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wisteria-lodge · 1 year

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burnt & exploded bird + badger secondary (bird model)

Hi! I've been doing a lot of introspection lately and I kind of wanted a second opinion about me?

I've been reading about the primaries and of all of them, Snake seems the least wrong, but it doesn't really feel right? Like, I prioritize my people over everyone else, but I don't do it because it's the right thing to do or because I care about my people. I do it because it helps me. I don't think I'm really capable of caring about people for who they are instead of what they provide me. When I was in grade school, I made a chart of how often I could interact with my friends to maximize fondness and minimize distaste for my innate personality.

Well, somebody's got some Bird somewhere.

And you're definitely an Idealist. Loyalists see people as ends in themselves, and you don't which is... totally fine.

Although this "distaste for my innate personality" thing... you had such a strong belief that you were such a huge problem so young? What happened?

Most of my conclusions from back them remain true to this day.

Oh. Yes. You're a Bird Primary. You built a system, you built it young, and you're still living in it.

Including an inability to suppress my extreme selfishness, an inability to understand how my actions will affect other people, and an inability to actually hold a decent conversation. I intentionally "befriend" people who like to talk more than they like to listen because I don't like talking to other people, but I quite enjoy learning. My people are the only ones I ever consider, but I consider them so I can keep them, not because I really care.

You know this is fine, right? To want to be around interesting people, and listen to them talk? You're a good listener, and that is a HUGE part of "holding a decent conversation." There is no reason you have to be some sparking, witty, extroverted charmer.

And all of this talk of "extreme selfishness" and "inability to understand how my actions will affect other people?" So far it seems like you make flow charts to try to understand how your actions affect other people. Is the problem that you're not omniscient?Something is up with your secondary, there's to much "I literally am incapable of being a person" for there not to be.

Bird is the second closest, but it seems to imply a level of... put-togetherness? that I don't really have.

Yeah, I adore Birds, but Birds are crazy.

I appreciate logic and reasoning, but I'm self-aware enough to know that my decisions are mostly emotion and instinct and justified after the fact. I don't trust the "outside world" to convey accurate information to me, likely due repeated and continuous incidents in my childhood that I won't get into because it's a little too personal.

OH. You're Exploded. You're an Exploded Bird. Mostly likely you've dealt with some heavy duty gaslighting (sadly common) and this has messed with your ability to take in new information.

Best guess is that your secondary, whatever it is, is Burned, and you don't feel confident navigating the world using it.

I think I want to be a Bird and try to be a Bird but can't actually use any of its tenets. I am not a rational person.

And... that's Burnt Primary talk. "I can't reason." You're a Burnt Bird as well. I mean sure you have emotions, and bias, you're a person. But you like logic, you like coming up with conclusions and then using them as rules to live by, and you can think and reason. What does it even *mean* to say "I'm not a rational person?" Like, what, intrinsically rational? There are no rational four-year-olds, this is something that you build.

I think rationality is the best possible metric for morality you will ever find

Bird.

and I am incapable of judging on a standard that isn't "how will this help me". I use rationality as a tool to further my objective of maximizing myself.

What's the problem with that. That's just, existentialist philosophy.

I don't really like myself either, so I'm not really sure why it's an objective to maximize self-benefit. And even this isn't really the best portrayal of me? Because I think I'm acting for my own self-benefit. It's the best way I've thought of to understand myself.

No one is born not liking themselves. That happened at some point. And whatever it is, it seems to have to do with *how* you interact with the world (secondary) and not *why* you interact with the world (primary.) For having Burning and Exploding in your past, you seem pretty confident in your primary.

But the thing is, I automatically try to live up (or down) to people's expectations. This has hurt me greatly in life, both academically and socially. EX: I made a really weird first impression on one of my current "friends". They genuinely think I'm plausibly a serial killer now. I don't know how to tell them it was a bit, and I don't know how to stop acting like that around them. It doesn't feel like me while I'm not around them, and I don't think they like being around me either, but I am genuinely incapable of stopping.

Feeling like you got "stuck doing a bit" is generally an Actor Bird Secondary problem... but the idea that you can't switch out of it in the moment (even though you want to) and feeling like you're kind of only doing it because of inertia, that's something I recognize in myself. So I'm kind of inclined to say this is an automatic Secondary, Badger or Snake.

Also, it needs to be said, but if you were really as creepy and as off-putting as you seem think you are... no one would hang out with you. (unless... are you insanely good-looking? incredibly rich? Is that the context I'm missing? :)

You truly seem to believe that the multi-player version of your secondary is ineffective/incorrect/wrong. You're Burnt, in the terminology of this system. And I suspect you're being too hard on yourself.

For secondary, I feel weirdly split between Lion and Snake. Like, who I am is unchanging.

(Except when you're doing a bit.) (But I know what you mean. The 'neutral' you is always you, but that's the case for everybody.)

I will never compromise myself to fit in, even if it would help the situation.

Sounds like a You-Move secondary. (Lion or Badger.)

I have strong difficulties adapting to situations.

Prep-work secondary (Badger or Bird.) And some Burnt secondary language of course.

If you're following along, that gives us: Automatic, You-Move, Prepwork seconday = Badger.

However, I have noticed that these convictions of mine are probably false.

... that is something a Lion primary would never, ever think. To a Lion, convictions are internal and therefore true. But that doesn't work for you. You're a Bird, so you need your Truth to exist externally as well, in order to be secure and safe.

I change a lot depending on the person I'm around. EX: When I'm alone, I'm a paranoid mess that flinches at loud sounds (past trauma). When I'm with this one friend of mine who has a lot of issues with manic episodes and hates touch, I'm loud and bombastic, smiling and unnerving, and oddly physical considering the touch aversion of both me and my friend. When I'm with this other friend who's a bit more mellow, I'm almost actually nice. I say "please" and "thank you", which is also weird because this friend doesn't.

You've stopped putting "friend" in air quotes. I'll take it.

You'll call me crazy, but this sounds like Courtier Badger. You're unusual, and probably your friends are too, so it's going to manifest in some interesting ways, but that's what's going on. I know this is a process that gets called "mirroring," but the idea is not that you're reflecting back a duplicate of your friend, the idea is that you're responding to whatever they're putting out, and reflecting back whatever energy you think they need.

(I would not be at all surprised if your mellow friend finds the upped manners comforting... and your friend with manic episodes finds you being bombastic, tactile and out-there comforting as well. Like, I'd buy that. Maybe they get a lot of people tip-toeing around them and treating them with kid gloves, and the fact that you don't do that makes for a pleasant change.)

It feels like me when I'm there, but when thinking about it when alone, I don't recognize it.

^ This is a very real part of being a Courtier Badger, especially if your friends are very *different* from each other. Getting emotion "hangovers" or needing time to reset back to center after interactions is also very real.

Bird is also maybe an option, but like if I had no areas of expertise. Probably not, though.

Again with that burnt secondary talk. You almost certainly have a Bird secondary model, that you built very young when whatever happened to your Badger secondary happened. And started writing relationship flow-charts as a coping mechanism.

I think somewhere along the line, I internalized the fact that all my choices are the wrong ones and became terrified of having agency. I don't know how much this affects the evaluation, but yeah.

I hate to say it, but that's absolutely classic Burnt Bird.

That's me. You know now more about me than my therapist. Do you have a sorting?

I sure do. Maybe not the best news in the world, but then that's for you to decide. I've laid out what I think. And I'm doing to lightly suggest that you're working from some old data that is... no longer relevant. You are not nearly as bad at being a person as you seem to think you are.

#sortme #wisteria sorts #shc #sortinghatchats #bird badger #bird primary #burnt bird primary #exploded bird #badger secondary #bird secondary model

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bitterrobin · 2 months

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a quick PSA on pre-Robin Damian (again):

He has never called himself the "Blood Son". Those specific words have never come out of his mouth in a comic. In fact, Damian has only had dialogue regarding his bio status or another character's adoptive status like... three or four times.

Yes, pretty much all of those times have something to do with Tim in one way another. That's because Damian was less of a character, and more of a sword-carrying plot device when he was first introduced.

Damian's early writing lines up more with that of a minor villain than any supporting character. He existed at first only to rile up chaos in the Batcave for like, two issues, before his death in the fourth issue he appeared. He was introduced in issue 655 and killed by torpedo-submarine explosion in 658. Damian as a character was effectively "punished" for his earlier actions through a violent death.

You need to understand that early Damian (2009 mostly) didn't have a cemented personality or much characterization other than the basics that Morrison imbued into him i.e he was 10, an assassin, lax about death, very sarcastic/rude in tone, and weirdly spoiled despite his upbringing implying the opposite. Grant Morrison tends to write the large story concepts they like and they don't often adhere to any consistent/previous characterization (as seen with Talia) if it doesn't line up with the vision they want. Not even Damian's existence was kept consistent, as it's very hard to believe that Batman #656 Damian has the same backstory as Son of the Demon Damian or the Ibn al Xuffasch of Kingdom Come.

They didn't flesh out Damian a whole lot when he was first introduced, making him more of a spoiled rich kid who just happened to know how to kill people than the Damian that you probably think of. It took later comic appearances and other writers to add onto Damian's sporadic characterization - because he didn't have much major development after being created until becoming Robin and working alongside Dick.

To further characterize Damian as Robin, now that he needed to play against a larger cast and more established figures, writers needed to come up with ideas fast. So some writers played up his League backstory and wrote him colder, more logical and vaguely terrifying. They made Talia and Ras more and more ooc and abusive. They wrote dialogue for Damian that made him more of an annoying little brother figure, impulsiveness and all. Sometimes his dialogue with female characters drifted towards sexism, as clearly some writers can't write young boy characters without relying on shitty sitcom-style misogynist tropes. He got different moments, some skewing towards insanely violent or towards a normal child reeling from issues. This long trek of his writing was always changing in little ways until the reboot in 2011 and his first real death in Batman Incorporated, and then just continued on afterwards to this day.

In short, early pre-Robin Damian was a mess, and it took a long time for DC to develop him as a full character. (Even now, writers are still "figuring him out" and pulling ooc takes out of their asses). We have fun here.

#quick PSA more like long diatribe #every time someone writes Damian calling himself the Blood Son I lose a year off my life #and then I cast a wizard's curse of “balls explode!”onto whoever wrote that #please stop writing Damian that way in the year 2024 #we have got to move on from Damian's 2009 characterization for the love of god #damian wayne #robin #dc #waspdoesathought #dc comics #a painted bird named tamer

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