#This has almost the same premise as Uncanny Avengers | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

bigskydreaming · 1 year

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Okay, hmm. Which of these unfinished posts to tackle first:

1) Fanon depictions or hot takes in isolated cases have never been the problem, there’s room in any fandom for just about any take no matter how flattering or unflattering it is to a certain character (with the exception of takes rooted in racism, rife with microaggressions, etc - those things are always going to be indefensible and not what I’m discussing here). I just mean in terms of: no character will ever have universal appeal. There will always be people who look at your favorite blorbo and have the most wtf take on them where you see only charming blorbo-ness.....blah blah skipping stuff on account of not trying to write the actual whole post here....stuff about how the problem only lies when enough of those instances of a singular take add up until it reaches a tipping point where this take is the first and most consistent thing anyone new to the fandom or source material sees.

Compounded by the fact that people have a PROBLEM w/changing their minds on fandom stuff, even when its relatively innocuous in and of itself - because as a society, so many of us have internalized this weird belief that admitting that your first impression or opinion on something might have been the wrong thing to go all-in on is somehow a weakness or deficit to your image, even if your first impression or opinion was literally just formed by skewed information that meant you were NEVER going to have an opinion to the contrary until you got a chance to see counterpoints or attain more information that clarifies...oh this is not a ‘the Earth is the third planet from the sun’ type of factoid, this is just like...somebody’s opinion, man.....

And so we get this totally unnecessary phenomenon of people doubling down on stuff - even stuff they themselves don’t think is a big deal or worth getting worked up over in any other context - more because ‘can’t have ppl thinking I endorsed a Bad Take’ is the issue motivating them than ‘I believe so strongly that Jason Todd was bullied by Nightwing that I will go to WAR, I just know it IN MY SOUL OKAY.’

Blah blah blah more stuff and then the point that the more we open ourselves up to pulling back on the throttle when it comes to relatively innocuous fandom takes....the more the racist and harmful takes become a lot more in focus, harder to distract from or defend, etc. Because ppl are always gonna dig their heels more in when told ‘hey this take you endorse is racist and here’s why’ versus ‘hey this take you endorse has a counterpoint you literally just might not have been aware of to even consider before now.’ And thus the more we as individuals train ourselves to be open to changing our minds on the ‘does it really even matter tho’ stuff, the less ppl have to throw up as a smokescreen to distract from the truly harmful takes they’re less inclined to admit they were wrong about. Aaaaand also....the more we train ourselves to be like ‘okay this doesn’t have to be a big deal that I was wrong about this take’....the more of a red flag it raises to OURSELVES when we find ourselves surprised by how intensely we push back against ‘maybe I was wrong tho’ on a point that SEEMS like it should be innocuous. Because those are almost always the points where....yeah there’s probably something we should unpack there.

I swear that’s not the whole post. Maybe it was. I don’t even know. Wow I literally can not condense an opinion to save my damn life, can I? Even to summarize. Sheesh.

2) Why the Uncanny Avengers fundamentally does not work as a concept and thus I really hope they’re not bringing it back....not because of any opinion I have on the Avengers, which is booooo, but also not the point.....but because....the very nature of it undermines the premise it claims to have. The concept has always supposedly been about combining X-Men and Avengers on the same team as a solidarity thing and thus Avengers doing more to support mutants and how they’re viewed by the public....but the problem is....the book, the concept, is rooted more in the Avengers brand than the X-Men brand when it SHOULD be the exact opposite.

Because as it stands, so long as the book feels and is marketed more as an Avengers title but with X-Men, rather than an X-Men title with Avengers....it will always carry the implicit undercurrent that the win for mutants here is being associated with the Avengers name and reputation will lend X-Men legitimacy and elevate them in the public’s esteem. Except the public’s esteem and regard for the Avengers is absolutely rooted in a long history of scapegoating mutants as problems while ‘human heroes’ are the solution....thus its systemically exploitative in nature, with the Avengers tangibly benefitting from being the non-scapegoated while the X-Men are scape-goated....and you fundamentally can’t dismantle a social inequity by trying to bootstrap another group to the level you only have due to an existing system of exploitation, regardless of whether or not you had anything to do with putting that system in place. Not even the point. Its just....you can’t forge true equality by raising other groups up to your level, when it requires stepping on the backs of others to reach that level in the first place. You have to get on the same level by stepping DOWN from the elevation you only had due to advantages over other groups that are wholly artificial and you should have never had in the first place.

And thus it just flat out doesn’t fucking work to ‘help mutants’ by having a few X-Men get to benefit from the Avengers’ limelight and public appeal.....so long as on a large, systemic scale....Avengers are still seen as the ‘good kind of superhuman’ whereas mutants are the untrustworthy flip side of that coin. All you’ve actually done is said ‘see? Mutants can be heroes too!’ which.....no. What are you even doing. How do you think that is possibly doing anything. What was the point. Omg stop. “Watch us achieve equality in real time by patronizingly allowing a marginalized group to share our stage so long as we still retain all the social power, call the shots, set the agenda, etc.” LOL nah.

If you ACTUALLY want this premise to have any legs at all, you have to invert that. You have to do something like Avenging X-Men, where its X-Men who have the numbers, call the shots, set the agenda, are surrounded by THEIR community....and the Avengers that are there as allies in a fight against Orchis or some other attempted mutant genocide, there to lend support where the X-Men say they need it, etc.

3) Post that’s basically just an analysis of a list I arbitrarily came up with of some of the ways problems in a source material intertwine with and exacerbate various fandom trends and vice versa. Like for instance:

a) Conflicts between characters in the source material, where there’s a disproportionate scale to the conflict because its been inflated solely for the added drama. Basically...how often do major conflicts central to two characters’ dynamics (and those of those characters’ fans)....like how often do they originate in fights that only ever rose to the level they were treated as being at in a show or book....because the writers amped up each character’s reaction to the nth degree just for the added drama as a shortcut to raising stakes when ratings are down...rather than because these reactions and the scale they happen at genuinely fit and arise from established characterization?

And thus by extension, how often are fans trying to make certain scenes ‘work’ in accordance with a character’s established character arc, when the pieces don’t fit because it was the writers who deviated from their own narrative, taking a detour for a short dramatic spike that they don’t INTEND to have lasting or altering effects on longterm character arcs....and yet, that happened anyway?

b) How always reframing how we view a source material through the lens of non-canon ships can skew fandom reception of various character actions in an eagerness to view them as motivated by things the writers did not actually write in subtextually. With the acknowledgment that interpretation is always subjective, how often do not-so-great-takes or interpretations of shipped characters interactions end up romanticized SOLELY because shippers are so eager to frame the relationship as exceptionally deep and romantic....thus necessitating that even some very bad interactions be reframed as still proof of romantic feelings.

And this is a problem not because ‘ships don’t have to be perfect or between two people who are good for each other, sometimes the dysfunction is the appeal’.....like, I get that. And its true. And not the issue. The issue’s more when we get ‘shippers have reframed a moment that might have been MEANT to be badly received by fans but now has been given a pass because if it WAS viewed as critically as it was meant to be, shippers would have a harder time coming up with ‘evidence’ that their ship is obviously right there and the writers just aren’t getting it or giving it to fans.’

Like I just mean.....sometimes a fight between two men is evidence of sexual tension and repressed romantic interest, yes. But sometimes a fight between two men is because one of them is being a fucking dick cuz he’s on a power trip and yet fandom has rewritten this to be evidence of their endgame ship’s deep and profound bond and are henceforth interpreting every interaction these characters have based on a premise the writers literally just did not lay out for those characters at all, and thus from that point on fandom and the source material are not even actually aimed in the same direction even while referencing the exact same sequences of events.

Did I basically just mash up the missing pieces of three entirely different posts into one new post instead of just.....writing them into the actual proper posts? Why yes, yes I did. Apparently it was just easier to get out that way. The proper posts will be forthcoming once I edit the right parts into the right places and wrap those up.

But I mean. But in the meanwhile.....here’s whatever this is, I guess. LOL.

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traincat · 5 years

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What exactly happened with the Fantastic 4? I never followed the series, I'm not really much of a comic book fan besides Spider-man and CO. But I knew that the Fantastic 4 were an iconic part of Marvel, basically their mascot heroes at one point, but they were missing for a while now? What happened?

The Fantastic Four are basically to 616 comics as Iron Man is to the MCU: they’re the foundation that a lot of future properties were built on and without them it’s almost certain we wouldn’t have any Marvel comics today. A lot of what we now consider classic in the Marvel universe originally debuted in their books. The Skrulls, for instance, originally debuted in Fantastic Four #2. The Inhumans and Black Panther also first appeared in the pages of Stan Lee and Steve Kirby’s original run. The Fantastic Four have been hugely popular at times, but not consistently. That popularity has waxed and waned throughout the years, but despite the common arguments you see (”they’re old-fashioned”) it’s hard to argue that they had a huge impact on the Marvel landscape.

In 2015, Marvel stopped publishing the Fantastic Four comic series. At the time of the cancellation, I believe the book was not doing badly, at least not compared to other titles at the time. (Sorry, I’m not pulling numbers, it’s Christmas and I am champagne drunk. This is all stuff that’s pretty easy to google once you have some framework for the situation.) It had just wrapped up a run by James Robinson that I personally find hugely enjoyable. Before that, Matt Fraction had run a messy in places, great in others run that spanned two different Fantastic Four monthly titles. And before that, Jonathan Hickman had written a truly fantastic, pun fully intended, run that brought the book back into a lot of prominence. So what the hell happened?

In short, movie rights. This is an open secret. Marvel has repeatedly and very badly denied this, but multiple sources, including Jonathan Hickman, have gone on record that the Fantastic Four were canceled because Marvel chair Ike Perlmutter threw a fit over film rights. As you probably know, Marvel is currently owned by Disney. Fox owned the Fantastic Four film rights. What happened in 2015? Fox put out a new Fantastic Four movie. (Marvel also attempted to replace the X-Men in comics around this time with the Inhumans, who operate under a similar premise -- a series starring a very large cast who all belong to the same group but who can all have different superpowers -- but whose film rights Marvel had control over. As you might remember, that really didn’t work out so well.)

So from 2015 until August of this year, there were no Fantastic Four books published. They were essentially persona non grata. Reed and Sue and their children were shipped off on a multiversal mission and presumed dead by near everyone, including their remaining family, in-universe. The remaining core cast was divied up: Ben Grimm ended up as a member of the Guardians of the Galaxy. Johnny Storm was on the Uncanny Avengers and worked with the Inhumans. The majority of Doctor Doom’s appearances in this time period are within Iron Man books, with him eventually being the lead character on one.

So that all happened. I don’t doubt that the biggest reason for the frankly sudden (though extremely welcome imho) return of the Fantastic Four involves the Disney-Fox deal, but I have to say the fan effort in demanding that Marvel return the Fantastic Four was terrific and only got louder as more and more time went by, and that was great to see.

#*replies #traincat talks comics #Anonymous

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dontcallmecarrie · 6 years

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LTTR Shatterpoints

Yes, another one. At this rate the series might just end up being me remixing this one premise over and over again, because they just keep coming. Plus I’m trying to put off the inevitable major character death that I’d tagged for, there’s that too. Slow going, on that front.

So, I’ve already done several everyonelives!AU shatterpoints [or, well, almost everyone], but I’ve been going over LTTR and looking at the buildup and one jumped out at me.

See, I’ve been trying to be as nice as I can to Howard, trying to show how his vices screwed him over and how WWII and everything that came after changed him. Hopefully, it showed through in both LTTR and the minific thing set in the same universe [Just Hide Behind Your Pride].

Howard, in my interpretation, is a complex character. The alcoholism is a huge vice I can’t overstate, and he cares but his communication skills are shit and add in his other issues and you do not get a case of ‘love conquers all’.

Reason this all comes up is: in LTTR, I’m trying to be nice to his character. This shatterpoint, however, is anything but, even if it’s slightly happier in other ways.

Because in one universe, Maria stayed with Howard through thick and thin, in sickness and in health, and died at his side nearly two decades later.

In another life, however, Maria Stark divorced her husband in 1973.

Howard’s alcoholism had become a bone of contention, not long into their marriage. Maria hated it—each fight was more exhausting than the one before it.

Because when he was home, Howard Stark was almost always drunk.

And when he was drunk, he got loud, he broke plates and glasses and the only reason he never hit his wife was an unconscious, instinctive urge for survival, warning him even at his lowest to not provoke the other in the room, the gleam in her eyes sometimes putting him on edge in a way he could never explain sober.

In one life, Maria would’ve gritted her teeth and stuck it out, would’ve done her level best to try to keep her husband from crawling into the bottle and never coming back out, and even somewhat succeeded.

In this universe, however, Howard’s sense of self-preservation lapsed for a moment, and during an especially terse shouting match, he tried to hit his wife. Emphasis on tried, because Maria caught his hand.

But that was the last straw, for her, and where before she’d politely pretended to buy it when Howard acted like he didn’t remember what happened when he was drunk, this time she looks him in the eye and smiles even as she says, “I want a divorce.”

Because before, Howard had been pushing everyone out of his life. That, she was willing to deal with. The secrets and the way he put her at risk because he kept bringing his SHIELD-related work home, she’d been dealing with. But she had her limits, and she drew the line at domestic violence. If Howard didn’t want her in his life, all he needed to do was say so and she’d leave.

Divorce was a-okay with her, screw social norms, screw everything, she didn’t care, she’d married him out of love. If he didn’t love her back, then what was he doing wasting his time with her?

Howard, of course, tries to fight it. Tries to say no, he doesn’t want to, he was Howard Stark and that meant something, didn’t she know?

Unfortunately for him, Maria was just as stubborn as he was.

And when he brought in the lawyers, she didn’t hesitate to bring up PR, and after making it clear that she didn’t care about his money, didn’t give a damn about alimony or anything, everything else fell into place. She even had a cover for it, ready to go the day after their last fight: anyone asked, they could say she was infertile, and use that if necessary.

They didn’t have a child, after all, it’d be easy to pin it on that and she didn’t care about what the world thought about her as long as she could get this over with stat. And he’d never see or hear from her again, and everyone could carry on with their lives. [Or maybe she says something about spreading a rumor about infidelity, because Maria doesn't care about her reputation, she just wants out.]

From there, it’s a no-brainer, really.

Howard’s not happy, but when it’s put that way, everything’s lined up perfectly and it’s not like he can argue. Not when he suspects that if he doesn’t sign, Maria might just end up walking out the next time he leaves for the Arctic.

So he signs, and tries to ignore everyone else’s yelling at him as he does so. Because Peggy’s sharp enough to read between the lines, knows both him and Maria well enough to know that Maria wouldn't have divorced him without one hell of a push, and Jarvis had quit outright in protest. Well, not in protest, but the look his old friend had given him had stung. [Especially since there was an uncomfortable amount of truth in there.]

So Howard Stark signs the divorce papers, and Maria Carbonell and Edwin Jarvis then proceed to vanish off the face of the Earth.

Not that the cameras care, of course: the world was interested in the rich business tycoon first and foremost, now that he was back on the market. Sure, there was a bit of speculation as to where his ex-wife was, but really the story presented was pretty much cut and dry, and interest waned after a while.

Howard’s alone, now, in his mansion. Nothing but him and the bottle, and the knowledge that he had something good and blew it because the reminders of his brilliant, brilliant wife are everywhere.

In SHIELD:

Peggy won’t speak to him if it’s not for strictly professional reasons. Then, she’s absolutely glacial, and the look in her eyes is practically daring him to try anything.

Nick Fury, Peggy’s apprentice of sorts, is also side-eyeing him too; has been ever since he got wind of the divorce, ever since he last saw Maria walking away with nothing but a messenger bag with everything she’d had to her name prior to getting married.

Hell, even Hank Pym had commented on it.

he’s even worse after losing Janet, though: now Howard’s pretty sure Hank pretty much hates him, because he had a wife and let her go, instead of...well.

if there’s rumors of infidelity floating around, then it’s even worse because Hank just pities him and Howard hates it.

Even in Stark Industries, he can’t catch a break.

it’d been his Legal department who’d helped with the divorce, they’re the ones privy to the details. They’d mentioned, more than once, just how unusual it was, that the wife of a rich man didn’t care about alimony. Howard didn’t doubt they side-eyed him even now, sometimes.

his PR department is working better than ever, and also, very clearly, all-but-hated him.

He’d known Maria had been involved in it, but to the extent where an entire department was acting like he’d fired their head after the divorce?

Obadiah, at least, does what he can to help. He hadn’t commented much on the divorce itself, beyond mentioning how much of a pity it was.

However, he’s also starting to talk about remarrying, and Howard doesn’t want to think about it right now but his friend’s right, he’s not getting any younger but after Maria—well. He’ll figure something out. He’s busy right now, but...damn he needs another drink.

aka I’m not sure if Howard remarries or not, in this AU. Probably not, to keep things from getting too complicated and for added drama later on because...

On Maria’s end, she had to get creative to get back to Night Vale, but she manages it. She’s home, not two weeks after getting divorced, and with Jarvis in tow to boot.

...and finds out she’s pregnant shortly afterwards.

Maria tries to let Howard know about it, but he’s always out and never picks up the phone. The one who ends up answering it is a newly-hired lawyer who thinks it’s a crank call and goes ‘you say you’re Howard’s ex, and that you’re pregnant with his kid? yeah, right, keep harassing him this way and we’ll sue’ [because he doesn’t recognize her voice, or whatever]��which...yeah. Oops.

[aka Tony’s born and raised in Night Vale]

Tony’s born in Night Vale General Hospital, just like his mom, and grows up terrifying.

Sometimes, sure, he’s curious about the outside world, about his biological father. But for the most part, he’s content with showing up Desert Bluffs when science fair season rolls around, or when Jarvis is doing his thing, or when his mom’s coming back from her job at the library. [Or maybe Maria works at Night Vale Community Radio as a sort of go-between of Station Management, or something?]

Thanks to the internet, he knows what his biological father looks like, and it’s really uncanny how much he looks like him. [Weird, but cool.] Both his mom and Jarvis have plenty of stories to tell, but Tony can also pick up pretty easily on what they’re not saying, too.

Still, the older he gets, the more curious Tony can’t help but feel.

And from there I can imagine a few ways things’d end up panning out:

Option A: Howard dies in a ‘car accident’ before Tony can meet him.

The outside world doesn’t learn about Tony until after a green rage monster crashes through and passes out in Mission Grove Park. Bruce Banner wakes up to a very apologetic Tony because “sorry, that knockout gas is still in beta, didn’t expect for it to do that”. The discovery that this small town just rolls with him having the Other Guy is mind-blowing, to say the least.

Bruce soon gears up to head off because he fell from the Helicarrier and knows they’re probably going to need help for whatever Loki’s up to, and gets a ride not via a moped, but one of Tony’s...creations. Not only that, but Tony goes with as well, because possible alien invasion meant science and he was, above all else, a scientist.

The Avengers get a heart attack when Bruce Banner shows up after having disappeared from the Helicarrier. SHIELD gets a heart attack when an unknown shows up and starts doing heavy damage, and Steve Rogers gets a heart attack when said unknown lifts his faceplate and he’d been told Howard was dead, had died without children, yet this man’s his spitting image, what was going on?

Option A1:

[I’m pretty sure it’s been done before, but meh]

It’s not the Other Guy who crashes into their little town.

Instead, it’s a hammer, followed by a very loud and very buff blond guy. Except here, the Destroyer gets taken care of by Street Cleaners, or Hooded Figures, and Thor has to jump through quite a few more hoops to prove he’s worthy.

or maybe it’s Steve Rogers on his motorcycle, exploring America after getting unfrozen and trying to get his bearings back, only to stick around after he meets Tony.

or maybe MCU canon ensues without Tony, for the most part, right up until Thanos shows up. Unfortunately for him, he picked the wrong planet, because if Night Vale could take on a Smiling god, they could take on a Mad Titan.

Option B: Tony decides to visit the outside world the summer before entering college, and accidentally ends up interfering with the assassination attempt.

Tony’d gotten quite a few strange looks the entire time he’d been traveling, but he hadn’t realized just how much he resembled his father until he’s at a party in New York City and a security guard takes one look, pales, and proceeds to take him by the arm and all-but-frog-march him to an office.

Less than an hour and quite a lot of yelling later, Tony meets his father. And is distinctly unimpressed.

Of course, by then Howard’s probably remarried or something, which doesn’t help. Here, he doesn’t, because there’s no damn time between SHIELD and SI and more drama that way.

Especially since it takes several repetitions and a letter to explain that yes, actually, his mom had tried to let Howard know about his having a son, but nobody believed her so she’d given up after a while. No, he wasn’t after his money, Tony just wanted to at least meet his biological father even if it’s just the once, and now that he’d seen him he was okay with walking away, no harm done.

Suffice it is to say, there is a lot of yelling.

Apparently, everyone’s very interested in both him and his mom. Yes, she’s fine, she’s currently the one wrangling press conferences for City Hall, happy as a clam. He’s about to enter college, no, he’s not going to say where because he likes his privacy. Again, Tony just wanted to meet Howard, now that was done they could both go on with their lives, simple. See? No? ...well, shit.

so, so much yelling.

Howard, for his part, had been urgently called away from the party, and escorted by a very tense security team to a small office on premises, who’re keeping him updated on the situation. It sounds ludicrous, like a bad joke, but when he first sees the young man languidly slouching in the tiny office chair, all doubts vanish. Because Howard couldn’t deny it if he wanted to—the resemblance was just too much. And Tony—that’s what he called himself, even as he’s lazily waving a school ID for Anthony Carbonell— had his mother’s eyes.

The evening just gets more mind-blowing from there, really.

Howard Stark has a son, and he never knew—heads would roll for that alone, he was sure. Howard has a son, who didn’t seem to care about his money, who’s only remark remotely to that effect had been a joke about child support but nothing else. Howard has a son, who’s a genius, because he’d been doodling on a piece of scratch paper for like 5 minutes that looked disturbingly like the schematics for a laser gun of some kind. All right then.

Given the number of bombs being dropped in succession—his ex-wife and his old friend were both alive and well despite having vanished off the map decades ago, he had a son he didn’t know about who was about to enter college—Howard feels he’s excused for clocking out early. He’d expected a gala, and got...this.

So he heads home early, and has Tony come with him because hell, might as well get to know his son, right?

...of fucking course there’s an assassin. What is even his life—why’s his son throwing a fireball at their attacker?

aka Tony ends up fighting off the Winter Soldier and saves his father’s life. And Howard has so many questions as to when and how a seventeen-year-old managed to pick up the skills to take down a veritable Terminator.

Shit goes down, and Howard’s blood pressure skyrockets because he keeps getting more questions and Tony’s very good at keeping secrets. The most Howard gets is his son’s hometown, but even that’s a dead end—he should know, given he looked long and hard for it, back when he’d married Maria, and it didn’t seem to exist anywhere he could find.

Tony leaves, not long after, but at least Howard managed to wrangle a promise of keeping in touch because...well. He’d just discovered he had a son and wrapping his head around it all was going to take a while.

Time passes, and he manages to keep it mostly quiet, with only the people in his social circle being made aware of it. He wouldn’t have believed it himself it he hadn’t experienced it, if he didn’t have the Winter Soldier in custody and currently getting treated for his various third-degree burns, if he didn't have a few photographs of his son(!).

Nick Fury had managed to meet his son as well, actually: Howard had called him as soon as he’d arrived home, because of obvious reasons, and when his old friend had shown up he’d taken one look at Tony’s carefully keeping watch over the man who’d been privately revealed to be Barnes, before turning around and just giving Howard the single most deadpan look he’s ever gotten. [Part of Howard thinks he might’ve been shocked by the Barnes thing, if the rest of the evening hadn’t desensitized him to it.]

...then Howard and Co. find out about the HYDRA thing after interrogating the newly-captured Winter Soldier, and you guys can guess the rest on that front.

Peggy learns about Tony from Nick Fury and just gives Howard a look because she suspects him at first, but then Tony visits again during the weekend and she gets to know his son. Tony’s very amiable, disturbingly well-versed in interrogation and brainwashing tactics and whatnot, and when he mentions ‘yeah, mom wanted me to know dad but the lawyers said they’d sue’, she finally drops it. Obadiah, meanwhile, gets caught flat-footed in all this, and gets sloppy in his double-dealing. Since this is so soon after the HYDRA scare, he gets made not long afterwards.

Steve Rogers wakes up to Bucky sitting in the chair next to him.

Well, technically no: he wakes to the sight of Tony very carefully and very deliberately removing the screws in his sleeping friend’s chair, and running away cackling when Bucky fell backwards.

“That little shit,” Bucky growls after running a hand through his hair and cursing even more because apparently Tony got glitter on him too, and makes to chase after him before a strange sound comes from the bed, and his thoughts derail because Steve’s awake. And laughing at him, but first things first.

“You get off this time!” He calls down the hall, and after another look at Steve, adds, “And get your dad!”

Then he turns to Steve, and smirks. “What he doesn’t know is I switched out all the coffee in the house for decaf, so he’s going to be crashing soon.” Then he sobers, and smiles with more warmth than before. “Hey, Steve. It’s been a while.”

...okay I think it’s safe to say I have a problem with making AUs. Anyone mind my remixing LTTR multiple times?

#behind the scenes #shatterpoint #Live Through The Rain #Only The Names Change #Just Hide Behind Your Pride #thinking aloud #brain don't do it #my brain did a thing #gdi brain #behind the scenes mini fic #might as well #fic ideas #fic idea

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wazafam · 3 years

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The newest trailer for Marvel's upcoming Loki series once again features a shot of a redheaded woman sitting with Loki – but it's entirely possible this character is Verity Willis, not Black Widow or even Lady Loki. The third Marvel series for Disney+ will follow the exploits of the God of Mischief after the events of The Avengers, when a 2012 just post-Battle of New York version of Loki snags the Tesseract and poofs out of S.H.I.E.L.D. custody.

However, that action ends up breaking the timeline and so he's conscripted into service by Owen Wilson's Mobius M. Mobius of the Time Variance Authority, who capture and recruit him in order to help them fix the universe he messed up. The trailers make it appear as though Loki will be bouncing around various timelines and running into a number of new characters. One of those new characters is one some believe will actually be an old character: Black Widow. And, it's true, the trailer shots of a redheaded woman with a short bob sitting next to Loki in what appears to be an alien world does bear a rather uncanny resemblance, at least from behind and at a distance, to Avengers-era Natasha Romanoff.

Related: Loki Trailer 2 Breakdown: Every New Secret & Reveal

But there's another character being largely overlooked to this point, and it's one who has important ties to Loki in the comics: Verity Willis. Here's why it's entirely possible that the redheaded woman people keep spotting in the trailer is Verity, not Natasha - or even Lady Loki, as others have posited.

As with many Marvel movies and TV shows, the Loki series looks to be a very loose adaptation – call it a spiritual adaptation – of the Loki: Agent of Asgard series by Al Ewing & Jason Aaron. In that series, he's not working for the TVA, but the All-Mother. Determined to erase his past as a villain and become a truly good person, Loki agrees to be a secret agent for Asgard. For every successful mission he pulls off, one of his sins is stricken from the gods' record book and replaced with a good deed. Though it appears that in the series he'll be helping the TVA for slightly less noble reasons, at least at first, but the core premise is the same: Loki acts as an agent sent on various missions across time to right wrongs and atone for his crimes.

While Loki establishes himself on Earth, one human he meets becomes more important than anyone to him: Verity Willis. Verity is a human who, through an accident when she was a baby, possesses the ability to see through any lie or illusion, whether told for good or ill intention – making her an intriguing and formidable match for Loki, the master of lies, even with his magic. While he's shocked she immediately sees through his guise of an old man, eventually, the two form a bond that blossoms into a close friendship. Over time, Verity becomes Loki's best friend, arguably the only real friend he's ever had. While Verity hasn't made any appearances outside of the Agent of Asgard comics, she had an enormous impact on Loki.

It's unlikely that the woman in the trailer is Natasha. For starters, it's not generally been Marvel's way to reveal something that big in the trailers. Secondly, it just doesn't make much sense to bring her back. While Black Widow is now coming out a month after Loki, it was originally supposed to be released well before the Marvel Disney+ show and its new release date was only decided upon a few weeks ago. With Natasha's death in Avengers: Endgame, Black Widow director Cate Shortland and Scarlett Johansson both have said that the movie was meant to serve as a final goodbye to Natasha and give her the proper send-off she deserves. With that in mind, it would be incredibly odd for Marvel to bring back Black Widow for a cameo in Loki as it would undercut the emotional impact of her sacrifice in Endgame and everything her solo film is trying to accomplish.

Related: Phase 4 Needs To Explore Black Widow's Death For Bucky's Sake

Of course, it is possible that it is Natasha in an alternate timeline: After all, of all the Avengers Loki has gone up against, Black Widow is likely the one he's closest to having a grudging respect for seeing as how she played him at his own game in Avengers to learn his plan for the Hulk. The others he doesn't have much use for, but Natasha's successful deception is something that, in his own perverse way, Loki would approve of. But even that doesn't make much sense.

Nor is it likely to be Lady Loki for no other reason than that it would be a wild reimagining of how she looks in the comics. In the comics, she's literally just the female form of the genderfluid Loki and as such looks exactly like him: Black hair, green eyes, pale skin. That's not to say Lady Loki won't be appearing in the Loki series - in fact, it seems almost certain she will, especially now that the trailer has confirmed there are "variants" of Loki in different universes or timelines – it's just that it's unlikely she's the redhead people keep spotting in the trailer. Even more than Black Widow, Lady Loki would be a character Marvel would absolutely not give away in trailers.

There is admittedly a third option: It's Lady Loki glamoured to look like Black Widow. If that were the case, technically, that shot in the trailer would neither undermine Natasha's end as it's not actually Natasha, nor would it give away that it's Lady Loki as it doesn't reveal her on the surface. Still, for everyone convinced it's Black Widow or Lady Loki in that scene are overlooking what Verity could bring to the series.

The Loki of the Disney+ series is not the Loki who found himself on a redemption arc after the brutal blow of his mother's death and helping Thor save Jane Foster in Thor: The Dark World, losing his adoptive father and defending Asgard against Hela in Thor: Ragnarok, or attempting (however uncharacteristically poorly) to kill Thanos and keep the Tesseract from him in Avengers: Infinity War. This is the Loki who was under the control of the Mind Stone until recently and who had attempted to take over the world by destroying New York. If he wants to be redeemed, something or someone will have to propel him toward a redemption arc. That something could very well be Verity Willis.

Related: Loki Trailer Confirms Loki Is Behind The MCU's Multiverse Problem

In the comics, Verity was the only person Loki couldn't fool and because he had to be completely honest with her, she was arguably the only person in this world or any other who got to know Loki for exactly who he was. It was Verity's faith in Loki and her true friendship that gave him the encouragement he needed to cast off his title of the God of Mischief to become the God of Stories. It mattered to him that she always knew he was telling the truth after a millennium of him lying so much for so long that no one believed him when he actually did tell the truth. As he says to her in Loki: Agent of Asgard #6, "Verity-- I'm sorry. I'm not used to having friends, and I don't know how to be a good one. But I'm trying. And I want to change. I want to be better than I am. [...] Just... trust me. Trust in me.”

While the Loki of the series is a pre-redemption Loki, it doesn't mean he's a completely different Loki. He's still the same Loki, just from an earlier point of time. All the willingness to become a better man and grow closer to Thor is still theoretically inside him – he just needs a bit of a push and a reason to want to become a better man. There are a number of different ways Loki could set him on a path to becoming a true hero, but it would create the most interesting dynamic if it were Verity Willis, and not Black Widow or Lady Loki, who helps the God of Mischief do it.

More: The Loki Series Needs To Show Thor's MCU Journey From Loki's Perspective

Loki Theory: The Woman In The Trailer Is Verity Willis (Not Black Widow) from https://ift.tt/3rUvto9

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15 Marvel Characters Who Need Their Own Movie

As soon as the Walt Disney Company bought Marvel Entertainment in 2009, Disney proclaimed that it now had access to Marvel’s “treasure trove” of over 5,000 characters. That ever-growing library of characters has been the beating heart of the Marvel Universe for decades. With the announcement that Miles Morales’ Spider-Man will be headlining his own feature film, one more character is set to come to life on the big screen.

RELATED: 15 Reasons Why Batman & Robin Isn’t the Worst Movie Ever

Despite that, most of those 5,000 characters still haven’t had a starring role. Now, CBR is taking a look at some Marvel characters that should have their own films. For this hardly comprehensive list, we’ll be looking at characters and teams from Marvel’s comics and movies that have either never been adapted or have never starred in a solo adventure.

NICK FURY

Although he’s been absent from some of the more recent Marvel films, Samuel L. Jackson’s Nick Fury was the nucleus of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in its earliest years. Since his debut at the end of 2008’s “Iron Man,” Jackson’s Fury has given Marvel’s films a sense of gravitas as the director of S.H.I.E.L.D. Thanks in part to Jackson’s commanding performance as the manipulative spymaster, the MCU is a world that can cohesively mix espionage and Asgardians without coming apart at the seams.

While Fury’s excelled as a supporting player, he hasn’t had a starring role since David Hasselhoff’s ill-fated 1998 “Nick Fury” TV movie. Jackson’s Fury would be an ideal candidate to star in a gritty, high-octane action thriller. Even after five seasons, “Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.” still hasn’t introduced some major S.H.I.E.L.D. players like Jimmy Woo, G.W. Bridge and Contessa Valentina Allegra de la Fontaine. With those kinds of characters on the table, a stylish Fury-focused film could draw from Jim Steranko’s iconic run on the character, flesh out the early days of the MCU and maybe even show just how he lost the eye.

THE INVADERS

While “Captain America: The First Avenger” and “Agent Carter” both spent time exploring the World War II-era MCU, the Invaders, that era’s premiere superhero squad, still haven’t made an appearance. Created by Roy Thomas and Sal Buscema in 1969, the Invaders brought Captain America, Namor the Sub-Mariner and the original robotic Human Torch together for WWII adventures. While that team was known as the All-Winner’s Squad in the 1940s, the Invaders have an expansive roster that has included characters like Winter Soldier, U.S. Agent and Union Jack over its various incarnations.

With characters like the Howling Commandos already established, an Invaders movie could give Hayley Atwell’s Agent Carter a new home and introduce Namor and the android Human Torch to the MCU. Between Atlantis and his famous flooding of Manhattan, Namor could bring an unparalleled spectacle to Marvel’s films. In addition to tying up loose ends from “Agent Carter,” an Invaders movie could be the perfect venue to introduce some of the early ill-fated attempts to recreate the Super Soldier formula and set up future Captain America plotlines.

SILVER SURFER

While “Guardians of the Galaxy” has opened up the cosmic side of the MCU, Fox’s Fantastic Four and X-Men franchises have remained distinctly earthbound. While that may change soon, the Silver Surfer could help expand Fox’s Marvel Universe in a major way. Created by Jack Kirby and Stan Lee in 1966, the Silver Surfer has a conceptual elasticity and complexity that makes him one of Marvel’s richest characters. Whether he’s racked with guilt from serving as the Herald of Galactus or riding the spaceways in a psychedelic romp, the cosmically-powered Surfer is a compelling character who can easily hold down a stand-alone adventure.

While the Silver Surfer appeared in 2007’s “Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer,” he’s conspicuous by his absence in the MCU. If Fox continues to hold on to the Fantastic Four rights, a Silver Surfer movie would be the first logical extension of the franchise. By embracing Dan Slott and Mike Allred’s lighter “Doctor Who”-esque take on the Silver Surfer, Fox could rebuild the Fantastic Four universe with a much-needed tonal shift.

MYSTIQUE

Thanks to the fortuitous casting of a pre-superstar Jennifer Lawrence, Mystique has taken on a surprisingly large role in Fox’s three most recent X-Men movies. While Rebecca Romijn’s Mystique was more of a silent supporting villain in the first X-Men trilogy, Lawrence’s Mystique has literalized the philosophical conflict between Charles Xavier and Magneto. While this focus has added some unique wrinkles to the familiar character, the continued emphasis on the character has taken screen time away from underserved X-Men like Cyclops and Storm.

While Mystique doesn’t have an extensive history as a solo character, the 2003 series “Mystique” provided a solid template for a more heroic interpretation of her. In that series, which was partially written by Brian K. Vaughan, Mystique was cast as a secret agent who worked for Xavier. While the idea of a shape-shifting spy is a fairly compelling idea in its own right, this could be a convenient way to tease some less flashy pieces of X-Men lore like Genosha or the Legacy Virus.

MARVEL BOY

With the blockbuster success of Fox’s “Deadpool,” audiences seem willing to embrace a different, more violent kind of superhero. While Marvel’s Netflix shows have fulfilled that role in the MCU so far, Marvel could shake up its reputation for relatively safe, predictable fare by adapting “Marvel Boy.” Created by Grant Morrison and J.G. Jones in 2000, “Marvel Boy” follows Noh-Varr, a young Kree alien, as he viciously wages war against the trillionaire Doctor Midas and the sentient corporation known as Hexus.

While Marvel Boy would eventually become more traditionally heroic and join the Young Avengers, that initial miniseries was filled with a cosmic punk aesthetic that would be a shocking change of pace for the MCU. With all of the power and none of the responsibility, Marvel Boy could offer a dramatic counterpoint to fellow teen superhero Spider-Man. A Marvel Boy solo film might finally give Cobie Smulders’ S.H.I.E.L.D. agent, Maria Hill, something to do, and could begin to set up a Young Avengers film.

HAWKEYE

While audiences got to make an extended visit to Hawkeye’s farm in 2015’s “Avengers: Age of Ultron,” the Avengers’ archer still feels like a far cry from his comic book counterpart. Jeremy Renner has done what he could with a fairly thankless role, but Hawkeye’s trademark charm has gotten lost in some overcrowded MCU outings. A Hawkeye solo film could give Renner’s character a chance to breathe in between all of the Civil Wars and Infinity Wars.

Along with several other modern comics masters, Matt Fraction and David Aja perfected this kind of low-key Hawkeye with their 2012 run on “Hawkeye.” By following Hawkeye on his days off from the Avengers, the creators had the room to innovate and flesh out Hawkeye’s supporting cast, especially Kate Bishop, the younger Hawkeye. Given the prominence of teen superheroes in comics, there’s a surprising lack of them on screen. Introducing Kate could help remedy that while also setting up a Young Avengers movie. Although that comic starred a single, city-dwelling Hawkeye, a movie focusing on Renner’s rural, married hero could unearth some new depths for the character.

SPIDER-WOMAN

In 2016’s “Captain America: Civil War,” Tom Holland’s Spider-Man joined the MCU to great fanfare. While that newfound cooperation between Sony Pictures and Marvel Studios has let Spider-Man swing alongside the Avengers, it could also pave the way for a Spider-Woman film. Since her 1977 debut by Archie Goodwin and Marie Severin, Spider-Woman has lived in an occasionally macabre world of espionage and lies that could help connect the desperate points of the MCU.

Given Spider-Woman’s history of working for both Hydra and S.H.I.E.L.D., a dark Spider-Woman solo film could dig into the complex psychology of what it’s like working for these impossibly massive organizations. In addition to serving as a new potential Avenger, Spider-Woman could act as a sustainable link between Sony’s Spider-Man movies and the larger MCU. Spider-Woman’s nemesis, Morgan le Fay, could make an obvious foil for Doctor Strange and help establish the role of magic in the Marvel movies. Given the character’s prominent role in the 2008 crossover “Secret Invasion,” a Spider-Woman solo film could almost single-handedly set-up a major storyline for a future Avengers movie.

STARJAMMERS

In 1977, Dave Cockrum created the Starjammers as an independent feature. When there wasn’t any room for them in any of Marvel’s anthology titles, he and Chris Claremont introduced them to “Uncanny X-Men” in the middle of the landmark “The Phoenix Saga.” While Corsair, Raza, Hepzibah and Ch’od have always been close X-Men allies, Fox could easily give the ragtag team of space pirates their own X-Men-free adventure. Even though the characters have only appeared irregularly since their debut, they could overcome the inevitable comparisons to “Guardians of the Galaxy” and thrive on film in a light-hearted space romp.

Thanks to Fox’s control of the X-Men and Fantastic Four rights, a Starjammers film could feature some tantalizing match-ups. The Starjammers could watch as the Shi’ar Imperial Guard make a desperate last stand against Galactus or fight off Annihilus’ Annihilation Wave filled with the Brood and the Phalanx. By introducing some of these more science-fiction elements, a Starjammers film could also pave the way for the X-Men and Fantastic Four’s intergalactic adventures.

MOON KNIGHT

While Marvel has had tremendous success with its solo character films, none of them have been the same kind of grand urban epic that Christopher Nolan perfected with the “Dark Knight” trilogy. With its dark premise and a strong library of underrated source material, Moon Knight could be Marvel’s celluloid answer to Batman. While most of Marvel’s street-level heroes have a home on Netflix, the earthy avatar of Khonshu would make a striking image on the big screen with his eerie all-white ensemble.

With the character’s relatively complex premise, a Moon Knight feature could mix the grimy heroics of Marvel’s Netflix shows with the magic of Doctor Strange and the mythology of Thor. While Moon Knight could bridge all of these worlds, it could also serve as a spiritual sequel to the Blade franchise. By drawing on Bill Sienkiewicz’s depiction of Moon Knight or Warren Ellis and Declan Shalvey’s recent run on the character, Moon Knight could also work as a thrilling standalone psychological horror film.

BISHOP

In comics, Bishop’s history is hopelessly tied to the X-Men’s convoluted possible future timelines. Without the minutia of X-Men continuity, Bishop makes a compelling protagonist with a brilliant high-concept. Created by Whilce Portacio, Jim Lee and John Byrne in 1991, Bishop is a time-traveling policeman who comes back to the past to hunt an energy vampire named Trevor Fitzroy. While Omar Sy only had a few moments as the character in 2014’s overcrowded “X-Men: Days of Future Past,” that kind of time-traveling fugitive tale is the perfect set-up for non-stop sci-fi action in the vein of “Timecop” and “The Terminator.”

A Bishop film could also take a more grounded approach and adapt the short-lived crime series “District X.” In that comic by David Hine, David Yardin and Lan Medina, Bishop served as a policeman in the mutant-haven known as District X. Either one of those premises can stand on its own merits with a loose connection to the X-franchise, or could establish a number of plotlines for further X-Men movies equally well.

SUPERIOR FOES OF SPIDER-MAN

Even after five movies, most of Spider-Man’s villains still haven’t appeared on the big screen. While Spider-Man’s iconic villains should make their debuts fighting the wall-crawler, some of Spider-Man’s less lethal foes could build up his rogues gallery in their own feature. As “Suicide Squad” proved, a villain-focused film can succeed with nothing but cameos from established heroes. With that in mind, Nick Spencer and Steve Lieber’s “Superior Foes of Spider-Man” could be the perfect basis for a different kind of Spider-Man movie.

While most Spider-Man films have been fairly kid-friendly, a Superior Foes movie could exhibit the world-weariness and desperation of blue-collar criminals like the Shocker or Boomerang. A Superior Foes movie could make Spider-Man’s New York feel more expansive and lived in. Like Spencer and Lieber’s comic, the movie could be a light-hearted comedy of errors or more cynical look at the psychological toll of getting repeatedly beat up by a teenager in tights.

X-STATIX

Outside of Deadpool, the X-Men doesn’t lend itself terribly well to the world of comedy. While X-Statix doesn’t share “Deadpool’s” violently absurd sense of humor, the team could star in a solo film with vicious social satire. Created by Peter Milligan and Mike Allred as a later incarnation of “X-Force” in 2001, “X-Statix” cast its young mutant team as immensely popular reality TV celebrities. While that concept lends itself well to parody, the book was equally noteworthy for its sudden bouts of extreme violence and expendable team members.

Beyond tonally pushing Fox’s X-Men franchise in a drastically new direction, an X-Statix movie could offer a glimpse of how the world views mutants outside of the X-Men. Along with the compelling romance between Mister Sensitive and U-Go Girl and the commercial appeal of Doop, the team’s floating potato-like videographer, some of the comic’s less satiric elements could also translate to the big screen fairly well. Given the role of media in the series, the X-Statix movie could also be the ideal place to introduce the media-obsessed X-Men villain Mojo.

SPIDER-MAN 2099

Since Miles Morales is finally headed to the big screen, Spider-Man 2099 could add a whole new dimension to Sony’s Spider-Man franchise. Created by Peter David and Rick Leonardi for Marvel’s 2099 imprint in 1992, “Spider-Man 2099” showed how a future Spider-Man could operate in a corporately-owned dystopia that’s unlike anything Marvel has put on screen. While that line folded in the mid-1990s, Spider-Man 2099 has lingered long after the imprint’s cancellation and still stars in an ongoing title today.

Thanks to his appearance in a few Spider-Man video games and cartoons, some of the general public would already be familiar with Miguel O’Hara and the world of 2099. By clearly establishing the legacy of Peter Parker, a Spider-Man 2099 film could help set Tom Holland’s Spider-Man apart from his predecessors and offer audiences their first glimpse of the future of the MCU. Along with Spider-Man’s other film incarnations, a Spider-Man 2099 film could also help set-up a potential “Spider-Verse” crossover movie.

THUNDERBOLTS

While the MCU has many strengths, an expansive roster of well-defined villains hasn’t been one of them yet. A Thunderbolts movie could go a long way to changing that. Created by Kurt Busiek and Mark Bagley in 1997, “Thunderbolts” originally followed a group of villains who were posing as heroes. As the series progressed, some of those characters actually reformed and the title morphed into a work release program for super-criminals akin to DC’s “Suicide Squad.”

While many of the classic Avengers originally started out as villains, those origins haven’t really been reflected in the MCU. Although “Suicide Squad” relished in its characters’ misdeeds, a Thunderbolts movie could be a sincere underdog story about redemption. The Winter Soldier could find a home in a Thunderbolts movie, and longtime Thunderbolt Songbird could be a logical choice to join a future film incarnation of the Avengers. With its focus on villains, a Thunderbolts film could draw from Marvel’s Netflix shows, “Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.” and older MCU movies, and serve as a regrouping point for the larger MCU.

BLACK WIDOW

At this point, it’s absolutely ridiculous that Scarlett Johansson’s Black Widow hasn’t starred in a solo feature. While the character doesn’t have the most extensive history as a solo character in comics, Johansson’s super-spy has been a consistently engaging part of the MCU since her debut in 2010’s “Iron Man 2.” Thanks to her continued presence in Marvel’s movies, the Black Widow has unexpectedly risen from Marvel’s B-list to become one of the most visible superheroes in the world.

With Johansson’s proven box office appeal and experience headlining action thrillers like “Lucy,” the Black Widow could easily carry a Bourne-esque action-packed spy thriller in the espionage-rich MCU. As the rest of the Avengers movies continue to grow in size and scope, a Black Widow thriller could offer a necessary re-grounding after “Avengers: Infinity War.” Over the past few years, creators like Mark Waid and Chris Samnee have given the character several standalone comic stories that could model for the character’s solo cinematic outing. Even “The Avengers” director Joss Whedon has expressed interest in giving the Widow her first stand-alone starring role.

For all the latest Marvel Comics features, stay tuned to CBR! Let us know what Marvel character you want to see on the big screen in the comments below!

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