#we cannot just pretend that him being black doesn't play a role in this story just because the writers weren't outright with it

[aishathetaurus]

I said this in a much longer post, but I wanted to dedicate a post to it... but a lot of y'all's hatred towards Luke is just racism. You're racist.

The show's refusal to address race and y'all's obsession with Nick being with June is having an effect on y'all. I mean, you were racist before ever seeing the show, probably, but the show's refusal to just say it outright isn't helping. Its touched on in the book, but not so much in the show or movie... I'll solely address the lack of understanding towards Luke's circumstances and just... leave the whole Osblaine thing alone.

In the book, the racism is just as clear as the misogny. JUST as clear. You barely see black people (and nonwhite people in general, but I'm talking about black people and the book actually touches specifically on black people as well) in this setting simply because in Gilead black people are not allowed unless their ovaries are promising. Black women didn't become handmaids. They were just killed or sent to the colonies, and if they were lucky maybe they'd get to be a Martha. Its silly and naive to think the gendered slavery or horrids stopped at just forcing women to be bastardized surrogates when there's room for so much more horrendous realities, whether it was shown on screen or not. This isn't something you had to read the book to get a grasp on. Its just... heavily implied either way. This isn't saying much because there were few, but most black women we've seen on screen at once is when we saw Unwomen...

Some of us have noticed the few times the show has hinted to how race is being handled and how it affects everything. To some of us, even without those hints, its obvious... The racism of it all is implied actually. Its so implied, it almost, doesn't need to said. However, to most of you? You're oblivious, so it should've been said. Over and over, actually.

Luke is doing the best he can in a system that was literally built to go against him. Even the current system, where the focus is mainly on women, is built against him despite the fact he's a man... he's still black. Imagine the fear of living as black man of America... Now take all the worst parts of America and put them into their own country... Now imagine the fear navigating that... Imagine what the level of fear does to you... Again, this isn't something you'd have to read the book to wrap your head around... There's a lot of pressure on Luke not only as a man, but as a black person and he's clearly just very very scared, as he should be.

With all things considered, he's doing great. He's been doing great this entire time. He didn't ruin anything this episode, nor has he ever. He did what needed to be done. He didn't need permission or extra context. He has never had the time or space to pause, consider context, and be gentle with his wrongdoers the way people like June or Serena has... This being a hard time for women, doesn't erase the reality of how black people are treated. In fact, with so much freedom to treat people however, it just heightens the racism towards black people. Again, not necessarily something you needed to read the book to grasp.

Either way, Serena is a literal war criminal and a serial rapist that stepped foot out of her allowed space. Whether he called or not, immigration was coming for her ass, and he did the right thing by speeding up the process.

After being kidnapped AGAIN... calling immigration and the police on the woman that helped enslave, imprison, and rape his wife was the only option... How do you see that and then still rage? What else was he supposed to do? What are your expectations of him? Not just in this episode or the last, but this whole time... What the hell was he supposed to do as a black man? Try to save her and stick out like a sore black thumb and end up getting himself and June killed?? He's not Nick. There was no helping her. The anger literally doesn't make sense and its getting to the point I have to assume its simply racism.

The inability to understand his circumstances... How harshly he's judged... yeah...

Luke was just as "useless" in the book and 1990's movie, yet its only when it comes to the show, where he's portrayed as a black man, do I see any commentary on how truly "worthless" he is. Its interesting.

#luke bankole #june osborne #the handmaid's tale #handmaid's tale #handmaids tale #so annoying this nuance is missing from the show #its so annoying reading y'all's takes on luke having the understanding i have on how fucking scary it was to be black in gilead #even if i didn't read the book years ago #this is all information i would've gathered just from watching the show and really taking in every scene #just a reminder that majority of this show's audience are white women tbh #this isn't the original story but its the story now #luke in the original story didn't have to navigate any of this #but its the story now so... #anyway #a much needed race analysis #we cannot just pretend that him being black doesn't play a role in this story just because the writers weren't outright with it #its a story based on a real country that really had slavery and is actually violently misogny #if luke is gonna be black in the show then it has to be acknowledged when doing an analysis #it means something and it was a choice #black people played a role in the original story and it would be a disservice to ignore this reality now #especially when its been hinted at multiple times

[earth16comicswire]

Administrator Sly Moore conspires against Darth Vader

Administrator Sly Moore has been in Emperor Palpatine’s inner circle when he was still Chancellor of the Galactic Republic. A cunning political figure hailing from the planet Umbara and who is Force-Sensitive, Moore is dangerous, possibly much more so than the Emperor’s other right-hand person, Grand Vizier Mas Amedda.

When Darth Vader was punished by Emperor Palpatine for his side quest of finding out more information about his son, Luke Skywalker, Moore was one of the allies the Emperor ordered to eliminate the former Jedi Knight Anakin Skywalker. After Ochi of Bestoon, a Sith assassin, thought that he had defeated Vader on the volcanic planet of Mustafar, the Administrator felt that she had to pick up the pieces due to knowing that Vader could not be kept down that easily. After Vader got off Mustafar with Ochi as his prisoner, Moore was on board a Star Destroyer pursuing Vader and sending an entire fleet of TIE Fighters after him. However, the Sith quickly defeated the TIEs thanks to his skills as a pilot, his abilities in the Force, and a giant space creature enroute to the planet Exegol.

After she, Vader, and Ochi witness the Emperor’s true power and his plans involving Exegol, Moore also witnesses the Emperor’s armored enforcer being restored. However, this has the administrator concerned and by the end of “Darth Vader no.13,” she is revealed to have conspired with IG-88 and a secret group of followers to finally kill Vader.

Warning Spoilers Ahead

“Star Wars: Darth Vader no. 14” begins on the Imperial throne world of Coruscant where two Imperial cadets are in awe at how Darth Vader survived his ordeal on Mustafar by just being held together by Separatist droid parts. They comment that Vader is basically unstoppable. As Vader strides triumphantly with his new right hand man Ochi of Bestoon at his side, Administrator Sly Moore is not at all impressed.

Seeing her disappointment, Emperor Palpatine instigates jealousy within the Umbaran when he asks if she is satisfied with Vader being restored to full function and health. Sly admits that she failed to defeat Vader which the Emperor agrees and then chuckles as he walks away from her. To make matters worse, as the Umbara follows the Emperor, Grand Vizier Mas Amedda tells her that she is needed at the Prescreen Department. Moore quickly learns that due to her failure, she has been demoted to Sub-administrator. The Umbaran looks on as Amedda and Palpatine take the turbolift toward the Imperial Palace. Several Imperial officers and stormtroopers look on at the now Sub-administrator Moore.

As I continue to read this series, I continue to praise Greg Pak as one of the many writers who knows how to write Star Wars along with Charles Soule. In this issue, the story’s main focus is on Sly Moore and the ongoing battle for supremacy within the Emperor’s inner circle. The inner conflict within the Galactic Empire is nothing new in Star Wars. We have seen plenty of Imperials conspire against each other or their allies. For example, there have been several past stories where the Grand Moff Tarkin has traded blows with Darth Vader. In addition, there have been previous comic issues where the Emperor has sent potential new enforcers or apprentices to kill Vader so that he can replace him. Furthermore, there have been other stories in the Star Wars Legends lore, like “Shadows of the Empire, '' where Vader has deep animosity for the Emperor’s ally and leader of the Black Sun criminal syndicate, the Falleen Prince Xizor. In this latest “Vader” issue, Paks narration and dialogue between the characters are a reminder of how the Sith operate with each other and their allies. I also feel that Pak’s inclusion of the subtle infighting within the Emperor’s inner circle is a reminder of the Tragedy of Darth Plagueis with Wise.

While toiling away at the Prescreen Department with two Imperial officers, the now Sub-administrator Moore discovers that a high-ranking Imperial has been given an invitation to attend the auction of the carbonite frozen Han Solo from Crimson Dawn. Moore also hears the name “Skywalker” and sees this as a potential opportunity to enact revenge on Darth Vader.

Moore begins to put her plan into motion by heading to the repair block where Vader was fully restored back in “Darth Vader no. 12” so that she can get the schematics on his machine-infused anatomy. Mas Amedda catches her and the two discuss their roles within the Emperor’s inner circle and how they serve the Sith and do not have the power to “indulge in their pleasures.” Sly being sly tells Amedda to pretend that he did not catch her while she, unbeknownst to the Grand Vizier, creates a holodisk containing the schematics on Vader’s anatomy.

It is here that we learn how bounty hunter assassin droid IG-88 was able to track down Vader and temporarily have the upper hand on him during their fight in the last issue. It was Moore and her fellow conspirators who provided the assassin droid and his army of droids with the disk.

Toward the end of the comic, we are left off at the part where IG-88 meets with Moore and her followers. The droid tries to terminate his bounty contract since Vader defeated him during their last encounter. Much to Moore’s horror, Vader sneaks behind IG-88 and slices the droid with his crimson-colored lightsaber. Moore and her followers flee from the Sith Lord while they try to kill him. Moore also tries using the same mechanism IG-88 used to defeat Vader but ultimately, Vader overpowers her.

With no choice and admitting defeat, the Umbaran bargains with Vader by mentioning the Crimson Dawn invitation to the auction of Han Solo and also how Luke (who would not be far behind to rescue the smuggler) could potentially kill Vader. Sly makes a promise with the Sith Lord to purchase Solo for Vader so that the Sith could not only take Solo but also potentially fight Luke. The two come to a compromise on the plan. However, at the auction, things go south when Jabba the Hutt and his fellow Hutt, Bokku (who has allied with Vader) outbid Sly. The administrator is puzzled as to why Bokku, who is allied with Vader, is bidding against her. Ochi responds that it is the Hutt’s way to humiliate her and himself which in turn would expose her weakness to the Emperor.The assassin further explains that although Sly was very power with uniting her allies to defeat Vader, the Sith Lord is too powerful to let that happen. The end of this issue leaves off toward where “War of the Bounty Hunters no. 2” ended but with Vader inviting himself to the auction by force choking several Crimson Dawn guards.

As I mentioned before, the character of Administrator Sly Moore is very dangerous and shrewd. Greg Pak brought this character to life. Before the “Vader” comic, Moore was just a character who stood on the sidelines with a brooding expression in the “Star Wars” prequel films. Pak’s take on Sly Moore is a high ranking Imperial official who is an opportunist and a quick study. She is willing to do whatever it takes when an opening presents itself to execute her plan. She also is no push over when it comes to executing that plan by mentioning Luke Skywalker being the only person who could kill Vader and take his place. This shows that she is as much of a manipulator as the Emperor. In the end of the day, it doesn't matter who dies in the fight between Vader and Luke (who she may or may not know are father and son). One way or another, whoever dies, she would probably go for the killing bow.

I also like the direction Vader is going in this arc also. Yes, he knows that Luke is his son however, it seems that the Emperor wants to use that in order for him to have one less Skywalker to worry about. The Emperor is hell bent on manipulating Vader to kill Luke or vice versa since having an enforcer strong in the Force would serve his agenda. Especially if the Emperor was able to seduce someone as powerful as Anakin to the Dark Side. It will be interesting to see if Vader really is set on killing Luke or if this is just a ruse to get the Emperor off his scent of his own plans which involve having his son rule at his side.

The art by Raffaele Lenco and the coloring by Jason Keith played just as huge of a role as Pak’s writing did in bringing Sly Moore to life. The drawings of Sly Moore show the stark differences between her time as administrator in the Galactic Republic to her time as administrator for the Empire. When she was administrator for the Republic, she was wearing a silver, or lighter, gown while under the Empire, she was wearing an all black short trench coat with black slacks and boots. In addition to her clothing, Moore’s facial features are further darkened and chiseled, possibly to show her age throughout the 23-years she has been in service to Palpatine. But I also think that those additional lines and shading on her face make her far more brooding than she did in the prequel films.

Overall, the “War of the Bounty Hunters” arc has been the blockbuster of the summer that has rocked the Skywalker Saga in the Disney era. There hasn’t been such an arc since the Shadows of the Empire that has changed the landscape and expanded the Star Wars Universe. With the inclusion of Han Solo’s ex girlfriend Qi’ra, from “Solo: A Star Wars Story,” pulling the strings by gathering all entities in the galaxy, there is no way that it would be a “Star Wars” blockbuster without Darth Vader. Greg Pak’s post “Empire Strikes Back” Vader is ruthless, determined, and cold-blooded. From what I read, he knows that he cannot take on the Emperor alone but he also knows that Luke could very well defeat him. With that, Vader has no choice but to kill Luke or at least defeat him enough so that he could have one less potentially powerful enemy to worry about. Or, as I mentioned before, Vader is likely playing possum and secretly wants to have Luke at his side (which he actually does) so that they can overthrow the Emperor.

“Star Wars: Darth Vader no.14” is now out wherever comic books are sold.

Writer: Greg Pak

Artist: Raffaele Ienco

Colorist: Jason Keith

Letterer: VC’s Joe Caramagnna

Publisher: Marvel Synopsis: “The Blade Behind the Curtain" For decades, no figure has stood as close to theEmperor with so much mystery surrounding her. Who is theUmbaran? What is her role within the Empire and in the War of the Bounty Hunters? And what happens when she emerges from the darkness to challenge Darth Vaderhimself? Featuring an unprecedented look at the inner workings of the Emperor inner circle – and the return of IG-88!

#star wars #war of the bounty hunters #darth vader #marvel

[dogsliampaynedoesntinstagram]

Stan logic is so odd to me and its never sit right with me. And these last few anons of yours show me why it worries me so much. I don't know if its more worrying if its just one person or more but i am worried for them as well.

Also it is quite strange to me when people try to give justifications like these for thinking two people they don't know cannot be together or cannot be compatible. of course we all tell stories and its okay to not think they are together but reasoning it by making assumptions about either of them based on the snapshots we see of them that do not entirely define them or that are for marketing a certain image of them for whatever purpose is odd. Also the stigmatizing of certain actions. As you say "People who are this judgemental of other people are rarely kind to themselves" and I worry about stan culture cultivating this mindset and how its having an effect on the way people treat themselves.

Anyway i just wanted to share some of my thoughts after seeing your anons. I also had a question about something you mentioned. In this post you said "In fact most of this fits stereotypes of how men and women are in heterosexual couples (which I think is not a coincidence, but those ideas have played significant roles in fan storytelling)." I was wondering if you could elaborate on what you mean when you say you think its not a coincidence.

I hope you are having a good week!

Thanks anon - my week has had a terrible and very annoying start, but I have hopefully managed to resolve the annoying and terrible thing so it won't affect the rest of the week.

I do think stan logic is based on anxiety. A key aspect of anxiety is black and white thinking - things are either good and bad. In this mode of thinking the idea that you might be bad is intolerable and therefore any criticism is catastrophic. For a lot of people, when they identify with people, this psychological stress is also transferred as well. In this version of fandom, the imperative is to make sure that the person that they identify is with 'bad' (whatever that might mean). Standom is the culmulative impact of a lot of people really leaning into their anxiety response in the name of people they identify with.

I think you're very astute about the dangers to people who deal with their anxiety response in this way. I think constantly using fandom to recreate and police the line between black and white in terms of people who you identify with, can only make that anxiety worse. Whereas I think one of the key ways to grow as a person and figure out to have good relationships with people is to learn to live in the complications of shades of grey.

***********

As for your other question - I think there's a lot going on with the polarisation with fan stories about Harry and Louis. And there's lot to be said about stan culture, ideas about morality and fame, class and so much more.

But I do think that when the stories people tell hit gendered norms it all gets much weirder. I find the push to reduce Harry and Louis to these set of gendered characteristics infuriating whoever is doing it and why. But the stuff around diet and exercise is particularly infuriating (because I find the whole value system enraging to start with). I do think that gendered stereotypes are part of why when Louis says he hates exercise apart from playing football, people cut off the end and ignore it and pretend that nobody who ever says they hate exercise ever does it. And when there are rumours that Harry is describing himself as a vegan, people ignore the fact that we've been having descriptions of Harry as vegan alternating between accounts of him eating hawaiian pizza ever since I've been in this fandom.

The impact is this really cliched one of one partner who is hyper aware of food and being healthy - and the other who doesn't care and who eats anything. If they're a woman and a man - it's incredibly common. But as two men it's supposed to render them incompatible..

Anyway I think people recognise the gendered patterns and that's why these stories become hyper polarised. Even when not explicitly being invoked gendered stereotypes offer a way foward for a fandom cannot hold the idea that people can be multi-faceted, or even something as simple as 'sometimes we do things we present ourselves as disliking'.

But then there's lots of people telling these stories in different ways, which is why what is at it's heart a cliche about heterosexual relationships ends up being used as a reason that two men can't be together.

#I think of the anon #which seemed to think that Louis saying that he just watched television over COVID #was literally true #rather than a way of not engaging with the question #oh anons

[migleefulmoments]

"And whether he plays queer or not (we don’t know), the show has strong themes of homosexuality and closeting during the “golden age” of Hwood." lol we DO know but abby is demented. she thinks he's a pathological liar but he's not going to lie about this subject. seriously, she's so obsessed with him playing gay that she doesn't care about the backlash he'd get for taking another role. as an actual fan of his, I wouldn't wish that on him. nor do I think he lies about everything.

Her entire statement just hit me the wrong way.  IDK if it is her continued use of the word “queer”, her believing the anon who knows the entertainment industry, that she claimed we don’t know if his character is “queer” (we do) of if it was her use of ‘homosexuality” like it was a slur or her “How ‘Raymond’” comment. I posted hate entire post below simply because I needed to read that “how Raymond” quote again.  

“Obviously how problematic will depend on just “how raymond” his character is, but I cannot see how his character does not have some connection to closeting”. WTF does “How Raymond” mean?  She goes on to say she cannot see how his character does not have some connection to closeting? Why? What would make you think that based on what we know about Darren’s own comments about not playing gay characters and all the summaries we have seen about the show itself. This is purely wishful thinking and probably what she is hinting at what she “thinks” might be happening.  

She is also claiming that his team was able to get all the media outlets to talk about the statement.  They would be pretty damn powerful if they could actually make all the independent, for-profit media organizations and legit news organizations talk about their story. That isn’t how the media works. Yes there are sleazy rags that take stories for money but not any that I read.    

Anonymous asked:

Part 1: dividing this up in case this is too long. I work in the entertainment industry and I have a theory about the no more queer roles. The fact that this was brought up again tells me neither of his 2 upcoming roles are queer roles. That being said I have first hand knowledge that the one thing gay actors can’t stand other than a straight man getting a queer role is a closeted man getting queer roles.  

Part 2: what might have happened is after D’s rise playing gay parts someone (in or out) of the gay communities threatened to leak some information. D is well known especially in the Broadway/gay community and access to information about him is easily obtained. That explains why he seems more free in non acting roles to be himself (lip synch, halloween parties, gay benefits). Remember that it’s not just other gay actors that feel threatened by D. (wtf? if it’s easily obtained information then Darren must be prepared for it to come out. What could someone blackmail him over? He’s gay? I thought the theory is that Darren wants to come out, had tried to come out but he can’t conractuly? Are you claiming he’s too scared to come out? Because if that is the claim, then he is a spineless twit who has egregiously lied to his fans for 10 years and even married a woman he must not love to hide his truth).  

Part 3: it’s their managers that feel threatened by D. It’s not inconceivable that someone was threatening someone. None of D’s current actions make sense. No actor that I no of would make that statement on their own. Not one. In fact no legit manager would let their client make that statement. They would just not accept anymore gay roles without announcing it to the public. (Soooo you are in the industry but your only insider info is your first-hand knowledge that gay men don’t like closed men taking gay roles? Any woke, knowledge and compassionate actor would make a statement like that and if their manager wouldn’t let them make that statement, they need to let them go).

Part 4: I just finished Catch and Kill by Ronan Farrow. There is a whole other world where young gay men are taken advantage of in Hwood. Fact. I fear that all of this bizarre things we are witnessing with D’s. careers we are all questioning is only going to lead to some very dark things. (oh ...so your insider information is from Ronan’s book?)

********************************************************************************

Hi nonnie! I would agree that is is very well known in Hwood and on Bway the D is queer and M is a beard and I also agree that out actors often resent closeted ones for taking queer roles but not being honest about themselves. However, out actors also very well know the struggle that closeted actors face in Hwood and many know how closeted actors are treated pretty deplorably.   (So she agrees because she knows? I guess it’s all that insider information she has but can’t share with her followers, right? HI love how Abby is so aware of gay men’s feelings but she has never spoke to one.  Also she agrees that gay men don’t like closeted actors taking gay roles but she also know how deplorably they are treated and gay actors are well aware of the struggle.  She what is her point? Oh, right it isn’t Darren’s fault). 

My issue, like you, isn’t D not playing queer anymore, the issue was how such a production was made over the statement and frankly the timing of the statement. (Liar liar liar). I contend this is not something D circulated .  He absolutely mentioned in an interview earlier in 2018 that he did not think he should play queer anymore, i cannot deny that. But it was a podcast delivered to a very tiny audience and it was not done in such a big, slamming the door kind of way nor was it offensive.  Months after that podcast, his team (December) decided to turn this into a huge media story and had it published and subsequently talked abut by various media outlets so it pretty much spread all over the industry and to the GA forcing D’s hand and pretty much making it impossible for him to accept a queer role from then until he comes out of the closet.  

And in my opinion, it was a harmful statement, that was incredibly offensive. and his team led the charge to make sure it was circulated. (No, it wasn’t offensive in the least. In fact, it was the opposite)  

Several factors, D had just won an emmy for ACS and was nominated for 3 more.  Seems to me like a slap in the face to the very community that he built his career on and it could have (clearly did not) jeopardized his chances of winning if people had resented him for making the statement. (No it wasn’t offensive to actual gay people Abby, just you) 

It precludes him from considering roles with queer characters from now until he is out of the closet. Seems to be to eliminate a ton of opportunities without evaluating each one on its merits. (Yep, it absolutely does... because that is what representation means. It means he is also eliminated from all black roles, all female roles, all child roles...you see how this works?) 

And another huge factor, we now know D made a deal with RM prior to the no more queer roles article. And whether he plays queer or not (we don’t know), the show has strong themes of homosexuality and closeting during the “golden age” of Hwood.  This seems very problematic. And it seems like his team trying to sabotage his ability to be in this show.  (I still don’t get this argument- does she really legit think we will believe this is a valid argument? Being on a show with gay roles is no where near the same as playing a gay character. It isn’t a thing no matter how much Abby plays confused about it- in fact if he refused to be on a show with gay characters THAT would be offensive AF and would be worthy of the gay community hating him) Obviously how problematic will depend on just “how raymond” his character is, but I cannot see how his character does not have some connection to closeting.  But that is speculation and we will know more as time goes on.

Personally, I think his team did it to hurt him and to hurt the new show (SO Ricky -the world’s shittiest manager is going up against Ryan Murphy? That seems like a fair fight) .  They do not have his best interests at heart,(But you do abby don’t you?)  they know he is miserable and does not want to be closeted and frankly I think that makes the down right giddy and joyful. And they use the closeting, and M, to control him because they know how much he loves to act and that he does not want to jeopardize his career. And you can bet there is blackmail and threats going on behind the scenes, the essentially forced him to marry the most toxic person in his life (I cannot emphasize this enough, they are not friends).  

And you are correct, a team that actually cared, would never allow such a harmful statement to be made. Never.  But then again a useful team wouldn’t force him to pretend to own a misogynist bar either, and well, his does that as well. Nor would they force him to pretend to love a person that is vile, unambitious and the opposite of a role model not to mention a complete detriment to his well being. (blah blah blah blah the record is the skipping) 

So it is clear his team doesn’t give a fuck about D, just about themselves.

[amwritingmeta]

My dear, you are the most interesting writer of the fandom. I truly believe without knowing you in person that you are a fine human being. This I'm asking you, because I recall a piece of Meta you wrote almost a year ago about how it will be difficult to make Destiel Canon, because of the nature of show business. Now, about your last post of the color purple. Let me ask you honestly, you don't think at some point that all this things are a proof of queerbating if Destiel doesn't go Canon? Thanks

Hello, lovely Nonny! And oh wow *blushes violently* that’s one helluva compliment. And I must stress that I’m the most average human being to ever average! But thank you for saying such sweet things! Jeez Louise what a way to spend a Sunday! :D

And omg what a callback to the early days! I do remember that post, actually. It was in response to a queerbaiting discussion, but I cannot find the original to save my life so I’ll just run with it:

I do need to clarify that I believe what I said wasn’t that it is/will be/would be difficult to make Destiel canon because of the nature of show business, but rather that our fucked up world, and what it means for a show to launch itself with a queer lead, has informed how Dean Winchester and his presentation has been handled in the media and by the cast and writers/show runners. 

And, naturally, how Dean Winchester is presented must inform how Destiel is handled as well. Because Dean is our protagonist. 

I mean, this is my theory here and I cannot prove a single word of it, so take all of this with grains of salt - all I can give you is what makes sense to me when looking at the narrative and what I see as the intent of that narrative.

Whether Dean was always meant to be the protagonist, or meant to be the secondary character to Sam’s protagonist (roles which are established in the Pilot), is of little consequence here, what matters is that you can trace bi-Dean back to the Pilot. That side to his personality is present in the Pilot. Dean was always meant to be queer coded. Why not overtly so?

Well, the way I see: the show wanted a predominantly male audience for a reason. Because the show is about deconstructing the masculine ideal and teaching boys and men that denying who you are based on the terribly old-fashioned belief that “feelings make you weak” is not only wrong, but detrimental because the truth is this –>

–> you choose who to be, and you can be ANYONE YOU IDENTIFY YOURSELF AS

–> no one can ever tell you it’s wrong

–> there is no weird, everyone’s normal in their own way

–> and what makes a “man” is not fucking defined by the social norm bullshit of patriarchal gender oppression!!

*and breathe*

Granted, had the show actually ended in S5, this message wouldn’t have been as impactful as it is now, after thirteen years of character journey and evolution, after thirteen years of self denial and fear of happiness. But had the show ended in S5 I’m still convinced we could’ve gotten a reflection of what we’re driving towards now.

S5 could easily have climaxed with Sam and Dean ending the codependency, and Dean - instead of mistrusting Sam being able to defeat Lucifer - actually letting him go, letting him grow up, telling him “you got this”

It could easily have ended with a different angle on Cas’ arc, set up in S4 with Anna and echoed in 5x04 with Endverse human!Cas, where Cas actually chooses to give up his grace and ends up human for that final fight (not just rendered powerless and human-esque after carving that sigil into his chest)

And with Cas human, he would not have gone back to Heaven, we would have ended with Cas and Dean in the Impala, and I can see how the flirting that Dean tries to start up in 5x03 with the Thelma and Louise moment could’ve been built on throughout the season to TELL us that Dean is undeniable attracted to Cas and that it runs deeper than that and, once Cas chose humanity, they would’ve given us this love story in text for the end of the season because Cas would recognise his own feelings as well

And, you know, we could’ve gotten Sam back - the search for God and the hopelessness it rendered ending in God revealing himself and repaying Sam’s sacrifice with life and freedom… 

Because S5 is all about daddy issues in need of resolution and the codependency between the brothers highlighted (as it is in most seasons of course)

But, be aware, this is truly, truly just me seeing possibilities in the structure of the narrative and hell, I’m not going to pretend I actually know the mind of Eric Kripke, yeah? Yeah, no. 

But I honestly, truly believe the pattern of Dean’s bisexuality is there for a narrative reason, which means the reason I got into the queerbaiting discussion was to refute the claims and state my disagreement with them, because you can’t call it queerbaiting when the narrative function of this incredibly important character detail is hit on again and again and again on the show. 

It’s not there for the shits and giggles, you know? It’s not there as some sort of hook for the LGBTQ community. It is a key component of Dean Winchester’s character makeup and it’s at the heart of the reason why he ever needed to go through this journey in the first place, this journey of opening up to love and to being loved for who he is by letting go of his preconceived notions of who he has to be, notions that it’s established in canon have been informed by toxic masculinity.

And this is one of the most powerful why-hearts of any story: searching for one’s true identity and, in doing so, having to face one’s deepest fears and conquer them. 

The deconstruction of the masculine ideal is being done through Dean finding a reason to shed his toxic masculinity, and this reason is tied to his love for Cas. 

Could this have been done with Cas being a woman? YES! That’s the whole point for me. 

Cas’ gender is not important for Dean’s character progression or the role Cas plays in ensuring it - Cas the CHARACTER and his PERSONALITY are what’s important. The way these two men compliment each other emotionally are what’s important. The way they challenge and push and support each other’s growth is what’s important. This is why it has always been a love story - from first frame of footage. (to my mind) (I know not everyone agrees with this assessment)

And the POINT of Cas being a man instead of a woman is, for me, that it pushes the deconstruction of the masculine ideal to its very breaking point, because the ideal is idiotic and prescribes to societal norms that, honestly, are beginning to flake at the edges in modern society as is, thank goodness. 

The ideal is gender normative - men are men and women are women and everything is black and white and straightforward. So to build Dean Winchester into the epitome of the masculine ideal - the man’s man, the stud, the cowboy, the hero - and have him still retain all the qualities that make him that man’s man, that stud, that cowboy, that hero - while also softening him and opening him up and revealing that deep emotional life and all that longing for love and communication and equality and all the personality traits he’s always possessed (and we’ve always seen them) that, according to societal norm, are considered feminine, well, that’s a deconstruction of the masculine ideal worth writing home to grandma about, know what I’m saying?

Consider a woman being the one to open him up to love. Well, we kind of got that with Lisa, didn’t we? Only she wasn’t real. She was a representation of what Dean wants for himself: home love family - but she was, in the end, proven an illusion. Dean was not happy playing house: because he was playing house, still stuck in playing a part he never chose for himself because of course Dean Winchester was never meant to give up the life. The reason he’s broken and lost isn’t that he was raised a hunter (saving people gives his life great meaning and purpose), but that he’s stuck performing. 

So what if Cas was a woman? 

Yeah. He could’ve been a woman. But the fact that Cas is a man adds a layer to Dean’s search for his true identity that would otherwise be lost. Without the love story being Dean falling for a man, they have no real narrative way to highlight his bisexuality without baking it into the narrative simply to have him be a bisexual character. Make sense?

And they didn’t build Dean as overtly bisexual because if they had:

he would have been immediately put in a character niche and the audience they want to appeal to –>

the audience that believes in the masculine ideal as truth, or that are subconsciously influenced by it daily –>

that audience would’ve been lost to them –>

because they would’ve thought “gay” and switched channel –>

no matter how man’s man and heroic Dean Winchester still is with that pink/purple/blue label across his chest

Men enjoying following the story of a man who is attracted to other men will make the men following that story question why they enjoy it, and no man’s man wants to start wondering about their own sexuality. (yup that is a generalisation but one that is based in truth no?) 

“Liking bisexual Dean Winchester might mean I’m gay. So thanks but no thanks. Moving on.”

Like I said: societal norms = stupidity. Okay, actually, that’s not fair or true. The societal norms equal narrow mindedness and fear. And this is always forgivable, because it’s addressable and changeable. 

But this is also the reason why Dean is not canonically in our faces bisexual. (though he might as well be) (like sheesh doesn’t take a magnifying glass)

And this ^^^ is why Cas needs to be a man. Because it completes the deconstruction of the masculine ideal to such a degree, while retaining Dean Winchester’s already established characteristics, because Dean will still be all Dean once he’s actually with Cas, that the question of “What makes a man a man?” should be a resounding one. 

Is Dean Winchester not a badass, brave and tough as nails hero simply because he has softer sides and fancies dudes - one dude in particular? 

Of. course. he. fucking. is.

You are a man because you identify as a man; liking flowery wallpaper and crying your eyes out to Charlotte’s Web does not somehow transform you into something other or lesser than a man. Like… WHERE THE FUCK DID THIS IDEA EVEN COME FROM WHY DOES ANYONE ADHERE TO IT SOMETIMES I JUST

Now, about your last post of the color purple. Let me ask you honestly, you don’t think at some point that all this things are a proof of queerbating if Destiel doesn’t go Canon?

Yeah, so why am I going into great detail to clarify my stance on the structure of this narrative and the approach to Destiel through the presentation of Dean Winchester as the masculine ideal? To answer this ^^^^^ part of your ask!

Because all of the above statements and my view on how this narrative has been built, the way the characters have been built, the way all of it fits together, including my colour theory that you mention :), all of it is the reason why I argue so strongly against the queerbaiting allegations.

And it’s why I cannot, for even one second, fathom that where we’re headed is not towards positive endgame and the tying up of our love story.

Destiel, to me, is already canon. Subtext is such an important part to any text and absolutely no doubt hands down it’s extremely important to the SPN text. 

Dean’s character progression and evolution to where he’s at right now has been built through subtext, and through the deeper subtextual bond he shares with Cas. 

What’s telling is that this becomes even clearer when Cas has been missing from the narrative. Dean made leaps and bounds worth of character growth while thinking Cas dead in S7 (Sera knew what she was doing) and we got a sharpened and focused callback to the depiction of that loss in S13. (gorgeous stuff) Not to mention how Dean has acted as a catalyst for Cas’ character progression and evolution.

This is how you build a love story.

And this is why I’ve been saying since last summer that if we don’t get this love story pushed to the forefront in undeniable ways in S13 I will eat that over-priced and not-yet-purchased hat as self-punishment for being crap at interpreting this narrative, but the way S13 is going… 

All this stated, yes, of course, if they somehow fail to follow through then it will be the greatest case of queerbaiting in the history of fandom. 

But I believe, with every fibre of my being, that they’re following through. 

Okay, that got away from me a little, but it was very enjoyable to readdress the issue of SPN and queerbaiting and I’m amazed you remember that post!! Thanks so much for asking, lovely! And I hope I answered your question. :)

xx

#answered asks #spn queerbaiting #destiel #opinion piece #plus a bit of #spn meta #for good measure