#it was perfectly normal for me to engage in a discussion on racism. i wasn't speaking on an issue i have no say in

[mogai-sunflowers]

Am I the only one who really hated the year where the "nobody asked thing" happened a ton? It was used against me a lot whenever I overshared and as an autistic person I have trouble regulating that so I just stopped talking at all.

YEAH IT'S SO RUDE AND FOR NO FUCKING REASON??????????????? one time someone said that exact thing to me and i had a panic attack and felt so horrible but now looking back on it....... yes! yes you DID ask!!! because you made a public post with an opinion and gave absolutely no instruction as to who you wanted to respond! this is on YOU! /nay anon

#🌌written in the stars ; asks🌌 #im so sorry anon thats really sucky #u can overshare with me anytime and i wont be like that and im dead serious. #the way internet leftism practically requires you to be perfect is so fucking annoying #people act like if you aren't a part of a certain group that youre an asshole if you ever engage in convos about said group. #which is fucking RIDICULOUS!! #like for context #this person made a post sharing an opinion on unlearning racism. and i added my opinion because i too #am a person who has had to unlearn racism. what a shocker. #so i added on agreeing with their point and adding a little of my own insight. #and they responded saying they didnt ask for my white opinion and i needed to shut up #and its like. i understand and respect if you dont want white people interacting with your posts. but you DIDNT SAY THAT! #and sense you didnt i assumed that it was okay to add my opinion because THATS HOW HUMAN CONVERSATIONS WORK!!!! #it was perfectly normal for me to engage in a discussion on racism. i wasn't speaking on an issue i have no say in #i was simply talking about the importance of unlearning racism and doing the work because i have experience with that and its true. #this is true for all nuances and group dynamics im just talking about this rn #please dont get me wrong im not trying to undermine the importance of centering poc #and im not in any way trying to say that white people are always qualified to talk about racism or that we should always share our opinions #OR that poc are obligated to be nice to white people when they're disrespectful to them. #but my point is here that i was entirely within my lane #entirely respectful #but because i misinterpreted a social situation that was not at all clear i was suddenly the bad guy #and its infuriating because this has happened so many times. im not a bad person for getting shit wrong and its done so much and i mean SO #FUCKING #MUCH #harm to my mental health to think of myself as a failure because of my mistakes #it's just. ugh. stop

[castielcommunism]

Out and out John hater here. John was raised in the 50's and early 60's. Things like casual misogyny, racism and homophobia were just starting to be seen as "unpopular opinions" during John's formative years. And John in the 70's while mostly a sweet guy (ignoring the fact he was in Vietnam) he really doesn't seem like the "radical new ideas" type. I think at BEST John conformed his opinion to his (Step?) Father the way Dean would after him. (But really, if John's Dad was in WWII he might feel compelled by family loyalty even if it's not something he would agree with), and in the early 2000's that kind of behaviour (misogyny, homophobia, etc) was common and normalized to the point that I myself (a bi woman) said those things!

Obviously none of that makes the way he treated Dean okay. But with John as Dean's only major connection to other people (not including Sam because he wasn't his connection yet) I don't blame him for having a lot of outdated beliefs he needed to unlearn. Sammy is MUCH more progressive after only a few years away, but John had less to do with Sammy.

not sure what prompted this but uh. well a couple things:

I’m not interested in figuring out John’s exact political beliefs because they largely don’t matter. Even if John had been an outspoken anti-war communist, he was still an abusive person. Reactionary politics don’t have a monopoly on abuse. Like, I’m not sure why there’s a push to make John this ultimate boogieman who was a horrible bigot and evil person. You don’t need to infuse his character with any additional bile to justify disliking him. He was abusive and neglectful towards his children, so that should be the focus of the discussion, not the quality of his character. “Abusive” is not an intrinsic part of a person’s like, essence or whatever, it’s a behaviour that you can identify, talk about, and in some cases, stop people from engaging in going forward.

Building from that, I think Dean’s interpersonal problems have a lot more to do with the fact that John was the only durable relationship in his life aside from Sam, the little brother he was forced to take care of. Again, it doesn’t matter what John talked about at the dinner table, the fact that Dean grew up basically friendless with very few nurturing relationships is a much bigger factor in how ill-adjusted he is as an adult. You are going to have a very skewed perception of the world no matter how much (or how little) your father talked politics with you.

Anti-racist, feminist, lgbt, and anti-war movements were alive and well during the time periods you mentioned, so “product of his time” arguments don’t really land for me. I think it’s perfectly fine to admit that you outgrew certain biases and bigotries that were normalised in your environment (I certainly did!), but it’s also true that movements against those bigotries have very long histories that don’t originate on 2015 twitter.

Again, I’m not sure what prompted this ask, and I’m not entirely sure what it’s trying to accomplish. This is also ignoring the non-diegetic reasons Dean says misogynistic or homophobic things on the show (the writers’ own biases, Dean being originally written as an intentionally sleazy guy to contrast with Sam, etc). So I guess I’m just not super concerned with trying to find in-universe explanations for why Dean called a woman a bitch or thinks being gay is bad, etc, especially if they rely on conjecture and headcanon. I think there’s enough canonical and metatextual explanations around already. You can also just like, acknowledge that some of the things he says and does are bad and fucked up without trying to rationalise or contextualise them. Not that context is irrelevant, but Dean’s origins don’t cancel out culpability.

#dean.txt #asks #meta