#bc byler endgame is already happening

[chirpsythismorning]

I'm not going to say we should take every single thing official Netflix accounts post as gospel, because obviously they are not run by the Duffer Brothers themselves.

But to be clear, these people are hired by Netflix and there's more to it than just random interns scheduling posts. The people running these accounts are not the same people designing the posts made there, just like the people designing those posts have higher ups telling them what to do/not do in terms of the content they are creating. And there are plenty more levels that go beyond that, which eventually does lead to the Duffers and producers of the show, who do have a stake in how the show is promoted on a basic level to best align with their intentions and all the revelations still to come.

It is common knowledge that the Duffers work with Netflix marketing directly on a consistent basis to get their vision across, and that carries out in promotion with posters, merchandise, social media, etc., because it's really important in ST case (with it being a show made by nerds that love easter eggs), that they foreshadow what is still to come outside of the show itself.

When it comes to social media, the core purpose of those accounts is to encourage engagement for Netflix's user base, ideally ensuring they tune in to whatever is being promoted (and more), but it’s also more than that, in that it’s even more based on data and other factors.

What this leads to is the people in those less major decision-making roles, like graphic designers, simply being advised what to create, based on the information and content they are given to work with.

And so these accounts going from promoting byler subtly for years, to blatantly posting about it post-s5, is actually very, very intentional, going beyond a simple Netflix intern. It’s orchestrated by those in management positions, being advised by those in the ST production to do things a certain way, so that when all is said and done, we are able to look back and find tiny little things that point to it.

Byler can't be something they NEVER talked about even once on social media, only to have them end up being endgame with them posting about it forever afterwards when it's all said and done. It doesn't work like that, at least not in ST case. We're talking about a production that costs hundreds of millions to make, as well as being the most talked about mainstream series of our generation.

They have an obligation to make their story feel not only satisfying on its own, but to also promote the show in a way that makes the viewer feel this whole well-rounded experience, outside of the show itself as well.

And so when ST came out in summer 2022 and Netflix Geeked was making posts about it non-stop, that wasn't a rogue, low-paid Netflix intern doing whatever they wanted. That was multiple people with a job given a task and following through with it at their advisers discretion. Regardless of where it ended up, it started at the top with the Duffers informing higher ups in marketing that Byler is something that will happen, along with other revelations that they want to inform marketing about, so they can take the steps to plan ahead and create content that matches the Duffer's vision, most often to act as a foreshadowing device for the story still unraveling.

Remember when Netflix Geeked made a post acknowledging that Will the Wise drawing in El's room back in s3?? A very well known byler easter egg that only we know about??? That wasn't some ga intern watching the show once and them spontaneously coming up with content to create related to that drawing and posting about it themselves. That was very likely someone associated with the show giving suggestions to marketing, with a few of them being very incriminating in relation to byler, but with most being casual in relation to the show overall.

Just like I said in this post about how Noah didn't tweet about byler or mention it multiple times at cons unprompted bc he was feeling quirky. He was being advised to...

And look what Netflix did to that tweet Noah posted that was clearly a stunt in an of itself.? They broadcasted it and made a cheesy ass edit out of it... And it's bc several people behind the scenes were advised to make content like that specifically.

I mean, if you actually look at how social media promotes byler (if and when it does), it's arguably in the exact way that the Duffers want it to be promoted?. Just enough. Not too little. Not too much. I would argue if the Duffers had no say whatsoever in how the show was promoted, then we'd either be seeing byler constantly or we wouldn't see them at all, instead we see social media sort of dance around it, which tells me they are following the exact approach the Duffers themselves follow... because they were obviously given the instruction to.

And so seeing an account like UK Netflix, an account that as of recent has really went all out with posting Queer content since Heartstopper released, has also notably made really incriminating posts about byler over the years, but especially as of recent. And that's in large part because of what I've stated, but also based on data.

If higher ups in marketing at Netflix know about byler, then they are very likely pushing people lower on the payroll, doing more simple tasks like graphic design and social media management, to make connections to ST with other shows like Heartstopper, Sex Education, Young Royals, etc. And this is because if byler IS going to end up being this huge Queer love story, data is telling them to make these connections sooner than later, so that the eventual revelation will be a smooth transition amongst other content just like it. This works in Netflix's favor at the end of the day, which is the whole point of all of this.

Not saying you should take the most casual of Netflix posts as byler endgame proof if that's what you're asking. But to say that these accounts have NO association with the Duffer's and ST directly, therefore we shouldn’t even appreciate anything they post if it points to byler, is sort of over-simplifying things.

It's not like s5 is gonna drop and all of these interns are going to be like OHHH okay now i'm a byler so i'll post about it... Going into s5 they're going to be making some very side eye posts and it isn't going to have anything to do with them being an intern without any say in things, its gonna be about them getting a task list and following through with it bc it's their job.

#byler #stranger things #whenever i see bylers just having fun appreciating a netflix post acknowledging byler #only to see another byler discouraging them bc it's not proof #i lose brain cells #bc like no shit it isn't proof #but it's still a small piece of the puzzle just like posters and trailer and merch and everything else in between outside of the show #it's not like these accounts are going to spontaneously start posting byler post-s5 bc they feel like it... #it goes beyond that... #the duffers themselves have said they worked with marketing to plan out foreshadowing hiding in the details of their posters... #all it literally takes is them telling one person high up in marketing #'hint at byler... make it subtle but not too subtle!' #and that's literally all there is to it #all it takes is a graphic designer reading off notes for what the creators want/expect and doing it according to their wishes... #that's it #q: where do you think they get the footage to create and post what they do? a: the ST production! #like lets use our brains here #so if you see a byler positive post from an official netflix account #go nuts #bc byler endgame is already happening #it isn't going to happen/not happen bc of a social media post acknowledging it #but that doesn't mean you cant celebrate and enjoy yourself while we wait

[enamouredless]

15 years from now the melvin domestics are gonna be craaazy like plates floating around getting smashed the couch levitating all bc mike went on a 2 week long fishing trip with his good old pal will

#this is a brokeback mountain reference btw #if byler isnt endgame yes it is bc there's no way mike and el would have a healthy relationship like 10 years down the line #mike would 100% turn into ted over time i mean its already happening

[jaegerisim]

Vent post y'all are gonna hate me for.

I viscerally hate how the Duffers treat most of their non white or queer characters and I hate even more viscerally, how y'all big byler blogs in your circle jerk of other 5 big byler blogs casually like to ignore many red flags the show has.

Y'all like to say: "tHe DufFeRs ArE gReAt WrIteRs" and it's like girl, who are you lying to??? They aren't top shit writers at all. The Duffers are pretty mid imo. Yeah, they run a good show that's fun to watch and theorize abt , but that doesn't mean they're good writers cuz they're not.

1. they completely side lined Will during s3 for the sake of their straight romances: lumax, jancy, mlvn, duzie and partly stobin (even if stobin wasn't endgame, thankfully, Steve's intentions were clearly wanting to date Robin and they gave it a lot of screen time). Will was sidelined bc he didn't fit the straight romance plotline bc they planned to make him gay or whatever. Now in s4 Will and his feelings have been used as mlvn toilet paper. Yes, we like to say this is build up for byler but canonically, Will's feelings have been used to clean the shit mlvn leaves behind.

2. Billy was sympathized a lot during the last 2 seasons. They gave him the sad backstoryTM in order for ppl to feel sorry for him. Billy's backstory is literally Jonathan's but whatever.

3. El's anger issues are constantly girlboss-ified. They down play her bullying situation and literally just use it for El to be a ''girlboss" without realizing how triggering that is. As someone who has lived bullying, seeing it be ignored by canon and fanon is super sad. The whole Rink-O' Mania experience must have been so traumatizing for her yet, everyone absolutely forgets abt it 🤷🏻‍♀️

4. Robin, Erica and Argyle are stereotypical characters. Robin is the quirky lesbian with social anxiety, Erica is the badass black woman and Argyle is the Latino stoner that sells weed to white kids and works as a pizza delivery guy.

5. Altho Argyle and Eddie both do drugs, (Eddie actually sells K-12 to a minor and nobody batted an eye. He has a huge fan base). Eddie is held in a pedestal bc "poor thing 🥺 he lives in a trailer with his uncle 🥺". Tell me a single fact you know abt Argyle that isn't "he smokes weed", "he is Jonathan's only friend", "drives a van" and "he works at a pizzeria". Exactly, Eddie is given a useless backstory and Argyle isn't.

6. Dustin stopped being important to the plot sometime around s2 and s3. He is only there to curse and be mildly funny. My guy needs to hangout with ppl his age cuz he only hangs out with seniors.

7. El needs to stop having so much "I'M THAT BITCH" screentime like I need in s5 for El's arc to not just be her becoming more powerful and falling in love with Mike. I need the Duffers to explore her trauma and problems.

8. Angela should have been run over by the van.

9. Patrick should have been given a backstory that isn't the basic "strict black parents that hit their kids cuz they are a disgrace". Patrick's backstory is actually racist af, fight w the wall.

10. As Lex already said, they didn't trigger tag the ep where Jason and his friends assault Lucas and Erica. Like wtf? Why was that necessary? Why did I have to see a black boy being held at gunpoint by some white guy?? Was it relevant to the plot?? I don't think so. And then I've got to see ppl online be like "Jason wasn't that bad. He was just mourning" like bitch you can stfu. This is what happens when you make the racist assholes conventionally attractive.

Also the fact that Lucas's arc is fulfilled by him fist-fighting Jason and "embracing his weirdness" aka accepting he is black. His arc was not fulfilled at all cuz that ending spoke so loud to me. It showed how little empathy ppl have towards the struggles poc ppl living in the Midwest have. Y'all circle jerks can only see racism when it's super obvious.

Furthermore, parents complained when ST showed "an excessive amount of smoking" yet nobody batted an eye when Billy tried to run over Lucas, when Erica (an 11 y.o ffs) was chased by white kids or when Lucas was held at gunpoint by Jason.

All of this happened while they focused on Max's guilt and mourning that, yeah, are important but certainly not less important than racism!!!

11. In s3, they gave us that whole Nancy vs The Bigots arc that was honestly just triggering and useless. It didn't help Nancy's character at all, quite the opposite it put unnecessary angst.

12. Lonnie being presented as an abuser just for him to never be spoken of again. Can we please get to explore the trauma he left the Byers's with?

13. The fact that both queer relationships are considered "sloppy seconds" is extremely sad. Both Vickie and Mike are rebounding from their failed relationship with Robin and Will. These 2 ships have caused more commotion than Jancy and Jopper together! (These last ships are technically sloppy seconds too but everybody forgets that. Shocker!!)

14. Last but not least, ppl blame Argyle for being the one to get Jonathan into smoking weed as if Jonathan probably wasn't the one looking for it. Let me tell you, that you only find weed if you look for it.

#P.S: I'm gonna pay attention to how many ppl send me hate bc of this or block me #stranger things #lucas sinclair #st vickie #robin buckley #jason stranger things #will byers #dustin henderson #eddie munson #argyle #jonathan byers #erica sinclair #byler #← target audience #byler target audience

[livsmessydoodles]

thinking about this scene today

this scene alone convinces me that byler is endgame bc you cannot make will actively say that hes not gonna fall in love and then write a whole plotline abt him being in love with mike.... just for it to not be reciprocated???

will is the only party member who's completely unexperienced with romantic relationships, which of course has to do with the fact that he's gay in the 80's, but this is a TV show. all of this is fictional so they can take whatever route they want with these characters, and making will continue to stay alone and suffer through unrequited love would be awful storytelling, especially when people claim that will moving on from his feelings would bring character development and growth.

wills feelings for mike arent there just to "show his growth". weve seen this kid go through hell and back yet even with everything kicking him down he stays strong and kind. hes the most selfless character in the show and always puts others needs before his own. in s4, they put a lot of emphasis in these character traits of his, and they're always picturing his love for mike as something selfless and pure.

now if his feelings are not reciprocated, how does this teach will a lesson that leads to character growth?? he already doesn't expect anything. life has shown him time and time again that he always gets the short end of the stick, why would he think this is any different?? making him have feelings for his best friend just to get rejected would just be a nail in the coffin, reaffirming to him that no matter what hes not worthy of ever getting what he wishes. this isnt character growth at all.

but if his feelings ARE requited, that gives us a twist to the story we havent seen. we would get to see actual growth for will, him learning to give himself value and realize that he DOES deserve happiness!! instead of leading into the expected spiral of bad things keeping up the consistency with everything else that has happened to will so far, finally giving him one good thing leads to us seeing a shift in his whole nature, and wed see him dealing with things he hasnt dealt with before!!! GROWTH!!!

besides why would they make such an intricate complicated storyline.... just to lead to a rejection we all saw coming? the GA expects him to get rejected. his feelings not being reciprocated would not be any surprise. but twisting those expectations in a way to shock the GA AND give wills character the happiness he so deserves after being through so much..... now THAT would be world shattering and a satisfying ending to both the viewers and will himself!!

this scene establishes a clear subversion trope, making us aware of how will believes he's never finding love, just for the show to later on subvert expectations and reward will with the love he deserves and never thought hed get🫶

#long post wow sorry #i was just thinking about this scene and then remembered a thread id made on twt a couple months ago and. basically redacted it #i just think this is so important and its solid evidence that we often look past #the duffers have been setting this storyline for a while. the buildup is all there #i doubt theyd just push all of that aside to stay with the same ol boring het couple who honestly even the GA is tired kf #😭😭😭😭 #ANYWAY #i like doing think pieces i might do more eventually #byler #stranger things #will byers #mike wheeler #byler analysis #st4 #stranger things 5 #mike wheeler x will byers #will byers x mike wheeler #will and mike get on the petri dish #liv rambles

[sterlingarcher23]

Max's memories are forshadowing: ElMax & Lumax

Inventive foreshadowing creates a sense of unity in a story even when the audience may not be consciously aware of the foreshadowing and payoff., David Trottier

Sort of. The happy memories actually give us the basic structure of Max's character arc in regards to relationships in Season 5. (As far as there is scene material because I think there's something else.)

Now the first thing is Lucas & Max from S4, but then they start to show us several scenes but completely out of order.

Lucas "I'm right here" (at her bedside - S4 or 5?), Swallowing the red Skittle/the ghost like Pac-Man mid flight ("You were wearing that yellow benny's burgers t-shirt and it was so big it almost swallowed you whole")=consumption of a ghost, followed by the linking sequence, going back to S2 apso out of order, the boys meeting the killer & Lucas and Dustin teaming with Max, the ghost trap, photos of ElMax, like frozen in time (Doctor Who=single moment in time). Lucas and Max when he calls her Madmax (like Mad Max Rockatansky), again ElMax together ....

...even Mike appears (a talk between him & Max like Kota and Lucy having a conversation?), foreshadowing the movie date, ElMax hugging, Lumax not unhappy and, Highfive! Winners.

Lover in the mind - lover in the physical world.

Lucas speaks to the dying (physical), El speaks to the going (mind).

Both have patterns that need another verse in order to rhyme bc of a tiny change midway through (similar to a certain D&D bridge puzzle😉)

Elumax Endgame.

Byler on the left, ElMax on the right, both when Will or Max respectively, have their possession phase.

Oh, and the movie date scene is a basic story writing technique: a promise. And this needs a payoff. The question isn't IF but HOW. (And how you get abilities is been established in Season 4.)

It's you and me won't be unhappy.... Promise, progress, payoff.

So, they made a promise, are now (with the revival) in the process of a progress which will be added through the way how Max will wake up....

...and this will get a payoff. Simple. Right now, most can't imagine how, given the circumstances even though the writers gave us the rules for doing it and every foreshadowing possible that will lead to a payoff. Max can't feel nor see - both! So, either both will be mended or none. Excluding one is bad writing. - So, its both. We learned how, therefore it's not a Deus ex machina, and we will learn why. Max only needs to take his, I mean her medicine. Darn pronouns.

That payoff is only possible through ElMax and note how they use sequences with them in which they are physically close to one another after the mall scene in which they link, like they are...inseparable.

Here separated...

...after this they are combined. Linked. "Love goes through the stomach"

It's all One and One for all = 11

A bit dated (admittedly)

#max mayfield #elmax #stranger things #el hopper #elmax nation #elmax my beloved #elmax supremacy #elmax is endgame #stranger things analysis #elmax is real #elumax #lumax #lumax endgame #max x eleven #eleven and max #byler

[booksandpaperss]

“I’m just a little worried that Mike has to have a whole gay realization arc all in the last season”- YALL. PAY ATTENTION THATS WHAT HES BEEN DOING THIS WHOLE TIME:

Season 2: Mike is unaware of what his feelings mean but knows how much he cares about Will, legit spends the whole season being in love with him. By the end at the showball he realizes that somethings up, he doesn’t rlly understand what but he can tell something feels different and he doesn’t like it. Cue part 1 of his realization arc; subconscious denial

Season 3: Subconscious denial is rapidly turning to conscious denial, and at the start of the season we see Mike is in part 2 of his realization arc; a severe case of internalized homophobia. He cycles through it all the way to his absolute lowest point in part 2 (rain fight) and then he slowly comes back from it just a little bit. Then, at the end of the season, we see Mike shift onscreen from part 2 to part 2.5; conscious realization and fear. At this point Mike is halfway through his internalized homophobia arc. He KNOWS how he feels, but it still terrifies him. He grapples with this in the time period between s3 and 4.

Season 4: Ah yes, the penultimate season. The season that sets up endgame. The season that has an *entire gay road-trip plot line dedicated to byler*. This season is part 3 for Mike; acceptance. At first glance you miss it if you’re not looking, since s4 byler was almost entirely from Will’s lovely but very biased POV as he was also going through his own gayangstTM arc at the same time, but all it takes is a second glance to see that it’s there. At the start of the season Mike is on the very last, very flimsy legs of denial, and reuniting with Will again after not speaking for months is what catapults him into the acceptance chunk of his arc. In almost every cali crew scene, we see Mike slowly get closer and closer to total acceptance. We see him accept that he doesn’t love El the way he’d originally thought, he accepts that he loves Will the way he thought he was supposed to love El, and by the van scene, Mike is soso close to accepting that both of these things are okay.

Close being the key word here. Will accidentally throws him off again in volume 2, so Mike’s realization arc isn’t fully concluded yet, things are still very messy and season 5 has a lottt to address. But that’s the THING; season 5, as far as byler goes, actually only needs (for the most part ofc) to address development and realizations that have already happened. A lot of the fandom is really underestimating how much Mike suspects and has realized, at least about himself, and that’s where I think most of the remaining byler doubt is coming from (not including Twitter, we don’t count byler Twitter they do not know shit abt what’s going on 💀).

But that worry is unnecessary! Some of you guys don’t realize how perfect of a plot device Vecna is. I’m saying this as a writer: He’s like a writers dream bc you can basically tell viewers what’s happening in a character’s psyche while still maintaining “show don’t tell.” Bc now? All the writers rlly have to do to start canonifying Mike’s gay realization that has, once again, already happened, is have vecna target him! And they’ve clearly been planning that if that several billion hints in s4 and 3 and EVEN 2 AND 1 are anything to go by 👀👀

Guys, Mike’s *realization* arc is practically FINISHED. The duffers and writers have just been hiding it this whole time by not giving us any Mike POV in s3 or 4 bc they couldn’t confirm Mike before confirming Will, that would make byler endgame wayy too obvious they had to sneak it in there.

But it’s there, and it’s happened. The only thing WE have to worry about now is preparing ourselves for the sheer level of angst that is going to be Mike’s internalized homophobia plot line getting confirmed… I rlly don’t think we’re ready for that. I know IM not 😭

#s5 byler is gonna hurt no matter which way we rationalize it 😭 #s5 in general too #we gotta prepare ourselves for some SHIT goin down #just not Mike figuring out he’s gay #bro already knows 💀🖐🏻 #it WILL that need to figure out Mike is gay next season rip #byler #byler endgame #byler s5 #byler analysis #mike wheeler analysis #byler proof #byler s2 #byler s3 #byler s4 #mike wheeler #mike wheeler i know what you are #and so do u 👀👀 #mike and will #byler tumblr #text post #elli talks mike wheeler

[bibylers]

Ships // opinions // rating // endgame or not? 🤔

Okay, so I got this idea to share my opinions on different ships, and what I think will happen to them in s5!

LUMAX:

I DEFINITELY think this is endgame. Like I’m talking 100000%. I think the only reason it wouldn’t become endgame is if Max didn’t wake up (which SHE WILL.)

This ship is over all a perfect 1000000000000/10 for me.

I love them in all the seasons but especially in s4!!

JOPPER:

10000000000000% ENDGAME.

There is nothing in this world that will make me not believe that Jopper is endgame.

Literally SOOO ADORABLE

I loved them in every season but ESPECIALLY s3 and s4!

Solid 1019101001011901/10.

I LOVE THEM.

BYLER:

Yeah, I think you already know.

But if you don’t, ENDGAME.

FAV SHIP EVER.

ADORABLE FROM S1-S4.

If they don’t become endgame I will DIE.

110101010101001010101010101010101010299293921/10 💙💛

MILEVEN:

I think there’s a very small possibility of Mileven becoming endgame.

I would LOVE THEM as platonic bffs but just not romantically.

I loved them in s1-s2, but in s3 they just became uninteresting to me.

Overall a 2/10!

RONANCE:

ADORABLE. SO ADORABLE.

I don’t think it’s gonna be endgame but in another universe okay ☹️☹️

I LOVE THEM SMM

Obviously love them the most in s4 😭

1110000101010101010/10 🛐🛐🛐🛐

ELMAX:

LOVE THEM SM

I don’t think it’s gonna be endgame but IT DEFINITELY NEEDS TO GET A HAPPY ENDING WITH A PARALLEL TO THE STARCOURT SCENE IN S3 😭😭💕💕

SO ADORABLE.

LOVED THEM IN S3-S4

1000000000000/10 ‼️‼️‼️

STEDDIE:

I loveeeeee the concept of this but I really don’t think it’s gonna be endgame 😭😭☹️☹️

Definitely wish they would’ve built it up more as a friendship atleast 😞

OFC love them bcs of the FRUITY FOUR 🛐🛐💓💓‼️‼️

7/10, love the concept but I never really saw it as a possibility 😣

JANCY:

LOVELOVELOVELOVELOVE THEM.

CUTEST THING EVER.

I RLLY HOPE THEYRE ENDGAME. 😣

LITERALLY ALL THE SEASONS BUT ESPECIALLY S2-S3.

✨ A M A Z I N G M A S T E R P I E C E. ✨

10000/10. 💕💕💕

ROCKIE:

We didn’t see ALOT of them but I still LOVE THEM.

DEFINITELY ENDGAME.

LIKE 100000%.

8/10. ENDGAME.

DUZIE:

Super cute 😭😭😭😭

LOVED them in s3 (only one scene BUT THATS OKAY!!!)

10000% endgame.

8/10. Adorable. ☹️💓

STANCY:

I never really saw it IM SO SORRY 😭😭😭

Season 1 was the best season for them I think but I still never really thought they were that cute ☹️

I kinda think theres a SMALL CHANCE of them becoming endgame, and that would literally TEAR APPART THE HEART OF JONATHAN BYERS. 😭😭😭😣😣💔💔💔 (and Robin)

(No one hurts a Byers. NO ONE. 😡😡😡)

Anyway those are all of the ships I can currently think of! 💙💛

#stranger things #byler #stranger things fandom #byler endgame #ronance #jancy #byler tumblr #the byers family #jopper #lumax

[mlchaelwheeler]

(Same anon, more thoughts)

Ik a lot of the GA think that S5 will have Will finding another boyfriend after being accepted by all of his friends/family and moving on from Mike, but that'd also be queerbaiting bc the thing is, the painting isn't just a representation of Will being gay. It's a physical embodiment of his love for Mike specifically. To profit off of that with no real payoff and Byler just reverting to their S1-2 status of 'great best friends' would be so shitty of them bc then it just did not need to happen. There's no way they'd go through so much trouble of making all that merch about Will loving Mike (not just boys in general) and then doing nothing with that storyline.

CORRECT exactly!! the painting isn't just a revelation of will's sexuality, it's a physical embodiment of his love for mike. they wouldn't be plastering it on every item possible for merch if byler wasn't gonna be endgame.

they've already had multiple opportunities to give will a different love interest/boyfriend atp, and they haven't. they could've done smth in s3 at the mall ("summer of love" and whatnot) or easily have introduced a love interest for will in cali. yet they didn't. instead they heavily ramped up the plot of will being deeply in love with mike (all while showing mike to be having major problems with el).

if byler wasn't gonna be endgame, this is not how the story would be written. it would be vastly different if will's arc was about coming to terms with his sexuality. his arc is more than that though. it's about his love for mike. it's about spilling his feelings and finally getting that same love in return. it's about ending up with his best friend, his love interest, the boy of his dreams. it's about will and mike together.

#sorry that got long but with all the narrative choices so far. it's obvious byler is the only option #they've literally backed themselves into a corner with that painting and the van scene #there's no way out of it now 🫡 #byler #ask sarah #anon tag

[wakeupthemembersofbylernation]

When I say Bylers are misinterpreting what is happening in the narrative and overstating stuff on the show, and making stuff up in the process... I mean that they go by fanon and ignore the canon narrative. I do think Byler is endgame. I myself am a Byler shipper. However, I also think most Bylers' takes are all wrong or heavily misinterpreted. And honestly? They are consistently being disproven by canon on the show. People's takes regarding El were all wrong. She still has feelings for Mike and wasn't angry with him, she was thinking about Max at the cabin scene. The expectation for her to just break up with Mike and for Mlvn to end quickly in the next season is baseless and sounds very hilarious if we go by canon instead of fanon.

I don't think this situation is as complicated as ppl are making out to be. The most likely scenario is that El will potentially break up with Mike in EP4 or later on, and they will realize that they are incompatible in their relationship, and over the time we will see Mike and Will getting closer and then entering a relationship by the end of the show in the last episode. And while I would want Mike to have an explored and explicit sexuality and coming of age storyline, I feel like that is more envisioned and will happen in Will's narrative specifically as the Duffers also talked about. While Mike's is more about realizing his self worth and choosing to be with Will bc he realizes he loves Will and they're more compatible to be together, and the painting is also used as a plot device for Mike to realize that because Will later on decides to admit the truth to Mike and Mike accepts Will's feelings and realizes he also feels the same and they're fit for each other.

I feel like the fandom is really overstating/misinterpretating what is happening with Byler/Mlvn and that's the reason why their theories are either falling apart by the canon narrative, or getting disproven by the show.

Misinterpretation is always a possibility, but I disagree that Bylers are “making stuff up.” For the most part, Byler theories, even the arguably “out there” ones come from careful analysis and a genuine response to what is shown on screen. I wouldn’t say Bylers are ignoring the canon narrative because I think most Byler analysts are trying to genuinely engage with the canon narrative. With regards to the popular theory that El was mad with Mike, this wasn’t pulled out of thin air but by watching the show. I mean, she genuinely doesn’t look happy with Mike, and her being done with him or no longer having feelings for him would have been consistent with her previous actions as well. So it wasn’t crazy.

But yes, it’s an interpretation. And I agree that The Piggyback script threw a monkey wrench into that interpretation. The thing about interpretations is that they can be wrong. Based on the script, you’re right that it does seem like El still has feelings for Mike and wasn’t mad with Mike about the monologue but about losing. I do still find this concerning, not in terms of Mike’s character necessarily, but in terms of El’s character. I’ve already shared my thoughts on this matter. I’m concerned about character regression. (However, it’s important to note that things in Stranger Things do often change from script to how things are portrayed on screen. I’m still of the belief that in terms of the monologue scene and its aftermath, some things still aren’t adding up. But we’ll see in Season 5).

A lot of Bylers were of the opinion that El and Mike were gonna completely break up in the first episode and that maybe they already broke up secretly off screen during the missing time. I think this is largely due to our desire to see our boys 😉 get together as quickly as possible. But that was never really my position. I think they wanna drag out the love triangle as much as possible for angst/drama, and there still are a lot of shoes to drop such as the painting lie.

You mention that you don’t think this situation is as complicated as people are making it out to be, and that is certainly possible. Your thoughts on what will happen with Byler/Mlleven are a possibility for sure. But I actually think this approach would be more complicated. Most of the general audience is still convinced that Mike is exclusively straight and could never ever be gay or bi or queer in any way. Many of them also don’t like Mike’s character anymore due to his confusing actions in Season 3 and 4. We know better, but the easiest way to explain both of these things is to get inside his head. I really really hope Mike gets Vecnaed, and while it’s not a certainty, I still think there’s lots of evidence for it within the text of the show. If we don’t get into his head, if the problem with Migration Pattern is just incompatibility and nothing more, it raises so many questions and doesn’t really explain anything about Season 3 and 4. And coupled with the love confession monologue, if we operate under the assumption that Mike wasn’t lying at all, it also comes dangerously close to Will being basically a second option. And I don’t think that’s the message we really want the show to convey.

#byler #mike wheeler #will byers #el hopper #stranger things 5

[kuumara]

ok lets go

usually the original post is alright and its the comments that are weird, but not this time. bc i could say the exact same thing ab mcdonalds, that they would be disappointed crying pissing screaming etc when they see s5. i personally think more ronaldmcdonaldasses should be ok with a byler endgame, but if i said this they would all cry piss scream shit

--

yeah, he did say he's scared of losing her. but as the saying goes that you've prob seen from alot of other stuff, "if you love something you're not afraid to let it go". so idk ab u but mike saying that just confirms that the relationship is toxic and if it continues it might even turn into an emotionally abusive one, IMO (its a pattern- ur anxious the partner will leave, u start being more cautious around them; even turn into a whole another version of urself u think the partner will like more (mikes lenora drip), etc etc. very stressful for u (mike) and also ur partner (el)).

"he's clearly inlove with eleven" idk it wasnt really clear to me when she offensively side-eyed him at the cabin and then he rolled his eyes or wtvr that was, which was literally the last time they interacted. not really madly in love healthy relationship of them tbh. and its EL not goddamn eleven that alone speaks volumes ab how much they care ab her well-being or character arc or wtvr their other excuses are (they say mike leaving her would crush her, but so would if u called her eleven in her face)

"it would go against everything we've seen in the show" i agree with this one. except, byler not being canon would go against everything blablabla 🤓 like, we've seen this happen before with steve and robin, this would just be even more bombastic.

then, the show dunks on homophobes all the time so Macabre canon would go against that too; and yes, it would be homophobic to use a gay character's CONFESSION and FEELINGS THAT ARE ALREADY CAUSING HIM PAIN to uplift the straight couple, making them happy married with 17 kids while the gay character is in even more pain and like dies or smth

--

holy shit i thought yall were exaggerating when u said they actually think mleven is love at first sight.

1) the duffers wouldnt "suddenly scrap it", ppl have been finding subtext and set design clues since the beginning, since ep1. no its not delusions, its stuff for which there isnt any other actual explanation. it all makes sense, every subtext reference, every set design prop, every decoration on clothes- theres even an official st video on yt where the set design says she put triangles on robins clothes bc shes gay asf. Guess who else has triangles on his shirt (which he wears for majority of the show, might i add)? MIKE -but that just means he likes girls!! just like robin, to shut down any theories the fans made ab him liking guys!!! hes a lesbian😭😭😭

2) im assuming these are hard core fans, since theyre still in the subreddit and all that, and i dont doubt theyve seen the stranger things twitter account say they don't believe in love at first sight. so the writers=write the show. don't believe in love at first sight, it's just cheesy (infatuated) 12yr old shit. so, why would they include smth they think isn't real, unrealistic even? except if they're saying mike and els love isn't real-

--

alright final one. the classic "yall delusional" argument. Nothing else to say besides we are seeing patterns and we are recognizing them. not my fault ur not as observant and intelligent🙄

#anti mileven #anti milkvan #anti m*leven #stranger things #byler #this is fun asf

[beaulesbian]

No bc Mike getting vecna'd is such a good idea if byler endgame is the goal. Like his regret/shame would be the fact that he can't say ily to his gf and the fact that he's in love w his best friend but repressing it. Then will could confess and this would remove some of that shame thus possibly saving him?? Cause people saying will gets cursed has me wondering what his regret would be (other than his love for Mike, which he seems to be relatively accepting of, whereas Mike (if he is in love w will) is repressing it much more and prob thinks it will hurt el whom he really cares about)

(this got a bit longer than i first wanted, but i have too many delusional theories 💖)

exactly, i see this more even as a great tool for their respective character developments than even for the ship itself, but ofc that would be best outcome if this all happened.

in my opinion if will gets vecna'd it would just be too similar to what hes already been through before, it would be unnecessary repeating. what we need is to see will have some connection to the upside down, that will help by the end to defeat vecna or whoever else in s5.

meanwhile it would be much more interesting to see this with mike. bc overall its a bit more difficult to see what hes really thinking, if we only see the surface level emotions.

first, he cares about all his friends beyond anything. and while will and el and max went through such trauma that was very visible, (and theyre still dealing with that, we still dont know much how mike is dealing with anything.

we only see how he changes depending on whos around him and how they interact together (dustin and lucas, eddie, will, el, his family - i feel he acts very different around each of them)

In season one his best friend went missing, was pressumed dead and had a funeral - mike thought, even for a while, he lost him permanently.

In that time el appeared and was helping find will, his friends suddenly think he likes her more than a friend (its whats normal, right? Ofc he should like her before he even knows himself...)

He fights with lucas about el in s1, and one of the things he said (i cant remember exactly now) is how he feels guilty they fought about it, "if only he could have said something more, something better, its my fault"

i think he said something similar in different situations during the first three seasons, and then in s4, when hes opening up to will about this, he tells him similar thing twice "if only i explained myself better, i should have said something more to el, do something better"

from that i get the feeling hes always trying to do not just the best he can, but whats expected of him. and when he finds he doesnt have the power to stop something, or physically cannot make himself say something thats probably not true, he blames himself afterwards.

S3 is such rollercoaster for him, hes with el but cant be with el bc hopper, and then cant say what he feels - or maybe he doesnt know whats hes supposed to feel. And then el and will are leaving. Two of his most important friends, and i think thats what made him all the more confused, bc what if he misses will more than el?

Why did the promise of will wanting only play d&d with mike made him smile so much, but then the kiss with el made him all the more confused?

theres two such contrasts in his personality, where one of his main beliefs is "friends dont lie" and he does as much as he can with honestly, but at the same time he pushes something inside him down and pretends it doesnt exist (his complicated feelings towards.. romance, lets say).

Back to the vecna theory - this is why i think if mike gets vecna'd it would add more perspective to his character and for us to see what all hes been going through in the past seasons.

Same as his feelings towards will, its been there building from s1.

It could be few flashbacks and memories telling the audience the scenes that already happened from mike's point of view, how he struggles at home,

how he regretted the words he said to will in s3 (its not my fault you dont like girls), bc it was more directed at himself than will, but he didnt realize that yet.

how finding eddie and playing in d&d club could mean hes slowly finding himself (and with d&d being like a connection will again, bc its something they both loved playing together).

And how all of this is so confusing, especially for their time in the 80s, and hes still trying his best, but slowly, more and more cant ignore that his heart wants something (someone) else than hes supposed to be with.

Its just all these things that will go either unnoticed and unmentioned in the series, which i think would be a shame, or it could be addressed in the way with vecna who would manipulate his fears and nightmares, and if others can save him (which im sure they would), he could start process it in a better way, more honest to himself as well to others. To accept himself, and by that also will's feelings (if he noticed those, which i dont think he did, i think will noticed mike's confused ones, if anything.)

#ok posting it like this theres probably a million mistakes but i could only write this during work half thinking about other things shdjnf #byler #my ramblings #i hope this wasnt totally confusing i just have too many headcanons and theories about mike and his character #at the same time i wanna hug him but also.. boy you need some vecna therapy sorry about that #stranger things #spoilers #mine #byeler

[chirpsythismorning]

Idk what’s worse, the fact that there are milkvans out there that believe El commissioned Will’s painting, or that a majority of milkvans believe she didn’t, but still think everything Will said to Mike in the van scene applies to how El feels about Mike as well. And honestly, how could they not? Mike looked very happy and emotional hearing Will's words in the van... no shit they're hoping that's how El feels.

But El never called Mike the heart. El never said she needed Mike and always will. Those words coming from Will's feelings for Mike, then being used to inspire Mike to give his monologue to El, was disingenuous bc it was never El’s feelings being responded to in the first place.

‘It only works if it comes from you’

That’s the whole problem. It didn’t work bc it was coming from Will, not El.

IF everything Will said applied to El, why not have it come from her?

No, but seriously??

Is s5 just going to open up to El apologizing to Mike for ignoring him after the monologue, followed by her just repeating everything Will said with her own twist and Mike being like cool!! That works for me!

The problem with making the narrative choice to instead focus on Will's feelings at the forefront, only to follow it up with El's identical feelings, does nothing but make the whole thing fall flat.

Instead of seeing this main couple voice their love for each other themselves, I gotta have her brother do it for her?? And only then after he does it, can I see her do it in like a 2.0 version of sorts????

So many milkvans are willing to acknowledge that Mike and El’s dynamic throughout the series is riddled frivolous conflict more than anything, with little to no time dedicated to showing the development that actually matters. They say they wish the show spent more time with them actually face to face acknowledging how they both feel verbally without the constant cloud of some other third party interfering, causing them to have issues. They say that this time though, they think the Duffers will magically pull through for them and go from what they believe is shitty writing to ‘good’ writing, based in terms of how they'll handle Mike and El's relationship in s5...

But that's not realistic on any front, milkvan, byler or otherwise.

And that's a big part of the problem, bc they know the pacing has not been great for them, and they NEED the show to just give them Mike and El so they can be happy, but that's not how you build up suspense for a love story. And dragging out Mike and El any more, would just be a repeat of every other season before. They reached their peak and so they can only down from here. That's kind of the whole point.

One thing to note is that the Duffers always create conflict for the incompatible couple early in a season, so that the audience doesn’t feel too uncomfortable with the idea of considering the other option that’s at the forefront for the rest of the season.

This will ESPECIALLY be the case for byler, bc Will already has home wrecker allegations as it is. And it's also a highly controversial queer ship, and so people are going to be making claims left and right that it’s wrong bc of xyz.

They just wont be able to have byler scenes loaded with romantic tension all season long, more than any other season, and with the story making it more obvious they want us to root for them, while also having Mike and El still be together. And it's simply bc the reality is the Duffers have a record of doing the complete opposite of that.

This is also endgame territory, so there is a serious pressure on the writers part to get their audience to be closer to rooting for byler than denying it even being possible. Meaning they NEED the audience to be watching their first kiss and, for better or worse, be thinking, FINALLY just get it over with already!

Also what's El's supposed to be up to while this is happening? Are we assuming she's just stringing along waiting for Mike to get his shit together? Like Jesus!

El has every right to say her piece and get that shit over with, by episode 1 or 2 at the latest. She could be a focused on Max and her family and friends, which if you'll note also includes Mike and Will, but instead this time without the pressure of her having to hope that something will turn around and suddenly Mike will decide he finally loves her... She doesn't deserve that.

Byler is clearly the route they are taking. If that is the plan, it's time to make this separation so that the audience is finally confronted with viewing Mike and El without the constant rose tinted love at first sight goggles, and instead give them a chance to be their authentic selves.

And I think El, being a character that could barely speak in s1, that her not getting her own voice in this situation is fucking serious. El not being able to say those words to Mike herself, like there's a reason for that. And so when she finally does get to say how she feels, there isn't going to be any room for subtext or misunderstanding, not on the audiences part nor Mike's. El has always been pretty clear about what she wants and I think that will apply in s5 now more than ever.

#byler #no but srs i try to imagine their version of the show and my brain sort of just freezes up #is their dynamic going to just completely shift and they'll communicate perfectly #after barely communicating at all at the end of s4? #like they know that milkvan need to be together by now to make sense and that's why their version has them happy right away #bc they cant allow themselves to see it any other way #bc it would just literally be a repeat of every other season... #somethings gotta give #give el her voice to say how she feels for herself #and don't be mad when it turns out her brothers feelings don't exactly match up with hers #you know.. the words mike smiled captivatingly too...

[deathon1leg]

“m*leven is the main couple of the show” ok but that’s not true. byler has always been the main couple.

i know they’re not together yet but we know they’re going to be, and they’ve been setting it up since the beginning. two characters can be the main couple without being together yet as long as the media they’re from demonstrates that to us through romantic tropes, parallels, set/costume design, camerawork, music, etc. plus, will is already canonically in love with mike.

i know this is an.. unusual show to use as an example, but it’s popular so—take the office. ask anyone who the main couple is and they’ll 100% say jim and pam. ask someone who’s only on, say, season 1, and they’ll probably still say jim and pam. but they didn’t officially get together until season 4. pam actually had a fiancé who wasn’t him for the first two seasons, yet still, they were the main couple. everyone knew it was going to happen eventually.

mike and will’s relationship has always been coded as romantic (not really getting into any specific romantic moments bc that’s not the point of this post, but most of u prob know what i mean. there’s so many and you can find them easily) and more people would see that if they took off the heteronormativity goggles. and again, will is in love with mike, which they have to resolve somehow.

and i DO SEE why people think m*leven is the main couple. on a surface level, it seems obvious. they’re two of the main characters, their dynamic is given a lot of screen time and they’re canon. but when you look harder, m*leven comes secondary to byler. m*leven’s relationship can’t separate itself from will/byler, and a lot of major events between mike and el are intertwined with will/byler, sometimes to such an extent that these things wouldn’t happen/function otherwise. for example:

in s1, they only find el because they were looking for will. mike only keeps her at his house for as long as he does bc he thought she could help find will. he doesn’t value her nearly as much once he thinks she can’t help. for most of s1 he saw her more as a tool to find will than a person.

in s2, mike is very upset about el’s disappearance and tries to walkie talkie her everyday, but (correct me if i’m misremembering) once the mind flayer starts possessing will, mike seems to push that all aside to prioritize taking care of him.

in s3, m*leven’s comedic breakup is overshadowed by byler’s rain fight. there’s no question which one we’re meant to take seriously. mike doesn’t care that he upset el and is in no hurry to make it up to her, but when he upsets will he regrets it right away, and immediately bikes to his house in the rain to apologize.

in s4, el getting bullied turns into a byler fight about them growing apart. mike opens up to will several times (which he can’t do with el) about his and el’s issues, and will offers advice. will gives mike the painting and gives his coded confession, which mike, thinking those were el’s feelings, uses as fuel for his ily monologue. mike’s whole monologue was literally about will.

will is more intwined with m*leven than ever in s4 because it’s the second to last, which means a breakup is coming soon. byler will get together sometime after that—i think it probably won’t be until after the time skip, though.

like i said, this post isn’t about any specific romantic moments between mike and will (but if you wanna see some just search “byler proof”, “byler endgame”, “byler analysis”, “byler evidence” or smth similar on here. there’s tons), but whether or not you take account of their romantic-coding, the show has purposefully shown us many times that byler’s relationship is stronger, healthier, and more loving than m*leven’s. obviously a relationship doesn’t have to be romantic to be those things, but the thing is, they’ve already shown us byler is romantic.

and, as the whole reason for this post suggests, byler is (or—if you’d rather look at it this way—will become) the main couple in stranger things. they’re two of the main characters, and i’d argue that their relationship is given more emphasis and importance placed on it than any other duo in the show, even established couples. the show is constantly saying to us: hey! look at them! look at the way they interact with each! look at them in comparison with other duos/couples! look at the specific type of bond they have with each other! like, the first two seasons’ storylines wouldn’t even work without their bond, which is also true to a slightly lesser extent in s3 and s4.

also, i’m just spitballing here, but isn’t it kinda unusual for a show with multiple established couples to place the most emphasis on a platonic pair? usually if a show has a two characters whose bond they place more importance on than any other pairs in the show, they’re a couple—or will end up becoming one.

so. when you combine the numerous flaws and weaknesses in m*leven’s relationship (which you can also find examples of easily—try searching “anti m*leven” or “anti milkvan”) + the strength and love in byler’s relationship + byler being coded as romantic since the start + s4 making it clear that m*leven’s breakup is imminent + will canonically being in love with mike + the painting that prompted mike’s monologue, which he’s yet to find out was entirely from will...

it’s safe to say byler will be endgame, which is fitting, because they’re already the main couple. i will shout this from the rooftops—they’re already the main couple!!

just in case, let me say it again, but bigger and more colorful:

byler is already the main couple!

thank u if you read this whole long thing!! i should honestly stop expecting that i’m gonna write short posts when i have something to say about byler. it never ends up short. <3 <3 hope you enjoyed

#number of days since ollie set out to make a short post about byler and then wrote an essay: 0 #thanks for reading!! #yes i looked up the info for that office part #byler #byler analysis #byler meta #byler evidence #byler proof #byler endgame #gotta get all the tags #anti m*leven #stranger things

[will80sbyers]

People will count the most blatant and casual examples of queerbait usage and then come and say that it's not queerbait / wouldn't be queerbait.... I mean, queerbaiting it literally done via marketing, while hinting at a same sex romance without the intention of delivering it.

We already know that byler was marketed over twitter, and got hyped for viewer engagement. we literally saw that play out even during the Pride Month even.... they knew what they were doing when they posted those tweets to promote the ship.

The obvious dynamic in the show and the way they portrayed Mike and Will's relationship.

Selling of a merch, which is tied to Will's feelings for Mike.

All of those thing ARE queerbaiting. You are literally counting the most blatant examples of queerbait but then come and say you don't think it would be queerbaiting when in fact it would be bc those things are literally the most used examples of queerbaiting in media... I've seen less queerbaiting examples than Byler, and those examples were still queerbait or bordered on queerbaiting territory.

The writers and the people who promoted ship inside the show and outside the show via social media accounts are not dumb. They know what they're doing when they're doing that.

totally agree! unfortunately it would be queerbaiting if it didn't happen and we have to acknowledge this

now for what will actually happen I don't think it will be, I think all of this just means byler endgame because it is too much only for Will to be rejected in the end

#byler #ask

[apatheticlexicographer]

i’m a firm believer in the “m!leven break up in v2 but byler don’t get together til s5″ agenda. i feel like jumping directly out of a relationship with el and straight into one with will wouldn’t be a great idea for mike, even if his heart wasn’t really in m!leven. what i’d like to see this season would be him and el breaking up and him coming to terms with his sexuality. i don’t think he needs a boyfriend right now this very second; i think he needs some time to process and learn to understand himself better, same as el. will seems to have pretty much accepted himself, but mike really hasn’t, and i don’t think it would be fair to either of them to immediately jump into a relationship before he feels more secure in his identity, or only just after he’s begun acknowledging his sexuality. i wouldn’t be unhappy if byler got together in v2, but i would be surprised, and a little concerned about how their relationship would be portrayed in s5 with regards to mike’s internalised homophobia.

even if the duffers decided to be cringe and go for m!leven endgame i still think they should break up this season bc i can’t see their relationship getting any healthier without a break. if they each had a good amount of self discovery and then decided to get back together then i don’t really think it would make narrative sense and it would probably be the most egregious bit of queerbating that netflix has ever done, but it would be a damn sight better character progression wise than them just staying together for the duration of the show.

also from a more real-world perspective, if m!leven are broken up by the end of s4 it gives netflix a good couple of years to go absolutely batshit bananas with the love triangle, ‘who’s gonna end up with mike’ marketing and i don’t think they’d pass that up.

EDIT :

as an aside, the majority heterosexual general audience is probably gonna need the next couple of years to accustom themselves to the idea that byler might happen. sure, it’s obvious to us, but a lot of them don’t even realise or at least don’t acknowledge that will is gay, let alone have the slightest inkling about mike’s sexuality. it wouldn’t be coming out of nowhere, but to the large audience who are conditioned to expect straight relationships and are only watching the show casually, it would seem that way. the duffers might not care what people think but the netflix execs definitely do. they’ve only just started the byler marketing after v1, and considering ST is basically netflix’s flagship show i’m sure they’re going to be handling the whole thing very carefully internally. a month’s worth of fairly subtle marketing mostly targeted at the people who care enough about the show already to follow official accounts isn’t enough to break through the straight-tinted glasses.

#byler #not sure how cohesive this is i'm just rambling #will byers #mike wheeler #stranger things #i want them to get together but i want mike to feel more secure abt his identity first #if he was a shitty bf to will in s5 because his internalised homophobia made him paranoid i would go FERAL and not in a good way #obviously i'm not expecting him to be out and proud to the whole of hawkins #but he doesn't give me the impression that he's mentally ready to be in a queer relationship in the 80s just yet #i could be wrong ofc and tbh i'd be happy if i was #but i'm nervous about how the duffers would portray a whole SEASON of them dating while possibly still closeted from their friends

[henrysglock]

idk if this is anything, but the chandelier in the background of this scene made me think of ur phantom of the opera post bc of the whole phantom of the opera broadway chandelier thing that ive seen online!!

OOOOOOH HOLY SHIT AEMIRON GOOD CATCH!!

yes absolutely!

it 100% resembles the crashed chandelier in POTO, right down to the shape of the lightbulbs and the way it leans on stage.

It’s very much worth noting that Christine’s final kidnapping precedes the crash (the one that solidifies the love triangle dynamic), with Raoul watching from the audience helplessly as she’s taken.

The crash is followed up with Raoul’s near murder by the Phantom (as a result of him consistently trying to teary the Phantom’s plans).

Sounds very much like s2, maybe a callback? Foreshadowing for s4/5?

Christine has been trance-kidnapped once already by the point, and it’s the kidnapping that initially sets off the storyline of Christine realizing this isn’t an acceptable/safe situation and starting to fight back. She goes from being slightly fearful of the Phantom but still thinking nothing bad could happen to her, to displaying fear/trying to predict and avoid her next kidnapping.

We already had that in s2, with the “I felt him everywhere” breakdown after the visions but before the possession. Will goes from fearful but still somewhat convinced that this will pass to displaying fear/trying to avoid another kidnapping over the course of the possession arc.

That would put him, now, in the middle of Christine’s “I need to free myself from this place” arc, maybe just before Raoul suggests the bait and trap plan? He’s scared, he’s trying to thwart Henry and free himself, he finally knows the truth of the possession, and he’s beginning to rely of Mike to help him.

Mike, like Raoul in POTO’s final arc, will be targeted in s5. I think we have enough textual and cinematographic evidence in ST to say that. Henry hasn’t forgotten that Mike’s been a thorn in his side this whole time. Henry wants the world, he wants Will, and Mike has been the only thing in his way time and time again, much like Raoul has thwarted the Phantoms attempts at getting Christine.

I think, given everything, it could be a callback and foreshadowing. They saying hey, remember the beginning of this storyline? Yeah. Prepare for the end. You already know how this might end. And also? Byler endgame.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS!!! I need to rewatch ST fr…

#asks #byler #stranger things