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#how does that relate to the Jotuns? which he's been raised on war stories on since he was a kid?
worstloki · 3 years
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funny story but I’ve never heard anyone criticize liking Thor by saying “but he killed people” or “he attempted genocide” or “he tried to conquer a realm” :/
#im just saying#Thor's on-screen kill count is higher than Loki's#¯\_(ツ)_/¯#and Thor has been the one saying he'll slay all the jotuns since he was 7 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯#he also then went on to try and proclaim a war to ''break their spirits'' after his failed coronation because ''as king of asgard''#that#that's what conquering is#he wanted to take the armies and beat up an already put down planet#even though he was already all set to rule nine realms he thought it necessary that his first act as king be establishing military dominance#might I add that Loki attempted genocide under extenuating circumstances? and for the purpose to prove himself? and end a war?#Thor was just doing it for fun#''but Thor changed his mind at the end of the movie!'' mhm ok when. and how. tell me how a day in Jane's presence taught him worth of life.#because Asgard views Midgard and Jotunheim *very* differently so even if Thor values humans after becoming one for a while#how does that relate to the Jotuns? which he's been raised on war stories on since he was a kid?#and I'm not saying that Thor's more easily influenced but Loki spares Jotun lives where he can in the opening of Thor 1#even though they've both been raised on the same stories and with the trademark Asgardian god complexes#and while Loki is allegedly the one who lets the frost giants in at the beginning he's also attempting damage-control the entire way#Thor is painfully unsuited to a throne let alone the one to the nine realms at that point and Loki is the reasonable one who is also ignored#yeah he resorted to letting 3 jotuns into the vault and he stretches the truth to thor about odin's sleep and#he also sets things up so he can be a hero by making a deal with the enemy BUT you know what? it WAS the most effective way to solve things#there was a war? ok cool if Laufey tries to kill Odin and Loki kills him it's fair game#problemo solved war over Loki's done crisis management and doesn't need to worry about having another father either#then THOR comes along with his treasonous friends and spills the beans and Loki#Loki's going to have to prove himself again for real when he TRIED to avoid the war and unleashing the bifrost? most efficient way to do it#Odin had already left the planet to a slow death and all Loki did was try and do what Thor had failed at#if you're not criticizing Thor for a failed attempt at genocide why criticize Loki for being a bit more successful?#they're in the same boat here except Loki has reasons behind what he was doing that wasn't his ego and that goes for New York too#check and mate#for real though I don't think i have ever heard anyone argue that Thor killed people :/ everyone is on about him being a himbo sweet bean :/#I must find out where so I can determine whether cultural differences are being infantalized or it's the fight:non-fight-time ratio
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Heading back; Snow.
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“We made it lil’ one...” -Voice of Beralda
Within the where about of a cavern, the shadows lit upon wings overstretched the far reaches of the back where light were just barely shining from an oil lamp at the side. A Valkyrie it appeared out of her elements, sat cross legged by the fire with her newly acquired journal she had been given in her one day’s worth of travel. Silver accents upon her feathers from the wings were a lit with many small messages that glowered every so often in a lovely bluish color. A quill made from gryphon feather were brushed over pages, leathered in texture. Almost papyrus, but different style. 
“This place is surreal, almost another part of this Eorzea I’ve not yet experienced in quite sometime having the Garlean designs as intricate patterns here. I search in time for Bodvar and Aelfred. Aelfred mostly, nick named Stetson due for his favorite hat he adorns. He’s another half-breed I've come across in the few months I’ve been here. The others are Elezen’s mostly. Knife-ears as others call them. This writing a ‘journal’ theme seems to help soothe my mind, so. I will start off with. I am Lady Beralda, Valkyrie. Shield Maiden of the North, to the Clan of Wolf. 
My home is much North of here, within the ‘legend’ place apparently as I’ve been told, Halls of Valhalla. The Aesir are her people. ‘Her’ being the homelands of Asgard. I know, muchly known at the mythical place of others but here I am writing in a journal just to be away from this civilization of Eorzean citizens. Mostly Ul’dah. I stopped at this place call Camp Bluefog? Yes, odd name, but I’m here. With a small pup that followed me out from these caverns. I’ve yet to name him, but his spirit is strong. He is a young Wolf, that much I can see forth of his features and the way he carries his stride. A good traveling companion since I do not have my Gryphon. Bodvar. That is another...story itself.”
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(Picture of Beralda and said Wolf pup right in the corner.)
The picture were placed within the journal taken a sketch of her as well the wolf pup earlier. The Valkyrie smiled, running her fingers over it before going back to her writings; 
“I’ve managed to talk to others here, about the where about of Aelfred. No signs of him this way, only through Ul’dah. Do I strive myself back there to the city-state to face the others yet? No. With or without my gryphon I will be heading North none the matter. There is a place called Camp Dragonhead I can go to, right outside of Ishgard. The home city to these knife-ears here. Some of them are kindly, I’ve met one actually that befriended quickly over Mead. Others...Not so much. The people here at the camp are to say the least...Colorful, if anything.
They strive to protect what they have here away from the Imperials. Little do they know, I once served on a vessel to get here for a long time. Learn the ways through them. That will be for another journal posting. Imperials that recruit Eorzeans into their ranks have little knowledge of what they were getting themselves into. I pity them, all of them. Including the footsoldiers of the Imperial Army. Everyone has a life. Everyone has a standard. My hatred for them is long gone after almost killing one that turned out to be a child no less. Barely in their summer years.
The Moon here rarely shines on the tavern here to which bunks to a Lalafell, two other patrons and a few more. They share beds or take turns through out the night to rest. A trust squadron. We did this back home when watching out for enemies through the raids we’ve done if I were not picking through Einherjar to bring forth to Odin. So many countless battles...
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My sword and shield are still no where to be found, but this sword I have currently serves me proper. Given to me a by traveler that died on my first arrival here known as Coerthas Western Highlands. The gates were impeccable to go through, but once through is where I came upon this land. I am heading back there, to hunt and live perhaps for awhile. I don’t know yet, it’s my destination for the time being while in search of my gryphon and his current rider. Perhaps my sword and shield will pop up on the way North. I pray to the gods it does.
I wonder how my friends are foregoing in their nature after realizing some emotions that I’ve never had before. I need to clear my mind, my heart. Though I fear for them without me around, what am I to do? Asatolf, I’ve asked to watch over my good friend the Elder Monk Singing Ocean. While Rothgar I’ve packed my things from mostly and left in a hurry after assurance of leaving something behind at Yrsa’s. That woman of truth norse blood. Halone’s Priestess she is, as is she shall be. She is a Warrior, but a good woman, good heart. Means well. Rothgar? Well, he is a sweetheart of one, but some exchanged words made me realize that perhaps a friend were right. I am not meant for here. His wife as well himself share a housing that is much reminding me of Doman. It’s lovely.
Asatolf is a Baker as well a Monk. He has a wonderful home with a luxurious hot tub he spends most of his time within to clear his thoughts after a stressful day. He knows many friends, but at the same his heart is heavy as is his peace. He looks to me always with affection that I cannot give back due for oath. Of heart of gold, as well good manners. The Jotun is always welcomed in my book.
Yrsa is a woman of gratitude, beauty but stubborn. Comical in some ways, one of the first I’ve come to known in this land. A hot head like myself but welcomed me in her home first before any. I lived there with one other which I’m about to get to. She’s a long hall that is not visible really to those around, however seen clear as day if one knew where to look. Also a deputy with the Flames, which I were gracious of. She’s been a help more than any, if not one of my closest friends. A woman of home I can relate to.
Aelfred, or Stetson I like to call him for nickname really is a character. He brings out the best in folk that others cannot see with pestering them. A kindred that made me stop in tracks upon first walk in the Quicksands reminding me of someone. Though, that wasn’t ever the case. There’s a connection there I know of, but won’t write here. Perhaps it’s my mentality. He’s the one with my gryphon right now, however; after what Yrsa spoke to me, I’d rather a word with him to get my Bodvar back. I raised that feathered beast from an egg. I doubt he’d sell my gryphon but who knows?...He’s the half-breed I mentioned earlier also. The red haired one with open coat few have spoken to the last couple of days. I’ve gotten hints of his where about but he seems to frequent the city state when I’m not there. If one does see him, He’s always with cigar in hand, drinking Mead. Looks for Miqo’te tail to cut off wanting all the colors. As well tosses out Elezen out of the bar. There’s more here, but I’ll leave that for another section of journal entry.
Rothgar, helping in killer of the Siren, my dear friend. Or at least I thought. Perhaps he still is in a wonder of things if only wiser words were chosen. I get the fight stopping, but I were defending myself...Long story. Roth is a quiet man, calls himself old, but is a very good friend to others.  He would give the shirt off his back to others as well if it came to that. Currently, I’m still upset with him.
Jahl is the maker of happiness with others, gracious in his ways as well his husband. His heart is there but also shares another ‘open relationship’ type deal. Perhaps in time he will fondly help me capture Aelfred with Bodvar. When I mean fondly, I mean literally chasing him, soon. 
Siti, the Xaela that is another skin changer I call them. They make themselves known through other skins it seems. Miqo’te then back to Xaela. Quite odd for me to capture this in my mind but it has happened on several occasions. My heart calls out to mine friend of dark thoughts, he is young learning to protect others in his grace. I only which that his dance were the speak of his tongue as well. One day he’ll get it. He is still one never to be forgotten.
For now that is all I have to wish to write on this page, however I will continue so forth on my journey. This journal writing is something new as well interesting. Maybe one day my story will be shared when I am gone from this Eorzea or printed to share with others if I decide to stay here long term. That’s another saddening thing...Eorzean’s do not live as long as a Valkyrie. I found this out yesterday as well...”
The journal were closed while Beralda stowed it away into her satchel for another day worth of writing. She’s had plenty of time upon her hands recent with all going on after leaving the city-state. Her where about will be shared with friends alike through letters to send through the Moogles. Another creature she finds yet interesting, but curious. Within the light of the caverns now darkened from the oil lamp being turned down. Her wings were the only bluish light to now reckon the icy walls of the cave. Shadows danced from the small flames now dying off within the once campfire that lingered upon logs. 
The wolf pup yipped happily beside the Valkyrie when she made herself a bed out of straw to lay upon. With the pup jumping up within arms to be held for the night, the dreams came upon her quickly of prior wars. Good dreams then a nightmare she’d soon never forget.
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bunny-wan-kenobi · 6 years
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Thor Thoughts Pt 2: Golden Boy Comes Down to Earth
Part II of my series of Thor reflections since I love the muscled teddy-bear badass way too much…
Part I: Why I Love Thor 
Golden Boy Comes Down to Earth 
Upon watching Thor Ragnarok, many viewers have labeled the Thor movies as a “coming of age story.” I agree but would add another layer: it’s also a story examining privilege.
Maybe the movies did not necessarily intend to tackle this theme, but I’m firmly of the belief that there is more depth to these movies than people give them credit for. Yup they’re fun, but there’s a lot to mull over beneath the surface. So let’s talk Thor, epitome of Privilege (on soooo many levels).
We first meet Thor when he is most young and brash and reckless. Thor is used to being the Golden Boy–he’s tall, handsome, popular, and proud. Not only that, but within the social context of our world, he’s basically a rich able-bodied white guy positioned on the highest tier of his society. Now put a hammer in his hand that only responds to his call (talk about exclusivity at the top) and you’ve got one powerful man–and a potentially dangerous one. 
Thor’s sheer concentration of privilege is dangerous because he was raised not to question it. His society is founded on the subjugation of other realms, and despite Odin’s call to honor and responsibility (oh Odin), he has this attitude that he and other Asgardians are inherently superior to everyone from the savage monsters outside their borders (the Jotun) and the petty subjects under their rule (humans). And Thor’s not the only one who thinks this way—it’s a symptom of his greater society.  
This is the view of conquerors, the ones who have the power to re-work the collective narrative in their favor so history remembers them as benevolent rulers bringing order to a world at war rather than colonizers forcibly bringing other peoples under their control (Ragnarok did a good job touching on this). So we end up with Thor the spoiled Norse jock with a bludgeoning tool–and Daddy’s a despot (less bloody post-Hela edition). 
King Laufey: Your father is a murderer and a thief! And why have YOU come, to talk of peace? You long for battle, you crave it! You’re nothing more than a boy trying to prove himself a man!
Thor: Be warned, this boy grows tired of your mockery!
Thor (2011)
Let’s be real here: Asgard as portrayed by these movies is an imperialist realm. How do we know this? Look at Loki. Why try to destroy Jotunheim (his birthland)? Why try to take over Midgard? Okay, there are a WHOLE lot of reasons underlying Loki’s motivations, but one thing he tells Odin in TDW is:
I went down to Midgard to rule the people of Earth as a benevolent God, just like you 
Thor: The Dark World (2013)
He says something a long these lines to Thor in Avengers–this is what their people do, they conquer people, keep them in line, and rule them, so what’s the big fuss? That is the way things are in Asgard, that’s what people believe keeps the order and peace. That’s what they want to believe at least…
And the thing is, Thor might’ve agreed with Loki once–before coming to Earth. Remember the Thor who basically reignited war with the Frost Giants because his pride was hurt? The guy went off to Jotun and killed a bunch of them and told his dad that they should destroy them together! (Asgardians have weird ideas of father-son bonding). I wonder where he got the idea that stomping into another realm to teach them a lesson and make them submit under brutal force was a perfectly acceptable way to approach inter-species relations… *coughOdingetyolifetogethercough*
Odin: What action would you take?
Thor: March into Jotunheim as you once did! Teach them a lesson! Break their spirits, so they would never dare try to cross our borders again!
Thor (2011)
Just to hammer in the point (see what I did there?), we see that Odin essentially has a whole MUSEUM vaultful of relics stolen from other realms, tokens of his conquests. Hmmmm that sounds familiar…
So we have a prince raised in the dominant culture, raised with an internalized sense of supremacy and raised not to challenge the status quo because it benefits him. And why would he? He’s used to being on top and throwing his weight around to get what he wants because this is how Asgard itself has stayed on top of all the Nine Realms for centuries. Thor’s point of view is myopic, too narrow to consider the wide-reaching consequences of his actions. It also prevents him from engaging struggles outside of his own, especially those of people without his advantages–a flaw that contributes to the splinters in his relationship with his brother (He calls Loki’s problems “imagined slights.” Yeaaah…not getting any Brother-of-the-Year Awards here Thor). 
Thor has tremendous influence in his position–he’s a prince, a future ruler, but we see him in movie 1 so fixated on his own glory, his own sense of rightness that he ends up trampling people right and left. Thor is like the thunder he commands, loud, powerful, and abrupt. He doesn’t linger for the aftermath but leaves a large echo.   
So what happens then when Thor is stripped of his hammer, his armor, his land, and his godhood status? Thor is literally stripped of his previous (mostly unearned) privileges and banished to Earth. And like anyone facing this kind of loss for the first time, Thor is angry. He’s defensive, desperate to get back to his hammer and restore a sense of normalcy to his life. He’s now stuck in a foreign world that no longer bends to his rules.
But this is why Thor’s time on Earth matters so much. For the first time, Thor’s worldview is exposed for its gaping holes, and he has to respond to the breaking down of tales he’s heard all his life about his people’s superiority. There’s a loss of innocence with that, but it’s replaced with a growing maturity. It’s also important to acknowledge that Thor comes to these realizations by developing relationships with beings different from himself. 
Thor: You know, I had it all backwards. I had it all wrong.
Erik Selvig: It’s not a bad thing finding out that you don’t have all the answers. You start asking the right questions.
Thor: For the first time in my life, I have no idea what I’m supposed to do.
Erik Selvig: Anyone who’s ever going to find his way in this world, has to start by admitting he doesn’t know…
Thor (2011)
In forming friendships with humans like Jane and Selvig, in living in a human town-even for a little while-Thor’s eyes are opened to the experiences of beings outside of Asgard, and instead of dismissing them for perceived deficiencies, he learns to value them in their complexity. He comes to appreciate humans for their intelligence, their capacity for kindness, their desire to understand the unknown. He observes their ignorance of so many things (he has traveled the cosmos after all and has a magic hammer), and yet…there’s things they can teach him too, maybe precisely because as a race they’re always learning and their lives are short. He may have been born to rule them, but now he is actually seeing them for the first time, and it changes him. 
When Thor sacrifices himself for the town in the first movie, it’s a climatic moment that signifies just how far he’s come in his journey of understanding his own privilege. He not only apologizes to Loki for how he has wronged him, but he also demonstrates his willingness to lay down his life for people that just a few days earlier, he might’ve waved off as inferior. And with that understanding comes not only a restoration of his previous power, but also a new commitment to defend these people with that power.  
This is an interesting development because then Thor returns to Asgard and later admits to Odin that he still has “much to learn.” Humility has begun to reshape Thor’s motivations so he acknowledges his flaws and seeks to learn from his mistakes rather than placating his own pride. He begins to understand that the power he wields and the position he holds can be used to serve others rather than simply dominate them. 
Fast forward and we see Thor protecting humanity in Avengers, and we get this fascinating and underrated exchange with Loki when he confronts him:
Thor: So you take the world I love as recompense for your imagined slights? No, the Earth is under MY protection, Loki! Loki: [laughs] And you’re doing a marvelous job with that! The humans slaughter each other in droves, while you ideally threat. I mean to rule them. And why should I not? Thor: You think yourself above them? Loki: Well, yes. Thor: Then you miss the truth of ruling, brother. A throne would suit you ill.
Avengers (2012)
I really don’t think people give enough credit to Thor’s insight here. He’s basically telling Loki that ruling can’t be reduced to an exercise of privilege where one sees themselves as inherently better than the people they seek to lead. When that happens, a ruler becomes a tyrant and no longer contributes to the welfare of their people–which in Thor’s estimation is what a true leader should do. The boot-and-ant analogy Loki champions falls short of Thor’s re-envisioning of what the throne really means. 
Loki takes the side of the imperialist: they’re better, more advanced than humans, so the humans should serve them and be grateful for it. But Thor introduces a new paradigm counter-cultural to what he has been taught: ruling as a means of stewardship. Not domination, not assimilation, but the recognition of responsibility towards the people directly impacted by your actions. A bloody history may have resulted in Asgard’s rule over Earth, but Thor realizes this does not give his people license to exploit humans’ resources and devalue them. Instead, they should be helping them, contributing to their flourishing and, ultimately, respecting their agency. 
The fruit of Thor’s time on Earth can be seen in TDW where the situation with the Dark Elves forces him to confront the reality of Odin’s past war crimes (and this is BEFORE Ragnarok). He questions Odin’s stance of isolationism and the wisdom of just staying put to destroy your enemy while getting destroyed yourself. There is a cyclical nature to these political conflicts, a generational ill that is poisoning everyone involved, and Thor no longer wants any part of it. 
Odin: Malekith is sure to return, we have what we wants. And when he does, we will defeat him.
Thor: We can not fight an enemy we can not locate! Malekith could be right over us now, and we’d never know! How many Asgardian lives must we sacrifice?
Odin: AS MANY AS IS NEEDED! Till the last Asgardian falls, till the last drop of blood is shed!
Thor: What makes you so different from Malekith, then?
Odin: [mirthless laugh] The difference, my son, is that I will WIN.
Thor: The Dark World (2013)
Remember this: Thor gives up the throne. Not just to be with Jane, and not because he wants to go off and vacation on Midgard like an overgrown fratboy, but because he fears he doesn’t have the ruthlessness to rule in a way that will maintain Asgard’s power like his father has done for centuries. He’s afraid of how that kind of pressure will change him, make him the manifestation of the worst parts of Odin. He’s afraid of how that privilege could consume him and harm countless others. By the end of TDW, Thor lays down the power of kingship given him by birthright because he believes he can do more good as a free agent ensuring the welfare of Midgard and the other realms. 
Odin: You once said there would never be a wiser King than me. You were wrong. The alignment has brought all the realms together. Every one of them saw you offer your life to save them. What can Asgard offer its new King in return? Thor: My life. Father, I cannot be King of Asgard. I will protect Asgard and all the realms with my last and every breath, but I cannot do so from that chair. Loki for all his grave imbalance understood rule as I know I never will. The brutality, the sacrifice, it changes you. I’d rather be a good man than a great King. 
Thor: The Dark World (2013)
By this point, Thor has matured past Odin, past Loki, past the reigning paradigms of his culture. They’ve all remained stagnant, caught in the same patterns of war and conquest and revenge. Once you’ve known privilege, it’s hard to conceive of life without that power–or the labor to preserve it. The cost of losing your advantage seems too painful because it’s woven into the normalization of your day-to-day existence. 
Others in Asgard may not want to consider what the alternatives may be, but Thor has come to realize the damage this attitude has wreaked upon not only the peoples of the Nine Realms, but also the very people who benefit most from the hierarchy as is. He sees the blind spots among his people, in “Humans-are-fleeting-their-lives-are-nothing” Odin, but he cannot force them to see differently if they are not willing to. If he cannot do good from the throne, then he cannot in good conscience sit in it. 
With that choice to loosen his grip on his privilege and recognize the responsibility tied to his positioning in the world, Thor finally emerges as someone worthy to be king. Loki had a point, he would have been a terrible ruler before the changes he’s undergone–he was arrogant and guilty of the same narrow-minded thinking passed down from the generation before. That Thor needed a crash-course to Earth to finally be open to unlearning what he learned and to develop empathy for others once considered lesser than him. 
So what we see in Ragnarok is the culmination of all this development, all these shifts in attitude. Yes, Thor is still bumbling and proud and powerful, but he is also wiser. He doesn’t believe he could be a better king than Odin, but his choices have already proved the opposite. I love that moment when Odin reveals to him that his power was never in Mjonir; instead, the hammer was there to train him to channel his power well. And isn’t that the summation of Thor’s whole journey? 
Thor: Life is about growth and change. But you, my dear god of mischief brother, just want to stay the same.
Thor: Ragnarok (2017)
Throughout 3 movies, Thor has been learning how to wield power wisely, to steward what he has been given to serve others. A hammer is cold and can only press other things down under it, but hands, eyes, feet involve skin-contact, the intimacy and intentionality of one’s body–and these are now the primary extensions of Thor’s power. 
Thor loses his hammer but takes full ownership of his identity, his embodied and social position within his community–and his power. There’s something beautiful in that idea because it’s Thor’s relationships-his experiences in drawing close to people and collaborating with them- that have contributed to his growth. He will not be the ruthless conqueror Odin was. He will be something entirely different that has yet to be seen. 
I don’t think it’s a coincidence that the movie that fully exposes the sins of Asgard and Odin’s bloody history is the same one that ends with Thor on the throne after everything he has learned and experienced. Asgard was built on a corrupt foundation, and so maybe in this case the whole structure needed to fall apart so something good and lasting could be built in its place. In the same way, privilege, whether racial, gendered, embodied etc., needs to be challenged and deconstructed if all peoples are to thrive together as true equals. Hela is framed as a relic of the old order; Thor is the burnished symbol of the new. 
Thor: I love what you’ve done with the place. Redecorated and everything.
Hela: It would seem our father’s solution to every problem was to cover it up.
Thor: Or cast it out. I would love for someone else to rule but it can’t be you. You’re just… the worst.
Thor: Ragnarok (2017)
Though he still doesn’t desire the throne, Thor steps up into the role of king because his people need a leader. Not a paternalistic Allfather, but a leader who can support and steer them into the unknown that awaits them after the destruction of Asgard. Thor knows what it’s like to have security, privilege, comfort stripped away, and so he understands how painful and difficult their next steps will be. Like he did years ago, they’re coming down to Earth, and Asgard may be better for it. 
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