless people who put others before themselves without a second thought. On the other hand, when you look at Takato, you might realize that this is very much not the case, especially during the early parts of the series. As much as Takato is a “soft” person, he’s not necessarily very “kind” or “nice”, especially during the early parts of the series; he can get possessive or clingy, petty, or even a little arrogant (Tamers episode 11 basically has him go on a mini-power trip based on his card combo having worked so well in the prior episode, which ends up becoming part of his isolation from Hirokazu and Kenta in the following one). Moreover, Takato loses his emotional composure and becomes a crying mess as early as Tamers episode 2, and while it’s not like other characters in Adventure and 02 hadn’t been prone to emotional outbursts, combine it with the above facts and you get the take-home that Takato isn’t “soft” out of an active choice to be so as much as he’s just really, really lacking in emotional mettle to begin with.

To be fair to him, Takato has to deal with quite a bit more stress during the early parts of Tamers than Haru has to during the equivalent parts; having to deal with a Digimon partner that’s outright feral at times and doesn’t have a fully intelligent understanding of how to communicate is a pretty rough thing to start off with. That said, Takato is fairly cowardly even in situations that don’t necessarily have to do with this, it’s just that this makes it worse -- but it means a lot that Takato himself is willing to put in that much effort in bonding with Guilmon despite being initially intimidated by what he’d just created, and that perhaps is what’s the beginnings of how he continues to develop that strength of heart for the rest of the series (and also extends to how he’s the one who connects with Grani).

This is in contrast to how Haru is described by Yuujin at the end of Appmon episode 1, in which Yuujin states that Haru is already cut out to be a protagonist because he’s a kind person -- in other words, Takato is someone who is not cut out to be a protagonist of any kind of adventure at the start of Tamers, even though he thinks he now gets the luxury of being one due to the circumstances he’s thrust into, whereas Haru is already someone with the potential to be one even at the start of the series, but initially lacks the self-confidence to consider himself able to be so. Thus, Takato’s character arc involves having to actually grow into someone worthy of the position, whereas Haru’s involves coming to terms with the aspects of himself he already has but doesn’t quite understand yet.

One very important thing to reiterate is that “unconventional” does not necessarily mean “better” by default, and, on the flip side, just because Takato isn’t as virtuous of a person at the beginning doesn’t mean he’s a worse character (after all, these kinds of things are what makes one interesting). Rather, it’s more important to consider why these characters are this way based on the context of the narratives they’re in.

In the case of the Adventure/02 kids, getting twelve naturally kind kids wasn’t exactly accident, nor was Haru and the other Appli Drivers also being that way; said kids have a bit of selection bias in that they were deliberately chosen by various entities (”the one who wishes for stability” and the Agents, the Holy Beasts, or Minerva) knowing that a massive world- or humanity-threatening crisis was on the horizon and quite understandably picking kids who had the greatest potential for the kindness that shouldering the world’s burdens would take (in Adventure and 02 this manifested in having the kids resonate with Crests and Digimentals that represented virtues, and in Appmon this involved Minerva actively testing them). After all, it’s only natural that anyone with the chance to recruit people to help with a monumental task would ideally go out of their way to pick people who seem best suited for the job, whether it’s something as grand as fantasy chosen hero picking or something as simple as job recruitment. But at the beginning of Tamers, none of the involved parties were really aware of any kind of grand, looming threats on the horizon, and whatever the DigiGnomes were thinking (or not thinking) when giving Takato his D-Ark is arcane to us all, and so Takato ended up becoming a Tamer by functional accident, resulting him starting off very poorly equipped for the job and having to learn how to do it on the fly.

This also means that the “motives” Takato and Haru have for taking action at the beginning of the series are accordingly different. Because any concept of “stakes” was not immediately apparent at the start of Tamers, Takato’s motivations for being a Tamer are more self-centered and selfish than Haru’s are for being an Appli Driver at the start of their respective series.

Takato’s motives at the beginning of Tamers really just revolve around “I want to be able to play with Guilmon more and not lose him,” and there’s no indication at said beginning that he’s really prepared for or even understands the part about having to protect others from harm. That doesn’t mean that Takato’s a selfish person to the extent of not caring about others at all -- in fact, by the time of Tamers episode 15, he demonstrates an understanding that they’re not playing a “game” anymore when things get difficult (and even puts his foot down in front of the other kids for it, a huge improvement from his rather cowardly outlook at the beginning of the series), so the issue largely had to do with the fact that the early parts of Tamers didn’t immediately make such high stakes clear, and Takato himself was thus in a situation of not worrying about others because that necessity wasn’t there yet. But even in the same episode, Takato still has a clear motive of wanting to show off his cool Digimon partner to the others and bask in his “status” as a Tamer, and it’s still a huge contrast to Haru who was initially too humble to accept his role as part of such a larger narrative until his desire to “protect everyone” won out. It’s a big deal that Haru understood the stakes that would be involved in the fight against Leviathan from day one, and actively chose to opt in because of his selflessness.

Another major reason for this difference is that Haru has a certain character trait explicitly ascribed to him that isn’t with Takato: Haru enjoys reading books and is actually rather book-smart and intellectual. On a certain technicality, Takato being characterized as not particularly skilled in that department actually brings him a little closer to the conventional shounen protagonist archetype than it does a “bookish” character like Haru, because such a character is often considered too nerdy for the protagonist position -- but in Haru’s case, the fact he’s actively thoughtful and ruminates on things means that he spends a lot of time thinking about “what’s the right thing to do” in a given situation.

For all it’s worth, I really hope that the above won’t be taken as an implication that Takato is a fundamentally bad person for having more selfish immediate priorities than Haru or the Adventure/02 kids do; having to carry the weight of such a large thing is a huge thing to ask of someone, especially when we’re talking about someone who kind of got thrown into this whole mess and has been spending the entirety of this series trying to figure it all out without a lot of reliable sources of help. On top of that, it should also be noted that Takato is ten; if there’s anything that can be said to be not entirely true-to-life with the Adventure and 02 cast personalities, it’s that a lot of the emotional awareness and levelheadedness they exhibit usually come from people much older than 8-12 (it’s one of the “acceptable breaks from reality” employed in kids’ shows that kid protagonists are often a tad bit more mature than actual kids would be at that age, otherwise a lot of said kids’ show plots wouldn’t function), and real ten-year-olds in Takato’s situation would often have more difficulty knowing what to do with such great burdens at this age. It’s actually fairly significant that Haru is 13 and from a group composed mainly of middle schoolers, in contrast to the older series having elementary school kids (the youngest Appli Driver, Astra, is actually the same age as a classic Digimon series protagonist), and thus it’s probably not surprising that they’re more willing and able to deal with such huge issues much earlier on.

Thus, although Takato’s character arc does involve him slowly growing into the role of becoming less shallow and selfish, and becoming more truly assertive while he’s at it, this fundamental difference in their natures ends up continuing to have a major influence by the time of the later parts of the series. The difference can be most starkly illustrated in Tamers episode 35 versus Appmon episode 41 -- in which Takato, upon seeing Beelzebumon kill Leomon, is utterly consumed by his emotions and decides that the best course of action to take would be killing Beelzebumon in revenge, even though this won’t bring Leomon back or accomplish anything productive (and, indeed, it does make things worse in the form of driving his own partner over the edge and traumatizing Juri further). (Adventure had already warned that prioritizing “revenge” over “protecting others” is foolhardy and tends to cause a lot of really nasty problems.)

In contrast, one thing you might notice about Haru is that he never “denies anyone’s feelings”, even when confronting someone like Knight. You could argue that Haru wasn’t necessarily dealing with direct trauma in front of him, but recall that Knight had caused tons of grief and misery for many (something Haru takes serious offense at) and had, along with Charismon, gotten very close to permakilling all of the Buddy Appmon at one point back in Appmon episode 37 -- so it’s not like Haru doesn’t have reason to have grudge against Knight, even if the severity isn’t as immediate. Note that Haru doesn’t “both-sides” this issue; he still insists on making his own case, it’s just that he still doesn’t have it in him to not acknowledge that Knight has a good reason for making the case he does given his background, consider his words to an extent, and fight against the idea of having Knight be killed for no good reason. Haru has a very strong belief in “thinking with one’s heart” and “respecting feelings” that he'd exhibited through the entire series (for example, very prominently in Appmon episode 12 with Rei), and because of that he has a ton of emotional control over himself even taking some very harsh things. It’s clear that Haru does have very deep understanding of what he’s dealing with -- and chooses to be idealistic and kind anyway.

(In addition, because Haru is so naturally inclined to be selfless, the one time he really does hit an emotional low in Appmon episode 49, it’s not anger or lashing out at anyone, but rather sadness and despair. Haru just really does not have the fundamental capacity to be aggressive.)

As said before, Takato’s character arc is very much a personal story of how he grew into the role of a Tamer, via learning to fight for what’s important and have a strong heart for it. As a result, his motives for fighting end up still having a much more personal streak to it than anything -- at the time of Tamers episode 49, technically speaking, the Wild Bunch was still being counted on to work on the D-Reaper problem, and his own family was urging him to stay home for now, but what tipped him over the edge was not some desire to protect people as a whole but rather the fact that Juri was calling for him. It’s not to say that such a thing is selfish -- he’s clearly doing it for her sake, not anything to do with his own -- but nevertheless his involvement was directly related to something that hit a little more personally moreso than it was for the sake of the wider picture.

As said before, this is fitting for someone whose story is really more of a personal character arc before anything else; the significance is more in line with the sheer amount of emotional growth Takato had to go through in order to get to this point at all, and how someone normally so divorced from the concept of heroism could come to do something so meaningful, especially thanks to his interactions with Guilmon and growing alongside him. There’s absolutely no doubt that Takato wouldn’t have been able to do this kind of thing at the beginning of the series, so it’s a huge accomplishment that shouldn’t be watered down. It also makes him a very good foil to the D-Reaper, an emotionless program that’s still fixated on rehashing the same destructive purpose it was originally created for years ago and has long lost its purpose, and while Takato isn’t technically the sole factor in putting it to rest (at most, the most valuable asset as part of the Wild Bunch’s plan), the contrast is quite apparent.

On the flip side, Appmon episode 54 not only involves the exact opposite -- in which Haru sacrifices something closely personal to him for the sake of everything else -- but also ties it very closely to its own series themes, which are assertively laid down in all of their glory during this finale. The reason Haru had been “chosen” by Minerva to begin with, and the reason he himself had been given an opt-in “choice” at the beginning of the series and again in Appmon episode 38, and so many other characters had been given “choices”, is that this story is about choices -- because Leviathan (and Knight, and any kind of “AI should manage everything” argument that this series fights hard against) believes that humans shouldn’t be allowed them, and that everything ought to fall in accordance with a “rational” system. Haru, on the other hand, believes in the human heart that can do unexpected things, and his constant choices to do things out of kindness despite understanding what they entail.

Over the course of the series, Haru hadn’t always been putting himself in a spotlight situation -- in fact, many episodes had involved him saying “we’ll support you!” and generally uplifting others before he’d ever tried to take charge. But in the end, the reason he ends up as the “protagonist” who makes the final choice for everyone’s sake is because he’s the one who understands that gravity of “making a choice with one’s feelings” that’s so vital to changing Leviathan’s mind -- plus, the fact he’d been so supportive and kind to everyone means that everyone else shows up for him when he needs it most. Note that when Astra and Eri are upset at Yuujin in Appmon episodes 48 and 51, it’s not so much out of the overall betrayal as much as the fact he specifically betrayed and hurt Haru, because that’s how much they’ve come to care for him in return.

Hence, why Appmon latently ends on a frame of redefining the concept of “protagonist” -- certainly, on a meta level, Haru became the “protagonist” of the narrative that is Appmon, but what it actually means in terms of what Haru became is that everyone, including the members of the audience watching this series, is “the protagonist of their own life”, meaning that being a “protagonist” is defined merely by said act of “making choices” and defining what your own path will be. And especially in a world where singularity is going to become more and more of a real possibility -- as the show indirectly reminds us, AI surpassing human intellect is something that’s been predicted and warned about in this very world we, the viewers, live in -- understanding this is going to become even more important.

Incidentally, in the end, as much as it might be tempting to try and draw parallels with Takato because both of them are in the franchise-mandated position of “protagonist”, removing that requirement actually brings up a character that might make a much closer parallel -- “making choices that are out of kindness” easily directly invokes a certain other character from 02 who had “kindness” as a huge part of his character arc, doesn’t it...?

Really, if you think about it, Haru has a lot in common with Ken, who’s also thoughtful, intellectual, very in touch with his own feelings, assertive, resilient, strong in heart, and kind out of choice even when he doesn’t have to be -- you could basically say Haru is what Ken would be like if he hadn’t gone through such a massive formative event of trauma early in his life, or, alternatively, Ken if he had a bit more of Daisuke’s more outwardly bright, friendly, and supportive traits. It may not be a comparison you’d be easily tempted to make because, as stated above, as much as Ken had a deep connection with 02′s plot, he’s not portrayed as the protagonist of his own narrative...and, hence, Haru is unusual in that the exact archetype that was formerly placed in the role of the series deuteragonist has now been recast in the role of the protagonist itself. But then again, from Haru’s perspective, it’s not like Ken wasn’t technically the driving force of his own story, right?

(I’m not just drawing this comparison because I usually blog for 02. I promise.)

#digimon #digimon tamers #appmon #matsuda takato #shinkai haru #takato matsuda #haru shinkai #shihameta

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