#and i actually think this fandom has been pretty good in regards to conflict because all of the lyric ops posts responses were less attacks-

[utilitycaster]

To elaborate on this post specifically with regards to Worlds Beyond Number, well, Suvi says it all, really:

They love being on my tab, they love having fun, they love being protected by me, but they never listen to me and they don't care.

Because here is the thing. Suvi is of the Citadel, which is part of the Empire. We do not have a full understanding of the geopolitical system but as a rule an empire is participating in conquest; sometimes two empires both exist and attack each other and so the exact scenario gets very gray and complicated but I think we do all agree the Empire is not great.

Suvi is of the Citadel. She holds a position of great privilege within the Citadel. This is in part because her parents were, as far as we know, betrayed and murdered by an enemy of the Citadel (having themselves been, again, based on what we know, reformers and rule-breakers as well as extremely capable spies) and she was adopted by one of their closest friends, who became the Sword of the Citadel.

She is not the Citadel. She is a 20-year old who was primarily raised within it, with all of the above complications of her parents. She is not single-handedly responsible for every action the citadel takes. She is not personally trying to stop Ame or Eursulon, only saying that there will be consequences if they leave. Consequences that she has experienced after Ame ran into the kudzu and Eursulon went after Naram and they all attempted to break Ame's curse; consequences she knows will become more and more dire if she continues to disobey Steel, particularly a direct order; consequences that already resulted in Ame being in a coma for a month. (The court-martial, I will say, is entirely on Suvi; the rest is not).

And in all of those situations: Ame and Eursulon were, as Suvi says, happy to have Suvi's purse pay for room and board, and her wizard's staff open doors, and to be put up and fed at the Chantry, and take the skyships, and train at the Citadel and have a marvelous time there. It's been several days and they could have left sooner, and they didn't. It's very "no ethical consumption under capitalism, which means that I can do whatever I want" rather than like, attempting to make slightly less harmful choices from Ame and Eursulon. Their choices aren't coming from a principled stance against the Citadel and Empire; they are coming from a "well, thanks for all the fun and the safe place to stay and the resources for research but you told me not to do something I wanted to do and I won't wait an hour to try and see if we can come to a solution that works for everyone."

For that matter, they're making these choices in part because of what a wizard of the citadel is saying to them; and yet Suvi's presence was said by that very wizard to be crucial to Ame's survival, and they're still not waiting.

[stepping outside of all of the above and the below: I think all the actions being taken, as a listener, are fucking great because this is D&D and conflict is fun and also all of these characters are like, the equivalent of 20 years old and level 2; this is not me saying Suvi is right and Ame and Eursulon are wrong. Rather, Suvi is no less right or wrong than the others, and she is extremely justified in feeling hurt and angry and that her friends are willing to take and not give.]

Something I've found in a lot of sf stories but especially actual play is a pretty strong and frankly, weird bias within the fandom of exactly this nature, as the linked post said. Someone affiliated with an empire or a power is somehow, as an individual, responsible for every harmful action that power commits. They're brainwashed. They're evil. They don't get it. They just need to come around to the right mentality. And that right mentality is, of course, that of the good rural person with nature magic. They are a leader within their small community and hold an immense amount of power over them - and perhaps beyond - but don't worry, they use it correctly. They're wise and they're right about everything.

Except they're not. They are frequently either idealistic to the point of ignoring the realities of the situation, or very limited in their viewpoint, or do not realize the immense privilege of being in their position as both a person in nigh absolute benevolent power within a small domain and also the only person with that power. Those wise, provincial, nature-based characters rarely understand that to exist within a complex and yes, extremely flawed and even ill-intentioned system like the Citadel is to be, even as a person with privilege within that hierarchy, a cog.

Suvi cannot just leave. She exists within a vast system and she is not stupid or brainwashed for acknowledging the realities of it. I think that yes, a very possible path forward for her is one in which she grows to question the Citadel's practices. I also think that to treat her as the embodiment of this entire empire, or to expect that her only way to be a good person is via a sudden about-face at the cost of everything she has, when she is a level 2 apprentic, is not just overly simplistic but flat-out incorrect. And I think that to assume Ame is objectively correct for not waiting a very brief amount of time for Steel (when, in fact, one could argue she should have left immediately upon being contacted; she had been absent from her duties for months already) is similarly oversimplifying to the point where one's conclusions are no longer useful.

Recall that witches' familiars are said to embody the traits within them that, to be an effective steward of their position, they often must set aside. Ame has been letting hers lead her.

#ngl this fandom mentality sets off some admittedly hair-trigger Yikes tendencies tingling re adulation of the good rural people. #anyway. this post is also secretly about every cr campaign and also a little about midst and also a little bit the wheel of time #worlds beyond number #wbn spoilers #wbn

[aspoonofsugar]

Say question, do you have a post talking about Wizard of Od allusions in RWBY? Some are pretty obvious, such as the Tinman, Ironheart, rejecting his hummanity/heart, and Leo Lionheart being the cowardly lion. But do you have a detailed breakdown about Gylinda, Qrow and Ozpin in regards to their allusions?

And is Ruby Dorothy as well as Little Red Ridding Hood? Or is there no Dorothy?

Hi!

I have never written a whole meta dedicated to The Wizard of Oz in RWBY, but I think there are some pieces here and there.

Anyway, I don't know the story super well, so I am rather sure I am missing several details. That said, here are some thoughts on the Wizard of Oz Allusion in RWBY.

First of all, this allusion works on two different levels:

It interests the World of Remnant

It interests individual characters

WORLD ALLUSION

The world of Remnant has become the Kingdom of Oz, not because it is based uniquely on this narrative world, but rather because it is the fruit of an endless conflict between The Wizard of Oz and the Evil Witch of the West.

Ozpin and Salem's feud has been defining the world for centuries, so their allusion has ended up permeating all of Remnant.

By this, I mean that the entirety of Remnant is ruled by "Wizard of Oz"'s characters:

Ozpin is the Wizard of Oz > Beacon

Leo is the Cowardly Lion > Mistral

Ironwood is the Tin Man > Atlas

Theodore is Dorothy > Vacuo

Moreover, we have Qrow (the Scarecrow) and Glynda (The Good Witch of the North) as Oz's henchmen. Do you see the pattern? The most influencial people in Remnant are all linked to Oz and all reference characters of his fairy tale. All together they are the crew chosen by the Wizard to defeat the Evil Witch of the West.

In short, Oz allusion has "conquered the world" because Ozpin and Salem are too intertwined with the history of Remnant (they basically made it).

However, this doesn't meant RWBY is a re-telling of the Oz's books. It references them, sure, but RWBY's narrative universe is wider, as we saw this volume.

In volume 8, the characters step away from the yellow brick road and enter a brand new world:

The Ever After, aka Wonderland. A completely different setting for a completely different story. A story, which is really not defined by Salem and Ozma, but rather by Alyx and Lewis.

Meta-narratively, the characters leave Ozma and Ozpin's story for a while and enter into Alyx's adventure. This is also why the main plot is on break this season.

OZ CHARACTERS: OLD GENERATION VS NEW GENERATION

As mentioned above, Ozpin's crew all allude to Oz's characters. Still, they are actually inversions of their literary counterparts. To be specific, they fail, where their characters succeed:

The Cowardly Lion wants courage, but Lionheart betrays Ozpin and sides with Salem out of fear. He gives up his bravery.

The Scarecrow wants a brain, but Qrow decides to blindly follow Oz without asking himself any question about him. He gives thinking for himself.

The Tin-Man wants a heart, but Ironwood chooses to lose his hunamity to become a machine. He gives up his feelings.

It is too soon to comment on Theodore's allusion on Dorothy, but he will probably be an inversion too.

What is sure is that Ozpin's crew is made of adults that have been traumatized and corrupted by the long war they have been fighting. This is where the new generation comes in.

Blake, Yang and Weiss allude to Dorothy's three friends:

Blake is the Cowardly Lion - she starts the story as a "scaredy-cat", but learns to conquer her fears and stops running away

Yang is the Scarecrow - she starts the story as a "himbo", but she grows smarter and wiser

Weiss is the Tin-Man - she starts the story as an "ice-queen", but she grows warmer and kinder

Notice that "bravery", "heart" and "brain" fit the body, heart and mind archetypes, which are very easily found in stories. This is why the fandom is able to apply these three allusions rather easily in the series. Basically, any character is either mind or heart :P (see, you can also see Blake as the mind to Yang's heart).

So, why do I say BYW allude to these specific characters? They do because of 2 reasons:

Some motifs they have confirm this

They all foil their respective older counterpart when it comes to their overal story-line and flaw

Blake and Lionheart

Blake is a scaredy-cat, while Lionheart is supposedly the Cowardly Lion. Both are Faunus in a position of power. Blake is the daughter of the Chief of Managerie, while Leo is the Headmaster of Haven. So, both are in a position where they can change things for the Faunus. Still, they both are afraid.

Blake is scared of Adam and this is why she leaves her group of friends and goes back home, where she thinks she will be safe. She temporally runs away from the main battle, seeking refuge in an island, which is peaceful, but also a prison.

Lionheart is scared of Salem, so he chooses to switch sides in an attempt to survive. He runs away from the battle metaphorically and later on he does so even physically, as his last action is to escape leaving EM and Hazel on their own.

In the end, though, Blake comes back and decides to fight for what is right. Lionheart instead doesn't and is punished with death. Blake is a scaredy cat, but she is also braver than everyone else. Lionheart is a lion, but he is a coward.

Blake and Lionheart's foiling is ultimately about what they do and don't do for the Faunus, especially. After all, Lionheart was supposedly put in charge of Mistral because a Faunus as an authority figure seemed like the best option to overcome racism in the Kingdom. And yet, Blake's actions in Mistral do more good for that than anything Lioheart has ever done.

Yang and Qrow

Yang and Qrow's foiling is about their relationship with Raven and Oz, really.

Qrow trusts Ozpin blindly and doesn't mind Raven's doubts or reservations. He refuses Raven's philosophy of asking the right questions:

Raven: Now you're catching on. So far you've done nothing but accept what others tell you, (puts her cup down) but you need to question everything.

Yang instead does integrate this part in her and starts asking questions of both Raven and Ozpin, aka her two main authority figures. This leads her to become wiser:

Yang: No, I'm starting to ask questions like you said. So tell me… what happened to the last Spring Maiden? Did she die in battle? Was it sickness?

When the truth about Ozpin comes out, Qrow and Yang are among the most disturbed by it because they are both triggered. Qrow dedicated his whole life to a man, who was never honest with him. Yang instead gets angry at another authority figure "running away". However, Yang has grown enough to withstand the setback, while Qrow is undone.

In short, Yang and Qrow's foiling is really about demanding the truth from the people they are following and learning to think with their own heads. It is about accepting the complexity of the world and to carve their own paths. Without letting others lead them around.

As an additional note, Yang fits the Scarecrow symbolism for a very heartbreaking reason. Scarecrows are meant to scare ravens and crows and the Oz character initially can't fulfill this purpose. The birds tell him he is too stupid to really scare them. So, the Scarecrow wants to become smarter.

Well, Yang does become smarter, but her wisdom is so keen it drives a cowardly bird away:

Weiss and Ironwood

Weiss and Ironwood are both Atlas elite, who learnt to suppress their feelings in order to meet the impossible expectations of their society.

They have the same problem: mind and heart contradict each other. It is just that Weiss chooses to follow her heart and becomes one:

I'm shattering the mirror that kept me split in pieces That stood between my mind and my heart This is where I'll start

Ironwood instead chooses to negate his hear and becomes no-one:

What if it’s true as they say That I don’t have a heart That I'm more a machine than a man? What would that change? Would it matter at all? I've made my plan Hearts and minds may not agree Emotions topple strategy

This juxtaposition is well conveyed through their shared Tin-Man motif...

Weiss's Tin Man is a proud Knight:

Ironwood's Tin Man is a mindless robot:

Let's highlight the first time Weiss summons her Knight is after all in juxtaposition to a hacked Paladin, which is used to attack people, rather than to protect them. So, we have our Brave Knight vs a Mindles Robot.

Other than them, there is another old vd new generation foiling going on (obviously):

Ozpin/Oscar where Ozpin is the old generation wizard, who gave up on trust, while Oscar is the new generation wizard who keeps having faith no matter what.

Their foiling is explored also through their allusions:

Ozpin alludes to the wizard of Oz > an impostor who acts as an almightly being

Oscar alludes to princess Ozma/Top > the true Queen of Oz

Ironically, Ozpin's real name is Ozma, while Oscar's name is the one of the Wizard. So, they are like... criss-crossed.

Oscar's introduction happening after Beacon also makes sense because... in the books the first novel focuses on the Wizard of Oz and Dorothy, while Ozma is introduced only in a later book. So, the moment our wizard (Ozpin) is death, our Princess Ozma (Oscar) is introduced. Other then this, Oscar's developing bond with Emerald may allude to the Emerald City aka the Town ruled by the Wizard where everyone wears green-glasses, which make everything appears as green.

Now then, what about Dorothy?

TWO DOROTHIES

Apart from Theodore (the titular Dorothy), I think there are 2 other characters that fit the description:

Both Ruby and Oscar allude to Dorothy in different ways:

Oscar lives in a farm with his aunt before going on an adventure and during his journey, he gains a pair of red boots. If you follow this reasoning, then you can headcanon JNR as another trio that loosely fits the Cowardly Lion (Jaune maybe), the Scarecrow (Nora) and the Tin Man (Ren). Still, I think they fit less.

Ruby is noticed by the titular Wizard of Oz because of her silver eyes, whereas Dorothy's slippers are silver in the books. She leaves for a journey in order to fix a world the Wizard is unable to fix

Not only that, but RWBY's main-plot loosely follows that of the classical Oz story. Ruby meets the Wizard and is given the mission to defeat the Evil Witch of the West with 3 friends (each lacking something). During her journeys she meets Oscar (Ozma). Moreover, the reason why the Evil Witch of the West is interested in her is her silver eyes. An ability that emerges when Ruby uses it against Cinder aka a younger version of the Witch herself. In the classical Oz story, Dorothy's arrival in Oz kills another less powerful evil witch and she takes the slippers as a result. Here, Ruby uses her eyes on Cinder and then she is targeted by Salem.

Notice also that Ruby's volume 4 short has her fighting this:

Specifically she goes from Bewolves (LRRH's story) to this very intelligent Monkey Grimm (Oz's allusion). It is as if Ruby's personal arc is LRRH, but her journey when it comes to the bigger picture is similar to Dorothy's.

Thank you for the ask!

#rwby #stormmodblog #asksfullofsugar #once upon an allusion #rwby meta

[leggerefiore]

Team Galactic, grunts and commanders alike, being perplexed by Cyllene the 2nd/Cyllene Junior and the whole base going ham after Cyrus brings her to work.

You know Team Galactic would have been internal conflicts i.e. a very messy fandom war over Cyrus being a "knows what sex is, does not fuck," or a "knows what sex is, does fuck," kind of guy (clearly Saturn and Mars fall into the latter). The poor baby girl is evidence that Cyrus does fuck (at least occassionally).

The highly inappropriate and unprofessional gossip does not end with this discovery though. The Cyrus-fuckers within the organization now need to know HOW he fucks, for science of course, and heated discussion is part of the learning process.

The idea of the little lady being born post-PLA is cute, being named after the ancestor who set Cyrus on the right path and gave the reader a chance to prove herself worthy. Though her being born beforehand and Cyrus and/or reader realizing in retrospect that they made a fantastic choice in naming her after the good captain is also good.

A secret 3rd option is for the baby to be born in Hisui, named after her "cousin".

High Five Anon

Saturn has to excuse himself. He's so mad someone else got Cyrus's dick before him and then even somehow further convinced him to have a kid. There's no way that child was an accident, the Galactic Boss is too careful to make an error like that. This is a completely unfair world. He is Cyrus's favourite commander, too! Catboy enraged.

Former group of no fucking is more correct alas. He doesn't Fuck often. It's too much for him, but there are moments when base instinct and how restrictive emotions break free in him and he needs some physical contact with his partner. Poor guy still isn't really liking the whole Emotions thing.

Is Jupiter opposed to Mars's and Saturn's views? Just ugly fandom war even among the commanders. (Charon doesn't care since he isn't a True Cyrus Fan™️.) Mars is going full "I told you so" on Jupiter since Saturn is too busy fuming to do it himself.

Cyrus heard this and was still not caring enough to put a stop to it. He just covers Cyllene's little ears. Such filth needn't bother her. She just babbles and coos at her father in return, warming his usually cold heart.

Saturn firmly stands in his point Cyrus likes kinky shit. "I mean we do call him Master Cyrus..." Mars argues he probably doesn't do much work in bed since he just seems like the "softer" type. They are now in a petty squabble amongst themselves.

He, actually, is pretty lazy in bed and doesn't really have any kinks because he rarely regards sex in his mind. There are times he prefers a more dominant type of action, but usually, he's just going along with whatever his partner likes.

I think normal Cyrus post-giving up his plans names his daughter after Cyllene because he definitely pulled his team's insignia from her somehow. He just could not think of a good name and after seeing how much his child unfortunately favoured him named her after his ancestor. It worked out well since it fit her.

The Hisui au Cyrus 100% named her after the captain. A form of respect to her kindness and care for both him and his partner in their time in the past. He does not want her memory lost to time and tells his daughter endless stories about Cyllene, so she knows how name-sake was a powerful, brave woman.

Her being born in Hisui, though, and named after Cyllene actually flusters the captain secretly. She truly was frozen when you both announced the pregnancy to her and then again when the child was actually born. A little girl you both instantly agreed to name after her. She feels so warm inside to know her impact on you both was positive and lasting enough for you to name your child after her.

Now, she also secretly really wants to hold the baby and is awkwardly standing in the infirmary until her willpower gives out. (Cyrus and you invite her to, and she is instantly charmed by her decades' down descendant. Such a tiny face and hands and little tufts of blue hair. It makes her excited for whenever she will start her own family.)

#cyrus.ima #per cyllene's begged request the child is given sword training

[maro-mellow]

⚠️ dungeon meshi episode 16 spoilers! ⚠️

A post in defense of both Toshiro and Laios!!

(A very messy one that is)

(I’m not a writer and know nothing about critique or good writing please excuse this if it’s stupid)

oh I loved Laios and Toshiro’s fight scene!!

Now, I have seen some discourse around who was in the wrong and who was in the right in the situation,

I wanna put in my two cents as someone who faces insensitivity around my culture by westerners and someone who relates deeply to Laios (Especially in that “reading the room” conversation.)

Because of these reasons I just listed I felt really moved by this scene and felt the need to talk about some hate both Toshiro and Laios (Toshiro especially) have faced in the fandom.

I believe that this scene was meant to illustrate how flawed they both are, how both of them have something in common—their treatment of those they see as not the norm/uncommon.

Laios, having grown up in what i assume is a small town with only people who looked similar to him, and being coded as a neurodivergent person who feels disconnected to other people’s feelings and can’t immediately tell if he’s making them uncomfortable, has completely overlooked Toshiro’s feelings towards him and has not noticed (or simply not cared, assuming it wasn’t a big deal) about some of the micro-aggressions he has directed at Toshiro.

Toshiro, having grown up in a culture where the ability to read subtleties and things like politeness is held in high regard, sees Laios as odd, and even a bit of a nuisance to be around, which is made worse by how insensitive he’s been towards him (Most obvious example is how Laios mispronounces his name) Many of Laios’s behaviors are most likely seen as inappropriate where Toshiro’s from, and his cluelessness about Toshiro’s culture probably adds insult to injury.

They both have been ignorant towards the other, but instead of their fight scene being used to pit them against each other, I see it more as both of them confronting the other—and by the end of it, their relationship has improved. It’s not fair to call Laios or Toshiro a bad person, as they’re both ignorant, not bad intentioned. I don’t think these flaws ruin either character, I actually think it was pretty good writing, as flaws make for room for improvement, and this could drive both of the characters to have a better relationship with each other. It would have been flat if it was just a conflict about Toshiro being mean to Laios, or Laiso being racist to Toshiro, but this instead makes them multifaceted characters and adds layers to the conflict they have.

I’m not a writer, I don’t know the first thing about good writing or good critique, but this is how I see it: a misunderstanding between two people who haven’t tried to see things from the other’s perspective, and an exciting opportunity for character development.

If anyone has anything to add or something I missed, please feel free to add it in the comments or tags, and if there are any mistakes I can edit my post❤️

Tl;dr: both of them are flawed multifaceted characters with zero outright bad intentions and the capacity to improve and it’s kinda dumb to call one or the other the bad guy in the situation.

I love you, Toshiro dungeon meshi…I love you, Laios dungeon meshi…my favorites ever…

#dungeon meshi #toshiro dungeon meshi #laios touden #laios dungeon meshi #Falin…my love…. #dungeon meshi episode 16 spoiler #this post isn’t meant to be interpreted as babying or saying that Laios is dumb or anything #Toshiro isn’t a bad guy #he was also severely malnourished #we should probably cut him some slack #even if he was pretty mean #Laios was kinda mean too

[ciaossu-imagines]

For the 6 characters and what you'd do with them. Can we add "sit down and have a serious talk with them" and do all 7 of Tsunas Guardians? (Mukuro AND chrome)

Oh, this one is so fun! I love the extra prompt you came up with as well though the choices for this were so hard to make!

The character I'd push off a cliff

Honestly, it would be Lambo. I mean, I love Lambo more than a considerable portion of the fandom does and he amuses me greatly, but he can still be an awfully annoying brat and I'd probably get fed up and punt him off a nearby cliff by accident. However, let's all admit that Lambo takes a lot of very physical damage in canon that's equivalent to being tossed off a cliff or worse and he still keeps ticking after all of it, so he'd probably be okay after being sent over a cliff.

The character I'd kiss

Well, to make a terrible joke, depression and a complete lack of regard for my physical and mental well-being at times (I'm honestly trying and improving guys, don't take this too too seriously) means that I do not fear death, I welcome it. So I'm kissing Hibari. Might as well go out doing something fun and leaving an impression on someone, haha!

The character I'd marry

Okay, but he's not even, nor has he ever truly been, my favourite or one of my fictional others, but even I have to admit you'd be crazy not to marry Yamamoto. The man will always make you smile and laugh, will be fiercely loyal to you, will have your back, can cook and clean, and my parents would both love and hate him. Perfect marriage material and I'd get the best father in law in the world.

The character I'd set on fire

Ryohei and I could totally get him to not only allow me to do it but have him beg me to do it, if I convinced him that it was some new training method or ritual that only the strongest of fighters can withstand. And I can be pretty damn convincing. Of course, I'd put him out pretty quick because I wouldn't want to cause any actually serious damage.

The character I'd wrap a blanket around

Surprising nobody, it's Chrome. That poor girl has been through so much and she still tries so damn hard to be good and strong and to do her best for those she cares about. And I so badly want her to rest under a pile of warm blankets, in a feather soft bed, in the softest of pyjamas and wake up to breakfast in bed and spend the day getting pampered and doing things that would truly make her happy. I mean, she would probably never let anyone do that for her, but I totally want to.

The character I'd be roommates with

Okay, but these last two are where I had the most fight to decide who to put but in the end, I just have to admit that living in the filth that Kokuyo Land is would legitimately probably kill my very clean, everything in its place, super organized, obsessive-compulsive ass so I will have to go with that I would room with Gokudera. Honestly, I think that as long as we weren't in a pandemic like situation again where we were stuck together every hour of every day, we could probably survive rooming together without too many major fights, especially since I'm an extremely tolerant person who hates conflict, so I would shoulder and grin and bear a lot of his more unpleasant traits and just continue to live in ways that worked for the both of us.

The character I'd sit down and have a serious talk with them

Okay, but who wouldn't look at Mukuro at some point and be like 'bitch, why are you like this? Like, seriously? And all these plans and plots of yours? To what end? And then, after you succeed, what then?' Because I love Mukuro and I love his characterization and his growth and development through the story but sometimes you really do have to wonder if he's even figured it all out, if he even knows what he truly wants and desires and why.

#replies #ask game #katekyo hitman reborn #khr

[cherrychipheart]

Update

Heya~ It’s been a while. 5 years

First off... I’m genuinely surprised that my dead blog still gets likes and reblogs occasionally. During the course of time, a lot of asks were sent, and I’m really sorry for having left you guys hanging. At that time, high school grades were a priority ;; Now that I’ve been free from all that for a while, at the very least, an update was necessary. 

1. Updating blog theme

There were concerns that the blog was hard to navigate and to add, also lead to external links. I’m incredibly sorry to those who experienced this. The blog has now reverted back to the vanilla tumblr theme. 

2. Back to being active?

I’m afraid that I have lost all motivation to continue this blog. There are 15 drafts/unposted theories that were left sitting there, and when I look at those posts, I think man, what was I thinking? As of right now, I’ve forgotten 80% of what my theories were originally about, that I’ve had to reread them over and over ; And it’s unlikely I’ll ever get back on track. So with that, I’m afraid that I won’t be able to answer all of the asks, since the part of my brain concerning itself with Cheritz has been collecting webs and dust 😞

3. The future of this blog    

I’ve considered deleting this blog for some time. It’s pretty much dead, but I’m still conflicted over whether I should or not. It’s actually my very first and only tumblr blog...  

4. Moving on

Part of what made this fun were some online friends I made along the way in creating these seemingly wild theories. I’ve lost touch with them overtime, but its a part of growing up in general, moving on with life. I’ve had so much fun also looking at others’ theories and looking at the asks. In fact, there were some that were like a revelation o.o, things that I had never considered. There was one ask which talked about how some of the organisations making contact with the RFA sounded like they were making desperate wishes 😮

Anyway, I’ve moved on. From Mystic Messenger. From Nameless, Dandelion. All of Cheritz I’m afraid. I was never interested in The Ssum from right when it was announced back in 2017, because first, it came out of nowhere, and I had doubt that it was connected to the previous games. Turns out... 

I’ll leave that there for you to figure out (don’t wanna risk spoilers haha).

But the biggest demotivator for dropping my blog has to be...

5. Cheritz’s declaration that the story of Mystic Messenger was up to interpretation

That particular post shook me. Starting from Nameless, Cheritz had established that their future games were truly something to look forward to, at least for me. It’s not just throwbacks or cameos, it’s within the same universe. The announcement of MysMe and introduction of Jumin’s character hooked me in right from the start. It was very exciting back in the past. But now, it’s just... eh. Cheritz appears to want to please everyone. Apparently, the Mysme fandom that hadn’t played Dandelion or Nameless were angry that they had to check out the two to understand the story of Mysme which was why Cheritz had made that post (don’t quote me, even I’m unsure of whether this is true or not 😶 But if Cheritz had to make a post like that, it must mean something)

Ultimately, I actually hadn’t even started V’s route nor got a satisfactory ending with Saeran. Their routes were a big surprise, and I felt it got messy quick. When I looked at the story of Mysme at face value (so looking at it independently without any connection to the other games) and paired with other people’s perspectives of Saeran’s and V’s routes based off screenshots, I found there were some inconsistencies regarding the characters and their point of views of events. And if that’s at face value, then there’s just no way I’ll be able to, well, make connections between the games. And the fact that Jumin’s got a route based off a bad ending... well, more profit is good I guess? They are a company after all  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Ultimately, if there are inconsistencies, paired with the fact that Cheritz says that the game is up to interpretation... what, then, is considered canon or a theory?  

If you’ve read this far... nah, there’s no way haha.

6. Just some rambling (my own thoughts, feel free to disagree of course)

I feel like Cheritz has made a mistake. By saying that Mysme can be interpreted in any way, only to connect the Ssum back to Mysme, and killing Lynn Project. Dandelion and Nameless had a clear direction. Lynn Project could’ve had a direction, who knows? Both Mysme (any additional content after the main story, new routes etc) and the Ssum don’t feel like they have a clear direction, with how they’ve had to develop these two within either a tight time frame, or lacking storytelling and anticipation. 

Anyway, I’m not sure if people are still interested in the theories surrounding Cheritz games. If so, it’s really impressive their brains haven’t fallen out. Mine fell out a long time ago. Looking back at my theories, I have now understood how crazy I must’ve sounded to others haha. 

7. So what am I doing now?

At the moment, it’s still unclear on whether I should keep this blog up or not. It all depends. Although I doubt there are others following this blog to begin with (like, is there even a discord server for Cheritz fans on theories and headcanons?)

I’ve moved onto other things at this point: working for a living, learning art, checking out other otome games, Kdramas, and so on.           

Peace~ 

-cherrychipheart   

#cheritztheories #cherrychipheart #mystic messenger #mysme #nameless #dandelion #cheritz

[jonahh]

i loveeee jonah and i can’t rly think of a good question for u?? maybe like how did u feel abt the amy jonah breakup proposal scene in s6? i know it was sorta unpopular in the fandom as forced but i thought it was very sympathetic and understandable on both sides tbh

narratively speaking superstore actually hit the jackpot by getting canceled when it did, because if that had been the last we see of amy i don't think they could have salvaged it—or it would have been very difficult to, at least. i definitely had my doubts on a larger scale about superstore without america, and i still don't know that amy moving to california was the smartest plot move, but they weren't expecting to lose a lead and you work with what you have i guess

that being said! given that this was the in-universe route they chose, i do think that they pulled it off in a way that felt true to the characters. it's definitely brutal to watch, but it makes sense. of course amy is hesitant to make such a big, official step. even though it's jonah, and he's been around for a long time, and their relationship is great, she's been through this before and it completely derailed her from what she originally wanted in life. and so in her mind, there's always room for things to go wrong—whether that's in an immediate and catastrophic way or a slower, boiling-frog stagnation way. because of her circumstances, it's important to her that she have an easy escape route if that were to happen.

there's also the issue of the timing. i think that, if the circumstances were different and this didn't come up at the time of the move, it would feel less claustrophobic for her. but it's sort of an insane and tumultuous period, and adding yet another life-altering decision to the mix was definitely. not great.

jonah's view is completely different here. he pretty much sees them as already-married at this point, so it doesn't feel as daunting for him. this is where i do start to feel a little conflicted, so bear with me. on the one hand i do think he should have known better than to think this wouldn't be an added stressor for amy. like, obviously he's aware of her past, and the baggage/trauma she has regarding marriage. he's not adam, of course he's not adam, but who's to say he wouldn't fall into the same rut? he has a string of abandoned jobs behind him, and frankly not a whole lot of prospects. adam has a string of abandoned hobbies. amy's always been the one to take on the role of "adult" and frankly, as much as she (and i) love jonah, the relationship doesn't...look all that different. yes, true love, etc but she has kids and so she has to look at it from a practical as well as a romantic perspective.

the thing is, while he went about it in a way that was a little thoughtless and insane, jonah's also not in the wrong for wanting something more. i mean, the dude is moving across the country for her. they HAVE been together for several years, and they've known each other for several years before that. they are, functionally, a family, so it makes sense that he would want to make that official. and as solid as the relationship is, he just needs to know that she won't pull the rug out from under him suddenly—marriage seems like the most natural way to prove the stability of the relationship and soothe his neuroses. plus, in his mind, there's absolutely no chance he's going to be the one to leave. she's the reason he's stuck around for so many years, after all. but she has no way of fully understanding that without literally being in his head.

seeing him stand up for himself and set that boundary is cathartic. watching amy have to deal with the ultimatum is heartbreaking. marriage means two different things to these characters, and that's what makes the breakup so potent.

#fictionandmusic #also they both acted their ASSES off in this scene ben especially #however again. if they hadn't ended it after s6 it wouldn't have been a satisfying ending for them. the context is essential #.txt #nbc superstore #superstore #jonah x amy #jonah simms #amy sosa

[damnfandomproblems]

All Responses to 3855:

This will be the big post that includes all responses to Fandom Problem 3855. After this I will answer one final ask related to this and that will be the last response regarding that problem. All will be below the read more. If I find more in the inbox, I will post them individually.

The following responses came in on February 27th and will be numbered. Number 1 will be the last one that came in on this day.

1: Glad that the submitter of 3855 came to their senses and see that Mulan isn't trans. She is a historical figure who was a 100% biological woman. Submitter of 3855 was probably exposed to too many woke people. I feel bad for them. hope they find better people to learn from

2: Mulan is a historical figure in Chinese culture. She isn't just some Disney character that people can just make headcanons for. She is meant to be a 100% biological woman. So be respectful and just accept that she isn't trans, anon that keeps complaining that people won't respect their "headcanon."

3:

Tbh, the only correct response to the Mulan thing would be "that's not a fandom problem, that's a headcanon. Why did you even send it in?"

This blog is about venting frustrations with fandoms, everything that gets sent in will be critized by some people. Keep your headcanons to positivity blogs, unless you're trying to say "other fans are dumb for thinking otherwise"

Sorry you have to put up with this chaos, mod! I hope you'll get a nice long break soon :)

4:

Tbh, the only correct response to the Mulan thing would be "that's not a fandom problem, that's a headcanon. Why did you even send it in?"

This blog is about venting frustrations with fandoms, everything that gets sent in will be critized by some people. Keep your headcanons to positivity blogs, unless you're trying to say "other fans are dumb for thinking otherwise"

Sorry you have to put up with this chaos, mod! I hope you'll get a nice long break soon :)

5: the entire mulan thing starting from the submission itself was one big bait, stop taking the bait, christ. also to other anons, mulan is a woman willing to pretend to be a man but who ultimately and very comfortably returns to being a woman at the end.

(Mod note: It is hard to spot trolling. I have to see a pattern to be able to identify it.)

6: 710384943149285376 Mulan aside, being so enormously petty and childish that you'll immediately ban someone from a server just for floating the idea of a character being trans is a big yikes, it shows you can't stomach anyone with even remotely differing opinions (that's a good recipe for ending up in a tiny, tiny echo chamber), and it says a LOT more about you than anyone you're banning, pal.

(Mod note: The link takes you to the ask this anon is responding to.)

Here are the anon responses I received on February 26th or earlier with the newest being first:

1:

Have a strong feeling that the submitter is the same person who sent those responses as well.

Anyways, it always has been and always will be common for trans folk to feel seen by gender nonconforming characters, including cis crossdressing characters, that's not going away anytime soon (especially because canon recognition of ACTUALLY trans characters is even still pretty rare and even still not always handled as well as they should be).

However making the statement that a character IS trans despite it conflicting with their story, followed up with the twee annoying fandom person cliche of a bold inaccurate statement followed by "won't be taking any criticisms" is just looking to kick up a fuss. Followed by a whiny "fine i guess i just WON'T headcanon Mulan as trans now thanks guys". Like, as stated before, characters breaking gender norms is a thing, you're free to project on them but dictating that others do in the same ways that you do is annoying.

2: response to 3855 Saying Mulan is trans is culturally inaccurate

#response to previous problem #fandom problem 3855 #response to previous ask

[thepalmofyourfreezinghand]

I loathe cheaters I knew personally, I’ve been cheated on and it absolutely destroyed my life for a good couple of months. Uprooted absolutely everything. It was a horrible time and I’ve always been vocal about my dislike for cheating.

However… if Taylor cheated, or even if Joe cheated, or if they both cheated… I don’t know them. It doesn’t have anything to do with my life lol. I think it would suck, but I’m not going to stop being a fan of Taylor’s music or Joe’s acting over it. I mean, Taylor’s lyrics hinted to cheating WITH Joe and I’ve never let it cloud my judgment of the music… which tbh is what I’m here for anyway. Because I don’t know Taylor lol.

I think it’s just too easy for this fandom to forget we don’t actually know her. We know Taylor Swift the musician and Taylor Swift the celebrity. But we don’t know Taylor Swift the person. What she chooses to do in her own, private life has nothing to do with us. We can have our feelings about it but, like, idk. I don’t think there’s any reason to take it personally like some fans are doing with the Joe rumors, or some fans would do if it was revealed she cheated. It’s just not that serious.

(However all that to say, I’m still really disappointed in her regarding the whole m*tty thing because he’s just a nasty person. And she’s flaunting him, making it a public thing and an extension of her celebrity persona, so it doesn’t feel like prying for us to speak about it.)

I’m so sorry you had to go through that, anon. I hope you were eventually able to get over it without too many repercussions ❤️.

About the last paragraph I’m a bit conflicted, because whatever Taylor does in New York becomes public. Unless she stays in her home 24/7 or she lays veeeeeery low, people are gonna know what she’s doing. Whatever she does, she ends up “flaunting” it, whether she likes it or not, because people care and follow her around. And I don’t want her to hide away if right now she wants to be more open.

I have more problems with Phoebe bringing Matty onstage, for example, just as I’ll have more problems with Taylor featuring him on her music. I agree that right now she’s giving him a BIG platform, but she’s not doing it purposefully. The platform Matty gets is a reflection of Taylor’s fame, it’s not a consequence of Taylor putting him under a spotlight she’s purposefully shining on him (I don’t know if I made myself clear hahah).

But yeah, the result is the same: people know about him and about the stuff he’s done and it’s hurt so many fans.

I don’t have a solution, I’m just angry, sad, disappointed and annoyed. It’s all gonna blow over pretty soon, probably, but my admiration for her has been indented permanently.

#taylor swift #matty healy

[sydmarch]

I've been wanting to ask you this for a while, what do you think of the season finale? And who do you think is at fault? And how would you have written that fanfic you said you'd write in a post?

hi i finally have access to my laptop & have had a chance to clear my head enough to get around to answering this!! first off THANK YOU for asking bcus this is the kind of thing i could talk about for hours lol so let's get into it.

i think the s4 finale was a godawful ooc mess of poor writing & forced drama. even as just a season finale it's bad but as a SERIES finale?? worst series finale of all time and i say that as a fan of supernatural lmao.

in terms of who's at fault, this might not be the answer you want to hear but personally i felt like for a significant part of s4 (ESPECIALLY the finale) the characters were so ooc that my brain isn't able to engage with who's at fault in a watsonian/in universe way - the only ones i can see as at fault for all the bullshit that goes down are THE WRITERS because the characters started acting in ways that completely contradicted everything we knew about them.

quick sidebar from the characters to add that i feel like it was stupid to go for yet another version of the whole "team breaks up then reconciles" thing because they had already done that before.. although never with that big a split, so i guess it had the potential to be compelling if the spit hadn't felt so forced & if we had actually gotten a s5 to watch them reconcile.

pretty much everyone felt out of character to me in the finale but ESPECIALLY walter, paige, and sly. oh and FLORENCE it absolutely didn't make any sense for her to develop feelings for walter & that's not just the part of me who had hoped she would end up with sly talking.

the arguments and drama just felt so forced and unnatural like, you're really telling me the same walter who said to sly "your refusal to let go of the wonderment of childhood, how you look at the world with open eyes, your innocence is your brilliance, and anyone who tries to tell you any different is dead wrong" in a christmas car roll said in the finale "if you were a real man instead of a comic book reading baby boy you would’ve asked florence out ages ago"??? it does NOT make sense & i see no explanation for it other than poor writing & the writers trying to just force a conflict.

in earlier seasons it felt like when there was conflict between characters it MEANT something, it made sense with their characters, & it was satisfying to watch how it played out. an example sticking w the walter/sly dynamic for now - when sly was afraid to tell walter he was dating megan & walter was upset when he found out, only for it to turn out that walter was upset because he was worried about sly getting hurt and not because he didn't think he was good enough for megan like sly was worried about. THAT was conflict that's actually GOOD and MAKES SENSE, not some bullshit that doesn't fit with the characters we know and love like the finale split.

getting back to ooc moments in the finale tho - walter was totally justified to call out sly for bringing megan into the whole mess, but like sly would never do that in the first place?? i was floored that they had him bring up megan like that it was honestly disrespectful sly and megan. i remember in my liveblog while watching the finale i literally said "were the writers on crack" regarding that part and i still stand by that lmfao. they really just shit on sly's character to throw more drama into this mess.

i have to talk about paige as well here... in early seasons i always loved paige & felt like she got a lot of undue hate from the fandom in back then but come season 4 i can definitely see where some of that negativity was coming from. imo part of what made her go downhill was her already established negative traits coming out more often (like from the beginning paige has always had a tendency towards jealousness, pettiness, & idk if i should call it internalized misogyny or the writer's misogyny showing through her (like the "we should give it to a scent tracking dog who specializes in finding sluts" directed at stella in s2)) so those things i can fault paige the character for in the finale. even if i wish they hadn't chosen to exaggerate those traits, they do align with paige as we've seen her at her worst.

what i do fault the writers for completely wrt paige is how just like, mean they made her for no reason? and mean towards walter that just don't make sense when compared to how she acted with him in the past. watching paige go off on walter saying shit like "I wanna go to the beach without hearing marine biology facts or go to dinner without hearing about the inefficiency of putting parsley on the plate" had me feeling like who IS this woman and what did you do with paige? it didn't make any sense for her to be so frustrated with always having to do "genius stuff" and wanting to just do "normal stuff" sometimes when they had already known each other for years before they started dating, so like what exactly did you expect? their relationship was SUPPOSED to be grounded on the fact that while she wanted to help walter better himself, she loved him and understood him, and accepted his genius traits in a way no other non-genius really had before. but then throughout all of s4 it felt a lot more like paige was trying to change walter and turn him into someone she wanted him to be than it felt like she actually loved him for who he was.

of course to some extent paige was always working to change walter i mean, that was basically her job description, but in early seasons it never felt like she wanted to change him so much, or so selfishly, or in ways that weren't just to help him be more well-adjusted without actually changing him fundamentally. s4 largely left me feeling like what happened to the paige that wanted walter to be the best version of himself he could be while also embracing himself and everything that made him different? where's the paige who ordered fermented fish? my feelings about waige at this point are basically "they were one of the most ships of all time until they actually started dating, then it all went downhill". they had so much potential as a couple but the writers kept fucking it up & the finale was the ultimate fuck up on that front.

i don't really have many issues with walter's characterization in the finale other than what i've gone over already in this post but one thing that consistently frustrated me with his late seasons writing was how the writers would just let him stagnate. we'd have a whole episode about walter learning a specific lesson then episodes later he'd be acting exactly like he was before he'd learned said lesson. it felt like SUCH a disservice to his character especially with all the growth we'd seen from him in earlier seasons.

to name just one example - looking at a christmas car roll as an episode i love it & it's a very fun watch (despite the fact that to me it marks the point where the season starts going downhill because of the stupid dream that everyone made way too big a deal about lol) but it didn't really feel like it fit with season 4? it's something that really would've felt more at home in season 1 or 2. "walter learns to appreciate his team" is already a lesson that's been learned multiple times by now, it doesn't make any sense for him to even be in a place where he NEEDS to be relearning this lesson in s4. he should've been far past that but it's like the writers never allowed most of his character development to stick long term. i wish s4 had allowed him more room for actual growth instead of the same lessons repeated over & over again - it felt like he was more developed in earlier seasons & the writers brought him backwards which is such a waste of potential with him.

anyway that's enough about that because this is getting long & a bit off topic from the finale itself but i kind of had to go into my thoughts on s4 in general since they shape my thoughts on the finale so much lol. as far as fic, i had a few vague ideas planned about something with a canon-divergent retelling of the events of s4 tackling a lot of the things i mentioned above.

the most fleshed out idea i'd had in mind tho was one that, for the most part, stuck w the canon of s4 & still had the team split into scorpion 2.0 and centipede with the same people choosing the same sides. the idea started purely out of spite lmao in my mind i had to prove to the writers that ok, you really need the team divided? here's how to do that while writing it in a way that made sense, keeping the post split-teams the same, and WITHOUT fucking up everyone's characterizations. i never really wrote a rough draft but did come up with a bunch of bullet points and a kind of general outline for what i had in mind:

-paige is still upset with walter because yes - she can be petty irrational and jealous. so i'd let her get a little jealous, but i'd cut all of the stuff about "not wanting to do genius stuff all the time" and "emotionally you'll never be more than 16". basically i'd allow her to be jealous & petty but cut all the meanness & the end goal would be for her to actually ADDRESS her pettiness and jealousy by the time they reconcile.

so they would still break up but it would be partially about the jealousy and partially paige being upset/disappointed about walter lying more than anything else. instead of thinking that he'lll never mature emotionally, she'd feel like he isn't mature enough to handle their relationship yet. once we get to the part where the team/waige reconcile it can be based on both walter gaining some more perspective (i don't want it to sound like put all the blame on him here or anything - paige did a pretty shit job explaining the whole white lies thing and was pretty hypocritical about it but i blame that more on the writers trying to force drama than on her) and paige working on her issues too, especially jealousy. so by the time they get back together they're both more mature & prepared to be in a relationship with each other. i'd like to have him write her another love song & have him sing it for her right before they get back together.

-sly still gets rejected by florence & some part of him still blames walter but much less so than in canon. i'd get rid of all the "you made her fall in love with you/you stole her from me" nonsense and make it more like he's projecting his own issues with self worth onto being upset with walter. considering his primary arc throughout the season was around his self worth, what am i really doing with my life, will i ever find some after megan, etc, it would make sense for him to take the rejection poorly and lash out but not so much out of direct jealousy towards walter but more in a sense that he feels overshadowed by him, and envious of the fact that walter has paige while he doesn't have anyone.

the aftermath/reconciliation arc i imagine for sly would be more about finding his own sense of self worth without feeling like he necessarily needs to "find someone". but then i think i'd still have him find someone anyway because it'd be nice and he deserves it. as much as i shipped him and florence during early s4 i don't think i'd have it be her, more likely i'd invent a character for this.

-florence isn't romantically interested in sly OR walter. she sticks with walter on scorpion 2.0 purely because they're friends and they work well together (this would probably be something paige gets EXTREMELY jealous about & would be one of the things she spends a lot of time working through.) also because it'd be pretty awkward to join centipede after turning down sly. i never really figured out what i'd do with her after that, i feel like we didn't really get enough info in s4 about florence as a character rather than just like, florence as a plot device/source of drama. to be fair it's been a while since i last watched s4 but even looking through my old notes i don't have anything about like an arc i'd like to see for florence so i feel like i'm remembering correctly & there's just not a whole lot to go on.

i also wasn't able to come up with any reasonings for toby & happy to leave that i'm truly satisfied with lol. all throughout s4 i was just waiting for them to decide to adopt WAY sooner because i mean. it's the OBVIOUS choice for happy & absolutely ridiculous that they jumped through so many hoops & did all these fertility treatments. should NOT have taken her so long to realize she wanted to adopt.

if it were up to me i would've had happy decide she wanted to adopt as soon as she decided she wanted kids. so in this scenario maybe i'd have them already with an adopted kid & they decide to leave & be part of centipede because they're just stressed out from all of the drama. i don't feel like there's much i'd need to change with cabe here, it's obvious he'd stand by walter.

i was never able to really wrap my brain around ralph in this scenario maybe bcus i'm not good with kids lol but i was LIVID that they just left him out of the finale completely when he should've been one of the most important characters to take into consideration for something like this?? yes obviously ralph has grown up a lot since s1 but when the team split in the past how it would impact ralph was ALWAYS a big thing that was taken into account. he wanted paige & walter to get together so badly, he always wanted walter to be his dad (personally i always thought it was kind of dumb how that stuff was written - imo walter WAS his dad from early on. he doesn't have to be dating paige to be ralph's dad. the found family show needn't be so beholden to the nuclear family but that's a whole 'nother post!) and they just did not include him in the episode or even bring him up.

anyway this post kind of got away from me but that's pretty much the gist of my thoughts on the finale & what i would have done differently!

#sorry it took me so long to respond to this one i've been going through some shit but genuinely appreciate you asking & giving me the #opportunity to go off about all of this. much needed distraction to switch my brain into hyperfixation mode #cbs-scorpion-coffee-shop #ask #scorpion #cbs scorpion

[spinjitzuhottakes]

Lloyd Garmadon - A brief look at Shipping and Discourse

Right, figure I'd start off with a bang and light myself up like a firework on new years cause what better way to make my first discussion on this blog than be about Lloyd, one of the most discoursed characters to ship in this dang fandom.

Let me just say this.

I don't actively ship Lloyd with anyone. A lot of the opinions surrounding Lloyd in a romance makes it difficult for me to do so, its even more difficult when Lloyd is the character who gets shipped 90% of the time with a fan oc character. (No shame there if you do that, its just something I've very much noticed.)

However. HOWEVER.

I still have in fact, read and viewed fancontent which contains Lloyd in a romantic or sexual relationship. Some of that content does in fact include ships with the main cast, particularly the main 4.

And yes, some of this content is in fact in the universe of the show, not the movie (which tbh is a whole other topic that I probably will touch at a later point cause I have noticed things about the fandom and the show that were caused by the movie releasing)

Why is that?

Cause the art is really cute and the fanfic premise is really interesting or honestly really sweet.

Anyway.

My point is, is that while I don't actively ship Lloyd with anyone, I still have chosen to read and look at things that depict that sort of thing.

And some of those things? They were pretty explicit and sometimes I did feel the need to scroll and fastforward through the scene.

However I still chose to look at those of my own volition and not just because of the...well content. (not usually)

For fanfics, it was how the story was laid out to me, I was usually drawn to those things due to the premise, sometimes they were pretty grim and tragic in a way.

Why is that?

Something I will honestly admit is that when it comes to fandom fanfic as a whole, Ninjago is a fandom I don't really read E rate smut fics for, it's never been that sort of fandom for me. If I do read something mature or explicit here, it really is honest to god not for the pure 18+ content in there.

Cause good lord, some of those explicit fics honestly need a revision or three.

The fics and content I have viewed and found interesting, usually has to do in some regards to how Lloyd in a relationship (explicit or otherwise) would work and honest to god conflict.

Especially given how much we as the fandom remember the situation regarding the tomorrow tea.

Lloyd's situation with the tomorrow tea actually reminds me of a character in my favourite anime. But i'll get into that in a later topic that talks more about Lloyd's age.

Point is, Lloyd's situation is not really the first time I've seen this happen in media and is one of the reasons why shipping Lloyd is actually quite fascinating even if it gets seriously fucking annoying when I have to deal with fandom.

Now, heres the first hurdle, what about Lloyd's age. He's practically eight/twelve and morally its wrong to ship him.

So...i'm just gonna say this. I actually think to suggest something like that really does a disservice to Lloyd as a whole.

Something that has been stated as canon and what I feel was meant to always be implied by the creators is that when Lloyd used the Tomorrow Tea, He was infact permenantly aged up to be the roughly same age as the rest of the cast. He needed to become their equal storywise. It was basically their way of getting around the fact that they had no idea how to make Lloyd as a 8-12 year old reasonably fight his dad/the dark one and have it not seem seriously messed up compared to what would essentially be a teenager fighting him.

Which even though its less messed up, it still is messed up. Wtf destiny.

For reasons I may or may not also further address at a later date in the same talk about Lloyds age, I also honestly believe that Lloyd needing to age up to be same age as the cast was needed for his development and any concept that deletes or reverses that fact has to have a very good reason to do so, otherwise it just seems like they're reversing an essential part of Lloyds story.

And I enjoy exploring content that touches upon the result of that, because the conflict that can be drawn from that is really interesting! Especially if it has to do with romance!

However this honestly leads into the other elephant in the room. And something that gets reasonably talked about and I understand where the thought comes from.

The power dynamics between age and experiance can seem off and at times uncomfortable when it comes to Lloyd being shipped with any of the Ninja. I understand where people are coming from with that, particularly when it comes to pre season 8 to 10 interpretations of the team and Lloyd. Lloyd is very much still seen by a lot of people (and the fandom) during this time as the youngest in the group even though he is roughly the same age as everyone. (Like truthfully, if anything the youngest he'd be is Nya's age.)

Heck they even joke about it multiple times hilariously enough. s5 and s8 with the voice jokes?

Post s10 though? Its a lot more less of a thing. Aside from the occasional joke about Lloyd not knowing what a VCR is (cause he's the kid in the group you guys remember?.) The would be power dynamic and age imbalance between him and the others is less apparent and I'm pretty sure if someone came into the series post s10, they would only know Lloyd as being the leader of the ninja and the same age as the others and not as that gremlin kid from s1.

That's because that's how Lloyd has been developed into, He's in full context basically just like the others now, like what his movie form is (which is also another topic I'd like to talk about at a later point about how the movie changed the show in a few ways)

The only reason a lot of people think otherwise is due to the fact we have context of previous seasons that truthfully does affect us. A lot of people still see and H/C Lloyd as being a lot younger than the other characters and therefore its morally wrong to ship him with the other Ninja and if you do, you should burn at the stake.

But, that's dumb. Like really dumb.

Exploration of these topics is risky yeah and it can lead to some questionable things. But honestly it shouldn't be completely demonized. These sorts of things can act as a sort coping material for folks struggling on those issues.

It really isn't hurting anyone and if you say its harming you, than maybe you should ask yourself why you chose to read/look at the thing in the first place instead of blaming the person who made it.

Why would you eat the food if you know you hate the taste? Thats like asking for olives when you detest olives

Listen I'm not gonna lie...I've seen some questionable stuff tagged in the Ninjago tag and the fanfic section of ao3. But I knew not to touch it.

Why?

Cause I knew I wasn't for me.

This is a mindset I honestly wish a lot of people in this fandom could pick up. If someone is being a genuine threat to the fanbase then yeah, maybe there's a reason for concern.

However, someone shipping two characters together is NOT that reason. No matter how much you try to tell yourself.

- H.T

#ninjago #ninjagohottakes #Shipping Discourse #lloyd garmadon #ninjago lloyd #Discourse Dump #Antis #lego ninjago

[utilitycaster]

i think it's telling that so many of the responses to imogen's convos with liliana and laudna were 'this is kinda fucked up and i am fascinated by it and am enjoying it' and but the response to THAT was like 'STOP trying to make everything toxic, ugh fandom never should've learned therapy speak'. like. ignoring that's NOT what that is, people are pretty clearly interacting POSITIVELY with these moments but because what they're enjoying is the parts that are messy, that's somehow bad too???

YUP! There are definitely people who use therapy speak inappropriately, including about Imogen and Laudna, and honestly I pretty specifically avoided using the word "toxic" (or "codependent") about their most recent interaction, but like...there is nothing wrong with enjoying the relationship for being messy! A good deal of the people who are calling it toxic or messy are people who support it and enjoy it! A good deal of people who don't particularly like the relationship for being flat and bland and the conflict constantly fizzling out into nothing, myself included, perked up at yesterday's conversation! It was fascinating: Laudna went to comfort Imogen and told her she loved her, and Imogen's response was to say "oh, you love me? well then why did you go running off to Delilah the second we were apart? why did you lie to me a second time [Laudna did not lie to her the first time, which by now Imogen knows]?"

I don't actually think Imogen's opinions re: Delilah are inconsistent - I think she very specifically started becoming uncomfortable after encountering Delilah in the middle of the night in Whitestone (and I think Laura said as much on a 4SD too), and so her previous assertions about digging into their power sources are not hypocritical. However, yeah, I think we should talk about how both of the two big kisses between these characters are specifically Imogen trying to cut off an emotional speech from Laudna - I don't think it is intended as manipulation, but rather coming from a place of profound fear, but that's still something you need to deal with because this is now three pretty significant cases of kicking the can of conflict down the road and it's only snowballing. I think we should talk about how actually maybe it's valid that Imogen, who has had to make a lot of difficult decisions regarding her engagement with Predathos's power and could be risking losing her powers through her actions, is frustrated that Laudna hasn't done the same with Delilah, but neither of them are working it out. Imogen is letting an assassination of her mother go forward - and I agree with her choice - and Laudna hasn't done anything to extricate herself from Delilah in 30 years despite expressing interest early in the campaign. Imogen is about to lose her mother because her mother declared her reliance on a potentially evil power as an inevitability and wouldn't listen to her, and Laudna's now doing the exact same thing.

And on the other hand, again, Laudna hasn't lied to Imogen. Imogen cut off Laudna's angry, hurt, and extremely valid rant about being betrayed by Bor'Dor by asking to kiss her and so Laudna, trying to make Imogen happy, never worked out these feelings and they've just been building up. Laudna can't express her fears to Imogen because Imogen will demonstrably cut her off. If Imogen is disgusted by Delilah, and that's not going away, what does that mean? Like, is the love enough? I don't know? Could be, but not without actually having a means of resolving all of these extremely valid hurt feelings, and they don't have that. And maybe some of us would like to have some resolution, and are getting real tired of the particularly dim children going "uwu let me have my cottagecore stardew valley dream you all are such MEANIES let people like things" which. Again, if the fact that other people want different things from this relationship is genuinely preventing you from liking things, that's entirely your problem, because I like all kinds of things other people dislike. If you cannot stomach any dissent from your personal interpretation and perceive it as an attack, that says a lot of things about you and none of them bode well.

There is a deeply frustrating tendency that is not limited to this fandom, nor to discussion of Imogen and Laudna, to deny that traumatized characters can hurt other people. You see it with some of the dumber discussions of Ludinus that presume he is specifically a survivor of Aeor (valid as a theory, but unconfirmed); his (hypothetical) trauma does not negate how many other people's lives he's ruined. Percy is deeply traumatized but he did still introduce the gun to the world. Fjord is traumatized but had he willingly completed Uk'otoa's unsealing that would have caused untold damage. Astrid is traumatized but she's still done terrible things as a Volstrucker. FCG and Yasha are both traumatized and both were not even in control of their actions when they caused their worst harm, and they both feel terrible about what they've done. I mean, touching on this episode, it is not actually a contradiction to say both "Liliana is traumatized and has been indoctrinated by a cult and is a victim of said cult and genuinely believes she is doing this for Imogen's benefit" and also "Liliana is a fucking shitty mom." These are both true. This is what cycles of abuse and generational trauma look like. This is what that "blorbo-centered morality" is; suddenly when it's your favorite character they can do no wrong and every explanation becomes, instead, an excuse.

I've been talking a lot about the harassment in this fandom and it really is like...look, I don't know if this harassment is coming, from some of those partaking in it, from a personal trauma. I do not want to ascribe shitty behavior to mental illness, because some people are just assholes. But if it is - it doesn't make it okay! If you are lashing out and sending hate because you project a lot of your own trauma onto Imogen or your own relationships to that of Imogen and Laudna and you perceive every bit of criticism as an attack on you, guess what! You're being a fucking asshole by trying to hurt other people and it does not ultimately matter that it might come from a place of your own hurt and you need to stop.

I've been going off about this and related topics all morning and so I do want to step back and say that I believe this is a relatively small group of people with an outsized toxic impact. I do think that many people are enjoying the relationship for its complexity and unhealthy, messy aspects, that most people would love to read more Imogen meta that covers her as a whole, complex person and not as a tee hee just a silly guy girlfailure. But yeah, I think everyone is getting increasingly done with the group of people who throw a tantrum and retreat into the most idiotic See Spot Run-levels of conflict fantasies whenever there's actual grit and friction and mess in the relationship.

#answered #Anonymous #cr spoilers

[spinef0ryou]

I think it's a bit weird that people are getting so made about some peopld calling out bc for using lyrics like bitches and hoes in their songs. And some time ago someone brought up niko's chloroform joke and people got very mad (the joke turned out to be reference to something (?). Like some people are new to this music genre and cant possibly know everything bc might be referencing! And some people might even like just bc and listen to a completely different genre normally so theres no way everyone can be aware of everything. And i dont understand the logic that because so many other band use these misogynistic lyrics, it it okay for bc to use them as well?? (Tho i get the context in snake for example) but yeah, this is not hate i am just trying to have the discussion on this point of view as well🖤

my opinion on this whole thing is very much coloured from the fandoms i came from (slipknot, murderdolls, dope (who are pretty tame)) so i did think it (edit: the og callout) was weird. but i also saw that op’s blog and what they usually post about which shed some light on their perspective. (though i have Many thoughts about that fandom due to personal bad or neutral experiences with it. and that has probably coloured my view on this as well)

the chloroform joke out of context is pretty bad taste. within context it’s maybe funny. or gives you an inside joke kinda feel, but imo that’s why context is important (i’m an historian so i will scream about the importance of context until the end of time). if i’d never heard hollywood undead and just heard the joke then i’d be like wtf and try to find out. (the song is called dead bite and the lyric is ‘i know that we have never really met before, but tell me does this rag smell like chloroform’. i don’t know if it’s a reference or if the band made it up) and then when i know i’d be like. oh! joke referencing a band bc toured with! poor taste joke but eyyy i see the reference. (and even if i didn’t know that they toured together, hollywood undead are one of the biggest bands of the past twenty years, and that’s one of their more famous songs)

i do think modern cancel culture jumps the gun every time and especially with tumblr (and the rest of the internet but i’m usually here) being the way it is, things get blown up and mountains get made out of molehills. people do that and then when there’s an actual problem no one listens to them (or anyone) and it’s just a horrible mess.

and like i said: context is pretty important. we like to act like bc are a very new band because they are for a lot of people, but they’ve been together since 2013. internet and social media culture has exploded in the past decade, so even with the unlisted and deleted videos, there a lot of content of them out there (and those videos i think have been saved). eight years worth of content is of course not easy to get through but skipping over it or not being properly informed about the band doesn’t give someone a good position to air complaints from.

i think it was @bigsoftkatiedotpng who mentioned (i think it was cultural or social anthropology? i hope that’s right dude!) and growing up in a misogynistic society means some misogynistic things will filter to you without realising them. and to (i suppose) further that thought a bit, i think we forget that whilst bc do have a lot of pop punk and pop and emo aspects to them, they did start off as more of a nu metal band. nu metal was never exactly known for being especially feminist (to put it lightly), which actually leaves me surprised at the lack of songs calling a woman a bitch or hoe. and yeah. like you said, it’s not just bc who use that language. i’ve made a joke both here and on twitter about someone calling joel a misogynist that they should listen to the song bitch by dope whilst jokingly calling it a feminist anthem. breakups hurt and they suck and if it was instigated by one person cheating, of course there’s going to be strong feelings involved. but to get mad at one band for using that language but not others seems odd and a waste of time to me.

and a final note that you didn’t address but i haven’t seen other people talk about do i might as well talk about it here is that no one is putting bc on a pedestal and saying they can do no wrong. the response to someone calling joel a misogynist was to go heavily the other way, not because we don’t think he can do any wrong, but because he continuously gets shit for no reason and it’s unfair on him. the worst example i’ve seen was someone on the youtube comments of an interview from when they got back in finland after rotterdam where someone said they thought he was on drugs because he was fidgety. they didn’t back down even after the interviewer got involved and said he wasn’t. that hit more than a few nerves with a lot of people. also, considering that substance abuse can common with adhd, it can be an extra insult for some. another example was him reposting things to his insta story of like. fan stuff. and some of the insta fandom got the Big Mad about it and saying things that amounted to ‘she looks fifteen so that’s a bit dodgy’

#answer #anon #blind channel #i am very sorry for clogging the tag #i probably didn’t need that final point but i don’t wanna clog the tag with too many posts so it’s just my thoughts here #and i actually think this fandom has been pretty good in regards to conflict because all of the lyric ops posts responses were less attacks- #- (apart from a few initial posts. myself perhaps included.) but more trying to debate instead of fight #edit: some of the last paragraph was incorrectly phrased and that has been dealt with #edit: also i’m fixing typos as i see them cuz i wrote this lying down on one arm

[stellocchia]

I think it's been more than two months since I pushed my "Wilbur is remembered far more competent than he is" agenda in your asks.

So let's rectify that, shall we?

Wilbur is pretty fucking incompetent. He's never been that amazing charismatic smooth talker we characterize him as (not that I'm not absolutely behind that too)

Like. Who did he ever successfully smoothtalk? The Lmanbergians? None of them were ever hesitant to join from the very beginning and Eret betrayed them pretty easily when Dream manipulated them.

Techno? Techno wanted to join them, he was the one who reached out to them. There was no convincing needed and Wilbur never convinces Techno of anything Techno wasn't already willing to do by himself.

Dream? Definitely not during the revolution and Dream's support during Pogtopia was Dream following his own agenda, not being influenced by Wilbur in any way.

He couldn't even get Quackity to let him into Las Nevadas.

Nah, the only person Wilbur ever smooth talked is TommyInnit. The fucking powerhouse of this cell. And even that's not completely true. Tommy hasn't been convinced by Wilbur of anything since the very beginning of the Lmanberg revolution. Not during Pogtopia. And not even now (it's not smooth talking if it's just exploiting mental exhaustion and trauma and all that. Tommy isn't convinced of what they're doing.)

Really. Not even Tommy, per se.

He just got Tommy extremely loyal and attached to him.

And honestly, that's all he needs.

You don't need to have influence over everyone, you just need to have strong influence over the right person.

And that's what Wilbur had and has.

Wilbur's accomplishments are just pretty much him having a vision and Tommy throwing himself at it to make it come true.

Wilbur had the idea for L'manberg but Tommy was the one leading the troops. Tommy was the one who negotiated for their independence and got it when Wilbur was negotiating their surrender. Tommy was the one who FOR NO REASON built the escape tunnel they escaped through when Dream blew up L'manberg and he was the one who built the lil panic room at the end. Tommy was the one who's home became the embassy to L'manberg (something Wilbur very much pressured and kinda manipulated him into btw. I'm never not gonna mention that lil detail when the embassy comes up)

Wilbur had the idea and stood around looking pretty. My guy literally stood around looking pretty, without armor, during battles. Just. I love him.

And let's not forget that Tommy was fckin great at being the general. The SMP was so much better equipped and still, L'manberg was kinda winning. To the extend that Dream saw the need for TnT (which was hidden) and the betrayal through Eret (which was hidden)

Dream felt the need to pull two deceitful moves to keep if not even gain the upper hand.

If I'm not mixing stuff up here, correct me if I'm wrong.

And stuff like the tunnel weren't even expected of Tommy. My boy just thought of that on his own and did it on his own. Noone knew it existed. Noone expected it to exist.

After independence Wilbur is implied to have been leading but he generally wasn't around too much. Tommy was keeping order in the more face to face kinda way. He tried to navigate people's personal conflicts and make sure things didn't escalate and just. He did so well.

And Pogtopia? Oh, Pogtopia.

It's a bit more difficult here, since they were no longer on exactly the same side and goals are more muddled but still.

(and I want to make it clear that I'm in no way trying to shame Wilbur for mental health issues or anything. This isn't about that. I'd never fucking even imply that)

Tommy kept morale high. He made sure that other people were fine, when there was a chance. He tried to reassure Wilbur when Wilbur was spiraling, he asked Tubbo if he was happier, he told Tubbo to be safe, he recruited Quackity when he saw the chance while making sure that Quackity's intentions were sincere enough (he didn't just naively offer Quackity a place in Pogtopia and risk it being a trap).

He avoided any kind of destruction to L'manberg as much as possible.

He rallied people.

Really, his one actual flaw was not "turning" on Wilbur. His unwillingness to give up on him or even just incapacitate him or limiting his ability to act as he wanted was what ended up costing him everything. His unwillingness to interfere with Wilburs plans beyond talking to him and threatening him with a crossbow that one time ended up making the 16th possible. And he can hardly be blamed for that.

And Wilbur, during Pogtopia... Well... Nobody liked him, he made everyone uncomfortable and most people just kinda tolerated him because... Yeah...

Without Tommy troop morale would have been abysmal thanks to Wilbur. He constantly put himself and his side down, labeling them as villains and thus morally inferior. He pitted his own people against each other, spread paranoia between his people. No communication or actually planning involving other people. Still refused to wear armor.

And don't get me wrong, that's the point. He wasn't on their side. Obviously Tommy added more to their victory, Wilbur didn't want their victory. But still I just wanna praise my boy Tommy, he was. So amazing. Boy fucking peaked.

He's so good in tactical warfare or whatever you call it.

And I wanna just make it clear that this isn't criticism of Wilbur. Not at all. This isn't criticism at all. This is just about the big fanon perception of Wilbur as this great and mature leader.

Tbh this is actually more about showing people how amazing Tommy was and PLEASE I WANT FICS TO HAVE TOMMY BE MORE OF AN EFFECTIVE POWERHOUSE

Regarding my former ask I just wanted to clarify again that I'm not trying to critique Wilbur or anything.

It's really just that I think it's hilarious how people remember him as way more put together and competent than he really was.

-

Yeah, honestly one of the biggest disservice people have done to c!Tommy in this fandom is fail to portray him as the badass general that he actually was. Like, sure, Wilbur's title was as "general", but he never did anything for it. He gave a few speeches, but then the work was left up to Tommy. Like, genuinely, rewatch the Eret betrayal vod, Wilbur says it openly that he's leaving it in Tommy's hands. And Tommy does manage to lead his troops into an advantageous position! They get their enemies to retire at one point during the very first battle!

Then, of course, there is the betrayal, but, once again, Tommy didn't give up. He built the tunnel for their scuffed escape beforehand and, when everyone was just about ready to give up, he went against Dream in a duel and then traded the discs for their independence without loosing a beat.

Tommy was a BIG asset during that war!

Wilbur mostly was and still is kind of a wreak. And it's not his fault, 'cause mental health is an absolute bitch and he wasn't doing too hot after the war, then it got worse with Pogtopia and even worse during the 13 years in Limbo. And now we are where we are now with Wilbur being... not a great individual.

But still! In Pogtopia Tommy was the de-facto leader. And yeah, that was because Wilbur wasn't on their side anymore, but they didn't entirely know that. Or didn't wanna see that.

Tommy himself was hoping that Wilbur would "come back around" if he managed to get back their country. That was a big motivator for him. And he did everything that was in his power to do to not lose either Wilbur or L'Manburg. He tried talking to Wilbur multiple times, tried persuading him that there was another way, he never bought into Wilbur's ideals, he recruited people and he lead the troops once again. It wasn't Techno that lead the troops (despite him being a much better fighter) it was Tommy. And once everything was exploded and Techno and Wilbur betrayed them? Well he kept encouraging people. Literally I'm begging everyone to watch that vod! Tommy was there at every step of the way, telling Niki that it wasn't over, telling Quackity to keep fighting and, after that, you know who was there to validate Tubbo's presidency? To rally people behind him? It wasn't Tubbo. Tommy gathered everyone by the L'Mantree and got their spirits high once again.

He is just genuinely amazing.

And, like, yeah now Wilbur managed to manipulate Tommy to an extent to be by his side. But that's not that much of an accomplishment anymore because Tommy has just been through so much that he's exhausted now, as you said. Like, remember when Tommy said he wanted to be on Wilbur's side because "he gets things done"? Well, I'm still waiting to see that one honestly...

#ladycatland ask #dream smp #tommyinnit #c!tommy #c!wilbur critical #<< just in case #long post #character analysis #tl:dr #the fanon interpretations for tommy and wilbur are often a reverse of canon #tommy is made to be a lot more incompetent and in need of help while wilbur is made a lot more competent and in control #I wonder why that became the case?

[o-wyrmlight]

Okay I've been home for like 4-5 hours but I got caught up in playing the new Kirby game and got all the Waddle Dees and gem stages of the first world so let me see if I can uhh. Y'know. Explain my thing with Affogato.

So I've been rather aware of the fact that my interpretation of Affogato himself is a lot less about Affogato as a character and moreso in regards to how he is in relation to Dark Cacao. Of course, Dark Cacao's probably my favorite Cookie Run character, so that's sort of a given--but then I sort of started thinking a bit more into depth about why that is.

After all, my interpretations of pretty much any other character is rather complex. Madeline is conspiring against the Republic to take down its corruption, Dark Cacao is dealing with the repercussions of generational trauma and complicated grief, and Pure Vanilla even has the trauma of losing his kingdom and his family, having to deal with that while trying to keep himself as put-together as he possibly can be. They have their own individual character that defines them, and isn't necessarily canon, but it's interesting enough for my brain to latch onto.

Affogato, meanwhile, sort of doesn't have that in my AUs. Canonically he's a largely manipulative person, capable of using charisma and words to sway his way into the good graces of places he ought not to. And for a while a part of me was wondering whether or not it's because I'm not very good at writing manipulative characters--half of my brain fumbles with trying to find a way for them to justify their manipulation tactics to themselves, and make it seem like they have no choice--but perhaps that's not entirely the truth. A part of it, yes, but not entirely.

After all, I like Manipulative Madeline a lot. He's a very self-driven character. So what's the difference between him and Affogato, when canonically Affogato is a manipulator and Madeline absolutely isn't?

So it's sort of at this point that I come to realize that all of my character interpretations actually have characters outside of themselves. The dynamics exist but it isn't what them or the story centers around, and that's largely aided by the fact that it's essentially also how it is in canon. Affogato doesn't really have that luxury--the vast majority of his character is defined as a contrast against Dark Cacao, so I feel we don't really know who he is on a personal level, and as such, it's difficult to figure out what his character is.

It's the same issue with Caramel Arrow, I feel. We have a blueprint of how these characters exist and what their motivations are, but it's rather basic and both of them revolve around a person--that person being Dark Cacao. While there's nothing wrong with that, it's hard to come up with an interpretation that stays loyal canon or takes an aspect or two of them and twists it on its head in an interesting way.

As an example, I saw how the fandom treats Madeline largely like a lovable doofus golden retriever sort of person with narcissistic tendencies and a heart of gold, and then I thought: 'What if that was a cover-up?' And from there, I worked on his personality, his backstory, and his belief system to make the blueprint for a story that I genuinely believe is very, very interesting.

And with Pure Vanilla, I saw a sweet cookie with a heart of gold who can do no wrong and doesn't like conflict and thought to myself: 'I know cookie descriptions imply that the ingredients of a cookie influences their personality, but I feel like it'd be interesting if Pure Vanilla is sweet and kind not because that's how he's made, but because that's how he CHOSES to be.' So now I have a stressed king who doesn't take praise well, loves too much to the point of self-neglect, and is perpetually teetering on the edge of losing his shit.

The pont being that with those two characters, there were traits that I could take and then subvert--ways that I could change them in an interesting manner without making them unrecognizable. What do we have with Affogato? What do we have with Caramel Arrow?

Affogato is implied to have had a rough life. He's manipulative. He wants the crown. That's kind of it. What kind of subversion can you do with that? How much context can you gleam?

Caramel Arrow is fiercely loyal to Dark Cacao. ... That's kind of it.

It's. Mmn. Difficult for my brain to write characters like that, it seems. When I think of Affogato reacting to situations, some part of my brain feels flighty in an uncertain way, because I don't really. Know. How he would react to certain situations. I don't know how I'm supposed to perceive his character. The only things I can glean for my AU is a) He genuinely wants to do good by cookies, b) he had a difficult childhood, and c) the different-ness of Bittersweet's kingdom is an odd sense of comfort.

But like. After that comfort and that loss of interest in taking the crown, what is there? Sort of nothing. So I'm like. Hmm. The story becomes less about Affogato in Bittersweet's world and more about Affogato trailing along after Bittersweet while Bittersweet has a lot of his own shit to deal with. That just. Doesn't seem. Interesting and seems like a disservice to the potential that Affogato could have. But without having an idea for what would motivate his character outside of the crown and comfort, it's difficult to figure out how to give him more plot relevancy and conflict.

Idk I'm probably rambling at this point but ah. Just some thoughts. Smth prompted me to bring this up earlier today but it is legit something that's been bothering me for like a month or so.

#bittersweet friends au #ramble i guess

[grewlikefancyflowers]

I think something that a lot of people in this fandom seem to misunderstand about WWX's conflicts with LWJ in his first life (regarding his use of guidao) is that it could not have been resolved if LWJ had just ~talked about his feelings~ - ie, made it clear to WWX that his concern was primarily for his wellbeing, because LWJ cared for him.

Setting aside for now the fact the LWJ had very good reasons not to speak more openly about his feelings (towards WWX), and in Ch.62 never indicated to WWX that he wanted to punish him, and stated very clearly that he did not want to denounce him.

WWX's response would not have changed. He would still find LWJ's belief that he could lose control just as offensive, he would still be set in his view that guidao is the only option available to him, and still have no interest in explaining to LWJ why that is, nor be interested in exploring some other option. Primarily because WWX knows there isn't one, but also because (and I think this is something this fandom struggles with) WWX is proud of his cultivation. True, it is not the path he would have chosen, but it is the path he's on and he is not, and refuses to be, ashamed of that.

There's also the issue that due to WWX's (lack of) understanding of his own sexuality at this point in his life, LWJ revealing his romantic feelings for WWX would definitely not have helped. Taking into account some feedback loop of comphet & JC's homophobia, it might even worsen their relationship. Regardless, WWX definitely isn't going to suddenly realise & understand his own feelings just because LWJ revealed his. Even if he did, WWX's position would not change.

Hopping back to my previous point about LWJ having good reasons not to speak more plainly, I do think LWJ understands that too. He of course does not have a complete insight into the situation, but he does understand that 1. WWX is not interested in men (as he told him in Xuanwu Cave), 2. WWX stated very clearly that he is willing and able to pay whatever consequences guidao has for him, 3. WWX responds to LWJ's pushing by communicating to him that he considers him an outsider, that WWX's personal matters are not his business.

Of course, LWJ making it clear that he cares for WWX does not necessitate revealing that his feelings are romantic, but 'I wanna be fwends now' is a pretty weak position for him to take, and isn't gonna convince WWX any more than anything else is.

And it's not as if post-BM WWX is suddenly disinterested in LWJ—he still pursues his attentions just as desperately as before. This isn't a WWX who's had enough of LWJ saying they're not familiar & has finally given up on the idea of friendship with him—we can see from WWX's later actions (throughout Phoenix Mt hunt, in Yunmeng, in Yiling) that this is not true. The crux of the matter is, regardless of any level of familiarity between them, WWX is entirely assured in what he's doing and is not interested in— either out of genuine desire or just to indulge LWJ—exploring any alternative to using guidao. Even in his second life once him & LWJ are close, WWX is not interested in confiding in him about his golden core or his reasons for turning to guidao. There were many opportunities once he got Suibian back, WWX continues to keep these things to himself.

Sure, LWJ could have handled that situation more tactfully, but doing so would not have actually changed anything, WWX and LWJ were at odds over this not because of some miscommunication, but because they held fundamentally different positions at this time, that could not be reconciled.

#mdzs #rambles #i havent rlly seen anyone discuss this yet ?? #and also bc i was reading a fic that i was otherwise enjoying until it got to sunshot era and wwx was like #🥺 omg you care about me 🥺 ok i guess i could go back to gusu with you 🥺 #and i had to smash that back button #also something relevant that i couldn't squeeze into this post is that in his second life during the tenderness arc wwx had plenty of #opportunities to give lwj an explanation as to why he turned to modao #suibian is right there being a whole elephant in the room #and it's not incidental that the evil arc precedes the tenderness arc like that #(ughdhdhfsdk evil-tenderness arc my beloved) #anyway the point is they are at this level of familiarity and wwx is still not interested in confiding in lwj abt his golden core #wx being close or lwj being nicer wouldn't make wwx honest with him abt this